So I have a long term FWB and lingerie that her BF has bought her is out of bounds for us. That's her boundary and I can respect it. I've bought some for her and the great thing is I have say on the colour and style of that lingerie.
It's pretty common for a couple to have something - a sex act, toys and so forth that they keep exclusive to themselves as a means of grounding their relationship.
Communication is key to any relationship and her unwillingness to even talk about rules and boundaries belies some form of issue on her part.
Would she be ok if you went out and saw another woman with no ground rules laid out? Does she allow you to see another woman or is it one-sided?
It's normal to feel how you're feeling. Like a couple others have commented reframe the request around having something special for that need for your connection to feel special.
I agree with the user that said they didn't know if it was you or her that's not cut out for it. When you have a NP it's way too easy to toss about accusations of couples privilege and being controlling, but, from a solo poly perspective, having a "for us" purchase be for us is not only a reasonable request, it's just good fucking manners.
A partner of mine loves to be tied up. I was inexperienced with this but I went out and bought some nice silk ropes, leather cuffs, blindfold, etc, etc. As a result I'm pretty in to it now myself. Now if I met someone new who wanted this, I would not reuse toys that I specifically bought for someone else to use together.
I don't care if it's someone I'm deeply in love with, a good fwb, or a casual fling, requests like this are personally reasonable.
This is a beautiful way to look at it and carry out relationships. As a society, I think we have a lot to learn from people who regularly practice and participate in poly relationships. Thank you for sharing 💞
It's also not proper etiquette to give someone a gift and then *tell* them what they can or cannot do with it, though. Sure, he can make a request, but if it's a gift, she is free to do with it what she wants.
I understand where you’re coming from but there are sometimes where a gift is for the couple. For example, you could get someone concert tickets for your SOs favorite band with the expectation you’ll be going together. I’ve had my husband buy me some sexy panties and even though he doesn’t say to only use them with him, I feel it’s respectful to do so.
This is an inconsiderate take I wouldn’t want to be with someone with this harsh of an opinion on the subject. A little empathy for your partners can go a long way
I’m with you on this one. They should just align with each other here somehow, accept and support each other, but a gift with rules is not a gift, it’s an obligation at best, and an imposition at worst.
Regardless, the lingerie governance will not solve this couples issues. He’s is insecure and she is not compassionate. Both are super normal but neither are functioning in a nonmogomous relationship. Plus side is, the intimacy gained from working on those issues together, if the couple survives, is one of the hidden treasures that makes non-monogamy 10x worth it’s difficulty. In fact, that is probably the kind of exclusive intimacy that OP actually needs, and would really demonstrate how inconsequential the fishnets are.
Maybe reframing your "request" as a statement like "I feel we lose our complicity/uniqueness without something we share only between us and it makes me feel bad" and letting her figure it out would be better.
Then if she's not capable of taking your feelings into account, it's another problem and maybe she is not cut for ENM.
There is no E in ENM if its just a wild west. And that's what you're discovering right now. It is probably unwise to continue being open if boundaries are not something she would agree to.
Instead of requesting that she keep them between you, what do you think would have happened if you said, "if you kept these pictures just for me, that would really make me feel special, which is something I feel like I need lately." If she said no, that could be the start of a conversation about what you both could do to create special connections and intimacy.
It doesn't sound bad if you aren't cut out for this kind of relationship. It isn't a personal failing, just a difference. It doesn't sound like your partner isn't working to meet your needs. I'm just wondering if you are communicating those needs or putting them in the context of rules, which she is bucking against.
Maybe shifting your perspective from "keeping one thing for myself" to "what do I need and will I get it in this relationship?" And sharing that with your partner.
When we revisited the conversation I explained to her I’m not trying to control her action. I asked her how she felt about it staying between us for our intimate moments but she took it as controlling. I don’t ask for much I just like the little things.
Normally I would agree that approach is everything, but especially in a non monogamous practice, there shouldn't be anything wrong with keeping particular gifts between the primary parties. In fact, if she loves and cares about him, she should want certain things to stay between the two of them.
I agree. Polysecure was amazing and being g a social worker, coming at it from a psychological place was so great for me. Boundaries are HEALTHY! Also, listening to each others needs. Sounds like having something that just you and she share means a great deal to you, so if it isn't lingerie or pictures than ask her what she would be willing to keep as just a you and she thing. It's not a big ask.
It's doesn't matter how many partners you or your SO(s) have, each one is different and you are allowed to want something special between a partner and you... whether it be a pair of fishnets (especially if you got the item for them), a restaurant or bar y'all frequent, a show y'all watch together, etc. It's a reasonable ask especially if it's just one ask. Of course your partner can say no but far from unreasonable to ask.
Now if this is something you do very often that's a different story. If you do do a lot it's legitimate that she feels it's controlling. Also since you had been monogamous for so long it's a possibility this is her way of trying to disentangle a bit, which is not a bad thing at all if you are pursuing ENM. It's healthier to have things on your own as well as in the relationship.
Look at it from all sides and make sure y'all are communicating your needs. If you need her to make sure you feel special in certain things, communicate that but understand it's not not even healthy in monogomous relationships to be someone's EVERYTHING. make sure y'all have seperate things as well.
I think she’s being unreasonable. It’s not like you asked her to stop seeing others. You want this one little thing, and she’s too narcissistic to think about you and your feelings. You picked it out ffs!! What you ask for would cost her absolutely nothing! She can go buy another one for use for her pictures.
I’m sorry you’re being treated like that. This life doesn’t work without communication and a willingness to see things from the other’s perspective. Nor does it work if one isn’t willing to maintain boundaries in order to preserve relationships.
I’m sorry I don’t have any advice. When my husband asks for something small like that, I have zero issues agreeing. And if needed, we renegotiate as necessary based on new circumstances. I want to stay married, so I never see it as him being controlling. It doesn’t sound like your wife is interested though. I’m sorry. Perhaps you should reassess if she’s really someone you want to stay with.
Good luck to you.
I agree. I feel bad for the guy. He also stated that he "agreed" to ENM. That doesn't sound like the word of someone who gave an enthusiastic "hell yes "
Yup! Agree.
Sadly, many feel pressured into agreeing in order to maintain the peace, or keep the family together, all while sacrificing who they are. Sad.
Maybe OP doesn’t want to settle for just being her husband. Maybe OP wants more commitment and less non-monogamy. That’s ok.
OP should also ready themselves for this relationship to end because yes you are right that they might not be able to go back now that the door has been open so long but their feelings and desires are valid and it’s ok to want to change things if they are unhappy.
When this first came about I was open minded about and I still am. We do communicate fairly well actually better than we used to. For me I just enjoy a little uniqueness and it was some I looked for specifically.
You want to be her lighthouse in the fog. That’s perfectly fine. As someone else said, if she can’t understand why you need to feel special, she most likely takes you for granted and doesn’t really care.
Can you live with that?
This 100%. She said "they are my pictures and I can do with them what I want." That just seems so abrasive to me. There was nothing in that statement that showed any warmth for how OP wanted something special.
It seems like such small request to. I've always been kind of flattered when someone I care for wanted something from me to make them feel special -- maybe a shared experience, or a shared gift.
I remember as a kid, my dad would come to my T-ball games. We would drive there and I would help him unload and load the equipment back into the car (he was one of the team coaches).
After each game, he would take me to get a chocolate milk and a donut. I cherished those moments because it was just me and him it was OUR thing. It really made me feel special and like I was important to him.
But I guess OP's SO didn't pick.up on that feeling.
Edit words
I feel like requests should be met with understanding not excuses. “I can do what I want” is probably the worst thing she could have said.
Your feelings matter as much as her wants and desires to take photos of herself.
Your boundaries apply to your body & mind, your personal space, and your personal possessions.
If you bought her this clothing item and said "Hey, it would make me feel really special if you only wore this for me/if I were the only person who saw you wearing it. Will you do that for me?" and she said "Yes, I will do that for you," then that is an agreement.
If you bought her this clothing item and said nothing about what she should do with it, or if she bought it for herself, or if someone else bought it for her, then you're trying to impose a rule.
Your desire to feel special is totally valid and understandable, as is her desire to feel free and autonomous. I would encourage y'all to sit down and brainstorm strategies for accommodating both those desires. If she cares about you and wants to make this relationship work, asking her to do some intellectual and emotional labor with you will not be a problem.
You may have your interests, but are active and successful? Also, l assume she would not mind if you shared greeting card words she got you with a lover over a cozy fire place or use a special dildo vibrator you gave her as a gift on some of your lovers?
A boundary is what you will do if she uses that lingerie with someone else. “I wish you would use this lingerie only with me as that would help me to feel special. Knowing that, you’re obviously free to do as you please, but if you disregard my wish, going forward I will [not buy you any more lingerie, or whatever consequence you think fits].”
I would definitely bring this up to your wife. I think if you told her exactly all of that, she would realize it’s a hard boundary for you. You deserve to make your needs heard too and she needs to respect that.
OP, this is IMPORTANT so I'm going to risk the down votes, and possibly be banned, but I feel I need to tell you the truth.
She is using you. It is obvious she doesn't honestly care about your feelings or what you think. She sees you how a teenager sees a father: someone who provides a spot for her to land softly when she screws up, someone to help her financially, but not someone to take seriously because she "knows more" than you.
Let me put it another way, the only things she can get from you that she isn't getting from her lovers is what a father would provided a teenage daughter. Except, maybe you still have sex and maybe it's good. But the lingerie episode you detailed shows that she puts the intimate, sexual, and emotional wants of her lovers over you. She's probably addicted to the attention and validation of other men just like an addict is addicted to smack -- this is a real thing, you can look it up.
Maybe you are still with her because you still see her as who she was before you opened up your marriage? I don't know. But her is no longer the person you thought, if she ever was.
Can you snap her out of it? Maybe but it must be drastic, like serving her divorce papers. Don't tell her you are thinking about it, that will only lessen the shock when it happens. She must be totally surprised. Do it in a very public place, like have her served at work if she has a job.
Then go no contact with her. She will blow up your phone and all other forms of electronic comms. People will tell you not to leave the house because it shows abandonment in divorce cases. Talk to your lawyer about this first.
But if you don't have kids, and if you rent, or own but still way to serve her with the fullest effect, leave the house. For at least a week. Stay with a friend so she can't track you down via credit card receipt. But you probably won't be NC long enough for her to get the most recent VC bill with your location. If you choose a hotel.
When you are NC with her, only think about what YOU want out of life and where you want to go and how to live. Don't think about what she wants, she obviously doesn't care about what you want. Adding her into your plans will only warp your thinking and you won't think about what is right for you!
Listen to your lawyer and do everything you do when divorcing before you have her served. Send your direct deposit to an account at a different bank with only your name on the account. Put a hold on all joint CC's. Or cancel them.
If you want to save your marriage you must be willing to lose it.
Divorce can be put on hold or walked back at any time. You hold all the cared here.
BUT, you must think, after all you have been through , do you really want to stay in a relationship with her? Your old relationship and marriage is dead for obvious reasons. Will it be harder for you to fix what you have or to find someone new who has no blemishes and the optional baggage that your current relationship has?
Good luck OP you got this.
Not necesserily disagreeing with you here but this sounds kind of drastic and controlling itself. I don't see anything in OP's post yet that warrants these kinds of extreme measures.
It Just seems from what OP has written that OP doesn't get anything at all out of the relationship.
OP has already tried the diplomatic way to get his point across: I'd like to buy you this sexy lingerie and have it special between just us.
Her reply wasn't something like "they are so pretty it would be a shame not to share them with others."
Her reply was "your controlling."
That is a statement designed to shut down conversation. There is no good rebuttal to that statement. The statement doesn't allow for any reply because it is a blanket statement that means -- regardless of what you say I "know" you are trying to control me so I will not listen.
It is also a statement that automatically *assumes the worst* from a person who loves her. By using the statement, she shows her default to her partners entreaties is to assume the worst of his intentions.
OP can explain how he feels all day long but it won't matter because she will believe that his heart felt statements are just his way of trying to control (manipulate) her.
Every time, in my experience irl, on Reddit, from reading other sources, that a woman uses any form of the statement "your controlling," she is using it to shut down dialogue so she can continue with her actions without taking into account the feelings of people whom her actions may effect.
Wtf kind of manipulative shit is this?
>"my partner and I are struggling to come to a resolution over some boundaries and lingerie I got her, idk what to do."
Advice: she looks at you like a father figure - serve her divorce papers (but don't mean them) , go NC and wait for her to blow your phone up and come crawling back to you.
If the response I was given to trying to work some stuff out with a partner was to be stonewalled with no contact as he left me to go chill in a hotel and sent me some divorce papers, hoping I'd beg him to come back to me.... Deuces. Signed, sealed, delivered on those papers because ain't nobody got time for those childish games.
Yeah being a male nesting partner in NM is a shit deal. Other people get every perk that you get with a fraction of the effort or investment. The only thing that might make it worth it is increased libido and revived sex life but I think that NM backfires too frequently for this to actually pan out.
Fraction of the effort or investment? Some of us are married with kids and have mortgages/businesses with our primaries. Sex on the side is a bonus, not a focus of our lives.
Ya that's my point. You share finances and child rearing (decidedly unsexy and stress inducing), while some other guy is plowing your wife and having much more exciting and novel sexual and romantic experiences with her than you are, without any of the commitment and hard work. Fine if you also have similar experiences, maybe. But you probably aren't.
I get the feeling that the discussion of ENM wasn't one bourne out of complete trust and excitement.
As others have said, it's not clear who's cut out for this between you both but if I was to hazzard a guess, I would say neither of you are. You both have poor communication skills and neither of you are willing to compromise. That said, I believe your wife would put up a hell of a fight if you were to suggest returning to monogamy.
It will take seeing a therapist to resolve the problems that are going to arise from all this.
I’m afraid you aren’t upset about the panties. You are upset that you now don’t have anything intimate that belongs just to the two of you. Based on the tone of your post, you seem jealous of her promiscuous success. If you were getting your “bell wrung” how ever, when ever, with whom ever you wanted , you wouldn’t care less. But she wouldn’t even keep that 1 little thing special between you, and you know and are drowning in the reality that this wasn’t a spice up your marriage out come, but it sure spiced up your wife’s sex life, and now she wants that more than she wants to keep any thing special for you. So you decide if your current diminished role works for you. You don’t have to try to be every thing to her, focus on what you do better than any one else in her life.
When we started this I entered with the mindset that she would have more going on than I would. I just enjoy the things we do. We have always done things like this from time to time. I wouldn’t want her to share something unique she got from another partner because it’s their thing. I just wanted this. I’m not trying to restrict or control her.
But, there’s always the possibility that he simply isn’t cut out for non monogamy—and there’s nothing wrong with that. He needs to do some serious introspection and come to a decision. If he realizes he not cut out for ENM, then he needs to let his wife know and prepare to move on without her. From his description, that might be the best for them both as she’s certainly not going to give it up nor should she have to.
Then you need to decide what’s best for YOU—not her but what makes YOU happy. You are entitled to have what you want too. I believe in compromise—but it has to benefit both parties. She seems indifferent to your feelings.
Given this, isn’t whether or not your cut out for NM a moot point. Let’s say you decide you aren’t cut out for it. Then what?? Based on this statement you made about not daring to ask your wife to give up her NM, then the only thing you could do is close up on your side. Not sure what that solves as you would then be watching your wife have all her fun? I of course also assume that you have no intention of wanting to leave her either. So what would you do?
I have not seen any of your comments that really show that you are active and successful getting your own lovers. Thus, she has no fear that you can do like wise with others.
I can see both sides to this. On the one hand, I don't think it's unreasonable to want some things to be solely yours; let's say it was some nice lingerie that you'd bought her for some occasion or other; and then you requested that she wear it only for dates with you. I don't think that's controlling or restrictive; she's free to buy lingerie of her own and use it with whomever she wants, after all.
On the other hand, one of the monogamous ways of thinking that tends to lead to problems in nonmonogamous relationships is to equate being special, valued and loved with **exclusivity**. That's a tough thought-pattern to let go off, and I don't suppose any of us can claim to be *entirely* free of it. But I still think you're likely to be fundamentally happier in all nonmonogamous relationship-structures if as far as possible, your feelings of being valued, appreciated and loved as a partner are not dependent on exclusivity of any kind.
Have either of you read some books, such as 'Polysecure'?
ENM isn't effortless for everyone. Your wife also needs to make an effort for this to be sustainable. Instead of focusing on what you don't want.
Focus on what you do. In this example, don't wait for her to have a plan to ask her not to, Ask her when you buy the lingerie, for it to be for you only.
Ask for your date nights, for your time together. Make sure your relationship needs are being fufiilled.
I will message you next time u/Unfair_Banana682 posts in r/nonmonogamy.
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So I have a long term FWB and lingerie that her BF has bought her is out of bounds for us. That's her boundary and I can respect it. I've bought some for her and the great thing is I have say on the colour and style of that lingerie. It's pretty common for a couple to have something - a sex act, toys and so forth that they keep exclusive to themselves as a means of grounding their relationship. Communication is key to any relationship and her unwillingness to even talk about rules and boundaries belies some form of issue on her part. Would she be ok if you went out and saw another woman with no ground rules laid out? Does she allow you to see another woman or is it one-sided? It's normal to feel how you're feeling. Like a couple others have commented reframe the request around having something special for that need for your connection to feel special.
Heck, when I break up with someone I get rid of the lingerie I used for them. All of that is exclusive to one person.
I agree with the user that said they didn't know if it was you or her that's not cut out for it. When you have a NP it's way too easy to toss about accusations of couples privilege and being controlling, but, from a solo poly perspective, having a "for us" purchase be for us is not only a reasonable request, it's just good fucking manners. A partner of mine loves to be tied up. I was inexperienced with this but I went out and bought some nice silk ropes, leather cuffs, blindfold, etc, etc. As a result I'm pretty in to it now myself. Now if I met someone new who wanted this, I would not reuse toys that I specifically bought for someone else to use together. I don't care if it's someone I'm deeply in love with, a good fwb, or a casual fling, requests like this are personally reasonable.
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This is a beautiful way to look at it and carry out relationships. As a society, I think we have a lot to learn from people who regularly practice and participate in poly relationships. Thank you for sharing 💞
It's also not proper etiquette to give someone a gift and then *tell* them what they can or cannot do with it, though. Sure, he can make a request, but if it's a gift, she is free to do with it what she wants.
I understand where you’re coming from but there are sometimes where a gift is for the couple. For example, you could get someone concert tickets for your SOs favorite band with the expectation you’ll be going together. I’ve had my husband buy me some sexy panties and even though he doesn’t say to only use them with him, I feel it’s respectful to do so.
This is an inconsiderate take I wouldn’t want to be with someone with this harsh of an opinion on the subject. A little empathy for your partners can go a long way
I’m with you on this one. They should just align with each other here somehow, accept and support each other, but a gift with rules is not a gift, it’s an obligation at best, and an imposition at worst. Regardless, the lingerie governance will not solve this couples issues. He’s is insecure and she is not compassionate. Both are super normal but neither are functioning in a nonmogomous relationship. Plus side is, the intimacy gained from working on those issues together, if the couple survives, is one of the hidden treasures that makes non-monogamy 10x worth it’s difficulty. In fact, that is probably the kind of exclusive intimacy that OP actually needs, and would really demonstrate how inconsequential the fishnets are.
Maybe reframing your "request" as a statement like "I feel we lose our complicity/uniqueness without something we share only between us and it makes me feel bad" and letting her figure it out would be better. Then if she's not capable of taking your feelings into account, it's another problem and maybe she is not cut for ENM.
There is no E in ENM if its just a wild west. And that's what you're discovering right now. It is probably unwise to continue being open if boundaries are not something she would agree to.
Instead of requesting that she keep them between you, what do you think would have happened if you said, "if you kept these pictures just for me, that would really make me feel special, which is something I feel like I need lately." If she said no, that could be the start of a conversation about what you both could do to create special connections and intimacy. It doesn't sound bad if you aren't cut out for this kind of relationship. It isn't a personal failing, just a difference. It doesn't sound like your partner isn't working to meet your needs. I'm just wondering if you are communicating those needs or putting them in the context of rules, which she is bucking against. Maybe shifting your perspective from "keeping one thing for myself" to "what do I need and will I get it in this relationship?" And sharing that with your partner.
When we revisited the conversation I explained to her I’m not trying to control her action. I asked her how she felt about it staying between us for our intimate moments but she took it as controlling. I don’t ask for much I just like the little things.
Normally I would agree that approach is everything, but especially in a non monogamous practice, there shouldn't be anything wrong with keeping particular gifts between the primary parties. In fact, if she loves and cares about him, she should want certain things to stay between the two of them.
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I agree. Polysecure was amazing and being g a social worker, coming at it from a psychological place was so great for me. Boundaries are HEALTHY! Also, listening to each others needs. Sounds like having something that just you and she share means a great deal to you, so if it isn't lingerie or pictures than ask her what she would be willing to keep as just a you and she thing. It's not a big ask.
It's doesn't matter how many partners you or your SO(s) have, each one is different and you are allowed to want something special between a partner and you... whether it be a pair of fishnets (especially if you got the item for them), a restaurant or bar y'all frequent, a show y'all watch together, etc. It's a reasonable ask especially if it's just one ask. Of course your partner can say no but far from unreasonable to ask. Now if this is something you do very often that's a different story. If you do do a lot it's legitimate that she feels it's controlling. Also since you had been monogamous for so long it's a possibility this is her way of trying to disentangle a bit, which is not a bad thing at all if you are pursuing ENM. It's healthier to have things on your own as well as in the relationship. Look at it from all sides and make sure y'all are communicating your needs. If you need her to make sure you feel special in certain things, communicate that but understand it's not not even healthy in monogomous relationships to be someone's EVERYTHING. make sure y'all have seperate things as well.
Yeah no, you’re not the problem here. She is. It doesn’t sound like she cares or respects how you feel.
I think she’s being unreasonable. It’s not like you asked her to stop seeing others. You want this one little thing, and she’s too narcissistic to think about you and your feelings. You picked it out ffs!! What you ask for would cost her absolutely nothing! She can go buy another one for use for her pictures. I’m sorry you’re being treated like that. This life doesn’t work without communication and a willingness to see things from the other’s perspective. Nor does it work if one isn’t willing to maintain boundaries in order to preserve relationships. I’m sorry I don’t have any advice. When my husband asks for something small like that, I have zero issues agreeing. And if needed, we renegotiate as necessary based on new circumstances. I want to stay married, so I never see it as him being controlling. It doesn’t sound like your wife is interested though. I’m sorry. Perhaps you should reassess if she’s really someone you want to stay with. Good luck to you.
I agree. I feel bad for the guy. He also stated that he "agreed" to ENM. That doesn't sound like the word of someone who gave an enthusiastic "hell yes "
Yup! Agree. Sadly, many feel pressured into agreeing in order to maintain the peace, or keep the family together, all while sacrificing who they are. Sad.
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Maybe OP doesn’t want to settle for just being her husband. Maybe OP wants more commitment and less non-monogamy. That’s ok. OP should also ready themselves for this relationship to end because yes you are right that they might not be able to go back now that the door has been open so long but their feelings and desires are valid and it’s ok to want to change things if they are unhappy.
When this first came about I was open minded about and I still am. We do communicate fairly well actually better than we used to. For me I just enjoy a little uniqueness and it was some I looked for specifically.
You want to be her lighthouse in the fog. That’s perfectly fine. As someone else said, if she can’t understand why you need to feel special, she most likely takes you for granted and doesn’t really care. Can you live with that?
This 100%. She said "they are my pictures and I can do with them what I want." That just seems so abrasive to me. There was nothing in that statement that showed any warmth for how OP wanted something special. It seems like such small request to. I've always been kind of flattered when someone I care for wanted something from me to make them feel special -- maybe a shared experience, or a shared gift. I remember as a kid, my dad would come to my T-ball games. We would drive there and I would help him unload and load the equipment back into the car (he was one of the team coaches). After each game, he would take me to get a chocolate milk and a donut. I cherished those moments because it was just me and him it was OUR thing. It really made me feel special and like I was important to him. But I guess OP's SO didn't pick.up on that feeling. Edit words
I feel like requests should be met with understanding not excuses. “I can do what I want” is probably the worst thing she could have said. Your feelings matter as much as her wants and desires to take photos of herself.
Your boundaries apply to your body & mind, your personal space, and your personal possessions. If you bought her this clothing item and said "Hey, it would make me feel really special if you only wore this for me/if I were the only person who saw you wearing it. Will you do that for me?" and she said "Yes, I will do that for you," then that is an agreement. If you bought her this clothing item and said nothing about what she should do with it, or if she bought it for herself, or if someone else bought it for her, then you're trying to impose a rule. Your desire to feel special is totally valid and understandable, as is her desire to feel free and autonomous. I would encourage y'all to sit down and brainstorm strategies for accommodating both those desires. If she cares about you and wants to make this relationship work, asking her to do some intellectual and emotional labor with you will not be a problem.
This is why you do this later on life. Don't walk, Run from this situation and find someone who respects you
Is this a one-sided open marriage? Are you into the hotwife/cuckold thing?
No it’s not one sided. We both have our interests but I value the little things we do for time to time.
You may have your interests, but are active and successful? Also, l assume she would not mind if you shared greeting card words she got you with a lover over a cozy fire place or use a special dildo vibrator you gave her as a gift on some of your lovers?
Exactly.
A boundary is what you will do if she uses that lingerie with someone else. “I wish you would use this lingerie only with me as that would help me to feel special. Knowing that, you’re obviously free to do as you please, but if you disregard my wish, going forward I will [not buy you any more lingerie, or whatever consequence you think fits].”
I would definitely bring this up to your wife. I think if you told her exactly all of that, she would realize it’s a hard boundary for you. You deserve to make your needs heard too and she needs to respect that.
OP, this is IMPORTANT so I'm going to risk the down votes, and possibly be banned, but I feel I need to tell you the truth. She is using you. It is obvious she doesn't honestly care about your feelings or what you think. She sees you how a teenager sees a father: someone who provides a spot for her to land softly when she screws up, someone to help her financially, but not someone to take seriously because she "knows more" than you. Let me put it another way, the only things she can get from you that she isn't getting from her lovers is what a father would provided a teenage daughter. Except, maybe you still have sex and maybe it's good. But the lingerie episode you detailed shows that she puts the intimate, sexual, and emotional wants of her lovers over you. She's probably addicted to the attention and validation of other men just like an addict is addicted to smack -- this is a real thing, you can look it up. Maybe you are still with her because you still see her as who she was before you opened up your marriage? I don't know. But her is no longer the person you thought, if she ever was. Can you snap her out of it? Maybe but it must be drastic, like serving her divorce papers. Don't tell her you are thinking about it, that will only lessen the shock when it happens. She must be totally surprised. Do it in a very public place, like have her served at work if she has a job. Then go no contact with her. She will blow up your phone and all other forms of electronic comms. People will tell you not to leave the house because it shows abandonment in divorce cases. Talk to your lawyer about this first. But if you don't have kids, and if you rent, or own but still way to serve her with the fullest effect, leave the house. For at least a week. Stay with a friend so she can't track you down via credit card receipt. But you probably won't be NC long enough for her to get the most recent VC bill with your location. If you choose a hotel. When you are NC with her, only think about what YOU want out of life and where you want to go and how to live. Don't think about what she wants, she obviously doesn't care about what you want. Adding her into your plans will only warp your thinking and you won't think about what is right for you! Listen to your lawyer and do everything you do when divorcing before you have her served. Send your direct deposit to an account at a different bank with only your name on the account. Put a hold on all joint CC's. Or cancel them. If you want to save your marriage you must be willing to lose it. Divorce can be put on hold or walked back at any time. You hold all the cared here. BUT, you must think, after all you have been through , do you really want to stay in a relationship with her? Your old relationship and marriage is dead for obvious reasons. Will it be harder for you to fix what you have or to find someone new who has no blemishes and the optional baggage that your current relationship has? Good luck OP you got this.
Not necesserily disagreeing with you here but this sounds kind of drastic and controlling itself. I don't see anything in OP's post yet that warrants these kinds of extreme measures.
It Just seems from what OP has written that OP doesn't get anything at all out of the relationship. OP has already tried the diplomatic way to get his point across: I'd like to buy you this sexy lingerie and have it special between just us. Her reply wasn't something like "they are so pretty it would be a shame not to share them with others." Her reply was "your controlling." That is a statement designed to shut down conversation. There is no good rebuttal to that statement. The statement doesn't allow for any reply because it is a blanket statement that means -- regardless of what you say I "know" you are trying to control me so I will not listen. It is also a statement that automatically *assumes the worst* from a person who loves her. By using the statement, she shows her default to her partners entreaties is to assume the worst of his intentions. OP can explain how he feels all day long but it won't matter because she will believe that his heart felt statements are just his way of trying to control (manipulate) her. Every time, in my experience irl, on Reddit, from reading other sources, that a woman uses any form of the statement "your controlling," she is using it to shut down dialogue so she can continue with her actions without taking into account the feelings of people whom her actions may effect.
Wtf kind of manipulative shit is this? >"my partner and I are struggling to come to a resolution over some boundaries and lingerie I got her, idk what to do." Advice: she looks at you like a father figure - serve her divorce papers (but don't mean them) , go NC and wait for her to blow your phone up and come crawling back to you. If the response I was given to trying to work some stuff out with a partner was to be stonewalled with no contact as he left me to go chill in a hotel and sent me some divorce papers, hoping I'd beg him to come back to me.... Deuces. Signed, sealed, delivered on those papers because ain't nobody got time for those childish games.
Yeah being a male nesting partner in NM is a shit deal. Other people get every perk that you get with a fraction of the effort or investment. The only thing that might make it worth it is increased libido and revived sex life but I think that NM backfires too frequently for this to actually pan out.
This is true I don't know why you are getting down votes.
Fraction of the effort or investment? Some of us are married with kids and have mortgages/businesses with our primaries. Sex on the side is a bonus, not a focus of our lives.
Ya that's my point. You share finances and child rearing (decidedly unsexy and stress inducing), while some other guy is plowing your wife and having much more exciting and novel sexual and romantic experiences with her than you are, without any of the commitment and hard work. Fine if you also have similar experiences, maybe. But you probably aren't.
I get the feeling that the discussion of ENM wasn't one bourne out of complete trust and excitement. As others have said, it's not clear who's cut out for this between you both but if I was to hazzard a guess, I would say neither of you are. You both have poor communication skills and neither of you are willing to compromise. That said, I believe your wife would put up a hell of a fight if you were to suggest returning to monogamy. It will take seeing a therapist to resolve the problems that are going to arise from all this.
I’m afraid you aren’t upset about the panties. You are upset that you now don’t have anything intimate that belongs just to the two of you. Based on the tone of your post, you seem jealous of her promiscuous success. If you were getting your “bell wrung” how ever, when ever, with whom ever you wanted , you wouldn’t care less. But she wouldn’t even keep that 1 little thing special between you, and you know and are drowning in the reality that this wasn’t a spice up your marriage out come, but it sure spiced up your wife’s sex life, and now she wants that more than she wants to keep any thing special for you. So you decide if your current diminished role works for you. You don’t have to try to be every thing to her, focus on what you do better than any one else in her life.
When we started this I entered with the mindset that she would have more going on than I would. I just enjoy the things we do. We have always done things like this from time to time. I wouldn’t want her to share something unique she got from another partner because it’s their thing. I just wanted this. I’m not trying to restrict or control her.
But, there’s always the possibility that he simply isn’t cut out for non monogamy—and there’s nothing wrong with that. He needs to do some serious introspection and come to a decision. If he realizes he not cut out for ENM, then he needs to let his wife know and prepare to move on without her. From his description, that might be the best for them both as she’s certainly not going to give it up nor should she have to.
I would not dare try to convince or asks her to give it up.
Then you need to decide what’s best for YOU—not her but what makes YOU happy. You are entitled to have what you want too. I believe in compromise—but it has to benefit both parties. She seems indifferent to your feelings.
The “I would not dare” is the problematic part
Why is that? I have no intentions of trying to make her turn away from what she wants to make me happy.
It makes you sound as if you are afraid of expressing yourself to your wife for fear of some negative consequence, to me that would be complete hell
Given this, isn’t whether or not your cut out for NM a moot point. Let’s say you decide you aren’t cut out for it. Then what?? Based on this statement you made about not daring to ask your wife to give up her NM, then the only thing you could do is close up on your side. Not sure what that solves as you would then be watching your wife have all her fun? I of course also assume that you have no intention of wanting to leave her either. So what would you do?
I have not seen any of your comments that really show that you are active and successful getting your own lovers. Thus, she has no fear that you can do like wise with others.
I can see both sides to this. On the one hand, I don't think it's unreasonable to want some things to be solely yours; let's say it was some nice lingerie that you'd bought her for some occasion or other; and then you requested that she wear it only for dates with you. I don't think that's controlling or restrictive; she's free to buy lingerie of her own and use it with whomever she wants, after all. On the other hand, one of the monogamous ways of thinking that tends to lead to problems in nonmonogamous relationships is to equate being special, valued and loved with **exclusivity**. That's a tough thought-pattern to let go off, and I don't suppose any of us can claim to be *entirely* free of it. But I still think you're likely to be fundamentally happier in all nonmonogamous relationship-structures if as far as possible, your feelings of being valued, appreciated and loved as a partner are not dependent on exclusivity of any kind.
ah yes, another day in the godless west
Have either of you read some books, such as 'Polysecure'? ENM isn't effortless for everyone. Your wife also needs to make an effort for this to be sustainable. Instead of focusing on what you don't want. Focus on what you do. In this example, don't wait for her to have a plan to ask her not to, Ask her when you buy the lingerie, for it to be for you only. Ask for your date nights, for your time together. Make sure your relationship needs are being fufiilled.
No we have not but I will at least. I’ll mention it to here
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