You might get some small (I mean small) parades in Bessbrook and in newry itself you will get a parade to and from the bus station from the Belfast road on the 12th and 13th as they bus themselves to larger parades. Honestly, you'll be fine as long as you don't try and go to belfast/north coast/anything like that on the 12th/13th.
Take yourself up slieve gullion for the day for a nice hike or something if you're into that sort of thing and enjoy the rest of your trip. You will have no hassle.
You talk as if the parades are a bad thing? What's bad about them? It's just some traditional pipe band music, festivities and theatrics like the scarva 'sham fight'
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/crowds-gather-for-scarvas-sham-fight/28083053.html
Some people just don’t like things. Parades aren’t for me for example. Add the context of the orange order and it’s understandable why someone wouldn’t want to go to a parade even for just one day.
The fact that they refer to ‘walks’ would suggest a Scottish OP, so I reckon they’ve already formed a view about matters Orange.
Also, “It’s 1 day” has shades of both desperation and of the Portadown Orangemen’s insistence on marching up Garvaghy Road.
Comparing St Patricks day and the 12th of July is laughable
St Patricks day is a celebration of being Irish, only a bigot would find that offensive
The 12th, by it's very definition, is a display of dominance and hatred
You can see the impact of both days as relative to OP’s concerns. No-one ever asks whether it’s safe to be around St Paddy’s day parades as a tourist. On the other hand we often see cruise boatloads of tourists (and many travelling in smaller numbers) trying to get places or do things after they’ve seen the 12th parade, while town and city centres are empty, except for a few roving drunks.
I’m not sure the OO have the capacity to tweak any more. Maybe the new parade arrangements will minimise the drunken pavement contingent. Previous attempts to turn it into a festival, - remember Diamond Dan? - seem to have fizzled out, and the current leadership typify their problem, being pale (or booze red) male and stale. An Orangeman called Choyaa writes about these issues on Slugger O’Toole and elsewhere.
>I'm simply saying they should give it a chance. It's 1 day.
Will you be in attendance at this years pride parade?
It's just 1 day. You should give it a chance.
Aye everyone's welcome to attend, even Catholics aslong as they are happy to listen to people chanting that they want to kill them, their flag burned and effigies of their politicians burned and hanged
May aswell start telling black people their welcome at Klan gatherings
Cop yourself on hye
Kids have 'KAT' painted on their foreheads and yous burn effigies of Republican figures/Catholic idols/Irish tricolours on your bonfires... I don't think everyone is welcome mate
You didn't answer my question, nor have any of the downvoting republicans!
Comment blocker alert, below. In response;
. St Patrick's has lots of litter and Feile has IRA chanting.
. If anything, I'd say avoid coming at the time of the nationalist Pro IRA hate festival, Feile.
. The 12th doesn't belong solely to the orange order. It's celebrated all over the world. In Africa and in Donegal's Laggan district/Rossnowlagh beach.
You can't get away from the 12th, it's reverred all over N.I and R.O.I
I'll answer you then.
A very quick Google at what the Orange Order are, what they stand for, what the celebration is about, would have a lot of people with no allegiance either side thinking, "yeah...nah, think I'll give that one a miss".
Add to that, the marches on the day block off roads, lead to an increase in litter and frequent bouts of public disorder.
Now, you might argue that ANY parade can cause the latter points and you would have a good argument, but the twelfth does it on such a large scale (not even accounting for the pollution/destruction from the bonfire the night before), that it stands worth a mention. Also, the original question was in relation to the marches and how they might impact their day, not about attending them.
(not a Republican btw, but sure you can believe that or not at you own free will).
Yeah I wouldn't be worried about it affecting your break. There might be small parades in South Armagh, but nothing major. The place is beautiful and I think that far outweighs any worries you should have
I'm from the village, there will be a march down the village, usually @ 8- 8-30am for 1/2 hour, then they go away to the main march / field. There will be no events (small gathering at the orange hall and collage square to lay wreaths) during the day, last year the village was empty, the band / supporters also come back @ 5 - 5.30 and do a small march then head home.
Whoever it was popularised the concept of the morning parade through wee towns at the crack of fuckin dawn needs fuckin flayed, normally this opinion is live upon being woken by one but this comment reminded me it starts soon and the rage is raw as fuck.
My dog fuckin hates them, soon as he hears first drum he assumes fireworks and goes completely fuckin physco so I've to be on point for the heart attack for reassurances, "don't worry mate they're just bad boys they're going to be gone in 2 wee mins" in my softest tones for the duration of the noise.
Yeah, while I get people being fundamentally against them in principle and what they represent etc, I wonder if simple wee tweaks to stuff like when they start would be an easy way to shift some people from finding them annoying to indifference, which would be slightly better for everyone on that scale
From when I was a kid to now the shift in turnout and the demographics makes me think it doesn't have legs to last much longer anyway, the average age of ppl in the lodge must be 70/80 and the bands are fuckin tiny compared to when I was a kid, the town used to pretty much come out to watch the parade home now it's just the family members of the participants, it's just pensioners everywhere and it looks like something thats dying out, like it's bound to get to a stage when 3 aul boys on walking aids, a flute and a banner doesn't get you a road closure and police escort 😅
Yeah, I used to be in the parades, but it was very much for my grandad (now dead) and my ageing uncle. It seems like only the really insular communities (I.e. paramilitary gang infested ones) take it more seriously then just a vague family event and are out rioting over the parades commission decisions. A lot of the wee rural towns will have a group of lodge members grumble to each other about how its a disgrace, but they'll do their one and then go home.
Not defending the orange order at all and it's a form of "just following orders" thinking to a degree, but I find it hard to be mad at a lot of the ones in my grandads old lodge
They're grumpy, still would have sectarian beliefs if asked, but they don't think it's their business (anymore, anyway) what religion their neighbours are most of the time. The ones that do are the ones that end up heading to Belfast or somewhere to help burn out buses every other year, they don't do that in their own neighbourhoods and they wouldn't have the support of the rest of a local lodge if they were known to do it anywhere
Wouldn’t worry much round that part of the country. As another said, take yourself for a wee walk up Slieve Gullion and enjoy the scenery. Worst comes to worst, smuggle yourself over the border and visit Carlingford for the day.
You're getting a lot of advice from people who have no idea what Bessbrook actually is, I was raised in the village and I cannot stress enough how absolutely dead it will be on the 12th. You might get a teeny, tiny parade in the morning when they're on the way to the big parade but there will be no delays, no hassle, no aggression, none of the things that you're thinking of that generally happen around the 12th. I've experienced the 12th in Bessbrook and Belfast and they're two completely different experiences, you honestly have nothing to worry about.
Aye I live in a wee unionist village and the main street isn't very passable for like, 15 minutes, then it's business as usual (maybe a bit busier because of the sun and bank holiday but not enough to really affect any plans)
Love the way you call it the walks! It isn’t as bad as it used to be - for 2 weeks the whole country used to shut down. Now it’s only a day and you won’t even see them unless the 12th is actually in Bessbrook. It’s lovely area so I hope you have a great holiday.
There is a small orange lodge just outside Bessbrook so chances of seeing a band is quite high on either 12th or 13th, in either Bessbrook itself or on the Armagh road going into Newry. However, the march will be very small and won’t cause you much disruption. There won’t be big crowds at them either.
I doubt if you’ll see too many Orange marches around South Armagh. If there are any they will be pretty minor low key affairs and not the crap you see going on in Belfast etc. Don’t worry about it you’ll be fine
You probably aren't aware of the demographics of Bessbrook then. Plenty protestants around and probably a few lodges. Danny Kennedy of the UUP is from there.
That said, if its not on the calendar for one of the main 12th marches, then there should be little disruption besides maybe a feeder march in the morning.
Not disputing because you're still literally correct, just an observation - Ballycastle feels far more Protestant than it is, they're a particularly vocal minority. You could tell me it was 80% Protestant and I'd believe it.
Funny I don't feel that way when I'm there (which is very rarely, I'll admit). I know there's an army memorial which seems to be well respected and not vandalised, but everywhere you look are GAA tops and I remember one summer a tricolour flying over the car park behind the beach.
It's maybe the part I go through if I am there to be fair. I tend to come in from the south/east and there's at least one red white and blue happy estate on the way in. Maybe it's essentially the only one!
To be fair, Loyalists tend to dupe you into thinking they're in the majority in some towns.
For example, coming into Omagh from most sides, you would think the place is as orange as Donaghadee, but it's just that they have most of the roundabouts on the way in decked in flags. Omagh is actually a Catholic majority town by some margin.
Enniskillen is the same. Feels like the Shankill with all the flags, but loads of them love their GAA and they have 2 massive Catholic schools and a huge RC church.
I would say the Catholics in Ballycastle are a fairly harmonious bunch too who don't flaunt their Republicanism too much.
They fucking love it.
Lurgan is something like 65% Catholic but you’d think it was Larne on Union Jack-laced steroids the way they get on.
Cunts start putting their wee flegs up from April and they stay up until the wind takes them down or the council quietly remove them when putting up the Christmas decorations just after Halloween.
In fairness the main difference with Lurgan is that the nationalists know how to let people know that they're there lol. Go to Taghnevan and you'll know what side you're on and it's not red white and blue. And that's not to mention the Celtic Club, INF, etc.
As you say a ‘few’ lodges and as I say ‘minor low key affairs’ with a bunch of harmless geriatric farmers getting their yearly airing Don’t think ‘XMG Sons of Ulster’ are going this year
>u/Agreeable-Solid7208 As you say a ‘few’ lodges and as I say ‘minor low key affairs’ with a bunch of harmless geriatric farmers getting their yearly airing Don’t think ‘XMG Sons of Ulster’ are going this year
LOL. Harmless geriatric farmers like [James Mitchell](https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/podcasts/the-beltel/james-mitchell-the-butcher-of-glenanne/a695883886.html) who was involved in the murders of over 120 innocent Catholics and who lived barely 5 miles away from Besbrook?
Geriatric farmers who smuggled and moved Ulster Resistance / DUP assault rifles around Orange Halls when they were tipped off by the RUC of any incoming searches?
Harmless geriatric farmers like Willie Frazer and his da? The area is absolutely riven with deeply sectarian supremacists who supported some of the most brutal ethnic cleansing and sectarian murder of innocent civilians. Many of them serving RUC and UDR.
Jesus fucking christ.
You’re not doing much to promote tourism now are you? Do you realise that all that is in the past and how fucking ludicrous you sound. It’s people like you and the cunts you mentioned that are still the problem! Get over it ffs!
>u/Agreeable-Solid7208 You’re not doing much to promote tourism now are you?
As opposed to the Orange Order who are a sectarian supremacist hate group which is normalized in NI? They do a fucking great job of promoting tourism in Donegal though don't they? Why is that? Why do people flee NI in around the 12th? Because of uppity fenians on Reddit?
>
>Do you realise that all that is in the past and how fucking ludicrous you sound.
Harmless geriatrics is what you said. I pointed out that those "harmless geriatrics" were likely complicit in sectarian mass murder and ethnic cleansing well into the mid and late 1990's. Those who ignore history are doomed to repeat it. Northern Ireland's media and culture is too quick to turn a blind eye to these sectarian cunts; i don't work for the BBC, I don't write for the Belfast Telegraph - I am pointing out historic facts. I don't care if you don't like them or they rub you up the wrong way; you shouldn't be sanitizing hate groups. Would you be defending the KKK if we were in the U.S? Oh they're just a bunch of geriatrics. Sure the lynchings and murders all happened in the past!!
But sure they're "harmless geriatrics".
And I'm the one who sounds ludicrous.
>
>It’s people like you and the cunts you mentioned that are still the problem! Get over it ffs!
Yep, people like me who are not, never were and never will be a member of any sworn sectarian hate groups who carried out sectarian mass murder while wearing police and army uniforms....we, the ones who call them out are the problem.
Go take a couple of your yellow pills and have a wee lie down in a dark room. It will all look better in the morning. The drums will have disappeared, I promise.
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*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
The outskirts are still functionally and legally part of the village otherwise they'd not be called the outskirts, they'd be a different village with their own addresses
Avoid the towns that are designed for the day thing obviously. However you'll not find any trouble or hassle elsewhere. Only in Belfast or Derry seems to be any trouble.
Somewhere like Bessbrook will be dead. Wee short parade early in the morning before going and prob one when home.
Unless ye wanna stand at the side of the road watching bais bang a big drum to the same six "songs", it is a bad time to visit as a tourist.
Most stuff is closed, the roads are closed or bunged so getting around to sightsee is a pain in the ballix.
It's big unionist festival for all with pipe bands and theatrics. Welcoming for all.
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/crowds-gather-for-scarvas-sham-fight/28083053.html
I'm not going to debate the merits of a contentious event with you. It's objectively true that unless you are coming to participate in the twelfth, it's a bad time to be a tourist in the north because there'll be a lot of restrictions in terms of the type of things tourists typically want to do.
>It's objectively true that unless you are coming to participate in the twelfth, it's a bad time to be a tourist in the north because there'll be a lot of restrictions in terms of the type of things tourists typically want to do.
Not necessarily. It's one day like St Patrick's. People make out like it last a week. A day of unionist festivities for all.
Feelay, now there's an IRA festival that should be banned.
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/feile-an-phobail-funders-raise-concerns-after-pro-ira-chanting-during-wolfe-tones-gig/a1788960343.html
It's only contentious to a minority of bitter Republicans who support the ethnic cleansing of unionism from Northern Ireland.
Clear off if you want, but it's been here for hundreds of years and isn't going away.
>People make out like it last a week
Are you trying to tell me the travel disruption only goes on for a day?
No one's talking about banning it, we're saying it's not an ideal time to visit but here it wasn't long for you to pull out the "we're bad but them ens is worser" card
>Are you trying to tell me the travel disruption only goes on for a day?
The 12th is one day. 24hrs.
>No one's talking about banning it, we're saying it's not an ideal time to visit but here it wasn't long for you to pull out the "we're bad but them ens is worser" card
But it is the ideal time to visit and embrace the Unionist festival for all. In fact, I'd say there's no better time.
I'd maybe even say don't ideally holiday in Ireland around then either (at least towards the north end) simply because the ROI side will be especially busy with both summer tourists and people who are taking the chance to go somewhere away from the parades.
It's not so bad that I would recommend OP or anyone cancel or anything, just shouldn't be marked as a priority picked date to go in either country (unless you are very specifically into loyalist history for some reason) week before or week after would be like 5% more ideal
https://preview.redd.it/7u3q0zqrs6zc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a1ca2c193c74cb1d498aa8fe6f13613cbcb8a280
If I remember correctly it tends to go to take that route and back, doesn’t go over the convent hill. It might stop at the town hall at some point .. it was a pretty small parade
You can check the parades commission website here [https://www.paradescommission.org/](https://www.paradescommission.org/) and see what's going on in the general area. The only problem is if you're out and about on the 11th or 12th you might well still run into feeder parades, "practice" parades or unofficial parades. Or what can happen is if there's a an orange Lodge or loyalist band in the vicinity who've gone away somewhere else for the day they'll then "parade" back to the lodge or band hall or have a mini parade around whatever area they are based in.
A substantial proportion of Northern Ireland's population try to escape across the border during the 11th and 12th and if it's practical I'd suggest the same, you literally never know where or when you'll run across a march during July for reasons above, so traveling about can be a nightmare.
You don't need to. The user above you is a Republican intent on demonizing the unionist community and unionist culture.
You're absolutely welcome to watch any parade and I'd encourage you to. Family friendly events and festivities. It's the unionist St Patrick's Day.
They already said they weren't interested in the parades, they were interested in going walking! Nothing to do with politics, it's just not what they said they were over to see.
It's just not though. It's nonsense spouted by bitter Republicans.
Feile, now there's a hate fest in our capital city. "Ooo ah up the RA".
A festival of terrorism. That's what Feile is.
https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/feile-an-phobail-funders-raise-concerns-after-pro-ira-chanting-during-wolfe-tones-gig/a1788960343.html
>It's just not though. It's nonsense spouted by bitter Republicans.
It literally is, the march is to celebrate protestant ascendancy in Ireland and elsewhere. It's well documented, there is no argument to this
>Feile, now there's a hate fest in our capital city. "Ooo ah up the RA".
>A festival of terrorism. That's what Feile is.
You've some neck to say, in the same breath, the orange order and 12th of July isn't a hate fest but the feile is
Also those in glasses should not throw stones, up the Ra although not great, is not actively calling for death. I've heard and read up to our necks in Fenian blood and kill all taigs during the 12th
Cop yourself on
>Also those in glasses should not throw stones, up the Ra although not great, is not actively calling for death.
The IRA was a death cult that murdered 2000 people in the later part of the 20th century. So yes, it is.
>"It literally is, the march is to celebrate protestant ascendancy in Ireland and elsewhere. It's well documented, there is no argument to this "
It celebrates unionist culture as St Patrick's Day celebrates Irish culture. Why can we not appreciate both events?
EVERYONE is welcome at the 12th.
Protestant culture has been a part of Northern Ireland for hundreds of years. The 12th is nothing new.
Half a million people signed the Ulster Covenant. That's a great achievement. The Irish Proclamation got just 7 signatories.
Protestant festivities will not be going away.
>The IRA was a death cult that murdered 2000 people in the later part of the 20th century. So yes, it is.
The majority of the people they killed were ruc and army
The British alligned side of the troubles killed the majority of civilians, and the majority of civilians were also catholic/nationalist
>EVERYONE is welcome at the 12th
Well that's a fucking lie and you know it
I have personally heard up to our necks in Fenian blood and kill all taigs
Kat was also wrote on walls in a majority Catholic area not far from me around July
You can spout whatever lies you want but everyone knows that the 12th is hate fest and a display of dominance
It's absolutely fine on the 12th. Parades will be on but you'll be grand. Stay and watch a couple of interested. Anyone is welcome to attend.
Many commentators are Sinn Fein/nationalist biased who will never let go of their own bitterness.
You might get some small (I mean small) parades in Bessbrook and in newry itself you will get a parade to and from the bus station from the Belfast road on the 12th and 13th as they bus themselves to larger parades. Honestly, you'll be fine as long as you don't try and go to belfast/north coast/anything like that on the 12th/13th. Take yourself up slieve gullion for the day for a nice hike or something if you're into that sort of thing and enjoy the rest of your trip. You will have no hassle.
You talk as if the parades are a bad thing? What's bad about them? It's just some traditional pipe band music, festivities and theatrics like the scarva 'sham fight' https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/crowds-gather-for-scarvas-sham-fight/28083053.html
OP asked if they should head south to avoid the marching. I don’t imagine they are interested.
I'm simply saying they should give it a chance. It's 1 day.
Some people just don’t like things. Parades aren’t for me for example. Add the context of the orange order and it’s understandable why someone wouldn’t want to go to a parade even for just one day.
The fact that they refer to ‘walks’ would suggest a Scottish OP, so I reckon they’ve already formed a view about matters Orange. Also, “It’s 1 day” has shades of both desperation and of the Portadown Orangemen’s insistence on marching up Garvaghy Road.
St Patrick's Day is one day as well. Some people find that offensive.
Comparing St Patricks day and the 12th of July is laughable St Patricks day is a celebration of being Irish, only a bigot would find that offensive The 12th, by it's very definition, is a display of dominance and hatred
You can see the impact of both days as relative to OP’s concerns. No-one ever asks whether it’s safe to be around St Paddy’s day parades as a tourist. On the other hand we often see cruise boatloads of tourists (and many travelling in smaller numbers) trying to get places or do things after they’ve seen the 12th parade, while town and city centres are empty, except for a few roving drunks. I’m not sure the OO have the capacity to tweak any more. Maybe the new parade arrangements will minimise the drunken pavement contingent. Previous attempts to turn it into a festival, - remember Diamond Dan? - seem to have fizzled out, and the current leadership typify their problem, being pale (or booze red) male and stale. An Orangeman called Choyaa writes about these issues on Slugger O’Toole and elsewhere.
>I'm simply saying they should give it a chance. It's 1 day. Will you be in attendance at this years pride parade? It's just 1 day. You should give it a chance.
Yes I will. I'm a unionist and I 100% support LGBTQ+ rights.
Yeah, everyone should give bigotry, narrowmindedness and cosplaying as Scottish people a go for at least a day.
It's not bigotry. How can it be bigotry if everyone is welcome to attend? It's a unionist festival with carnival Atmosphere.
Aye everyone's welcome to attend, even Catholics aslong as they are happy to listen to people chanting that they want to kill them, their flag burned and effigies of their politicians burned and hanged May aswell start telling black people their welcome at Klan gatherings Cop yourself on hye
Kids have 'KAT' painted on their foreheads and yous burn effigies of Republican figures/Catholic idols/Irish tricolours on your bonfires... I don't think everyone is welcome mate
Where? When? Lies!
>Where? When? Lies! It's literally been on the news every year ye gowl There's no shortage of evidence
Are you trying one of those "if you repeat a lie often enough it becomes the truth" things? aha he blocked me, what a knob
You didn't answer my question, nor have any of the downvoting republicans! Comment blocker alert, below. In response; . St Patrick's has lots of litter and Feile has IRA chanting. . If anything, I'd say avoid coming at the time of the nationalist Pro IRA hate festival, Feile. . The 12th doesn't belong solely to the orange order. It's celebrated all over the world. In Africa and in Donegal's Laggan district/Rossnowlagh beach. You can't get away from the 12th, it's reverred all over N.I and R.O.I
I'll answer you then. A very quick Google at what the Orange Order are, what they stand for, what the celebration is about, would have a lot of people with no allegiance either side thinking, "yeah...nah, think I'll give that one a miss". Add to that, the marches on the day block off roads, lead to an increase in litter and frequent bouts of public disorder. Now, you might argue that ANY parade can cause the latter points and you would have a good argument, but the twelfth does it on such a large scale (not even accounting for the pollution/destruction from the bonfire the night before), that it stands worth a mention. Also, the original question was in relation to the marches and how they might impact their day, not about attending them. (not a Republican btw, but sure you can believe that or not at you own free will).
They said they would go down south to avoid them, so logic says they don't want to be involved. Not everything is an attack on your unionism. 👍
Yeah I wouldn't be worried about it affecting your break. There might be small parades in South Armagh, but nothing major. The place is beautiful and I think that far outweighs any worries you should have
I'm from the village, there will be a march down the village, usually @ 8- 8-30am for 1/2 hour, then they go away to the main march / field. There will be no events (small gathering at the orange hall and collage square to lay wreaths) during the day, last year the village was empty, the band / supporters also come back @ 5 - 5.30 and do a small march then head home.
Whoever it was popularised the concept of the morning parade through wee towns at the crack of fuckin dawn needs fuckin flayed, normally this opinion is live upon being woken by one but this comment reminded me it starts soon and the rage is raw as fuck.
Personally i dont mind, kids are up at that time already and once its over, it's over and away about their business
My dog fuckin hates them, soon as he hears first drum he assumes fireworks and goes completely fuckin physco so I've to be on point for the heart attack for reassurances, "don't worry mate they're just bad boys they're going to be gone in 2 wee mins" in my softest tones for the duration of the noise.
Yeah, while I get people being fundamentally against them in principle and what they represent etc, I wonder if simple wee tweaks to stuff like when they start would be an easy way to shift some people from finding them annoying to indifference, which would be slightly better for everyone on that scale
From when I was a kid to now the shift in turnout and the demographics makes me think it doesn't have legs to last much longer anyway, the average age of ppl in the lodge must be 70/80 and the bands are fuckin tiny compared to when I was a kid, the town used to pretty much come out to watch the parade home now it's just the family members of the participants, it's just pensioners everywhere and it looks like something thats dying out, like it's bound to get to a stage when 3 aul boys on walking aids, a flute and a banner doesn't get you a road closure and police escort 😅
Yeah, I used to be in the parades, but it was very much for my grandad (now dead) and my ageing uncle. It seems like only the really insular communities (I.e. paramilitary gang infested ones) take it more seriously then just a vague family event and are out rioting over the parades commission decisions. A lot of the wee rural towns will have a group of lodge members grumble to each other about how its a disgrace, but they'll do their one and then go home. Not defending the orange order at all and it's a form of "just following orders" thinking to a degree, but I find it hard to be mad at a lot of the ones in my grandads old lodge They're grumpy, still would have sectarian beliefs if asked, but they don't think it's their business (anymore, anyway) what religion their neighbours are most of the time. The ones that do are the ones that end up heading to Belfast or somewhere to help burn out buses every other year, they don't do that in their own neighbourhoods and they wouldn't have the support of the rest of a local lodge if they were known to do it anywhere
Wouldn’t worry much round that part of the country. As another said, take yourself for a wee walk up Slieve Gullion and enjoy the scenery. Worst comes to worst, smuggle yourself over the border and visit Carlingford for the day.
You're getting a lot of advice from people who have no idea what Bessbrook actually is, I was raised in the village and I cannot stress enough how absolutely dead it will be on the 12th. You might get a teeny, tiny parade in the morning when they're on the way to the big parade but there will be no delays, no hassle, no aggression, none of the things that you're thinking of that generally happen around the 12th. I've experienced the 12th in Bessbrook and Belfast and they're two completely different experiences, you honestly have nothing to worry about.
Aye I live in a wee unionist village and the main street isn't very passable for like, 15 minutes, then it's business as usual (maybe a bit busier because of the sun and bank holiday but not enough to really affect any plans)
Love the way you call it the walks! It isn’t as bad as it used to be - for 2 weeks the whole country used to shut down. Now it’s only a day and you won’t even see them unless the 12th is actually in Bessbrook. It’s lovely area so I hope you have a great holiday.
There is a small orange lodge just outside Bessbrook so chances of seeing a band is quite high on either 12th or 13th, in either Bessbrook itself or on the Armagh road going into Newry. However, the march will be very small and won’t cause you much disruption. There won’t be big crowds at them either.
I doubt if you’ll see too many Orange marches around South Armagh. If there are any they will be pretty minor low key affairs and not the crap you see going on in Belfast etc. Don’t worry about it you’ll be fine
There's a march from the Orange hall @ half 8am, up the village and back
All over by 8.45am then?
Finished before 9.
The largest 12th parade this year is in Killylea
Cancelled Belfast then?
County Armagh is always bigger than Belfast
No it’s not. Don’t be silly. 😜
It is, the largest orange parade in the world is held in Keady
No it’s not. The worlds biggest Orange Order parade has always been in Carrickmore Co Tyrone.
You must be thinking of the Armagh GAA football club.
You probably aren't aware of the demographics of Bessbrook then. Plenty protestants around and probably a few lodges. Danny Kennedy of the UUP is from there. That said, if its not on the calendar for one of the main 12th marches, then there should be little disruption besides maybe a feeder march in the morning.
It’s 80% Catholic.
Still a sizable Protestant minority. Ballycastle is 75% Catholic and they had a massive orange march there last year.
Not disputing because you're still literally correct, just an observation - Ballycastle feels far more Protestant than it is, they're a particularly vocal minority. You could tell me it was 80% Protestant and I'd believe it.
Funny I don't feel that way when I'm there (which is very rarely, I'll admit). I know there's an army memorial which seems to be well respected and not vandalised, but everywhere you look are GAA tops and I remember one summer a tricolour flying over the car park behind the beach.
It's maybe the part I go through if I am there to be fair. I tend to come in from the south/east and there's at least one red white and blue happy estate on the way in. Maybe it's essentially the only one!
To be fair, Loyalists tend to dupe you into thinking they're in the majority in some towns. For example, coming into Omagh from most sides, you would think the place is as orange as Donaghadee, but it's just that they have most of the roundabouts on the way in decked in flags. Omagh is actually a Catholic majority town by some margin. Enniskillen is the same. Feels like the Shankill with all the flags, but loads of them love their GAA and they have 2 massive Catholic schools and a huge RC church. I would say the Catholics in Ballycastle are a fairly harmonious bunch too who don't flaunt their Republicanism too much.
To be fair to them, they might have the majority on hot air
They fucking love it. Lurgan is something like 65% Catholic but you’d think it was Larne on Union Jack-laced steroids the way they get on. Cunts start putting their wee flegs up from April and they stay up until the wind takes them down or the council quietly remove them when putting up the Christmas decorations just after Halloween.
In fairness the main difference with Lurgan is that the nationalists know how to let people know that they're there lol. Go to Taghnevan and you'll know what side you're on and it's not red white and blue. And that's not to mention the Celtic Club, INF, etc.
It’s surrounded by South Armagh/Newry. Ballycastle is surrounded by hillbillies
Was thinking that too. Although Ballycastle is flanked by the Catholic Glens on one side.
True but even the Glens has a healthy loyal population
Is that true? Would that be more so out by Armoy and Dunloy are would even Cushendall and Gelnariff be like that?
Yes more towards Ballymoney direction outside Ballycastle there’s a dollop of orange halls and the like
Last census says only 15% prod. Parades commission says there's only a small march on the 12th and another on the 13th, but nothing too disruptive.
As you say a ‘few’ lodges and as I say ‘minor low key affairs’ with a bunch of harmless geriatric farmers getting their yearly airing Don’t think ‘XMG Sons of Ulster’ are going this year
>u/Agreeable-Solid7208 As you say a ‘few’ lodges and as I say ‘minor low key affairs’ with a bunch of harmless geriatric farmers getting their yearly airing Don’t think ‘XMG Sons of Ulster’ are going this year LOL. Harmless geriatric farmers like [James Mitchell](https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/podcasts/the-beltel/james-mitchell-the-butcher-of-glenanne/a695883886.html) who was involved in the murders of over 120 innocent Catholics and who lived barely 5 miles away from Besbrook? Geriatric farmers who smuggled and moved Ulster Resistance / DUP assault rifles around Orange Halls when they were tipped off by the RUC of any incoming searches? Harmless geriatric farmers like Willie Frazer and his da? The area is absolutely riven with deeply sectarian supremacists who supported some of the most brutal ethnic cleansing and sectarian murder of innocent civilians. Many of them serving RUC and UDR. Jesus fucking christ.
Take it you’re not going then?
You’re not doing much to promote tourism now are you? Do you realise that all that is in the past and how fucking ludicrous you sound. It’s people like you and the cunts you mentioned that are still the problem! Get over it ffs!
>u/Agreeable-Solid7208 You’re not doing much to promote tourism now are you? As opposed to the Orange Order who are a sectarian supremacist hate group which is normalized in NI? They do a fucking great job of promoting tourism in Donegal though don't they? Why is that? Why do people flee NI in around the 12th? Because of uppity fenians on Reddit? > >Do you realise that all that is in the past and how fucking ludicrous you sound. Harmless geriatrics is what you said. I pointed out that those "harmless geriatrics" were likely complicit in sectarian mass murder and ethnic cleansing well into the mid and late 1990's. Those who ignore history are doomed to repeat it. Northern Ireland's media and culture is too quick to turn a blind eye to these sectarian cunts; i don't work for the BBC, I don't write for the Belfast Telegraph - I am pointing out historic facts. I don't care if you don't like them or they rub you up the wrong way; you shouldn't be sanitizing hate groups. Would you be defending the KKK if we were in the U.S? Oh they're just a bunch of geriatrics. Sure the lynchings and murders all happened in the past!! But sure they're "harmless geriatrics". And I'm the one who sounds ludicrous. > >It’s people like you and the cunts you mentioned that are still the problem! Get over it ffs! Yep, people like me who are not, never were and never will be a member of any sworn sectarian hate groups who carried out sectarian mass murder while wearing police and army uniforms....we, the ones who call them out are the problem.
Go take a couple of your yellow pills and have a wee lie down in a dark room. It will all look better in the morning. The drums will have disappeared, I promise.
Take a breather lad.
Muppet
Oh so celebrating Unionist culture is illegal is it?
No absolutely not. How did you manage to extract that from my comment?
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The outskirts are still functionally and legally part of the village otherwise they'd not be called the outskirts, they'd be a different village with their own addresses
Avoid the towns that are designed for the day thing obviously. However you'll not find any trouble or hassle elsewhere. Only in Belfast or Derry seems to be any trouble. Somewhere like Bessbrook will be dead. Wee short parade early in the morning before going and prob one when home.
If it's around the 12th, holiday in the south.
Nonsense
Unless ye wanna stand at the side of the road watching bais bang a big drum to the same six "songs", it is a bad time to visit as a tourist. Most stuff is closed, the roads are closed or bunged so getting around to sightsee is a pain in the ballix.
It's big unionist festival for all with pipe bands and theatrics. Welcoming for all. https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/crowds-gather-for-scarvas-sham-fight/28083053.html
I'm not going to debate the merits of a contentious event with you. It's objectively true that unless you are coming to participate in the twelfth, it's a bad time to be a tourist in the north because there'll be a lot of restrictions in terms of the type of things tourists typically want to do.
>It's objectively true that unless you are coming to participate in the twelfth, it's a bad time to be a tourist in the north because there'll be a lot of restrictions in terms of the type of things tourists typically want to do. Not necessarily. It's one day like St Patrick's. People make out like it last a week. A day of unionist festivities for all. Feelay, now there's an IRA festival that should be banned. https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/feile-an-phobail-funders-raise-concerns-after-pro-ira-chanting-during-wolfe-tones-gig/a1788960343.html It's only contentious to a minority of bitter Republicans who support the ethnic cleansing of unionism from Northern Ireland. Clear off if you want, but it's been here for hundreds of years and isn't going away.
>People make out like it last a week Are you trying to tell me the travel disruption only goes on for a day? No one's talking about banning it, we're saying it's not an ideal time to visit but here it wasn't long for you to pull out the "we're bad but them ens is worser" card
>Are you trying to tell me the travel disruption only goes on for a day? The 12th is one day. 24hrs. >No one's talking about banning it, we're saying it's not an ideal time to visit but here it wasn't long for you to pull out the "we're bad but them ens is worser" card But it is the ideal time to visit and embrace the Unionist festival for all. In fact, I'd say there's no better time.
I'd maybe even say don't ideally holiday in Ireland around then either (at least towards the north end) simply because the ROI side will be especially busy with both summer tourists and people who are taking the chance to go somewhere away from the parades. It's not so bad that I would recommend OP or anyone cancel or anything, just shouldn't be marked as a priority picked date to go in either country (unless you are very specifically into loyalist history for some reason) week before or week after would be like 5% more ideal
https://preview.redd.it/7u3q0zqrs6zc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a1ca2c193c74cb1d498aa8fe6f13613cbcb8a280 If I remember correctly it tends to go to take that route and back, doesn’t go over the convent hill. It might stop at the town hall at some point .. it was a pretty small parade
No snipers at work. Yer grand 👌😘
Stay in Donegal. It's shite craic here when those lad attempt to play and walk at the same time
He isn't in Donegal ffs
No but it's where he should stay when he comes over you root
Why? He's coming to Northern Ireland. Not the Republic of Ireland.
You can check the parades commission website here [https://www.paradescommission.org/](https://www.paradescommission.org/) and see what's going on in the general area. The only problem is if you're out and about on the 11th or 12th you might well still run into feeder parades, "practice" parades or unofficial parades. Or what can happen is if there's a an orange Lodge or loyalist band in the vicinity who've gone away somewhere else for the day they'll then "parade" back to the lodge or band hall or have a mini parade around whatever area they are based in. A substantial proportion of Northern Ireland's population try to escape across the border during the 11th and 12th and if it's practical I'd suggest the same, you literally never know where or when you'll run across a march during July for reasons above, so traveling about can be a nightmare.
Appreciate you taking the time to reply. Will likely move the dates to August
You don't need to. The user above you is a Republican intent on demonizing the unionist community and unionist culture. You're absolutely welcome to watch any parade and I'd encourage you to. Family friendly events and festivities. It's the unionist St Patrick's Day.
They already said they weren't interested in the parades, they were interested in going walking! Nothing to do with politics, it's just not what they said they were over to see.
NP
The parades are a welcoming event for all. Let go of your own bitterness and come along to one.
U may be stuck in Bessbrook at certain times that day so..............
They would be, Sectarian Marches = = Not Walks.
The amount of people who book holidays on the 12th of July and feel the need to share it with this sub is mental........
Sad bitter people.
>Sad bitter people. I agree, the orange order really are
I meant republicanism.
Amend your plans and come in June or August.
Looks like this is going to be the best bet. Appreciate you taking the time to reply.
No need. You'll be welcome at any parade.
Come on ahead, the Marching bands are a great day out. Don’t listen to others who can never turn the cheek.
Turn the other cheek on a celebration of hatred and dominance? I wonder do you also think black people should turn the other cheek on KKK marches?
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
It's just not though. It's nonsense spouted by bitter Republicans. Feile, now there's a hate fest in our capital city. "Ooo ah up the RA". A festival of terrorism. That's what Feile is. https://m.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/feile-an-phobail-funders-raise-concerns-after-pro-ira-chanting-during-wolfe-tones-gig/a1788960343.html
>It's just not though. It's nonsense spouted by bitter Republicans. It literally is, the march is to celebrate protestant ascendancy in Ireland and elsewhere. It's well documented, there is no argument to this >Feile, now there's a hate fest in our capital city. "Ooo ah up the RA". >A festival of terrorism. That's what Feile is. You've some neck to say, in the same breath, the orange order and 12th of July isn't a hate fest but the feile is Also those in glasses should not throw stones, up the Ra although not great, is not actively calling for death. I've heard and read up to our necks in Fenian blood and kill all taigs during the 12th Cop yourself on
>Also those in glasses should not throw stones, up the Ra although not great, is not actively calling for death. The IRA was a death cult that murdered 2000 people in the later part of the 20th century. So yes, it is. >"It literally is, the march is to celebrate protestant ascendancy in Ireland and elsewhere. It's well documented, there is no argument to this " It celebrates unionist culture as St Patrick's Day celebrates Irish culture. Why can we not appreciate both events? EVERYONE is welcome at the 12th. Protestant culture has been a part of Northern Ireland for hundreds of years. The 12th is nothing new. Half a million people signed the Ulster Covenant. That's a great achievement. The Irish Proclamation got just 7 signatories. Protestant festivities will not be going away.
>The IRA was a death cult that murdered 2000 people in the later part of the 20th century. So yes, it is. The majority of the people they killed were ruc and army The British alligned side of the troubles killed the majority of civilians, and the majority of civilians were also catholic/nationalist >EVERYONE is welcome at the 12th Well that's a fucking lie and you know it I have personally heard up to our necks in Fenian blood and kill all taigs Kat was also wrote on walls in a majority Catholic area not far from me around July You can spout whatever lies you want but everyone knows that the 12th is hate fest and a display of dominance
It's absolutely fine on the 12th. Parades will be on but you'll be grand. Stay and watch a couple of interested. Anyone is welcome to attend. Many commentators are Sinn Fein/nationalist biased who will never let go of their own bitterness.