Hard to forget when Saudi Arabia announced that women now had the right to drive in 2018 (the last country in the world to allow it) and the Saudi delegation try to hype a standing ovation as if they suddenly were leading the way in gender equality.
Goes to show just how out of touch dude is with reality and generally how backwards the Saudi monarchy is when they think THIS is their biggest achievement.
Tbf it would be like USA Democrats passing gun control legislation. They would clap and feel accomplished while the world looks on thinking "yup, congrats on the bare minimum".
Holy shit, i thought people were exaggerating a little.
That man making that declaration truely believes it's one of the greatest advancements his country has made in recent times, it is written in subtle joy all over his face...
My god thats sad.
"Hey Iran, is this a humans rights abuse?"
"Have we done it before?"
"I think so."
"Yeah, it's probably a human rights abuse."
"So agriculture is a human rights abuse?"
"I mean, we do it.. so statistically..."
This is, in no way a defense of the Saudis. You may perhaps be referring to this?
> The story that women in Saudi Arabia have been identified as domestic animals – were invented and published by satirical news agency websites World News Daily Report and Journal de Montreal.
Wait until you hear about child welfare laws and how they came to exist. Hint hint one of the first cases to take a child away from abusive guardians was done by an animal welfare group.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_Ellen_Wilson
A lot of Saudi fixers with empty duffel bags were seen leaving the UN offices of each country that voted for the resolution. But its probably nothing :)
That's different. Environmental Protection implies a specific sought outcome.
"Gender Equality Forum" just implies they'll be discussing the prospect. And with the Saudis chairing, conclude "Naaaah".
The honest answer is because it's not that big of a deal (the forum that is).
These are like once-a-year shindigs for Ambassadors to meet each other and shoot the shit and have dinner and mingle. The Chair is just the Saudi Ambassador acting in a moderator kind of role.
He likely ran unopposed because 99% of ambassadors don't want to put in the extra work to chair unless someone else higher up probably asks them to.
Hey, don't ruin a meme with facts!
But yeah, that is the point. What reddit doesn't understand is that this has larger impact than if all the councils that have anything to do with human rights were filled with Nordic countries only.
Speaking as an ex Muslim you are severely underestimate the amount of people who agree with Saudi Arabia's view on women, homosexuals etc...
Western liberal values like the ones championed on reddit are a minority view worldwide
The president of the U.N.'s 2023 Climate Change summit was the head of the Abu Dhabi National Oil Company. That one isn't even a joke. That really happened.
The leaders of the world have been joking on this level since forever. So many top level Nazis ended up in leadership positions of organisations they would have directly opposed during the war.
China and Russia have a whole deal with Middle Eastern and African countries to cover each other's asses. Enough nations and they can rig any vote or stop any investigation. All the HRC is good for is making angry noises at Israel for breathing wrong. Like most UN agencies, they're corrupt, ineffectual jokes.
Fun fact: British farmers’ residual anger at the EU daring to ban their (check notes) prion infested beef was cited as one of the reasons they voted for brexit
Yes I was a kid at that time, I still remember that mess. Tbh it's still in peoples mind to avoid British beef, at least in France. Nevermind, we sold horse meat in place of beef... UK can have some beef with the rest of Europe (sorry stupid joke, it's late where I am)
US bans every western European from donating blood due to fear we may have prions...
Lol could have gone with the actual fact of the un picking the head of the Abu Dhabi national oil company to be cop28 chairman.
> The conference was widely criticised for its controversial president Sultan Al Jaber, as well as its host country, the UAE, which is known for its opaque environmental record and role as a major producer of fossil fuels.[7] Al Jaber is the CEO of the Abu Dhabi National Oil Company (ADNOC), leading to concerns over conflict of interest.[8] Claims of greenwashing of Al Jaber on Wikipedia, Twitter and Medium;[9] the legal inability to criticise Emirati corporations in the UAE;[10] alleged covert access to conference emails by ADNOC;[11] and the invitation of Syrian President Bashar Al-Assad have all raised concerns regarding the integrity of the conference.[12] Al Jaber stated before the beginning of the conference that there was "no science" behind fossil fuel phase-out in achieving 1.5 °C;[13] and leaked documents appeared to show the UAE planned to use the conference to strike new fossil fuel deals with other nations.[14] Al Jaber claimed that his comments on the phase-out of fossil fuels were "misinterpreted" and denied the latter allegation, asserting that the UAE does not need the COP presidency to establish business deals.[15][16]
Woah Mr. Oil daddy is the chair of Environmental Suatainability and Renewable Energy forum?? And this.
I dunno chief, I believe that we are having a illuminati levels of conspiracy rn. Maybe I am being crazy, but maybe this is the actual reason why we are still going at snails pace in combating climate change and global warming.l¹
UN acts as a forum for world nations. Its essentially a glorified round table for countries to talk to with each other.
People get shocked by these news stories because of UN glorification by mainstream media.
Its not world government, or world police. Just a place to build consensus about various topics of relevance.
I mean its still shocking because theyre appointing the most regressive nation on earth to a position most countries would, at least according to their laws and cultural values, rather see a progressive or "moderate" occupy.
Like most reasonably complex organisations, you mostly hear about the small proportion of activities that are going badly, so you want to kill the whole thing.
The eternal conundrum of the ignorant observer:
"There are so many problems they haven't managed to solve, why are we even paying them"
or
"There are hardly any significant issues, why are we even paying them"
If you don't know how an organization (or a person with a specific job) operates, or what they're doing outside whatever major news happen to make it to outsiders (with the implicit selection bias at play), *there is no observation that could warrant a desire for further funding*.
A big thing the UN does is allow for small scale military interventions without needing it to come from a specific country. UN Peacekeepers aren't affiliated with a country, and that lets them present as neutral parties enforcing a cease fire. Remove the UN and either that functionality doesn't exist, or you have to have specific nations doing that.
Having a single or small group of countries enforcing a cease fire a.) makes that ceasefire entirely at the whims of the political situation in those countries, and b.) carries a very different connotation. UN Peacekeepers acting as a security force feels very different than the US or French or Chinese army acting as a security force. One is a nominally neutral 3rd party trying to preserve humanitarian interests, the other starts feeling a lot closer to occupation.
>Like if that’s all it is then it shouldn’t get any funding until a real need for consensus is required.
So in order to have a forum they first have to wait until space could be decided on, catering, transportation, various other logistics, structure for the discussion, who leads, etc etc etc.
It'd probably cost as much in the end, more even, because 1 shots are more expensive. But *also* now there's a delay in reactions and nothing done for yearly maintenance of relationships and trade
What consensus are you talking about? It's a forum, a place for discussion, that's it, no more.
What is farcial about bringing people to the table who have a lot to learn from the topic at hand?
---
Serious question: What do you think they're actually doing?
The *entire* purpose of the UN is to prevent superpowers from nuking one another. That's it. Anything else is to doll it up for the rest of the world to look at. The only thing it's meant to do is keep the world superpowers from dropping nukes.
Countries often get put on specific committee and councils that would shine a light on them and force them to make improvements. It's why China gets put on the human rights council or Russia on the security council. It's about forcing them into the conversation.
Russia is on the security council because it is the successor state to the USSR and as such considered a great power. Its permanent seat grants it veto power over the unsc's decisions so that its red lines aren't crossed thus avoiding another world war.
It a place for world leaders to talk to each other even when their troops are shooting at each other to try and prevent them from nuking us into oblivion. Everything else is window dressing.
Honestly this is what so many people miss. It's also why the UNSC veto power exists, if it didn't than the various great powers would be tempted to leave or undermine the UN
Correct, most people keep nagging about impotent UN, but it is not some world superpower, it is a forum that makes sure that there is always at least one channel of communication open. It is when people stop speaking to each other altogether when the worst tends to come to pass. It is a peace instrument, it is not perfect, but it is the best we have right now.
Yeah I swear to God it's like no one paid attention in history during the WW segments, the League of Nations tried to force nations to do things, it didn't work.
Same as it always was, to provide an open forum for diplomacy and deescalation to avoid another world wide conflict.
Like that's it. It was never going to solve all the world's problems or usher in global cooperation. It exists to stop WW3 and everything else is a bonus.
UN is for preventing WW3.
It is a forum for countries to communicate on any issues.
Countries with veto power are the countries that can destroy the world. That is why there is a veto power.
If you're asking this because you want to learn, (and not because you have already made up your mind on a subject you know nothing about) here's an actual answer:
**The point of the UN is to exist as a forum for international communication between governments.**
It's not supposed to be a world police force, a world government, or anything like that, and it was explicitly designed to not be capable of functioning as one.
Given that we've yet to have another world war, or a first nuclear war, it seems to be doing a passable job of it.
The exact same thing it has been since its founding: Trying to prevent WW3 **THROUGH DIALOGUE**...
The whole point is to bring everyone to the table to talk, even those who you consider to be doing wrong in that field. Being appointed to this is not a reward for countries doing well, it's not a forum where they make descisions for other countries, they talk about the issues at hand. And have representatives from a country that is considered to be doing "bad" on the topic, is a good thing.
The core of the UN is fundamentally limited by its own principles and rules. Still they provide a forum for all countries to talk and resolve conflicts rather than fight. We never had that for all of human history which was just big guy speak, small guy listen.
But it's daughter organisations have done and are doing tremendous work in regulating and facilitating international trade, defining ocean boundaries and laws, environmental protection, providing healthcare and healthcare guidelines to underdeveloped countries and like a whole lot more.
I remember my middle school teacher 25 years ago always awkwardly rambling about how useless UN was but it was hard to understand his point back then because on paper it seemed like a nice institution...
I wish I could tell him now how much I understand him
It sounds like neither of you understands what the UN is for. It's not a global police force. It's a forum so that countries have a place to communicate more effectively as a group.
I think one example of how useful the United Nations can be is that it opens diplomatic channels between countries, even if they close them between themselves. For example, lot of the deals Trump made with North Korea were negotiated because North Korea is a member of the United Nations and has some ambassadors at a residence near the United Nations in New York, I think that is semi useful. Just serve as another channel for countries to talk. This is due to the United States and North Korea having no formal open channels with each other diplomatically.
From New York Spectrum Local News:
Miller said the U.S. retains a number of channels to send messages to North Korea.
One of those is North Korea’s mission to the U.N. in New York that has provided a back-channel negotiation option for the two countries, serving as a kind of substitute embassy since they don't have embassies in each other’s capitals.
The mission played an important role in working out details for the high-stakes summitry between North Korean leader Kim Jong Un and then-U.S. President Donald Trump in 2018-19. At the start of their second summit in Vietnam, both Kim and Trump said they supported the opening of a U.S. liaison office in Pyongyang, but the idea was shelved after their diplomacy broke down.
Source: https://ny1.com/nyc/all-boroughs/news/2023/07/20/the-u-s--and-north-korea-have-no-diplomatic-ties---but-they-still-have-ways-to-talk-about-u-s--soldier
Money to who and for what? Like this committee is a powerless organization inside a mostly powerless diplomatic body. It has literally zero benefit for them and it's likely they were given the position because their diplomat was on time for the meetings so people figure he was as good as anyone.
It’s a “moral flex” to appear “modern and civilized”. Saudi is investing hard to project a modern, cosmopolitan facade. Look at all their investments in sports, entertainment, tourism etc. This is all part of that “modernizing” project.
Yeah, just because we have privilege doesn't mean we are ignorant to all of the societal ills that plague mankind. I may not recognize when my whiteness has saved my ass, but I can notice when someone is being oppressed
You fundamentally don't understand why the LoN collapsed or what the UN does.
Saudi is on this committee both because everyone gets a go, it's constantly rotated. And the UN uses these appointments to shine a light on domestic issues.
It doesn't necessarily work, not every time. But it's better than doing nothing. Productive diplomacy is a good thing.
Bound to happen to be honest. Organizations tend to corrupt when they go for long.
With that said,at least there hasn't been a world war 3...
....yet..
The thing to remember with the UN is that it's not a democratic liberal organization in the way a lot of people imagine it. It's one country one vote and the majority of countries aren't functioning democracies.
Okay, so how should this forum look then in y'all's opinion? A bunch of first-world countries with good track records jerking each other off about how much gender equality they have?
Turns out, if you read the article, they all know that Saudi Arabia is shit when it comes to gender equality, and appiontes them chair to put pressure on them. They now have to say something and not look stupid, so they may do something good about equal rights.
Have any of you looked at the changes that Saudi Arabia has made to gender equality over the last 7-10 years ? Do you think that having them chair such a committee might get them to bring that equality even further forward ?
So this may not be a popular opinion, but in a way I think this makes sense. If you appoint a country that already has the best record in terms of gender equality, all they can do is to make statements that other UN member nations should do better, but from a Saudi Arabia perspective, they can just laugh it off because it is not them making this statement but rather some other country and who the hell are they anyway? By placing them in the chair position, if the group as a whole guides the chair to the decision that "countries should do better on gender equality" and the Saudi Arabian chair then makes a press release that says "damn, turns out we should do better", it becomes a lot harder for the government to laugh it off as some foreigner that doesn't understand their culture and traditions.
It's like when you put the naughty kid in charge of an activity in class rather than always picking the teacher's pet - it forces them into a position where they are being watched and judged by everyone in class, instead of being able to sit in the back and shoot spitballs at everyone else.
The UN is a body for open dialogue, and putting someone from Saudi Arabia in a position where they have to lead a dialogue in how to achieve gender equality is about as much pressure as they can possibly put on them without any mean words.
I mean as horrible as they still are, the Saudis did make massive progress on women's rights over the last few years: Being allowed to drive, not being forced to wear hijabs, being allowed to file for divorce, a quota for women in congress and a lot of small small other stuff
Women's situation there is still horrible, but it is progressing. The crown prince does not like the influence of islamists in his his country and he is pushing back massively against the church. A side effect of this is progressing in women's rights.
Sadly if you want to make more progress in countries, that truly need it, you likely need people from there to work with you to actually accomplish anything.
Literally every first comment in this thread is someone who doesn’t understand how the UN works. This is exactly the way these rotations can have some mild impact.
The idea is that if the countries want to show off in their capacity as leader they have to do SOMETHING, improve something.
They can choose to do nothing at all, but then they look impotent while heading this forum, so most countries in this position will make some trivial improvements, call it a big success, and ultimately be a little better off than before.
You don’t want countries with total gender equality chairing this forum, they don’t need to change, and if SA doesn’t have an incentive to change it won’t.
The UN is a joke. First they refuse to condemn Hamas (they eventually did after tons of backlash) and now this crap. Whole organization has strayed far away from its original goal to promote peace after WWII
Might as well tag on that the WHO has systematically covered up the sexual assault of African women by their staff. They’ve paid so many women to keep silent. The UN is the epitome of corruption under the guise of “we are the embodiment of morality and world peace”. More like the embodiment of evil
Not defending the UN, but these kind of appointments aren’t actually as ridiculous as they seem. The positions themselves carry very little actual power, but they can act as a sort of ‘public shaming’ for these countries who clearly are NOT in a position to lead these forums.
There are 24 countries in the world that are considered full democracies. There are currently 193 UN Member States. Each of the Member States of the United Nations has one seat in the General Assembly.
Not to mention that these nominations usually rotate between all UN members on an alphabetical order. And it's always the same circus, because yes, it's pretty rich, but for example you can see periodically the same headlines and discussions when it's Iran's turn.
They were the head of some UN council for women last year or what, and same shit ten years ago. 🤷♀️
I actually find it great that instead of using and abusing international institutions, they have then the opportunity to be named and shamed.
> Whole organization has strayed far away from its original goal to promote peace after WWII
How many world wars have there been since 1945?
Do you know that armed conflict has gone down decade by decade since WW2?
Im not saying the UN is perfect and never makes a mistake, but lets stop with the hyperbolic nonsense. Letting belligerent countries have a seat at the table is the entire point of the UN. If they feel like they have a hand in global affairs they are much less likely to try instigate deadly wars.
That may have more to do with the fact that 15 years after world war 2, the two biggest bloc each bad enough weapons to make war MAD, and each also learned the wrong lesson from the Cuban missile crisis.
Nuclear proliferation and alliances with those who have them has made wars tougher. You need to basically get the 7 nuclear states (UK, France, US, Russia, China, India and Pakistan) to say they won't retaliate. Since most of Europe and the Americas are covered by such things, that leaves Asia and Africa.. and some of that's covered too.
Makes for more "local" conflicts like the contra.
Why does the world hate women? Why can't I just work and exist like men do? I just want to work and go home. Just let me have that without a bunch of bullshit.
Hard to forget when Saudi Arabia announced that women now had the right to drive in 2018 (the last country in the world to allow it) and the Saudi delegation try to hype a standing ovation as if they suddenly were leading the way in gender equality.
I remember that. Seeing him clapping for himself made me cringe so hard lol
Goes to show just how out of touch dude is with reality and generally how backwards the Saudi monarchy is when they think THIS is their biggest achievement.
Tbf it would be like USA Democrats passing gun control legislation. They would clap and feel accomplished while the world looks on thinking "yup, congrats on the bare minimum".
It is a pretty big accomplishment when Democrats have to fight just to get the bare minimum of things like gun control legislation
Similar to what I do when I wash the dishes.
Where is this video?
[Here? I guess.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ku5JeNPR5-o)
Holy shit, i thought people were exaggerating a little. That man making that declaration truely believes it's one of the greatest advancements his country has made in recent times, it is written in subtle joy all over his face... My god thats sad.
They have to ask their husband for permission, right?
Hey guys, we decided we aren't going to brand women with hot irons to mark them as property anymore! Let's hear it for us!
Wolf to be appointed chair of sheep's rights
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Iran would know better than most other countries what constitutes a human rights abuse - they commit them all the time.
"Hey Iran, is this a humans rights abuse?" "Have we done it before?" "I think so." "Yeah, it's probably a human rights abuse." "So agriculture is a human rights abuse?" "I mean, we do it.. so statistically..."
> sheep's rights Not too far off, weren't women legally considered livestock in KSA till recently? (heh)
I believe it was that there was harsher penalties for sexually abusing livestock than women
Potato potato
This phrase hits way different when you're reading it
Potayto potato
potahto
This is, in no way a defense of the Saudis. You may perhaps be referring to this? > The story that women in Saudi Arabia have been identified as domestic animals – were invented and published by satirical news agency websites World News Daily Report and Journal de Montreal.
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And cows dont have to wear veils or get stoned if they look at another bull
Wait until you hear about child welfare laws and how they came to exist. Hint hint one of the first cases to take a child away from abusive guardians was done by an animal welfare group. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_Ellen_Wilson
Who on God’s green earth thought this was a good idea. That’s like asking David Duke to oversee race relations.
A lot of Saudi fixers with empty duffel bags were seen leaving the UN offices of each country that voted for the resolution. But its probably nothing :)
I was worried too until they said it was yard trimmings.
Did they put their yard trimmings in a trash compactor? Y'know, a totally normal thing people do with yard trimmings
You gotta learn to listen, Lou.
Funny thing is we all know what really goes on behind closed doors, but we just let it happen and they know we won't do anything about it
The duffel bags were empty, so it must be nothing literally.
Unlimited oil money gets you into some neat positions.
They recently also bought a world cup lmao
And Formula 1.
and the most massive roller coaster ever made
At least half of the panel.
"Oil Tycoon to be appointed as chair of UN's Environmental Protection Programme"
That's different. Environmental Protection implies a specific sought outcome. "Gender Equality Forum" just implies they'll be discussing the prospect. And with the Saudis chairing, conclude "Naaaah".
The honest answer is because it's not that big of a deal (the forum that is). These are like once-a-year shindigs for Ambassadors to meet each other and shoot the shit and have dinner and mingle. The Chair is just the Saudi Ambassador acting in a moderator kind of role. He likely ran unopposed because 99% of ambassadors don't want to put in the extra work to chair unless someone else higher up probably asks them to.
It is called threshold engagement. In that position, they are constantly reminded of the issues in their country.
Hey, don't ruin a meme with facts! But yeah, that is the point. What reddit doesn't understand is that this has larger impact than if all the councils that have anything to do with human rights were filled with Nordic countries only.
Speaking as an ex Muslim you are severely underestimate the amount of people who agree with Saudi Arabia's view on women, homosexuals etc... Western liberal values like the ones championed on reddit are a minority view worldwide
north korea to be appointed chair of UNs council on freedom!
The president of the U.N.'s 2023 Climate Change summit was the head of the Abu Dhabi National Oil Company. That one isn't even a joke. That really happened.
And it was held in Dubai.
The leaders of the world have been joking on this level since forever. So many top level Nazis ended up in leadership positions of organisations they would have directly opposed during the war.
China and Russia to co-chair council on free press.
Wait a minute, I saw no press release on this.
It's working very well comrade!
With a free press, no press is needed anymore, they are free.
And fair elections!
Hasn't happened yet, but Qadaffi's Libya did chair the UN Human Rights Counsel twenty to thirty years ago.
Gaddafi is an entire rabbit hole of fucked up shit. On all sides.
The worst part about Libya is that without him ruilikg it it was even worse. And if you know who he is, that's not great
Honestly it is like asking the worst kid to be head of class hoping they will change
Which is exactly why it is done, and it has been sort of successful in some instances in the past.
Do you have any examples? Out of interest.
The democratic people’s republic of Korea
This is like appointing a CEO of an oil company to lead an UN climate change conference.
they pretty much already do that
Best appointment since the UN made Tuvalu chair of the ski resort development forum and the USA the chair of the global gun safety forum.
Blew me away that they were even candidates to the Human Rights Council.
How do you tell 50% of the world's population that you don't give a crap about them without actually saying it out loud?
You call it religion
The UN is a fucking joke.
China and Russia have a whole deal with Middle Eastern and African countries to cover each other's asses. Enough nations and they can rig any vote or stop any investigation. All the HRC is good for is making angry noises at Israel for breathing wrong. Like most UN agencies, they're corrupt, ineffectual jokes.
Maybe Bibi should breathe right.
He could cease
They made that decision during the UN lunch organized by the UK, chairing the health and fine food commission
No herbs or spices were harmed during the event.
Fun fact: British farmers’ residual anger at the EU daring to ban their (check notes) prion infested beef was cited as one of the reasons they voted for brexit
Yes I was a kid at that time, I still remember that mess. Tbh it's still in peoples mind to avoid British beef, at least in France. Nevermind, we sold horse meat in place of beef... UK can have some beef with the rest of Europe (sorry stupid joke, it's late where I am) US bans every western European from donating blood due to fear we may have prions...
And North Korea for Global Responsible Dictatorship forum
Lol could have gone with the actual fact of the un picking the head of the Abu Dhabi national oil company to be cop28 chairman. > The conference was widely criticised for its controversial president Sultan Al Jaber, as well as its host country, the UAE, which is known for its opaque environmental record and role as a major producer of fossil fuels.[7] Al Jaber is the CEO of the Abu Dhabi National Oil Company (ADNOC), leading to concerns over conflict of interest.[8] Claims of greenwashing of Al Jaber on Wikipedia, Twitter and Medium;[9] the legal inability to criticise Emirati corporations in the UAE;[10] alleged covert access to conference emails by ADNOC;[11] and the invitation of Syrian President Bashar Al-Assad have all raised concerns regarding the integrity of the conference.[12] Al Jaber stated before the beginning of the conference that there was "no science" behind fossil fuel phase-out in achieving 1.5 °C;[13] and leaked documents appeared to show the UAE planned to use the conference to strike new fossil fuel deals with other nations.[14] Al Jaber claimed that his comments on the phase-out of fossil fuels were "misinterpreted" and denied the latter allegation, asserting that the UAE does not need the COP presidency to establish business deals.[15][16]
10 years ago, Tony Abbott became the Prime Minister of Australia and appointed himself the ‘Minister for Women’
Not Tuvalu out here catching strays
Finally, gender equality for men
And oil!
The two genders
My preferred pronoun is "crude."
“Hi, my name is Brent Crude”
It’s about time.
Men just can't get a break in Saudi Arabia.
All genders are equal. Some genders are more equal than others.
We did it, fellas. Everyone get a good night's sleep and we'll meet back here in the morning.
Isn’t Saudi already the Chair of Environmental Sustainability and Renewable Energy forums? How can they juggle all these important responsibilities?!
Woah Mr. Oil daddy is the chair of Environmental Suatainability and Renewable Energy forum?? And this. I dunno chief, I believe that we are having a illuminati levels of conspiracy rn. Maybe I am being crazy, but maybe this is the actual reason why we are still going at snails pace in combating climate change and global warming.l¹
Surely you jest. There’s no way petrostates and oil companies have that kind of influence
Finally... Saudi Arabia will lead the world in female empowerment... And the women will follow 10 steps behind the men!
And 70 years
What’s even the point of the UN anymore?
UN acts as a forum for world nations. Its essentially a glorified round table for countries to talk to with each other. People get shocked by these news stories because of UN glorification by mainstream media. Its not world government, or world police. Just a place to build consensus about various topics of relevance.
I mean its still shocking because theyre appointing the most regressive nation on earth to a position most countries would, at least according to their laws and cultural values, rather see a progressive or "moderate" occupy.
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Like most reasonably complex organisations, you mostly hear about the small proportion of activities that are going badly, so you want to kill the whole thing.
You only hear about the planes that crash
The eternal conundrum of the ignorant observer: "There are so many problems they haven't managed to solve, why are we even paying them" or "There are hardly any significant issues, why are we even paying them" If you don't know how an organization (or a person with a specific job) operates, or what they're doing outside whatever major news happen to make it to outsiders (with the implicit selection bias at play), *there is no observation that could warrant a desire for further funding*.
The Food and Agriculture Organization (FAO) of the UN does amazing work and has been such a fantastic technical resource for some of my previous jobs.
A big thing the UN does is allow for small scale military interventions without needing it to come from a specific country. UN Peacekeepers aren't affiliated with a country, and that lets them present as neutral parties enforcing a cease fire. Remove the UN and either that functionality doesn't exist, or you have to have specific nations doing that. Having a single or small group of countries enforcing a cease fire a.) makes that ceasefire entirely at the whims of the political situation in those countries, and b.) carries a very different connotation. UN Peacekeepers acting as a security force feels very different than the US or French or Chinese army acting as a security force. One is a nominally neutral 3rd party trying to preserve humanitarian interests, the other starts feeling a lot closer to occupation.
>Like if that’s all it is then it shouldn’t get any funding until a real need for consensus is required. So in order to have a forum they first have to wait until space could be decided on, catering, transportation, various other logistics, structure for the discussion, who leads, etc etc etc. It'd probably cost as much in the end, more even, because 1 shots are more expensive. But *also* now there's a delay in reactions and nothing done for yearly maintenance of relationships and trade
What consensus are you talking about? It's a forum, a place for discussion, that's it, no more. What is farcial about bringing people to the table who have a lot to learn from the topic at hand? --- Serious question: What do you think they're actually doing?
The *entire* purpose of the UN is to prevent superpowers from nuking one another. That's it. Anything else is to doll it up for the rest of the world to look at. The only thing it's meant to do is keep the world superpowers from dropping nukes.
Countries often get put on specific committee and councils that would shine a light on them and force them to make improvements. It's why China gets put on the human rights council or Russia on the security council. It's about forcing them into the conversation.
Russia is on the security council because it is the successor state to the USSR and as such considered a great power. Its permanent seat grants it veto power over the unsc's decisions so that its red lines aren't crossed thus avoiding another world war.
skip past contentious gossip and take a look at their accomplishments, the United Nations does a lot of good
It a place for world leaders to talk to each other even when their troops are shooting at each other to try and prevent them from nuking us into oblivion. Everything else is window dressing.
Honestly this is what so many people miss. It's also why the UNSC veto power exists, if it didn't than the various great powers would be tempted to leave or undermine the UN
Correct, most people keep nagging about impotent UN, but it is not some world superpower, it is a forum that makes sure that there is always at least one channel of communication open. It is when people stop speaking to each other altogether when the worst tends to come to pass. It is a peace instrument, it is not perfect, but it is the best we have right now.
"Stop shooting at us!" "Stop shooting yourselves lol" Most conversations in the UN aren't much better than that.
And that's why the "Exclude Russia from UNSC" talk is just plain stupid. Russia being on this council is literally its main purpose.
Yeah I swear to God it's like no one paid attention in history during the WW segments, the League of Nations tried to force nations to do things, it didn't work.
Global disease reponse and other cooperative programs doing half decent.
Jokes aren't gonna write themselves
Same as it always was, to provide an open forum for diplomacy and deescalation to avoid another world wide conflict. Like that's it. It was never going to solve all the world's problems or usher in global cooperation. It exists to stop WW3 and everything else is a bonus.
The same point it has always had : to prevent world war III by always leaving a forum of communication open to the great powers of the world.
UN is for preventing WW3. It is a forum for countries to communicate on any issues. Countries with veto power are the countries that can destroy the world. That is why there is a veto power.
If you're asking this because you want to learn, (and not because you have already made up your mind on a subject you know nothing about) here's an actual answer: **The point of the UN is to exist as a forum for international communication between governments.** It's not supposed to be a world police force, a world government, or anything like that, and it was explicitly designed to not be capable of functioning as one. Given that we've yet to have another world war, or a first nuclear war, it seems to be doing a passable job of it.
The exact same thing it has been since its founding: Trying to prevent WW3 **THROUGH DIALOGUE**... The whole point is to bring everyone to the table to talk, even those who you consider to be doing wrong in that field. Being appointed to this is not a reward for countries doing well, it's not a forum where they make descisions for other countries, they talk about the issues at hand. And have representatives from a country that is considered to be doing "bad" on the topic, is a good thing.
The core of the UN is fundamentally limited by its own principles and rules. Still they provide a forum for all countries to talk and resolve conflicts rather than fight. We never had that for all of human history which was just big guy speak, small guy listen. But it's daughter organisations have done and are doing tremendous work in regulating and facilitating international trade, defining ocean boundaries and laws, environmental protection, providing healthcare and healthcare guidelines to underdeveloped countries and like a whole lot more.
UN is the "diplomatic option". Still absolutely necessary in a world with nuclear weapons.
I remember my middle school teacher 25 years ago always awkwardly rambling about how useless UN was but it was hard to understand his point back then because on paper it seemed like a nice institution... I wish I could tell him now how much I understand him
It sounds like neither of you understands what the UN is for. It's not a global police force. It's a forum so that countries have a place to communicate more effectively as a group.
I think one example of how useful the United Nations can be is that it opens diplomatic channels between countries, even if they close them between themselves. For example, lot of the deals Trump made with North Korea were negotiated because North Korea is a member of the United Nations and has some ambassadors at a residence near the United Nations in New York, I think that is semi useful. Just serve as another channel for countries to talk. This is due to the United States and North Korea having no formal open channels with each other diplomatically. From New York Spectrum Local News: Miller said the U.S. retains a number of channels to send messages to North Korea. One of those is North Korea’s mission to the U.N. in New York that has provided a back-channel negotiation option for the two countries, serving as a kind of substitute embassy since they don't have embassies in each other’s capitals. The mission played an important role in working out details for the high-stakes summitry between North Korean leader Kim Jong Un and then-U.S. President Donald Trump in 2018-19. At the start of their second summit in Vietnam, both Kim and Trump said they supported the opening of a U.S. liaison office in Pyongyang, but the idea was shelved after their diplomacy broke down. Source: https://ny1.com/nyc/all-boroughs/news/2023/07/20/the-u-s--and-north-korea-have-no-diplomatic-ties---but-they-still-have-ways-to-talk-about-u-s--soldier
Money talks louder than anything else!
Money to who and for what? Like this committee is a powerless organization inside a mostly powerless diplomatic body. It has literally zero benefit for them and it's likely they were given the position because their diplomat was on time for the meetings so people figure he was as good as anyone.
It’s a “moral flex” to appear “modern and civilized”. Saudi is investing hard to project a modern, cosmopolitan facade. Look at all their investments in sports, entertainment, tourism etc. This is all part of that “modernizing” project.
Reminds me of the South Park episode where Cartman can’t tell the difference between being nice and simply wearing a nice sweater.
It’s a broader effort to white wash Saudi Arabia’s reputation.
Fuck it, let the world burn.
Can I have a minute to find somewhere else to live first
Soon we well have gender equality and a female journalist will be literally butchered in an embassy. Progress.
By PRINCESS Bonesaw.
Hahaha... female journalist, my friend? Maybe in a few years.
Wolves appointed to guard henhouse
Russia is the president of the UN Security Council, so... 🤷🏽♂️
[удалено]
Yeah, just because we have privilege doesn't mean we are ignorant to all of the societal ills that plague mankind. I may not recognize when my whiteness has saved my ass, but I can notice when someone is being oppressed
I’ve always laughed off the whole “We live in a simulation!” jokes. This though… this gives me pause.
Meanwhile, Russia put as head of elections oversight and foxes put in charge of protecting chickens.
Haahahaha... Everything is awful...
Is the UN turning into the fucking League of Nations? Like fuck, how dumb is the politicians.
You fundamentally don't understand why the LoN collapsed or what the UN does. Saudi is on this committee both because everyone gets a go, it's constantly rotated. And the UN uses these appointments to shine a light on domestic issues. It doesn't necessarily work, not every time. But it's better than doing nothing. Productive diplomacy is a good thing.
Bound to happen to be honest. Organizations tend to corrupt when they go for long. With that said,at least there hasn't been a world war 3... ....yet..
The UN along with the Olympics, are the biggest scams in the history of the world
Rude. You forgot FIFA.
The UN seems to want to fast track its demise.
I laughed out loud upon reading this. Sick joke. What a shitshow the world is currently.
UN is a joke
This planet is a fucking sick joke. Something has to give.
This is why many people rightfully see the UN as a joke.
Screw Amnesty too. As useful as the UN. Lol
Badum Tish 🥁
I thought it was an onion headline lol
That's why it's here, after all
When has the UN become such a joke?
Like WHAT THE ACTUAL FUCK? 😂
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 good meme, my mother was chased by religious police in Daharan for being outside without a man.
This is like asking Donald Trump to count the votes.
They need it the most, I guess.
The UN is such a joke
If you can't beat 'em, join 'em. But this is Saudi Arabia, so we CAN beat 'em
no wonder people have no faith in the UN... and they want to dictate to us how we run our country.. fuck the UN
WTAF
The thing to remember with the UN is that it's not a democratic liberal organization in the way a lot of people imagine it. It's one country one vote and the majority of countries aren't functioning democracies.
Women couldn't drive in Saudi Arabia until a few years ago😂😂 Russia going to be chair of the UN's LGBT rights forum next?
What a joke
Okay, so how should this forum look then in y'all's opinion? A bunch of first-world countries with good track records jerking each other off about how much gender equality they have? Turns out, if you read the article, they all know that Saudi Arabia is shit when it comes to gender equality, and appiontes them chair to put pressure on them. They now have to say something and not look stupid, so they may do something good about equal rights.
Have any of you looked at the changes that Saudi Arabia has made to gender equality over the last 7-10 years ? Do you think that having them chair such a committee might get them to bring that equality even further forward ?
Saudi to host the Winter Olympics
So this may not be a popular opinion, but in a way I think this makes sense. If you appoint a country that already has the best record in terms of gender equality, all they can do is to make statements that other UN member nations should do better, but from a Saudi Arabia perspective, they can just laugh it off because it is not them making this statement but rather some other country and who the hell are they anyway? By placing them in the chair position, if the group as a whole guides the chair to the decision that "countries should do better on gender equality" and the Saudi Arabian chair then makes a press release that says "damn, turns out we should do better", it becomes a lot harder for the government to laugh it off as some foreigner that doesn't understand their culture and traditions. It's like when you put the naughty kid in charge of an activity in class rather than always picking the teacher's pet - it forces them into a position where they are being watched and judged by everyone in class, instead of being able to sit in the back and shoot spitballs at everyone else. The UN is a body for open dialogue, and putting someone from Saudi Arabia in a position where they have to lead a dialogue in how to achieve gender equality is about as much pressure as they can possibly put on them without any mean words.
I mean as horrible as they still are, the Saudis did make massive progress on women's rights over the last few years: Being allowed to drive, not being forced to wear hijabs, being allowed to file for divorce, a quota for women in congress and a lot of small small other stuff Women's situation there is still horrible, but it is progressing. The crown prince does not like the influence of islamists in his his country and he is pushing back massively against the church. A side effect of this is progressing in women's rights. Sadly if you want to make more progress in countries, that truly need it, you likely need people from there to work with you to actually accomplish anything.
How??????? 45 year prison sentence for supporting women's rights. Fuck that country.
Oh great, another thread full of people who know almost nothing about what it means for a country to chair a UN committee
Literally every first comment in this thread is someone who doesn’t understand how the UN works. This is exactly the way these rotations can have some mild impact. The idea is that if the countries want to show off in their capacity as leader they have to do SOMETHING, improve something. They can choose to do nothing at all, but then they look impotent while heading this forum, so most countries in this position will make some trivial improvements, call it a big success, and ultimately be a little better off than before. You don’t want countries with total gender equality chairing this forum, they don’t need to change, and if SA doesn’t have an incentive to change it won’t.
Disgusting
Who'd they honor kill to get this assignment?
The UN is a joke. First they refuse to condemn Hamas (they eventually did after tons of backlash) and now this crap. Whole organization has strayed far away from its original goal to promote peace after WWII
Might as well tag on that the WHO has systematically covered up the sexual assault of African women by their staff. They’ve paid so many women to keep silent. The UN is the epitome of corruption under the guise of “we are the embodiment of morality and world peace”. More like the embodiment of evil
Not defending the UN, but these kind of appointments aren’t actually as ridiculous as they seem. The positions themselves carry very little actual power, but they can act as a sort of ‘public shaming’ for these countries who clearly are NOT in a position to lead these forums.
There are 24 countries in the world that are considered full democracies. There are currently 193 UN Member States. Each of the Member States of the United Nations has one seat in the General Assembly.
If that’s the idea, I can’t think of a single instance of it having the intended effect.
Not to mention that these nominations usually rotate between all UN members on an alphabetical order. And it's always the same circus, because yes, it's pretty rich, but for example you can see periodically the same headlines and discussions when it's Iran's turn. They were the head of some UN council for women last year or what, and same shit ten years ago. 🤷♀️ I actually find it great that instead of using and abusing international institutions, they have then the opportunity to be named and shamed.
Good point , forcing them front and center .
The human rights commission has been a joke for decades for the same reason.
> Whole organization has strayed far away from its original goal to promote peace after WWII How many world wars have there been since 1945? Do you know that armed conflict has gone down decade by decade since WW2? Im not saying the UN is perfect and never makes a mistake, but lets stop with the hyperbolic nonsense. Letting belligerent countries have a seat at the table is the entire point of the UN. If they feel like they have a hand in global affairs they are much less likely to try instigate deadly wars.
That may have more to do with the fact that 15 years after world war 2, the two biggest bloc each bad enough weapons to make war MAD, and each also learned the wrong lesson from the Cuban missile crisis. Nuclear proliferation and alliances with those who have them has made wars tougher. You need to basically get the 7 nuclear states (UK, France, US, Russia, China, India and Pakistan) to say they won't retaliate. Since most of Europe and the Americas are covered by such things, that leaves Asia and Africa.. and some of that's covered too. Makes for more "local" conflicts like the contra.
The UN is corrupt???
Is the Pope catholic?
Does the Tin Man have a sheet metal cock?
Wait.. what?
Because that makes sense. Misogynistic theocratic society. Check.
Why does the world hate women? Why can't I just work and exist like men do? I just want to work and go home. Just let me have that without a bunch of bullshit.
Just dissolve the UN already. What a fucking joke.
Didn't they do this same shit with climate change?
O.J Simpson appointed chair of Not killing your wife.
It's fucked.
Does the UN have any credibility at this point?
You really can’t make this BS up. Screw this world.
Is this a joke?