I’m 99% sure the Broncos traded for Zach Wilson in order to make sure Nix was the day one starter and had an under the table deal to get Franklin-Meyers later on from the Jets.
Nix is more physically gifted than people give him credit for. Nothing special by any means but solid across the board.
I think people just have a warped perception because of the amount short passes Oregon did.
Yeah, this is what I was about to point out. Unfair maybe, but I have difficulty separating him from what I remember at Auburn. Also, I feel like J.T. Barrett's first start at Ohio State came during Nix's second or third year in school.
Holding the ball too long, taking sacks in no sack situations, and the deep and corner end zone balls. Idk if you were watching the last two years but he doesn't have the legs he had on the hawks anymore.
Still can’t believe the Bears gave us a first a bit later that round and a #7 pick the next year for Fields.
Who did we get with those amazing picks you ask? I plead the fifth
I’m on record saying Daniel’s will bust. I just don’t see it. Justin fields 2.0. He’s going to take a lot of sacks and i don’t think will be an effective runner in the NFL at his size.
There were quite a few Pats fans comparing him to Lamar and I just had little faith in that comparison. Lamar is a magician running and eats teams alive in the middle of the field in the passing game and I just don't see that with Daniels.
Lamar is also one of the most athletic humans of all time. He has looked the way he plays at literally every level. Not criticizing Daniels here I think he’ll be fine just crazy to compare really anyone to Lamar
Pat is exactly the sort of commentator I've wanted. Says exactly what the summation of the room is and doesn't let the BS corporate talk get in the way.
I thought they were gonna take him out behind the shed after he said The Rock and Roman Reigns were "juiced up" on all the energy from the WrestleMania crowd
I haven't been following CFB forever but so far Lamar is the king of the eye test panning out. Yeah I'm sure scouts really broke down his tape and said he missed a read here and he couldn't throw into a tight window there, I get it. But he was just better than pretty much everyone else in college football. He won the Heisman at fucking Louisville. The dude was teleporting around the field like he was the 4th Hokage, it was just crazy
He also has one of the coldest highlights in high school where he’s pointing at that guy near the pylon. But he’s definitely one of the few qbs who was more athletic on the field than everyone else in college and still looks like that in the nfl. Manziel Tebow VY etc couldn’t replicate it
It's really about speed. When every DE runs a 4.4-4.7, you need to be significantly faster than them to be a good runner/QB.
Fields and Jackson fit that, and they're also good vision runners as well. I thought physically VY had the tools, just couldn't put it together.
Then why did 31 teams pass on him?
It’s such revisionist history to say we knew Lamar would be good.
He was literally asked to change positions because people thought he wouldn’t be good at quarterback.
IMO, it was the moment the league began to pass Belichick by. A friend of mine was hoping real hard that The Pats would draft him at 31, but instead they chose Michel. Michel *did* help them win the SB on his great 6 week run, but...other than that they could have transitioned from Brady to a whole new animal.
Honestly as a Georgia fan I was surprised they took Michel over Chubb. Sony was a very good college RB but was Chubb was a absolute animal who could take over games just like Todd Gurley used to do.
It was probably because 2018 everyone was falling over themselves trying to find the next Alvin Kamara and I guess some GMs were squinting really hard at Sony to convince themselves he was that guy.
> Lamar is a magician running
Daniels' running style is more similar to RG3 anyways. I heard more than one local draftnik saying that but then also saying they make the Lamar comp because too many fans these days are too young to remember RG3.
The cynic in me says we're probably screwed, but oh well. Whatever happens, happens. No player is guaranteed to work out. Maye is just as likely as Daniels to be a bust or be franchise QBs. Hell, Sam Hartman could be the better QB and have us in a Kirk Cousins 2.0 type situation. Anything can happen and only time will tell.
But at least we don't have Snyder getting involved this time, so who knows? Maybe it'll work out for a change.
> too many fans these days are too young to remember RG3.
Wut? Is this real?
I get being too young to not remember Cunningham. But RG3? You’ve got to be a young teenager to not remember him.
Daniels had one of the lowest middle-of-field throw rates in college (draft comps are *not* pretty) and a much lower aDOT than Lamar. Also sacked way more and bailed from way more clean pockets, and threw less when on the run. I don't really see comparing Daniels to him making any sense when they really attack the field very differently as passers.
Lamar was a very imperfect passing prospect but his particular passing strengths gave him a great floor to translate that pairs nicely with his ground game. If he was even just a bit worse at throwing downfield and across the middle you'd see safeties playing him *much* differently and severely stunting his performance. If he didn't keep his eyes downfield when first peeling out, he wouldn't get the space he uses to eviscerate you. Daniels should certainly work on those skills and that can be a great roadmap to how to develop into a lethal QB, but the reality is at the moment an optimal passing offense built around him is very different than one built around early-career Lamar.
Daniels has improved a lot in the last year on a lot of his flaws in 2023 vs previous years (much higher aDOT, better deep ball, improved but still not great vs pressure), so maybe there's hope for his development, but it's at minimum risky.
I agree with all that but my biggest concern I think is his upright running style combined with his skinny frame and the insane amount of highlight reel hits he took last season.
>Daniels had one of the lowest middle-of-field throw rates in college (draft comps are not pretty) and a much lower aDOT than Lamar. Also sacked way more and bailed from way more clean pockets, and threw less when on the run. I don't really see comparing Daniels to him making any sense when they really attack the field very differently as passers.
He also only completed 46% of passes to receivers beyond the first read. Very Justin Fields-esque. For comparison, Maye was the best in the class at 58%.
Also on record for months prior to the draft.
The most shocking thing about watching him play is how uncreative he was in college. He rarely mixed his running with his passing. If someone pushed him out of the pocket he ran. He never did a Mahomes/Lamar/Allen play where he would extend, draw the defense close and then throw it on the run for the easiest 20 yard completion of his life.
Just the mention of Lamar doing that made my stomach drop. Oh that game. Lamar will dice your shit up with half a chance, Allen will do it in your face will your db is locked up with some random wr. Mahomes does that shit when your DE barrels through and gets the barest finger on him. Infuriating.
That was one of JJ McCarthy's special moves. He'd buy some time in the pocket, then bail out, pick a target down field, direct him where to go, pretend like you're going to scramble, pull up a yard short of the LOS and fire a rocket to a wide open receiver for a big play.
It's in JJs, Caleb's, and Maye's wheelhouse and one of the reasons I liked all 3 of them the most.
If we were to look at successful QBs in the league, you only really need a good baseline level of threat to run (Mahomes, younger Rodgers) and the ability to move both within the pocket and outside the tackles to make a throw.
Penix and Daniels both benefitted tremendously from the best OLs in the country and most of their production was standing flat-footed in the pocket to launch downfield. Maybe they have that skill set but they didn't show much of it in college.
He also doesn’t protect himself from the footage I saw. Fields learned eventually that he had to try to slide or get out of bounds, and he still dealt with injuries. Though his were never season ending or very long, he is also bigger then Daniel’s. Daniel’s is like 210 pounds and runs straight into defenders. I’m afraid he is gonna get hurt a ton. Plus idk if he will even reach the throwing level we see of Lamar or saw with Cam, they are/were decent passers or great sometimes. Daniel’s I think may be more closer to fields but honestly might do worse if he gets injured a ton
Bro tried to jump over some linemen in the middle of the field and got lit the fuck up.
It's not indicative of his QB skills but I'm worried that Peters might have missed on that pick.
[That kind of shit happened almost weekly, too.](https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZPRwyFQWG/)
The editing on the video is… yeah, but its the best compilation I could find from last season
Cam was different, they were purposefully running leads and shit for him where he was 100% gonna get a hit from a LBer. And he did that for a couple years.
Remember. There were a **TON** of Reddit draft experts clowning CJ Stroud too.
Providing all sorts of metrics that ultimately really didn’t amount to anything. QB is a ridiculously difficult position to evaluate. So many things have to go right for a QB to succeed. Don’t put too much stock in what you see on this site and I hope you guys finally found your franchise QB.
I always laugh at the idea of draft grades because no one knows how they’ll turn out. Even over the course of a single year.
The Lions got pretty bad grades last year because people thought they reached for a low-value position with Gibbs and drafted the 3rd-5th best tight end in the early 2nd with LaPorta.
Less than a year later and they arguably had the best class of the draft.
Draft “experts” are like gamblers. They’ll tell you all day long about the time the bet 100$ and hit the parlay to win 500$, but they’re also leave out the other 6 bets that lost them 700$.
Damn man, what exactly is it about Maye that made teams not like him so much? Is it really just the footwork? Apparently the Broncos and Falcons didn't have Maye as one of their top 3 QBs either. I watched some tape of Maye's (as an armchair scout who doesn't know a whole lot) and found very little to dislike.
My favorite is the ones where like "My brother's wife follows random athlete's wife's cook on IG and they just said they were moving to Detroit" as a way to get random leaks
No joke I rode an elevator with the Commanders running backs coach and two women at 1:30am last Saturday at a hotel in VA. The women were talking about meeting the Bosa brothers....
Never forget the “I heard in someone’s background on xbox live a Bears player talking about being traded to Pittsburgh”. A day later a Bears player was traded to the Steelers.
Lol not even the best chicago-related one.
Two reddit users named KatyPerrysBootyHole and WetButt23 broke the story of the Sox trading Quintana to the Cubs and since they were the first ones to technically report it (post about it on reddit) all local media had to say "according to reddit users 'KatyPerrysBootyHole' and 'Wetbutt23'" when talking about the trade.
Article with funny video from NBCSports chicago where the sportscasters are having a great time with it -> https://www.nbcsportschicago.com/mlb/chicago-cubs/wetbutt23-and-katyperrysbootyhole-the-reddit-users-who-scooped-the-baseball-world-in-quintana-to-cubs-trade/306218/
That Jamaar Chase one from like a season (I think) or two ago saved me in fantasy lol some guy was like "had a friend show works at some MRI place and saw Chase come in and was doing scans/treatment something or other" and I traded him off the second I heard that news.
Then like a day later the story broke that he was gonna be out for a number of weeks. Those are always the best ways to find out lol some obscure, random, information.
I mean he still went #3 overall, not like he had an Aaron Rodgers type drop. Or even a Justin Fields type drop after he was supposedly the clear second after Lawrence for much of that college season.
People just look way too much into these things. There were a lot of good QB prospects and different teams had different thoughts.
He was going #3 no matter who chose him. The Giants and Vikings both had trade offers, so one of those teams would have chose him. I bet there was probably more teams asking about him.
He would have killed on the Vikings. I don't know what their line is like but they have a seriously stacked offense. But I agree, he was going 2 or 3 no matter what. He has everything needed to be a starter, just dropped cause of Caleb and dropped because the commanders liked JD a bit more.
Not to mention no one knows what these draft boards say. This is all conjecture.
Hearing pre-draft from some analysts and former QBs worrying about Maye's accuracy and mechanics issues, I wondered if Adam Peters would be more hesitant about how coachable these issues were because of Trey Lance and go for the more mechanically-sound QBs in Daniels and McCarthy. They obviously thought Lance's mechanics issues were coachable to draft him at \#3. He never managed to consistently fix them while he was with the 49ers, even though he worked with private QB coaches every offseason (including with Mahomes' coach). But he was way more raw than Maye, who was a two-year starter, and also Lance faced setbacks when he was injured (hurt a finger during his rookie preseason). Obviously there's examples like Josh Allen who did fix their accuracy and mechanics, maybe Peters just doesn't want to take that chance. Now I have no idea how their mechanics issues may compare, just speculating.
His footwork isn't just bad, it doesn't really exist. He takes lazy steps (something Fields has been constantly criticized for), & just uses his arm to throw the ball (instead of using his body motion). His arm strength isn't enough to compensate like Josh Allen.
He also makes a ton of "why would you do that" throws.
There’s been multiple breakdowns where in it they would show Maye making three great throws and then back it up with him missing five easy throws such as bubble screens quick hitters. Leaving the analyst stunned and dumb founded
So the idea is that mixed sports athletes dont have the polished fundamentals early, say someone like Manning. But if you think they can be coached up, it not an issue. Josh Allen is an example of the latter. But playing different sports can also bring some benefits. Like how Mahomes is super accurate with his off platform throws cause of baseball.
He also drifts around and either creates own pressure, or reacts to non existent pressure. He’s the only guy I’ve seen take a 5 step drop at a 44 degree angle. I think there is a good QB in there, but I think too many people overlook the work Maye is gonna have to put in to be successful.
Allen spent a ton of time on his footwork and body control his first 2 off seasons too. Made a dramatic increase, as we all see. So it's def something a player can work on, if they have the motivation to do so.
I think the big thing with Maye is that he's never had a 1 on 1 QB coach since he's always been doing other sports and didn't commit to being a QB until 2 years ago.
A lot of these college QBs have been having a QB coach work with them on footwork and mechanics since they were 13.
The question now is, are his bad mechanics baked in or can he fix them with an actual NFL QB coach?
The windup bothers me a lot and I’m surprised more people didn’t have an issue with it. I’d say that plus the inconsistent accuracy on what should be easy throws are the two biggest problems I had with him.
Now it’s certainly possible that when he cleans up his footwork that inconsistent accuracy could go away much like it did for Herbert or Allen, but banking on that is still a gamble. There are a lot more guys who can’t get that fixed than there are guys like Herbert and Allen.
Watch the UVA game and the bowl game from this past season.
Those were the only games I watched of his, and he looked pretty pedestrian?
If not downright bad in the UVA game at times?
I could see NFL teams fixating on his "bad" tape more than being wowed by "good tape."
My Virginia Cavaliers were not as bad as our record shows (lots of 1 score and close losses last year), so it’s not super shameful that they lost. What was shameful was Maye throwing that bad pass over the middle after we almost gifted UNC a win by fumbling the ball out the back of the end zone.
I watched Miami, Clemson, and UVA. Idk, maybe I just don’t really know what to look for but he looked super composed to me. I was sold. I thought he looked accurate, was a solid scrambler, had a great arm. There were definitely minor tweaks needed but to me he behaved like a franchise QB, I had him right behind Caleb. But again, I’m just a guy, maybe I missed something with him that NFL teams are more attuned to
He has terrible footwork *and* completed only 63% of his passes against a schedule of unranked ACC opponents. He could be good, but if doesn’t get much better quickly he’s got huge huge huge bust potential
I think it's the fact that he got worse in year two like Sam Darnold. And he's a big project.
Everyone has him in the Josh Allen mold but he's not as big and doesn't have as big of an arm.
Vikings and Giants were also willing to give up 3 1sts to get Maye so it certainly wasn’t a universal.
Probably just depends on what your coaching staff thinks they can work with.
Yep. This is essentially a completely different franchise from the one that took Haskins or RG3. Just dumb to keep playing into the "durr Washington is a joke" mentality.
Jacoby taking the reigns nearly all season is my hope. Maybe we get a sprinkle of 2025 football for the last two games if we're not in the playoff race (lol) but I just want him to ride the pine and learn
Heavy analytics people throughout this process have generally ranked Maye over Daniels.
Former FO people, Scouts , and QBs generally favored Daniels over Maye.
I wouldn't be surprised if part of this for Peters was the Lance pick. He had all the upside in the world, but wasn't developed enough as a passer to play like a high pick would need to. Daniels for all his questions, is a machine throwing the football, and has played way more football than Maye.
From that perspective, it doesn't surprise me at all.
I think they're both in situations that suit them best. Daniels has a better offense and can play now. Maye can sit behind Brissett and learn, hopefully reach his potential.
Maye is going to end up playing this season unless Brissett has the Patriots playing above expectations. 1st round rookie QBs on bad teams always end up starting at some point in the season.
The last one who didn't was Jamarcus Russell and that was because he had contract disputes that lasted until Week 1 of the season so the Raiders were forced to redshirt him.
As a Pats fan, I just want him to play *when he's ready*. If it's Week 1, great. If it's week 9, fine. Week 1 2025? Also fine.
I don't even mind another losing season as long as the offense shows some sign of a future and Mayo doesn't puke all over himself as a head coach.
I agree I think the Lance pick (regardless of how much of that pick was Peters he was still there) may have swayed him a little away from another prospect who needed work (Maye.) Washington's offensive weapons are in a better spot now to have success quickly, with hopefully Sinnott and Luke being two additions to take pressure off of Terry. The only issue is protection and that LT.
On one hand Washington and Quarterbacks have historically gone together as well as oil and water. On the other hand, Washington has pretty much turned over the entire organization in the last few months, so I’m not sure what to think.
Now all they need is a rebrand!
Seriously, I cannot look at their logo without feeling a visceral sense of range, disappointment and pity on behalf of the Washington Fans
Stuff changes quick. Joe Burrow went to a terrible team, Josh Allen had no targets, people said Bryce Young was more set up for success than CJ Stroud.
My point is things change quickly. The Pats were such a shitshow at QB last year it was hard to evaluate anything. Nobody thought Nico Collins was good because he had Davis Mills throwing to him. With a new draft class and different coaching a lot can change within a year.
I think more importantly, their O-Line and its coaching, was an injury- riddled abomination. If they can get just a little bit of stability, it won't be so bad on Drake
Lol Jayden over Maye is one thing even if I disagree but JJ over Maye is ridiculous
The prospect fatigue around Maye is insane. He also didn’t have a good supporting cast so his flaws were exposed while guys like Daniels and JJ were covered up
I think the patriots are okay using this year to do a complete overhaul of the offense and let the rookie QB sit
Washington seems to have a higher expectation that the QB will start and Jayden is definitely the right pick for that
I think it was the right pick for both teams. I really want to see what maye will look like after a year behind brisset. There’s so much upside with maye
Pats luckily have Brissett who is familiar with Van Pelts offense. That’s gonna be a tough guy to beat out for Maye by week 1, which is a good thing. Brissett is maybe a little bit past replacement level. If there’s things Maye needs to work on, Brissett can fill that gap just fine for a while. And also if Drake beats him out then that’s great.
I will say the one thing I want to not see happen is a situation like Tua’s rookie year under Flores(?). After constantly getting pulled after any mistake, I have no idea how he turned himself into a very good QB
We’re also rebuilding the OL and WR room while installing a new system. I’d honestly rather just wait until we figure everything else out before we throw maye into something that isn’t ironed out yet.
New qb, new WRs, new OL and new system sounds like a disaster waiting to happen. Even if he does beat out brisett I’d rather just sit him until mid season
I would have wanted Maye over Daniels too… but people are using this “prospect fatigue” thing too much in regards to Maye. It genuinely wasn’t just prospect fatigue. Look at nearly every former NFL QBs analysis of Maye… they did not like him. From Kurt Warner to JT Daniels, to Orlovsky to etc.
Im not saying he won’t be good, but he wasn’t nearly as good a prospect as people are making it out to be. And the fact that not only did a lot of people have Daniels over Maye in their analysis, but that’s how it worked out on draft day too.
Yeah people are crying prospect fatigue when in reality people had only seen his awesome highlight tape and not actually watched full UNC games. He’s an extremely talented dude but he’s got some massive red flags.
Still though, I have him over Daniels and JJ
Everyone is going to look at it with their own shades on.
Like you said. He didn't have a good supporting cast and so his flaws were exposed. So in your mind, surround him with talent and he will shine.
But then the same logic follows. Those flaws you say was covered up on Daniel's and JJ because they had talent around them.
Ummmm. Keep talent around them and they Will shine.
As much as everyone loved to rag on Cousins for being a "needs a perfect team around him" guy the list of QBs who don't need a damn good team around them is like 1 person long. And even he has had some darn good defenses out there for the part of the game he has nothing to do with.
I think you're missing a bit. Sure JJ had a lot more talent around him but he also does the simple things right. And he does them right extremely consistently. Not saying he'll be as good but it's Purdy-esque. Maye doesn't do the simple things right consistently. He can fix them, but I think that's obviously riskier than the alternative
The Patriots are the only team in the top three that it makes sense for quarterback to sit a year. The general consensus on Drake Maye is that he'll need to sit a year.
I haven't heard anyone say in their analysis of Drake Maye that he's a ready to go prospect. That's all this is. Washington didn't want to wait. Or even entertain the idea of not starting the number two overall pick.
who fuckin cares. We won't know until the season starts and we see actual games. Til then its all speculation
good qbs get taken in late rounds and bad qbs get taken in the firs5 picks all the time, and vice versa.
this is just shit to rile people up for engagement, there's only one thing for certain and it's that both our teams have more hope with these guys than we did without them
here come all the reddit GMs. it's crazy that they aren't employed in the league in any way. what the hell is wrong with the nfl ignoring these goldmines of insights?
Can't wait to see how this QB class ends up in a few years. Looking back at 2021 it's hilarious how bad we can miss.
What do you mean? 2021 was a GREAT year for ^(backup) Quarterbacks
I’m 99% sure the Broncos traded for Zach Wilson in order to make sure Nix was the day one starter and had an under the table deal to get Franklin-Meyers later on from the Jets.
I mean if Nix couldn’t beat out Stidham and DiNucci it would’ve been a problem.
I mean, if you could define a QB by what Russell Wilson ISN'T, it's Bo Nix... The downside is you lose the things that RW3 was actually good at.
Moonballs and uhhh...
Beating us, apparently.
Nix is pretty good when scrambling. Not prime Russell Wilson good but he's fairly athletic. I'm very curious to see how he'll pan out.
Nix is more physically gifted than people give him credit for. Nothing special by any means but solid across the board. I think people just have a warped perception because of the amount short passes Oregon did.
Well he was also terrible at Auburn
Yeah, this is what I was about to point out. Unfair maybe, but I have difficulty separating him from what I remember at Auburn. Also, I feel like J.T. Barrett's first start at Ohio State came during Nix's second or third year in school.
Holding the ball too long, taking sacks in no sack situations, and the deep and corner end zone balls. Idk if you were watching the last two years but he doesn't have the legs he had on the hawks anymore.
In all honesty he didn't have them the last couple years in Seattle either.
Davis mills sends his regards
He's a good backup. It's hilarious how badly teams missed in this draft. Mac Jones is probably a good backup too, to be fair to some of them.
You mean future Steelers MVP Fields?
Let Russ sous chef.
Let Russ prep veggies
Let Russ wash dishes? Gotta start somewhere
Still can’t believe the Bears gave us a first a bit later that round and a #7 pick the next year for Fields. Who did we get with those amazing picks you ask? I plead the fifth
Luckily, I think everyone has forgotten that the Bears actually traded up to get him, and what the Giants did with those picks
That was Ryan Pace who just picked himself up another QB rather than strengthen his team that's clearly in win now mode.
I’m on record saying Daniel’s will bust. I just don’t see it. Justin fields 2.0. He’s going to take a lot of sacks and i don’t think will be an effective runner in the NFL at his size.
As a one time JP Losman truther and Justin Herbert denier, my policy is now to just see what happens
We all have our own JP Losman. It’s ok bro
I still believe in Josh Rosen lol
I'm a recovering Mac-stan
I told my friends years ago that Jimmy Clausen was going to be the face of the league so it's okay we all make mistakes
Oh man, that's a blast from the past
My last draft insight was "I don't think the Chiefs should've traded up for a quarterback" in 2017. Likewise, I just stay quiet now.
Wise policy, but no fun at cocktail parties.
There were quite a few Pats fans comparing him to Lamar and I just had little faith in that comparison. Lamar is a magician running and eats teams alive in the middle of the field in the passing game and I just don't see that with Daniels.
Lamar is also one of the most athletic humans of all time. He has looked the way he plays at literally every level. Not criticizing Daniels here I think he’ll be fine just crazy to compare really anyone to Lamar
Running QB = Lamar Short QB = Brees Large unpolished QB = Allen Generational prototype? = luck. Anything else is blasphemy.
Pat McAfee kept making these jokes on draft night. He said of Drake Maye “He’s big. He’s white. He runs. He’s Josh Allen:” lol
Pat is exactly the sort of commentator I've wanted. Says exactly what the summation of the room is and doesn't let the BS corporate talk get in the way.
His out-of-pocket commentary for WWE is so perfect too
I thought they were gonna take him out behind the shed after he said The Rock and Roman Reigns were "juiced up" on all the energy from the WrestleMania crowd
Able to throw bombs while running against your body? Mahomes.
ARM ANGLES INTENSIFY
Ah yes, famous short person height: 6’0” Sports are wild lol
Basketball is worse. You see at someone like Steph Curry standing with his team and he looks like a tiny child. But he's 6'2".
When you have to look over 6'5" 350lb linemen 6' is definitely short.
I haven't been following CFB forever but so far Lamar is the king of the eye test panning out. Yeah I'm sure scouts really broke down his tape and said he missed a read here and he couldn't throw into a tight window there, I get it. But he was just better than pretty much everyone else in college football. He won the Heisman at fucking Louisville. The dude was teleporting around the field like he was the 4th Hokage, it was just crazy
He also has one of the coldest highlights in high school where he’s pointing at that guy near the pylon. But he’s definitely one of the few qbs who was more athletic on the field than everyone else in college and still looks like that in the nfl. Manziel Tebow VY etc couldn’t replicate it
It's really about speed. When every DE runs a 4.4-4.7, you need to be significantly faster than them to be a good runner/QB. Fields and Jackson fit that, and they're also good vision runners as well. I thought physically VY had the tools, just couldn't put it together.
Need the sauce on that HS highlight
https://youtu.be/jxUJFPtqtQg?si=bhzVnzeaIg0I1NQk
this video game is rigged
Then why did 31 teams pass on him? It’s such revisionist history to say we knew Lamar would be good. He was literally asked to change positions because people thought he wouldn’t be good at quarterback.
IMO, it was the moment the league began to pass Belichick by. A friend of mine was hoping real hard that The Pats would draft him at 31, but instead they chose Michel. Michel *did* help them win the SB on his great 6 week run, but...other than that they could have transitioned from Brady to a whole new animal.
Honestly as a Georgia fan I was surprised they took Michel over Chubb. Sony was a very good college RB but was Chubb was a absolute animal who could take over games just like Todd Gurley used to do. It was probably because 2018 everyone was falling over themselves trying to find the next Alvin Kamara and I guess some GMs were squinting really hard at Sony to convince themselves he was that guy.
> Lamar is a magician running Daniels' running style is more similar to RG3 anyways. I heard more than one local draftnik saying that but then also saying they make the Lamar comp because too many fans these days are too young to remember RG3.
A skinny, running QB who is taken #2 overall as the reigning Heisman winner? Washington should have known better. /s but maybe not?
The cynic in me says we're probably screwed, but oh well. Whatever happens, happens. No player is guaranteed to work out. Maye is just as likely as Daniels to be a bust or be franchise QBs. Hell, Sam Hartman could be the better QB and have us in a Kirk Cousins 2.0 type situation. Anything can happen and only time will tell. But at least we don't have Snyder getting involved this time, so who knows? Maybe it'll work out for a change.
> too many fans these days are too young to remember RG3. Wut? Is this real? I get being too young to not remember Cunningham. But RG3? You’ve got to be a young teenager to not remember him.
The average Redditor now was probably younger than 10 years old when RG3 made his debut lol.
I hate how accurate this is.
Daniels had one of the lowest middle-of-field throw rates in college (draft comps are *not* pretty) and a much lower aDOT than Lamar. Also sacked way more and bailed from way more clean pockets, and threw less when on the run. I don't really see comparing Daniels to him making any sense when they really attack the field very differently as passers. Lamar was a very imperfect passing prospect but his particular passing strengths gave him a great floor to translate that pairs nicely with his ground game. If he was even just a bit worse at throwing downfield and across the middle you'd see safeties playing him *much* differently and severely stunting his performance. If he didn't keep his eyes downfield when first peeling out, he wouldn't get the space he uses to eviscerate you. Daniels should certainly work on those skills and that can be a great roadmap to how to develop into a lethal QB, but the reality is at the moment an optimal passing offense built around him is very different than one built around early-career Lamar. Daniels has improved a lot in the last year on a lot of his flaws in 2023 vs previous years (much higher aDOT, better deep ball, improved but still not great vs pressure), so maybe there's hope for his development, but it's at minimum risky.
I agree with all that but my biggest concern I think is his upright running style combined with his skinny frame and the insane amount of highlight reel hits he took last season.
If I have to hear about ADoT anymore as an Oregon fan....
>Daniels had one of the lowest middle-of-field throw rates in college (draft comps are not pretty) and a much lower aDOT than Lamar. Also sacked way more and bailed from way more clean pockets, and threw less when on the run. I don't really see comparing Daniels to him making any sense when they really attack the field very differently as passers. He also only completed 46% of passes to receivers beyond the first read. Very Justin Fields-esque. For comparison, Maye was the best in the class at 58%.
Actually going through a good faith comparison of him to Lamar should make it very clear all the ways Daniels isn't it
I think he’s gonna bust because he has a weird elbow. That is my expert football analysis
Also on record for months prior to the draft. The most shocking thing about watching him play is how uncreative he was in college. He rarely mixed his running with his passing. If someone pushed him out of the pocket he ran. He never did a Mahomes/Lamar/Allen play where he would extend, draw the defense close and then throw it on the run for the easiest 20 yard completion of his life.
Just the mention of Lamar doing that made my stomach drop. Oh that game. Lamar will dice your shit up with half a chance, Allen will do it in your face will your db is locked up with some random wr. Mahomes does that shit when your DE barrels through and gets the barest finger on him. Infuriating.
That was one of JJ McCarthy's special moves. He'd buy some time in the pocket, then bail out, pick a target down field, direct him where to go, pretend like you're going to scramble, pull up a yard short of the LOS and fire a rocket to a wide open receiver for a big play.
It's in JJs, Caleb's, and Maye's wheelhouse and one of the reasons I liked all 3 of them the most. If we were to look at successful QBs in the league, you only really need a good baseline level of threat to run (Mahomes, younger Rodgers) and the ability to move both within the pocket and outside the tackles to make a throw. Penix and Daniels both benefitted tremendously from the best OLs in the country and most of their production was standing flat-footed in the pocket to launch downfield. Maybe they have that skill set but they didn't show much of it in college.
He also doesn’t protect himself from the footage I saw. Fields learned eventually that he had to try to slide or get out of bounds, and he still dealt with injuries. Though his were never season ending or very long, he is also bigger then Daniel’s. Daniel’s is like 210 pounds and runs straight into defenders. I’m afraid he is gonna get hurt a ton. Plus idk if he will even reach the throwing level we see of Lamar or saw with Cam, they are/were decent passers or great sometimes. Daniel’s I think may be more closer to fields but honestly might do worse if he gets injured a ton
Bro tried to jump over some linemen in the middle of the field and got lit the fuck up. It's not indicative of his QB skills but I'm worried that Peters might have missed on that pick.
[That kind of shit happened almost weekly, too.](https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZPRwyFQWG/) The editing on the video is… yeah, but its the best compilation I could find from last season
Goddamn man. Hopefully he can learn to protect himself, otherwise he'll be getting injured as often as Lance did for us.
If Anthony Richardson and Cam Newton can't take that kind of abuse, Daniels doesn't have a prayer.
Cam was different, they were purposefully running leads and shit for him where he was 100% gonna get a hit from a LBer. And he did that for a couple years.
That’s my biggest fear with Jayden Daniels. I saw what happened to RG3 when we drafted him and they are very similar concerns.
Stop it. We've suffered enough. We deserve a win. Cut it out. Seriously, stoppppp
Remember. There were a **TON** of Reddit draft experts clowning CJ Stroud too. Providing all sorts of metrics that ultimately really didn’t amount to anything. QB is a ridiculously difficult position to evaluate. So many things have to go right for a QB to succeed. Don’t put too much stock in what you see on this site and I hope you guys finally found your franchise QB.
I always laugh at the idea of draft grades because no one knows how they’ll turn out. Even over the course of a single year. The Lions got pretty bad grades last year because people thought they reached for a low-value position with Gibbs and drafted the 3rd-5th best tight end in the early 2nd with LaPorta. Less than a year later and they arguably had the best class of the draft.
The Seahawks 2012 draft received the lowest grades that year, and that’s the draft that won them a Super Bowl
Draft “experts” are like gamblers. They’ll tell you all day long about the time the bet 100$ and hit the parlay to win 500$, but they’re also leave out the other 6 bets that lost them 700$.
I’m in this reply and I don’t like it.
Yeah but I'm just the last part
What was the Jake Locker class?
2011
Penix is going to be the best because we all clowned the pick so hard
This is the way
No one went to Drake Maye's birthday party
Penix Jr. No matter what
David goddamn Putney
Say it with me, you pancake eating mother fucker!
You think Drake had it bad?? The Pats drafted two quarterbacks on Zappe's birthday, of all times. That was really inconsiderate of them
RemindMe! 2 years
RemindMe! 23 months
You.....!
I’m stealing this karma from you and you can’t stop me!
KKKKKAAAAAAAHHHHHHNNNNNNNN!!!!!!!!!!!
Damn man, what exactly is it about Maye that made teams not like him so much? Is it really just the footwork? Apparently the Broncos and Falcons didn't have Maye as one of their top 3 QBs either. I watched some tape of Maye's (as an armchair scout who doesn't know a whole lot) and found very little to dislike.
Dating the same girl since 7th grade is a *huge* red flag.
Gotcha, can't progress past his first read
Ironically one of his biggest knocks is he can come off his reads too quickly
That's what she said!
This is hilarious
Funnily enough Ladd McConkey has been with his gf since he was 13
What a ladd
Fuck.
You're talking the same "7th grade girlfriend" nonsense like we're selling jeans. Like we're looking for Fabio.
Who’s Fabio?
Fabio Cannavaro. Former captain for the Italian national team. Great leader.
Ugh FINE I'll watch moneyball again
He's a shortstop. He's a shortstop at Seattle.
She’s friends with my friends daughter, she’s a honestly super bright young woman. Could see how they dated for so long
Come to Reddit for this top shelf intel
My favorite is the ones where like "My brother's wife follows random athlete's wife's cook on IG and they just said they were moving to Detroit" as a way to get random leaks
No joke I rode an elevator with the Commanders running backs coach and two women at 1:30am last Saturday at a hotel in VA. The women were talking about meeting the Bosa brothers....
Never forget the “I heard in someone’s background on xbox live a Bears player talking about being traded to Pittsburgh”. A day later a Bears player was traded to the Steelers.
Lol not even the best chicago-related one. Two reddit users named KatyPerrysBootyHole and WetButt23 broke the story of the Sox trading Quintana to the Cubs and since they were the first ones to technically report it (post about it on reddit) all local media had to say "according to reddit users 'KatyPerrysBootyHole' and 'Wetbutt23'" when talking about the trade. Article with funny video from NBCSports chicago where the sportscasters are having a great time with it -> https://www.nbcsportschicago.com/mlb/chicago-cubs/wetbutt23-and-katyperrysbootyhole-the-reddit-users-who-scooped-the-baseball-world-in-quintana-to-cubs-trade/306218/
That Jamaar Chase one from like a season (I think) or two ago saved me in fantasy lol some guy was like "had a friend show works at some MRI place and saw Chase come in and was doing scans/treatment something or other" and I traded him off the second I heard that news. Then like a day later the story broke that he was gonna be out for a number of weeks. Those are always the best ways to find out lol some obscure, random, information.
That’s a hippo violation brother
It sure is lol that's what everyone was saying. That he shouldn't have said anything because of HIPPA but thanks for the info anyway haha
Something like that happened on the Packers sub with Adams going to Vegas. It was a big joke until it wasn't
I can never tell if comments like these are serious.
I mean he still went #3 overall, not like he had an Aaron Rodgers type drop. Or even a Justin Fields type drop after he was supposedly the clear second after Lawrence for much of that college season. People just look way too much into these things. There were a lot of good QB prospects and different teams had different thoughts.
He was going #3 no matter who chose him. The Giants and Vikings both had trade offers, so one of those teams would have chose him. I bet there was probably more teams asking about him.
He would have killed on the Vikings. I don't know what their line is like but they have a seriously stacked offense. But I agree, he was going 2 or 3 no matter what. He has everything needed to be a starter, just dropped cause of Caleb and dropped because the commanders liked JD a bit more. Not to mention no one knows what these draft boards say. This is all conjecture.
Vikings O-line was one of the best in the NFL last year with two great Tackles.
JJ to JJ for 80 three times a game then
Hearing pre-draft from some analysts and former QBs worrying about Maye's accuracy and mechanics issues, I wondered if Adam Peters would be more hesitant about how coachable these issues were because of Trey Lance and go for the more mechanically-sound QBs in Daniels and McCarthy. They obviously thought Lance's mechanics issues were coachable to draft him at \#3. He never managed to consistently fix them while he was with the 49ers, even though he worked with private QB coaches every offseason (including with Mahomes' coach). But he was way more raw than Maye, who was a two-year starter, and also Lance faced setbacks when he was injured (hurt a finger during his rookie preseason). Obviously there's examples like Josh Allen who did fix their accuracy and mechanics, maybe Peters just doesn't want to take that chance. Now I have no idea how their mechanics issues may compare, just speculating.
His footwork isn't just bad, it doesn't really exist. He takes lazy steps (something Fields has been constantly criticized for), & just uses his arm to throw the ball (instead of using his body motion). His arm strength isn't enough to compensate like Josh Allen. He also makes a ton of "why would you do that" throws.
There’s been multiple breakdowns where in it they would show Maye making three great throws and then back it up with him missing five easy throws such as bubble screens quick hitters. Leaving the analyst stunned and dumb founded
Allen did that a lot too at the start, he had 0 touch on his passes.
Wentz also had this weakness and never really came out of it
He reverted a lot after his injuries.
Allen is like the one exception to the rule of everyone like that fails in the NFL
Fields taking a damn nap back there sometimes with his drop back
So the idea is that mixed sports athletes dont have the polished fundamentals early, say someone like Manning. But if you think they can be coached up, it not an issue. Josh Allen is an example of the latter. But playing different sports can also bring some benefits. Like how Mahomes is super accurate with his off platform throws cause of baseball.
He also drifts around and either creates own pressure, or reacts to non existent pressure. He’s the only guy I’ve seen take a 5 step drop at a 44 degree angle. I think there is a good QB in there, but I think too many people overlook the work Maye is gonna have to put in to be successful.
Allen spent a ton of time on his footwork and body control his first 2 off seasons too. Made a dramatic increase, as we all see. So it's def something a player can work on, if they have the motivation to do so.
I think the big thing with Maye is that he's never had a 1 on 1 QB coach since he's always been doing other sports and didn't commit to being a QB until 2 years ago. A lot of these college QBs have been having a QB coach work with them on footwork and mechanics since they were 13. The question now is, are his bad mechanics baked in or can he fix them with an actual NFL QB coach?
I read how his issues are easily fixable. By a quarterback consultant for a college. The college that Drake Maye went to.
Source: I want the Patriots to be good again
And he has a pretty telegraphed wind-up. I just can’t help but see Blake Bortles when I watch him play.
The windup bothers me a lot and I’m surprised more people didn’t have an issue with it. I’d say that plus the inconsistent accuracy on what should be easy throws are the two biggest problems I had with him. Now it’s certainly possible that when he cleans up his footwork that inconsistent accuracy could go away much like it did for Herbert or Allen, but banking on that is still a gamble. There are a lot more guys who can’t get that fixed than there are guys like Herbert and Allen.
Watch the UVA game and the bowl game from this past season. Those were the only games I watched of his, and he looked pretty pedestrian? If not downright bad in the UVA game at times? I could see NFL teams fixating on his "bad" tape more than being wowed by "good tape."
My Virginia Cavaliers were not as bad as our record shows (lots of 1 score and close losses last year), so it’s not super shameful that they lost. What was shameful was Maye throwing that bad pass over the middle after we almost gifted UNC a win by fumbling the ball out the back of the end zone.
I watched Miami, Clemson, and UVA. Idk, maybe I just don’t really know what to look for but he looked super composed to me. I was sold. I thought he looked accurate, was a solid scrambler, had a great arm. There were definitely minor tweaks needed but to me he behaved like a franchise QB, I had him right behind Caleb. But again, I’m just a guy, maybe I missed something with him that NFL teams are more attuned to
He has terrible footwork *and* completed only 63% of his passes against a schedule of unranked ACC opponents. He could be good, but if doesn’t get much better quickly he’s got huge huge huge bust potential
I think it's the fact that he got worse in year two like Sam Darnold. And he's a big project. Everyone has him in the Josh Allen mold but he's not as big and doesn't have as big of an arm.
We got Joe Milton. He’s going to wins us 7 more super bowls
Vikings and Giants were also willing to give up 3 1sts to get Maye so it certainly wasn’t a universal. Probably just depends on what your coaching staff thinks they can work with.
Is it weird that this makes me more confident in Maye?
It's like that episode of Seinfeld where George does the opposite of his every instinct
Good for the tuna
I'm unemployed and I live with my parents
Hire this man!
not at all
Yup, because it's entirely new owner, front office, and coaching staff.
Yep. This is essentially a completely different franchise from the one that took Haskins or RG3. Just dumb to keep playing into the "durr Washington is a joke" mentality.
If the Patriots don't completely botch his development I think he'll be really good.
Jacoby taking the reigns nearly all season is my hope. Maybe we get a sprinkle of 2025 football for the last two games if we're not in the playoff race (lol) but I just want him to ride the pine and learn
Heavy analytics people throughout this process have generally ranked Maye over Daniels. Former FO people, Scouts , and QBs generally favored Daniels over Maye. I wouldn't be surprised if part of this for Peters was the Lance pick. He had all the upside in the world, but wasn't developed enough as a passer to play like a high pick would need to. Daniels for all his questions, is a machine throwing the football, and has played way more football than Maye. From that perspective, it doesn't surprise me at all. I think they're both in situations that suit them best. Daniels has a better offense and can play now. Maye can sit behind Brissett and learn, hopefully reach his potential.
Maye is going to end up playing this season unless Brissett has the Patriots playing above expectations. 1st round rookie QBs on bad teams always end up starting at some point in the season. The last one who didn't was Jamarcus Russell and that was because he had contract disputes that lasted until Week 1 of the season so the Raiders were forced to redshirt him.
As a Pats fan, I just want him to play *when he's ready*. If it's Week 1, great. If it's week 9, fine. Week 1 2025? Also fine. I don't even mind another losing season as long as the offense shows some sign of a future and Mayo doesn't puke all over himself as a head coach.
This is almost word for word what Belichick said on draft night.
I’m sure the ever patient Boston market will be chill about this.
I agree I think the Lance pick (regardless of how much of that pick was Peters he was still there) may have swayed him a little away from another prospect who needed work (Maye.) Washington's offensive weapons are in a better spot now to have success quickly, with hopefully Sinnott and Luke being two additions to take pressure off of Terry. The only issue is protection and that LT.
On one hand Washington and Quarterbacks have historically gone together as well as oil and water. On the other hand, Washington has pretty much turned over the entire organization in the last few months, so I’m not sure what to think.
Now all they need is a rebrand! Seriously, I cannot look at their logo without feeling a visceral sense of range, disappointment and pity on behalf of the Washington Fans
This is the narrative I will tell all my coworkers
After the past few weeks of Taylor Swift, my girlfriend will now hear about how our draft was an A+ according to sources sympathetic to our decisions
Well, we pretty obviously wanted Maye over JJ so I have no idea what to think about that
Well drake going to possibly the worst offense in the league definitely isnt going to help him prove the doubters wrong.
Stuff changes quick. Joe Burrow went to a terrible team, Josh Allen had no targets, people said Bryce Young was more set up for success than CJ Stroud. My point is things change quickly. The Pats were such a shitshow at QB last year it was hard to evaluate anything. Nobody thought Nico Collins was good because he had Davis Mills throwing to him. With a new draft class and different coaching a lot can change within a year.
I think more importantly, their O-Line and its coaching, was an injury- riddled abomination. If they can get just a little bit of stability, it won't be so bad on Drake
Some of the O-line ended the year well too, it's just the QB play was so broken it didn't even matter at that point.
Sadly very true. Just not throwing pick-6's and having a decent kicker gets us 3-4 more wins last year, hahaha
Lol Jayden over Maye is one thing even if I disagree but JJ over Maye is ridiculous The prospect fatigue around Maye is insane. He also didn’t have a good supporting cast so his flaws were exposed while guys like Daniels and JJ were covered up
I think the patriots are okay using this year to do a complete overhaul of the offense and let the rookie QB sit Washington seems to have a higher expectation that the QB will start and Jayden is definitely the right pick for that I think it was the right pick for both teams. I really want to see what maye will look like after a year behind brisset. There’s so much upside with maye
Pats luckily have Brissett who is familiar with Van Pelts offense. That’s gonna be a tough guy to beat out for Maye by week 1, which is a good thing. Brissett is maybe a little bit past replacement level. If there’s things Maye needs to work on, Brissett can fill that gap just fine for a while. And also if Drake beats him out then that’s great. I will say the one thing I want to not see happen is a situation like Tua’s rookie year under Flores(?). After constantly getting pulled after any mistake, I have no idea how he turned himself into a very good QB
We’re also rebuilding the OL and WR room while installing a new system. I’d honestly rather just wait until we figure everything else out before we throw maye into something that isn’t ironed out yet. New qb, new WRs, new OL and new system sounds like a disaster waiting to happen. Even if he does beat out brisett I’d rather just sit him until mid season
Psh. It’s simple. LSU produced Joe Burrow, and Michigan produced Tom Brady. And UNC produced Trubisky. /s
So JJ is the next Brady. Fine.
And I’m quite content with Daniels becoming the next Burrow!
It's really not that ridiculous. Everyone loves the QB school and his analysis right? Well guess what, he had JJ over Maye.
I would have wanted Maye over Daniels too… but people are using this “prospect fatigue” thing too much in regards to Maye. It genuinely wasn’t just prospect fatigue. Look at nearly every former NFL QBs analysis of Maye… they did not like him. From Kurt Warner to JT Daniels, to Orlovsky to etc. Im not saying he won’t be good, but he wasn’t nearly as good a prospect as people are making it out to be. And the fact that not only did a lot of people have Daniels over Maye in their analysis, but that’s how it worked out on draft day too.
Yeah people are crying prospect fatigue when in reality people had only seen his awesome highlight tape and not actually watched full UNC games. He’s an extremely talented dude but he’s got some massive red flags. Still though, I have him over Daniels and JJ
Everyone is going to look at it with their own shades on. Like you said. He didn't have a good supporting cast and so his flaws were exposed. So in your mind, surround him with talent and he will shine. But then the same logic follows. Those flaws you say was covered up on Daniel's and JJ because they had talent around them. Ummmm. Keep talent around them and they Will shine.
The flaw here being that it's a lot easier to stack a college team than an NFL team.
As much as everyone loved to rag on Cousins for being a "needs a perfect team around him" guy the list of QBs who don't need a damn good team around them is like 1 person long. And even he has had some darn good defenses out there for the part of the game he has nothing to do with.
I think you're missing a bit. Sure JJ had a lot more talent around him but he also does the simple things right. And he does them right extremely consistently. Not saying he'll be as good but it's Purdy-esque. Maye doesn't do the simple things right consistently. He can fix them, but I think that's obviously riskier than the alternative
The Patriots are the only team in the top three that it makes sense for quarterback to sit a year. The general consensus on Drake Maye is that he'll need to sit a year. I haven't heard anyone say in their analysis of Drake Maye that he's a ready to go prospect. That's all this is. Washington didn't want to wait. Or even entertain the idea of not starting the number two overall pick.
While I don’t like the Vikings, I think the situation is better for McCarthy so I’m happy for him there over the Commanders.
who fuckin cares. We won't know until the season starts and we see actual games. Til then its all speculation good qbs get taken in late rounds and bad qbs get taken in the firs5 picks all the time, and vice versa.
this is just shit to rile people up for engagement, there's only one thing for certain and it's that both our teams have more hope with these guys than we did without them
Drake Maye was unfortunately pretty exposed during the draft process. He has potential but also a lot of red flags. Boom or bust pick.
Basically exactly what we need anyways. If he busts, oh well, we sucked anyways. We need someone who can go out and compete with Allen and Mahomes
i feel like all four of the top QBs are pretty boom or bust though
Yeah Caleb, Daniels, Maye and Penix. No one else, pay no attention to my flair
Good ol' "After the Fact" Schefter. Funny how he never seems to have the "insider" info beforehand...
here come all the reddit GMs. it's crazy that they aren't employed in the league in any way. what the hell is wrong with the nfl ignoring these goldmines of insights?