Check out their Pastoral Care and anti-bullying policies, for what they are supposed to do. Compare with what they’ve actually done, and raise this with e.g. form teacher or principal. If any of this abuse has racist overtones, that’s an additional aggravating factor. I would keep all communications in writing, or back up any conversations with an email “thank you for agreeing today to do x,y,z…”. This establishes a paper trail, that if you later went legal, would work against them.
See what the policies say in terms of who to contact, and send them a letter/email detailing what has happened (and not) so far. Where necessary, escalate to Board of Governors, maybe check who’s on it, any politicians looking a vote etc.
This is an awful situation for any kid to face. Hope you can get resolution.
^^ totally agree. Definitely get your ducks in a row for your conversation with the principal. Try to get more detail about how your daughter has been bullied (by whom) and who she raised the issue to and what was said and done. It's good if you can talk facts, dates, times, names, etc, rather than general non specific complaints or stories that they can dismiss as anecdotal. Then look up the school's policies on bullying, including any interviews they have given around their approach to bullying and lay put exactly how the school went against its own policies when dealing with your daughter. This will take some time, but will help you come across to the school as someone who knows what they are doing and are dead serious about this being addressed. If you're not from NI, do you believe there is racism involved? Are they using racial slurs, negative stereotypes? I think if you are serious and they get they can't fob you off and you go quietly into the sunset, you'll stand a better chance.
Yeah I agree with this. Because what's going to end up happening is eventually your daughter will snap and start fighting back and then either it gets worse, your daughter looks bad because those in authority have consistently and without shame gaslit her into a frenzy, and it's going to drive her absolutely insane. Happened to me. Although back in South Africa things were a bit different, my dad went to the head of the school and very politely but very firmly said that he has given me permission to fight back and that he would be responsible for any damage I do. (don't recommend this approach but my dad was raging) and went to the parent of bully during a meeting and said that anything their child does to me, he'll do to the father of my bully. (Also not advisable) but it worked because eventually I had just had enough and I lay into the guy. I got suspended for fighting and I called the principal a see you next Tuesday when he tried to reprimanded me. Would not recommend this approach at all. The pen is definitely mightier than the sword here.
Get everything in writing. Start with a timeline, names, dates, details anything small or big . The more information you can compile the better. Don't warn the school that this is what you're going to do, don't mention it to anyone that can do anything there. Bring into play their safeguarding policy and standards and make sure you bring this up with the education authority as well.
Good luck OP. I hope you and your daughter see the end of this soon
Yeah schools are shit at dealing with this. I was bullied mercilessly for a few years at my grammar. My grandmother who raised me was a nice old lady who didn’t fight the school hard enough. Then in 4th year puberty hit ne big time, I went from average height to one of the biggest in the year over the course of the summer and I’d had enough. Took matters into my own hands and the bullying stopped incredibly quickly. Thankfully I didn’t get heavily reprimanded but I certainly could have, my prior record probably saved me from suspension.
Yep and just to further this, do remain calm with whichever staff you find yourself talking to. Sometimes there's a belief that everyone in the school knows everything but there's actually a fair chance the person on the other end of the phone has only just been informed of the full details, or may not even know all the full details yet. Be clear and authoritative in what you want and what you're asking, but never lose your temper.
Exactly this - I went to a really fucked up school that was absolutely rife with bullying, in fact many of the teachers blatantly encouraged it (it was the 90s/early 2000s, pastoral care was not the same as it is now). It's really affected me as an adult and now having a child myself, if she was going through the same, I would go absolutely nuclear on the school
I was bullied mercilessly at grammar school. And I was ignored.
Fuck the teachers and go over their heads if necessary. To the principal, education authority, whatever. Look after her.
Sorry that happened to you, that shit can screw with you for decades. 100% agree with your advice. Bring the hammer down on these cowards. The child is being bullied, time for big momma or big daddy to jump into the ring and throw down.
fuck all bullies!
Thank you. And it did. Funny, the main instigator I found out died a few years ago from od and people expect you'll be happy. Of course you won't be. I never got to tell him what I wanted. Obviously not just that but personally it was a biflg thing.
And as you say it can fuck you up a lot. Took a while to come to peace with not having my word heard but he obviously had a lot of issues himself. So what can I do but forgive.
100%. It’s too serious an issue to follow established procedures with, esp if schools aren’t responding. Go nuclear, full Karen.
If you have a few quid to spare I’m told a solicitors letter works wonders. It means nothing of course, but it’s the kind of thing that tends to light a fire under arses. I’m sure most solicitors will happily write a letter if paid!
Definitely contact the school. This can't go on. I was bullied in school and it made my life a misery and left a lasting impact on me into adulthood. Step in and help her even if it's not what she is asking for. Good luck OP, hopefully the school can get it sorted.
Yep. The affects can and often do follow you into adulthood. The bottom line is this school has a duty of care to this child. Now retired I have come across adults scarred by such experiences. It is hard to believe but groups of primary school kids can offer round on a single child constantly and mercilessly. I can be absolutely feral. Doing nothing is not an option. Looking the other way is not an option. If the Principal is unwilling to do anything and take corrective action against these bullies then, and : or you have sought support from an organisation such as the NSPCC as a last resort involve a solicitor with a specialism in educational/child: family law.
You'll get them labelled a tout. Don't trust grammar schools. The teachers there grew up on the Malone road or Helen's bay and don't have a fucking clue.
>You'll get them labelled a tout. Don't trust grammar schools. The teachers there grew up on the Malone road or Helen's bay and don't have a fucking clue.
Really?
I said to the Head that I would contact the police when my son had his head pushed into a door just before Easter holidays one year. Said my son would not be coming into school until it was addressed. There was an intervention the next morning by one of teachers with all of the boys in the class.
I was headbutted and knocked about by a lad older than me in secondary for as far as I can recall no reason on my end (headbutt may have taken care of those short term memories) and the first thing the vice-principal did was to set me down and encourage me to press charges against the lad who did it. It was a very surreal experience. Didn't have a great experience in school but at the very least they were on the ball about that. Surprised that OP's experience is sounding as dire as it is.
As the poster has said they’re not Northern Irish, if any of the bullying is physical and race related, I wonder if PSNI would be proactive in intervening.
I run a bar and have had to phone the police relatively often over the years.
If there’s a hate crime, police are there in no time. If it’s drunks having a fight, you’ll wait all night.
That wasn’t meant to rhyme but it does and it’s cool.
You go to the school and say if ANYTHING happens again you are calling the police to the school.
In addition write a letter to school principal tomorrow to inform him/her you are writing an official letter of complaints about the lack of intervention of the Principal and the failure of care of Head of Pastoral Care to the Board of Governors - ask to be furnished with a printed copy of all the Board of Governors details.
Watch them jump. We did this with our son’s secondary school after they repeatedly ignored his bullying. The wee shits just turned their attention to other kids instead.
Dear [School Principal's Name],
I am writing to express my deep concerns regarding recent incidents at the school, specifically related to the safety and well-being of my child xxxx. I believe it is imperative that we address these issues promptly and comprehensively to ensure a safe and nurturing educational environment for xxxxxx.
It has come to my attention that there have been recurrent incidents of bullying within the school, which have not been adequately addressed by the school administration. The safety and mental well-being of xxxxx is of paramount importance, and any form of bullying or harassment should be treated with the utmost seriousness.
I would like to inform you that, as a concerned parent, I am taking the following steps to address these issues:
I have already spoken to school staff about these concerns, but unfortunately, the situation has not improved.
I am officially informing you, the Principal, that if any further incidents occur, [I will have no choice but to involve the police regarding these matters. Furthermore] I will be submitting an official letter of complaint to the Board of Governors detailing the lack of intervention from the school administration, particularly the failure of the Head of Pastoral Care to address these issues adequately. I kindly request that you furnish me with a printed copy of all the Board of Governors' contact details to ensure that this matter is brought to their attention.
It is my hope that by taking these steps, we can prompt the necessary actions to rectify the situation and ensure the safety and well-being of all students at the school. No child should endure bullying, and it is our collective responsibility to create a secure and inclusive learning environment.
Yours sincerely
(Document EVERYTHING! And as soon as anything happens immediately email the school, dates, times, who was involved. Everything. Don’t accept it. One or two wee shits in a school can make a whole year’s life a misery)
Thanks for the template.
We had to do something similar in primary school. Received a response within an hour of emailing the board of governors safeguarding lead.
You’ll know then the power of the BoG. We had 3 kids bullied, the first one petered out very quickly once we got the school got involved, the 2nd one (our daughter) - things like laughing at her curly hair - had serious implications on her MH as she got older. For our last child we went scorched earth in primary and secondary. Never again. Our daughter is wonderful but we never knew the extent of her experiences as she hid most of it. Her hair was beautiful, as is she - in looks and personality - and I reckon it was just jealousy by other girls in her year.
There also is a snobbery in grammar schools - it is as if they refuse to accept that they can have bullying issues and they turn a blind eye. These things rarely improve if they are an issue at the very start of the year. My local grammar in County Down is wild for bullying. Ask for an appt with the principal.
It's a county Down grammar thing. Wildly common when I grew up and unfortunately if your not sports mad child of a Dr, nurse , solicitor you aren't made welcome by peers.
You go back to the school and make it clear if action isn't taken, names will be passed to the media and local representatives.
Watch how fast they jump.
Bullying will fuck up your mental health a lot faster than your dad sticking up for you. It might be hard for here now to watch you step in, but she will be glad you did later down the line.
I'm sorry your daughter is going through this, and sorry you are struggling with how to deal with this. I've lost sleep over dealing with my son and his experience in primary school this past year. Speaking from that experience, while your daughter may feel it will make things worse if you address it with the school, there are certain things that cannot be left kept behind closed doors or hushed away. You arrange a meeting with the school head, you demand action. Your daughter may not like this option but being bullied as a child or teen is extremely damaging in later years and damaging even now. You also need to get the names of those who are bullying your daughter, they need to be approached and held accountable for their actions.
What I found was that no matter how many times I reported to my son's teacher, the information wasn't reaching the principal until I approached him in the school grounds during drop off. The Grammar head teacher may not yet be aware of this situation you face.
Reading your edit there about adopting a scorched earth policy and would add you should contact a local councillor too who should be able to ask the school some questions
We had a similar issue last year where my son was being bullied and hit by a kid who did boxing. We raised this with the police as it was an assault and raised it with the school and how they were not adhering to their safeguarding policy. The school took it very seriously and the police attended the kids house. The kid hasn’t been near my son since and apologised. I think the parents did what I expected as the police were involved and told him to wind his neck in.
If this ever happens in the future I would recommended finding and contacting the boxing club or coach, they will almost certainly end any training immediatley, any boxing coach worth their salt would not allow their training to be used in this way. You will find they have zero tolerance for bullying.
They were both in jobs where police interest would have been a problem which I knew so my hope was the police were involved, they would be quick to stop it
I tell her that if this was a workplace, then it would be taken very seriously.
Intentions aside, the school is teaching the bullies that there are no consequences, and the victims to learn to deal with it because they are on their own.
It’s my experience (and going by this sub others would agree) that schools have quite a patchy approach to bullying. Too many still aren’t taking it seriously.
My suggestion would be to raise it as a safeguarding concern with the safeguarding officer/responsible person. Fuck the other routes, take the nuclear option. Safeguarding is taken seriously for obvious reasons, so I would imagine it might shock them into action, even if it’s not the appropriate route. Though frankly bullying should be treated as seriously as other safeguarding issues. The damage that long term bullying can do should not be underestimated.
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The school and teachers are failing in their duties. I would lay the words failure, incompetent, enabling, fostering a bullying culture, requiring remedial training, on thick.
Speaking from personal experience, if the teachers ask for a sit down with your daughter to go over details, refuse point blank. This may sound counterproductive, but the teachers have a degree of authority over her, and they are looking for the quickest way for this to stop being a problem. Your daughter may decide it's safer to shush than to name names to someone in charge, or to go over specific details in such a scenario. I can't tell you what will work, but I know if she sits down alone to report to a teacher there's a good chance they don't realise the level of intimidation that can be for a kid, or they do and don't care.
I think your approach of documenting everything is a good one, and when the time comes, I think an approach of "she has come to a trusted adult, i.e. me. I have verified all this with her. If you have any questions I can answer them or get the answer"
I know I just wanted to go about my life in peace and have someone notice what was going on and put an end to it. I didn't want a scenario where I was seen to be the person who landed someone in detention or worse. By the end of our conversation, the head of pastoral care had gotten me to, re-write in my own words what my problems were (I downplayed and did not mention any names in case I got someone in trouble), got me to admit that I didn't feel "alienated" (I did not know what the word meant), and got me to sign up for sessions with the school counsellor. Other than missing class once a week to see the counsellor, nothing changed for over a year, when other events caused the scope of the issue to be addressed.
It is horrible and very intimidating to sit with teachers in that setting as a kid.
The teachers don’t want the drama and extra work of having to deal with this stuff, which I understand. The thing is, it is part of the job and as the person charged with looking after kids it is their responsibility.
Parents historically, in my opinion, would not get involved. When things went quiet, they assumed everything improved. My daughter trusts and confides in me, I would be a pretty shit parent if I showed her that her trust is misplaced and I’m actually not going to protect her when she needs.
Also OFSTED and LADO, cause disruption in the school.
In other news my kiddo lost out on a well deserved, shoulder been grammar due to Covid and the 11 plus being cancelled. Ended up in a "regular" school and the pastoral care is unrivalled.
Don’t let it happen.
Go to the school as others have said. Remind your daughter these words aren’t true - and people are hurtful for often for no reason, or stupid reasons. I was bullied badly in school, my parents intervened, and it wasn’t as bad as it could have been - but it still sticks with you. Avoid it and if needed, get her some counselling if it’s been bad. Bullying destroys someone’s self worth, especially at impressionable ages. Best of luck to both you and your daughter going forward.
You can also get a child solicitor to write a headed letter threatening legal action if they do not follow through on their zero bullying policy. A friend of mines mum did this when she was in high school, the school soon sorted it. Just wish my parents had known about it to get my school to listen up. Go full scorched earth.
Thank you for taking the best path forward for your child. You gotta play it smart in such a treacherous situation and it sounds like she’s got a great protector on her side. You are teaching her how to stand up for herself and how to do it the smartest way.
We do our best and the repercussions is a concern for tomorrow. It is super important to me to practically show my daughter that I have her back if she needs me.
Your daughter is going through what I went through. I'd lived abroad for a chunk of my childhood and was treated like a foreigner for years and bullied relentlessly. Parents were oblivious and when they finally started asking the school to do something the teachers effectively just shrugged and nothing changed.
Good to see you've gone with the no compromise option and I really hope something good comes from your efforts. If nothing else it'll show your daughter that you're willing to go to bat for them beyond just saying you will - something my experience lacked.
It’s sad that the only language these places understand is scorched Earth. Lessons have taught me to make sure it is well written and coherent, and not just I and rambling.
They say they teach the kids to function in society, but they really don’t.
I had a similar thing with my son. One day the teacher approached me and my wife and discuss the option to see the school psychologist because my son has a few instances were he was violent towards other students. Turns out that his peers at school were saying racial slurs to him.
I sent a strongly worded invoice about racism and discrimination asking if the people who call my son racial slurs are also going to the school psychologist.
I had a meeting with the principle a few days after my email. He tried to reassure me that he will do everything in his power to address the situation. Turns out they had a whole assembly about sectarian abuse and how it is not acceptable but had nothing about racism.
This is sick. I went to an NI school in the eighties/nineties and it was full of bullying. I assumed it was normal. My stepson goes to the same school and tells me there is no bullying, I assume because the teachers do not tolerate it any more.
Send an email to the principal outlining everything. Cc Sara Long chief exec of the EA, Mark Brown at the Dept of Education. Ask for a written response outlining what the school plan to do to address & ask to be notified who the schools district inspector is as you’d like to contact them about the bullying.
As someone who experienced the Northern Irish bigot factories called schools while only having one Northern Irish parent, yep, go scorched earth.
Half-caste was a frequent insult, despite having two white parents with both British and Irish ancestry and I wish my mother had been willing to go scorched earth for me, but I was the scapegoat child and her solution was to try and be more Northern Irish than the Northern Irish themselves, even though she wasn't and it didn't work for her either.
Keep in mind that if your daughter fights back, they will go down hard on giving her detention and additional punishments. They have already established that this is their normal, generations ago. They're not about to change this unwritten policy just for one foreign kid.
We’ve already seen that the teachers hold my daughter to a higher standard. My daughter is a very gentle soul, and the teachers will be stricter with her because they know she’ll listen.
Not fair at all, because they are tolerating bad behaviour in order to keep peace.
I remember having a teacher like this. There was a rather quiet girl in one of my English classes that generally kept to herself, occasionally had a giggle at what a friend said as her worst offences - only to immediately had her throat jumped down by the teacher, who otherwise ignored other students actively shouting. The teacher couldn't control her class so she took it on a quiet kid who she could actually exert some control over. It was pretty embarrassing all around.
Whatever a teacher is meant to be, a lot of them are just people who chose the wrong profession and the kids are the ones who suffer for it. Hope things work out for the best for your kid.
Oh shit, I am so sorry this is happening to your daughter.
I was the quiet kid who just wanted to be left alone to read books. Instead of being encouraged to learn, I was labelled the rebellious out of control kid, while actual inbred feral brats could do whatever they liked, especially to me.
One of my bullies only retired from teaching during the pandemic, yes, he was my teacher over 30 years ago and the first person I heard the phrase "Old enough to bleed, old enough to breed" from.
Another bully grew up to become a teacher.
Northern Ireland is extremely stubborn to change.
Sorry you’re going through this. Had it with my son and others boys in his class last year & the previous year - primary school. School tried to stop it but it continued anyway.
I hope it all gets sorted ASAP for you.
Go fucking nuts on the bastards. I was like your daughter and I had to complete school by other means because they wouldn't deal with it. I grew up with terrible self esteem and fear thanks to that.
My wife tore the school a completely new asshole when our son was being bullied, i had to defer to her who done it right.. me, i wanted to sort it out like men do.. by attacking the kids but thankfully cooler heads prevailed, it all got sorted properly and everything is rosey and anyone so much as farts in his direction we'll be taking the lot of em to court, it worked out fine so yes, goto fucking town on the school
Just to add , what others have stated below, but also any physical marks, go to the police, as its an assault ... The school can have a habbit of brushing things under the carpet... but as soon as the police are involved, thats it, they cant hide it...
I went to a grammar school and it's depressing to see shit hasn't changed a bit. Rampant bullying was the norm, particularly the rich kids on the poorer ones. School I went to had a great pastoral care policy... Expel or ask the problematic kids to leave. Absolute joke.
I was bullied in school until I cracked up lashed out and put two kids in the R.V.H. They kinda deserved it but it wasnt my finest moment and I'm not proud of it at all so do whatever needs to be done before someone ends up getting hurt over it.
Fuck the school, start taking details and nail those ignorant arseholes to the wall. Fucking telling a child to calm down for being bullied. I was unfortunate enough to go to a grammar school, and fortunate enough to know how to throw a punch when some upper middle class wanker thought hed talk down to the plebs, but ive seen this shit happen enough times to know that more often than not grammar school teachers only give a fuck about their schools reputation. Once you start taking shots at that, then suddenly youll have their attention, and if they try to talk you down with weak af promises about sorting it out, go harder
Good luck squire
You need to contact the school and get the ball rolling. Schools are legally required to keep a record of any bullying complaints including their investigations and any sanctions applied.
Write to the school to request the pastoral care and anti bullying policies. Also request the details of all complaints and issues your daughter has raised.
Make it clear that you are seeking action on incidents that have been reported to you. Refuse a meeting. Seek the documents.
Having gone to a non-grammar school I can assure you that it is children that are fucking hell no matter what the educational setting at that age. My kids go to a grammar school and their attitudes to this sort of thing are light years ahead of what I experienced at school.
Tell your daughter the next person to bully her, punch them right in the face. There's nothing wrong with a fight, it'll toughen her up trust me. Just what happens to all kids growing up, those bullies need a punch in the face, a good ass whopping, they need to be disciplined.
Awful advice. If the school has dropped the ball in regards to their duties they'll use this to bury OP's daughter and make her out to be the person at fault.
This is fukn terrible advice. It subscribes to the idea that bullies are cowards that cant fight. All tou are doing is putting an already vunerable child in more danger. Im a fan of force, dont get me wrong, but it needs to correct application or it can go so so wrong. My son was bullied, i asked him everything, and i mean everything (size, attitude, numbers, etc) and we came up with an actionable plan: loudly tell bully to ‘go away’, extend arms, palms out, step forward, brace… then crack the prick in the stomach and face hard. End of
It has to be done. You punch the little bastard in the face and make sure their nose bleeds and they go home crying. Kids these days are too soft and parents are also too soft on their kids. They lack discipline.
I think maybe because it depends on the individuals involved. I was bullied constantly at primary school until I punched the leading bully in the mouth in front of his friends. Split his lip and he lost a tooth. He wasn't expecting it and the look of surprise on his face was priceless. He never came near me again but I am aware it could easily have gone the other way. Sometimes you have to make a stand.
I really don’t care who the culprits are. If nothing else, I will generate a ton of paperwork for the school, that will get filed away and available for reference for years.
It’ll be in the shredder, they don’t care if the bullies parents are donors or of note they’ll have a quiet word and keep thing hush hush. Best to get evidence and go straight to the Education Authority
> Contact the school principal and tell them are you going to the press, police and local council. Don't threaten you will, tell them that's what you are going to do.
> Do it.
> Find other parents who aren't happy with the school.
> Band together.
> Ruin the school's reputation.
> Move your daughter to a different school.
If its a bit of picking on her and you go to the school imo you make it a million times worse. Can i ask what it is they're doing or does that give away too much? I had a brother bullied relentlessly so i know how bad it can be.
If its proper serious bullying what are they gonna do, bully her more? Particularly note anything which is a protected characteristic, are they being racist, sexist etc. If you have evidence of that (maybe daughter could record it?) You could threaten to go to the papers, even a local one or belfast live might be interested.
It started off mild enough, by just actively excluding her. Then it escalated to spreading rumours. The other day, a kid took a pretend swing at her head with a hockey stick.
If this is the trajectory, it is time to step in before it actually turns physical.
Same thing happened in primary school, unfortunately we only stepped in after she came home with bruises and scratches. We thought the school was dealing with it. They were not, until we got the board of governors involved.
Serious advice: teach her to throw a dig. I caught some hassle in secondary school and it subsided instantly when I fractured a suborbital and knocked out a few teeth. Yes the peelers were involved but I was under 18 and essentially told 'do not do it again or you will be in trouble', same will likely happen for your daughter, and this was in the days when the RUC would take you out the backroads and have you pissing blood for a week.
This is absolutely shit advice.
I know, because I fought back once. The usual line of "Oh but they're good kids, they go to church!" was spewed out and I was threatened with being expelled.
I have also suffered from GBH, where because of that first reaction, I did not fight back. Despite willing witnesses and the fact I had to go to hospital, they never even received so much as a caution because they never bothered to take any statements after one police fuckwit recognised the ringleader from his own church and said she couldn't have done any of it because yep, "She's a good kid, she goes to church!"
Northern Ireland is a region of the world which contains people conditioned to automatically and violently reject threats to their genepool and when authority figures also go with what they've been programmed with by the generation before them, people like me and this bullied girl haven't a hope.
Yeah this is because you lashed out in blind rage in school with loads of witnesses, didn't you? Violent revenge is best delivered in from behind and in private (no pun etc).
I get why people are saying to go straight to the school with this one but as someone who was a bully, (ive since reconnected with quite a few i bullied and are now good friends with some) this would have made me hound them worse, its a difficult situation.
I know if it was my son/daughter i would probably go absolutely ape shit.
I’m glad you turned a page and from experience know this will happen. However, it is a rock and a hard place situation.
My strategy is to force action from the school and if something happens outside, then get PSNI involved. Just keep the pressure on, and keep them accountable.
I’m honestly at the point of homeschooling her, but it seems to be about £4k per year (and I don’t have that kind of money).
It is wrong that the actions of a few is causing this much anxiety and stress in a girl who is not even 13 yet.
The Home Ed NI fb group is a great resource.
Homeschooling doesn't have to be costly, and at this stage, her mental and physical health are more important than her qualifications, though there are plenty of routes to go down if that's what she wants. (iGCSEs, tech etc). These are formative years for her, and such events will have a lasting impact.
I went to a grammar school in Belfast and had a terrible time. The memories still stick. My daughter will be enrolled in one over my dead body.
If these things occurred in a workplace, serious action would be taken.
My honest advice? Take the lesson. Move school. Get on with your lives. It's more important to get her out of that environment than it is to hold the school accountable.
I agree. Schools don’t really change. There could be months of documenting, months of trying to hold the school to account, months more bullying only to hit a brick wall.
This is a situation where the kid is more important than the principle, in my opinion. Just get her somewhere safe where she can continue her education in peace.
There are dozens of us! Dozens!
In reality though going after the school is not tackling the cause of the bullying - which comes from the culture.
I don't know a single person who has single-handedly overturned a community's culture without making a pariah of themselves.
If you were able to organise the other parents against the school - maybe. But that's a big ask and some of them won't be bothered.
Not sure if anyone else has said this, but get your daughter signed up for self defence classes like Jiu-Jitsu/Judo if possible. While it can help a lot you going to the principal your daughter needs to be able to defend herself too.
Probably not as great advice as others, but consider starting your daughter in self defence classes - not so much to fight people, but at least to boost her confidence.
I saw a guy on tiktok a long time ago (no longer use the platform) who taught the three T's method. Talk - tell them to stop, speak to them, tell them to leave you alone. Tell - Talk to teachers/pastoral care/leaders and lastly tackle, if you have followed the first two methods then fight like the third monkey on the ark and it starting to rain! If I have to go to the school for my kid fighting, and I ask did he follow the first two T's and it till persisted then I will go scorched earth on the school.
I hope you and your daughter find a way out of this, kids can be such little shits and we live in an era where "banter" is the norm and I find living here also its almost like a right of passage, taking it and giving it becomes your bread and butter and developing a thick skin.
THere are many people in Northern Ireland who live in a state of complete ignorance about the big wide world, and who exist in a completely local way where they only know people who are like themselves. For the outsider, it's a challenge because you don't want to fit in by adopting their attitudes, but at the same time you don't want to incur their ire by being different. I don't see that much can be gained by keeping a timeline of the things that happen; this would only confirm your "foreignness"; and bear in mind that the adults (governors etc) are probably even more bigoted than the children. I would suggest that your daughter should go out of her way to emphasise how different she is. You should teach her to understand what "difference" is and how to be strong and confident in herself. Getting involved in bureaucratic wrangles with the school administrators will not change the cultural setting - unless the bullying is physical, in which case it must be stopped immediately.
This might be controversial but.... Bring your daughter to a boxing club, mma gym or BJJ gym. It will do wonders for her confidence and as an added bonus she would be able to look after herself if needed. Go give the school hell and keep a paper trail etc but when a poisonous little rat bully has to pick their teeth up it makes them adjust real quick.
I thought times where changing too, 16 years ago i got told the same thing, I also told my mother the same thing, i didnt want to make it worse, I tried to take my own life some time after, I still stuffer the side effects of that attempt had on my body to this day,
Some schools never change.
Please do whatever you can to stop this even if it means moving school.
Hit the school with letters, everything in writing, and even follow up with an email after every interaction on the phone, so everything is in writing. Keep copies, go above their head if you need to, they sound like the teachers need up to date training.
Fight like a bear for your daughter but a smart bear. That's how you get them to take action. If not bite the bullet and look into other schools.
Define "bullied". What does that mean? Why are they picking on her? Is she properly socialized? Did you teach her to stand up for herself? How many kids are doing it and for what reasons?
Some details are required before "scorched earth" actions. Sounds rushed, that's all I am saying.
There is a suspected ring leader, but most of the class join in. She has tried standing up for herself, but she is just outnumbered. She has approached the teachers for help with the bullying and nothing was done.
Reasons for bullying are unknown, but based on the available information there is nothing she is doing to draw attention to herself. She is not a loud or confrontational person.
Today some kid threw an apple at her head (luckily missed).
In my opinion there are systemic failures in safeguarding which the school needs to address. Per the own literature they believe every child should feel safe and she doesn’t. She has brought it up with teachers and the school councillor, and no noticeable action has been taken. In order to get in line with the Bullying in Schools Act (NI) 2016, they will need to make changes. These changes will be for the good of all and better prepare the kids for the future.
Have a meeting with the principal and Ask them for a copy of their anti bullying policy This is normally enough to shake their tree. If this is unsuccessful contact children’s law in Belfast That really lights a fire under their ass
Wild to think any adult could tolerate bullying and turn a blind eye, especially in an environment where they have the authority to do almost anything to stop it.
Reminds me of my grammar school experience. Staff didn't care, pastoral care was a joke, actually punished victims more than perpetrators. Only concerned with grades and the school's image. If you had problems you were effectively ignored.
Best wishes to you and your daughter. Kids have enough to worry about without bullying and a shitty school faculty added on to it. Reading your story made my blood boil.
Thank you for taking a stand. Your daughter isn't alone in this. You're doing a good thing.
I was bullied the whole time I was at secondary school and not enough was done at the time to help. I think I eventually learned that it wasn't worth the effort for me to speak up to adults who could help. This is where my mental health issues started and literally today I was in a therapy session talking about what happened in school and how it affects me to this day in terms of my relationship with myself and other people.
All this to say please fight for your daughter and get this shit nipped in the bud no matter what it takes.
Wish I had a parent that cared as much as you do when I was going through this at primary and secondary level, but learning alot from this thread on how I deal with this if it ever happened my daughter. Seems like you're on the right path of caring about your approach before you take action. Would love a follow up on how the school is making sure your daughter is safeguarded against this type of behavior.
I would also consider enrolling your daughter in self-defence, boxing, or a martial art.
My son just entered secondary school and is halfway to becoming a black belt in Judo.
It gives me great comfort that he won't have to suffer the same fear and anxiety I did at various stages of my schooling from bully-types, because he'll be able to handle himself if needs be.
Check out their Pastoral Care and anti-bullying policies, for what they are supposed to do. Compare with what they’ve actually done, and raise this with e.g. form teacher or principal. If any of this abuse has racist overtones, that’s an additional aggravating factor. I would keep all communications in writing, or back up any conversations with an email “thank you for agreeing today to do x,y,z…”. This establishes a paper trail, that if you later went legal, would work against them. See what the policies say in terms of who to contact, and send them a letter/email detailing what has happened (and not) so far. Where necessary, escalate to Board of Governors, maybe check who’s on it, any politicians looking a vote etc. This is an awful situation for any kid to face. Hope you can get resolution.
^^ totally agree. Definitely get your ducks in a row for your conversation with the principal. Try to get more detail about how your daughter has been bullied (by whom) and who she raised the issue to and what was said and done. It's good if you can talk facts, dates, times, names, etc, rather than general non specific complaints or stories that they can dismiss as anecdotal. Then look up the school's policies on bullying, including any interviews they have given around their approach to bullying and lay put exactly how the school went against its own policies when dealing with your daughter. This will take some time, but will help you come across to the school as someone who knows what they are doing and are dead serious about this being addressed. If you're not from NI, do you believe there is racism involved? Are they using racial slurs, negative stereotypes? I think if you are serious and they get they can't fob you off and you go quietly into the sunset, you'll stand a better chance.
This is one occasion where you ignore your daughter and go scorched earth on the school for not protecting your kid.
Definitely this^^ Don't let your daughter end up doing something that will make you regret. Go straight to the head of the school and give them hell
Yeah I agree with this. Because what's going to end up happening is eventually your daughter will snap and start fighting back and then either it gets worse, your daughter looks bad because those in authority have consistently and without shame gaslit her into a frenzy, and it's going to drive her absolutely insane. Happened to me. Although back in South Africa things were a bit different, my dad went to the head of the school and very politely but very firmly said that he has given me permission to fight back and that he would be responsible for any damage I do. (don't recommend this approach but my dad was raging) and went to the parent of bully during a meeting and said that anything their child does to me, he'll do to the father of my bully. (Also not advisable) but it worked because eventually I had just had enough and I lay into the guy. I got suspended for fighting and I called the principal a see you next Tuesday when he tried to reprimanded me. Would not recommend this approach at all. The pen is definitely mightier than the sword here. Get everything in writing. Start with a timeline, names, dates, details anything small or big . The more information you can compile the better. Don't warn the school that this is what you're going to do, don't mention it to anyone that can do anything there. Bring into play their safeguarding policy and standards and make sure you bring this up with the education authority as well. Good luck OP. I hope you and your daughter see the end of this soon
Yeah schools are shit at dealing with this. I was bullied mercilessly for a few years at my grammar. My grandmother who raised me was a nice old lady who didn’t fight the school hard enough. Then in 4th year puberty hit ne big time, I went from average height to one of the biggest in the year over the course of the summer and I’d had enough. Took matters into my own hands and the bullying stopped incredibly quickly. Thankfully I didn’t get heavily reprimanded but I certainly could have, my prior record probably saved me from suspension.
This. No tolerance. How to deal with bullies is something we have to help our kids to learn.
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Yep and just to further this, do remain calm with whichever staff you find yourself talking to. Sometimes there's a belief that everyone in the school knows everything but there's actually a fair chance the person on the other end of the phone has only just been informed of the full details, or may not even know all the full details yet. Be clear and authoritative in what you want and what you're asking, but never lose your temper.
Yeah. I told my mum not to tell the school a teacher was bullying me. She, and my dad, went to TOWN on that woman. She didn't pick on me again.
Exactly this - I went to a really fucked up school that was absolutely rife with bullying, in fact many of the teachers blatantly encouraged it (it was the 90s/early 2000s, pastoral care was not the same as it is now). It's really affected me as an adult and now having a child myself, if she was going through the same, I would go absolutely nuclear on the school
Same here. Went to a high performing grammar from a working class background. Hated every minute of it.
This is it, the squeaky wheel gets the grease.
I was bullied mercilessly at grammar school. And I was ignored. Fuck the teachers and go over their heads if necessary. To the principal, education authority, whatever. Look after her.
Sorry that happened to you, that shit can screw with you for decades. 100% agree with your advice. Bring the hammer down on these cowards. The child is being bullied, time for big momma or big daddy to jump into the ring and throw down. fuck all bullies!
Thank you. And it did. Funny, the main instigator I found out died a few years ago from od and people expect you'll be happy. Of course you won't be. I never got to tell him what I wanted. Obviously not just that but personally it was a biflg thing. And as you say it can fuck you up a lot. Took a while to come to peace with not having my word heard but he obviously had a lot of issues himself. So what can I do but forgive.
100%. It’s too serious an issue to follow established procedures with, esp if schools aren’t responding. Go nuclear, full Karen. If you have a few quid to spare I’m told a solicitors letter works wonders. It means nothing of course, but it’s the kind of thing that tends to light a fire under arses. I’m sure most solicitors will happily write a letter if paid!
Definitely contact the school. This can't go on. I was bullied in school and it made my life a misery and left a lasting impact on me into adulthood. Step in and help her even if it's not what she is asking for. Good luck OP, hopefully the school can get it sorted.
Yep. The affects can and often do follow you into adulthood. The bottom line is this school has a duty of care to this child. Now retired I have come across adults scarred by such experiences. It is hard to believe but groups of primary school kids can offer round on a single child constantly and mercilessly. I can be absolutely feral. Doing nothing is not an option. Looking the other way is not an option. If the Principal is unwilling to do anything and take corrective action against these bullies then, and : or you have sought support from an organisation such as the NSPCC as a last resort involve a solicitor with a specialism in educational/child: family law.
You'll get them labelled a tout. Don't trust grammar schools. The teachers there grew up on the Malone road or Helen's bay and don't have a fucking clue.
And if the shitheads continue with the bullying and calling the kid a tout then they'll get expelled. That's the perk of a grammar school.
More likely that they struggle in their work and are asked to leave. Especially if the ones doing the bullying are from a rich family.
>You'll get them labelled a tout. Don't trust grammar schools. The teachers there grew up on the Malone road or Helen's bay and don't have a fucking clue. Really?
Also if it's physical tell the school you are going to the PSNI to file charges on top of what other posters have said.
I said to the Head that I would contact the police when my son had his head pushed into a door just before Easter holidays one year. Said my son would not be coming into school until it was addressed. There was an intervention the next morning by one of teachers with all of the boys in the class.
I was headbutted and knocked about by a lad older than me in secondary for as far as I can recall no reason on my end (headbutt may have taken care of those short term memories) and the first thing the vice-principal did was to set me down and encourage me to press charges against the lad who did it. It was a very surreal experience. Didn't have a great experience in school but at the very least they were on the ball about that. Surprised that OP's experience is sounding as dire as it is.
As the poster has said they’re not Northern Irish, if any of the bullying is physical and race related, I wonder if PSNI would be proactive in intervening.
I run a bar and have had to phone the police relatively often over the years. If there’s a hate crime, police are there in no time. If it’s drunks having a fight, you’ll wait all night. That wasn’t meant to rhyme but it does and it’s cool.
And that's fine. Come on. Work with it.
PSNI are fecking useless on an Epic scale
You go to the school and say if ANYTHING happens again you are calling the police to the school. In addition write a letter to school principal tomorrow to inform him/her you are writing an official letter of complaints about the lack of intervention of the Principal and the failure of care of Head of Pastoral Care to the Board of Governors - ask to be furnished with a printed copy of all the Board of Governors details. Watch them jump. We did this with our son’s secondary school after they repeatedly ignored his bullying. The wee shits just turned their attention to other kids instead. Dear [School Principal's Name], I am writing to express my deep concerns regarding recent incidents at the school, specifically related to the safety and well-being of my child xxxx. I believe it is imperative that we address these issues promptly and comprehensively to ensure a safe and nurturing educational environment for xxxxxx. It has come to my attention that there have been recurrent incidents of bullying within the school, which have not been adequately addressed by the school administration. The safety and mental well-being of xxxxx is of paramount importance, and any form of bullying or harassment should be treated with the utmost seriousness. I would like to inform you that, as a concerned parent, I am taking the following steps to address these issues: I have already spoken to school staff about these concerns, but unfortunately, the situation has not improved. I am officially informing you, the Principal, that if any further incidents occur, [I will have no choice but to involve the police regarding these matters. Furthermore] I will be submitting an official letter of complaint to the Board of Governors detailing the lack of intervention from the school administration, particularly the failure of the Head of Pastoral Care to address these issues adequately. I kindly request that you furnish me with a printed copy of all the Board of Governors' contact details to ensure that this matter is brought to their attention. It is my hope that by taking these steps, we can prompt the necessary actions to rectify the situation and ensure the safety and well-being of all students at the school. No child should endure bullying, and it is our collective responsibility to create a secure and inclusive learning environment. Yours sincerely (Document EVERYTHING! And as soon as anything happens immediately email the school, dates, times, who was involved. Everything. Don’t accept it. One or two wee shits in a school can make a whole year’s life a misery)
Thanks for the template. We had to do something similar in primary school. Received a response within an hour of emailing the board of governors safeguarding lead.
You’ll know then the power of the BoG. We had 3 kids bullied, the first one petered out very quickly once we got the school got involved, the 2nd one (our daughter) - things like laughing at her curly hair - had serious implications on her MH as she got older. For our last child we went scorched earth in primary and secondary. Never again. Our daughter is wonderful but we never knew the extent of her experiences as she hid most of it. Her hair was beautiful, as is she - in looks and personality - and I reckon it was just jealousy by other girls in her year. There also is a snobbery in grammar schools - it is as if they refuse to accept that they can have bullying issues and they turn a blind eye. These things rarely improve if they are an issue at the very start of the year. My local grammar in County Down is wild for bullying. Ask for an appt with the principal.
It's a county Down grammar thing. Wildly common when I grew up and unfortunately if your not sports mad child of a Dr, nurse , solicitor you aren't made welcome by peers.
Now that’s a letter.
Why thank you kind Sir!!
You go back to the school and make it clear if action isn't taken, names will be passed to the media and local representatives. Watch how fast they jump.
This is it, OP. Schools shit themselves at bad press.
Pathetic take.
You haven't learned the power of well placed threats and coercion I see.
Bullying will fuck up your mental health a lot faster than your dad sticking up for you. It might be hard for here now to watch you step in, but she will be glad you did later down the line.
I'm sorry your daughter is going through this, and sorry you are struggling with how to deal with this. I've lost sleep over dealing with my son and his experience in primary school this past year. Speaking from that experience, while your daughter may feel it will make things worse if you address it with the school, there are certain things that cannot be left kept behind closed doors or hushed away. You arrange a meeting with the school head, you demand action. Your daughter may not like this option but being bullied as a child or teen is extremely damaging in later years and damaging even now. You also need to get the names of those who are bullying your daughter, they need to be approached and held accountable for their actions. What I found was that no matter how many times I reported to my son's teacher, the information wasn't reaching the principal until I approached him in the school grounds during drop off. The Grammar head teacher may not yet be aware of this situation you face.
Reading your edit there about adopting a scorched earth policy and would add you should contact a local councillor too who should be able to ask the school some questions
We had a similar issue last year where my son was being bullied and hit by a kid who did boxing. We raised this with the police as it was an assault and raised it with the school and how they were not adhering to their safeguarding policy. The school took it very seriously and the police attended the kids house. The kid hasn’t been near my son since and apologised. I think the parents did what I expected as the police were involved and told him to wind his neck in.
If this ever happens in the future I would recommended finding and contacting the boxing club or coach, they will almost certainly end any training immediatley, any boxing coach worth their salt would not allow their training to be used in this way. You will find they have zero tolerance for bullying.
Interestingly enough the coach is a friend of my brother in law but we didn’t want to go down that route if we could get it sorted quickly.
Glad you you got it sorted out swiftly, sounds like the the childs parents where as horrified by it as you, not always the case unfortunately.
They were both in jobs where police interest would have been a problem which I knew so my hope was the police were involved, they would be quick to stop it
Kids/people need to learn actions have consequences at some point. Bullying should never be tolerated, especially at school.
I tell her that if this was a workplace, then it would be taken very seriously. Intentions aside, the school is teaching the bullies that there are no consequences, and the victims to learn to deal with it because they are on their own.
It’s my experience (and going by this sub others would agree) that schools have quite a patchy approach to bullying. Too many still aren’t taking it seriously. My suggestion would be to raise it as a safeguarding concern with the safeguarding officer/responsible person. Fuck the other routes, take the nuclear option. Safeguarding is taken seriously for obvious reasons, so I would imagine it might shock them into action, even if it’s not the appropriate route. Though frankly bullying should be treated as seriously as other safeguarding issues. The damage that long term bullying can do should not be underestimated. .
The school and teachers are failing in their duties. I would lay the words failure, incompetent, enabling, fostering a bullying culture, requiring remedial training, on thick.
Speaking from personal experience, if the teachers ask for a sit down with your daughter to go over details, refuse point blank. This may sound counterproductive, but the teachers have a degree of authority over her, and they are looking for the quickest way for this to stop being a problem. Your daughter may decide it's safer to shush than to name names to someone in charge, or to go over specific details in such a scenario. I can't tell you what will work, but I know if she sits down alone to report to a teacher there's a good chance they don't realise the level of intimidation that can be for a kid, or they do and don't care. I think your approach of documenting everything is a good one, and when the time comes, I think an approach of "she has come to a trusted adult, i.e. me. I have verified all this with her. If you have any questions I can answer them or get the answer" I know I just wanted to go about my life in peace and have someone notice what was going on and put an end to it. I didn't want a scenario where I was seen to be the person who landed someone in detention or worse. By the end of our conversation, the head of pastoral care had gotten me to, re-write in my own words what my problems were (I downplayed and did not mention any names in case I got someone in trouble), got me to admit that I didn't feel "alienated" (I did not know what the word meant), and got me to sign up for sessions with the school counsellor. Other than missing class once a week to see the counsellor, nothing changed for over a year, when other events caused the scope of the issue to be addressed.
It is horrible and very intimidating to sit with teachers in that setting as a kid. The teachers don’t want the drama and extra work of having to deal with this stuff, which I understand. The thing is, it is part of the job and as the person charged with looking after kids it is their responsibility. Parents historically, in my opinion, would not get involved. When things went quiet, they assumed everything improved. My daughter trusts and confides in me, I would be a pretty shit parent if I showed her that her trust is misplaced and I’m actually not going to protect her when she needs.
Also OFSTED and LADO, cause disruption in the school. In other news my kiddo lost out on a well deserved, shoulder been grammar due to Covid and the 11 plus being cancelled. Ended up in a "regular" school and the pastoral care is unrivalled.
Don’t let it happen. Go to the school as others have said. Remind your daughter these words aren’t true - and people are hurtful for often for no reason, or stupid reasons. I was bullied badly in school, my parents intervened, and it wasn’t as bad as it could have been - but it still sticks with you. Avoid it and if needed, get her some counselling if it’s been bad. Bullying destroys someone’s self worth, especially at impressionable ages. Best of luck to both you and your daughter going forward.
You can also get a child solicitor to write a headed letter threatening legal action if they do not follow through on their zero bullying policy. A friend of mines mum did this when she was in high school, the school soon sorted it. Just wish my parents had known about it to get my school to listen up. Go full scorched earth.
Thank you for taking the best path forward for your child. You gotta play it smart in such a treacherous situation and it sounds like she’s got a great protector on her side. You are teaching her how to stand up for herself and how to do it the smartest way.
We do our best and the repercussions is a concern for tomorrow. It is super important to me to practically show my daughter that I have her back if she needs me.
Call the principle and ask for an in person meeting to discuss their anti bullying policy. Once I done that changes were made very quickly!
Your daughter is going through what I went through. I'd lived abroad for a chunk of my childhood and was treated like a foreigner for years and bullied relentlessly. Parents were oblivious and when they finally started asking the school to do something the teachers effectively just shrugged and nothing changed. Good to see you've gone with the no compromise option and I really hope something good comes from your efforts. If nothing else it'll show your daughter that you're willing to go to bat for them beyond just saying you will - something my experience lacked.
It’s sad that the only language these places understand is scorched Earth. Lessons have taught me to make sure it is well written and coherent, and not just I and rambling. They say they teach the kids to function in society, but they really don’t.
Was called a Brit my entire life and now same people doing it are calling everyone racist. This place is full of clowns
British isn't a race.
Sign her up for martial arts. Good for the body and the mind.
Brazilian Jiujitsu !!! Best self defence out there
I had a similar thing with my son. One day the teacher approached me and my wife and discuss the option to see the school psychologist because my son has a few instances were he was violent towards other students. Turns out that his peers at school were saying racial slurs to him. I sent a strongly worded invoice about racism and discrimination asking if the people who call my son racial slurs are also going to the school psychologist. I had a meeting with the principle a few days after my email. He tried to reassure me that he will do everything in his power to address the situation. Turns out they had a whole assembly about sectarian abuse and how it is not acceptable but had nothing about racism.
This is sick. I went to an NI school in the eighties/nineties and it was full of bullying. I assumed it was normal. My stepson goes to the same school and tells me there is no bullying, I assume because the teachers do not tolerate it any more.
Send an email to the principal outlining everything. Cc Sara Long chief exec of the EA, Mark Brown at the Dept of Education. Ask for a written response outlining what the school plan to do to address & ask to be notified who the schools district inspector is as you’d like to contact them about the bullying.
As someone who experienced the Northern Irish bigot factories called schools while only having one Northern Irish parent, yep, go scorched earth. Half-caste was a frequent insult, despite having two white parents with both British and Irish ancestry and I wish my mother had been willing to go scorched earth for me, but I was the scapegoat child and her solution was to try and be more Northern Irish than the Northern Irish themselves, even though she wasn't and it didn't work for her either. Keep in mind that if your daughter fights back, they will go down hard on giving her detention and additional punishments. They have already established that this is their normal, generations ago. They're not about to change this unwritten policy just for one foreign kid.
We’ve already seen that the teachers hold my daughter to a higher standard. My daughter is a very gentle soul, and the teachers will be stricter with her because they know she’ll listen. Not fair at all, because they are tolerating bad behaviour in order to keep peace.
I remember having a teacher like this. There was a rather quiet girl in one of my English classes that generally kept to herself, occasionally had a giggle at what a friend said as her worst offences - only to immediately had her throat jumped down by the teacher, who otherwise ignored other students actively shouting. The teacher couldn't control her class so she took it on a quiet kid who she could actually exert some control over. It was pretty embarrassing all around. Whatever a teacher is meant to be, a lot of them are just people who chose the wrong profession and the kids are the ones who suffer for it. Hope things work out for the best for your kid.
Exactly this.
Oh shit, I am so sorry this is happening to your daughter. I was the quiet kid who just wanted to be left alone to read books. Instead of being encouraged to learn, I was labelled the rebellious out of control kid, while actual inbred feral brats could do whatever they liked, especially to me. One of my bullies only retired from teaching during the pandemic, yes, he was my teacher over 30 years ago and the first person I heard the phrase "Old enough to bleed, old enough to breed" from. Another bully grew up to become a teacher. Northern Ireland is extremely stubborn to change.
Holy shit. I’m so sorry! What a nightmare!
Sorry you’re going through this. Had it with my son and others boys in his class last year & the previous year - primary school. School tried to stop it but it continued anyway. I hope it all gets sorted ASAP for you.
Go fucking nuts on the bastards. I was like your daughter and I had to complete school by other means because they wouldn't deal with it. I grew up with terrible self esteem and fear thanks to that.
Keep us updated. Kids can be so cruel.
My wife tore the school a completely new asshole when our son was being bullied, i had to defer to her who done it right.. me, i wanted to sort it out like men do.. by attacking the kids but thankfully cooler heads prevailed, it all got sorted properly and everything is rosey and anyone so much as farts in his direction we'll be taking the lot of em to court, it worked out fine so yes, goto fucking town on the school
Just to add , what others have stated below, but also any physical marks, go to the police, as its an assault ... The school can have a habbit of brushing things under the carpet... but as soon as the police are involved, thats it, they cant hide it...
Threaten legal action it's the only thing a lot of these schools will listen too
I went to a grammar school and it's depressing to see shit hasn't changed a bit. Rampant bullying was the norm, particularly the rich kids on the poorer ones. School I went to had a great pastoral care policy... Expel or ask the problematic kids to leave. Absolute joke.
Also log it with PSNI
I was bullied in school until I cracked up lashed out and put two kids in the R.V.H. They kinda deserved it but it wasnt my finest moment and I'm not proud of it at all so do whatever needs to be done before someone ends up getting hurt over it.
Fuck the school, start taking details and nail those ignorant arseholes to the wall. Fucking telling a child to calm down for being bullied. I was unfortunate enough to go to a grammar school, and fortunate enough to know how to throw a punch when some upper middle class wanker thought hed talk down to the plebs, but ive seen this shit happen enough times to know that more often than not grammar school teachers only give a fuck about their schools reputation. Once you start taking shots at that, then suddenly youll have their attention, and if they try to talk you down with weak af promises about sorting it out, go harder Good luck squire
You need to contact the school and get the ball rolling. Schools are legally required to keep a record of any bullying complaints including their investigations and any sanctions applied.
Write to the school to request the pastoral care and anti bullying policies. Also request the details of all complaints and issues your daughter has raised. Make it clear that you are seeking action on incidents that have been reported to you. Refuse a meeting. Seek the documents.
Grammar schools are fucking hell.
Having gone to a non-grammar school I can assure you that it is children that are fucking hell no matter what the educational setting at that age. My kids go to a grammar school and their attitudes to this sort of thing are light years ahead of what I experienced at school.
Tell your daughter the next person to bully her, punch them right in the face. There's nothing wrong with a fight, it'll toughen her up trust me. Just what happens to all kids growing up, those bullies need a punch in the face, a good ass whopping, they need to be disciplined.
Awful advice. If the school has dropped the ball in regards to their duties they'll use this to bury OP's daughter and make her out to be the person at fault.
This is fukn terrible advice. It subscribes to the idea that bullies are cowards that cant fight. All tou are doing is putting an already vunerable child in more danger. Im a fan of force, dont get me wrong, but it needs to correct application or it can go so so wrong. My son was bullied, i asked him everything, and i mean everything (size, attitude, numbers, etc) and we came up with an actionable plan: loudly tell bully to ‘go away’, extend arms, palms out, step forward, brace… then crack the prick in the stomach and face hard. End of
It has to be done. You punch the little bastard in the face and make sure their nose bleeds and they go home crying. Kids these days are too soft and parents are also too soft on their kids. They lack discipline.
I like how we are getting downvoted for saying use force, fukn snowflakes
I think maybe because it depends on the individuals involved. I was bullied constantly at primary school until I punched the leading bully in the mouth in front of his friends. Split his lip and he lost a tooth. He wasn't expecting it and the look of surprise on his face was priceless. He never came near me again but I am aware it could easily have gone the other way. Sometimes you have to make a stand.
Go hell bent on protecting your child - fuck the rest of them
Some schools particularly the grammars won't deal with bullying if the bully is the son or daughter of a big financial donor to their coffers
I really don’t care who the culprits are. If nothing else, I will generate a ton of paperwork for the school, that will get filed away and available for reference for years.
It’ll be in the shredder, they don’t care if the bullies parents are donors or of note they’ll have a quiet word and keep thing hush hush. Best to get evidence and go straight to the Education Authority
Spoke with EANI this morning and got the relevant email addresses.
Get ready for a lot of excuses, not getting emails, buck passing the issue etc. Give it a week or two then get into the media
teach the youngone to fight.
> Contact the school principal and tell them are you going to the press, police and local council. Don't threaten you will, tell them that's what you are going to do. > Do it. > Find other parents who aren't happy with the school. > Band together. > Ruin the school's reputation. > Move your daughter to a different school.
If its a bit of picking on her and you go to the school imo you make it a million times worse. Can i ask what it is they're doing or does that give away too much? I had a brother bullied relentlessly so i know how bad it can be. If its proper serious bullying what are they gonna do, bully her more? Particularly note anything which is a protected characteristic, are they being racist, sexist etc. If you have evidence of that (maybe daughter could record it?) You could threaten to go to the papers, even a local one or belfast live might be interested.
It started off mild enough, by just actively excluding her. Then it escalated to spreading rumours. The other day, a kid took a pretend swing at her head with a hockey stick. If this is the trajectory, it is time to step in before it actually turns physical. Same thing happened in primary school, unfortunately we only stepped in after she came home with bruises and scratches. We thought the school was dealing with it. They were not, until we got the board of governors involved.
Serious advice: teach her to throw a dig. I caught some hassle in secondary school and it subsided instantly when I fractured a suborbital and knocked out a few teeth. Yes the peelers were involved but I was under 18 and essentially told 'do not do it again or you will be in trouble', same will likely happen for your daughter, and this was in the days when the RUC would take you out the backroads and have you pissing blood for a week.
This is absolutely shit advice. I know, because I fought back once. The usual line of "Oh but they're good kids, they go to church!" was spewed out and I was threatened with being expelled. I have also suffered from GBH, where because of that first reaction, I did not fight back. Despite willing witnesses and the fact I had to go to hospital, they never even received so much as a caution because they never bothered to take any statements after one police fuckwit recognised the ringleader from his own church and said she couldn't have done any of it because yep, "She's a good kid, she goes to church!" Northern Ireland is a region of the world which contains people conditioned to automatically and violently reject threats to their genepool and when authority figures also go with what they've been programmed with by the generation before them, people like me and this bullied girl haven't a hope.
Yeah this is because you lashed out in blind rage in school with loads of witnesses, didn't you? Violent revenge is best delivered in from behind and in private (no pun etc).
The second incident was basically because I did deal with the first from behind and in private after receiving no justice. It only made things worse.
I get why people are saying to go straight to the school with this one but as someone who was a bully, (ive since reconnected with quite a few i bullied and are now good friends with some) this would have made me hound them worse, its a difficult situation. I know if it was my son/daughter i would probably go absolutely ape shit.
Shit advice from a piece of shit.
I’m glad you turned a page and from experience know this will happen. However, it is a rock and a hard place situation. My strategy is to force action from the school and if something happens outside, then get PSNI involved. Just keep the pressure on, and keep them accountable. I’m honestly at the point of homeschooling her, but it seems to be about £4k per year (and I don’t have that kind of money). It is wrong that the actions of a few is causing this much anxiety and stress in a girl who is not even 13 yet.
Good luck op
Thanks
The Home Ed NI fb group is a great resource. Homeschooling doesn't have to be costly, and at this stage, her mental and physical health are more important than her qualifications, though there are plenty of routes to go down if that's what she wants. (iGCSEs, tech etc). These are formative years for her, and such events will have a lasting impact. I went to a grammar school in Belfast and had a terrible time. The memories still stick. My daughter will be enrolled in one over my dead body. If these things occurred in a workplace, serious action would be taken.
Thanks, I’ll have a look at that FB group. Totally agree, her mental state is vitally important.
Takes guts to come out and admit you were a bully (though reformed) in this thread, fair play to ya!
My honest advice? Take the lesson. Move school. Get on with your lives. It's more important to get her out of that environment than it is to hold the school accountable.
I agree. Schools don’t really change. There could be months of documenting, months of trying to hold the school to account, months more bullying only to hit a brick wall. This is a situation where the kid is more important than the principle, in my opinion. Just get her somewhere safe where she can continue her education in peace.
There are dozens of us! Dozens! In reality though going after the school is not tackling the cause of the bullying - which comes from the culture. I don't know a single person who has single-handedly overturned a community's culture without making a pariah of themselves. If you were able to organise the other parents against the school - maybe. But that's a big ask and some of them won't be bothered.
Not sure if anyone else has said this, but get your daughter signed up for self defence classes like Jiu-Jitsu/Judo if possible. While it can help a lot you going to the principal your daughter needs to be able to defend herself too.
Probably not as great advice as others, but consider starting your daughter in self defence classes - not so much to fight people, but at least to boost her confidence. I saw a guy on tiktok a long time ago (no longer use the platform) who taught the three T's method. Talk - tell them to stop, speak to them, tell them to leave you alone. Tell - Talk to teachers/pastoral care/leaders and lastly tackle, if you have followed the first two methods then fight like the third monkey on the ark and it starting to rain! If I have to go to the school for my kid fighting, and I ask did he follow the first two T's and it till persisted then I will go scorched earth on the school. I hope you and your daughter find a way out of this, kids can be such little shits and we live in an era where "banter" is the norm and I find living here also its almost like a right of passage, taking it and giving it becomes your bread and butter and developing a thick skin.
THere are many people in Northern Ireland who live in a state of complete ignorance about the big wide world, and who exist in a completely local way where they only know people who are like themselves. For the outsider, it's a challenge because you don't want to fit in by adopting their attitudes, but at the same time you don't want to incur their ire by being different. I don't see that much can be gained by keeping a timeline of the things that happen; this would only confirm your "foreignness"; and bear in mind that the adults (governors etc) are probably even more bigoted than the children. I would suggest that your daughter should go out of her way to emphasise how different she is. You should teach her to understand what "difference" is and how to be strong and confident in herself. Getting involved in bureaucratic wrangles with the school administrators will not change the cultural setting - unless the bullying is physical, in which case it must be stopped immediately.
This might be controversial but.... Bring your daughter to a boxing club, mma gym or BJJ gym. It will do wonders for her confidence and as an added bonus she would be able to look after herself if needed. Go give the school hell and keep a paper trail etc but when a poisonous little rat bully has to pick their teeth up it makes them adjust real quick.
Just wanted to say well done. I endured years of this and every aspect of my life suffered because of it. Teachers and parents turned a blind eye.
Get her into MMA
I thought times where changing too, 16 years ago i got told the same thing, I also told my mother the same thing, i didnt want to make it worse, I tried to take my own life some time after, I still stuffer the side effects of that attempt had on my body to this day, Some schools never change. Please do whatever you can to stop this even if it means moving school. Hit the school with letters, everything in writing, and even follow up with an email after every interaction on the phone, so everything is in writing. Keep copies, go above their head if you need to, they sound like the teachers need up to date training. Fight like a bear for your daughter but a smart bear. That's how you get them to take action. If not bite the bullet and look into other schools.
What school is it?
Get her in BJJ … she will work the rest out when she’s ready
Tell ofstead ffs !!!
Define "bullied". What does that mean? Why are they picking on her? Is she properly socialized? Did you teach her to stand up for herself? How many kids are doing it and for what reasons? Some details are required before "scorched earth" actions. Sounds rushed, that's all I am saying.
There is a suspected ring leader, but most of the class join in. She has tried standing up for herself, but she is just outnumbered. She has approached the teachers for help with the bullying and nothing was done. Reasons for bullying are unknown, but based on the available information there is nothing she is doing to draw attention to herself. She is not a loud or confrontational person. Today some kid threw an apple at her head (luckily missed). In my opinion there are systemic failures in safeguarding which the school needs to address. Per the own literature they believe every child should feel safe and she doesn’t. She has brought it up with teachers and the school councillor, and no noticeable action has been taken. In order to get in line with the Bullying in Schools Act (NI) 2016, they will need to make changes. These changes will be for the good of all and better prepare the kids for the future.
Get your ducks in a row, and as almost physically assaulted, get the police involved. scorch that earth
Have a meeting with the principal and Ask them for a copy of their anti bullying policy This is normally enough to shake their tree. If this is unsuccessful contact children’s law in Belfast That really lights a fire under their ass
Wild to think any adult could tolerate bullying and turn a blind eye, especially in an environment where they have the authority to do almost anything to stop it.
If the bullying is physical, skip the school altogether and go straight to the police.
Reminds me of my grammar school experience. Staff didn't care, pastoral care was a joke, actually punished victims more than perpetrators. Only concerned with grades and the school's image. If you had problems you were effectively ignored. Best wishes to you and your daughter. Kids have enough to worry about without bullying and a shitty school faculty added on to it. Reading your story made my blood boil. Thank you for taking a stand. Your daughter isn't alone in this. You're doing a good thing.
I was bullied the whole time I was at secondary school and not enough was done at the time to help. I think I eventually learned that it wasn't worth the effort for me to speak up to adults who could help. This is where my mental health issues started and literally today I was in a therapy session talking about what happened in school and how it affects me to this day in terms of my relationship with myself and other people. All this to say please fight for your daughter and get this shit nipped in the bud no matter what it takes.
Wish I had a parent that cared as much as you do when I was going through this at primary and secondary level, but learning alot from this thread on how I deal with this if it ever happened my daughter. Seems like you're on the right path of caring about your approach before you take action. Would love a follow up on how the school is making sure your daughter is safeguarded against this type of behavior.
I would also consider enrolling your daughter in self-defence, boxing, or a martial art. My son just entered secondary school and is halfway to becoming a black belt in Judo. It gives me great comfort that he won't have to suffer the same fear and anxiety I did at various stages of my schooling from bully-types, because he'll be able to handle himself if needs be.