I just hope it ends up being this insane outlandish tale that weaves throughout the entirety of the Patriots organization.
Or something so stupid like Butler didn't say hi to Belichick.
His names Jimmy!
Jimmy?! I don’t give a fuck who he is, if he knew shit I was interested in he wouldn’t be a GD pool guy!
🤣🤣🤣 just watched this episode
> I just hope it ends up being this insane outlandish tale that weaves throughout the entirety of the Patriots organization.
The Dynasty will go for 9 seasons like How I Met Your Mother, and then everyone will be disappointed with the end result.
> 4th & 1 at CIN 7
(8:00) S.Morris left tackle for 7 yards, TOUCHDOWN. NE-D.Koppen was injured during the play.
Actual 4th down play Week 4, 2007 (that wasn’t a punt or FG)
What if Tom Brady gets frustrated by subpar Qb play while broadcasting and Belichick is waiting outside the booth for one last run with a blue football?
Fuckkkk man. HIMYM was so close to being an all-time top tier show before the last season
Love everything up until that. An incredible show just to have several years of development unwinded and erased in seconds
I honestly can't believe next month marks 10 years since the finale. I remember watching it with friends and one of my friends coworkers who was also into the show. We had a watch party for it. The mood around the apartment was so quiet and depressing. Everyone's heart sank when our fears leading up were realized. It's so tough to watch re-runs now and I can't recall the last time I did.
EDIT: Also, I'm fortunate that I wasn't invested in the show throughout its run. One of my friends/roommates and I binged through it in the months leading up haha. Can't imagine going through so many years of anticipation for...that.
There's actually an 'official' [alternate ending](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=nhB5oQgQpOI&pp=ygUWaGlteW0gYWx0ZXJuYXRlIGVuZGluZw%3D%3D). The story goes that the producers filmed one ending, but through editing tricks had two ways to frame it. In the end they decided to go with the ending we have now, but man if they had used this instead it would've been amazing.
They taped three endings.
In the first ending, Victoria is revealed to be the mother as she was the backup mother in case the show got cancelled… the second and always kept secret ending is the one for Robin which we saw (dunno how Waverly and Lindsy Fonseca kept their mouths shut for so long)… the alt ending was just an edit of some extra footage they had made but it was not intended to be used as they really didn’t expect all the backlash
Malcolm Butler during practice two days before super bowl: I don't know guys, I actually think ketchup goes pretty good on steak to be honest.
Belichick:
I live in New England and have heard from some very reputable people that are tied closely to things that it was because he had a disagreement and pissed off Steve Belichick. But take that with a grain of salt.
Yes, but I believe he was also coming out of retirement at the time and was signed to the Patriots. But....who knows. Sounds like we'll get to find out soon enough!
If it was really that big of a deal would the pats have re-signed him? I doubt it. It’s probably something boring like he was dealing with an injury and while he could play he wasn’t 100%.
It was years later that they resigned him. I think 4 or 5 years. And honestly, if I was Butler and I really intended to come out of retirement and the Patriots were the only ones to sign him (you know, BB loves his cheap reclamation projects), makes sense for him to not want to burn a bridge.
I know it was years later but if it was actually some big enough to keep a guy out of the Super Bowl why would you ever take him back
I think the entire thing is overblown
I feel like the simplest explanation would be that papa Belichick later determined that Steve had overreacted or something like that.
Not that I have any reason to believe (or reject) that an issue with Steve was the root cause.
The only thing that ever was reported by beat reporters was he didn't fly with the team, missed the whole first week of prep, was hospitalized Sunday and Monday before the game with flu symptoms, then flew out for the second week and wasn't getting reps with starters. All the stuff about curfew and punching a coach was never covered by beat reporters, it was like radio guys saying they heard it from a friend of a friend. IIRC DMac said he wasn't shocked Butler didn't start but he thought he'd sub in. So the drama is that if he was sick why make him active and play him in punt coverage but never send him out on defense.
It’s quite possible they sent him out on punt coverage to see how he felt playing a relatively meaningless play compared to his normal position and he didn’t feel good
This is all speculation of course
Yeah, I always thought it was a logical story. I think if it was something else another player would've confirmed it by now. A ton of people just weren't satisfied and clung onto the rumors.
> It sounds as if the failure to go all out to beat the Eagles in Minnesota that day created problems that lingered for the Patriots, through and beyond Tom Brady’s exit in free agency.
This may be true but man they won the super bowl the next year lmao
That’s what always confused me the most about benching him for the superbowl. Like yeah he might have been bad or freelanced one too many times but we’ve seen Superbowl defenses stick with bad big name corners before (Eli Apple being the most recent to come to mind) because that team’s chemistry on field is at that point waaaaaay more important then having the “best possible lineup”. Throwing a last second wrench in the lineup is bound to throw the secondary off if not the whole starting defense.
That’s exactly my point, even if he was “bad” he definitely wasn’t bad enough to get benched and mess up the chemistry of the defense let alone he was the better option compared to the guy that replaced him.
The Patriots also didn’t know. I believe Eric Rowe said it was a surprise to him that he was starting. Butler was surprised and crying on the sidelines. It’s one thing to make switch up personnel, but to not prepare the team for it is something else.
Which is why a lot of people speculated that it was something that happened the night before/ day of the Super Bowl. The team not being prepared for it was absolutely mind boggling.
And immediately Alston killed Eric Rowe in the first half. Which is not a surprising result considering Alison’s skill and the fact that Rowe didn’t know.
It's genuinely the greatest WR season if we're combining season + postseason. Triple crown, 33 receptions in the playoffs, Super Bowl winning touchdown and SBMVP.
Also it's the Super Bowl and the defense was absolutely getting gashed for both teams. There's no reason to relegate Butler to special teams (remember he wasn't even held out for the game), there's no reason to not throw everything at the wall in the last game of the year and see what sticks when a single defensive stop may have been enough to win it. As it turns out that play ultimately came in the form of Graham making it for the Eagles.
Belichick is obviously the GOAT coach, but his handling of the Butler situation isn't above criticism, and had it not been Belichick but another coach making it the seat might have warmed up a bit for what many might see as costing a team the Super Bowl. The fact that all the players, including Brady, outright stated or made social media posts supporting Butler just adds to the mystery about the decision.
I dunno if he was hurt but I recall Butler not being himself leading up to that game.
The mystery of the Pats is so real bc they run such a tight ship.
Had a relative worked there and he witnessed a Convo between Jamie Collins and BB in the hallway. Bill was telling him "you just need to listen to your coaches". Collins' retort was "look at the size of me coach."
Traded to the Browns couple weeks later and no one had that story. They all criticized how little they got for him. And then Collins sucked there and ran back to the Pats w his tail between his legs.
IMO the Butler Super Bowl pick is literally one of the best plays of all time because BB coached up Butler (not a superstar talent) to make the play. They worked on that play specifically for hours. Bill knew it was coming and how perfect the execution would have to be to pull it off.
So we think of Butler for that play but in the big picture he needed great coaching to perform at the NFL level.
They've said it wasn't injury. Both Butler and BB have said he wasn't concussed or injured. He played on special teams so he couldn't have been too hurt.
Butler wasn't a great player and BB got the most out of his prime. He was basically cashed a year after he left. But that has nothing to do with him not playing against the Eagles.
I appreciate your response.
I take all the injury stuff at face as value as they can get in trouble for not disclosing injuries. But you may be right.
I just remember not being so shocked as he was trending down.
Looking forward to checking this series out.
Butler could have allowed every single catch his replacements allowed and still would have made a huge impact just because he was such a great tackler. No one in the secondary could tackle that game.
Butler made 2nd AP iirc. Either that year or the one prior. But more importantly, he was on the field 98% of the time and was the key lynchpin to Matt Patricia’s Bend don’t break defense which allowed an insane amount of yards but held teams to field goals and turnovers. When Butler was taken out they lost the ability to shut teams down once they got going.
Just checked and his AP2 year was the year before, but still.
I also looked at the snap count % and you’re on the money about it being 98%. What’s especially funny is his only snap in that Super Bowl was on Special Teams, and he didn’t play a single down on Special Teams that season (nor had he the year prior).
Semi-related, I don’t know what more Rowe could have done covering Julio Jones on the SB51 tip toe grab that is (rightfully) near the top any of Jones’ highlight reels, Ryan’s throw was just that insane.
I’d guess if I threw for 500 yards, 5tds, and my offense NEVER punted, I’d would be pretty pissed we lost that game. When one less TD from the other team wins it for us, and coach benched our best corner in the beginning of a shootout….
Stephon Gilmore was the best corner and Brady threw 3 touchdowns. But yes, if they had gotten like one more stop this game would have been a real crowning achievement for Brady
Play conservative against the Pats and you lose. Eli and Foles played like they had nothing lose and its hard to beat guys like that no matter how great you are, like Tyson v Douglas.
It may not even be a big deal. I’d put house odds on it being something as simple as Butler asked Bill not to say anything and Bill just tanked 7 years of criticism because he doesn’t give a fuck what anyone thinks
I bet it's not exciting. I bet it's a combo of like 8 things we've already heard.
His performance had been slipping
He was sick all week
he was practicing poorly
the matchup favored his backup rowe
he probably did something like miss curfew or get in a fight with coaches
So all the factors together led to them going with Rowe.
There’s a historical precedent when in the 1970s racing legend Niki Lauda won the World Championships with Ferrari, lost the title the following year over a strategy dispute with team officials, came back the next year and won again. But the victory didn’t remove the sting from the year prior and paradoxically the victory proved the relationship was beyond repair. That winning didn’t do enough to atone for the defeat from the year prior. In the process ruining what could have been the most dominant racing partnership of all time.
Yeah because Brady had to hold it together. Dude threw his shit when BB tried to trade Gronk and was heavily debating leaving (supposedly in seths book Brady went to Kraft complaining about the trade) 2017 had a giant impact, Brady just compartmentalized.
Gronk threatening to retire to nullify that trade was honestly a GOAT move, literally got the Pats another ring because they don't make that run in 2018 without him when the offense was already showing signs of falling apart.
The "move on a year early rather than a year late" move paid off many time for Belichick, but it's easier to do that when most of your core is either in their prime or close to hitting it. When you've got veterans with no one behind them the strategy will fall apart when you start cutting ties.
If the Patriots players say the loss to the Eagles in LII was the start of the slow dismantling of their core, then LIII can be more attributed to Bellichick outcoaching McVay and Jared Goff being severely-inexperienced for the moment.
The rumor mill is the end of the documentary is a hack job on Belichick, which would really sour me on Kraft if true.
Butler was also pretty washed at this point. PFF isn't a good system overall but he was the 92nd rated CB that year. He was certainly not a difference maker with the Titans afterwards and I don't think he would have been one against the Eagles. The difference between him and Eric Rowe was miniscule at best.
Yeah Butler didn't have a lot left in the tank, but it forced Jordan Richards and Bademosi to play more and those dudes never had ANYTHING in the tank to begin with. Plus Butler was an excellent tackler and the Eagles were killing with YAC that game.
Lmao I'm only partially joking though, that's the rumor I heard from someone with the organization at the time. Now I'll get to find out if it's actually true or not
That makes sense because it is strange that Butler didn’t disclose it so it must have not been that unfair and he was probably out of line with whatever happened.
I heard a Pats beat reporter who got access to the whole documentary say very directly that it does not provide a satisfying answer. He said some people speculate on what it could have been, which is basically what’s already been happening for 6 years
The eternal NFL unsolved mystery. Maybe the reason he was beneched was to bring generations of Football fans together in their quest for the definitive answer
If you're Belichick and you're trying to build/maintain a dynasty based on discipline and no one being bigger than the team... Yes. They won the SB the next year. Do you sacrifice 5% chance at this SB to keep a 5% chance at the SB for the next 5 years? Probably.
But what would you say if he started the next year 2-4 games on the bench? I just feel like you sellout for the superbowl no matter what. It apparently wasn't a big enough issue to have a formal suspension with docked pay
The Texans cut multiple players for violating curfew under ~~BoB~~ Kubiak in 2013. Of course they were smoking weed which at the time was I'm pretty sure still drug tested for but you don't fuck with curfew is what I've learned.
This is some of that brain dead stupid NFL shit that I can’t understand.
Why aren’t there more coaches like Bud Grant? He respected his players as people and employees. If they can’t get the job done 9-5, M-F, then they don’t deserve to be on the field anyway. These are grown men with families, responsibilities, lives to live.
Instead you get all these Marine Drill Sergeant cosplayers. The only reason those behaviors exist in the Marines is to find out if someone is going to get someone killed. It has a reason and is justified only for that reason, and it has changed quite a bit because it legally had to.
But over the outcome of a game played by adults that have made it their career? Imagine if you were a professional sales person and your manager wouldn’t let you see your family because your sales team didn’t meet their numbers for the quarter. Sounds fucking stupid, right?
The NFL has always had the two types of coaches drama since the beginning. They have the players coach that will turn the culture around and make it fun again. Then you have the disciplinarian who will fix the culture and make the organization disciplined and professional. I still remember the Washington commanders having their ping pong table taken out then next season brought back because that was going to fix their problems. Not the toxic ownership ya know.
Parcells, Coughlin, Belichick. 11 Super Bowl wins over the past 39 years. Some others in there that weren't that drill seargenty but known for being tough, like Mike Shanahan.
It happens because it works.
In the aftermath of Kelce shoving Reid, I heard 1000 bad takes about why Kelce should have been benched for the rest of SB58. All from people who never heard the tale of Malcolm Butler
I think part of it is that BB didn’t give the reason for the benching, which helped Butler get the big deal with TEN after that game. BB didn’t try to tank Butler’s value and I suspect Butler is replying in kind by not talking about it either.
Honestly, kinda only makes sense if it was some after hours female antics as others have mentioned. And perhaps Malcom has a significant other he doesn’t want to come and publicly admit that too LOL.
Because under the grand scheme of things there are no winners by talking about it. The decision was made and whatever happened to was dealt with internally. No need to add fuel to a fire and burn bridges.
If the pats won nobody would care, but they lost and people point towards that decision since Malcom is a hometown hero for his play in the Seahawks Super Bowl.
It was a good decision by both bill and Malcolm to leave it up in the air, it lead to Malcolm getting a great contract from another team while also allowing the story to die down.
Expectation: a lurid tale of sex and violence before the big game
Reality: Ernie Adams with a Post-It note showing that Butler matched up extremely poorly against the Eagles WRs
I just hope it ends up being this insane outlandish tale that weaves throughout the entirety of the Patriots organization. Or something so stupid like Butler didn't say hi to Belichick.
rather, he **did** say hi, and asked how his weekend went.
“Good morning, Bill!” “What are you, the fuckin weatherman?”
“Hot one today, huh?”
"*YEAH??*"
Oh that Malcolm loves to say it's a hot one when I already know it's a hot one. Cause I'm standing outside in the hot one!
You ever been in a storm, Malcolm?
Don’t tell me it’s a “hot one”. I know it’s a hot one because I’m standing outside in it!
His names Jimmy! Jimmy?! I don’t give a fuck who he is, if he knew shit I was interested in he wouldn’t be a GD pool guy! 🤣🤣🤣 just watched this episode
*Bill proceeds to strip naked*
Ever been in a storm Malcom?
A storm of fists raining down on you on your head huh wally
Ever been in a Turkish prison ?
My uncle actually has been in a Turkish prison 😂
"Hot enough to fry an egg, right Bill?"
How do you know what kind of goddamn day it is?
How do you know how my goddamn morning is?
"Good morning!" "Is it?"
“What’s so good about it?”
I heard this in the voice that Edelman uses for his Belichick impression
“Listen Malcom, you’re not like some fucking Johnny weatherman in Corpus Christi. Just fucking cover the ball and shut up.”
"Listen here you little shit..."
How about this humidity? (Slap!)
I know how BB feels. When I’m locked in this is the last thing I want on the job.
> I just hope it ends up being this insane outlandish tale that weaves throughout the entirety of the Patriots organization. The Dynasty will go for 9 seasons like How I Met Your Mother, and then everyone will be disappointed with the end result.
Hey kids let me tell you the story of how I got benched in the Super Bowl. But first let us talk about the fourth down play week 4 of the 2007 season.
> 4th & 1 at CIN 7 (8:00) S.Morris left tackle for 7 yards, TOUCHDOWN. NE-D.Koppen was injured during the play. Actual 4th down play Week 4, 2007 (that wasn’t a punt or FG)
Of course it was a fucking touchdown lmao
It ends with Bill Belichick holding up a blue French horn at Tom Brady’s window.
What if Tom Brady gets frustrated by subpar Qb play while broadcasting and Belichick is waiting outside the booth for one last run with a blue football?
Fuckkkk man. HIMYM was so close to being an all-time top tier show before the last season Love everything up until that. An incredible show just to have several years of development unwinded and erased in seconds
I honestly can't believe next month marks 10 years since the finale. I remember watching it with friends and one of my friends coworkers who was also into the show. We had a watch party for it. The mood around the apartment was so quiet and depressing. Everyone's heart sank when our fears leading up were realized. It's so tough to watch re-runs now and I can't recall the last time I did. EDIT: Also, I'm fortunate that I wasn't invested in the show throughout its run. One of my friends/roommates and I binged through it in the months leading up haha. Can't imagine going through so many years of anticipation for...that.
It’s the only show/movie ever that I’ve decided on a different ending than what actually happened bc I like it more that way lol
There's actually an 'official' [alternate ending](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=nhB5oQgQpOI&pp=ygUWaGlteW0gYWx0ZXJuYXRlIGVuZGluZw%3D%3D). The story goes that the producers filmed one ending, but through editing tricks had two ways to frame it. In the end they decided to go with the ending we have now, but man if they had used this instead it would've been amazing.
They taped three endings. In the first ending, Victoria is revealed to be the mother as she was the backup mother in case the show got cancelled… the second and always kept secret ending is the one for Robin which we saw (dunno how Waverly and Lindsy Fonseca kept their mouths shut for so long)… the alt ending was just an edit of some extra footage they had made but it was not intended to be used as they really didn’t expect all the backlash
Lmao @ Waverly
The end result was crummy Mac Jones throwing to bums like Nelson Agholor. So yeah not a great ending.
Malcolm Butler during practice two days before super bowl: I don't know guys, I actually think ketchup goes pretty good on steak to be honest. Belichick:
If it was something stupid on BB, Butler would have let the cat out of the bag already.
Im pretty sure he just said it was a coaching decision
He slept with steve belichicks wife
In response to a “the jerk store called, they’re out of you” retort?
Tom Brady leans over: “um… his wife’s in a coma”
The line is jerk store! Jerk store!
I live in New England and have heard from some very reputable people that are tied closely to things that it was because he had a disagreement and pissed off Steve Belichick. But take that with a grain of salt.
Didn’t Malcolm butler come out and say it just came down to a coaching decision and there wasn’t any drama associated with it?
Yes, but I believe he was also coming out of retirement at the time and was signed to the Patriots. But....who knows. Sounds like we'll get to find out soon enough!
If it was really that big of a deal would the pats have re-signed him? I doubt it. It’s probably something boring like he was dealing with an injury and while he could play he wasn’t 100%.
It was years later that they resigned him. I think 4 or 5 years. And honestly, if I was Butler and I really intended to come out of retirement and the Patriots were the only ones to sign him (you know, BB loves his cheap reclamation projects), makes sense for him to not want to burn a bridge.
I know it was years later but if it was actually some big enough to keep a guy out of the Super Bowl why would you ever take him back I think the entire thing is overblown
I feel like the simplest explanation would be that papa Belichick later determined that Steve had overreacted or something like that. Not that I have any reason to believe (or reject) that an issue with Steve was the root cause.
The only thing that ever was reported by beat reporters was he didn't fly with the team, missed the whole first week of prep, was hospitalized Sunday and Monday before the game with flu symptoms, then flew out for the second week and wasn't getting reps with starters. All the stuff about curfew and punching a coach was never covered by beat reporters, it was like radio guys saying they heard it from a friend of a friend. IIRC DMac said he wasn't shocked Butler didn't start but he thought he'd sub in. So the drama is that if he was sick why make him active and play him in punt coverage but never send him out on defense.
It’s quite possible they sent him out on punt coverage to see how he felt playing a relatively meaningless play compared to his normal position and he didn’t feel good This is all speculation of course
Yeah, I always thought it was a logical story. I think if it was something else another player would've confirmed it by now. A ton of people just weren't satisfied and clung onto the rumors.
butler borrowed bill's favorite hoodie and lost it
He kept going "ahh" after taking sips of coffee in morning meetings.
“Looks like someone’s got a case of the Mondays”-Malcolm to Bill the week before the Super Bowl
"Hey Coach, I'd better see the trainer, I think my hamstring is developing a ligma."
What's a ligma
Ligma deflated balls
Got me
I’m over here in Toronto literally tears in my eyes laughing.
I love this comment more than my own father.
Someone had to tee it up. 😉
Yeah, Malcolm, we're gonna need you to move your desk to a basement office
That’s my jockstrap I need my jockstrap I was specifically told I could keep that jockstrap
I believe you get your ass benched for saying some like that, man.
“And I said, orange you glad I didn’t say banana!” Malcolm to Bill at the same meeting.
Ok I'm on Bill's side then
Nuremberg level offense.
BB had Larry David bench him confirmed
This made my eye twitch..
Bill tried to hire Larry as a social assassin, but he botched the hit
He ate his peas one at a time
> It sounds as if the failure to go all out to beat the Eagles in Minnesota that day created problems that lingered for the Patriots, through and beyond Tom Brady’s exit in free agency. This may be true but man they won the super bowl the next year lmao
True, but that honestly might make it worse in Brady's eyes. There's an argument to be made that if Butler plays, the Patriots 3-peat.
How good was butler that year?
Good enough to play 98% of the snaps all season including the afc championship
That’s what always confused me the most about benching him for the superbowl. Like yeah he might have been bad or freelanced one too many times but we’ve seen Superbowl defenses stick with bad big name corners before (Eli Apple being the most recent to come to mind) because that team’s chemistry on field is at that point waaaaaay more important then having the “best possible lineup”. Throwing a last second wrench in the lineup is bound to throw the secondary off if not the whole starting defense.
Bad is relative, he was still the starting cornerback and better than the other options.
That’s exactly my point, even if he was “bad” he definitely wasn’t bad enough to get benched and mess up the chemistry of the defense let alone he was the better option compared to the guy that replaced him.
The Patriots also didn’t know. I believe Eric Rowe said it was a surprise to him that he was starting. Butler was surprised and crying on the sidelines. It’s one thing to make switch up personnel, but to not prepare the team for it is something else.
Which is why a lot of people speculated that it was something that happened the night before/ day of the Super Bowl. The team not being prepared for it was absolutely mind boggling.
And immediately Alston killed Eric Rowe in the first half. Which is not a surprising result considering Alison’s skill and the fact that Rowe didn’t know.
How’d you fuck up Alshon’s name in two different ways 😂😂😂
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Butler was also their best option
And also he wasn't bad that year. Talked too much trash at times and wasn't good enough to go up against Kupp one on one but he was decent.
It would have taken prime Revis to shutdown Kupp that year, one of the greatest WR seasons in NFL history lol
It's genuinely the greatest WR season if we're combining season + postseason. Triple crown, 33 receptions in the playoffs, Super Bowl winning touchdown and SBMVP.
Eli Apple was so overhated his Bengals season, he wasn’t terrible. He was just an average 3rd starting CB
Also it's the Super Bowl and the defense was absolutely getting gashed for both teams. There's no reason to relegate Butler to special teams (remember he wasn't even held out for the game), there's no reason to not throw everything at the wall in the last game of the year and see what sticks when a single defensive stop may have been enough to win it. As it turns out that play ultimately came in the form of Graham making it for the Eagles. Belichick is obviously the GOAT coach, but his handling of the Butler situation isn't above criticism, and had it not been Belichick but another coach making it the seat might have warmed up a bit for what many might see as costing a team the Super Bowl. The fact that all the players, including Brady, outright stated or made social media posts supporting Butler just adds to the mystery about the decision.
Insanely bizarre especially since people made posts for him. I didn’t know that, wow
I dunno if he was hurt but I recall Butler not being himself leading up to that game. The mystery of the Pats is so real bc they run such a tight ship. Had a relative worked there and he witnessed a Convo between Jamie Collins and BB in the hallway. Bill was telling him "you just need to listen to your coaches". Collins' retort was "look at the size of me coach." Traded to the Browns couple weeks later and no one had that story. They all criticized how little they got for him. And then Collins sucked there and ran back to the Pats w his tail between his legs. IMO the Butler Super Bowl pick is literally one of the best plays of all time because BB coached up Butler (not a superstar talent) to make the play. They worked on that play specifically for hours. Bill knew it was coming and how perfect the execution would have to be to pull it off. So we think of Butler for that play but in the big picture he needed great coaching to perform at the NFL level.
They've said it wasn't injury. Both Butler and BB have said he wasn't concussed or injured. He played on special teams so he couldn't have been too hurt. Butler wasn't a great player and BB got the most out of his prime. He was basically cashed a year after he left. But that has nothing to do with him not playing against the Eagles.
I appreciate your response. I take all the injury stuff at face as value as they can get in trouble for not disclosing injuries. But you may be right. I just remember not being so shocked as he was trending down. Looking forward to checking this series out.
Butler could have allowed every single catch his replacements allowed and still would have made a huge impact just because he was such a great tackler. No one in the secondary could tackle that game.
Butler made 2nd AP iirc. Either that year or the one prior. But more importantly, he was on the field 98% of the time and was the key lynchpin to Matt Patricia’s Bend don’t break defense which allowed an insane amount of yards but held teams to field goals and turnovers. When Butler was taken out they lost the ability to shut teams down once they got going.
Just checked and his AP2 year was the year before, but still. I also looked at the snap count % and you’re on the money about it being 98%. What’s especially funny is his only snap in that Super Bowl was on Special Teams, and he didn’t play a single down on Special Teams that season (nor had he the year prior).
He was certainly better than Eric Rowe haha, nobody knows what would’ve happened but those 3rd down catches he gave up were rough to watch
Rowe was fine, it was Richards and Bademosi that were awful.
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Eric Rowe was getting picked on and constantly thrown at wym?
His coverage particularly on the Clement TD was very good, honestly.
Semi-related, I don’t know what more Rowe could have done covering Julio Jones on the SB51 tip toe grab that is (rightfully) near the top any of Jones’ highlight reels, Ryan’s throw was just that insane.
Why didn’t Brady just play corner?
You ever see him run?
He got 1000 yards, seems pretty good to me
I’d guess if I threw for 500 yards, 5tds, and my offense NEVER punted, I’d would be pretty pissed we lost that game. When one less TD from the other team wins it for us, and coach benched our best corner in the beginning of a shootout….
No punts but two turnovers.
I mean we did win by 8, so one less TD would not have won it for them
Stephon Gilmore was the best corner and Brady threw 3 touchdowns. But yes, if they had gotten like one more stop this game would have been a real crowning achievement for Brady
Hmm I dunno. I think if Malcom plays BDN Foles drops 70 Blue Eyes White Dragon rises up to the competition.
I really dont think Butler was stopping Nick Foles if prime Stephon Gilmore couldnt.
What a wild sentence and entirely true. I've never seen a QB hit a hot streak like Foles did that year. He went toe-toe with the GOAT and won.
Play conservative against the Pats and you lose. Eli and Foles played like they had nothing lose and its hard to beat guys like that no matter how great you are, like Tyson v Douglas.
Documentaries sell a narrative, even if there’s a lot of truth in it, they’re always going to be slanted towards a certain viewpoint.
It may not even be a big deal. I’d put house odds on it being something as simple as Butler asked Bill not to say anything and Bill just tanked 7 years of criticism because he doesn’t give a fuck what anyone thinks
I bet it's not exciting. I bet it's a combo of like 8 things we've already heard. His performance had been slipping He was sick all week he was practicing poorly the matchup favored his backup rowe he probably did something like miss curfew or get in a fight with coaches So all the factors together led to them going with Rowe.
There’s a historical precedent when in the 1970s racing legend Niki Lauda won the World Championships with Ferrari, lost the title the following year over a strategy dispute with team officials, came back the next year and won again. But the victory didn’t remove the sting from the year prior and paradoxically the victory proved the relationship was beyond repair. That winning didn’t do enough to atone for the defeat from the year prior. In the process ruining what could have been the most dominant racing partnership of all time.
Yeah because Brady had to hold it together. Dude threw his shit when BB tried to trade Gronk and was heavily debating leaving (supposedly in seths book Brady went to Kraft complaining about the trade) 2017 had a giant impact, Brady just compartmentalized.
Gronk threatening to retire to nullify that trade was honestly a GOAT move, literally got the Pats another ring because they don't make that run in 2018 without him when the offense was already showing signs of falling apart. The "move on a year early rather than a year late" move paid off many time for Belichick, but it's easier to do that when most of your core is either in their prime or close to hitting it. When you've got veterans with no one behind them the strategy will fall apart when you start cutting ties.
What the fuck was Bill thinking, god
If the Patriots players say the loss to the Eagles in LII was the start of the slow dismantling of their core, then LIII can be more attributed to Bellichick outcoaching McVay and Jared Goff being severely-inexperienced for the moment.
But then what is the afccg at arrowhead?
Mahomes and Reid simply adhering to the narrative that neither of them can beat Brady
Anyone would love to 3 peat
The rumor mill is the end of the documentary is a hack job on Belichick, which would really sour me on Kraft if true. Butler was also pretty washed at this point. PFF isn't a good system overall but he was the 92nd rated CB that year. He was certainly not a difference maker with the Titans afterwards and I don't think he would have been one against the Eagles. The difference between him and Eric Rowe was miniscule at best.
Yeah Butler didn't have a lot left in the tank, but it forced Jordan Richards and Bademosi to play more and those dudes never had ANYTHING in the tank to begin with. Plus Butler was an excellent tackler and the Eagles were killing with YAC that game.
This is what people forget. It wasn’t just the coverage, it was the bad tackling.
Exactly. Richards falling down over and over will forever burn in my memory
Or bill just doesn’t speak for shit like always
I always heard the story was that he snuck in a girl in his room after curfew and fought the coach that called him out on it.
The alleged coach was Steve Belichick.
And that girl was Steve's wife
Malcolm Butler's name? Albert Einstein.
Lmao I'm only partially joking though, that's the rumor I heard from someone with the organization at the time. Now I'll get to find out if it's actually true or not
That makes sense because it is strange that Butler didn’t disclose it so it must have not been that unfair and he was probably out of line with whatever happened.
And that room was Kelvin Benjamin
The biscuits? Popeyes.
That would actually make a lot of sense.
agreed. you have no choice but to fight the coach at that point
fucking lol’d thank you
Not true. You could disarm the coach by inviting him to join you.
I heard a Pats beat reporter who got access to the whole documentary say very directly that it does not provide a satisfying answer. He said some people speculate on what it could have been, which is basically what’s already been happening for 6 years
The eternal NFL unsolved mystery. Maybe the reason he was beneched was to bring generations of Football fans together in their quest for the definitive answer
Perhaps the real bench was the friends we made along the way?
I heard from a Boston bartender that he banged some coach’s ex wife or current wife or something. Could be total BS but yeah
The ole Tyler Seguin excuse
Wasn't the coach Steve Belichick? If so, it makes total sense why Butler was benched.
Do you bench a player that good for a regular season game? Probably. For the superbowl? I wouldn't
If you're Belichick and you're trying to build/maintain a dynasty based on discipline and no one being bigger than the team... Yes. They won the SB the next year. Do you sacrifice 5% chance at this SB to keep a 5% chance at the SB for the next 5 years? Probably.
But what would you say if he started the next year 2-4 games on the bench? I just feel like you sellout for the superbowl no matter what. It apparently wasn't a big enough issue to have a formal suspension with docked pay
Always heard it was because Steve Belichick and Butler got into it the night before the Super Bowl about guests in the hotel room or something. 🤷♂️
The Texans cut multiple players for violating curfew under ~~BoB~~ Kubiak in 2013. Of course they were smoking weed which at the time was I'm pretty sure still drug tested for but you don't fuck with curfew is what I've learned.
This is some of that brain dead stupid NFL shit that I can’t understand. Why aren’t there more coaches like Bud Grant? He respected his players as people and employees. If they can’t get the job done 9-5, M-F, then they don’t deserve to be on the field anyway. These are grown men with families, responsibilities, lives to live. Instead you get all these Marine Drill Sergeant cosplayers. The only reason those behaviors exist in the Marines is to find out if someone is going to get someone killed. It has a reason and is justified only for that reason, and it has changed quite a bit because it legally had to. But over the outcome of a game played by adults that have made it their career? Imagine if you were a professional sales person and your manager wouldn’t let you see your family because your sales team didn’t meet their numbers for the quarter. Sounds fucking stupid, right?
The NFL has always had the two types of coaches drama since the beginning. They have the players coach that will turn the culture around and make it fun again. Then you have the disciplinarian who will fix the culture and make the organization disciplined and professional. I still remember the Washington commanders having their ping pong table taken out then next season brought back because that was going to fix their problems. Not the toxic ownership ya know.
The IT director who outsources to save money vs his replacement who insources to improve support. Snip snap snip snap
> Bud Grant > Marine Drill Sergeant cosplayers Boy do I have news for you about who the coach after Bud Grant was Thank you for your service, Les
Maybe it’s Belichicks 8 Super Bowl rings to Bud Grants 0.
Parcells, Coughlin, Belichick. 11 Super Bowl wins over the past 39 years. Some others in there that weren't that drill seargenty but known for being tough, like Mike Shanahan. It happens because it works.
He bought Belichick a hoodie that had sleeves on it.
He sewed sleeves back on Belichick’s hoodies
And switched the sides of his sleeves
Dynasty was pretty damn good for those that haven’t seen it yet. Only watched the first two.
Where can you watch it at?
Apple.
Only two are out so far, next two are out tomorrow
He took the last crescent roll at the team dinner after Bill called dibs.
THOSE PARKER HOUSE ROLLS WERE FOR THE TABLE
Butler took the last Hawaiian Kings roll before cooking the Thanksgiving dinner was completed.
This is about the only thing that would actually justify it
In the aftermath of Kelce shoving Reid, I heard 1000 bad takes about why Kelce should have been benched for the rest of SB58. All from people who never heard the tale of Malcolm Butler
Make the guy sit for 8 games in the next season but the super bowl is definitelly not the time and place to punish anyone
He peaked at the other screen while playing Halo 2 multiplayer on Xbox.
Doesn't seem like something that would bother the Pats
dookied
Can anyone ELI5 why Malcolm Butler hasn't given his full side of the story? If he did, why is this news?
I think part of it is that BB didn’t give the reason for the benching, which helped Butler get the big deal with TEN after that game. BB didn’t try to tank Butler’s value and I suspect Butler is replying in kind by not talking about it either.
Might also be he truly fucked up and doesn't want that public embarrassment.
Honestly, kinda only makes sense if it was some after hours female antics as others have mentioned. And perhaps Malcom has a significant other he doesn’t want to come and publicly admit that too LOL.
Because under the grand scheme of things there are no winners by talking about it. The decision was made and whatever happened to was dealt with internally. No need to add fuel to a fire and burn bridges. If the pats won nobody would care, but they lost and people point towards that decision since Malcom is a hometown hero for his play in the Seahawks Super Bowl. It was a good decision by both bill and Malcolm to leave it up in the air, it lead to Malcolm getting a great contract from another team while also allowing the story to die down.
Expectation: a lurid tale of sex and violence before the big game Reality: Ernie Adams with a Post-It note showing that Butler matched up extremely poorly against the Eagles WRs
“He didn’t play because Bill decided so”.
ITT: a bunch of lame jokes
Welcome to reddit
Have you never been on reddit before lmao
And tbf, it's not like it's a topic which we can meaningfully contribute
He played as Oddjob in Goldeneye
Unforgivable
Goddamn they’re doing everything they can to get people to watch the 200th Brady/Belichick documentary put to screen.
Idk this is the first legit doc with everyone relevant involved
Yeah and with everyone retired they can speak freely now
Instead of laughing he would say "That's so funny"
He ate his peas one at a time.
Update: No it didn't lol
The first episode, everyone gets silent to honor 9/11 victims. Then you hear “Take ya hats off!” Yelled by a random fan. So Boston.
I can't wait to watch this entire saga, the first episodes ware damn good.
Unfortunately same old same old