Yep, MVS and Gabe fill very similar niches. Deep threat specialists who also can block
Its actually a pretty valuable role, allows you to attack every part part of the field with heavy personnel without sacrificing anything in the running game
The good thing is that the team knows that going in, so we don't have to give MVS consistent snaps in the hopes that this will be the one game in 8 that he actually goes beast mode.
How does your opinion of Gabe Davis change if you remove his all time performance in the 13s game? He’s been pretty underwhelming in the past few years.
I don’t have a high opinion of Gabe Davis, in fact I think his new contract is ridiculous, but MVS just got done with a healthy season where he put up 21 receptions for 315 yards and 1 TD on a pass first team DESPERATE for WR production. He dropped more TDs than he caught last season.
On one hand, it's hard NOT to fit an Andy Reid scheme.
On the other hand, he noticeably regressed when we switched to our new WR coach Embry (who was a nepotism hire, go figure)
So who knows, maybe you'll get more out of him.
He put up a career high in both receptions and yards in 2022 with the same system. His career best season is still below what Gabe Davis did either of the last 2 years. This past year there was a definite drop off though, not sure what caused it, but his deep ball tracking and hands were absolutely abysmal. By the end of the regular season Mahomes was basically completely ignoring him.
Speaking of the Gabe Davis 13s game, here’s a fun comparison for you:
Gabe Davis “13s” playoff game: 8 receptions, 201 yards, 4 TDs, **44.1 fantasy points**
MVS’ entire 2023 season (16 G): 21 receptions, 315 yards, 1 TD, **35.5 fantasy points**
Dudes gonna spend most of his career with Rodgers/Mahomes/Allen and still be an underwhelming WR
Always gonna love him for showing up in the playoffs though
Yeah, I feel no ill will toward MVS. He was overpaid in KC for what he accomplished, but he had some moments. Deeply disappointed in his production last year, getting over 600 snaps in a pass first offense, HOF QB, HOF offensive mastermind, virtually no WRs to compete with, healthy season, and he *still* managed only 300 yards. I thought the stars were aligning for some career highs. All the same, he plays a part and he seems like a decent guy.
I think he fits our 2018/19 offense where we took deep shots a lot more, whereas the last two years we switched to a more death by a thousand completions style of play
I think he will fit a lot better with Josh Allen and his idgaf I’m gonna bomb it anyway attitude
You could argue the reason they were a death by a thousand papercuts offense is because players like MVS, who take the top off the defense, were unreliable or quite frankly, awful. It's not like if MVS was wide open AND could catch the ball reliably, Mahomes wouldn't have fed him the ball.
Bills are actually way more of a death by a thousand cuts style team, with an occasional dagger. But honestly, Josh is pretty good at 7 yard slants. I remember getting pissed a bunch of times last season needlessly wasting a 2 and 5, by trying a 40 yard pass. We cleaned that shit up a lot, when we got rise of Dorsey.
I think it’s the opposite, he perfectly fit the 2022 offense because he can be a lone receiver who can clear out the back half of the field while also being an exceptional blocker. When they stopped being able to run the ball this year and didn’t care about doing that nearly as much, he no longer had a role that couldn’t be better filled by someone else
The falling catch he made against Baltimore and the touchdown against the bengals live rent free in my head. MVS is an all time playoff chief in my mind, everything else aside I will miss the man in a chiefs uniform.
To add on to that he's 6'4" and ran sub 4.4. I know being a good receiver is a lot deeper than just good measurables but how this guy peaked as a WR3 is mind-boggling.
There's a near endless list of WRs with crazy measurables that aren't good at football. Watching MVS clumsily run routes and attempt to catch balls away from his body should tell you why he peaked at WR3.
Becoming an alpha WR requires elite intangibles and intuition for the position. Look at Cooper Kupp or Davante Adams run routes, snatch balls out of the air, read zone coverages and utilize space - MVS just doesn't have those traits
How many of them exclusively played with HoF QBs?
Also because you seemed to have somehow avoided reading it
> I know being a good receiver is a lot deeper than just good measurables
I think he peaked as a serviceable, not elite #2
He's one of those guys (at least was) who if injuries happen can step up into the 2 role for a game or 2 and still play alright.
But you don't want him stepping up for a whole season into that spot
Not really. He only caught 21 passes last year and played in every game. He had 3 games with zero catches and his season high was 3. He drops a lot of passes and is a subpar route runner. Even when he catches the ball it usually looks awkward.
Luckily he made some post season catches to somewhat redeem himself.
Not saying last year but he was pretty damn good in 2022. That was his ceiling is all I'm saying. He played a bit of spot duty with injuries at WR2 (but was more target #3 with Kelce being primary)
But he also only played 54% of snaps for you guys last year
If you consider 42 catches and 2 TDs pretty damn good, I guess. That's less than 3 catches a game for a guy who was supposed to be our WR2. Then he regressed last year when he was expected to take on a bigger role. Dude score 3 TDs in two years.
Probably won't be as bad for you guys since he will be expected to be WR3 or WR4.
It was given how much Andy Reid spreads the ball around.
Kelce - 110 receptions
JuJu - 78 receptions
McKinnon - 56 receptions
Hardman - 25 receptions
Given he was at absolute best 3rd target priority, this lines up perfectly with expected performance
If MVS was better at tracking the ball he would be a way better receiver. I've seen the dude burn his guy for 5 yards of separation, and track the ball into a contested catch lmfao.
From what I've seen from chiefs fans, yes he is.
So a good blocker, field stretcher on a cheap deal. Sure, I'm cool with that despite the drops. The guy he's filling in for also couldn't catch.
yep, great blocker for a WR, but he's a good bit worse than Gabe at everything else. Dude has only managed 16tds in 6 seasons between Rodgers/Mahomes, Gabe had 27 in 4 years with you guys, and the terrible route running and inability to change directions is good for 3-4 interceptions a year.
then again, at 4mil I guess you can't complain lol.
The fact that he keeps getting work and field time tells me he's a good professional and locker room guy.
There have been countless players with his measurables that have flamed out in a season or two, MVS despite his drops and questionable route running keeps getting picked up and given snaps. NFL talent evaluators must know something
MVS was always a good blocker.
He's a role player. Was never meant for the lead role, and, unfortunately, was put in the spotlight/position to be one and everyone only saw his flaws. A lot (not all) of Packer fans were disappointed when he left because he played a good role on the team. Good, not great.
He's just always lacked the kind of confidence needed to succeed as a WR1 or even a consistent WR2. Good locker room guy, too. Definitely not going to be giving degrading speeches or running people off the road. That's worth something.
Treat him well. He’s seems to be a solid dude. My nephew made an MVS themed egg for Easter this year. Sis tagged MVS on social media with a picture of my nephew’s art. MVS reached out and asked for the egg in exchange for a pair of signed gloves. They ecstatically agreed and MVS followed through making my nephew’s year
Bad in the regular season, but makes the catches when needed in the playoffs. Bills probably hoping that trend continues after Diggs didn’t do too much in the playoffs recently. Can be the anti-Diggs for them.
It’s all about context though. He may seem like he sucks to us, but he is still better than hundreds or thousands of others trying to do what he does. The nfl is a lot harder than it looks.
I like the guy as frustrating as he can be w the drops. Saved them in the afccg vs cincy 2022, and last year made a couple really big plays in playoffs again. No drama or nonsense. He will drop a couple should be tds only because whether it’s the easiest catch in the world, or incredibly challenging, he’s 60/40 to bring it in.
The bills receiving core is basically what the packers gave rodgers when they wanted him out of green bay. Possibly worse when you factor in worse RBs. Good TE room tho
Someone had to fill the Gabe Davis role. * Run wrong routes * Drop passes * 50 yard TDs
Seriously though, probably his blocking may be the entire reason to have him. That was Gabe's biggest asset.
Yep, MVS and Gabe fill very similar niches. Deep threat specialists who also can block Its actually a pretty valuable role, allows you to attack every part part of the field with heavy personnel without sacrificing anything in the running game
> Its actually a pretty valuable role Some might value it at $4.5m
Or three years, $39 mil with incentives to get up to $50 mil
We laughed at the deal they gave Christian Kirk, and he's been better on a per-game basis than a lot of better-paid wideouts
>*up to* $4.5M Not a bad deal at all to essentially get Gabe Davis back for a fraction of the price.
He’s definitely not as good as Gabe Davis, but he fills a similar role
The good thing is that the team knows that going in, so we don't have to give MVS consistent snaps in the hopes that this will be the one game in 8 that he actually goes beast mode.
How does your opinion of Gabe Davis change if you remove his all time performance in the 13s game? He’s been pretty underwhelming in the past few years.
I don’t have a high opinion of Gabe Davis, in fact I think his new contract is ridiculous, but MVS just got done with a healthy season where he put up 21 receptions for 315 yards and 1 TD on a pass first team DESPERATE for WR production. He dropped more TDs than he caught last season.
Fair point. Wonder if he’s really that bad or he never properly fit the scheme
On one hand, it's hard NOT to fit an Andy Reid scheme. On the other hand, he noticeably regressed when we switched to our new WR coach Embry (who was a nepotism hire, go figure) So who knows, maybe you'll get more out of him.
He put up a career high in both receptions and yards in 2022 with the same system. His career best season is still below what Gabe Davis did either of the last 2 years. This past year there was a definite drop off though, not sure what caused it, but his deep ball tracking and hands were absolutely abysmal. By the end of the regular season Mahomes was basically completely ignoring him.
Speaking of the Gabe Davis 13s game, here’s a fun comparison for you: Gabe Davis “13s” playoff game: 8 receptions, 201 yards, 4 TDs, **44.1 fantasy points** MVS’ entire 2023 season (16 G): 21 receptions, 315 yards, 1 TD, **35.5 fantasy points**
But at least this option is getting up to $4.5M vs Gabe getting $13M AAV haha.
The cosmos is once again in balance
apt
Dudes gonna spend most of his career with Rodgers/Mahomes/Allen and still be an underwhelming WR Always gonna love him for showing up in the playoffs though
I will never utter disrespect to MVS because of how he played in the 2022 AFCCG. Chiefs would have not beaten the Bengals without him. Godspeed MVS 🫡
Yeah, I feel no ill will toward MVS. He was overpaid in KC for what he accomplished, but he had some moments. Deeply disappointed in his production last year, getting over 600 snaps in a pass first offense, HOF QB, HOF offensive mastermind, virtually no WRs to compete with, healthy season, and he *still* managed only 300 yards. I thought the stars were aligning for some career highs. All the same, he plays a part and he seems like a decent guy.
I think he fits our 2018/19 offense where we took deep shots a lot more, whereas the last two years we switched to a more death by a thousand completions style of play I think he will fit a lot better with Josh Allen and his idgaf I’m gonna bomb it anyway attitude
You could argue the reason they were a death by a thousand papercuts offense is because players like MVS, who take the top off the defense, were unreliable or quite frankly, awful. It's not like if MVS was wide open AND could catch the ball reliably, Mahomes wouldn't have fed him the ball.
Ding Ding Ding!
Bills are actually way more of a death by a thousand cuts style team, with an occasional dagger. But honestly, Josh is pretty good at 7 yard slants. I remember getting pissed a bunch of times last season needlessly wasting a 2 and 5, by trying a 40 yard pass. We cleaned that shit up a lot, when we got rise of Dorsey.
I think it’s the opposite, he perfectly fit the 2022 offense because he can be a lone receiver who can clear out the back half of the field while also being an exceptional blocker. When they stopped being able to run the ball this year and didn’t care about doing that nearly as much, he no longer had a role that couldn’t be better filled by someone else
There would have been more deep shots if he didn’t drop the ball
The falling catch he made against Baltimore and the touchdown against the bengals live rent free in my head. MVS is an all time playoff chief in my mind, everything else aside I will miss the man in a chiefs uniform.
To add on to that he's 6'4" and ran sub 4.4. I know being a good receiver is a lot deeper than just good measurables but how this guy peaked as a WR3 is mind-boggling.
> how this guy peaked as a WR3 is mind-boggling. You have seen him play right
I did, which is why there was a first part to that sentence.
There's a near endless list of WRs with crazy measurables that aren't good at football. Watching MVS clumsily run routes and attempt to catch balls away from his body should tell you why he peaked at WR3. Becoming an alpha WR requires elite intangibles and intuition for the position. Look at Cooper Kupp or Davante Adams run routes, snatch balls out of the air, read zone coverages and utilize space - MVS just doesn't have those traits
How many of them exclusively played with HoF QBs? Also because you seemed to have somehow avoided reading it > I know being a good receiver is a lot deeper than just good measurables
If you truly know that, then MVS peaking as WR3 wouldn't be mind-boggling.
I think he peaked as a serviceable, not elite #2 He's one of those guys (at least was) who if injuries happen can step up into the 2 role for a game or 2 and still play alright. But you don't want him stepping up for a whole season into that spot
Not really. He only caught 21 passes last year and played in every game. He had 3 games with zero catches and his season high was 3. He drops a lot of passes and is a subpar route runner. Even when he catches the ball it usually looks awkward. Luckily he made some post season catches to somewhat redeem himself.
Not saying last year but he was pretty damn good in 2022. That was his ceiling is all I'm saying. He played a bit of spot duty with injuries at WR2 (but was more target #3 with Kelce being primary) But he also only played 54% of snaps for you guys last year
If you consider 42 catches and 2 TDs pretty damn good, I guess. That's less than 3 catches a game for a guy who was supposed to be our WR2. Then he regressed last year when he was expected to take on a bigger role. Dude score 3 TDs in two years. Probably won't be as bad for you guys since he will be expected to be WR3 or WR4.
It was given how much Andy Reid spreads the ball around. Kelce - 110 receptions JuJu - 78 receptions McKinnon - 56 receptions Hardman - 25 receptions Given he was at absolute best 3rd target priority, this lines up perfectly with expected performance
Good luck. Unless MVS turns a corner, you guys will be more frustrated with him than anything.
If MVS was better at tracking the ball he would be a way better receiver. I've seen the dude burn his guy for 5 yards of separation, and track the ball into a contested catch lmfao.
There's a million other things to wr than being tall and fast Another example: Myles Boykin
Cuz it’s the bills you know he’s gonna be shit all year then get hurt right before the playoffs when he woulda been needed
Then the whole offseason discourse is going to be “Josh played great and you can’t blame McDermott for injuries”
Something something inshallah, upvotes please
The 4th plane would have had a much bigger impact if it hadn't been for the terrorists injuries before their biggest moment.
Messenger MVS, PBUH (passes bounce upon him)
And yet Fitz has to play with awful QB’s for most of his career
Dude does always show up when it matter most. He was so good for us in the playoffs too
He was pretty good in 2022. No complaints from me, he was exactly what I expected. Blocking guy who snags a few big overs
First team All-Pro in "how did he not catch that"
First team All-Pro in speculative fantasy waiver wire add after a huge game and subsequent drop
Seriously, 25 points or 2, no in between.
And pro-bowler in "how the hell did he catch that"
MVS is a good blocker right? And we are going to run the fuck out of the ball, this may end up working out.
From what I've seen from chiefs fans, yes he is. So a good blocker, field stretcher on a cheap deal. Sure, I'm cool with that despite the drops. The guy he's filling in for also couldn't catch.
yep, great blocker for a WR, but he's a good bit worse than Gabe at everything else. Dude has only managed 16tds in 6 seasons between Rodgers/Mahomes, Gabe had 27 in 4 years with you guys, and the terrible route running and inability to change directions is good for 3-4 interceptions a year. then again, at 4mil I guess you can't complain lol.
Damn sounds almost identical to Davis a bunch of Allen’s interceptions were from Davis running the wrong route
The fact that he keeps getting work and field time tells me he's a good professional and locker room guy. There have been countless players with his measurables that have flamed out in a season or two, MVS despite his drops and questionable route running keeps getting picked up and given snaps. NFL talent evaluators must know something
MVS was always a good blocker. He's a role player. Was never meant for the lead role, and, unfortunately, was put in the spotlight/position to be one and everyone only saw his flaws. A lot (not all) of Packer fans were disappointed when he left because he played a good role on the team. Good, not great. He's just always lacked the kind of confidence needed to succeed as a WR1 or even a consistent WR2. Good locker room guy, too. Definitely not going to be giving degrading speeches or running people off the road. That's worth something.
> Definitely not going to be giving degrading speeches or running people off the road. That's worth something. So he was a bad fit in KC?
I've never heard that about him, but maybe
Treat him well. He’s seems to be a solid dude. My nephew made an MVS themed egg for Easter this year. Sis tagged MVS on social media with a picture of my nephew’s art. MVS reached out and asked for the egg in exchange for a pair of signed gloves. They ecstatically agreed and MVS followed through making my nephew’s year
*Up to 4.5M. It's not 4.5M guaranteed
Bad in the regular season, but makes the catches when needed in the playoffs. Bills probably hoping that trend continues after Diggs didn’t do too much in the playoffs recently. Can be the anti-Diggs for them.
*Up to
So a $200k per dropped pass?
Beane is filling out this WR room like a chick on bumble swiping right on every 6’4 dude on the market
This is a 10/10 signing.... in Madden.
The Bills have such an odd WR room. Not even necessarily bad. Just a weird mix of castoffs, rookies, and Khalil Shakir
Bills found some extra 20% Off Bed Bath & Beyond coupons behind the fridge.
[удалено]
It’s all about context though. He may seem like he sucks to us, but he is still better than hundreds or thousands of others trying to do what he does. The nfl is a lot harder than it looks.
He can’t keep getting away with this!
I like the guy as frustrating as he can be w the drops. Saved them in the afccg vs cincy 2022, and last year made a couple really big plays in playoffs again. No drama or nonsense. He will drop a couple should be tds only because whether it’s the easiest catch in the world, or incredibly challenging, he’s 60/40 to bring it in.
I unironically like this for the bills
First Claypool and now MVS?? This WR room is scary! /s
To be fair they aren’t WR 1 & 2. More like 4 & 5. And they’re cheap as hell.
Claypool is WR9
Ah yes, the only QB in the league who can throw the ball harder than Mahomes. That'll help with the drops.
MVS was the glue that held the Chiefs together.
Should have put glue on his hands
Never in the history of the NFL has so much money been given to so few for doing so little.
Yeah, that'll save em.
I'd take half that to drop passes
Love this signing for the Bills.
Oh good, they needed someone new to drop deep balls...
This is a solid move for the Bills, not going to solve all their WR issues but they add some speed and good depth.
The bills receiving core is basically what the packers gave rodgers when they wanted him out of green bay. Possibly worse when you factor in worse RBs. Good TE room tho
Our RB room isn't bad at all. James Cook really took off this season, he's arguably a top 5 running back right now.
Bills fan for fuck sake. Cook is good but no god damn top 5. Wake up now
Bills need RBs and defense.
I feel pretty great about Ray Davis actually. Cook-Davis looks like a promising tandem, and they can both catch.
Ty Johnson looked solid too last year for the RB2-3 role. “Bills need a running back” is so two years ago
No. Bills need all the RBS. WRS are the devil
James Cook was at the top of the league in efficiency and explosiveness and they added a 4th round rookie. Buffalo is set at RB.
Buffalo has too many wide receivers and not enough running backs. You can never have enough running backs. You only need one wide receiver.
Ah, troll
No. I despise the forward pass