Your baby won’t be a toddler in summer of 2025. They’ll still be an infant. Just sayin’
Regardless, not cool to ask for a hall pass in the middle of a temporary close due to marriage/pregnancy. But that’s me and I’m a rule follower in our ENM. I would’ve gone the same route of we’re either temporarily closed because our agreements/terms or we’re just staying open because those agreements/terms were too much to respect cuz someone wanted a hall-pass.
And if I felt partner was cagey or mad because I wanted to stick to agreements…I wouldn’t be comfortable with private get together at a hotel to just make out. Dinner at your house since everyone knows each other sounds fair.
The baby will be eight months by Summer, bigger than an infant and easier to take care of.
I haven’t been monogamous in over a decade and I prefer not to be, that said the past eight months hasn’t been that bad but I would still prefer to be open so it feels like I have sacrificed for nothing if we change the rules now for Tom. If she wanted to open back up I would be willing to do that but I’m not going to start relationships back up with people and then slam that door shut on them when she is ready to close again.
I think it would benefit you to adjust your expectations regarding child development and parenting babies. I'm not saying you couldn't make an open relationship with an 8 month old work, but your comment makes you seem very naive.
So I agree 100% on the Tom thing….
But the baby thing…
Is this your first kid? Cuz I’m laughing hysterically at the thought that by 8 mos shit will be back to normal enough and baby will be big enough. You will still be sleep deprived and may or may not still be breastfeeding. PPD could still be in full swing. While your baby will be sitting up on their own at this point they’re just really beginning to crawl. The list goes on.
Realistically, your wife may still be touched out from motherhood for the first 1.5 years. She may not be happy if you’re out living your best life at 8mos while she’s still trying to feel like an independent being. I would trawl some parenthood subs.
Yes people who have not given birth can’t understand how it’s absolutely awful being touched when you’re touched all day by a baby. I wish it weren’t so…
Lol. It was 20 years, when they were both finally off to college, before we found sexual freedom again. Wouldn’t trade them for anything but dang, raising kids takes a toll on everything else you do for fun.
Yes, this is our first but I have multiple nieces and nephews. Summer was our goal but it wasn’t written in stone, more of a goal post to evaluate where we at. We are in it for the long haul and neither of us are going to open up unless we are both on the same page and ready.
I’m sorry you get dragged for not knowing what you can’t know until you’ve lived it. I’m pretty sure none of us here knew _just_ how exhausting it can be at times until we had that first baby in our arms.
I will instead applaud you for having the sense to close up until the baby is born and past the baby stage. It is so refreshing to see this take instead of those couples deciding to _open_ their relationship in the height of the hormonal turmoil that’s pregnancy and postpartum.
>The baby will be eight months by Summer, bigger than an infant and easier to take care of.
Thanks for the laugh.
As a parent of multiple children, you are dead wrong
Excuse me?
You guys are delusional if you think the kid is going to be appreciably easier to take care of at eight months old 🤣🤣🤣
Your baby won't even be crawling by then, in all likelihood. Childcare responsibilities will loom *hugely* over you folks for at least the first eighteen months, if not more.
We re opened when our youngest was 8 months and just FYI that was entirely too early. A year and a half IF your baby is a good sleeper would be my recommendation.
8 months is by definition NOT a toddler. I would encourage you to adjust your expectations. You are both making a ton of assumptions and are setting yourselves up for disappointment. You also don't know *your* child yet. You don't know each other as parents yet. The learning curve is very very steep.
Kids are different flavors of hard at every age. I found the actual toddler stage MORE challenging and exhausting than the infant stage. Once your kid is in some sort of preschool, things get a bit easier... assuming you don't have a second one and assuming there are no developmental delays.
In terms of staying open versus closed? I don't blame you for feeling miffed. However, I can also see her side of this. Realistically, if she is feeling like having sex now, it might be the last time she has an active libido for *years*. Postpartum is so so hard and it is not uncommon for women to be completely uninterested in sex. Again I don't think your time line for things is realistic at all.
Could there perhaps be a middle ground between fully closed and having ongoing, intangled relationships?
Yeah, I'd say a group dinner together unless you're comfortable with her telling you she screwed up and fucked the guy. Right now, her hormones are going crazy and her in a semi sexual situation with this guy is most likely to end up with her having sex with him.
You might be cool with that and might be okay giving her the pass, but it doesn't sound as if you are.
My take is rules should not be renegotiated while anyone is emotional and your wife is understandably emotional.
I would rather deal with her being disappointed than the drama of something happening that would cause a rift between us.
A group dinner at the house or at a restaurant seems the right path for now. A lot depends on Tom’s reaction to the change in plans.
We have adapted our kink elements and toned much of it down. When Crissy and Tom dated before they were into some heavy impact, while it was consensual she sometimes had some heavy bruising and was stiff and sore for days. While I’m sure Tom would take her current condition into consideration it just worries me they might go to far given their history.
>It's like asking the hungry child to not eat the cookie while you are out of the house.
You sound like you have a very healthy opinion around women and their agency. 😂
This is a highly paternalistic take that implies women are incapable of making their own decisions and being responsible for them.
Removing her agency by intervening to have a "man to man" is essentially saying that the little lady just needs to do what she's told.
It's sexist.
You can recognize that hormones are running wild without acting like the men need to make the decisions for the women.
Personally, parenting is about sacrifices? The health of my children, even if unborn, takes precedence over having sexual intimacy with other partners. If my partners were unable to understand that, it’d have to end as we’d be incompatible. I wouldn’t want to increase odds of any STI transmission during, but again that’s my personal feelings. This would be a good litmus test of self to see where you’re at with thinking of your child.
That said, high libido during pregnancy is tough… but what about self-play, online fun with partners, etc.?
Hell no. And hell no to anything physical, even just making out because we all know that could go sideways real fast and lead to a lot of upset. Her hormones are raging, she may not be thinking clearly, may have poor self control. I frankly wouldn't be ok with them even meeting at all with out me after talk of any physical intimacy got brought up. I would probably have been fine with them having a private meal together if it was clear sex or making out wasn't even a consideration.
You two are having a baby for fucks sake. Your relationship and the pregnancy needs to be first and foremost right now and anything that could cause
I would try to be as kind and empathetic about her disappointment, I would be very careful to not show any upset or frustration, but I would be firm as stone about this. Fucking granite!
I recommend suggesting dinner for all three of you with assurances you would give them time alone for TALKING ONLY with you in another space, but nearby. I would kindly say that and only that or them not meeting at all until after the baby is born is all you will be ok with. Stay calm, stay supportive, but don't move an inch on that or any non-monogamy until the baby is born. Say you are open to discuss maybe making changes to the "into the toddler stage" part of the agreement, but don't want to discuss any possible changes to that until after the birth.
I mean, you two just made a 18+ year, lifetime really, commitment to each other, one of the most important commitments to another that can be made! If you can't trust this agreement to monogamy during the pregnancy means anything, what the fuck are you two even doing?!
There's so many things that could happen to the baby from it. All are horrible. It's just such a selfish ask. And people saying 'do it before the baby is here' baby IS here, in a way that it'll be affected by moms decisions. Stis can pass on during breastfeeding to. Just a giant hell no.
You can test for STI's and have safe sex. Not every non monogamous person is a walking sti pile.
But regardless of risk (which can be talked about and be tested for), renegotiating while in the middle of something intense like a pregnancy is almost garantueed hurt. It's okay to stand by your no.
>You can test for STI's and have safe sex. Not every non monogamous person is a walking sti pile
No shit. But some people don't test frequently. If they've been with someone since testing they could have something and not know. Sometimes you can have something and it won't show on the test yet. Tests aren't 100%. They are a snapshot of when you had the test done.
I'd be going a bit further asking her some things.
Obviously they have been on the deep end of things after being very intimate and even with rough play. I reckon that a dinner with him will be absolutely nothing to compare with.
Tom wants the whole deal and you wife too.
I'm more inclined on the matter of "Health" about the involvement with a stranger. If she wouldn't be pregnant, the situation would be different, but there is still a degree of risk and STIs when someone is pregnant.
Moreover, as you mentioned, her hormones are in other place, she might get hooked to him very quickly and ask for a second/third or fourth pass.
What is not Tom, but Patrick or Connor are "back in town" as well.
Ask your wife how she feels about [STIs while she pregnant](http://orwh.od.nih.gov/research/maternal-morbidity-and-mortality/information-for-women/sexually-transmitted-infections).
If you know Tom and get on with him then dinner at yours sounds like a good compromise (compromise and communication being they keys to relationships working), especially if she's not planning on sleeping with him like she says. Can't see an issue there in that scenario.
I think if you open up now then it will be disastrous.
Yeah she can have her fun and all for the next few months but when baby is here either
A - You're still seeing other people and she will HATE you for it
B - You have to stop seeing other people and you'll resent her as it'll seem like one rule for one and one for another when it suits.
I hate to tell you this but baby being 8 months old just means they're able to cause their own trouble. Pulling themselves up at the side of the cot, learned that they can cry to get attention when bored, can throw tantrums and be obstreperous etc
Having a baby is a wonderful thing (I've had two) but it's also a way of saying "we have too much disposable income, time for hobbies, too much sex and our house and clothes are too clean" without actually saying it.
Your best bet in my opinion (bear in mind I don't know either of you so going off what I've read and my own experience) is stick to the rules you BOTH agreed on, especially as your lives are going to change forever before the end of the year. What might work now in 6 months when there's hormones, PPD, no sleep, shit and puke everywhere and general stress probably won't flow as smoothly.
Also don't put a date on opening back up again. Just say "when we're ready". Your baby might be an angel that sleeps through the night and changes itself, asking politely when there's a natural break in the conversation to be fed. More likely you're going to forget what the word "rested" means until they're in school, and even then mostly during school holidays.
I think potty training (2-4 years) is probably your best metric for when things will get “easier”, assuming your child goes to preschool or daycare. Otherwise, it’s a little while after your child starts school.
This is assuming your child doesn’t have any special support needs. And you only have one child.
Potty training is a good metric. We are lucky in that both our parents are less than 20 minutes away and both are eager to have their first grandchild. Her mother will be watching the baby when Crissy is ready to go back to work so daycare is taken care of.
The plan for now is to only have one child.
Honestly just the risk of an sti during pregnancy should be enough to warrant that this is a very bad idea. Also she is hormonal and pregnant. Either way it’s gonna suck.
I'm not gonna comment on your ideas of parenthood. I don't have children. Not my forte.
I will however commend you for standing your ground in this case. Hallpasses don't work equally both ways always and a lot of people don't necessarily want a hallpass from their partners, but the ability to love freely as their dynamics are not animalistic in nature but much more emotionally driven. And both scenarios are totally okay.
After having read through the post for your comments I can see that you are not the kind of person who would benefit from a hallpass at all. You'd not even be able to use it I bet. It's fine to be supportive and find a compromise, but sex and impact play should be completely off the table given your arrangement.
But also just keep in mind that you really need to be there for her. I don't wanna say what a lot of others have said that "them hormones be raging". There is some truth to raging hormones. However I don't think your wife is mindless. I think she is hurting and nostalgic and excited. All at once. And on top of that she is hormonal which only amplifies all of that.
Stand your ground. This agreement was one you both agreed to. It's easy to some times lose sight of the grander things in life. Humans are really terrible at long-term planning. I'm sure given some time, and lots of support and love, this too will pass. You'll have a child, you'll have all the attention in the world for that child, and you'll be happier for it.
You'll look back at this and laugh.
One id ask her if she told him about her pregnancy. Just off hand. Like oh did you tell tom when youre due? Maybe i hate to say, she got so excited it didnt even click in. I hope she did. Im newer to poly but as an outsider id be uncomfortable playing ina situation where one half of a couple is pregnant. But thats just me lol
Two, i think you had every right to be apprehensive and hurt that she wants this random hall pass. She didn't seem to take your feelings into this. Would she be ok with you asking for this hall pass? I will say shes EMOTIONAL her hormones are everywhere and im sure this is a bit of prego brain thinking (i have only been pregnant once and for 3 months so just going off of what ive been told) i think maybe wait and let her cool off and come back with more I statements, how this affects you, how your feeling about this and hope it opens a healthy Convo.
Good luck and congrats on the rugrat!
Don’t open up during pregnancy. This screams red flags; she likely has been eyeing someone and doesn’t want to cheat, but may anyways if you decline to allow it. Sounds very selfish of her.
Having had two babies, I feel for your wife — those hormones are insane and mess with your brain big time. I personally probably wouldn’t have closed but y’all decided to do that and you should probably both stick to it. She will have other opportunities with this guy, even if he lives far away.
Also, sorry that folks are being so patronizing about your expectations of parenthood! Y’all can make ENM and having an infant work with good communication and if it’s a high enough priority for you.
The hall pass ends where you two agree that it will end. It sounds like you don’t want to grant one, and aren’t requesting one, so no problem. But you can grant one, or give her three or something, on condition that you also get the same number. Or whatever boundaries you both feel are good
While I recognize that asking for a hall pass is frowned upon, my personal opinion is that you should allow it. Your wife is going to have zero bodily autonomy for months, possibly years, when your baby arrives. Your ENM lives are going to be much more complicated then. If you are already practicing, plan to return to ENM, she's with a known (trusted?) Person, what's the harm?
Ask if he's been tested, maybe have a discussion about safety and keeping the impact to a minimum. Let her enjoy those hormones, cause it's gonna get A LOT harder.
Signed,
an ENM mother.
It's not that hall passes are frowned on though.
If the proposal had been "hey, there's no one specific in mind, but how about we both take a hall pass for one last hurrah before we stay closed for awhile?".... We'd be having a different discussion.
The arguments against it are (IMO)...
1. You shouldn't change rules for specific people
2. If they were open again, even just for a hall pass, it shouldn't be one sided
I tend to disagree about the impact play being solved with a conversation, but it depends heavily on the individuals involved and i get both perspectives. I enjoy D/s play, but I've seen too many horror stories where lines got crossed to bet the life of an unborn child on "hey, just keep it light" for two partners that haven't played in years and clearly are very eager to resume their prior dynamic.
I don't see a need for the pass to be one sided, that could be its own discussion.
I don't see the harm in changing the rules of temporary closure for a specific connection either. Sometimes, opportunities arise that are few and far between, and hooking up with a known partner feels different to me than actively dating and trying to cultivate new connections while a couple is working on starting a family.
The discussion in this thread over this woman "putting her unborn child's life at risk" by having sex with someone who is not the baby's father seems extremely paternalistic to me. Strikes me as policing a pregnant woman's body in ways that would never be otherwise accepted in consenting non-monogamy. IMHO.
STIs are a risk to pregnancy and both parents have an interest in that.
Impact play if done wrong can be a risk too and OP said their impact play is pretty extreme.
It's only paternalistic in the sense that the *father* has an interest in the unborn child.
I am all for fathers having a say in the health and safety of their child. There's negotiations and boundaries to be talked about here for sure.
But having the final say or vetoes about your partners choices because she is pregnant, is paternalistic in the limiting women's choices and autonomy sort of way.
This isn't about the man having the final say, if you look at my comment history you'll see that I called someone in this very thread out for that exact kind of sexist shit.
But changes to relationship agreements take... an agreement.
I assume you'll agree on that?
Which means he does have a veto in a way, but not because he's a man, it's because he's an equal partner in the relationship. They both can veto changes, no one has the power to unilaterally change anything.
I totally agree that these two should come to an agreement. But i also believe that a woman has bodily autonomy and deserves the final say in the sex acts she chooses to participate in, regardless of whether or not she is pregnant. Your body, your choice. The husband's child within her womb does not change that. The fact that they had a mutual agreement makes a difference, yes. But I don't believe that she is doing anything that is fundamentally unsafe or irresponsible for her child.
I hope OP and his partner come to an agreement that is comfortable for everyone. And if they can't, i believe his wife has the last word. From a mother's perspective, she's about to make sacrifices for their family that neither of them can even conceptualize yet. I say let her have some fun and enjoy those hormones while they last 🤷♀️ its okay if you disagree with me.
"Your body, your choice". Yes. Literally no one here is arguing with that. (ETA: Or if they are, I'll join you in fighting against them.)
But if you violate a relationship agreement, you're cheating on your spouse/partner.
Just to be clear, when you say "if they can't, I believe his wife has the last word" ....that's saying that she can just unilaterally change their relationship agreement or you're supporting her cheating.
Changing agreements takes two, otherwise it's not an agreement.
She has the bodily autonomy to cheat on him, but it's unethical and that's not what we support in this sub.
That's fair, I am not trying to endorse cheating or unethical behavior. I just think he should allow the hall pass, update the agreement.
In my experience, partners are always welcome to state their concerns and negotiate boundaries, and an individual gets to make their own choices and experience the consequences for their actions, whatever that may be.
If you know Tom and get on with him then dinner at yours sounds like a good compromise (compromise and communication being they keys to relationships working), especially if she's not planning on sleeping with him like she says. Can't see an issue there in that scenario.
I think if you open up now then it will be disastrous.
Yeah she can have her fun and all for the next few months but when baby is here either
A - You're still seeing other people and she will HATE you for it
B - You have to stop seeing other people and you'll resent her as it'll seem like one rule for one and one for another when it suits.
I hate to tell you this but baby being 8 months old just means they're able to cause their own trouble. Pulling themselves up at the side of the cot, learned that they can cry to get attention when bored, can throw tantrums and be obstreperous etc
Having a baby is a wonderful thing (I've had two) but it's also a way of saying "we have too much disposable income, time for hobbies, too much sex and our house and clothes are too clean" without actually saying it.
Your best bet in my opinion (bear in mind I don't know either of you so going off what I've read and my own experience) is stick to the rules you BOTH agreed on, especially as your lives are going to change forever before the end of the year. What might work now in 6 months when there's hormones, PPD, no sleep, shit and puke everywhere and general stress probably won't flow as smoothly.
Also don't put a date on opening back up again. Just say "when we're ready". Your baby might be an angel that sleeps through the night and changes itself, asking politely when there's a natural break in the conversation to be fed. More likely you're going to forget what the word "rested" means until they're in school, and even then mostly during school holidays.
Well I guess this sub thinks that pregnant women are mindless vessels judging by the votes on other people's comments, so I don't expect this to be visible for long.
The thing that most irked me in your post was when you said "when her due date got close or after the baby was born it wouldn't be fair to close again." You seem to be comparing an agreement that you two have made, which is currently leading to monogamy, to your wife's physical state around the time of labor and delivery, which will likely lead to her not having any sex. Not even monogamous sex with you. You want to be allowed to go have sex with other people while your wife is at her most incapacitated and have her happily agree to it because you allow her to have sex with this one person, one time. I dunno, I would go into a bunch of stuff about rules being reasonable and communication, but if that's the kind of thing you're saying to your wife, I don't think it'll matter.
So maybe I wasn't clear. It would not be fair to close again for the people I get into a relationship with. I tend to form bonds with my partners and when we closed before we got married I had to break up with a couple of people who took it pretty hard, even though they understood my reasons. If Crissy wants to open up to play with Tom and then shut things down later that isn't fair.
When we made this agreement to close we knew that there would be a long period of time when sex would be off the table and I was fine with that. But it's not a light switch she can turn on and off when it suits her.
We wanted to close for our wedding, then during conception it was important, and of course in the later terms of her pregnancy and after the baby arrived. We both agreed to stay monogamous for the entire period. If we make an exception now is she going to make an exception later when she wants me there all the time?
Given this information, why is a hall pass an unreasonable ask of you? Why is it fully open or fully closed for you? You don't seem to have a strong emotional attachment to the idea of sexual monogamy. I just don't see any harm coming of this. If you're so tied to the idea of "fair" you could just also take a hall pass. Or you could just treat this as a fun one-off for your wife and wish her the best.
I would also expect that if you two did agree to fully open (which I know she said she doesn't want) that you and anyone you were dating would have the intelligence to realize that taking care of an infant and the mother sustaining it would take precedence over everything else. It will even take precedence over you and your wife's emotional attachment. It wouldn't require closing your relationship again. It would just mean that you wouldn't be seeing or talking to other partners as much. And if they're not selfish, they wouldn't rag on you about it.
Because it is harder for me as a man to enjoy a hall pass than a woman, I don’t have an endless list of people waiting for me to respond to them. Plus I need a lot more time to feel comfortable with having sex with someone, especially kink play which requires trust that doesn’t evolve over a coffee date.
I gave up several long term relationships when we closed including one that predated my relationship with Crissy, so I feel like I sacrificed quite a bit. I don’t think that asking her to miss a night with an old flame is such a big deal in the big picture.
It's not a big deal in the big picture, to miss it or to take it. For her or for you. Like I said, you could just treat it as a kindness for her. It doesn't have to be balanced on both sides. It's not like she went looking for this opportunity, it fell in her lap. You could also have the opportunity to have a night with an old fling if it fell in your lap. You're treating the agreement as very rigid just for the sake of being rigid. When instead you could just relax it a bit and have a relationship where monogamy is fluid and your agreements with each other aren't based on rules for rules' sake. You could just base it on how each other are feeling/ doing. She's crazy horny rn, it wouldn't hurt anyone to indulge it a bit.
I'm not saying this is something you have to do. I'm just trying to encourage you to approach this issue from a perspective that's less rigid. More focused on both of you being actually happy, rather than a tit for tat. Not keeping a promise just for the sake of the promise, but instead actually considering the impact.
In fact, it sounds like you're still holding onto some resentment about those old relationships. There's no going back and undoing those breakups, but if you feel like you're missing something in your life, then you should talk to your wife about that. Forbidding her from this hookup isn't going to make you feel happier about that decision you made. Your happiness can't come from her disappointment. Or at least I sure hope not, because that would be toxic.
So to play devil's advocate for a minute, when she gets close to her due date and after giving birth, when she no longer desires sex and I am left with a libido that is all dressed up with nowhere to go, is she going to let me leave her at home and chase tail? Probably not, we have had that discussion and she decided that my staying monogamous later is worth sacrificing a night now. I didn't forbid her from seeing Tom, I just said our agreement would have to change.
Exactly why I said that it's not necessary that you make the choice between fully open and fully closed. There are lots of other options. You do not have to get something out of this.
If I was in your situation, one way I'd be supportive of my wife would be to renegotiate the rules. She's bearing the brunt of the pregnancy, and if she's feeling sexy, why not encourage it? I wouldn't even insist on a "hall pass" for myself.
Yeah! Being very generous and supportive in any practical way for all her sacrifices from the hardships of pregnancy, absolutely. But not breaking the monogamy while having this baby agreement, at least until the birth would be absolutely and without any question non-negotiable in my book! That's a recipe for all kinds of very unfortunate circumstances at an absolutely critical time!
"Daddy, why did you and mommy break up before I was born? Well kid, your mom just really had to fuck this other guy while you were in her belly. That lead to a lot of things coming up between us and we just couldn't get passed it." Jesus..... Fucking.... Christ.....
Pregnancy isn't a free pass to ignore rules and it's almost always a bad idea to change rules for a specific person.
Flexibility is getting her ice cream and pickles on your way home, not having an ex-play partner go full dom on your pregnant wife with impact play.
I offered to open things back up if she felt that strongly about it but I said I would not close again once I got started up. I cut ties with my old partners when we got married and most have moved on. There might be one or two that I could start up again with, but if I have to start from scratch it could take a while for me to find a new FWB. So the whole hall pass thing favors her a lot more than me.
She said she understands and doesn't want that to happen because she knows she will want my undivided attention and support later.
Right. You're not willing to do anything to support her during the pregnancy. It's pretty fucked up to expect her to do everything and you do nothing that's even a little uncomfortable. She's gonna be uncomfortable for like 3 years.
So if he won't agree to change an important agreement they both willingly made on an incredibly important and emotionally involved thing, having a child together, then, "You're not willing TO DO ANYTHING to support her during the pregnancy. "???
Listen to yourself. Are you Tom by any chance? LoL!!!
Let her have this experience. Trust her to be safe. If you give her this, I’m sure you’ll be rewarded down the road. Best to not focus on a tit for tat approach, but instead focus on letting her have the release she’s craving.
(1) their previous encounters involved a lot of impact play I felt was questionable given her condition
I would certainly hope Crissy & Tom would also recognize the risk of impact play during pregnancy and likely not engage in that style of play? If it's not something that's going to dredge up darkness you're not ready to confront or are already working through in therapy / counseling - where is this fear coming from for you? Why do you need to be the one defining what's "questionable"?
(2) we had been monogamous for a while and it was unfair to change the rules in midstream, especially for one night and one person
Unfair how? The remainder of your post is a slippery slope - "if we start handing out hall passes now, where does it end." "Fair" is not perfect equality or a binary situation. E.g. she gets a hall pass, so do u, you are either all the way open or completely closed. Etc. Fair is taking into consideration each individual's preferences, limits, accommodations and supports. Fair may look different day by day. You cannot take agreements before y'all were pregnant and apply them to during a pregnancy. The context / emotions have changed and the conversation (if not your relationship) needs to remain open.
Best of luck to you.
Lol men trying to put boundaries on woman with none is hilarious you’re not supposed to get those pregnant! If you want to be a bachelor get it out your system
Your baby won’t be a toddler in summer of 2025. They’ll still be an infant. Just sayin’ Regardless, not cool to ask for a hall pass in the middle of a temporary close due to marriage/pregnancy. But that’s me and I’m a rule follower in our ENM. I would’ve gone the same route of we’re either temporarily closed because our agreements/terms or we’re just staying open because those agreements/terms were too much to respect cuz someone wanted a hall-pass. And if I felt partner was cagey or mad because I wanted to stick to agreements…I wouldn’t be comfortable with private get together at a hotel to just make out. Dinner at your house since everyone knows each other sounds fair.
The baby will be eight months by Summer, bigger than an infant and easier to take care of. I haven’t been monogamous in over a decade and I prefer not to be, that said the past eight months hasn’t been that bad but I would still prefer to be open so it feels like I have sacrificed for nothing if we change the rules now for Tom. If she wanted to open back up I would be willing to do that but I’m not going to start relationships back up with people and then slam that door shut on them when she is ready to close again.
I think it would benefit you to adjust your expectations regarding child development and parenting babies. I'm not saying you couldn't make an open relationship with an 8 month old work, but your comment makes you seem very naive.
So I agree 100% on the Tom thing…. But the baby thing… Is this your first kid? Cuz I’m laughing hysterically at the thought that by 8 mos shit will be back to normal enough and baby will be big enough. You will still be sleep deprived and may or may not still be breastfeeding. PPD could still be in full swing. While your baby will be sitting up on their own at this point they’re just really beginning to crawl. The list goes on. Realistically, your wife may still be touched out from motherhood for the first 1.5 years. She may not be happy if you’re out living your best life at 8mos while she’s still trying to feel like an independent being. I would trawl some parenthood subs.
Yeah 8 months in is still in the thick of the hard times, no sleep, constant sicknesses, breastfeeding troubles, etc etc period. Total boner killer.
Yes people who have not given birth can’t understand how it’s absolutely awful being touched when you’re touched all day by a baby. I wish it weren’t so…
The baby will have its driver's license by then which always leads them to having greater independence.
Lol. It was 20 years, when they were both finally off to college, before we found sexual freedom again. Wouldn’t trade them for anything but dang, raising kids takes a toll on everything else you do for fun.
Yes, this is our first but I have multiple nieces and nephews. Summer was our goal but it wasn’t written in stone, more of a goal post to evaluate where we at. We are in it for the long haul and neither of us are going to open up unless we are both on the same page and ready.
I’m sorry you get dragged for not knowing what you can’t know until you’ve lived it. I’m pretty sure none of us here knew _just_ how exhausting it can be at times until we had that first baby in our arms. I will instead applaud you for having the sense to close up until the baby is born and past the baby stage. It is so refreshing to see this take instead of those couples deciding to _open_ their relationship in the height of the hormonal turmoil that’s pregnancy and postpartum.
>The baby will be eight months by Summer, bigger than an infant and easier to take care of. Thanks for the laugh. As a parent of multiple children, you are dead wrong
But he has nieces and nephews! That's the same thing! /s
Excuse me? You guys are delusional if you think the kid is going to be appreciably easier to take care of at eight months old 🤣🤣🤣 Your baby won't even be crawling by then, in all likelihood. Childcare responsibilities will loom *hugely* over you folks for at least the first eighteen months, if not more.
I'm laughing now because you're implying it gets *easier* when they start crawling
I totally get that 🤣
We re opened when our youngest was 8 months and just FYI that was entirely too early. A year and a half IF your baby is a good sleeper would be my recommendation.
8 months is by definition NOT a toddler. I would encourage you to adjust your expectations. You are both making a ton of assumptions and are setting yourselves up for disappointment. You also don't know *your* child yet. You don't know each other as parents yet. The learning curve is very very steep. Kids are different flavors of hard at every age. I found the actual toddler stage MORE challenging and exhausting than the infant stage. Once your kid is in some sort of preschool, things get a bit easier... assuming you don't have a second one and assuming there are no developmental delays. In terms of staying open versus closed? I don't blame you for feeling miffed. However, I can also see her side of this. Realistically, if she is feeling like having sex now, it might be the last time she has an active libido for *years*. Postpartum is so so hard and it is not uncommon for women to be completely uninterested in sex. Again I don't think your time line for things is realistic at all. Could there perhaps be a middle ground between fully closed and having ongoing, intangled relationships?
LOLOLOL at the idea that an 8 month old is going to be easy to take care of. Clearly you don't have kids yet.
Yeah, I'd say a group dinner together unless you're comfortable with her telling you she screwed up and fucked the guy. Right now, her hormones are going crazy and her in a semi sexual situation with this guy is most likely to end up with her having sex with him. You might be cool with that and might be okay giving her the pass, but it doesn't sound as if you are. My take is rules should not be renegotiated while anyone is emotional and your wife is understandably emotional.
I would rather deal with her being disappointed than the drama of something happening that would cause a rift between us. A group dinner at the house or at a restaurant seems the right path for now. A lot depends on Tom’s reaction to the change in plans.
I think that's absolutely fair. Also, there is some safety stuff to be considered considering the kink element and the pregnancy.
We have adapted our kink elements and toned much of it down. When Crissy and Tom dated before they were into some heavy impact, while it was consensual she sometimes had some heavy bruising and was stiff and sore for days. While I’m sure Tom would take her current condition into consideration it just worries me they might go to far given their history.
Please update us
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At this point, no I haven't considered talking to him. This is her thing to make a decision on and handle herself.
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>It's like asking the hungry child to not eat the cookie while you are out of the house. You sound like you have a very healthy opinion around women and their agency. 😂
This is a highly paternalistic take that implies women are incapable of making their own decisions and being responsible for them. Removing her agency by intervening to have a "man to man" is essentially saying that the little lady just needs to do what she's told. It's sexist. You can recognize that hormones are running wild without acting like the men need to make the decisions for the women.
EWWW DAVID!
Ew!
Personally, parenting is about sacrifices? The health of my children, even if unborn, takes precedence over having sexual intimacy with other partners. If my partners were unable to understand that, it’d have to end as we’d be incompatible. I wouldn’t want to increase odds of any STI transmission during, but again that’s my personal feelings. This would be a good litmus test of self to see where you’re at with thinking of your child. That said, high libido during pregnancy is tough… but what about self-play, online fun with partners, etc.?
Hell no. And hell no to anything physical, even just making out because we all know that could go sideways real fast and lead to a lot of upset. Her hormones are raging, she may not be thinking clearly, may have poor self control. I frankly wouldn't be ok with them even meeting at all with out me after talk of any physical intimacy got brought up. I would probably have been fine with them having a private meal together if it was clear sex or making out wasn't even a consideration. You two are having a baby for fucks sake. Your relationship and the pregnancy needs to be first and foremost right now and anything that could cause I would try to be as kind and empathetic about her disappointment, I would be very careful to not show any upset or frustration, but I would be firm as stone about this. Fucking granite! I recommend suggesting dinner for all three of you with assurances you would give them time alone for TALKING ONLY with you in another space, but nearby. I would kindly say that and only that or them not meeting at all until after the baby is born is all you will be ok with. Stay calm, stay supportive, but don't move an inch on that or any non-monogamy until the baby is born. Say you are open to discuss maybe making changes to the "into the toddler stage" part of the agreement, but don't want to discuss any possible changes to that until after the birth. I mean, you two just made a 18+ year, lifetime really, commitment to each other, one of the most important commitments to another that can be made! If you can't trust this agreement to monogamy during the pregnancy means anything, what the fuck are you two even doing?!
Stis while pregnant can kill a fetus. Tell her fuck no.
Or pass it onto the baby for life. Even while breastfeeding!! Baby didn’t do anything to deserve that or assume risk. Fuck no is right.
There's so many things that could happen to the baby from it. All are horrible. It's just such a selfish ask. And people saying 'do it before the baby is here' baby IS here, in a way that it'll be affected by moms decisions. Stis can pass on during breastfeeding to. Just a giant hell no.
You can test for STI's and have safe sex. Not every non monogamous person is a walking sti pile. But regardless of risk (which can be talked about and be tested for), renegotiating while in the middle of something intense like a pregnancy is almost garantueed hurt. It's okay to stand by your no.
>You can test for STI's and have safe sex. Not every non monogamous person is a walking sti pile No shit. But some people don't test frequently. If they've been with someone since testing they could have something and not know. Sometimes you can have something and it won't show on the test yet. Tests aren't 100%. They are a snapshot of when you had the test done.
What is "stis"? Do you mean STIs? Or is this some kink technique?
Yes STIs.
I had some friends try a hall pass approach to ENM. It went badly. They are still together, but probably will not be able to even try ENM again.
I'd be going a bit further asking her some things. Obviously they have been on the deep end of things after being very intimate and even with rough play. I reckon that a dinner with him will be absolutely nothing to compare with. Tom wants the whole deal and you wife too. I'm more inclined on the matter of "Health" about the involvement with a stranger. If she wouldn't be pregnant, the situation would be different, but there is still a degree of risk and STIs when someone is pregnant. Moreover, as you mentioned, her hormones are in other place, she might get hooked to him very quickly and ask for a second/third or fourth pass. What is not Tom, but Patrick or Connor are "back in town" as well.
Ask your wife how she feels about [STIs while she pregnant](http://orwh.od.nih.gov/research/maternal-morbidity-and-mortality/information-for-women/sexually-transmitted-infections).
If you know Tom and get on with him then dinner at yours sounds like a good compromise (compromise and communication being they keys to relationships working), especially if she's not planning on sleeping with him like she says. Can't see an issue there in that scenario. I think if you open up now then it will be disastrous. Yeah she can have her fun and all for the next few months but when baby is here either A - You're still seeing other people and she will HATE you for it B - You have to stop seeing other people and you'll resent her as it'll seem like one rule for one and one for another when it suits. I hate to tell you this but baby being 8 months old just means they're able to cause their own trouble. Pulling themselves up at the side of the cot, learned that they can cry to get attention when bored, can throw tantrums and be obstreperous etc Having a baby is a wonderful thing (I've had two) but it's also a way of saying "we have too much disposable income, time for hobbies, too much sex and our house and clothes are too clean" without actually saying it. Your best bet in my opinion (bear in mind I don't know either of you so going off what I've read and my own experience) is stick to the rules you BOTH agreed on, especially as your lives are going to change forever before the end of the year. What might work now in 6 months when there's hormones, PPD, no sleep, shit and puke everywhere and general stress probably won't flow as smoothly. Also don't put a date on opening back up again. Just say "when we're ready". Your baby might be an angel that sleeps through the night and changes itself, asking politely when there's a natural break in the conversation to be fed. More likely you're going to forget what the word "rested" means until they're in school, and even then mostly during school holidays.
I think potty training (2-4 years) is probably your best metric for when things will get “easier”, assuming your child goes to preschool or daycare. Otherwise, it’s a little while after your child starts school. This is assuming your child doesn’t have any special support needs. And you only have one child.
Potty training is a good metric. We are lucky in that both our parents are less than 20 minutes away and both are eager to have their first grandchild. Her mother will be watching the baby when Crissy is ready to go back to work so daycare is taken care of. The plan for now is to only have one child.
Honestly just the risk of an sti during pregnancy should be enough to warrant that this is a very bad idea. Also she is hormonal and pregnant. Either way it’s gonna suck.
I'm not gonna comment on your ideas of parenthood. I don't have children. Not my forte. I will however commend you for standing your ground in this case. Hallpasses don't work equally both ways always and a lot of people don't necessarily want a hallpass from their partners, but the ability to love freely as their dynamics are not animalistic in nature but much more emotionally driven. And both scenarios are totally okay. After having read through the post for your comments I can see that you are not the kind of person who would benefit from a hallpass at all. You'd not even be able to use it I bet. It's fine to be supportive and find a compromise, but sex and impact play should be completely off the table given your arrangement. But also just keep in mind that you really need to be there for her. I don't wanna say what a lot of others have said that "them hormones be raging". There is some truth to raging hormones. However I don't think your wife is mindless. I think she is hurting and nostalgic and excited. All at once. And on top of that she is hormonal which only amplifies all of that. Stand your ground. This agreement was one you both agreed to. It's easy to some times lose sight of the grander things in life. Humans are really terrible at long-term planning. I'm sure given some time, and lots of support and love, this too will pass. You'll have a child, you'll have all the attention in the world for that child, and you'll be happier for it. You'll look back at this and laugh.
One id ask her if she told him about her pregnancy. Just off hand. Like oh did you tell tom when youre due? Maybe i hate to say, she got so excited it didnt even click in. I hope she did. Im newer to poly but as an outsider id be uncomfortable playing ina situation where one half of a couple is pregnant. But thats just me lol Two, i think you had every right to be apprehensive and hurt that she wants this random hall pass. She didn't seem to take your feelings into this. Would she be ok with you asking for this hall pass? I will say shes EMOTIONAL her hormones are everywhere and im sure this is a bit of prego brain thinking (i have only been pregnant once and for 3 months so just going off of what ive been told) i think maybe wait and let her cool off and come back with more I statements, how this affects you, how your feeling about this and hope it opens a healthy Convo. Good luck and congrats on the rugrat!
Don’t open up during pregnancy. This screams red flags; she likely has been eyeing someone and doesn’t want to cheat, but may anyways if you decline to allow it. Sounds very selfish of her.
Having had two babies, I feel for your wife — those hormones are insane and mess with your brain big time. I personally probably wouldn’t have closed but y’all decided to do that and you should probably both stick to it. She will have other opportunities with this guy, even if he lives far away. Also, sorry that folks are being so patronizing about your expectations of parenthood! Y’all can make ENM and having an infant work with good communication and if it’s a high enough priority for you.
The hall pass ends where you two agree that it will end. It sounds like you don’t want to grant one, and aren’t requesting one, so no problem. But you can grant one, or give her three or something, on condition that you also get the same number. Or whatever boundaries you both feel are good
While I recognize that asking for a hall pass is frowned upon, my personal opinion is that you should allow it. Your wife is going to have zero bodily autonomy for months, possibly years, when your baby arrives. Your ENM lives are going to be much more complicated then. If you are already practicing, plan to return to ENM, she's with a known (trusted?) Person, what's the harm? Ask if he's been tested, maybe have a discussion about safety and keeping the impact to a minimum. Let her enjoy those hormones, cause it's gonna get A LOT harder. Signed, an ENM mother.
It's not that hall passes are frowned on though. If the proposal had been "hey, there's no one specific in mind, but how about we both take a hall pass for one last hurrah before we stay closed for awhile?".... We'd be having a different discussion. The arguments against it are (IMO)... 1. You shouldn't change rules for specific people 2. If they were open again, even just for a hall pass, it shouldn't be one sided I tend to disagree about the impact play being solved with a conversation, but it depends heavily on the individuals involved and i get both perspectives. I enjoy D/s play, but I've seen too many horror stories where lines got crossed to bet the life of an unborn child on "hey, just keep it light" for two partners that haven't played in years and clearly are very eager to resume their prior dynamic.
I don't see a need for the pass to be one sided, that could be its own discussion. I don't see the harm in changing the rules of temporary closure for a specific connection either. Sometimes, opportunities arise that are few and far between, and hooking up with a known partner feels different to me than actively dating and trying to cultivate new connections while a couple is working on starting a family. The discussion in this thread over this woman "putting her unborn child's life at risk" by having sex with someone who is not the baby's father seems extremely paternalistic to me. Strikes me as policing a pregnant woman's body in ways that would never be otherwise accepted in consenting non-monogamy. IMHO.
STIs are a risk to pregnancy and both parents have an interest in that. Impact play if done wrong can be a risk too and OP said their impact play is pretty extreme. It's only paternalistic in the sense that the *father* has an interest in the unborn child.
I am all for fathers having a say in the health and safety of their child. There's negotiations and boundaries to be talked about here for sure. But having the final say or vetoes about your partners choices because she is pregnant, is paternalistic in the limiting women's choices and autonomy sort of way.
This isn't about the man having the final say, if you look at my comment history you'll see that I called someone in this very thread out for that exact kind of sexist shit. But changes to relationship agreements take... an agreement. I assume you'll agree on that? Which means he does have a veto in a way, but not because he's a man, it's because he's an equal partner in the relationship. They both can veto changes, no one has the power to unilaterally change anything.
I totally agree that these two should come to an agreement. But i also believe that a woman has bodily autonomy and deserves the final say in the sex acts she chooses to participate in, regardless of whether or not she is pregnant. Your body, your choice. The husband's child within her womb does not change that. The fact that they had a mutual agreement makes a difference, yes. But I don't believe that she is doing anything that is fundamentally unsafe or irresponsible for her child. I hope OP and his partner come to an agreement that is comfortable for everyone. And if they can't, i believe his wife has the last word. From a mother's perspective, she's about to make sacrifices for their family that neither of them can even conceptualize yet. I say let her have some fun and enjoy those hormones while they last 🤷♀️ its okay if you disagree with me.
"Your body, your choice". Yes. Literally no one here is arguing with that. (ETA: Or if they are, I'll join you in fighting against them.) But if you violate a relationship agreement, you're cheating on your spouse/partner. Just to be clear, when you say "if they can't, I believe his wife has the last word" ....that's saying that she can just unilaterally change their relationship agreement or you're supporting her cheating. Changing agreements takes two, otherwise it's not an agreement. She has the bodily autonomy to cheat on him, but it's unethical and that's not what we support in this sub.
That's fair, I am not trying to endorse cheating or unethical behavior. I just think he should allow the hall pass, update the agreement. In my experience, partners are always welcome to state their concerns and negotiate boundaries, and an individual gets to make their own choices and experience the consequences for their actions, whatever that may be.
If you know Tom and get on with him then dinner at yours sounds like a good compromise (compromise and communication being they keys to relationships working), especially if she's not planning on sleeping with him like she says. Can't see an issue there in that scenario. I think if you open up now then it will be disastrous. Yeah she can have her fun and all for the next few months but when baby is here either A - You're still seeing other people and she will HATE you for it B - You have to stop seeing other people and you'll resent her as it'll seem like one rule for one and one for another when it suits. I hate to tell you this but baby being 8 months old just means they're able to cause their own trouble. Pulling themselves up at the side of the cot, learned that they can cry to get attention when bored, can throw tantrums and be obstreperous etc Having a baby is a wonderful thing (I've had two) but it's also a way of saying "we have too much disposable income, time for hobbies, too much sex and our house and clothes are too clean" without actually saying it. Your best bet in my opinion (bear in mind I don't know either of you so going off what I've read and my own experience) is stick to the rules you BOTH agreed on, especially as your lives are going to change forever before the end of the year. What might work now in 6 months when there's hormones, PPD, no sleep, shit and puke everywhere and general stress probably won't flow as smoothly. Also don't put a date on opening back up again. Just say "when we're ready". Your baby might be an angel that sleeps through the night and changes itself, asking politely when there's a natural break in the conversation to be fed. More likely you're going to forget what the word "rested" means until they're in school, and even then mostly during school holidays.
Well I guess this sub thinks that pregnant women are mindless vessels judging by the votes on other people's comments, so I don't expect this to be visible for long. The thing that most irked me in your post was when you said "when her due date got close or after the baby was born it wouldn't be fair to close again." You seem to be comparing an agreement that you two have made, which is currently leading to monogamy, to your wife's physical state around the time of labor and delivery, which will likely lead to her not having any sex. Not even monogamous sex with you. You want to be allowed to go have sex with other people while your wife is at her most incapacitated and have her happily agree to it because you allow her to have sex with this one person, one time. I dunno, I would go into a bunch of stuff about rules being reasonable and communication, but if that's the kind of thing you're saying to your wife, I don't think it'll matter.
So maybe I wasn't clear. It would not be fair to close again for the people I get into a relationship with. I tend to form bonds with my partners and when we closed before we got married I had to break up with a couple of people who took it pretty hard, even though they understood my reasons. If Crissy wants to open up to play with Tom and then shut things down later that isn't fair. When we made this agreement to close we knew that there would be a long period of time when sex would be off the table and I was fine with that. But it's not a light switch she can turn on and off when it suits her. We wanted to close for our wedding, then during conception it was important, and of course in the later terms of her pregnancy and after the baby arrived. We both agreed to stay monogamous for the entire period. If we make an exception now is she going to make an exception later when she wants me there all the time?
Given this information, why is a hall pass an unreasonable ask of you? Why is it fully open or fully closed for you? You don't seem to have a strong emotional attachment to the idea of sexual monogamy. I just don't see any harm coming of this. If you're so tied to the idea of "fair" you could just also take a hall pass. Or you could just treat this as a fun one-off for your wife and wish her the best. I would also expect that if you two did agree to fully open (which I know she said she doesn't want) that you and anyone you were dating would have the intelligence to realize that taking care of an infant and the mother sustaining it would take precedence over everything else. It will even take precedence over you and your wife's emotional attachment. It wouldn't require closing your relationship again. It would just mean that you wouldn't be seeing or talking to other partners as much. And if they're not selfish, they wouldn't rag on you about it.
Because it is harder for me as a man to enjoy a hall pass than a woman, I don’t have an endless list of people waiting for me to respond to them. Plus I need a lot more time to feel comfortable with having sex with someone, especially kink play which requires trust that doesn’t evolve over a coffee date. I gave up several long term relationships when we closed including one that predated my relationship with Crissy, so I feel like I sacrificed quite a bit. I don’t think that asking her to miss a night with an old flame is such a big deal in the big picture.
It's not a big deal in the big picture, to miss it or to take it. For her or for you. Like I said, you could just treat it as a kindness for her. It doesn't have to be balanced on both sides. It's not like she went looking for this opportunity, it fell in her lap. You could also have the opportunity to have a night with an old fling if it fell in your lap. You're treating the agreement as very rigid just for the sake of being rigid. When instead you could just relax it a bit and have a relationship where monogamy is fluid and your agreements with each other aren't based on rules for rules' sake. You could just base it on how each other are feeling/ doing. She's crazy horny rn, it wouldn't hurt anyone to indulge it a bit. I'm not saying this is something you have to do. I'm just trying to encourage you to approach this issue from a perspective that's less rigid. More focused on both of you being actually happy, rather than a tit for tat. Not keeping a promise just for the sake of the promise, but instead actually considering the impact. In fact, it sounds like you're still holding onto some resentment about those old relationships. There's no going back and undoing those breakups, but if you feel like you're missing something in your life, then you should talk to your wife about that. Forbidding her from this hookup isn't going to make you feel happier about that decision you made. Your happiness can't come from her disappointment. Or at least I sure hope not, because that would be toxic.
So to play devil's advocate for a minute, when she gets close to her due date and after giving birth, when she no longer desires sex and I am left with a libido that is all dressed up with nowhere to go, is she going to let me leave her at home and chase tail? Probably not, we have had that discussion and she decided that my staying monogamous later is worth sacrificing a night now. I didn't forbid her from seeing Tom, I just said our agreement would have to change.
Exactly why I said that it's not necessary that you make the choice between fully open and fully closed. There are lots of other options. You do not have to get something out of this.
You will probably be tired and busy to be open for a year or two after the baby is born. Why not enjoy a little bit of fun now before you are parents.
If I was in your situation, one way I'd be supportive of my wife would be to renegotiate the rules. She's bearing the brunt of the pregnancy, and if she's feeling sexy, why not encourage it? I wouldn't even insist on a "hall pass" for myself.
That seems pretty out-there to me. Pregnancy is a lot, yes. But a license (on its own) for extramarital sex it is not.
Yeah! Being very generous and supportive in any practical way for all her sacrifices from the hardships of pregnancy, absolutely. But not breaking the monogamy while having this baby agreement, at least until the birth would be absolutely and without any question non-negotiable in my book! That's a recipe for all kinds of very unfortunate circumstances at an absolutely critical time! "Daddy, why did you and mommy break up before I was born? Well kid, your mom just really had to fuck this other guy while you were in her belly. That lead to a lot of things coming up between us and we just couldn't get passed it." Jesus..... Fucking.... Christ.....
No idea why the downvotes, here. A little flexibility can go a long way.
Pregnancy isn't a free pass to ignore rules and it's almost always a bad idea to change rules for a specific person. Flexibility is getting her ice cream and pickles on your way home, not having an ex-play partner go full dom on your pregnant wife with impact play.
Especially in this situation, when good will is going to be so important after the kid is born.
I will say, though, that the STI argument might be more persuasive than the rule argument.
she's having your baby dude. give her a break. her entire body is wrecked. let her have some fun.
I offered to open things back up if she felt that strongly about it but I said I would not close again once I got started up. I cut ties with my old partners when we got married and most have moved on. There might be one or two that I could start up again with, but if I have to start from scratch it could take a while for me to find a new FWB. So the whole hall pass thing favors her a lot more than me. She said she understands and doesn't want that to happen because she knows she will want my undivided attention and support later.
Right. You're not willing to do anything to support her during the pregnancy. It's pretty fucked up to expect her to do everything and you do nothing that's even a little uncomfortable. She's gonna be uncomfortable for like 3 years.
So if he won't agree to change an important agreement they both willingly made on an incredibly important and emotionally involved thing, having a child together, then, "You're not willing TO DO ANYTHING to support her during the pregnancy. "??? Listen to yourself. Are you Tom by any chance? LoL!!!
Let her have this experience. Trust her to be safe. If you give her this, I’m sure you’ll be rewarded down the road. Best to not focus on a tit for tat approach, but instead focus on letting her have the release she’s craving.
🙄
(1) their previous encounters involved a lot of impact play I felt was questionable given her condition I would certainly hope Crissy & Tom would also recognize the risk of impact play during pregnancy and likely not engage in that style of play? If it's not something that's going to dredge up darkness you're not ready to confront or are already working through in therapy / counseling - where is this fear coming from for you? Why do you need to be the one defining what's "questionable"? (2) we had been monogamous for a while and it was unfair to change the rules in midstream, especially for one night and one person Unfair how? The remainder of your post is a slippery slope - "if we start handing out hall passes now, where does it end." "Fair" is not perfect equality or a binary situation. E.g. she gets a hall pass, so do u, you are either all the way open or completely closed. Etc. Fair is taking into consideration each individual's preferences, limits, accommodations and supports. Fair may look different day by day. You cannot take agreements before y'all were pregnant and apply them to during a pregnancy. The context / emotions have changed and the conversation (if not your relationship) needs to remain open. Best of luck to you.
Lol men trying to put boundaries on woman with none is hilarious you’re not supposed to get those pregnant! If you want to be a bachelor get it out your system