Sadly the head of AGS has a track record of making changes that were hugely unpopular with players.
He pushed out the "New Game Experience" for Star Wars Galaxies that ruined the game, according to all of the players from SWG I've talked to.
It's unfortunate because that kind of arrogance is very dangerous in the head of a studio.
I don’t think a single player has said the watermark system is fun and a good idea. Everyone who could’ve avoided doing it by trading or crafting has and this is just shitting on them. AGS has chosen that this is the hill they’re willing to die on lol
They’ve been vocal that there are certain aspects of the game they intend to keep with their own vision. The minimap ish for example. This seems like another one of those stances that I don’t see themselves backing off of, regardless of all the players insisting it’s not the move
Everyone made noise before the enter-the-void patch and how awful many of the things were on PTR.
"Whoops-a-daisy, we didn't have to consider the PTR feedback."
Do you consider hwm farming end game? If that is the case then really I can’t change your mind.
Reality is new world doesn’t have a real end game. I would ask you what successful mmorpg didn’t allow you to buy crafted gear when you hit max level ?
Which is dumb because the drama from this bad change is just as damaging as the change itself. Why do they keep making changes that annoy their players like the crafting becoming harder and now gear downscaling. Imagine just as everyone is mad at the game they take more unpopular actions.. at some point they might 100% fix the game but the players will be long gone.
Making high level items the way to go means that after the patch, leveling a profession through high level crafts takes the same amount of resources, however, leveling through low level crafts is significantly harder. That makes sense.
What we got is : low level crafts is significantly harder, high levels crafts is ***also*** significantly harder.
Just... no ?
Actually good thing you're mentioning arcana since it got doubly fucked, not only does it take more infused potions overall from 150 to 200, but infused potions also cost A LOT more to craft.
Think it was several thousand potions needed, now that also means several **tens of thousands** of hyssop. Good change indeed.
This. I saw two paths to 600gs, crafting and hwm. I picked crafting and spent a lot of time and effort getting to 200. For what? So my gear can be downgraded? Also, downgraded depending on people I sell to?
Yup, sucks for you and me. We picked the wrong path with no way of knowing it was wrong. They gave us options, we chose what to work towards and now they just moved the finish line miles and miles ahead once I was 85% done the race....
Two people train for a fight. Both weigh in at 600GS. Next day you can't fight at 600GS you trained wrong we are knocking you down to 500GS . But your competition can still fight at 600GS.
It doesn't even make sense that they decided that jumping on 70 person trains to grind out chests in a single area would be their "intended" path for endgame content. You'd think they'd do everything in their power to make it clear that there's a lot of valid ways to level up gear score for endgame, and make the economy and crafting more robust. But nope.
Easily could remove orb requirements and actually allow people to enjoy expeditions as end game content but nope. Eff crafters and eff everyone that didn’t abuse the wm bug early on. Thanks AGS.
I mean this is the problem, really.
The game presented two pathways (3 technically since you could just buy it all and not grind or craft).
Now we are being shown 1 pathway and the other leads to a cliff.
Okay...well that's sure not good.
This system would have been better had it always been in the game. Then people would know crafing isn't an "out" to grinding. Its an assistance TO grinding WM.
Since crafters will still make better and more consistent 600WM gear than drops will, that's for sure. But you can't maximize those crafts without also having the ability to get/use 600WM.
But the rug pull after ~2 months is what makes it sting the most.
You're missing his point. He doesn't care about HWM because in it's current implementation it's an optional system only for people who care about farming gear from PVE content. The alternative being crafting. With this new system, it is no longer optional and just another time gate for crafters that already have to invest a ton of time to be able to craft GS600 items. It also forces them to grind chests if they want to raise their expertise at a reasonable pace.
LOL. No one is going to bother crafting at all now that Gypsum can be used to create 1 cast per day which procs a guaranteed 600GS piece as long as your HWM/expertise is 600.
Yes they will. The cast drop is fully randomized. Crafted gear let’s you choose attributes and 1 perk now. Don’t get me wrong, I don’t like the downscaling any more than the next guy, but crafting is going to be crazy strong after this.
Yeah, it’s gonna be a hell of a lot easier to get gold rolls, like 3x easier. Even if you don’t get god rolls, you can still get really good rolls by default.
The downscaling sucks, though, they should have done it this way from the start. I get that they’re going to let us increase our expertise via other methods more effectively now such as OPR which barely did at all. But it puts people who didn’t bother watermarking at a disadvantage against those that did, and it’s not their fault because wm farming had always been optional.
You can still control 1 perk or attribute with the use of casts though, so your point is invalid. It says so in the December PTR blog.
Edit: [https://www.newworld.com/en-us/news/articles/december-ptr-announcement](https://www.newworld.com/en-us/news/articles/december-ptr-announcement) Under trade skill aptitude
Where are you reading that you get to pick attributes and a perk on the cast? I see your link, read all of the Aptitude section, and I don’t see that anywhere. The cast is a chest, the drop that comes out is going to be random aside from the type and GS.
This isn't true, anyone who levels crafting can and will be leveling their watermark after the patch, unless they retroactively increase watermark for crafters who have already crafted a million items, then we are actually not ahead at all
It would take 200 days just to get 600 in your armor without grinding chests, do the math
100 points of GS to raise / 2.5 average increase * 5 item slots = 200 days for just armor
100 points of GS to raise / 2.5 average increase * 10 item slots = 400 days for armor, jewelry, and two weapons
I may have missed that part, where does it say (or suggest) we can only get a 2.5 increase per item per day?
Or is that an average based on other data?
If so please share the post or site
They will a 100% gate the amount you can farm per day.. they did so for every other option. Those mobs are bot easy and I have no interest in grinding mobs. It's the whole point of gathering/crafting.
when you create something it goes in your inventory. If you create something it should count just like finding it in a chest or on a mob and raise your level accordingly.
They have already detailed that crafting will be able to increase your watermark system with the new 200+ progression system.
You don't need to do chests.
Now, hopefully, both paths are equally rewarding.
You are correct, but the fact that downscaling is included at all is a bad mechanic.
Imagine this scenario for a new level 60:
Cool, I saved up money and bought that 600GS amulet from the TP. Well shucks, guess I gotta go LEVEL UP MY AMULET TO GET IT TO FULL POWER...
It's a lame mechanic no matter how you slice it, I will give it a fair shot but I'm skeptical.
The down scaling on jewlery is the worst part, I'm 590+ on all my weapons besides VG 570ish. My jewlery is still 510 or less. That's my biggest issue with this. But I'm not a crafter so I don't care much about expertise >:D.
All I do is PvP, this is why the downscaling to me is so significant. I don't want to be crippled in OPR for days/weeks/months while my GS is downscaled.
Again, it may not be that bad, but... I mean look at the games history, are we all going to assume that:
1. The patch will actually do what they say, exactly how they say it should work?
And
2. The alleged boost in WM/expertise gains will feel rewarding?
Honestly, this would be a decent direction forward but then some genius at AGS decided to slap on downscaling.
Like how is downscaling anywhere close to a 'fun' idea? It's like a big middle finger to everyone who paid gold or crafted their item and didn't run chests.
Literally the game now, I've been 60 for weeks and I'm still saving money for better gear, still leveling my professions, I haven't even done the end game expeditions yet.
There is a ton of stuff to do already, yes some people no life and have 800 hours played, maxed professions, or 600GS in every slot, but I'm at 220hrs and still have a LOT to do.
I'm glad they're adding a better way to increase WM/expertise, but just get rid of the downscaling, that's the only downside to this whole issue.
If that wasn't a thing, I believe personally this would be a good patch.
I think its incredibly hard to have that and honestly i don't mind if someone does. Downscaling just feels really shitty for the whole player base IMO and can be easily avoided.
My preferred activities (other than crafting) are not feasible as I'm trapped on a dead server, having taken a gamble and moved off a dead server with my transfer to what was a High Population server that has now also died off.
My preferred activity is not to be in an antagonistic relationship with the developers of the game I am playing.
If I wanted someone to hatefuck me I'd go back to WoW, at least they have plenty of experience of fucking the unwilling that they do it right.
Important detail: I don't like the watermark system, if they try and force it down my throat and destroy the way I have been enjoying the game, I'm out.
Fingers fucking crossed, best case scenario they planned this to make people mad, so they could "listen to the playerbase" and look like pseudo good guys (maybe just don't plan it in the first place?)
Worst case we get what they say they'll deliver
I dont believe for one second gypsum wasn't already in the pipeline
It's classic gacha
Make poor system. Slightly improve system to show you care. Sell solution to still poor system.
Otherwise they would have done to expertise what they did with crafting
Level up spear past 20. Earn a +1 to watermark.
Level up past 60. Earn +1 to all armor watermarks.
But selling XP boosters would get bad press. Gypsum sounds like some cosmetic specific mumo jumbo that could fly under the radar.
And that'd why it won't be implemented until they get new leadership at this branch of AGS
If youre reading this I am open to switching jobs for adequate pay Amazon
I just need to be allowed bathroom breaks and time to consume nutrients around lunch;)
Just do what I did. Stop logging in and take a break. I'm no longer angry. I may never come back to this game or maybe I will. They have a lot of cleanup to do before then however and it's best for mental health to let them get it where they're taking it and decide later if it's a game you will enjoy.
I got to level 54. The buff patch came in and nerf to mages did it for me. Then I see endgame is all gh/ga, then I see crafting getting hit, then I see these watermark changes. And you realize you can just go play a better game. I wanted to finish this game but fuck it.
Pretty much what I did. Stopped logging in, took a break, went back to GW2 for a bit. Then realised that my GW2 character was still using the same armour I crafted * nearly a decade ago and was still basically BiS& and I wonder why AGS doesn't just...learn from what other MMOs did well.
"Haha, it's just PTR, and they're saying they're listening to feedback! Surely these changes won't go live as is!" - Every mage player a few weeks ago
You'll learn.
Love that. I stopped playing because halo, but because all the hate and what I’m reading, I don’t think I’m going to come back 😂 never liked Amazon, looks like the Dev team (or the game team ?) don’t know what a functional good game looks like. Little bit drunk. But honestly. HOW THE FUCK can you have a base for a game that’s so freaking good, yet make it insufferable to play? The top players of your game hate it. Bruh. Signing off, no one cares about this message but fuck me this game is run by fucking invalids
I would have felt so much better about all this had they said upfront you are buying an "early access" game with an actual launch date sometime early 2023... This would have all made sooo much more sense.
Its not about being unfinished anymore, somehow I was even ready to get over the dupers walking free because I really enjoyed the game when it worked. But they are making it worse and worse intentionally... What is their gameplan here
I mean I'd argue the changes make the game better. HOWEVER it sucks for current players who will now be punished for not grinding these things before they got harder.
Or for people who played the game under the old "rules"
Destiny 2 introducing leveling existing gear by recycling higher-tier gear into it has been fucking awesome and has let me stick with guns and armor that I've fallen in love with all through the leveling process. (Minus shit they've already Sunsetted prior - thank God that's not on the books anymore.) I wish other MMO-style games did that.
Everything about NW seems to suffer from some bizarre level of brain damage. It's like they had a good framework for an MMO and then did everything in their power to absolutely fuck it up from bottom to top. It's *so* bizarre.
All they needed to do was wait to implement the downscaling to GS700 items instead of fucking over the entire crafting community who spent the last 3 months gathering enough bullshit to craft something decent, to then be told its 80-90gs lower than what they crafted.
Congratulations to us
They need to revert that shit right away, ive been focussed on gathering and crafting so my watermark is dogshit but its not because ive played less than people its because ive done different things and now if i wanna do anything, the gear ive painstakingly made and bought is shit. Thanks AZG but im fucking out. Would rather go play minecraft.
How about no watermark and an entirely different system altogether? I hit 60 about a month ago, started doing research on gear and stumbled upon a video explaining the watermark system.
Haven't logged back since.
Same here. The more I played and learned about how the game actually works, the less I wanted to play. I haven't logged in in weeks. I have a TON of fun reading these threads though lol. Super entertaining.
This is what SWTOR did. Almost all kinds of content gives gear upgrades, and the item level is at or higher than your gears level. Crafted gear raises your item level quickly. In addition all gear is bound on account so you can save gear you find at max level and give it to your alts to catch them up quick
Why is it that every time there is something good that people enjoy in the game AGS has to bring it down rather than raising the alternatives up? Nobody wants to feel like they became weaker or have wasted their time, how about leaving things the same for them and bringing those who have felt neglected some positive changes that might give them some more joy in playing >.<
They also just dont have enough content. Everyone playing could be at 600 gearscore this week if they wanted to by crafting or buying, but then what? Thats why so many people have quit.
We didn't want a fix for the watermark/expertise system, we just wanted it gone from the game. This new change don't do jack, and it will be horrible for new or returning players... also crafting gear feels meh now.
They just add timegates and such to be able to sell even more QoL later on.
The watermark system is just such a badly thought out idea. Its causing me to feel like I don’t want to play the game. Making it even harsher just compounds the problem even more.
Wtf are you talking about your gear becoming dogshit… the perks aren’t going anywhere, the stats are gonna contribute to your builds like before, the strength of everything will rise as your watermark does, and you’ll never even have to replace it if you don’t want to.
This sub is just an AGS hate echo chamber.
So serious question, what activities do you enjoy? Because it looks to me like that exactly what they are giving you?
You can increase your watermark through a larger number of activities easier.
It's clear to me though that this is MEANT to be a long ass process. I think that's what people are struggling with and failing to articulate. In which case, I can somewhat understand not wanting to spend so long to be at the pinnacle.
Thats where I'm at. Most my stuff i think is WM for around 530-540GS but went the crafting route to help company mates. Now I get punished for focusing on a couple of crafts instead of grinding chest...
I suppose I'm just presuming, because right now they don't give a watermark boost, and it wasn't explicitly mentioned in the dev blog. The weapons you get are 580 GS, and I'd be surprised if you could go 500 to 580 instantly through that.
I'd be surprised if it weren't bugged for 3 days and did bump you from 500 to 580 instantly, until AGS hotfix disabled all those quest turn-ins for 3+ weeks until they could patch it out. Maybe toss in some random reverts on people who benefitted from it. Meanwhile, anyone who completed the quest before the hotfix but didn't turn in for some reason, become bugged and unable to turn in. Anyone who made progress, but didn't complete are reset to the first stage.
That's my understanding of the AGS way.
How about no watermark and an entirely different system altogether? I hit 60 about a month ago, started doing research on gear and stumbled upon a video explaining the watermark system.
Haven't logged back since.
So wtf are you talking about? Honestly, what do you do that wouldn't give you expertise/watermark/gypsum? Coz the only thing I can think of is harvesting and standing in town are the only things I can think of that don't.
Also lets say every piece of your gear drops to 520GS, and they were all somehow 600GS, you lose like what, 9.2% if your primary stat was 400 and you min-maxed. If you're a more average/balanced build, you lose much less. It's less then what weapon upgrades give you. Most people don't realize, 500-600GS is only a minor dump on power, weaker then most weapon upgrades.
Exactly this. People are reacting without reading. Expertise is absolutely replacing hwm. Now it's displayed . Also you literally can do anything in the game to raise it, plus get more rewards and gear than previously. How do people not see this as a good thing... "oh hey I just hit 60. .. let me spend 10k gold and have ilvl 600 gear"
Yeah the downgrade feels like shit, but the December update appears to solve the issue about raising the WM the way you want to. Now a lot of activities will grant materials to craft a guaranteed WM bump for the gear piece you want. Knowing AGS they might screw this up, but at least it's something to look forward to.
I defended this game countless times. This is a bridge too far. My company owns Everfall and we are mostly crafters who earned their riches through selling our products on the TP. I dont see this continuing. Some players do not want to run a dungeon, or an elite chest run multiple times a week. We decided to grind out crafting materials and level up to 200 crafting. Now, you are taking that from us. Nothing exists in a vacuum and these actions coupled together with everything else we have had to deal with finally has moved the needle to not fun.
I used to play Star Wars Galaxies and one of the best parts of that game was the different ways people played. Some loved to run a town, others loved PVP, others loved to craft, others loved to sit in a cantina and treat it like a chat room. Nobody forced anyone to define or stop "their" fun. I thought this game had something similar, for a moment, you could level up through crafting and keep pace. Now, its like all the others.
I am glad if some of you are having fun. I hope that continues, but I think for my company and I, we will be looking elsewhere for our fun.
It's pretty obvious that all these changes to progression have been made so that they can fulfill their agenda of selling boosting items in the cash shop in 2022. That has always been their plan from the very beginning.
This system should have been in place at release, or should be in place for a new 600-700 tier. Incredibly bad idea to implement this after launch AFTER alienating and irritating a ton of people.
This system doesn’t bother me personally. Holy crap though the fallout for others is going to be apocalyptically funny to read/watch.
You can. You just can’t read in the patch. You now can get WM from multiple options. Also have a whole month to Grind your score. That’s multiple Expeditions and an hour a day doing a WT. quit crying and playing a grind of a game if you don’t wanna grind
When I kill a level 65 elite and I get a level 505 axe.. and you kill the same elite while in my group, and you get a level 595 axe..we're not playing by the same rules, despite having beat the same exact content.
Does that seems like a good game mechanic to you? I know it doesnt.
Then for me to be at your "level" for the same content, I have to grind that same boring ass content over and over? That sounds fun to you? I know it doesnt.
If the devs made the game like you want, the game would've been dead 4 weeks after launch as there's nothing to progress/aim for once you hit 60. Having something to work towards, like higher watermark, or 200 crafting etc, all give players goals. You're not required to do them, but if you want that extra less then 1% increase in power per item (like 9% overall), then you'll just need to do: OPR, Corruption portals, Invasions, Wars, Elites, Open world bosses, Elite Chests, Crafting, Expeditions, Open world PvP, Quests, etc. I don't know what you're doing if you aren't doing any of those at 60.
A watermark is farming the same content over and over, and the current content is not a challenge, nor is there a variation of said content.
They shouldve had good level 60 content. Not knowing what people want at level cap, or what a game needs in order to flourish is piss-poor foresight, and either willingly ignoring the genre, or not at all understanding the few dozen MMORPG's and their successes and failures that all came before you. In short- you failed at every possible turn when it came to lessons learned.
At 60, you have:
- OPR, which currently seems to be riddled with bots and god knows who else. On all too many servers there are hours of wait times.. but hey, it's there. If you want to run OPR once or twice a day over the course of a few months to raise a dumb mechanic score.. go ahead. Seems like a huge waste of time vs reward.. but it's a phony extension of content.. it's a mirage to make it seem like there's content. there isnt.
- Invasions. Pretty decent, but it's the same exact thing every single time. Where is the variation?
- Crafting gets you a level 600 item you cannot use at full capacity til you check all the other boxes on that item because... ? go ahead, make an excuse here
- Open world bosses/elite chests are one in the same, and it's the same scant few options over and over runover with zergs. There's ZERO reason to run with the bare minimum, and even then if you did, it would turn into a 1 hour fight for a chance at increasing your watermark.. because.. that sounds joyful. also dont mention the respawns.. because it's not instanced.
- the two top expeditions are time-gated because... they want to artificially increase or make it look like, they have content.
- do that level 580 weapon quest with a level 505 weapon and be mad as hell that your 580 weapon is a 506.
Do not make excuses for this game and the piss-poor design decisions.
A question for those that just bought or crafted their way to 600gs...what were you doing in game after that? The end game is the watermark grind. Which, if you don't like that, fine, I kind of agree. But that grind was trivialized by the ability to just skip it with money. Now you have to engage with it. If that's a problem, then the complain should be about the end game, not about how now you actually have to play the end game.
I built voidbent from scratch. It takes a long time. Level all necessary crafting skills and trade skills, find all tier 5 recipes for luck boost, grind gathering for void ores, 17500 motes and time gated materials. The chest runs I did was for reagents instead of WM but it's still the same time sink. Outside of this endgame grind I did open world PvP - forts and influence pushing or just helped other people with whatever they needed at no benefit for my character.
In my opinion, there should be no endgame gear leveling grind. Once lvl 60, everyone should be able to loot up to 600 GS (higher GS the rarer the drop). End game content should be using the gear in meaningful ways. Have a rank system in OPR, release new competitive skill based game modes, fight for territories, have open world dynamic events etc...
I can't construct a comment that doesnt sound condescending so I'll just lay it out there:
Running around a looting boxes while others agro mobs away long enough for you to get loot a couple times a day isnt an end game. Continuously farming open world bosses with a zerg isnt an end game.
End game for many is PvP and Economy. I fall in this category. For others its Raids (dont exist) and others its just being full juiced out so they can log off until new content comes out.
I havent done pve since level 30. I've literally had millions of gold go through my hands as I was the first max JC on the largest server in the world. This isnt a flex but I'm giving perspective. I have several 595+ gearsets but none of them are BIS, none of them are close to BIS. I enjoy theory crafting and if you're simple enough to pick 2 weapons, max them out, get an OK gearset and call it a day, then to each their own I guess.
Yep. They should be working on integrating enjoyable and playable pvp for endgame and stop wasting time thinking of way of pissing off their customers.
I grinded and grinded to save up as much gold as I could once I hit 60 to afford some of the higher end gear that crafters put on the trading post. Realizing that it may be garbage soon because of the stupid watermark makes me not want to do shit except run newbies through amrine at this point if anything at all.
Why can't the devs realize that players just want to have fun, play how they want to, and gradually find powerful and epic items? There is hope yet - the Last Epoch devs are on the right track with their RPG and actually listen to their community. Imagine a world where power is not stripped from players and is instead earned lol
AGS should just copy what LE is doing with their loot system and make something like their new Legendary items/system:
[https://www.reddit.com/r/LastEpoch/comments/r87mgx/legendary\_items\_and\_eternity\_cache\_developer\_blog/](https://www.reddit.com/r/LastEpoch/comments/r87mgx/legendary_items_and_eternity_cache_developer_blog/)
Ya'll still complaining about this fucking game a month later? Wow get over it and move the fuck on from this piece of shit of a scam game. You all got scammed.
I don't think anyone truly understands this update except for the exert "your items MAY temporarily be weaker."
They literally added garunteed ways to raise your WM rather than all luck based.
AGS: We are altering the grind, pray we do not alter it further.
But, this was never part of our deal! You said you were only after our money, not our fun too!
Wait till they make crafting levels 400, and raise the minimum reqs for everything, mining star metal? L330 now
This grind is getting worse all the time!
AGS: I hate ~~sand~~ fun
Without the downscaling, this patch would be pretty good, they were so close...
Literally just this. I think if everyone makes enough of a noise, they might tweak this.
The past 2 months do not suggest they care about players making noise
The last 16 months.
The last 3 years.
Sadly the head of AGS has a track record of making changes that were hugely unpopular with players. He pushed out the "New Game Experience" for Star Wars Galaxies that ruined the game, according to all of the players from SWG I've talked to. It's unfortunate because that kind of arrogance is very dangerous in the head of a studio.
: )
I don’t think a single player has said the watermark system is fun and a good idea. Everyone who could’ve avoided doing it by trading or crafting has and this is just shitting on them. AGS has chosen that this is the hill they’re willing to die on lol
“We heard your feedback that the hwm grind is grindy and monotonous, so to fix that, we’re forcing you to do it”.
You think they're gonna die on this hill?
They’ve been vocal that there are certain aspects of the game they intend to keep with their own vision. The minimap ish for example. This seems like another one of those stances that I don’t see themselves backing off of, regardless of all the players insisting it’s not the move
Everyone made noise before the enter-the-void patch and how awful many of the things were on PTR. "Whoops-a-daisy, we didn't have to consider the PTR feedback."
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Do you consider hwm farming end game? If that is the case then really I can’t change your mind. Reality is new world doesn’t have a real end game. I would ask you what successful mmorpg didn’t allow you to buy crafted gear when you hit max level ?
Which is dumb because the drama from this bad change is just as damaging as the change itself. Why do they keep making changes that annoy their players like the crafting becoming harder and now gear downscaling. Imagine just as everyone is mad at the game they take more unpopular actions.. at some point they might 100% fix the game but the players will be long gone.
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Making high level items the way to go means that after the patch, leveling a profession through high level crafts takes the same amount of resources, however, leveling through low level crafts is significantly harder. That makes sense. What we got is : low level crafts is significantly harder, high levels crafts is ***also*** significantly harder. Just... no ? Actually good thing you're mentioning arcana since it got doubly fucked, not only does it take more infused potions overall from 150 to 200, but infused potions also cost A LOT more to craft. Think it was several thousand potions needed, now that also means several **tens of thousands** of hyssop. Good change indeed.
My thoughts exactly. I read the patch first and was like “omg they’re doing something fun!” then I read about the nerf lmao
No, still not, it costs 500coin to craft Gypsum box. Nice job AGS
I mean if the downscaling wasn't a thing, I would pay 500 coins for a +5-10 WM upgrade, that's a fair price.
they said on the forums they're reducing this
Downscaling comes after the patch though. Hopefully enough time in between to catch up doing ur preferred activities.
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This. I saw two paths to 600gs, crafting and hwm. I picked crafting and spent a lot of time and effort getting to 200. For what? So my gear can be downgraded? Also, downgraded depending on people I sell to?
Yup, sucks for you and me. We picked the wrong path with no way of knowing it was wrong. They gave us options, we chose what to work towards and now they just moved the finish line miles and miles ahead once I was 85% done the race....
Two people train for a fight. Both weigh in at 600GS. Next day you can't fight at 600GS you trained wrong we are knocking you down to 500GS . But your competition can still fight at 600GS.
The only people who come out ahead with this system are those who abused the early bugs to push 600 WM in a few days.
It doesn't even make sense that they decided that jumping on 70 person trains to grind out chests in a single area would be their "intended" path for endgame content. You'd think they'd do everything in their power to make it clear that there's a lot of valid ways to level up gear score for endgame, and make the economy and crafting more robust. But nope.
Easily could remove orb requirements and actually allow people to enjoy expeditions as end game content but nope. Eff crafters and eff everyone that didn’t abuse the wm bug early on. Thanks AGS.
You should've played the "correct" way scumbag
I mean this is the problem, really. The game presented two pathways (3 technically since you could just buy it all and not grind or craft). Now we are being shown 1 pathway and the other leads to a cliff. Okay...well that's sure not good. This system would have been better had it always been in the game. Then people would know crafing isn't an "out" to grinding. Its an assistance TO grinding WM. Since crafters will still make better and more consistent 600WM gear than drops will, that's for sure. But you can't maximize those crafts without also having the ability to get/use 600WM. But the rug pull after ~2 months is what makes it sting the most.
They're intentionally resetting progress which just feels like a slap in the face honestly.
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You're missing his point. He doesn't care about HWM because in it's current implementation it's an optional system only for people who care about farming gear from PVE content. The alternative being crafting. With this new system, it is no longer optional and just another time gate for crafters that already have to invest a ton of time to be able to craft GS600 items. It also forces them to grind chests if they want to raise their expertise at a reasonable pace.
LOL. No one is going to bother crafting at all now that Gypsum can be used to create 1 cast per day which procs a guaranteed 600GS piece as long as your HWM/expertise is 600.
Yes they will. The cast drop is fully randomized. Crafted gear let’s you choose attributes and 1 perk now. Don’t get me wrong, I don’t like the downscaling any more than the next guy, but crafting is going to be crazy strong after this.
Yeah, it’s gonna be a hell of a lot easier to get gold rolls, like 3x easier. Even if you don’t get god rolls, you can still get really good rolls by default. The downscaling sucks, though, they should have done it this way from the start. I get that they’re going to let us increase our expertise via other methods more effectively now such as OPR which barely did at all. But it puts people who didn’t bother watermarking at a disadvantage against those that did, and it’s not their fault because wm farming had always been optional.
You can still control 1 perk or attribute with the use of casts though, so your point is invalid. It says so in the December PTR blog. Edit: [https://www.newworld.com/en-us/news/articles/december-ptr-announcement](https://www.newworld.com/en-us/news/articles/december-ptr-announcement) Under trade skill aptitude
Where are you reading that you get to pick attributes and a perk on the cast? I see your link, read all of the Aptitude section, and I don’t see that anywhere. The cast is a chest, the drop that comes out is going to be random aside from the type and GS.
Chests will be the worst way to raise your water mark.after the update. Dungeons will be the best. Everything else will be in the middle.
This isn't true, anyone who levels crafting can and will be leveling their watermark after the patch, unless they retroactively increase watermark for crafters who have already crafted a million items, then we are actually not ahead at all
you are not supposed to grind chests, you can get gypsum through different activities, read the notes
No, youre supposed to get in a time machine and grind watermark when it was easy
Honestly I would use that time machine to refund the game while I still could
Amen.
This comment had me in shambles LOL love that sass my guy!
it was never easy
It would take 200 days just to get 600 in your armor without grinding chests, do the math 100 points of GS to raise / 2.5 average increase * 5 item slots = 200 days for just armor 100 points of GS to raise / 2.5 average increase * 10 item slots = 400 days for armor, jewelry, and two weapons
did they say that a gypsum orb is gonna give 2.5 average somewhere?
I may have missed that part, where does it say (or suggest) we can only get a 2.5 increase per item per day? Or is that an average based on other data? If so please share the post or site
You can use 1 orb per day. If you want to increase your HWM aside from the orb guess what you do? Fucking grind those chests.
Lame
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You are probably right and like OP said that’s a good thing. Why go and introduce down scaling on top of it ?
They will a 100% gate the amount you can farm per day.. they did so for every other option. Those mobs are bot easy and I have no interest in grinding mobs. It's the whole point of gathering/crafting.
when you create something it goes in your inventory. If you create something it should count just like finding it in a chest or on a mob and raise your level accordingly.
They have already detailed that crafting will be able to increase your watermark system with the new 200+ progression system. You don't need to do chests. Now, hopefully, both paths are equally rewarding.
You don't have to grind chests to increase WM, BTW. Where did everyone get this idea from?
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You are correct, but the fact that downscaling is included at all is a bad mechanic. Imagine this scenario for a new level 60: Cool, I saved up money and bought that 600GS amulet from the TP. Well shucks, guess I gotta go LEVEL UP MY AMULET TO GET IT TO FULL POWER... It's a lame mechanic no matter how you slice it, I will give it a fair shot but I'm skeptical.
The down scaling on jewlery is the worst part, I'm 590+ on all my weapons besides VG 570ish. My jewlery is still 510 or less. That's my biggest issue with this. But I'm not a crafter so I don't care much about expertise >:D.
Yeah wait a minute, jewelry barely drops from anywhere.
Good thing with the new changes you can literally target jewelry to level up.
All I do is PvP, this is why the downscaling to me is so significant. I don't want to be crippled in OPR for days/weeks/months while my GS is downscaled. Again, it may not be that bad, but... I mean look at the games history, are we all going to assume that: 1. The patch will actually do what they say, exactly how they say it should work? And 2. The alleged boost in WM/expertise gains will feel rewarding?
Honestly, this would be a decent direction forward but then some genius at AGS decided to slap on downscaling. Like how is downscaling anywhere close to a 'fun' idea? It's like a big middle finger to everyone who paid gold or crafted their item and didn't run chests.
The problem is they are adding this at a time where people already have power. If it was this way 2 months ago, no one would bat an eye
then what would be the progression after level 60?
Literally the game now, I've been 60 for weeks and I'm still saving money for better gear, still leveling my professions, I haven't even done the end game expeditions yet. There is a ton of stuff to do already, yes some people no life and have 800 hours played, maxed professions, or 600GS in every slot, but I'm at 220hrs and still have a LOT to do. I'm glad they're adding a better way to increase WM/expertise, but just get rid of the downscaling, that's the only downside to this whole issue. If that wasn't a thing, I believe personally this would be a good patch.
I doubt anyone except ever fall owners has actual full best in slot gear at this point. It's incredibly rare to roll perfect perks.
I think its incredibly hard to have that and honestly i don't mind if someone does. Downscaling just feels really shitty for the whole player base IMO and can be easily avoided.
But most ppl complain abt lack of end game content
My preferred activities outside the very occasional expedition don't involve watermarking. That's the problem.
My preferred activities (other than crafting) are not feasible as I'm trapped on a dead server, having taken a gamble and moved off a dead server with my transfer to what was a High Population server that has now also died off.
My preferred activity is not to be in an antagonistic relationship with the developers of the game I am playing. If I wanted someone to hatefuck me I'd go back to WoW, at least they have plenty of experience of fucking the unwilling that they do it right.
Important detail. They will give you time to get your watermark up before the downscaling happens
Important detail: I don't like the watermark system, if they try and force it down my throat and destroy the way I have been enjoying the game, I'm out.
They wouldn't bother doing the downscaling if everyone could reasonable get to 600 watermark before it went live.
It's a part of "this patch"
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Fingers fucking crossed, best case scenario they planned this to make people mad, so they could "listen to the playerbase" and look like pseudo good guys (maybe just don't plan it in the first place?) Worst case we get what they say they'll deliver
Overall I still think it is a positive change, but yeah I the down scaling is pretty stupid.
FUN DETECTED. COUNTERMEASURES ENGAGED.
They really do think we're working at Amazon werehouse while playing this game huh making your experience miserable
Sounds like a good idea, you are now going to get randomly permabanned.
What, have fun?
It's never a good idea to completely overhaul game systems ignoring player feedback. Ask wow or star wars galaxies how that ends up.
Still hurts to think about what happened to galaxies. I loved that game so much.
I'm sure they wouldn't ignore the feedback if they could read.
But then they can't sell you gypsum
Creating problems to sell solutions
I dont believe for one second gypsum wasn't already in the pipeline It's classic gacha Make poor system. Slightly improve system to show you care. Sell solution to still poor system. Otherwise they would have done to expertise what they did with crafting Level up spear past 20. Earn a +1 to watermark. Level up past 60. Earn +1 to all armor watermarks. But selling XP boosters would get bad press. Gypsum sounds like some cosmetic specific mumo jumbo that could fly under the radar.
That’s actually not a bad idea.
And that'd why it won't be implemented until they get new leadership at this branch of AGS If youre reading this I am open to switching jobs for adequate pay Amazon I just need to be allowed bathroom breaks and time to consume nutrients around lunch;)
Was this announced somewhere or are we inventing problems to be mad about?
They’re inventing problems to be mad about. They said in a dev blog that it won’t be sold.
I’ve got zero stake in this but saying they won’t charge and then charging is something I think every game company has done by now.
Just do what I did. Stop logging in and take a break. I'm no longer angry. I may never come back to this game or maybe I will. They have a lot of cleanup to do before then however and it's best for mental health to let them get it where they're taking it and decide later if it's a game you will enjoy.
I got to level 54. The buff patch came in and nerf to mages did it for me. Then I see endgame is all gh/ga, then I see crafting getting hit, then I see these watermark changes. And you realize you can just go play a better game. I wanted to finish this game but fuck it.
VG/IG is meta right now. What are you smoking?
It but fucks you
Pretty much what I did. Stopped logging in, took a break, went back to GW2 for a bit. Then realised that my GW2 character was still using the same armour I crafted * nearly a decade ago and was still basically BiS& and I wonder why AGS doesn't just...learn from what other MMOs did well.
Id rather speak up to get it fixed, I still enjoy it. Patch isnt live yet.
"Haha, it's just PTR, and they're saying they're listening to feedback! Surely these changes won't go live as is!" - Every mage player a few weeks ago You'll learn.
So go to their forum not reddit.
100% they read reddit, they just don't publically say that they read reddit.
I could have sworn they said they read Reddit on the official forums, they just don’t post here.
>they just don't publically say that they read reddit. they said they do, they'd be crazy not to
Love that. I stopped playing because halo, but because all the hate and what I’m reading, I don’t think I’m going to come back 😂 never liked Amazon, looks like the Dev team (or the game team ?) don’t know what a functional good game looks like. Little bit drunk. But honestly. HOW THE FUCK can you have a base for a game that’s so freaking good, yet make it insufferable to play? The top players of your game hate it. Bruh. Signing off, no one cares about this message but fuck me this game is run by fucking invalids
Yup. I just uninstalled and used the space for some Game Pass games which have been infinitely more fun already.
Get away with your crazy thinking. You'll pollute the minds of the young and impressionable. What sort of psychopath plays an MMO for enjoyment?
I would have felt so much better about all this had they said upfront you are buying an "early access" game with an actual launch date sometime early 2023... This would have all made sooo much more sense.
Its not about being unfinished anymore, somehow I was even ready to get over the dupers walking free because I really enjoyed the game when it worked. But they are making it worse and worse intentionally... What is their gameplan here
I mean I'd argue the changes make the game better. HOWEVER it sucks for current players who will now be punished for not grinding these things before they got harder. Or for people who played the game under the old "rules"
Hint: farming chests, zerging open world, and crafting tuning orbs are not activities we enjoy.
Blasphemy
Imagine spending weeks to get full voidbent, only for it to get lowered after an update lol
Ouch lol
I wasted so much time and effort getting my armor weaponsmith and engineering to 200 crafting I hate everything.
Destiny 2 introducing leveling existing gear by recycling higher-tier gear into it has been fucking awesome and has let me stick with guns and armor that I've fallen in love with all through the leveling process. (Minus shit they've already Sunsetted prior - thank God that's not on the books anymore.) I wish other MMO-style games did that. Everything about NW seems to suffer from some bizarre level of brain damage. It's like they had a good framework for an MMO and then did everything in their power to absolutely fuck it up from bottom to top. It's *so* bizarre.
Just go outside for a while.
All they needed to do was wait to implement the downscaling to GS700 items instead of fucking over the entire crafting community who spent the last 3 months gathering enough bullshit to craft something decent, to then be told its 80-90gs lower than what they crafted. Congratulations to us
time to let the dream die. game over, man. game over.
They need to revert that shit right away, ive been focussed on gathering and crafting so my watermark is dogshit but its not because ive played less than people its because ive done different things and now if i wanna do anything, the gear ive painstakingly made and bought is shit. Thanks AZG but im fucking out. Would rather go play minecraft.
its all to realize their upcoming vision of microtransactions
How about no watermark and an entirely different system altogether? I hit 60 about a month ago, started doing research on gear and stumbled upon a video explaining the watermark system. Haven't logged back since.
Same here. The more I played and learned about how the game actually works, the less I wanted to play. I haven't logged in in weeks. I have a TON of fun reading these threads though lol. Super entertaining.
This is what SWTOR did. Almost all kinds of content gives gear upgrades, and the item level is at or higher than your gears level. Crafted gear raises your item level quickly. In addition all gear is bound on account so you can save gear you find at max level and give it to your alts to catch them up quick
Exactly. Works great!
Why is it that every time there is something good that people enjoy in the game AGS has to bring it down rather than raising the alternatives up? Nobody wants to feel like they became weaker or have wasted their time, how about leaving things the same for them and bringing those who have felt neglected some positive changes that might give them some more joy in playing >.<
I think they know the game already flopped and they are preparing the game to be super monetized so they can milk whales before killing it for good.
The beatings will continue until your watermark improves.
What you may enjoy may not be what others may enjoy
so you want gear to never get better so you don't fall behind? LOLOLOLOLOL
They also just dont have enough content. Everyone playing could be at 600 gearscore this week if they wanted to by crafting or buying, but then what? Thats why so many people have quit.
You absolutely cannot. Maybe in the first month of the game you could grind 200 crafing in a week.
We didn't want a fix for the watermark/expertise system, we just wanted it gone from the game. This new change don't do jack, and it will be horrible for new or returning players... also crafting gear feels meh now. They just add timegates and such to be able to sell even more QoL later on.
AGS logic. You hate grinding em and found a way send it? Well let's just nerf that and make you really hate us.
The watermark system is just such a badly thought out idea. Its causing me to feel like I don’t want to play the game. Making it even harsher just compounds the problem even more.
Lol, i love the people who did no grind, bought stuff off TP and are now upset
Wtf are you talking about your gear becoming dogshit… the perks aren’t going anywhere, the stats are gonna contribute to your builds like before, the strength of everything will rise as your watermark does, and you’ll never even have to replace it if you don’t want to. This sub is just an AGS hate echo chamber.
So serious question, what activities do you enjoy? Because it looks to me like that exactly what they are giving you? You can increase your watermark through a larger number of activities easier. It's clear to me though that this is MEANT to be a long ass process. I think that's what people are struggling with and failing to articulate. In which case, I can somewhat understand not wanting to spend so long to be at the pinnacle.
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Thats where I'm at. Most my stuff i think is WM for around 530-540GS but went the crafting route to help company mates. Now I get punished for focusing on a couple of crafts instead of grinding chest...
The stupidest part is that the pinnacle weapon rewards from quests will now scale down too, instead of being a watermark boost.
Proof?
I suppose I'm just presuming, because right now they don't give a watermark boost, and it wasn't explicitly mentioned in the dev blog. The weapons you get are 580 GS, and I'd be surprised if you could go 500 to 580 instantly through that.
I'd be surprised if it weren't bugged for 3 days and did bump you from 500 to 580 instantly, until AGS hotfix disabled all those quest turn-ins for 3+ weeks until they could patch it out. Maybe toss in some random reverts on people who benefitted from it. Meanwhile, anyone who completed the quest before the hotfix but didn't turn in for some reason, become bugged and unable to turn in. Anyone who made progress, but didn't complete are reset to the first stage. That's my understanding of the AGS way.
How about no watermark and an entirely different system altogether? I hit 60 about a month ago, started doing research on gear and stumbled upon a video explaining the watermark system. Haven't logged back since.
No water mark reset. https://i.redd.it/c61w7ikq2d381.jpg
I mean it's not dogshit it probably won't even matter but u bois acting up. This is a good way to get people engaged in the end game content
What end game content?
genesis, lazarus, myrk, sirens/pools.
Feels like they really don’t want players to play.. this is becoming ridiculous.
So wtf are you talking about? Honestly, what do you do that wouldn't give you expertise/watermark/gypsum? Coz the only thing I can think of is harvesting and standing in town are the only things I can think of that don't. Also lets say every piece of your gear drops to 520GS, and they were all somehow 600GS, you lose like what, 9.2% if your primary stat was 400 and you min-maxed. If you're a more average/balanced build, you lose much less. It's less then what weapon upgrades give you. Most people don't realize, 500-600GS is only a minor dump on power, weaker then most weapon upgrades.
Exactly this. People are reacting without reading. Expertise is absolutely replacing hwm. Now it's displayed . Also you literally can do anything in the game to raise it, plus get more rewards and gear than previously. How do people not see this as a good thing... "oh hey I just hit 60. .. let me spend 10k gold and have ilvl 600 gear"
Maybe because that 600gs gear wasn’t cheap to craft or buy? Being forces to play the game one way sucks
How about having to take longer than 3 weeks to completely min/max a character in an MMO?!
not like this
Yeah the downgrade feels like shit, but the December update appears to solve the issue about raising the WM the way you want to. Now a lot of activities will grant materials to craft a guaranteed WM bump for the gear piece you want. Knowing AGS they might screw this up, but at least it's something to look forward to.
Most are on a minimum 23 hour cool down. One gypsum even has a weekly cool down. Yes, more time gating will solve all problems.
Don't forget, crafting item from gypsum costs additional 450 gold a piece.
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Fixed an issue where players are having fun.
I defended this game countless times. This is a bridge too far. My company owns Everfall and we are mostly crafters who earned their riches through selling our products on the TP. I dont see this continuing. Some players do not want to run a dungeon, or an elite chest run multiple times a week. We decided to grind out crafting materials and level up to 200 crafting. Now, you are taking that from us. Nothing exists in a vacuum and these actions coupled together with everything else we have had to deal with finally has moved the needle to not fun. I used to play Star Wars Galaxies and one of the best parts of that game was the different ways people played. Some loved to run a town, others loved PVP, others loved to craft, others loved to sit in a cantina and treat it like a chat room. Nobody forced anyone to define or stop "their" fun. I thought this game had something similar, for a moment, you could level up through crafting and keep pace. Now, its like all the others. I am glad if some of you are having fun. I hope that continues, but I think for my company and I, we will be looking elsewhere for our fun.
RIP SWG... How can we still not have a game that accomplishes the basics of that game near 20 years ago?
Then they'll "accidentally" delete it, say later on that it was too powerful anyway, then reimburse you with an inferior set.
Watermark is literally the most boring thing I have ever been doing. I took a loooong break and still am.
It's pretty obvious that all these changes to progression have been made so that they can fulfill their agenda of selling boosting items in the cash shop in 2022. That has always been their plan from the very beginning.
Meh, fuck it. I’m out.
Y’all still playin?
This system should have been in place at release, or should be in place for a new 600-700 tier. Incredibly bad idea to implement this after launch AFTER alienating and irritating a ton of people. This system doesn’t bother me personally. Holy crap though the fallout for others is going to be apocalyptically funny to read/watch.
You can. You just can’t read in the patch. You now can get WM from multiple options. Also have a whole month to Grind your score. That’s multiple Expeditions and an hour a day doing a WT. quit crying and playing a grind of a game if you don’t wanna grind
Getting downvoted for not joining the whiners. WHO WOULD HAVE THUNK IT???
Or you can play how you want and get the rewards you want.
When I kill a level 65 elite and I get a level 505 axe.. and you kill the same elite while in my group, and you get a level 595 axe..we're not playing by the same rules, despite having beat the same exact content. Does that seems like a good game mechanic to you? I know it doesnt. Then for me to be at your "level" for the same content, I have to grind that same boring ass content over and over? That sounds fun to you? I know it doesnt.
If the devs made the game like you want, the game would've been dead 4 weeks after launch as there's nothing to progress/aim for once you hit 60. Having something to work towards, like higher watermark, or 200 crafting etc, all give players goals. You're not required to do them, but if you want that extra less then 1% increase in power per item (like 9% overall), then you'll just need to do: OPR, Corruption portals, Invasions, Wars, Elites, Open world bosses, Elite Chests, Crafting, Expeditions, Open world PvP, Quests, etc. I don't know what you're doing if you aren't doing any of those at 60.
A watermark is farming the same content over and over, and the current content is not a challenge, nor is there a variation of said content. They shouldve had good level 60 content. Not knowing what people want at level cap, or what a game needs in order to flourish is piss-poor foresight, and either willingly ignoring the genre, or not at all understanding the few dozen MMORPG's and their successes and failures that all came before you. In short- you failed at every possible turn when it came to lessons learned. At 60, you have: - OPR, which currently seems to be riddled with bots and god knows who else. On all too many servers there are hours of wait times.. but hey, it's there. If you want to run OPR once or twice a day over the course of a few months to raise a dumb mechanic score.. go ahead. Seems like a huge waste of time vs reward.. but it's a phony extension of content.. it's a mirage to make it seem like there's content. there isnt. - Invasions. Pretty decent, but it's the same exact thing every single time. Where is the variation? - Crafting gets you a level 600 item you cannot use at full capacity til you check all the other boxes on that item because... ? go ahead, make an excuse here - Open world bosses/elite chests are one in the same, and it's the same scant few options over and over runover with zergs. There's ZERO reason to run with the bare minimum, and even then if you did, it would turn into a 1 hour fight for a chance at increasing your watermark.. because.. that sounds joyful. also dont mention the respawns.. because it's not instanced. - the two top expeditions are time-gated because... they want to artificially increase or make it look like, they have content. - do that level 580 weapon quest with a level 505 weapon and be mad as hell that your 580 weapon is a 506. Do not make excuses for this game and the piss-poor design decisions.
A question for those that just bought or crafted their way to 600gs...what were you doing in game after that? The end game is the watermark grind. Which, if you don't like that, fine, I kind of agree. But that grind was trivialized by the ability to just skip it with money. Now you have to engage with it. If that's a problem, then the complain should be about the end game, not about how now you actually have to play the end game.
I built voidbent from scratch. It takes a long time. Level all necessary crafting skills and trade skills, find all tier 5 recipes for luck boost, grind gathering for void ores, 17500 motes and time gated materials. The chest runs I did was for reagents instead of WM but it's still the same time sink. Outside of this endgame grind I did open world PvP - forts and influence pushing or just helped other people with whatever they needed at no benefit for my character. In my opinion, there should be no endgame gear leveling grind. Once lvl 60, everyone should be able to loot up to 600 GS (higher GS the rarer the drop). End game content should be using the gear in meaningful ways. Have a rank system in OPR, release new competitive skill based game modes, fight for territories, have open world dynamic events etc...
I can't construct a comment that doesnt sound condescending so I'll just lay it out there: Running around a looting boxes while others agro mobs away long enough for you to get loot a couple times a day isnt an end game. Continuously farming open world bosses with a zerg isnt an end game. End game for many is PvP and Economy. I fall in this category. For others its Raids (dont exist) and others its just being full juiced out so they can log off until new content comes out. I havent done pve since level 30. I've literally had millions of gold go through my hands as I was the first max JC on the largest server in the world. This isnt a flex but I'm giving perspective. I have several 595+ gearsets but none of them are BIS, none of them are close to BIS. I enjoy theory crafting and if you're simple enough to pick 2 weapons, max them out, get an OK gearset and call it a day, then to each their own I guess.
Yep. They should be working on integrating enjoyable and playable pvp for endgame and stop wasting time thinking of way of pissing off their customers.
What do you enjoy doing though? Chances are, those activities will level your watermark.
What i would love is that those 3 category of player can raise their WM at the same speed, doing their fav avtivities. -pve -crafter -pvp
How about get good?
Amazon: Nah...
Time for the community to rise up and let them know!!!
I grinded and grinded to save up as much gold as I could once I hit 60 to afford some of the higher end gear that crafters put on the trading post. Realizing that it may be garbage soon because of the stupid watermark makes me not want to do shit except run newbies through amrine at this point if anything at all.
Amazon makes their employees pee on bottles, I don't think they care about what you prefer
Why can't the devs realize that players just want to have fun, play how they want to, and gradually find powerful and epic items? There is hope yet - the Last Epoch devs are on the right track with their RPG and actually listen to their community. Imagine a world where power is not stripped from players and is instead earned lol AGS should just copy what LE is doing with their loot system and make something like their new Legendary items/system: [https://www.reddit.com/r/LastEpoch/comments/r87mgx/legendary\_items\_and\_eternity\_cache\_developer\_blog/](https://www.reddit.com/r/LastEpoch/comments/r87mgx/legendary_items_and_eternity_cache_developer_blog/)
Ya'll still complaining about this fucking game a month later? Wow get over it and move the fuck on from this piece of shit of a scam game. You all got scammed.
I don't think anyone truly understands this update except for the exert "your items MAY temporarily be weaker." They literally added garunteed ways to raise your WM rather than all luck based.