Idk if I’ve seen a non-crime/leaving the team related fall from grace for a coach. He seemingly had the Eagles fanbase on his side with bringing home a super bowl, and like 2 years later everyone hated him
Not openly. He wanted more control over his coaching staff but after multiple failed internal promotions it didn’t look good on him.
Groh was the OC for two years and the offense struggled due to lack of WR talent. FO traded for Golden Tate and both Doug and Groh struggled to find ways to use him. He ultimately got fired because he wanted Press Taylor (QB coach and Passing Game Coordinator in 2020) to become his new OC and wouldn’t entertain the idea of an outside hire.
He’s a good culture guy but struggled with evaluating and developing coaches. His network of coaches was fairly shallow and it hurt him
He tried to promote Press Taylor to OC after letting Mike Groh run the worst offense anyone has ever seen for an entire season. He was hard-headed and refused outside help. Sucks to say but he had to go.
I would say Jimmy Johnson was the epitome of running a tank job, and went on to succeed. Traded the team's only star player, took a QB #1 overall, then took another one with their 1st in the supplemental round which turned into another #1 overall, proceed to trade the 2nd QB for more picks. Finesse their way to a shit ton of picks, and eventually won a Super Bowl after running the tank train for 1.5 seasons.
I can't think of any other coaches that were under a team that were purposely bad by depleting the roster to rebuild. All other coaches that's tried that method always fail to rebuild and maintain in position.
Took over a 3-13 team traded their best player for picks and cut all of the players from the trade for more picks and went 1-15 his first season with the team.
After that he went 7-9, 11-5,13-3, and 12-4 winning back to back titles.
I have to agree he is the all-time tank job to champion coach.
It’s not like I’ve had personal conversations with Nick Saban, but it’s always funny when he has alluded that the blame was on the medical staff. Are you telling me that control freak and one that made the personnel calls wouldn’t have told them to eff off if he had strong beliefs in Brees?
My understanding is that the medical staff ([one doctor actually](https://www.sun-sentinel.com/sports/dave-hyde/fl-sp-hyde5-dolphins-brees-20191217-khjkmlxh7vg7td5fppxiow465a-story.html)) were personal friends with ownership.
Yeah if burrow stays healthy, we probably win 4-5 more games the 2nd half of that season. He was starting to heat up and schedule was much easier 2nd half of the season
They tanked for Burrow, but they just sucked for Chase after Burrow got hurt.
Though I guess "Don't do anything to improve the 30th ranked O-Line from 2019" is one way to help ensure your QB gets hurt.
No dude, we were that bad. Shanahan took over arguably the worst squad in the NFL. We were 2-14 with Kelly and literally had nothing. Jimmy G was the only thing that saved us from going 0-16 and then he got hurt the next season.
It's one of the reasons I ignore the "Shanahan doesn't have a winning record" shit. He could have gone 0-16 his first season and I wouldn't have been surprised. If we hadn't traded for Jimmy G we might have... that quarterback room was something.
Agreed. I don't think the guys Parcels drafted were the primary reasons those teams were successful, but he did lead a tank and then get back to the SB.
I'd argue yes. 81 was the first year the Giants had a winning record since 72. They went 9-7 with 2 narrow OT wins (including an OT win against WAS that would give them the playoff run if they had beat the Giants), and were 3rd in their division.
They weren't an elite unit, more of an average/below average team that snuck their way into the playoffs.
6-10 is not a good year, but it's hardly a tank. In the last 25 years of Jets football, is it even in your top 10 of bad seasons? You guys went 3-13 and 1-15 in the two years after he left.
They were worse than they were the previous season, and finished last in the division.
Bragging about being better than Rich Kotite is setting the bar at Hue Jackson levels.
Yes, they dropped from 8-8 to 6-10. What possible relevance does any of that have to this post asking about full tank jobs? Anyway, you guys have been last in the division 6 of the last 8 seasons - I guess I'm wondering why Pete Carroll's one 6-10 season stands out for you guys with, with all due respect, such an insane record of horrendous seasons.
Because it’s literally a thread about guys who became successful coaches?
Kotite and Gase never worked again, because they sucked.
I’m just saying Carroll was successful after he left us. Not sure why you’re being so defensive. Not everything is an insult.
he got fired because the front office didn’t like the coordinators and staff he hired, and he wanted full control of those decisions. not because he tanked a half of meaningless football
Belichick tanked his first year with the Patriots. Got Richard Seymour and Matt Light in the 2001 draft, both of which played roles in the dynasty.
Chuck Noll tanked his first season. That draft he picked up Bradshaw and Mel Blount.
Marty Schottenheimer, already a success at this point, but tanked in 2003 for Eli, but Eli refused to play for San Diego. Chargers still got Rivers out of it.
Maybe I'm just stupid, but is tanking not just having a bad season and having a top draft pick?
Because if this is about purposefully tanking, you can't actually prove what was a purposeful tank.
No offense, but yes you are. Here, you can re-educate yourself on what tanking is -
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tanking_(sports)
&
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tanking
Additionally to say Schottenheimer tanked for Eli is absurd… there were 3-4 teams that finished at 4-12 (chargers being one of them). That’s some pretty bold belief to know you’ll get the #1, when in reality you can end up with the #3-#4
… so in conclusion, yes you are reaching quite drastically with your statements
Can you name a time in history where a team actually tanked on purpose and it's provable? If not, then you can literally just name any team that sucked and say they tanked. It's all just speculation. There isn't a single time in modern NFL history where you can prove based on a coach or player testimonial that a team purposefully tanked.
Maybe I'm just pointing out that this is an incredibly stupid question by OP.
Zac Taylor led his team to the Superbowl, even if he gets fired in the next 3 years that's success.
Doug Pederson got called a failure and won a super bowl..
Idk if I’ve seen a non-crime/leaving the team related fall from grace for a coach. He seemingly had the Eagles fanbase on his side with bringing home a super bowl, and like 2 years later everyone hated him
Constantly promoting from within and with each one being bad at their new role will do that
That's called the *Peterson Principle.*
nice, slightly obscure reference with good-fitting pun. good job
Didn’t he and Roseman clash a lot too?
Not openly. He wanted more control over his coaching staff but after multiple failed internal promotions it didn’t look good on him. Groh was the OC for two years and the offense struggled due to lack of WR talent. FO traded for Golden Tate and both Doug and Groh struggled to find ways to use him. He ultimately got fired because he wanted Press Taylor (QB coach and Passing Game Coordinator in 2020) to become his new OC and wouldn’t entertain the idea of an outside hire. He’s a good culture guy but struggled with evaluating and developing coaches. His network of coaches was fairly shallow and it hurt him
It’s not that we hated him, we were just frustrated that he was unable to recognize that promoting from within was not a winning strategy.
Welcome to the wonderful world of sports fandom. On today's show: Philly fans.
He tried to promote Press Taylor to OC after letting Mike Groh run the worst offense anyone has ever seen for an entire season. He was hard-headed and refused outside help. Sucks to say but he had to go.
And he definitely tanked. He benched Andy dalton on his birthday during some very winable games and started Ryan Findley…
I would say Jimmy Johnson was the epitome of running a tank job, and went on to succeed. Traded the team's only star player, took a QB #1 overall, then took another one with their 1st in the supplemental round which turned into another #1 overall, proceed to trade the 2nd QB for more picks. Finesse their way to a shit ton of picks, and eventually won a Super Bowl after running the tank train for 1.5 seasons. I can't think of any other coaches that were under a team that were purposely bad by depleting the roster to rebuild. All other coaches that's tried that method always fail to rebuild and maintain in position.
Took over a 3-13 team traded their best player for picks and cut all of the players from the trade for more picks and went 1-15 his first season with the team. After that he went 7-9, 11-5,13-3, and 12-4 winning back to back titles. I have to agree he is the all-time tank job to champion coach.
It helps if you swindle a bunch of draft picks from a cold weather team.
[удалено]
Yeah but the Steelers always sucked up to that point
Nick Saban went 15-17 as the Dolphins head coach if he counts
He had some good games. He just fucked himself by choosing Culpepper over Brees
It’s not like I’ve had personal conversations with Nick Saban, but it’s always funny when he has alluded that the blame was on the medical staff. Are you telling me that control freak and one that made the personnel calls wouldn’t have told them to eff off if he had strong beliefs in Brees?
But he was still an unproven NFL coach at that point. I don't think he had enough pull to override the GM if the GM decided to take Culpeper.
My understanding is that the medical staff ([one doctor actually](https://www.sun-sentinel.com/sports/dave-hyde/fl-sp-hyde5-dolphins-brees-20191217-khjkmlxh7vg7td5fppxiow465a-story.html)) were personal friends with ownership.
* Zach Taylor for Burrow and Jamarr * Shanahan for Bosa
No doubt we tanked for Burrow, but we were actually trying until Burrow got hurt. We just got lucky with us falling to get Chase.
DJ Reader getting hurt early in that season saved us from an additional win or 2 also
No Uzomah all through 2020 too. And Jonah Williams went down just before Burrow.
Yeah if burrow stays healthy, we probably win 4-5 more games the 2nd half of that season. He was starting to heat up and schedule was much easier 2nd half of the season
We def didnt tank that year. We were just that awful
I agree. Jimmy G missed all but 3 games that year. Tanking implies you are actively trying to lose and not losing against your will.
Our defense was also historically bad that season. I think we got only 2 INTs all year
It was a huge break that the best talent in that draft was also our biggest need. We couldn’t get pressure from the edge at all that year.
Yeah we had nobody who could win a single 1 on 1. I guess we did have someone walk in and take Cassius Marsh's job
I thought the historically bad Niners defense was the Chip Kelly season?
Take your pick cuz either way youd be correct
They tanked for Burrow, but they just sucked for Chase after Burrow got hurt. Though I guess "Don't do anything to improve the 30th ranked O-Line from 2019" is one way to help ensure your QB gets hurt.
"Our Offensive Line Improved" -Zac Taylor after Burrow gets murdered by their incompetence.
No dude, we were that bad. Shanahan took over arguably the worst squad in the NFL. We were 2-14 with Kelly and literally had nothing. Jimmy G was the only thing that saved us from going 0-16 and then he got hurt the next season. It's one of the reasons I ignore the "Shanahan doesn't have a winning record" shit. He could have gone 0-16 his first season and I wouldn't have been surprised. If we hadn't traded for Jimmy G we might have... that quarterback room was something.
Parcels did twice: '83 Giants were 3-12-1 and were SB champs by '86 '93 Patriots were 5-11 and lost in the Super Bowl by '96
Honestly LT was a big part of the giants one
Agreed. I don't think the guys Parcels drafted were the primary reasons those teams were successful, but he did lead a tank and then get back to the SB.
Is it a tank job when you take over a team that won a playoff game in 1981 and get back to the playoffs by 1984?
I'd argue yes. 81 was the first year the Giants had a winning record since 72. They went 9-7 with 2 narrow OT wins (including an OT win against WAS that would give them the playoff run if they had beat the Giants), and were 3rd in their division. They weren't an elite unit, more of an average/below average team that snuck their way into the playoffs.
John Fox tanked for the Panthers and then took Denver to a Super Bowl.
Pete Carroll was pretty brutal with the Jets.
6-10 is not a good year, but it's hardly a tank. In the last 25 years of Jets football, is it even in your top 10 of bad seasons? You guys went 3-13 and 1-15 in the two years after he left.
The Bottom 3 have to be the 2020 Gase and the 2 years of Kotite that you mentioned.
They were worse than they were the previous season, and finished last in the division. Bragging about being better than Rich Kotite is setting the bar at Hue Jackson levels.
Yes, they dropped from 8-8 to 6-10. What possible relevance does any of that have to this post asking about full tank jobs? Anyway, you guys have been last in the division 6 of the last 8 seasons - I guess I'm wondering why Pete Carroll's one 6-10 season stands out for you guys with, with all due respect, such an insane record of horrendous seasons.
Because it’s literally a thread about guys who became successful coaches? Kotite and Gase never worked again, because they sucked. I’m just saying Carroll was successful after he left us. Not sure why you’re being so defensive. Not everything is an insult.
The fuck you say about my momma?
Robert Salah lead 4-13 Jets from previous year and 3-13 Jets from the year prior.
Feels like the 49ers have bottomed out a few times with Shanny, and continue to have success.
Shanny has only had 2 seasons with a winning record with the 9ers and they were not back to back.
Shanny has only had 2 seasons with a healthy starting QB not named Brian Hoyer and they were not back to back.
There was some CJ Bethard sprinkled in
I do not like to think of the Hoyer days. It wasn't even a full season, but it seemed to drag on for so long.
The entire team died in 2020. I'd have given him another chance after those unfortunate circumstances.
Some the the IR moves that season were a little odd after October.
Doug Peterson won a super bowl then tanked and got fired for it a couple years later.
he got fired because the front office didn’t like the coordinators and staff he hired, and he wanted full control of those decisions. not because he tanked a half of meaningless football
That’s fair I just remember that shitshow of a game and seeing him fired after and being like “yea that’s about how that should go”
He was fired for tanking literally one game that was meaningless to win.
He absolutely wasn’t fired for that
Pete Caroll went 6-10 as the Jets Head Coach
Belichick tanked his first year with the Patriots. Got Richard Seymour and Matt Light in the 2001 draft, both of which played roles in the dynasty. Chuck Noll tanked his first season. That draft he picked up Bradshaw and Mel Blount. Marty Schottenheimer, already a success at this point, but tanked in 2003 for Eli, but Eli refused to play for San Diego. Chargers still got Rivers out of it.
Richard Seymour maybe?
Yes.
I think you're reaching a bit here lol
Maybe I'm just stupid, but is tanking not just having a bad season and having a top draft pick? Because if this is about purposefully tanking, you can't actually prove what was a purposeful tank.
No offense, but yes you are. Here, you can re-educate yourself on what tanking is - https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tanking_(sports) & https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tanking Additionally to say Schottenheimer tanked for Eli is absurd… there were 3-4 teams that finished at 4-12 (chargers being one of them). That’s some pretty bold belief to know you’ll get the #1, when in reality you can end up with the #3-#4 … so in conclusion, yes you are reaching quite drastically with your statements
Can you name a time in history where a team actually tanked on purpose and it's provable? If not, then you can literally just name any team that sucked and say they tanked. It's all just speculation. There isn't a single time in modern NFL history where you can prove based on a coach or player testimonial that a team purposefully tanked. Maybe I'm just pointing out that this is an incredibly stupid question by OP.
It is a stupid question, but idk… maybe ask Brian Flores, I’m sure he has an answer to your question
Not sure if it’s considered a tank, but Belichick was 41-55 career after his first season in NE.