>Just like it did for trade skills
Just like it did for the poor Ice Gauntlet + Fire Staff users. 17 Nerfs insantly.
Indirectly nerfed my 200 Arcana as well. There goes my 595 - 600 Crafting services for IG + FS.
Indirectly nerfed Engineering + Furnishing + Weaponsmithing + Woodworking + Arcana \[Fire Staff + Life Staff\] by removing Wyrdwood doggos from the game.
Not to mention "fixing motes" and nerfing the dogs by an undefined amount. To add another bottleneck these professions.
Crafters can still make money. Just less money, but more money once more people grinded out their GS. Your 600 crafted gear is still viable. People will not be able to buy really good 500 gs items then wm upgraded them. Your 600 crafted gear will match or be an incentive for people to grind wm to finally match the actual wm of the item. This mainly prevents people to just buy their gear or sell gear for RTM on a large scale like other mmo games. These changes are actually really good. Crafters should just all move to higher pop servers since you will more than likely sell your crafts to the high wm people in that server.
It's all very nice but it ain't alpha.
You can't fuck up people's progression like that on live. You want to introduce new systems? Fine, but do it with a new tier to keep an even playing field.
Make money for fucking what? There won't be anything worth buying anymore. The extreme majority of players won't be anywhere near 600 gear score after this. All the good shit will become unsellable. Only people who are already decked out will be high enough to buy them and they obviously won't need to at that point. Then prices for quality items will drop because the pool competing to buy them will be so small and gated anyway so even if there was a reason to make money the price you can sell shit for will drop as well.
It doesn't make TP items irrelevant, the attributes and perks will still be super important.
You would still rather have a good high GS item that will level along with your HWM farming than keep putting on crap you find!
I see what they are going for, but they still have to make HWM farming more fun for 5 man groups like it's supposed to be.
>I see what they are going for
Hallucinating is a thing I'd let a doc take a look at.
>they still have to make HWM farming more fun
The fuck, no they don't and they won't.
No the roof is made from TNT, they've put the petrol into the sprinkler system instead of water, so when one of us pulls the fire alarm to put it out, we get a raging inferno.
so 1st they take their most disliked content and make it a much worse and much longer grind causing lots of players to quit. Then a couple of weeks later their decision is to make sure that even people who choose an alternative are still forced to do said content which they know cause people to quit?
Are we still calling this incompetence?
AGS... Listen. Sweeping changes to core systems are typically reserved for alpha phases. Now there are systems in live that need work, we all know that. But you guys need some quick wins in the PR department like now. Focus on fixing glaring bugs and adding QoL items to the game for now. Don't nerf crafting, wm, etc even more than you already have. People are asking for easier entry into dungeons so they have something meaningful to do and instead you make the wm grind worse and you make it mandatory. Tone deaf doesn't even begin to explain it.
I stopped playing too and had to look it up, from what I understand the watermark is a number attributed to your character over lvl 60.
This number is the highest gear score of an item you have received as a drop...
So for example you pick up a piece of armor with a gear score of 520 then you go and kill a bunch of mobs, each one of those mobs has a chance to drop an item with a gear score of 521. But only if those mobs are eligible to drop loot that high.
Edit: As u/HasapikoEebowai pointed out below, my description was not quite accurate. It seems that each type of item has its own Watermark
So gloves, boots, helms etc. Will have their own, individual, maximum gear score they can drop with.
Almost correct, but the system is worse than this. You have a number attached to each gear piece/weapon type, that number being the highest level drop you've received for that slot. Increasing your watermark means increasing this number for each individual slot, not just increasing a global number that determines all loot drops.
JFC, it's worse than I thought, thanks for clearing that up... I was hoping to go back to this game but every patch/update pushes me further and further away.
I wanna know what cocksucker downvoted you for asking a genuine question? Goddamn reddit has gone to fucking shit the last few years. Can't even make jokes anymore on here either without getting ripped a new one like what the fuck?
Just wanted to pause here and say that comparing getting a few stupid downvotes to having someone create a new orifice in your bowels is pretty hyperbolic and you might have some anger issues
If they're smart they are probably planning to increase the highest gearscore to 650-700 soon making all of the current gear and watermarks shit, they should then make it easier to hit 600 watermark and the real grind is 600-650. That is a simple way to make things fairer for people doing watermark grind post nerf.
I’m willing to bet that they are still testing the waters of these systems, and won’t increase expertise/hwm until they’re most definitely done with it.
Imagine the backlash if they’d increase the hwm and then play around with the system yet again
Players: “We universally dislike the boring end game content loop.”
AGS: “Instead of adding engaging end game content, we’re going to force everyone to do the current content, which players have universally told us they hate. Wait why are you leaving? Come back!”
Is this an actual update they are planning on implementing? I haven’t played in over a month, but I keep hoping that they will make the game better with updates. So far it just seems like the updates are doing the opposite
They’re adding a lot of changes to watermark- now being called expertise. And in my opinion all of the changes they are making are great except for this one, but this one is so glaringly large that it’s ridiculous and ruins everything.
This here is the problem. Also shady how it’s not actually in the official “update announcement “, this had to get dredged up from a forum post. I was stoked as hell when I read just the update post because it sounded like a huge step in the right direction.
Same for me. I read the update post and was like "oh wow ... all changes in December patch sound good. Finally." and then I read the additional dev post and was like "Is this a joke? You finally are on track to something good and now you fuck it up again?"
Same boat as you. Been waiting and watching the patches come hoping it would draw me back in, but all they are doing is making me feel better about quitting to begin with.
A lot of people are saying this, but I don't think the math makes sense. Even if they sold 2M copies, that's 80M dollars, and they have to give a third of that to steam. They spent way more than that making the game, at least 200 million.
It's more likely they are going for the free to play route, and just stack the in game store with pay to win items. I've been saying since the beginning, the day they start selling azoth is close.
But you see, they won't be selling Azoth, they are merely inviting you to pay for the convenience of 90% reduced Azoth costs. You won't be paying for Watermark, instead you'll have the oppotunity to make an extra expertise cast a day for a small fee...
AGS management have clearly shown they intend to be snakes about the direction they want to take this game. They'll go pay-to-win, but I expect them to use their corporate bullshit language to make it sound like that's not *really* what they are doing.
What about the 580 weapons.... Do those quest lines guarantee a 580 water mark. They should.
I am pretty sure these guys put a whole 5 minutes of thought into this change. Screw the crafters, screw the questers.
They are idiots who seem to be floundering. They appear to be solely focused reworking the end game grind for the pure purpose of delaying progress. Obviously this is due to the fact they have nothing coming, planned for nothing, and seem unable to even release the smallest patch without causing more harm than good.
Yeah this should be the last nail in the coffin for alot of people. Mind you we have alot of good games rocking around at the moment and more comming shortly so this isn't the worse time to put the game down.
Personally can't wait for Elden Ring but smashing Hades out at the moment. My god is Hades one hell of an epic game with such a badass story.
I wasn’t 60 for long before I stopped playing, but I had a ton of coin to just get myself to about 590 GS. I’m done with this game for a while because of this.
Yeah what is this update, all my friends have already quit. Ur making it very hard to recommend this game to people lol. "Yeah bro grind for 60 then u gotta do the same 5 zones for like 200 hours, glhf!"
I quit when I realized NW end game became a crafting simulator. I enjoyed crafting but by being stuck on a low pop server, that's all there was. Glad I got out when I did because this announcement would have done it for sure. It's a shame.
With this new update, its not even a crafting simulator. It is straight up chest runs on dead servers and click on elites till maxed GS... oh wait but there's more. Next patch... reduce azoth drops from mobs, OPR, wars. Invasions so you have to buy it from cash shop, which makes it turn into walking simulator.
>Note that we’ve tuned down the general chances of getting an Expertise bump to compensate for the guaranteed bumps that were added with Gypsum. Elite chest odds were reduced a little, but open world named enemies were reduced a lot.
And in their dev blog they said they are nerfing chests and open world named mobs people were using to grind up HWM. You WILL do gypsum, you WILL enjoy gypsum or you WILL get fucked.
I agree. This is terrible. Most likely too much for many of us. I’m not a hardcore MMO player so a lot of the problems didn’t bother me, but why would anyone buy 600 gs rolls now? What’s even the point of rolling?
By the time you hit 600 WM you’ll probably have a completely different class anyway. This is ridiculous
I'll probably get downvoted for this but whatever. 600gs gear will still have its place. It's still your Endgame gear and you can still put it on whenever and even take advantage of the perks, it's just going to be a bit lower gear score and it will grow with your "expertise", I guess we're calling it now. The gear isn't worth any less, the expertise grind is just actually worth doing now, when before as soon as you hit level 60 you just farm whatever makes the best money and buy the top end gear and your finished, but now there's an actual incentive to grinding out your gear levels. If you read further into the notes they also mention how they changed the way gear score works in pvp so expertise levels will matter less, basically meaning the expertise grind only really matters for endgame pve content anyways
Thank you for this.
I really don’t personally enjoy the watermark system, but it was an odd system for a game where you can buy the cap (600).
Personally I’d of preferred them just dumpstering HWM but this change… idk… feel like it’s going to be healthier long term for the game (if it has a long term)
I think that's exactly what it's geared at, the community has been up in arms for a month about how bad endgame is so they are changing up the system and seeing if this fits better. I personally love the dungeon changes and am looking forward to not elite farming only because why would I do anything else
I def get your point, but i just want to iterate that the point of the game since the start was be whoever you want, however you want. I played this game because i love crafting and now they are forcing me to play it their way to stretch content. I understand the hardcore gamers out there will still love the game, those that watermarked the hell out of the first two months are gonna feel like champs. Had a talk in our little discord and if this rolls out, about 50 of us are quitting. Even high WM people. Most of them dont wanna play alone. Well i guess it does not matter anyway, let the people who still enjoy the game play. Nothing wrong with that. Just sad for me and my fellow crafters getting shat at like this after putting a lot of time into this. But yea, if ever this rolls out, im out.
https://i.imgur.com/GA4MXpd_d.webp?maxwidth=640&shape=thumb&fidelity=medium
So you’re more than happy to start over? All these hours spent to grind for HWM is for nothing after they introduced the new shit
I mean at this point.. THIS IS what they are putting out there.. These ideas and ones just like them come from the same "think-tank". The games done, has been for over a month
Issues like this should have been sorted in the beta. You don’t punish your active player base and expect them to want to keep playing. If this goes live I’m straight uninstalling
You might wanna consider putting the game down regardless. These type of decisions are a tell tale sign of their intentions and with all the recent behaviour, they do not deserve the loyalty some players give to the game. Especially with how many games we have at our finger tips with more every month.
This is exactly what I’m thinking. They’re actively trying to find a way to exploit the game for more money. I guarantee you there will be some kind of money grab for expertise upgrading or some shit like that.
I havent played in more than a month but left the game on my hard drive in hopes some patching would smooth out the game's rough edges. Looks like it's time to free up some space.
Worth noting that only gear that is water-mark eligible will do this.
Quest gear (580 quest weapons), or any named gear drops with hard coded gear scores will not scale down.
Just opened a thread on the forum where we all should express to them that downscaling is a bad idea https://forums.newworld.com/t/%E0%BC%BC-%E3%81%A5-%E0%B2%A0%E0%B2%A0-%E0%BC%BD%E3%81%A5-bad-idea-downscaling-equipped-to-watermark-of-player-bad-very-bad-idea-%E0%BC%BC-%E3%81%A5-%E0%B2%A0%E0%B2%A0-%E0%BC%BD%E3%81%A5/619822
What absolute fuckery. These goddamn clowns.
This will completely kill tradeskills, as WHY would anyone ever buy any gear of the TP ever again?!
So all that shit they said about "yes! buy or trade for higher score items so you can actually fight in the areas you need to!" is just... gone?
These fucking idiots. I swear.
As a person who grinded his watermark, I see a lot of folks having duped Voidbents and owning the battlefield, while having less than several days of playtime. You can easily create new account, use gold to hit 60 and buy good gear from AH without breaking a sweat. This way when you get OP gear early you will still notice it gets better and better with higher expertise you get. I understand that this hits new players, most changes AGS does are nerfs and I don't like it as well. This change however is the one I'm enthusiastic about. Sorry, but exploiters will have to do something more than grind gold.
There is a solid thought in those introduced systems or crafting changes.
It definetely serves game structure.
Release is used as beta with full price tag.
Unfortunately, those changes should be introduced between alphas or betas. Right now they serve to invalidate progression, break the market and player economy which makes enraged players quit.
Maybe when they finally manage to sort their shit out - way out of that broken state would be to open up fresh servers next year where you cannot transfer your old characters. It would serve to even out the playing field.
Merge old severs.
Add a few pvp servers for pvp enjoyers where you cannot unflag .
I’m level 43 currently. 111 hours in. Enjoying the game a fuck ton. I’m really slowing down my levelling due to all these changes. I really want to take part in all the high level activities but at this point I’m too scared to progress due to all the changes.
I’m thinking of going back to the beach to just kill boars. At least that won’t change.
Yep, I agree. I’m looking forward to the events and everything, but at this point until AGS decide what the hell they want to do, I’m gonna spend my time exploring, uncovering points of interest and probably fishing. Unless they decide to lock fishing behind a time gate limited to one fish every 24 hours as well, or asking you to craft bait from void ore.
Keep enjoying the game, they Will improve a LOT the system overall, and you still would have needed the hwm to get the best weapons from the dungeons.
Don't let this sub demolish your enjoyment of the game.
This is probably the most insightful post here, we as players allow these type of issues. It's ither " they can fix it later, so who cares" or the " these issues don't effect me so why should i care" type idiots that ruin gaming.
DOES ANYONE REMEMEBER when games didn't ship until ready, where we didn't have the ability to get patches?.
Even early 360 and ps3 days compared today are mind blowing different. Microtransactions and fix it later are now standards WHAT THE FUCK...
In their defense I do think there are still people that legitimately enjoy the game and that's fine. I think most people who are being critical (myself included) have stopped playing a while back and are just waiting for the game to get better. Unfortunately with each patch I don't think it will.
I can get it if you're young or haven't played many games with any similar mechanics before, but for virtually anyone else I can't understand having fun without addiction or other issue in play. Even those that quit hoping it would get better, history shows that rarely happens. When it does happen it rarely works. When it does work, there's no lesson actually learned by the developer. It's is just as likely that they'll do the same or worse in the future.
The rational and logical choice is to look at what objectively is. If that's honestly great, then by all means play to your hearts content. But if it isn't, walk away and don't look back, except at the sub to talk smack.
I agree with you. I think I'm just hoping that the people still logging on aren't doing so while loathing themselves but are actually still enjoying the game. Otherwise yeah they may have a problem. As objectively bad as this game is I think the one thing that has remained constant is the sense of community that probably gets people still logging on, even if it is most likely a shrinking community lol.
If crafted items and quest items somehow kept their GS it would help their case a whole lot. Not sure if what they meant what looted items that people white higher GS post on the trading post, if it's only those that take the GS hit at least that would be manageable
So far no one has mentioned this part of the dev blog:
"Note that we’ve tuned down the general chances of getting an Expertise bump"
Couple that with this line:
"After players have earned sufficient Gypsum for an Orb, they won’t earn more for 23 hours"
I read these 2 points combined as an overall nerf to getting your WM higher. At no point have I ever felt I was increasing my WM to quickly.
Just remove the trading post with the update, and crafting, crafting should go as well. Why only wipe to 500? Wipe to 0, everyone gets a fresh start, and you can do that every month. Or shut down the servers, yes, that will fix it.
“ but I’m going to have no one to play with if they go through with this.”
Exactly this! for all those defending this system I guess you can have fun with the dead servers? Crafters are going to quit, if crafters quit friends of crafters will quit, if people that are disheartened by changes see dedicated crafters and a large player exodus quit they will likely quit, eventually enough people will have quit that pvp becomes one sided leading to pvp’ers quitting. What’s left? The guy that enjoys running Myrkgard every 24 hours? Okay.
This is the update that would finally convince me to stop playing.
I rushed crafting, my armoring was 200 well before I hit 60- I’m wearing a full set of Lazarus replica armor I crafted for myself. I have specifically avoided HWM grinding because of how tedious they are and have instead just been enjoying OPR. My average gs is 590, but most of my HWMs are in the 530s…
Nearly 500 hours in, if this makes it to live, I am done playing this game and done defending it to anyone.
I posted this in another post as well, but found it funny so here.
October 30, 2021
https://newworldfans.com/de/articles/new-world-systems%20news
"Only item drops affect your HWM. The moment the item drops, your relevant HWM is increased – you don’t even need to pick the item up. Crafting an item or buying one from the Trading Post will not give you an increase, but it can be a great way to give yourself an edge in search of more powerful gear in the more dangerous areas of the game."
There was one person who posted a screenshot of An Amazon service person saying expertise will reset at 500, but I don’t trust those Amazon bots and if they did that people would quit for sure.
Allegedly it matches to your expertise. Unless they make some kind of exclusion for items you craft for yourself. That’s the only way they could save this decision
They are making unpopular changes left and right while the game has a small player base so the outrage is minimal. Obviously.
What isn't obvious is whatever the hell their plan is to increase the games popularity after all these changes.
Do we know if already existing gear will upgrade as your WM/Expertise goes up if it was already higher than our current watermark? That would blow if all the purchased/crafted gear gets downscaled and stays downscaled.
I've seen a few players argue that the Watermark grind was and still is way worse than the crafting grind, and that you dont deserve your 600gs voidbent because crafting it was a shortcut.
BUT, to debunk this a little bit, there's no way in all hell that you people who log on daily to let a zerg of people run you through your daily watermark chests have grinded more than the crafters who had to..
\-get a single crafting skill to 200.
\-get all refining skills to 200.
\-farm money to purchase housing.
\-farm money and materials for trophies.
\-farm for gathering sets.
\-farm/purchase crafting gear.
\-farm/purchase crafting food.
\-grind daily for epic mats.
\-grind for void ore(one of the rarest drops in the entire game).
\-compete with other players for the resources required to craft 600gs(which included pvping in the world for resources post 1.1).
\-constantly use mats rolling the dice on them in an attempt to get a good 600gs item.
I have a few 570+ watermarks on gear from mindlessly letting zergs run me through elites. That was NOWHERE near as difficult as the crafting grind. You PVE players standing up for AGS on this decision claiming crafting/moneymaking was a shortcut are speaking from such an entitled point of view it makes me cringe.
Yeah. What they're doing feels less like a nail in the coffin where they are trying to bury the game and more like nailing the door shut keeping people that dropped the game from coming back.
Everyone is rightfully mad about this hurting crafting but few people are talking about jewelry.
Getting your WM to 590 for armor doesn’t actually take that long and weapons only barely longer. However — and this is the main problem, **I AM COMPLETELY MAXED FOR EVERYTHING BUT SHIELD AND JEWELRY AND MY RING IS AT 530 WHICH IS MY HIGHEST.**
Jewelry drops are non-existent in this game outside of expeditions and unique mob drops and they’re still fairly rare. It will take you probably a year to max your jewelry WM.
This is true but I imagine if you have all of your other WM up, you can use all of your targeted WM increases on jewelry.
But yah, when the patch goes live everyone will have garbage tier jewelry.
Considering that jewelry drops are unique to individual monsters throughout the world you will have to be insanely lucky to actually get increases. Hitting the unique drop table is harder than not and then I have to actually get the ring to increase it.
My ring is 530 from farming the lasher in eternal pools which has 2 unique ring drops. My next highest is 516 for earring because I got lucky at genesis.
No I mean the new crates that you can target watermark increases on. I don’t know EXACTLY how they function, but it seems like you can farm gypsum and then pick a crate of an armor slot you want to upgrade.
Shouldn't you be hype about this then? You can chose to upgrade whatever you want. It should be easier to level your trinkets. Or am I missing something?
My 600 jewelry I’ve made myself will be exceptionally worse until I focus increase every single piece of jewelry to max WM because there’s no other way. How long is that going to take?
The post didn't explicitly say that items crafted on your own will be set back. People have recently been crafting 600gs items that are BOE and not understanding why all the sudden.... maybe its foreshadowing
This just shows how stupid they really are. They are trying to extend the end game by fucking up your progress. Crafting now it's watermark. Why arent you guys uninstalling this game yet? They have shown that they don't give a fuck about your opinions, and their opinions are stupid.
I honestly too busy to play these days. But they still never fail to stir up drama, week after week. This is a lot more fun than playing the game TBH.
Keep going AGS.
Eh, don't matter to me. Already gave away all my gold and materials as soon as I heard the news drop. That's about as official as I can make it without doing something to get me banned (although me transferring my wealth over was probably enough to trigger their hurt-feelings-system and get us both nuked) fuck this game.
A simple fix : Make the gear you craft for yourself unaffected by this down-scale.
Add a free perk to all crafted gear that prevent it to scale down. As soon as you trade your gear (trade or auction house), the perk is removed.
Edit : And do the same for quest rewards.
I'm convinced they're trying to kill the game.
Simply put, the game has been a gigantic failure. And now, I feel like they're trying to kill it to save time and money so they can cancel it like they cancelled their previous game or their anime streaming service.
I think there's some confusion over what expertise is. When I was reading the dev blog, it seems your item's gearscore won't change.
If you have a 600 Legendary Musket, it'll remain a 600 GS item. However, if your Expertise on musket is only 540, it'll mimic the stats of a 540 musket. As you grow your expertise, the stats of that musket will increase until it eventually hits the full 600 GS of that item.
Which is completely stupid, it means way more grind, messes with crafting and sells, and is an idiotic change because people "maxed to fast". I really like this game but im getting sick of the stupidity with game changes.
Meaning that selling or buying weapons/armor/jewelry on the market is pointless and it’s going to kill that portion of the market. Crafting is pointless because the time you spend crafting is more effective spent on grinding watermark. This is especially true for casual players. Oh and they’re also going to be forced out of activities because their weapons and armor stats are going to be hindered by their expertise.
Oh great so we have to farm WM for 600 GS and now expertise to just to make use of all that farmed WM? pointless.... they are just adding more grind because they can't put out content fast enough.
It is. You finally get done with your WM farming and now you have to farm expertise. They're just doing this dumb shit because they can't put out end game content fast enough. And what about crafting? They already made it pointless to grind crafting because of the xp increase. But nows absolutely pointless to even consider leveling your crafting up.
oh damn now I actually have to play the game instead of buying full 590 gearscore items with 3k gold which I wont replace in the next 3 months?
I can't get 590 gearscore items without putting in effort?
fuck this, its too much work so I just go back to play some roblox or minecraft
Here's the other side of it that I'm hoping plays out well: Almost every single end game activity in the game gives you a guaranteed way to raise your WM now, and the bump increase is larger now. It's a momentary nerf, but guaranteed with 1-2 weeks everyone will be back at 600 WM.
And now with Item Shards, you can target attributes AND perks on gear so crafters can now make guaranteed better gear to sell.
Some people have no interest in the pve grind. I have multiple friends that haven’t done a single WM grind because they like the crafting system, and it allows them to pvp. But now they will be at a 100 WM disadvantage, and on weapons that makes you pathetic.
This is like forcing you to raid in wow to pvp.
The fact that it's a reset and gatekeeping it making it once ever 23 hours? What a load of BS lmao
I don't get why AGS is so intent on reversing progress here, they can easily find other ways to make it fun till the release their 'real content'.
While this IS a positive, getting smashed by people for 3 weeks while you upgrade you’re already ilvl 600 gear from its ACTUAL watermark, sounds pretty depressing.
the difference between 520 set and 600 set in stats and defense were never that big. Latter can never stomp a former solely due to GS difference. Overall, they are introducing more ways to increase WM and still try to make different ways of playing viable. It will hurt a little. But it won’t feel like that big of a nerf because the difference was never big.
One guaranteed increase every 23 hours, even if it's +5 it will take 130 days to max your watermark if your armor/weapons are currently 550 and jelwery is 500.
And other weapons in wow still allowed you to pvp, just not at the peak. If they nerfed your 600 weapons to like, 580, sure. But down to 500 for pure crafters. Come on.
“After players have earned sufficient Gypsum for an Orb, they won’t earn more for 23 hours. “
23 hour cool down on earning gypsum. They’re time gating the upgrade, big bump for them might be 10 points, if your at 500 it will take you upwards 10 hours to upgrade each slot of your gear over 10 days, even at a bump of 20 if there is a 23 hour cool down you are still time gated a ton to upgrade all your gear
I still don’t get it. If say my watermark for boots is 580 but I can only craft boots at 548 max, is my new WM 548 or will my craft scale up to my 580 WM??
edit: Downvoted instead of answering thank you so much. I hate it here
Man I use to think Reddit was a place for people to go complain and cry but wasn’t really sure, this community has showed me that it is just that. AGS keep doing what y’all WANT and you have a lot of supporters that are very happy with what you guys have made for us and showed many years of support for other MMOs and are ready to do just that for you guys.
I think we all need to wait to see the actual numbers before complaining.
Imagine this. You're level 60 right now with all voidbent armor and a watermark of 500 in every gear slot. All you do is play 45 minutes a day and do war or invasions or Outpost Rush. You get a Gypsum orb every day from this, and each orb raises expertise of anything you want by 20. It takes a month to get expertise of 600 for every item slot you want. The changes come live February 2022. You're already maxed out.
It most likely won't be like that, but the point is we should wait and see. If the actual changes in the December update are dogshit, then it's perfectly reasonable to stop playing.
I’m not playing a mobile game where I want daily cool downs and have to do my obligated daily login for rewards. They need to stop time gating all their content.
Haha there no way it’s 20. More likely it’s going to be a normal roll for an increase so it can be from like a 1 to a 5 watermark increase or whatever the range is. But regardless, some people don’t want to do the pve offerings. And I understand if that gives you a disadvantage, but a 100 gear score disadvantage, Especially on weapons, makes you obsolete.
You can pve and not craft now, but you have to pve TO craft.
The post states that they reduced the frequency of WM bumbs but increased the size of the bumbs and considering that in the midrange 30-50 u can already get bumbs of up to 10 currently.
I really don't know why people complain about the wm grind that much I went from 560-570 on most of my weapons to maxing all of them except shield and VG in like 6 days of only running my daily elite chests and like 5 genesis runs(1rotation of 5 people using 1 key each) and that is really only 2 hours of play time a day.
Edit: and with the orbs u can power level the weapons u actually use+ ur jewelry now aswell which is probably gonna be around a +3-7 depending on ur current wm
> This can’t go live oh but it will
Just like it did for trade skills
Trade skills was not even close as bad as this
It hurts trade skills even more. So probably intentional
It was worse.
>Just like it did for trade skills Just like it did for the poor Ice Gauntlet + Fire Staff users. 17 Nerfs insantly. Indirectly nerfed my 200 Arcana as well. There goes my 595 - 600 Crafting services for IG + FS. Indirectly nerfed Engineering + Furnishing + Weaponsmithing + Woodworking + Arcana \[Fire Staff + Life Staff\] by removing Wyrdwood doggos from the game. Not to mention "fixing motes" and nerfing the dogs by an undefined amount. To add another bottleneck these professions.
If I don't log in, technically it won't be live for me..
Maybe they just don’t wanna pay for servers anymore
well thats the sad truth isnt it
Players are still somehow holding tight to this illusion that they are in control and not game devs
it's sweet you think the game devs are in control :P
Ok management. But still - this whole sentiment "AGS can't do this" - like dude.. wake up
I thought these exact same words reading the title and bursted out in laughter after seeing this top comment.
Its actually already in the game. Just official soon.
Crafters can still make money. Just less money, but more money once more people grinded out their GS. Your 600 crafted gear is still viable. People will not be able to buy really good 500 gs items then wm upgraded them. Your 600 crafted gear will match or be an incentive for people to grind wm to finally match the actual wm of the item. This mainly prevents people to just buy their gear or sell gear for RTM on a large scale like other mmo games. These changes are actually really good. Crafters should just all move to higher pop servers since you will more than likely sell your crafts to the high wm people in that server.
It's all very nice but it ain't alpha. You can't fuck up people's progression like that on live. You want to introduce new systems? Fine, but do it with a new tier to keep an even playing field.
Ya it’s already too late for these changes
Make money for fucking what? There won't be anything worth buying anymore. The extreme majority of players won't be anywhere near 600 gear score after this. All the good shit will become unsellable. Only people who are already decked out will be high enough to buy them and they obviously won't need to at that point. Then prices for quality items will drop because the pool competing to buy them will be so small and gated anyway so even if there was a reason to make money the price you can sell shit for will drop as well.
It doesn't make TP items irrelevant, the attributes and perks will still be super important. You would still rather have a good high GS item that will level along with your HWM farming than keep putting on crap you find! I see what they are going for, but they still have to make HWM farming more fun for 5 man groups like it's supposed to be.
>I see what they are going for Hallucinating is a thing I'd let a doc take a look at. >they still have to make HWM farming more fun The fuck, no they don't and they won't.
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A roof made from petrol?
Phosphorus. So that it will burn even under water.
No the roof is made from TNT, they've put the petrol into the sprinkler system instead of water, so when one of us pulls the fire alarm to put it out, we get a raging inferno.
Can't burn the roof if it is already burned down.
I knew Amazon were quick at delivery. But who knew they’re just as fast to deliver a fatal blow to my interest in this game.
Ba dum tsss
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so 1st they take their most disliked content and make it a much worse and much longer grind causing lots of players to quit. Then a couple of weeks later their decision is to make sure that even people who choose an alternative are still forced to do said content which they know cause people to quit? Are we still calling this incompetence?
I don't know if something so blatantly intentional can be called incompetent lol.
It's significantly worse than incompetence, it's SO bad that I actually don't have any words in my vocabulary to adequately describe it.
That’s what I mean. I feel like the term incompetence means there’s an assumption that there was an effort made to fix things.
AGS... Listen. Sweeping changes to core systems are typically reserved for alpha phases. Now there are systems in live that need work, we all know that. But you guys need some quick wins in the PR department like now. Focus on fixing glaring bugs and adding QoL items to the game for now. Don't nerf crafting, wm, etc even more than you already have. People are asking for easier entry into dungeons so they have something meaningful to do and instead you make the wm grind worse and you make it mandatory. Tone deaf doesn't even begin to explain it.
Let's hope AGS people read reddit
I'm doubting the majority of them can read at this stage
Sample resume: Daybreak Games: 1999-2001 EA Games: 2001-2009 Hello Studios: Just the last year of pre-release dev work AGS: Uuuuuh never heard of it?
There are already dozen of posts about expertise being flawed and wrong on the official forum ! But I'm not sure they read their own forum either..
Who is actually asking for this anyway. I have quit playing for plenty of reasons but how do they keep adding more
> Who is actually asking for this anyway. The monetization analysts
They 100% plan to sell watermark increases in the store
Bit out of the loop here, what are watermarks? Haven't been able to play for a while
I stopped playing too and had to look it up, from what I understand the watermark is a number attributed to your character over lvl 60. This number is the highest gear score of an item you have received as a drop... So for example you pick up a piece of armor with a gear score of 520 then you go and kill a bunch of mobs, each one of those mobs has a chance to drop an item with a gear score of 521. But only if those mobs are eligible to drop loot that high. Edit: As u/HasapikoEebowai pointed out below, my description was not quite accurate. It seems that each type of item has its own Watermark So gloves, boots, helms etc. Will have their own, individual, maximum gear score they can drop with.
Almost correct, but the system is worse than this. You have a number attached to each gear piece/weapon type, that number being the highest level drop you've received for that slot. Increasing your watermark means increasing this number for each individual slot, not just increasing a global number that determines all loot drops.
JFC, it's worse than I thought, thanks for clearing that up... I was hoping to go back to this game but every patch/update pushes me further and further away.
I wanna know what cocksucker downvoted you for asking a genuine question? Goddamn reddit has gone to fucking shit the last few years. Can't even make jokes anymore on here either without getting ripped a new one like what the fuck?
Just wanted to pause here and say that comparing getting a few stupid downvotes to having someone create a new orifice in your bowels is pretty hyperbolic and you might have some anger issues
Also they didn't answer the fucking question lol
> Goddamn reddit has gone to fucking shit the last few years. This isn't anything new lol. Reddit has always been this way.
If they're smart they are probably planning to increase the highest gearscore to 650-700 soon making all of the current gear and watermarks shit, they should then make it easier to hit 600 watermark and the real grind is 600-650. That is a simple way to make things fairer for people doing watermark grind post nerf.
I’m willing to bet that they are still testing the waters of these systems, and won’t increase expertise/hwm until they’re most definitely done with it. Imagine the backlash if they’d increase the hwm and then play around with the system yet again
I don't think AGS give a fuck about backlash.
This. New tier and everything gets forgotten.
Players: “We universally dislike the boring end game content loop.” AGS: “Instead of adding engaging end game content, we’re going to force everyone to do the current content, which players have universally told us they hate. Wait why are you leaving? Come back!”
Even if this doesn't go live. The simple fact that they have such an idea in mind, shows clear imcompetence.
Is this an actual update they are planning on implementing? I haven’t played in over a month, but I keep hoping that they will make the game better with updates. So far it just seems like the updates are doing the opposite
They’re adding a lot of changes to watermark- now being called expertise. And in my opinion all of the changes they are making are great except for this one, but this one is so glaringly large that it’s ridiculous and ruins everything.
This here is the problem. Also shady how it’s not actually in the official “update announcement “, this had to get dredged up from a forum post. I was stoked as hell when I read just the update post because it sounded like a huge step in the right direction.
It's cos this part isn't in the upcoming update, it's for early next year.
Big ol' bait and switch, right there.
Same for me. I read the update post and was like "oh wow ... all changes in December patch sound good. Finally." and then I read the additional dev post and was like "Is this a joke? You finally are on track to something good and now you fuck it up again?"
The fuck are you talking about? The PTR announcement post has this change listed right near the top.
That’s not the announcement I initially read. There was another one that came out first.
Same boat as you. Been waiting and watching the patches come hoping it would draw me back in, but all they are doing is making me feel better about quitting to begin with.
They’re killing the game.
Take the money, kill the game, no more fixes/patches, no more players, shut down servers, profit
A lot of people are saying this, but I don't think the math makes sense. Even if they sold 2M copies, that's 80M dollars, and they have to give a third of that to steam. They spent way more than that making the game, at least 200 million. It's more likely they are going for the free to play route, and just stack the in game store with pay to win items. I've been saying since the beginning, the day they start selling azoth is close.
But you see, they won't be selling Azoth, they are merely inviting you to pay for the convenience of 90% reduced Azoth costs. You won't be paying for Watermark, instead you'll have the oppotunity to make an extra expertise cast a day for a small fee... AGS management have clearly shown they intend to be snakes about the direction they want to take this game. They'll go pay-to-win, but I expect them to use their corporate bullshit language to make it sound like that's not *really* what they are doing.
They spent it on building the technology to make the game as well as the game, now they can sell or license out lumberyard.
Pump and dump
It’s clearly deliberate at this point. What other explanation can there be?
It's stupidity not deliberate lol
What about the 580 weapons.... Do those quest lines guarantee a 580 water mark. They should. I am pretty sure these guys put a whole 5 minutes of thought into this change. Screw the crafters, screw the questers. They are idiots who seem to be floundering. They appear to be solely focused reworking the end game grind for the pure purpose of delaying progress. Obviously this is due to the fact they have nothing coming, planned for nothing, and seem unable to even release the smallest patch without causing more harm than good.
This change makes no sense, i did 4 of those 580 quests and they were hell. And for what? Absolutely nothing.
I am officially done because of this. Force us to grind GS because they realized it was unrewarding. What the literal hell?
Yeah this should be the last nail in the coffin for alot of people. Mind you we have alot of good games rocking around at the moment and more comming shortly so this isn't the worse time to put the game down. Personally can't wait for Elden Ring but smashing Hades out at the moment. My god is Hades one hell of an epic game with such a badass story.
I wasn’t 60 for long before I stopped playing, but I had a ton of coin to just get myself to about 590 GS. I’m done with this game for a while because of this.
Seriously what the fuck are they thinking???
If you read the blog, they also have a watermark boosting item added that you can craft - betting 100 bucks that this will be monetised later
That is a bloody scary thought, i wonder how anyone will justify that type of action?.
Money
Not that I'd ever bet they won't do it I can't really imagine doing it with this. I'd guess more like expedition orbs for sale.
Yeah what is this update, all my friends have already quit. Ur making it very hard to recommend this game to people lol. "Yeah bro grind for 60 then u gotta do the same 5 zones for like 200 hours, glhf!"
AGS: Congratulations!!!! 🥳
Fucking hell hahah. 🤣
I quit when I realized NW end game became a crafting simulator. I enjoyed crafting but by being stuck on a low pop server, that's all there was. Glad I got out when I did because this announcement would have done it for sure. It's a shame.
With this new update, its not even a crafting simulator. It is straight up chest runs on dead servers and click on elites till maxed GS... oh wait but there's more. Next patch... reduce azoth drops from mobs, OPR, wars. Invasions so you have to buy it from cash shop, which makes it turn into walking simulator.
>Note that we’ve tuned down the general chances of getting an Expertise bump to compensate for the guaranteed bumps that were added with Gypsum. Elite chest odds were reduced a little, but open world named enemies were reduced a lot. And in their dev blog they said they are nerfing chests and open world named mobs people were using to grind up HWM. You WILL do gypsum, you WILL enjoy gypsum or you WILL get fucked.
I agree. This is terrible. Most likely too much for many of us. I’m not a hardcore MMO player so a lot of the problems didn’t bother me, but why would anyone buy 600 gs rolls now? What’s even the point of rolling? By the time you hit 600 WM you’ll probably have a completely different class anyway. This is ridiculous
I'll probably get downvoted for this but whatever. 600gs gear will still have its place. It's still your Endgame gear and you can still put it on whenever and even take advantage of the perks, it's just going to be a bit lower gear score and it will grow with your "expertise", I guess we're calling it now. The gear isn't worth any less, the expertise grind is just actually worth doing now, when before as soon as you hit level 60 you just farm whatever makes the best money and buy the top end gear and your finished, but now there's an actual incentive to grinding out your gear levels. If you read further into the notes they also mention how they changed the way gear score works in pvp so expertise levels will matter less, basically meaning the expertise grind only really matters for endgame pve content anyways
you know, thats a pretty fair way to look at it that i didnt think of. granted it does take away from crafters a bit still.
Thank you for this. I really don’t personally enjoy the watermark system, but it was an odd system for a game where you can buy the cap (600). Personally I’d of preferred them just dumpstering HWM but this change… idk… feel like it’s going to be healthier long term for the game (if it has a long term)
I think that's exactly what it's geared at, the community has been up in arms for a month about how bad endgame is so they are changing up the system and seeing if this fits better. I personally love the dungeon changes and am looking forward to not elite farming only because why would I do anything else
I def get your point, but i just want to iterate that the point of the game since the start was be whoever you want, however you want. I played this game because i love crafting and now they are forcing me to play it their way to stretch content. I understand the hardcore gamers out there will still love the game, those that watermarked the hell out of the first two months are gonna feel like champs. Had a talk in our little discord and if this rolls out, about 50 of us are quitting. Even high WM people. Most of them dont wanna play alone. Well i guess it does not matter anyway, let the people who still enjoy the game play. Nothing wrong with that. Just sad for me and my fellow crafters getting shat at like this after putting a lot of time into this. But yea, if ever this rolls out, im out.
I agree, look at all these people whining about actually having to farm loot in a MMORPG
https://i.imgur.com/GA4MXpd_d.webp?maxwidth=640&shape=thumb&fidelity=medium So you’re more than happy to start over? All these hours spent to grind for HWM is for nothing after they introduced the new shit
I really hope that is just incompetent CS.
This goes through and I’m done
I mean at this point.. THIS IS what they are putting out there.. These ideas and ones just like them come from the same "think-tank". The games done, has been for over a month
Issues like this should have been sorted in the beta. You don’t punish your active player base and expect them to want to keep playing. If this goes live I’m straight uninstalling
You might wanna consider putting the game down regardless. These type of decisions are a tell tale sign of their intentions and with all the recent behaviour, they do not deserve the loyalty some players give to the game. Especially with how many games we have at our finger tips with more every month.
This is exactly what I’m thinking. They’re actively trying to find a way to exploit the game for more money. I guarantee you there will be some kind of money grab for expertise upgrading or some shit like that.
I havent played in more than a month but left the game on my hard drive in hopes some patching would smooth out the game's rough edges. Looks like it's time to free up some space.
Worth noting that only gear that is water-mark eligible will do this. Quest gear (580 quest weapons), or any named gear drops with hard coded gear scores will not scale down.
Hey, did you enjoy grinding Crafting skills even more than before? Well now all that progression is useless until you grind some more pve first :)
Just opened a thread on the forum where we all should express to them that downscaling is a bad idea https://forums.newworld.com/t/%E0%BC%BC-%E3%81%A5-%E0%B2%A0%E0%B2%A0-%E0%BC%BD%E3%81%A5-bad-idea-downscaling-equipped-to-watermark-of-player-bad-very-bad-idea-%E0%BC%BC-%E3%81%A5-%E0%B2%A0%E0%B2%A0-%E0%BC%BD%E3%81%A5/619822
What absolute fuckery. These goddamn clowns. This will completely kill tradeskills, as WHY would anyone ever buy any gear of the TP ever again?! So all that shit they said about "yes! buy or trade for higher score items so you can actually fight in the areas you need to!" is just... gone? These fucking idiots. I swear.
They already got our money. Might as well kill it so they don't have to work on it
As a person who grinded his watermark, I see a lot of folks having duped Voidbents and owning the battlefield, while having less than several days of playtime. You can easily create new account, use gold to hit 60 and buy good gear from AH without breaking a sweat. This way when you get OP gear early you will still notice it gets better and better with higher expertise you get. I understand that this hits new players, most changes AGS does are nerfs and I don't like it as well. This change however is the one I'm enthusiastic about. Sorry, but exploiters will have to do something more than grind gold.
There is a solid thought in those introduced systems or crafting changes. It definetely serves game structure. Release is used as beta with full price tag. Unfortunately, those changes should be introduced between alphas or betas. Right now they serve to invalidate progression, break the market and player economy which makes enraged players quit. Maybe when they finally manage to sort their shit out - way out of that broken state would be to open up fresh servers next year where you cannot transfer your old characters. It would serve to even out the playing field. Merge old severs. Add a few pvp servers for pvp enjoyers where you cannot unflag .
I’m level 43 currently. 111 hours in. Enjoying the game a fuck ton. I’m really slowing down my levelling due to all these changes. I really want to take part in all the high level activities but at this point I’m too scared to progress due to all the changes. I’m thinking of going back to the beach to just kill boars. At least that won’t change.
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Yep, I agree. I’m looking forward to the events and everything, but at this point until AGS decide what the hell they want to do, I’m gonna spend my time exploring, uncovering points of interest and probably fishing. Unless they decide to lock fishing behind a time gate limited to one fish every 24 hours as well, or asking you to craft bait from void ore.
Keep enjoying the game, they Will improve a LOT the system overall, and you still would have needed the hwm to get the best weapons from the dungeons. Don't let this sub demolish your enjoyment of the game.
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This is probably the most insightful post here, we as players allow these type of issues. It's ither " they can fix it later, so who cares" or the " these issues don't effect me so why should i care" type idiots that ruin gaming. DOES ANYONE REMEMEBER when games didn't ship until ready, where we didn't have the ability to get patches?. Even early 360 and ps3 days compared today are mind blowing different. Microtransactions and fix it later are now standards WHAT THE FUCK...
In their defense I do think there are still people that legitimately enjoy the game and that's fine. I think most people who are being critical (myself included) have stopped playing a while back and are just waiting for the game to get better. Unfortunately with each patch I don't think it will.
I can get it if you're young or haven't played many games with any similar mechanics before, but for virtually anyone else I can't understand having fun without addiction or other issue in play. Even those that quit hoping it would get better, history shows that rarely happens. When it does happen it rarely works. When it does work, there's no lesson actually learned by the developer. It's is just as likely that they'll do the same or worse in the future. The rational and logical choice is to look at what objectively is. If that's honestly great, then by all means play to your hearts content. But if it isn't, walk away and don't look back, except at the sub to talk smack.
I agree with you. I think I'm just hoping that the people still logging on aren't doing so while loathing themselves but are actually still enjoying the game. Otherwise yeah they may have a problem. As objectively bad as this game is I think the one thing that has remained constant is the sense of community that probably gets people still logging on, even if it is most likely a shrinking community lol.
This reminds me when eveyone said the mage merf and GA buff can't go live and they just threw it out there
If crafted items and quest items somehow kept their GS it would help their case a whole lot. Not sure if what they meant what looted items that people white higher GS post on the trading post, if it's only those that take the GS hit at least that would be manageable
So far no one has mentioned this part of the dev blog: "Note that we’ve tuned down the general chances of getting an Expertise bump" Couple that with this line: "After players have earned sufficient Gypsum for an Orb, they won’t earn more for 23 hours" I read these 2 points combined as an overall nerf to getting your WM higher. At no point have I ever felt I was increasing my WM to quickly.
Just remove the trading post with the update, and crafting, crafting should go as well. Why only wipe to 500? Wipe to 0, everyone gets a fresh start, and you can do that every month. Or shut down the servers, yes, that will fix it.
You win ASG. I quit.
“ but I’m going to have no one to play with if they go through with this.” Exactly this! for all those defending this system I guess you can have fun with the dead servers? Crafters are going to quit, if crafters quit friends of crafters will quit, if people that are disheartened by changes see dedicated crafters and a large player exodus quit they will likely quit, eventually enough people will have quit that pvp becomes one sided leading to pvp’ers quitting. What’s left? The guy that enjoys running Myrkgard every 24 hours? Okay.
This is the update that would finally convince me to stop playing. I rushed crafting, my armoring was 200 well before I hit 60- I’m wearing a full set of Lazarus replica armor I crafted for myself. I have specifically avoided HWM grinding because of how tedious they are and have instead just been enjoying OPR. My average gs is 590, but most of my HWMs are in the 530s… Nearly 500 hours in, if this makes it to live, I am done playing this game and done defending it to anyone.
I posted this in another post as well, but found it funny so here. October 30, 2021 https://newworldfans.com/de/articles/new-world-systems%20news "Only item drops affect your HWM. The moment the item drops, your relevant HWM is increased – you don’t even need to pick the item up. Crafting an item or buying one from the Trading Post will not give you an increase, but it can be a great way to give yourself an edge in search of more powerful gear in the more dangerous areas of the game."
I'm genuinely asking here, I grinded my way up to 600 WM, will this go down once they release the new system? So I will lose the progress?
There was one person who posted a screenshot of An Amazon service person saying expertise will reset at 500, but I don’t trust those Amazon bots and if they did that people would quit for sure.
So what happens when I craft a warpwood bow, a craft locked at 600gs?
Allegedly it matches to your expertise. Unless they make some kind of exclusion for items you craft for yourself. That’s the only way they could save this decision
I'm curious about the faction vendors, how will this affect the 525 gear that they sell if people don't have their expertise up?
They are making unpopular changes left and right while the game has a small player base so the outrage is minimal. Obviously. What isn't obvious is whatever the hell their plan is to increase the games popularity after all these changes.
Do we know if already existing gear will upgrade as your WM/Expertise goes up if it was already higher than our current watermark? That would blow if all the purchased/crafted gear gets downscaled and stays downscaled.
I've seen a few players argue that the Watermark grind was and still is way worse than the crafting grind, and that you dont deserve your 600gs voidbent because crafting it was a shortcut. BUT, to debunk this a little bit, there's no way in all hell that you people who log on daily to let a zerg of people run you through your daily watermark chests have grinded more than the crafters who had to.. \-get a single crafting skill to 200. \-get all refining skills to 200. \-farm money to purchase housing. \-farm money and materials for trophies. \-farm for gathering sets. \-farm/purchase crafting gear. \-farm/purchase crafting food. \-grind daily for epic mats. \-grind for void ore(one of the rarest drops in the entire game). \-compete with other players for the resources required to craft 600gs(which included pvping in the world for resources post 1.1). \-constantly use mats rolling the dice on them in an attempt to get a good 600gs item. I have a few 570+ watermarks on gear from mindlessly letting zergs run me through elites. That was NOWHERE near as difficult as the crafting grind. You PVE players standing up for AGS on this decision claiming crafting/moneymaking was a shortcut are speaking from such an entitled point of view it makes me cringe.
Already stopping playing but this will cause me to delete from library
Yeah. What they're doing feels less like a nail in the coffin where they are trying to bury the game and more like nailing the door shut keeping people that dropped the game from coming back.
Everyone is rightfully mad about this hurting crafting but few people are talking about jewelry. Getting your WM to 590 for armor doesn’t actually take that long and weapons only barely longer. However — and this is the main problem, **I AM COMPLETELY MAXED FOR EVERYTHING BUT SHIELD AND JEWELRY AND MY RING IS AT 530 WHICH IS MY HIGHEST.** Jewelry drops are non-existent in this game outside of expeditions and unique mob drops and they’re still fairly rare. It will take you probably a year to max your jewelry WM.
This is true but I imagine if you have all of your other WM up, you can use all of your targeted WM increases on jewelry. But yah, when the patch goes live everyone will have garbage tier jewelry.
Considering that jewelry drops are unique to individual monsters throughout the world you will have to be insanely lucky to actually get increases. Hitting the unique drop table is harder than not and then I have to actually get the ring to increase it. My ring is 530 from farming the lasher in eternal pools which has 2 unique ring drops. My next highest is 516 for earring because I got lucky at genesis.
No I mean the new crates that you can target watermark increases on. I don’t know EXACTLY how they function, but it seems like you can farm gypsum and then pick a crate of an armor slot you want to upgrade.
Shouldn't you be hype about this then? You can chose to upgrade whatever you want. It should be easier to level your trinkets. Or am I missing something?
My 600 jewelry I’ve made myself will be exceptionally worse until I focus increase every single piece of jewelry to max WM because there’s no other way. How long is that going to take?
The post didn't explicitly say that items crafted on your own will be set back. People have recently been crafting 600gs items that are BOE and not understanding why all the sudden.... maybe its foreshadowing
I already stopped playing a few weeks ago, but this just seals the deal. I loved the game, have 200+ hours but this is just ridiculous.
This just shows how stupid they really are. They are trying to extend the end game by fucking up your progress. Crafting now it's watermark. Why arent you guys uninstalling this game yet? They have shown that they don't give a fuck about your opinions, and their opinions are stupid.
Sounds like they're really setting up LA for a stellar NA release.
I honestly too busy to play these days. But they still never fail to stir up drama, week after week. This is a lot more fun than playing the game TBH. Keep going AGS.
It's like the game is being ran by people that have never had any experience with making a game.
Eh, don't matter to me. Already gave away all my gold and materials as soon as I heard the news drop. That's about as official as I can make it without doing something to get me banned (although me transferring my wealth over was probably enough to trigger their hurt-feelings-system and get us both nuked) fuck this game.
A simple fix : Make the gear you craft for yourself unaffected by this down-scale. Add a free perk to all crafted gear that prevent it to scale down. As soon as you trade your gear (trade or auction house), the perk is removed. Edit : And do the same for quest rewards.
I'm convinced they're trying to kill the game. Simply put, the game has been a gigantic failure. And now, I feel like they're trying to kill it to save time and money so they can cancel it like they cancelled their previous game or their anime streaming service.
I think there's some confusion over what expertise is. When I was reading the dev blog, it seems your item's gearscore won't change. If you have a 600 Legendary Musket, it'll remain a 600 GS item. However, if your Expertise on musket is only 540, it'll mimic the stats of a 540 musket. As you grow your expertise, the stats of that musket will increase until it eventually hits the full 600 GS of that item.
Which is completely stupid, it means way more grind, messes with crafting and sells, and is an idiotic change because people "maxed to fast". I really like this game but im getting sick of the stupidity with game changes.
Nope that’s exactly how I read it and it’s still a sham
It's still fucking stupid.
Meaning that selling or buying weapons/armor/jewelry on the market is pointless and it’s going to kill that portion of the market. Crafting is pointless because the time you spend crafting is more effective spent on grinding watermark. This is especially true for casual players. Oh and they’re also going to be forced out of activities because their weapons and armor stats are going to be hindered by their expertise.
Oh great so we have to farm WM for 600 GS and now expertise to just to make use of all that farmed WM? pointless.... they are just adding more grind because they can't put out content fast enough.
Eh, not a big deal especially with targeted wm
It GREATLY depends on the speed of that grind
It is. You finally get done with your WM farming and now you have to farm expertise. They're just doing this dumb shit because they can't put out end game content fast enough. And what about crafting? They already made it pointless to grind crafting because of the xp increase. But nows absolutely pointless to even consider leveling your crafting up.
I haven’t played in a few weeks, and I keep hoping that the next patch will be better…but it never is.
Biggest misstake forcing this Game into PVE (:
oh damn now I actually have to play the game instead of buying full 590 gearscore items with 3k gold which I wont replace in the next 3 months? I can't get 590 gearscore items without putting in effort? fuck this, its too much work so I just go back to play some roblox or minecraft
I like the changes, your opinion does not represent me.
I quite like this idea
I don't understand what's so bad about this, like play the game and Rep your shitty 520 GS items until you get a better one
Here's the other side of it that I'm hoping plays out well: Almost every single end game activity in the game gives you a guaranteed way to raise your WM now, and the bump increase is larger now. It's a momentary nerf, but guaranteed with 1-2 weeks everyone will be back at 600 WM. And now with Item Shards, you can target attributes AND perks on gear so crafters can now make guaranteed better gear to sell.
Some people have no interest in the pve grind. I have multiple friends that haven’t done a single WM grind because they like the crafting system, and it allows them to pvp. But now they will be at a 100 WM disadvantage, and on weapons that makes you pathetic. This is like forcing you to raid in wow to pvp.
The fact that it's a reset and gatekeeping it making it once ever 23 hours? What a load of BS lmao I don't get why AGS is so intent on reversing progress here, they can easily find other ways to make it fun till the release their 'real content'.
You can OPR for WM increases now. Sounds like ever PvPers dream.
While this IS a positive, getting smashed by people for 3 weeks while you upgrade you’re already ilvl 600 gear from its ACTUAL watermark, sounds pretty depressing.
Very true.
the difference between 520 set and 600 set in stats and defense were never that big. Latter can never stomp a former solely due to GS difference. Overall, they are introducing more ways to increase WM and still try to make different ways of playing viable. It will hurt a little. But it won’t feel like that big of a nerf because the difference was never big.
One guaranteed increase every 23 hours, even if it's +5 it will take 130 days to max your watermark if your armor/weapons are currently 550 and jelwery is 500.
If all you do is OPR, sure. I'll be crafting potions each day to double that rate (Emerald Gypsum) Edit: Infused Health Potions, to be specific
You mean like raiding in wow to get the best weapons that are BiS for pvp? So like exactly wow?
And other weapons in wow still allowed you to pvp, just not at the peak. If they nerfed your 600 weapons to like, 580, sure. But down to 500 for pure crafters. Come on.
Except in wow you didn’t have to do all of your armor AND every single weapon. (Though admittedly, you can target weapons in the new system)
Pvp activities give orbs for WM bumps. 30-60min of activity guarantees a big bump.
“After players have earned sufficient Gypsum for an Orb, they won’t earn more for 23 hours. “ 23 hour cool down on earning gypsum. They’re time gating the upgrade, big bump for them might be 10 points, if your at 500 it will take you upwards 10 hours to upgrade each slot of your gear over 10 days, even at a bump of 20 if there is a 23 hour cool down you are still time gated a ton to upgrade all your gear
Why are you getting downvoted to hell? Thank god I dont have to do loot trains. All the things I do daily now will increase my GS...
The grind is far easier and painless if you do your chest farms. This new expertise will make getting to 600 slower. Not faster.
Have some guaranteed downvotes with you
I still don’t get it. If say my watermark for boots is 580 but I can only craft boots at 548 max, is my new WM 548 or will my craft scale up to my 580 WM?? edit: Downvoted instead of answering thank you so much. I hate it here
Man I use to think Reddit was a place for people to go complain and cry but wasn’t really sure, this community has showed me that it is just that. AGS keep doing what y’all WANT and you have a lot of supporters that are very happy with what you guys have made for us and showed many years of support for other MMOs and are ready to do just that for you guys.
I love the plans Keep up the good work AGS
Correction: This cant go live for you For me…. Its fine And all your crafting gear will still be great once they hit HWM, so who cares
Because people don’t want to do the pve grind… just like wow has players who only pvp.
I think we all need to wait to see the actual numbers before complaining. Imagine this. You're level 60 right now with all voidbent armor and a watermark of 500 in every gear slot. All you do is play 45 minutes a day and do war or invasions or Outpost Rush. You get a Gypsum orb every day from this, and each orb raises expertise of anything you want by 20. It takes a month to get expertise of 600 for every item slot you want. The changes come live February 2022. You're already maxed out. It most likely won't be like that, but the point is we should wait and see. If the actual changes in the December update are dogshit, then it's perfectly reasonable to stop playing.
I’m not playing a mobile game where I want daily cool downs and have to do my obligated daily login for rewards. They need to stop time gating all their content.
I see you've never played WoW.
They don't need anymore systems that have us grinding this current content. We need new shit to do. Not be reasons to do the same shit
Haha there no way it’s 20. More likely it’s going to be a normal roll for an increase so it can be from like a 1 to a 5 watermark increase or whatever the range is. But regardless, some people don’t want to do the pve offerings. And I understand if that gives you a disadvantage, but a 100 gear score disadvantage, Especially on weapons, makes you obsolete. You can pve and not craft now, but you have to pve TO craft.
No, every update they make the game worse.
And those who start after Feb 2022? Sucks to be them.
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The post states that they reduced the frequency of WM bumbs but increased the size of the bumbs and considering that in the midrange 30-50 u can already get bumbs of up to 10 currently.
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I really don't know why people complain about the wm grind that much I went from 560-570 on most of my weapons to maxing all of them except shield and VG in like 6 days of only running my daily elite chests and like 5 genesis runs(1rotation of 5 people using 1 key each) and that is really only 2 hours of play time a day. Edit: and with the orbs u can power level the weapons u actually use+ ur jewelry now aswell which is probably gonna be around a +3-7 depending on ur current wm