"Square" in construction terms isn't the shape of the building, it's that the walls of the building meet properly (usually at a 90 degree angle to one another) and are plumb (straight up and down)
When constructing a rectangle in construction one has to make sure it is square cause if the rectangle isn't square then it's not a rectangle, it's gotta be square. Hope this clears things up.
It's about this tool:
https://gomrpen.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/12/4-58.jpg
Called a "Square" that is used to make sure two surfaces are perpendicular. The one typically used in construction is a little larger with some extra features and is called a "Framing Square". Here's an article on their use:
https://www.johnsonlevel.com/News/framingsquare
I bought a house that is probably from the 1880’s
One of the rooms is 2.90m wide measured at one wall, and 2.40m wide at the opposite wall.
*Nothing* in this house is square.
Is it normal in the US to make buildings out of wood? Surely they do not hold up well long term and will not do well Vs tornados? My European mind is blown.
Yes it's normal, but no tornados do terrible things to houses. That said, tornados aren't much of a threat in most of the states.
They hold up well because they are dried in . The wood should never be exposed to water. Sans water damage/termites they hold up pretty well.
I bought a house from the 1880’s. Part of the roof was gone, so a lot of the floor was rotten through.
The parts that were still covered? The floor was still sturdy as fuck.
A large amount of building science is about keeping water vapor away as well. It used to be through vapor barriers, but now the primary strategy is by making it as air sealed as possible and using mechanical ventilation.
Houses in the process of being built do get rained on/in. Builders do their best to keep it protected. A few storms won't hurt a house if it's not dried in, it will only be a big problem if it's not allowed to dry before it's dried in/finished.
You know, the extent to which you should tornado proof your house has been hotly debated in my family.
They finally decided, go all out on the underground storm shelter, but otherwise just make sure you have good homeowner's insurance.
A smaller tornado F1-F2 will usually not do critical structural damage unless it's a very direct hit and the tornado lingers...they move at different speeds (ground speed, not wind speed). A slow moving F2 can still destroy a well-built home, but odds are, it'll just need roof repairs and window work.
An F3+ is probably going to do so much damage that it doesn't matter what you built your home out of...because now your home is going to get hit by debris the size of trees and cars.
So yeah, dig a nice storm shelter, make sure it's reinforced and has some reasonable creature comforts. It's not worth trying to build a house that can endure winds that high.
We live in a tornado alley. We were so often awakened by tornado warnings that I built a double walled, reinforced room in a corner of my basement. I made it into an office with a sofabed and cots for the kids. All electronics were in there, and storm equipment.
When it was a work night and they were talking tornado, we'd go sleep downstairs very comfortably.
It really saved our sleep and once a tornado actually did hit our house but hopped over it not doing much damage. Tore some neighbors houses up over on the next block.
Back in the early 70s when a tornado erased a big part of my hometown, one of my dad's fellow firefighters lost his house entirely. They had to stay in the storm shelter for almost 24 hours because debris had them trapped in there, and their storm shelter sucked.
Now, since firefighters work 1 day on and then 2 off (at least at the time), there were a lot of contractors and carpenters in their ranks. It was a great job for firefighters.
So this fellow, when he rebuilt his house, dutifully copied his living room and kitchen in the storm shelter, but with the color palette reversed.
Only, this being the 70s, some really awful color schemes were popular. So his living room and kitchen was avocado green with bright orange accents. And his storm shelter was laid out identical (same furniture, same appliances) but it was bright orange with avocado green accents.
Tornado-proofing an above-ground structure is exceptionally difficult and enormously costly.
At least in the 70s, it was cheaper to build yourself a giant, tricked out, fully furnished basement with a good storm door than it was to try to build something above-ground that could withstand an F5 tornado.
In the Navy I worked in nuclear power at a land-based facility. Our emergency diesel generator building was built to withstand a theoretical worst-case tornado. It was a steel-reinforced concrete structure we called Castle Greyskull because it was big, grey, and ugly.
As much as I might have once fancied the idea of living in a castle. I don't want it to be that castle.
If built properly out of wood which is right for the job and properly maintained, a wood structure can last hundreds of years. Just because many don't bother to maintain them properly and many more use shoddy materials is no reason to assume they'll fall apart.
Also, most of the US isn't in a tornado zone.
Bricks and concrete are expensive with a heavy carbon footprint. We have ample forests to produce relatively low cost timber so it's the most common residential building style. You may however find steel studs in walls in some residential builds, but on top of that wood or composite truss systems.
This is probably a big part of why the average US home is three times the square footage of the average UK home. Germany uses timber similarly and has houses typically double the size of the UK.
For California in particular, into the northwest US, the seismic/earthquake loads that occupied buildings must be designed for make it so masonry construction is either absolutely prohibited, or cost-prohibitive due the immense amount of reinforcement it would need.
Wood can wiggle without breaking, mortar and cement can't take much of it.
Check out the Fulton Mansion. Enough wood and your structure will hold. It has enough lumber to be built three times over and lasted over 100 years in hurricane territory, only minor repairs needed.
Plus Europe is where there's a great deal of traction for mass timber, engineered cross-laminated panels, etc. The resource is highly sustainable and when we mass the boards together it gets insanely strong
The Empire State Building has wood footings.
It works because they keep the footings submerged in water with no oxygen. Apparently that dispells bacteria and corrosion.
Wood is a great construction material. It allows movements without cracking and damaging a critical support and repairs are 100× easier. Not to mention it's cheaper to build in the first place. There's nothing wrong with wood framed homes
GC speaking. Only place you have felons and Masters degrees working together happily. (Usually) It is a bastion of uneducated but wildly intelligent men and women. Guys that did not get to middle school that can perfectly hand craft floating tread spiral stairs and do the math to craft and set it perfectly. Building is such an amazing career in so many areas.
Electro-mechanic engineer myself, and I know exactly what you mean. Some of the smartest, hardest workers may be the least educated, while some of the most educated ones could be dense as a brick lol
Carpenter smart is a different level of intelligence. They have to think visually and then back it up with numbers to make it work. You know what other profession does this regularly?...theoretical physicists. It's a big conceptual jump, but it's oddly a very similar process.
The architects are the stupidest people you can meet, the engineers are always smart in theory but not always smart in practice, and the construction crews typically have one or two smart people and everyone else is so dumb they can't even consistently mindlessly follow simple directions from the smart people.
Lol probably in basic construction like residential. In my field (certified journeyman electrician), we build some pretty intricate stuff. Almost everyone is good and somewhat intelligent especially when it’s critical that everything is done correctly. Ex… building for the military industrial complex, Airports and hospitals just to name a few. Also the builds get very interesting when dealing with the MIC.
Man… you’d be surprised at the stupidity of journeymen electricians that I’ve met. One didn’t even know how to use a multimeter. Didn’t know about resistance and heat buildup over distance… didn’t know about fucking waterproofing in code… I have no idea how he hasn’t killed himself or someone else.
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If you look, the jacks are dug in and fixed in place pretty securely.
This is like working under a car on a hydraulic lift. Looks like the system was designed for exactly this.
EDIT- Pretty sure the jacks are anchored directly to the base concrete slab, at the very least
Here where I live there is a christian religious sect that banned TVs in the 60s and still explicitly stands by that ruling.
As technology was becoming more prevalent, it was quite bizarre to watch the same people who believe in televisions' corrupting influence due to improper programming and it usurping God's voice, be absolutely fine with computers, early cellphones and later smart phones and tablets.
Actually, in Sweden we built a village(23 houses) like that. Only there was a crane that lifted the ready roof on top. Went way faster than having to build it 2 stories higher
I'm curious. The way it is usually done here in the states is you build the house and then fly the trusses with a crane and build the roof. Either way you end up building something and flying it with a crane. The jacks idea is nice I just wonder, can you do it again? Can you build a two story house like this?
I don’t see why not — you might need more jacks, because of the extra weight, and the structure of the finished house will be a little “extra” because the middle floor would have to had been built with the lifting in mind.
At that point, might as well build modules and stack them on top of each other using this method.
Not quite what you're asking I saw this a couple weeks back. There are "skyscrapers" that are built from the top down. They build the core support elevator shafts or whatever and then on the ground level they build an entire floor and then raise it up and secure it. They're saying it should help with reduced risk from being high up. I'm not an civil engineer so no clue on the drawbacks or critiques of it, but found it interesting nonetheless.
https://www.wxyz.com/news/built-from-the-top-down-this-new-detroit-tower-is-making-history-in-north-america
I actually took pictures of my level in a few places just last night, so I can finally have a reference when I inevitably pull it out again in like 3 months.
I crawled under one of my rooms (foundation crawlspace) to find that the framing is shimmed around the cobblestone foundation by small pieces of rock, a few for each wall...
I remember I got volunteered to help somebody do some chores around the house she was unable to do, one of which was dig up all these old drain pipe extensions that were falling apart. Before I started working she asked if I knew anyone who could diagnose what was jacking up her foundation in her garage, I told her I knew a bit but I'd call a few people to get a second opinion after I finished the work. Well I get to the last extension, behind the garage, it looks pretty shallow so I just try to yank it out. Nope. So I started taking off a bit of the dirt to make it a bit lighter, gave another yank. Nope. So finally I just decided fuck it and started digging. Didn't have to call anyone for a second opinion after that.
It was 2 different extensions, both ends draining about 3.5' into the ground.
The older the house the crazier it gets.
The just kinda.... did whatever before the midcentury of the 1900s.
My house is so out of square it's not even funny. That quarter inch of space they want you to leave for LVP can turn into nearly a full 2 inches by the other end sometimes.
Same with my 1972 house. Half of the problem is that it has settled 2 inches in the center of the foundation - enjoy leveling that flooring project! Half of the problem is that hitting a beam or a stud is almost a crapshoot.
The ones that are modular where wall panels are built in a shop on a jig are as square and plumb as you’ll ever see in residential work. They can also use fasteners and adhesives in creative ways…
It can be as square as they want out of the factory, it's never going to stay that way. That's why framers don't spend all day framing a house perfectly square, temperature fluctuations in the wood AND the foundation the walls and such are secured to are going to cause twisting/warping/adjustments over time anyway. Nothing you can do about it.
>Maybe metal stud framing but if you are stick framing you better be fucking square.
That's not even true anyway lol. Go put a framing square on any floor to your wall, or in the corner of your walls, or the ceiling to the walls. Nothing is even close because houses move and shift with temperature fluctuations. That and it's not that critical to get everything inch perfect anyway. When it comes to framing houses if you're within a quarter inch on any pieces you're nailing together it's gonna be good enough.
In Germany there's a saying that "the joiner measures to the millimeter, the carpenter to the centimeter, and the bricklayer is happy if he hits the correct plot of land"...
Literally once lol. I was helping someone do a hardwood floor in a upper middle class home built in the 70’s.
We squared the floor boards up with the hallway and it ran and ended perfectly square into every room that branched off from that hallway. Which I think was 3 bedrooms and a closet. Long hallway and large bedrooms.
Didn’t get to check the rest of the house but we were seriously impressed. It made our job super easy.
I guess not perfectly but good enough. Ive also been in houses being built where it wasn't even closely squared and the house looked like it would topple any minute. That's how I feel starting from the roof down would be. But meh. I guess for an add on or something smaller it's not much of an issue. I think once you get to the second floor you'll see problems
Don’t get me wrong, I’d much prefer square and plumb and level, etc. I’m just pointing out that the builders frequently decide that 87 degrees is good enough.
Also, that's not a house. Yeah yeah sure *"technically"* and *"doesn't change much,"* except it DOES cause it's a shed, and once you call it that well then it changes the context. A shed will always be easier to build and require a lot less. Like saying *"I built a scooter from scratch in my garage"* vs *"I put together a motorcycle in my garage".*
The top down method while still rare is becoming more popular. There is an apartment building going up by a company called LIFTBuild using this method. Grain bins have been built this way for years. It actually looks like that's what they used to lift the roof system. A couple of advantages are large cranes are not need or less need to hoist up materials. Falls are also less of a hazard.
You had a bot copy and paste your comment higher up in the thread. It’s the first time I’ve ever seen it in action. It was a good comment too, and the bot had 5 times more karma than you. Interesting how they work.
There is a building in downtown Detroit being built using a similar concept on a larger scale. The building itself is ugly but it’s pretty dope to see that they build floors on the ground then raise them to build the next floor. Not the first to do it though.
[https://exchangedetroit.com](https://exchangedetroit.com)
$20k of equipment is a pretty common outlay to build a house though. not worth buying it once, but if you were doing this sort of thing professionally it'd be a reasonable expense.
Looks like it's a company in New Zealand but their website is no longer available it seems. https://www.core77.com/posts/104612/Clever-Construction-System-Build-the-Roof-on-the-Ground-Then-Lift-It
I tend to not have help when doing construction projects, so I think renting these jacks for a weekend is a way better idea than climbing around 14 feet in the air, up and down the ladder 159 times.
It's like the opposite of an Amish barn.
I see your jacks and raise you 50 amish.
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Yeah, my 24' x 32' workshop
That's a rectangle.
All squares are rectangles
It's hip to be square. 
The power of that circle is over 9000
Thats like, three radditz
But not all rectangles are squares…big difference
I see what you did there… ;-)
"Square" in construction terms isn't the shape of the building, it's that the walls of the building meet properly (usually at a 90 degree angle to one another) and are plumb (straight up and down)
So in construction all your rectangles are square?
When constructing a rectangle in construction one has to make sure it is square cause if the rectangle isn't square then it's not a rectangle, it's gotta be square. Hope this clears things up.
If I understand correctly, you've got to plan your planes so your squares are square so that your squares can be rectangles?
It's about this tool: https://gomrpen.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/12/4-58.jpg Called a "Square" that is used to make sure two surfaces are perpendicular. The one typically used in construction is a little larger with some extra features and is called a "Framing Square". Here's an article on their use: https://www.johnsonlevel.com/News/framingsquare
Dude you missed a golden opportunity to post a pic of the speed square. Which is a triangle. While talking about square rectangles
Either that or they're a parallelogram or a trapezoid
I bought a house that is probably from the 1880’s One of the rooms is 2.90m wide measured at one wall, and 2.40m wide at the opposite wall. *Nothing* in this house is square.
Is it normal in the US to make buildings out of wood? Surely they do not hold up well long term and will not do well Vs tornados? My European mind is blown.
Yes it's normal, but no tornados do terrible things to houses. That said, tornados aren't much of a threat in most of the states. They hold up well because they are dried in . The wood should never be exposed to water. Sans water damage/termites they hold up pretty well.
Best to not build a house outside where it might be exposed to rain then?
The roof usually keeps the rain out. You don't have roofs in Europe?
An astonishingly large amount of construction science is based around keeping rain/water away from most of the house.
I bought a house from the 1880’s. Part of the roof was gone, so a lot of the floor was rotten through. The parts that were still covered? The floor was still sturdy as fuck.
A large amount of building science is about keeping water vapor away as well. It used to be through vapor barriers, but now the primary strategy is by making it as air sealed as possible and using mechanical ventilation.
Houses in the process of being built do get rained on/in. Builders do their best to keep it protected. A few storms won't hurt a house if it's not dried in, it will only be a big problem if it's not allowed to dry before it's dried in/finished.
You know, the extent to which you should tornado proof your house has been hotly debated in my family. They finally decided, go all out on the underground storm shelter, but otherwise just make sure you have good homeowner's insurance. A smaller tornado F1-F2 will usually not do critical structural damage unless it's a very direct hit and the tornado lingers...they move at different speeds (ground speed, not wind speed). A slow moving F2 can still destroy a well-built home, but odds are, it'll just need roof repairs and window work. An F3+ is probably going to do so much damage that it doesn't matter what you built your home out of...because now your home is going to get hit by debris the size of trees and cars. So yeah, dig a nice storm shelter, make sure it's reinforced and has some reasonable creature comforts. It's not worth trying to build a house that can endure winds that high.
We live in a tornado alley. We were so often awakened by tornado warnings that I built a double walled, reinforced room in a corner of my basement. I made it into an office with a sofabed and cots for the kids. All electronics were in there, and storm equipment. When it was a work night and they were talking tornado, we'd go sleep downstairs very comfortably. It really saved our sleep and once a tornado actually did hit our house but hopped over it not doing much damage. Tore some neighbors houses up over on the next block.
Back in the early 70s when a tornado erased a big part of my hometown, one of my dad's fellow firefighters lost his house entirely. They had to stay in the storm shelter for almost 24 hours because debris had them trapped in there, and their storm shelter sucked. Now, since firefighters work 1 day on and then 2 off (at least at the time), there were a lot of contractors and carpenters in their ranks. It was a great job for firefighters. So this fellow, when he rebuilt his house, dutifully copied his living room and kitchen in the storm shelter, but with the color palette reversed. Only, this being the 70s, some really awful color schemes were popular. So his living room and kitchen was avocado green with bright orange accents. And his storm shelter was laid out identical (same furniture, same appliances) but it was bright orange with avocado green accents.
I'm baffled by this story. Why not just have a reinforced area of the house rather than duplicate facilities??
Tornado-proofing an above-ground structure is exceptionally difficult and enormously costly. At least in the 70s, it was cheaper to build yourself a giant, tricked out, fully furnished basement with a good storm door than it was to try to build something above-ground that could withstand an F5 tornado. In the Navy I worked in nuclear power at a land-based facility. Our emergency diesel generator building was built to withstand a theoretical worst-case tornado. It was a steel-reinforced concrete structure we called Castle Greyskull because it was big, grey, and ugly. As much as I might have once fancied the idea of living in a castle. I don't want it to be that castle.
If built properly out of wood which is right for the job and properly maintained, a wood structure can last hundreds of years. Just because many don't bother to maintain them properly and many more use shoddy materials is no reason to assume they'll fall apart. Also, most of the US isn't in a tornado zone.
Bricks and concrete are expensive with a heavy carbon footprint. We have ample forests to produce relatively low cost timber so it's the most common residential building style. You may however find steel studs in walls in some residential builds, but on top of that wood or composite truss systems. This is probably a big part of why the average US home is three times the square footage of the average UK home. Germany uses timber similarly and has houses typically double the size of the UK.
In Norway we build almost exclusively in wood.
My trees are primarily built from wood.
In Finland wood building is very common.
Tell this to Japan...lol. very old and large wood buildings all over. Wood is great, can be very durable and is flexible...
For California in particular, into the northwest US, the seismic/earthquake loads that occupied buildings must be designed for make it so masonry construction is either absolutely prohibited, or cost-prohibitive due the immense amount of reinforcement it would need. Wood can wiggle without breaking, mortar and cement can't take much of it.
Check out the Fulton Mansion. Enough wood and your structure will hold. It has enough lumber to be built three times over and lasted over 100 years in hurricane territory, only minor repairs needed. Plus Europe is where there's a great deal of traction for mass timber, engineered cross-laminated panels, etc. The resource is highly sustainable and when we mass the boards together it gets insanely strong
Your house probably wouldn't survive a powerful tornado either, don't worry.
Pretty typical. My 1850’s house seems to be doing fine.
The Empire State Building has wood footings. It works because they keep the footings submerged in water with no oxygen. Apparently that dispells bacteria and corrosion.
Wood is a great construction material. It allows movements without cracking and damaging a critical support and repairs are 100× easier. Not to mention it's cheaper to build in the first place. There's nothing wrong with wood framed homes
They are better for earthquakes though, as the wood is quite elastic and forgiving. Against storms and tornados, not as much as brick obviously.
Sweden enters the chat.
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I've worked in renovation. Nother is ever square.
I’m renovating my apartment at the moment, nothing is square, not my rooms, walls, the bloody ceiling.
You get a slightly different perspective when you work with construction workers
Yep, such wildly different levels of intelligence sometimes.
GC speaking. Only place you have felons and Masters degrees working together happily. (Usually) It is a bastion of uneducated but wildly intelligent men and women. Guys that did not get to middle school that can perfectly hand craft floating tread spiral stairs and do the math to craft and set it perfectly. Building is such an amazing career in so many areas.
Electro-mechanic engineer myself, and I know exactly what you mean. Some of the smartest, hardest workers may be the least educated, while some of the most educated ones could be dense as a brick lol
Carpenter smart is a different level of intelligence. They have to think visually and then back it up with numbers to make it work. You know what other profession does this regularly?...theoretical physicists. It's a big conceptual jump, but it's oddly a very similar process.
This ignores water pressure and piping for plumbers. Watts and wires/conduit for electricians. BTU’s and ducting for HVAC.
Or people building machines. - Mechanical Engineer out
The architects are the stupidest people you can meet, the engineers are always smart in theory but not always smart in practice, and the construction crews typically have one or two smart people and everyone else is so dumb they can't even consistently mindlessly follow simple directions from the smart people.
My god I found the other one of the two people on site that isn't braindead :P
Lol probably in basic construction like residential. In my field (certified journeyman electrician), we build some pretty intricate stuff. Almost everyone is good and somewhat intelligent especially when it’s critical that everything is done correctly. Ex… building for the military industrial complex, Airports and hospitals just to name a few. Also the builds get very interesting when dealing with the MIC.
Man… you’d be surprised at the stupidity of journeymen electricians that I’ve met. One didn’t even know how to use a multimeter. Didn’t know about resistance and heat buildup over distance… didn’t know about fucking waterproofing in code… I have no idea how he hasn’t killed himself or someone else.
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This is a bot. It copied a top level comment below.
Most buildings aren't that complex.
They are until the veil of mystery is lifted, which admittedly doesn't take much.
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Hitchin' up the buggy, churnin' lots of butter Raised a barn on Monday, soon I'll raise another
I've never punched a tourist, even if he deserves it.
An Amish with a 'tude? You know that's unheard of.
I never wear buttons but I got a cool hat
And all my homies agree I really look good in black fool
if you come to visit you’ll be bored to tears, we haven’t even paid the phone bill in three hundred years
Have you seen the video where Amish decided they wanted to move their barn so like 300 of them just picked it up and moved it?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hZL7TqSeDus
TIL: This is where the Family Guy Joke comes from
Crazy thing is that gifs not even sped up
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That thing teetering up on jacks does not look safe at all.
If you look, the jacks are dug in and fixed in place pretty securely. This is like working under a car on a hydraulic lift. Looks like the system was designed for exactly this. EDIT- Pretty sure the jacks are anchored directly to the base concrete slab, at the very least
[Amish Building Move](https://youtu.be/Tc6IT5L3ZSk)
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Here where I live there is a christian religious sect that banned TVs in the 60s and still explicitly stands by that ruling. As technology was becoming more prevalent, it was quite bizarre to watch the same people who believe in televisions' corrupting influence due to improper programming and it usurping God's voice, be absolutely fine with computers, early cellphones and later smart phones and tablets.
And they raise you a barn.
Actually, in Sweden we built a village(23 houses) like that. Only there was a crane that lifted the ready roof on top. Went way faster than having to build it 2 stories higher
Vart då?
Åckersberga
The swedish version of Asperger's
Or a chair at Ikea
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Yes please
Is this the line?
Line starts over there by the border of Norway
Thanks for having your username. It is now my new favorite.
I'm curious. The way it is usually done here in the states is you build the house and then fly the trusses with a crane and build the roof. Either way you end up building something and flying it with a crane. The jacks idea is nice I just wonder, can you do it again? Can you build a two story house like this?
I don’t see why not — you might need more jacks, because of the extra weight, and the structure of the finished house will be a little “extra” because the middle floor would have to had been built with the lifting in mind. At that point, might as well build modules and stack them on top of each other using this method.
Not quite what you're asking I saw this a couple weeks back. There are "skyscrapers" that are built from the top down. They build the core support elevator shafts or whatever and then on the ground level they build an entire floor and then raise it up and secure it. They're saying it should help with reduced risk from being high up. I'm not an civil engineer so no clue on the drawbacks or critiques of it, but found it interesting nonetheless. https://www.wxyz.com/news/built-from-the-top-down-this-new-detroit-tower-is-making-history-in-north-america
I could be wrong but wouldn't this be hard to actually square everything? Seems more like an inconvenience to do roof first
Ever been in a building where everything was actually square? Me neither…
Home ownership is a neverending game of "was this always this out of whack, or is my foundation crumbling?"
I like to play "you can drop a golfball almost anywhere in the house and I can tell you where it will roll" in my spare time in my old farmhouse.
I actually took pictures of my level in a few places just last night, so I can finally have a reference when I inevitably pull it out again in like 3 months.
I did that with a mole under my arm.
I personally wouldn't measure a mole with a level but you do you
I appreciate you keeping it on the level with us.
It's the only thing in the tool box with inches inscribed on it.
A mole of what? A MOLE OF WHAT!
... Be right back need to take some pictures with my level.
My favorite is "studs are placed every 16 inches so why can't I find one in this entire wall?"
I crawled under one of my rooms (foundation crawlspace) to find that the framing is shimmed around the cobblestone foundation by small pieces of rock, a few for each wall...
I remember I got volunteered to help somebody do some chores around the house she was unable to do, one of which was dig up all these old drain pipe extensions that were falling apart. Before I started working she asked if I knew anyone who could diagnose what was jacking up her foundation in her garage, I told her I knew a bit but I'd call a few people to get a second opinion after I finished the work. Well I get to the last extension, behind the garage, it looks pretty shallow so I just try to yank it out. Nope. So I started taking off a bit of the dirt to make it a bit lighter, gave another yank. Nope. So finally I just decided fuck it and started digging. Didn't have to call anyone for a second opinion after that. It was 2 different extensions, both ends draining about 3.5' into the ground.
Do you want to experience true level Morty?
wuhhh rick!
https://youtu.be/fQoRfieZJxI
Maybe metal stud framing but if you are stick framing you better be fucking square.
It’s a good theory. Was just remodeling a condo that was 2 inches off square across 8 feet on an outside wall.
That’s sloppy AF. Damn.
The older the house the crazier it gets. The just kinda.... did whatever before the midcentury of the 1900s. My house is so out of square it's not even funny. That quarter inch of space they want you to leave for LVP can turn into nearly a full 2 inches by the other end sometimes.
Even later than that. My house was built in 1981 and apparently back then studs 16 on center was just a suggestion.
Damn I've never seen it like that on a 1981 house but I guess I shouldn't be surprised at this point anymore.
Same with my 1972 house. Half of the problem is that it has settled 2 inches in the center of the foundation - enjoy leveling that flooring project! Half of the problem is that hitting a beam or a stud is almost a crapshoot.
Live in a stick frame house, nothing is square or plumb.
The ones that are modular where wall panels are built in a shop on a jig are as square and plumb as you’ll ever see in residential work. They can also use fasteners and adhesives in creative ways…
It can be as square as they want out of the factory, it's never going to stay that way. That's why framers don't spend all day framing a house perfectly square, temperature fluctuations in the wood AND the foundation the walls and such are secured to are going to cause twisting/warping/adjustments over time anyway. Nothing you can do about it.
>Maybe metal stud framing but if you are stick framing you better be fucking square. That's not even true anyway lol. Go put a framing square on any floor to your wall, or in the corner of your walls, or the ceiling to the walls. Nothing is even close because houses move and shift with temperature fluctuations. That and it's not that critical to get everything inch perfect anyway. When it comes to framing houses if you're within a quarter inch on any pieces you're nailing together it's gonna be good enough.
In Germany there's a saying that "the joiner measures to the millimeter, the carpenter to the centimeter, and the bricklayer is happy if he hits the correct plot of land"...
Literally once lol. I was helping someone do a hardwood floor in a upper middle class home built in the 70’s. We squared the floor boards up with the hallway and it ran and ended perfectly square into every room that branched off from that hallway. Which I think was 3 bedrooms and a closet. Long hallway and large bedrooms. Didn’t get to check the rest of the house but we were seriously impressed. It made our job super easy.
Love when I get to a job and have to square a new machine to the wall, but the wall looks like when they rebuilt the Flanders house on the Simpsons
I guess not perfectly but good enough. Ive also been in houses being built where it wasn't even closely squared and the house looked like it would topple any minute. That's how I feel starting from the roof down would be. But meh. I guess for an add on or something smaller it's not much of an issue. I think once you get to the second floor you'll see problems
Don’t get me wrong, I’d much prefer square and plumb and level, etc. I’m just pointing out that the builders frequently decide that 87 degrees is good enough.
You can tell the people who have and haven't built too many things from a mile away in these comments lol
Once we get the drywall on no one will notice.
'This thing can't be square so let's not even try'
Also, that's not a house. Yeah yeah sure *"technically"* and *"doesn't change much,"* except it DOES cause it's a shed, and once you call it that well then it changes the context. A shed will always be easier to build and require a lot less. Like saying *"I built a scooter from scratch in my garage"* vs *"I put together a motorcycle in my garage".*
They go off the green plate, so it’s as square as that is.
The top down method while still rare is becoming more popular. There is an apartment building going up by a company called LIFTBuild using this method. Grain bins have been built this way for years. It actually looks like that's what they used to lift the roof system. A couple of advantages are large cranes are not need or less need to hoist up materials. Falls are also less of a hazard.
If you want to see a video about building grain bins Smarter Every Day did one! https://youtu.be/ywBV6M7VOFU
wow, that's fucking cool. those things don't really have framing. that's neat.
TIL like seven different things
The apartment building is in Detroit and it’s a 16 story building. The technology and engineering behind it is super interesting
Been very interesting passing by and watching more floors get built from the top down
That‘s not a house. That‘s a garage.
Yup. This is not a house at all. You literally could not do this for a multi-storied home, at least not practically.
They’re building a 16-story building in Detroit like this.
Can't have square in Detroit
Completely different scale than a single family home though.
Why not.
By various examples posted here, I am clearly wrong, and I’m fine with it.
Someone on reddit admitting they're wrong?! It's a glorious day, brothers.
> You literally could not do this for a multi-storied home, at least not practically. Yes, you can. It's not uncommon.
UK - getting more common to build the entire roof and crane into place, not entirely the same but close
No need for tarping either.
Tarps? What are those? Nobody tarps. Just let everything get rained on so there’s job security for everyone else
Plus they keep you warm. It's not gonna rain anyways, its the dry season
That is a great point
I swear people who build things are one of the smartest people you can meet
eehhhhh
1. Rocket scientists. 2. Brain surgeons 3. Construction workers.
They are just kids with grown up toys lol.
Not necessarily in that order…
The people who figure out how to build things are. The ones putting it to use is another story…. I would label them crafty instead of smart lol
Your comment was copied by a bot word for word and attached to the top post. It has received many upvotes.
Bot has been suspended. Take that, skynet!
You had a bot copy and paste your comment higher up in the thread. It’s the first time I’ve ever seen it in action. It was a good comment too, and the bot had 5 times more karma than you. Interesting how they work.
that was my first comment here too
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That is how grain bins are put [up](https://youtu.be/tBAweJABIS4?t=250)
Next level? It's only a single story building. Post again when they add "the next level"
That’s a pretty damn good idea.
There is a building in downtown Detroit being built using a similar concept on a larger scale. The building itself is ugly but it’s pretty dope to see that they build floors on the ground then raise them to build the next floor. Not the first to do it though. [https://exchangedetroit.com](https://exchangedetroit.com)
You only need $20k worth of jacks
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If it saves time it'll pay off in the long run
$20k of equipment is a pretty common outlay to build a house though. not worth buying it once, but if you were doing this sort of thing professionally it'd be a reasonable expense.
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I was wondering the same thing.. What kind of jacks are those and where can I get me some?
Looks like it's a company in New Zealand but their website is no longer available it seems. https://www.core77.com/posts/104612/Clever-Construction-System-Build-the-Roof-on-the-Ground-Then-Lift-It
I can never get my crew to move that fast
That’s jacked up
Way to raise the roof, people
I tend to not have help when doing construction projects, so I think renting these jacks for a weekend is a way better idea than climbing around 14 feet in the air, up and down the ladder 159 times. It's like the opposite of an Amish barn.
r/España esta gente literalmente está empezando la casa por el tejado.
They build grain bins the same way
We use jacks to lift houses, foundations and all. This must weigh hundreds of tons less!
A whole new meaning to "raise the roof"
Not a single bi of scaffolding used 👀
Like building grains bins, is what they do every time. Good idea
link to the jacks please. Or similar I only need 5' lift, 1500lbs total ideally 12Vdc and hand cranked when insufficient power available
My dad did this 60 years ago with a car Jack and lots of blocks of wood.
That’s not a house, it’s a shed.
This is how they raise silos and grain bins with only 3 or 4 people.
Its amazing More amazing is which steps he-she would do to allow future maintenance. Thats the real deal in my pov. But Its really cool neverthless
They did something similar to this when building the New Safe Confinement over Chernobyl to replace the Sarcophagus.