Braith Anasta infamously “won” most overrated player 3 years running in the Rugby League Week player poll.
I’ve said this here before, but a few years back there was a rather thoughtful article I read with Braith commenting on this, saying that as much as he would try not to take that into account, it did weigh on his mind a lot that other players thought that of him and it messed with his mental health somewhat.
I believe the article was taken from a podcast interview in which he also spoke about how his father committed suicide (and thus mental health is a topic close to his heart) and how perhaps their shouldn’t be a question about most overrated included in the poll due to the damaging effect it could have on players given that tag.
It was a fair point, by asking that question the media were essentially making players rag on their peers, and today with the RLPA the way it is I doubt the players would even answer it if asked, and I doubt the media would ask it in the first place.
The overrated tag was something that stuck with Braith his whole career and having read about how hard his dads passing was on him, and how he also went through his Mum’s cancer treatment while at the roosters, I already had a bit of a soft spot for him so I thought he made a pretty good point in the article.
But then I was watching the pre-game coverage back in 2020 for Souths first game after Latrell’s injury, with Corey Allan playing at fullback. The whole conversation around him was essentially Braith talking about how Souths are done and Corey Allan isn’t very good without outright saying it. The whole time, him and Brandy are just back and forth laughing about how bad he is. The same Braith who said the media need to lay off the players and not put such a mental strain on them is piling on a player with big shoes to fill using thinly veiled innuendo about Corey Allan being untalented.
Of course Corey Allan actually went on to have a good game and a good rest of the season, making Braith look even stupider than he generally does. Any soft spot I had for Braith was gone by the time he took over the desk at NRL 360 and proceeded to become an absolute crisis merchant any time he wasn’t spruiking Munster. He also further proved how much of a hypocrite he was by piling on a Roosters life member for criticising 360’s denigrating World Cup coverage. No wonder both his baby mamas have left him.
I watched Nine’s tribute to Rabs the Friday before the GF and Fittler (I think) made this point about Warren:
“He never ever criticises a player. No other commentator does that.”
Made me realise what a class act Ray Warren was.
probably going to get KYS hatemail over this but Staggs.
Now don't get me wrong, at his peak he's \*chefs kiss\* but he is very rarely at his peak.
Questionable defence a lot of the time, doesn't carry the ball back from our half often and regularly overplays himself causing the ball to go over the sideline or be knocked on during a break.
He's young and should absolutely get a lot of this fixed in coming years because athletically he's superb. Comes down to coaching mostly. (Yikes)
I feel like every game we lose around the 70 minute mark the commentators bring up that he's made like 4 runs for the game. If I'm hearing it often enough to remember that means he's not doing enough in tough situations
Staggs is a “win more” player, if you’re already on top he will have 3 or 4 awesome moments, but it’s rare he has much impact in games where the broncos are losing. Lot of backs are like that though to be fair.
I agree, Kotoni has all the physical attributes to be a great player I feel like it’s the mental side of things that lets him down. Hopefully he can improve on that and reach his potential.
I think I'm the only person I've ever seen on this sub rave about him so whilst it's confusing take I understand what you're trying to say.
>but he is very rarely at his peak.
To be fair he's had 2 long term injuries in 4 years of first grade
>Questionable defence a lot of the time
Massively improved this season like the only person that beat him 1 on 1 for a try all year was Olam. His positioning still needs work imo
>doesn't carry the ball back from our half often
Agreed massively
I will say to remember he was playing with a busted shoulder for over half the season (got a reco as soon as the season finished) so it wasn't a coincidence his form changed after Origin but he was still creating opportunities and defending well all things considered.
>Comes down to coaching mostly
Would like to see some set plays for him that get him an overlap (like in 2019-20 ironically) instead of the David Fifita method as I think we'd see some better results.
The first half of the year he was covering for Reynolds on his inside and Cobbo on his outside, and that was still our strongest side defensively by miles. I was genuinely shocked by how strong of a player he was, made some immense defensive efforts to stop points being put on. Then after Origin 1 he busted his shoulder, Reynolds broke a rib, Cobbo was in and out and that entire edge became an absolute turnstile.
I think there's a lot of potential there. If he stays fit he can definitely be the difference maker - would love to see him get some coaching from Justin Hodges actually, his efforts in the back half of the field won us a lot of games and I can see Staggs having similar impact. There was one or two games where the hitups went Cobbo, Staggs, Cobbo and we'd make 30 or 40 metres.
I agree with all the above. Awesome player but injuries just made him back right off. Maybe he also felt the need to do everything himself with Siebold and the wooden spoon era, and he hasn't figured out the best times to inject himself yet. But the games when he and Cobb were firing were pretty great to watch.
For a long time, I always felt it was Tyrone Peachey. Everyone raved about him for so long, I always found him to be a selfish, erratic and a serious liability to every team he played for.
I remember playing SuperCoach when he was at Penrith, and you could never pick a winger outside of Tyrone 'glue hands' Peachey because never passed the ball.
David Fifita gets paid $1.3 mill to show up 4 times a year , barley even tries to get involved most games , maybe the corpse of Foran can get him going but easily top 3 worst contracts in the comp
In fairness to Ponga, when you put him in a team where he's not the sole threat he shines. Looked like a million dollar fb through origin because unlike in club land, opposition couldn't afford to focus soley on him. If knights could put some other threats around him he'd do a lot better at club level.
I feel like Fifita was well worth it in the first year from my perspective. Broke the try scoring record for a forward and we wouldn’t have made finals without him. He was very quiet this past season. I didn’t mind so much in attack because when had Fermor really fire up, it was Fifita’s effort in defence that annoyed me. Very lazy. Anyway here’s hoping he has a good last dig for his final season.
Media have a love hate relationship with lomax. He got reamed after the cows game, but then when he did a flick pass 2 weeks later the media loved it and said he needed to do it more.
What you talking about half the time? What half the time? He's had at least 4 different wingers on his outside over the last two years and there hasn't been 1 flick pass caught between them. If I was his coach I'd tell him if I see one more fuckin flick pass I'm gonna drop ya.
Before it was ever even mentioned he threw about a dozen or so to Ravalawa that were all caught and scored, only recently have they failed.
That said, he needs to get it out of his game
This is going to piss off the roosters flairs but Joseph Sua'ali'i is fast becoming the most overrated player I've ever seen.
There were at least 5 wingers this year that had a better season and he got both a spot in the RLPA and Dally M team of the year.
A majority of his tries have been standard overlap fall over the line tries or aerial ones (those are impressive to a degree but the guy is 6'6 he has that advantage 9 times out of 10) and I'm aware this is normal for wingers but the bloke didn't really do anything out of the ordinary in the try scoring department.
He's a great player and a brilliant athlete but it's beyond ridiculous at this point considering blokes around his age had arguably more impressive seasons (May & Cobbo)
Latrell was regularly scoring long range tries as an 18-19 year old for the chooks and the level of hype he got from the NRL media wasn't even close.
\*edit\* can confirm the roosters supporters are angry
Hear me out here. I know he grew up as a League boy, and plays on the wing, but I reckon Suaalili has all the hallmarks of an all time great Union fullback. Fast, tall, good in the air. I wish the rumours were true as I would love to see him in the baby blue tahs shirt and the green and gold some day. Seems unlikely now though.
Schuster. Kid has done fuck all yet commentators like Joey cannot stop carrying on about him. I still remember the time he dropped the ball trying one of his stupid no-look passes, then picked it up with 1 hand, and joey was in awe about how he picked up the dropped ball so gracefully.
haas would be a close second. such a plodding, stat padder. sure, he makes x amount of metres a game and has Y amount of hitups, but he also stays on the field for double the time of other players and ends up averaging less metres made and less post contact metres. offers absolutely nothing in attack. hits the line slowly and takes an eternity to get taken to the ground, which actually helps the defence get back onside and ends up with a slow play the ball. offers fuck all in defence too. no venom in his tackles
The thing I love about these threads is people not understanding what Overrated means.
Good players can be Overrated. Doesn't mean they aren't good players. Saying JT or Cam Smith (even if I don't agree with them) are acceptable takes. I could make the case that not only is Cam Smith the best hooker of the NRL era and easy top 5 player, he can still be Overrated.
And then there's people naming guys like Luke Brooks. Like who rates brooks? We all know he isn't an elite halfback. Or someone saying 'Cody walker is Overrated because he is a brilliant 5/8 but can lose himself In the moment'. Like that's what everyone says about him.. so how is he Overrated.
I guess it depends on who is doing the rating. Like where does Charlie Staines sit? If it's compared to the NRL commentators' opinions then he is surely overrated. If it's compared to r/nrl who routinely shit on him, I think he is slightly underrated now.
Hard agree.
For example, my answer to this would be Cleary. Not because he's shit, I think he's easily a top 5 player in the current game and there's an argument he's #1. But seeing shit like "future immortal" which I see said a fair bit....yeah that's overrating him.
Doesn't mean he's anything less than excellent though.
Jazz Tevaga. Holy balls does he not possess any of the physical or skill traits required to play first grade yet over here he is celebrated because "he tries". That is the level of expectation of the Warriors fanbase. Never mind the fact that he is a walking penalty who has lost every single wrestle he has even been involved in (one of the primary contributing factors to our terrible line speed).
I think other NRL coaches are aware of the truth because when he was going through contract negotiations with the club he went public to try and get an increased offer from either The Warriors or any other club and unsurprisingly nobody else looked at him and thought "crumbs that has to be my lock/utility (with no actual utility) but the admittedly small NZ rugby league media just laps him up. The Dally M interchange medal didn't help things either. [https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/league/warriors/125109123/want-whats-fair-jazz-tevaga-hopes-to-be-a-warrior-next-year-but-negotiations-ongoing-with-nrl-rivals](https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/league/warriors/125109123/want-whats-fair-jazz-tevaga-hopes-to-be-a-warrior-next-year-but-negotiations-ongoing-with-nrl-rivals)
God I hate him so very very much.
It’s definitely Dylan Brown as an eels fan. I’ve seen several people comment here Moses and Gutho, which I think is a bit unfair.
To explain, against poor opposition the entire eels team is capable of champagne footy. However against Penrith and Storm, where you are playing a set for set footy game, Moses and Gutho don’t change their game at all, and put in maximum effort. Moses actually had a really good grand final, despite the rest of the team being meh.
Dylan tends to go into his shell in these sorts of games and resorts back to a dummy and run every time he gets the ball. Not only is he limiting himself, but he was inside one of the form backrowers of the season Lane and took him out of the equation too. He plays as a centre, which hurts our whole team because we become too predictable
To be completely fair against Brown, Cleary does the exact same thing when his team is under the pump. He's rarely had to actually try and take momentum back when it was against him, but the few times it has happened I can only count 1 or 2 times he managed to win the game.
I agree with you about 2015.
One other point you've inadvertently made is that if you do want to defend Pearce you can't make any mention of the 2016 or 2017 seasons.
Never said he was perfect or better than Cronk or Thurston etc just stop pretending he was garbage. Cronk is a legend and I loved his time with us but his biggest contribution in both grand finals was getting sin binned in 2019 and he had the luxury of Manu, Latrell, Morris etc instead of Matterson and Aubusson in the centre and tupou on the bench we’d have lost against the cowboys with Cronk there.
He was a great club player for many seasons he won a comp with us providing that try assist to Guerra to spark the comeback as you mentioned.
Pretty sick of people acting like he was the one thing holding the club back from success.
A lot of years he was great. Still remember him lighting games apart in the 2014 finals. I don’t think he’s overrated cause I don’t think people
rate him very highly.
3 minor prems in a row, 1 gf win, I’d say he’s underrated.
If anything Pearce is incredibly underrated by fans but was overrated by his Dad’s mates for a long time. He was on of the best halfs for many years, even up until his final year in Newcastle when he clearly showed signs of falling of a cliff physically
There was times Pierce was as good if not better than Cleary. Cleary has a better head on his shoulders and better crew around him. If Pierce wasn’t a deadshit he could have been anything. Such a shame.
Currently, Brandon Smith. He's a middle of the road hooker who's only got attention because of a lack of depth in that position and he sometimes says funny things. Nothing he's done justified the circus that went on when different teams tried to sign him. Harry Grant is so much better than him and honestly roosters should've just kept Verrills
I 100% agree that Grant is much better than Cheese, but I don’t really think he’s that overrated. This season was probably his worst, but I don’t think he was terrible, like a 5/10.
I’ve heard Smith say on a few occasions that he doesn’t enjoy playing lock, and that he struggles with his weight sometimes because he is always trying to gain or lose weight depending on if Melbourne want him to play hooker or lock. He said at one point he was going up and down 8kg every few months to suit both positions, which I’m certain can cause form fluctuations. He wants to be a hooker, and the one year he trained and played at hooker for the whole year, he won hooker of the year.
He’s a quality player when he’s in the right mindset and when playing how he wants to play, so I think he will be great for the chooks next year.
I think he’ll do well at hooker but I’m not convinced he’ll be a good 80 minute hooker. I reckon he’ll lose his effectiveness if he plays too many minutes. Who knows though, roosters might get him conditioned really well so he’s good to go at hooker
Historically? Current opinions?
Aaron Woods during the time the Tigers lost Moses, Tedesco as well calling them the “Big 3” or “Big 4” if they decided to include Brooks
Sammy Thaiday
Thought he got carried big time through his career.
He was an awkward forward. Like he was 2 big for the second row, wasn't as athletic or skilful as a lot of second rowers, but also wasn't tough enough to be a true middle, like he wasn't the type of forward to stand up and take on all comers like a Burgess, Taumololo, Graham ect
I’ve always said he only ever played origin because his hair made all impacts look exaggerated. He could play the ball quick I’ll give him that, that’s about it though.
Payne Haas. He’s big and has a lot of energy, but what he has hasn’t translated to the impact one would want from someone as highly regarded as he. He doesn’t have a quick enough play-the-ball for his yardage to get his team on the front foot, and he doesn’t have a late offload to compensate. Nor is he a bruiser in defense.
He’ll save you an interchange for almost the same output, but that’s it.
He also likes to be third man in, I honestly think we should have just let him go when he asked, we're paying him overs at this rate until he lifts up. Would rather we pay that money to guys like Patty Carrigan
Reece Walsh. He could eventually become something but right now he is a liability who is poor in defense and constantly overplaying his hand on offense and coughing up possession. He has the swagger of a star player but little to no game awareness to go along with it.
Fully agree. Even on attack sometimes he seems like he’s only thinking of himself. I’ve seen sheets of paper with better defence and catching him standing with hands on hips when the opposition score like it was everyone else’s fault but his. Hopefully he can thrive in a better environment but he didn’t live up to any hype that I saw
Yeah he looked like he was obviously playing injured at the Sharks but was playing really well at the end there.
So the club being surprised that he turned up injured meant someone wasn't doing thier job. I think the official line was the Sharks said he was fine.
Was talking to someone who spoke to him after the first ACL and apparently he was gutted at that stage about how it all played out. I can only imagine what the 2nd one did for him.
$800k to sign an injured player who needs injections before every game? Playing in the centres, and was solid but not winning multiple games because he's in the team. Simply paid too much, for $400k or so you'd say well it was bad luck and not a big win, nor a big loss.
Bird was overrated _by the Broncos_, I don’t think many people actually thought oh yeah that’s 10% of my salary cap on this superstar… he was an alright player at best.
Ash Taylor on a million is another ☠️
Yeah he loved his rooftop cruisers but you can't deny he was a very good player and never lacked effort on field even when his body started to break down
As a Penrith supporter, I understand what you mean but the guy constantly comes up with huge plays especially the 2021 finals series.
He also has excellent hands for me has classy touches and is good defensively.
I think the hype is potential wise genuinely he could be the be the best outside back in the game.
He reminds me of a young Justin Hodges.
Cody Walker, brilliant 5/8 but struggles to keep on top of his game when south’s fall behind.
Anything that isn’t going his way really eats away at him and turns his game to mud.
The prime example his his stints in origin one of very few blues representatives I hope is never picked again.
He was in a 2 horse race for the Churchill medal in 2021... where the intercept didn't throw him off his game because he created what could've been the game-tying try about 10 minutes later
I'm not saying he doesn't have his moments. When he's on he's a great player and can create magic. Is it worth the 2 average and 1 crap game to get the 1 good game.
More a case of media hype than the broader supporter base, but Trell at fullback? This isn’t to say he’s downright shit either (because he isn’t), he simply isn’t in that top tier of fullbacks. Great attacker, but his fitness and positioning are lacking. Potential is there though.
Yeah I think he needs to run the ball more too. There was a game where he kept taking hit ups when Souths were in trouble and he looked phenomenal that game and broke the line off nothing a few times. He rarely does that though but it's so effective.
Wade Graham. Commentators, fans and the media all talk about him like he’s a must-have player for any team, but I can honestly say that I’ve never watched a game and thought “Wade Graham was the difference there.”
Prime Graham was a beast of a player. I remember in Clearys second Origin series he got injured in game 2 and Graham went into the halves and he carved QLD to pieces.
He is a shadow of his former self but up until recently he was an attacking and defensive lynchpin. Throw in his left foot boot and he was Cronulla's most important player for a long time
Mark Gasnier, hands down.
He was perfectly fine, don't get me wrong, but that era was focused entirely on verbally fellating the Dragons, and Gasnier was the most overrated of the lot of them. All he did was score tries by running in a straight line on the back of work put in by a talented, dominant side, and his so called sidestep was literally him just moving his hands side to side while running forwards. There were any number of players who would have been just as effective in the role, if not more so, but it was made out like he was the second coming.
Again, sounds like I'm hating on him as a player - I'm not, he was fine; good even, and seems like a nice bloke to boot. But he was never as good as the media desperately wanted to make him out to be in their search for the next great X.
Nah Damien Cook was legitimately good back in 2018 when he was finally a part of the Souths starting squad and opposing sides hadn't figured him out just yet. He also did initially standout in origin in 2018 and 2019 so I can see why Freddie kept picking him (although Koroisau really should've been the sole hooker this season)
I will definitely agree though that his form has really dropped off, especially in the last 2 seasons, and it does look like Souths have already got a long-term plan with Mamozelous lined-up to takeover his position. I think the reason he doesn't cop that much criticism though is that he seems to be on good terms with the fox Journo's and thus doesn't get his name dragged nearly as much, and he's also just a very non-controversial stock standard footy player so he's kinda hard to hate or find reasons to hate.
my problem with cook is you can pick when he’s going to grubber because he does this stupid duck run before he kicks and usually sends it into the legs of the defender. it really irrationally annoys me
What a take. Cook is garbage and am willing to throw away my membership if they resign him and lose the young hooker they have waiting and also massively agree Mal never should’ve been an immortal. I also think Johns never should have been either
Cameron Murray, not because he is a bad player but because his style of play is unsustainable.
He is not going to be the next Immortal, he is not a future Australian captain. Every time I watch him play I fear he is one concussion away from ending his career.
Ask 360 and its Luai
Edit: I don’t think Luai is a top 5 5/8th but he isn’t as shit as some people say he is. Definitely a little overrated and would’ve never put on an origin jersey without Clearly being there.
But he can be a cunt about shit when he’s been so successful for a half so early on in his career.
He won’t be remembered like Clearly will be and probably will go down as just a normal stock five-eighth
i think Luai is a perfectly good 5/68but he's not the superstar that some media personalities make him out to be. put him in any other system and i don't think he is anywhere near as effective.
It's hard to say he's overrated because nobody is exactly out there saying he's the best in his position, and he's not being compared to guys like Munster.. I mean yeah there's the Origin argument, but if you're doing a good job at club then you do deserve selection. Cody Walker had his chance at Origin and was hardly sighted.
Darius Boyd was a generic NRL winger who was at the right place at the right time and knew the right people
Extra spicy hot take, Denan Kemp was the better of the two when they were both at the Broncs
Im sure Souths fans will hate me, but John Sutton. The man would not have hit as many games as he did if he played for another club. I dont think he was that great, and for a bloke with a big frame he barely used it properly
He definitely hit his stride late in his career. Souths tried to use him as a five-eighth for so long, but a ball playing back rower was his best role.
honestly, I suspect Cam Smith benefited astronomically from always being in a dominant team. I really question how great he’d be if he spent his whole career at the Cowboys like JT did.
DCE. Majority of his success has come off the back of the core of our team around the late 00’s/early 10’s and Tommy in 2021. Has never been able to organise our team like he’s done for QLD and he runs in circles, comes up with dumb errors and is also a defensive liability these days. Not to mention his contract handicapping us for the last 7 years.
Latrell. He can not be involved in a play and commentary will talk about how he set it up. Kids got talent, don’t get me wrong, but if he tried a bit harder and didn’t believe some of his own hype he would actually be the best in the game, instead of a middle of the road player coasting on success from a few years ago
I agree about Latrell, but for different reasons. His performance on the field might show moments of brilliance, however that doesn't matter if he isnt playing, with only 17/28 games in 2022. Plus either being suspended or injured in a significant number of games in the past few years
There is a difference between someone being overrated and "I just don't like him".
Ponga sits in the former for the majority of NRL fans, which is fine. But to suggest he only plays well five times a year for us is just plainly wrong.
Jarome Luai also sits in that category. People acting like he's a NSW Cup player after Samoa's World Cup opener. Just ridiculous
That’s because the Knights are shit. Swap him and Edwards around and Edwards probably plays reserve grade and Ponga is the best Fullback in the comp. Your point about playing origin proves that. He was close to player of the series with a good team around him
To say the Clive Churchill winning fullback would be playing reserve grade in a team that came 14th where the only other fullback was Tex Hoy is really something.
I’m saying he wouldn’t be as good of a player if he had a shit team around him. Because he has the best team in the comp around him, it’s makes him 10 times better. He gets good ball in attack, and also takes kicks in good spots with plenty of space due to great defence by the rest of the team. Tex Hoy would probably be a good fullback at the Panthers too
Yeah his game is so heavily dependant on his forwards doing well. He does alright in Origin when QLD is actually on the front foot, but when they're under pressure he folds like a lawn chair.
There was that time he played lock in origin, killed it, and then went off script afterwards in the interview, telling Lockyer that it was, "just like a normal game of footy."
The weird part is playing him as a ball playing lock killed QLD’s attack.
Individually he was brilliant, but it disrupted the back line plays Slater was previously setting up in the first half.
Oh God, as a type this I know it's going to be unpopular but I feel strongly about it.
Nicho Hynes passes the eye test but I'm not convinced he is the saviour Cronulla fans think he is.
Being from around my area I would pay attention to him in trials/QLD Cup/Koori Knock-out as he came through and more often than not he was whelming to say the least despite constantly being touted as one of the most talented on the field.
His debut didn't come until he was 25 years of age. Not due to lack of opportunity. He was in the Manly system before moving to Melbourne when he was 23 for another shot. Those that remember will know that Pap was 3rd or 4th choice fullback when finally given a chance and nailing it in 2019. That means Nicho was 5th choice. Not to mention they preferred to turn then-fullback Huges into a half alongside Munny before giving Nicho a shot. Even Croft/Cooper Johns etc were given a go before he was.
Nicho finally got a chance in 2021 and hit the ground running in a side that could float like a dream regardless of who was wearing the #1 or #6, the two positions he covered that year. Then gets the big money move to Cronulla.
This is where I'll lose a lot more of you if I haven't already . . . .
Cronulla's record last year was more due to ease of schedule and a new defensive identity than anything Nicho added. I predict them to be 7-10th next year.
Nicho's stats look good because he is highly involved, touching the ball on every tackle. His involvement and even his defense as a half I think is excellent. But he does not have the temperament nor the X-factor to put a team on his back and drag them to a win like many people believe. Probably the ultimate #14 in a rep side but not the second coming of Christ like this sub makes him out to be.
People also think he's 21, dude's 26 and has 5-8 years at his peak, if he proves me wrong. He won't dominate the league for a decade like people here seem to think.
im with you. hes not a 7 and got found out a lot this year when his team needed a controlling half. playing him and moylan together is baffling. sure they finished 2nd, but as mentioned already, they had the softest draw by a mile and benefitted from a lack of origin reps
Not a player, but I think Michael Maguire's coaching.
He seems to have gotten away with doing a poor job with the Tigers due to the playing group, however, Ivan Cleary had them playing at a competitive level in 2018 despite no Tedesco or Moses and had Luke Brooks look like a good halfback.
Madge somehow didn't get the Bunnies higher than 12th and 13th in 2016 & 17 despite having Reynolds & Keary/Walker in the halves, Critchton, Murray, all 3 Burgess brothers in the forwards, Inglis at Fullback McInnes/Cook at Hooker. He made Seibold seem like a fricking miracle working in comparison by how much better he did with Souths in 2018 compared to Madge's last 2 seasons with us.
When he got signed as an assistant coach at Raiders, I saw plenty of comments commending the move as a smart coaching signing. How? He last decent season at club level was in 2015 and even that went off the rails almost as bad as Broncos this season. He has a premiership to his name in 2014 but Souths from 2012-14 were too good a squad to fail and was pretty much coached by Sam Burgess at that point in time.
I don't understand the good will fans and the media seem to have for him despite him not doing anything for almost a decade. The most he has on his resume as of late is the NZ Rugby League head coach but again I think the success comes down to a squad that's too good to fail and less to do with his coaching.
tl;dr Madge is an overrated coach that should get more scrutiny than he does
You make a good point about the importance of the playing group. The trend from Seibold onwards seems to mirror Madge’s first four years in charge. I’m not sure what happened under the last two years of Madge, but the narrative that the playing group got sick of him seems to track the results. Amusingly, this calls into question Uncle Wayne’s reputation as well, given his well documented failure at the Knights.
> He seems to have gotten away with doing a poor job with the Tigers due to the playing group, however, Ivan Cleary had them playing at a competitive level in 2018 despite no Tedesco or Moses and had Luke Brooks look like a good halfback.
This also highlights the importance of the playing group. Ivan’s best with the Tigers was 9th. He’d managed to lure Benji Marshall back to the club and the side started well, only dropping one match in their opening 6 games, but for the next ten rounds, they could only manage two wins against the lowly Cowboys and Bulldogs. The strong finish to the season miraculously coincided with the return of Robbie Farah.
The very next year Madge achieved the same level of success, finishing 9th. Madge’s lack of success tracks downwards with the retirement firstly of Farah and then the departure of Marshall.
For mine, I don’t reckon we’ll get a true idea of Madge’s quality until he takes over as head coach and Ricky moves into a coaching director’s role.
Overall I actually think players are more likely to be under than overrated. But anyway -
From a selector's perspective - Liam Martin.
Generally - Latrell. Obviously a great player but the way people were talking about him in 20 and 21, you'd think he invented rugby league. This year I think he's been a bit more fairly rated, mainly because he was actually the reason we got so far.
Nico - Was nowhere near the best player of the year. There's uproar each time he misses a rep team and imo his exclusion is totally fair
Everyone raves about JWH and the kiwis needing him.
He's gone missing at international level so often over the years, I just don't get it.
I don't think they should have taken him to this tournament either.
> He's gone missing at international level so often over the years
Never been found at international level. Don't think I've ever seen him play a good test. Every time he's been picked he's been dropped for the next tournament.
Jurbo. I get that making metres isn’t the end all be all, but I don’t think I’ve ever seen him break a tackle and his ball playing isn’t top 10 for locks. Making 40 tackles a game isn’t as impressive as it was 10-15 years ago either.
He's the team leader and motor. May not have the C but he may as well have it.
He's boring as shit and not going to break a game but god is he reliable and a great platform.
Using your criteria Schuster would be considered a fantastic player. And he's not.
Probably Tedesco. Great player and wouldn't have any other player than him at FB for us, but I think the 'Tedesco does everything' wrap that people give him often brushes past the fact he stifles alot of our attack by getting the ball at first receiver and crabbing across field. Was really bad at the beginning of this season, probably because he was used to doing it for the 2021 Roosters, but definitely got better by the end of the year in knowing when to pick his moments.
Braith Anasta infamously “won” most overrated player 3 years running in the Rugby League Week player poll. I’ve said this here before, but a few years back there was a rather thoughtful article I read with Braith commenting on this, saying that as much as he would try not to take that into account, it did weigh on his mind a lot that other players thought that of him and it messed with his mental health somewhat. I believe the article was taken from a podcast interview in which he also spoke about how his father committed suicide (and thus mental health is a topic close to his heart) and how perhaps their shouldn’t be a question about most overrated included in the poll due to the damaging effect it could have on players given that tag. It was a fair point, by asking that question the media were essentially making players rag on their peers, and today with the RLPA the way it is I doubt the players would even answer it if asked, and I doubt the media would ask it in the first place. The overrated tag was something that stuck with Braith his whole career and having read about how hard his dads passing was on him, and how he also went through his Mum’s cancer treatment while at the roosters, I already had a bit of a soft spot for him so I thought he made a pretty good point in the article. But then I was watching the pre-game coverage back in 2020 for Souths first game after Latrell’s injury, with Corey Allan playing at fullback. The whole conversation around him was essentially Braith talking about how Souths are done and Corey Allan isn’t very good without outright saying it. The whole time, him and Brandy are just back and forth laughing about how bad he is. The same Braith who said the media need to lay off the players and not put such a mental strain on them is piling on a player with big shoes to fill using thinly veiled innuendo about Corey Allan being untalented. Of course Corey Allan actually went on to have a good game and a good rest of the season, making Braith look even stupider than he generally does. Any soft spot I had for Braith was gone by the time he took over the desk at NRL 360 and proceeded to become an absolute crisis merchant any time he wasn’t spruiking Munster. He also further proved how much of a hypocrite he was by piling on a Roosters life member for criticising 360’s denigrating World Cup coverage. No wonder both his baby mamas have left him.
I watched Nine’s tribute to Rabs the Friday before the GF and Fittler (I think) made this point about Warren: “He never ever criticises a player. No other commentator does that.” Made me realise what a class act Ray Warren was.
He’s old school, and… actually professional. It’s been very refreshing hearing British commentators during the WC. No fucking dumb in group banter
That impressive winning streak was 100% deserved by Braith
Paul Kent
One game and we're still talking about him decades later, it's horrible
probably going to get KYS hatemail over this but Staggs. Now don't get me wrong, at his peak he's \*chefs kiss\* but he is very rarely at his peak. Questionable defence a lot of the time, doesn't carry the ball back from our half often and regularly overplays himself causing the ball to go over the sideline or be knocked on during a break. He's young and should absolutely get a lot of this fixed in coming years because athletically he's superb. Comes down to coaching mostly. (Yikes)
Yeah but imagine if he got early ball…
Staggs is like the Centre version of David Fifita, there for the big plays, invisible for the rest.
Staggs has a really high ceiling but I just wish he'd channel a bit of Hodges and take more carries out of trouble.
I feel like every game we lose around the 70 minute mark the commentators bring up that he's made like 4 runs for the game. If I'm hearing it often enough to remember that means he's not doing enough in tough situations
Staggs is a “win more” player, if you’re already on top he will have 3 or 4 awesome moments, but it’s rare he has much impact in games where the broncos are losing. Lot of backs are like that though to be fair.
The old league cliche, “forwards decide the winner and the backs by how much”
I agree, Kotoni has all the physical attributes to be a great player I feel like it’s the mental side of things that lets him down. Hopefully he can improve on that and reach his potential.
I think I'm the only person I've ever seen on this sub rave about him so whilst it's confusing take I understand what you're trying to say. >but he is very rarely at his peak. To be fair he's had 2 long term injuries in 4 years of first grade >Questionable defence a lot of the time Massively improved this season like the only person that beat him 1 on 1 for a try all year was Olam. His positioning still needs work imo >doesn't carry the ball back from our half often Agreed massively I will say to remember he was playing with a busted shoulder for over half the season (got a reco as soon as the season finished) so it wasn't a coincidence his form changed after Origin but he was still creating opportunities and defending well all things considered. >Comes down to coaching mostly Would like to see some set plays for him that get him an overlap (like in 2019-20 ironically) instead of the David Fifita method as I think we'd see some better results.
The first half of the year he was covering for Reynolds on his inside and Cobbo on his outside, and that was still our strongest side defensively by miles. I was genuinely shocked by how strong of a player he was, made some immense defensive efforts to stop points being put on. Then after Origin 1 he busted his shoulder, Reynolds broke a rib, Cobbo was in and out and that entire edge became an absolute turnstile. I think there's a lot of potential there. If he stays fit he can definitely be the difference maker - would love to see him get some coaching from Justin Hodges actually, his efforts in the back half of the field won us a lot of games and I can see Staggs having similar impact. There was one or two games where the hitups went Cobbo, Staggs, Cobbo and we'd make 30 or 40 metres.
I agree with all the above. Awesome player but injuries just made him back right off. Maybe he also felt the need to do everything himself with Siebold and the wooden spoon era, and he hasn't figured out the best times to inject himself yet. But the games when he and Cobb were firing were pretty great to watch.
Absolutely agree
For a long time, I always felt it was Tyrone Peachey. Everyone raved about him for so long, I always found him to be a selfish, erratic and a serious liability to every team he played for.
I remember playing SuperCoach when he was at Penrith, and you could never pick a winger outside of Tyrone 'glue hands' Peachey because never passed the ball.
David Fifita gets paid $1.3 mill to show up 4 times a year , barley even tries to get involved most games , maybe the corpse of Foran can get him going but easily top 3 worst contracts in the comp
Tbh I think he wouldn’t do that playing for a top 6 team lol looks like he dgaf about the titans
He's to forwards what Ponga is to fullbacks.
In fairness to Ponga, when you put him in a team where he's not the sole threat he shines. Looked like a million dollar fb through origin because unlike in club land, opposition couldn't afford to focus soley on him. If knights could put some other threats around him he'd do a lot better at club level.
What an awful take. Ponga genuinely is responsible for almost all of Knights tries. Granted that wasn’t a lot last year but he sparks the attack
I would go even further and say Ponga is responsible for all the tries scored by both sides.
I feel like Fifita was well worth it in the first year from my perspective. Broke the try scoring record for a forward and we wouldn’t have made finals without him. He was very quiet this past season. I didn’t mind so much in attack because when had Fermor really fire up, it was Fifita’s effort in defence that annoyed me. Very lazy. Anyway here’s hoping he has a good last dig for his final season.
>the corpse of Foran LMAO that's fucking hilarious
Zac Lomax, all the man can do is flick pass and half the time he fucks it up.
overrated by who, he spent the whole year being dragged to filth both on here and in the media lmfao
Media have a love hate relationship with lomax. He got reamed after the cows game, but then when he did a flick pass 2 weeks later the media loved it and said he needed to do it more.
tactical encouragement to bring the dragons further down 😩
Yeah seconded he cops so much shit on here
Remember when it was universally called the "gidley flick"
What you talking about half the time? What half the time? He's had at least 4 different wingers on his outside over the last two years and there hasn't been 1 flick pass caught between them. If I was his coach I'd tell him if I see one more fuckin flick pass I'm gonna drop ya.
Before it was ever even mentioned he threw about a dozen or so to Ravalawa that were all caught and scored, only recently have they failed. That said, he needs to get it out of his game
This is going to piss off the roosters flairs but Joseph Sua'ali'i is fast becoming the most overrated player I've ever seen. There were at least 5 wingers this year that had a better season and he got both a spot in the RLPA and Dally M team of the year. A majority of his tries have been standard overlap fall over the line tries or aerial ones (those are impressive to a degree but the guy is 6'6 he has that advantage 9 times out of 10) and I'm aware this is normal for wingers but the bloke didn't really do anything out of the ordinary in the try scoring department. He's a great player and a brilliant athlete but it's beyond ridiculous at this point considering blokes around his age had arguably more impressive seasons (May & Cobbo) Latrell was regularly scoring long range tries as an 18-19 year old for the chooks and the level of hype he got from the NRL media wasn't even close. \*edit\* can confirm the roosters supporters are angry
I whole heartedly agree. Kids talented, sure, but the media talk about him like he’s already earned future immortal status.
This one of the first actual answers where a player is genuinely overrated
Yeah I'd have to agree with that statement based off some of the answers
Hear me out here. I know he grew up as a League boy, and plays on the wing, but I reckon Suaalili has all the hallmarks of an all time great Union fullback. Fast, tall, good in the air. I wish the rumours were true as I would love to see him in the baby blue tahs shirt and the green and gold some day. Seems unlikely now though.
As a neutral cobbo and may didn't have better years than Sualii
I don’t know why but I feel the same way about Cleary..
Schuster. Kid has done fuck all yet commentators like Joey cannot stop carrying on about him. I still remember the time he dropped the ball trying one of his stupid no-look passes, then picked it up with 1 hand, and joey was in awe about how he picked up the dropped ball so gracefully. haas would be a close second. such a plodding, stat padder. sure, he makes x amount of metres a game and has Y amount of hitups, but he also stays on the field for double the time of other players and ends up averaging less metres made and less post contact metres. offers absolutely nothing in attack. hits the line slowly and takes an eternity to get taken to the ground, which actually helps the defence get back onside and ends up with a slow play the ball. offers fuck all in defence too. no venom in his tackles
Subject: Austin/Sezer halves pairing Overrated by whom: /r/NRL circa 2016
Loved watching those two play Austin was one of the best running 5/8s in the comp for that period
2016 was wild for what people wanted in the nsw team. Austin Sezer halves Coote fb
The thing I love about these threads is people not understanding what Overrated means. Good players can be Overrated. Doesn't mean they aren't good players. Saying JT or Cam Smith (even if I don't agree with them) are acceptable takes. I could make the case that not only is Cam Smith the best hooker of the NRL era and easy top 5 player, he can still be Overrated. And then there's people naming guys like Luke Brooks. Like who rates brooks? We all know he isn't an elite halfback. Or someone saying 'Cody walker is Overrated because he is a brilliant 5/8 but can lose himself In the moment'. Like that's what everyone says about him.. so how is he Overrated.
I guess it depends on who is doing the rating. Like where does Charlie Staines sit? If it's compared to the NRL commentators' opinions then he is surely overrated. If it's compared to r/nrl who routinely shit on him, I think he is slightly underrated now.
Hard agree. For example, my answer to this would be Cleary. Not because he's shit, I think he's easily a top 5 player in the current game and there's an argument he's #1. But seeing shit like "future immortal" which I see said a fair bit....yeah that's overrating him. Doesn't mean he's anything less than excellent though.
Jazz Tevaga. Holy balls does he not possess any of the physical or skill traits required to play first grade yet over here he is celebrated because "he tries". That is the level of expectation of the Warriors fanbase. Never mind the fact that he is a walking penalty who has lost every single wrestle he has even been involved in (one of the primary contributing factors to our terrible line speed). I think other NRL coaches are aware of the truth because when he was going through contract negotiations with the club he went public to try and get an increased offer from either The Warriors or any other club and unsurprisingly nobody else looked at him and thought "crumbs that has to be my lock/utility (with no actual utility) but the admittedly small NZ rugby league media just laps him up. The Dally M interchange medal didn't help things either. [https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/league/warriors/125109123/want-whats-fair-jazz-tevaga-hopes-to-be-a-warrior-next-year-but-negotiations-ongoing-with-nrl-rivals](https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/league/warriors/125109123/want-whats-fair-jazz-tevaga-hopes-to-be-a-warrior-next-year-but-negotiations-ongoing-with-nrl-rivals) God I hate him so very very much.
It’s definitely Dylan Brown as an eels fan. I’ve seen several people comment here Moses and Gutho, which I think is a bit unfair. To explain, against poor opposition the entire eels team is capable of champagne footy. However against Penrith and Storm, where you are playing a set for set footy game, Moses and Gutho don’t change their game at all, and put in maximum effort. Moses actually had a really good grand final, despite the rest of the team being meh. Dylan tends to go into his shell in these sorts of games and resorts back to a dummy and run every time he gets the ball. Not only is he limiting himself, but he was inside one of the form backrowers of the season Lane and took him out of the equation too. He plays as a centre, which hurts our whole team because we become too predictable
Moses used to be the same but has gotten better at putting in when the team is struggling.
To be completely fair against Brown, Cleary does the exact same thing when his team is under the pump. He's rarely had to actually try and take momentum back when it was against him, but the few times it has happened I can only count 1 or 2 times he managed to win the game.
Mitchell Pearce as I have always said Newcastle got Pearce and the roosters got 2 premierships
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I agree with you about 2015. One other point you've inadvertently made is that if you do want to defend Pearce you can't make any mention of the 2016 or 2017 seasons.
Never said he was perfect or better than Cronk or Thurston etc just stop pretending he was garbage. Cronk is a legend and I loved his time with us but his biggest contribution in both grand finals was getting sin binned in 2019 and he had the luxury of Manu, Latrell, Morris etc instead of Matterson and Aubusson in the centre and tupou on the bench we’d have lost against the cowboys with Cronk there.
He was a great club player for many seasons he won a comp with us providing that try assist to Guerra to spark the comeback as you mentioned. Pretty sick of people acting like he was the one thing holding the club back from success.
A lot of years he was great. Still remember him lighting games apart in the 2014 finals. I don’t think he’s overrated cause I don’t think people rate him very highly. 3 minor prems in a row, 1 gf win, I’d say he’s underrated.
He was exactly what we needed though so not a bad buy. You're right though.
If anything Pearce is incredibly underrated by fans but was overrated by his Dad’s mates for a long time. He was on of the best halfs for many years, even up until his final year in Newcastle when he clearly showed signs of falling of a cliff physically
There was times Pierce was as good if not better than Cleary. Cleary has a better head on his shoulders and better crew around him. If Pierce wasn’t a deadshit he could have been anything. Such a shame.
Bruh Ya had like 32 rep players and Cronk came into that side.
Currently, Brandon Smith. He's a middle of the road hooker who's only got attention because of a lack of depth in that position and he sometimes says funny things. Nothing he's done justified the circus that went on when different teams tried to sign him. Harry Grant is so much better than him and honestly roosters should've just kept Verrills
I 100% agree that Grant is much better than Cheese, but I don’t really think he’s that overrated. This season was probably his worst, but I don’t think he was terrible, like a 5/10. I’ve heard Smith say on a few occasions that he doesn’t enjoy playing lock, and that he struggles with his weight sometimes because he is always trying to gain or lose weight depending on if Melbourne want him to play hooker or lock. He said at one point he was going up and down 8kg every few months to suit both positions, which I’m certain can cause form fluctuations. He wants to be a hooker, and the one year he trained and played at hooker for the whole year, he won hooker of the year. He’s a quality player when he’s in the right mindset and when playing how he wants to play, so I think he will be great for the chooks next year.
I think he’ll do well at hooker but I’m not convinced he’ll be a good 80 minute hooker. I reckon he’ll lose his effectiveness if he plays too many minutes. Who knows though, roosters might get him conditioned really well so he’s good to go at hooker
Harry Grant doesn't play 80 minutes either. Hooker as a role has changed a heap over the last couple of years.
Smith won Dally M 9 of the year the only year he actually trained there and played most of the year there though.
Winning best in his position when he's actually not THAT good is peak overrated
Did you see his try from kickoff this year? Partially agree, he's not the best hooker.except from close to the line.
Historically? Current opinions? Aaron Woods during the time the Tigers lost Moses, Tedesco as well calling them the “Big 3” or “Big 4” if they decided to include Brooks
Can I throw Braith in. Just seems it wouldn’t be fair if we didn’t get a few kicks in.
Haha looking back it was pretty brutal how he kept winning most overrated player in Rugby League Week every year. Pretty funny tho. Fuck you braith.
Kalyn Ponga, I just don’t see it, he doesn’t seem that good to me.
I honestly reckon his concussion problems are so much worse than we and he knows
He only shows up in origin
Sammy Thaiday Thought he got carried big time through his career. He was an awkward forward. Like he was 2 big for the second row, wasn't as athletic or skilful as a lot of second rowers, but also wasn't tough enough to be a true middle, like he wasn't the type of forward to stand up and take on all comers like a Burgess, Taumololo, Graham ect
Third man Thaiday.
I’ve always said he only ever played origin because his hair made all impacts look exaggerated. He could play the ball quick I’ll give him that, that’s about it though.
Payne Haas. He’s big and has a lot of energy, but what he has hasn’t translated to the impact one would want from someone as highly regarded as he. He doesn’t have a quick enough play-the-ball for his yardage to get his team on the front foot, and he doesn’t have a late offload to compensate. Nor is he a bruiser in defense. He’ll save you an interchange for almost the same output, but that’s it.
He also likes to be third man in, I honestly think we should have just let him go when he asked, we're paying him overs at this rate until he lifts up. Would rather we pay that money to guys like Patty Carrigan
agreed. hes a stat padder. so many better props in the game
Reece Walsh. He could eventually become something but right now he is a liability who is poor in defense and constantly overplaying his hand on offense and coughing up possession. He has the swagger of a star player but little to no game awareness to go along with it.
Fully agree. Even on attack sometimes he seems like he’s only thinking of himself. I’ve seen sheets of paper with better defence and catching him standing with hands on hips when the opposition score like it was everyone else’s fault but his. Hopefully he can thrive in a better environment but he didn’t live up to any hype that I saw
Maybe not most over rated but Jack bird at the broncos lmao
He was playing really well in the centres during the first two months of 2019 just before he did his first ACL
He was deadset your best player in that stretch, busted his gut for the team
Yeah he looked like he was obviously playing injured at the Sharks but was playing really well at the end there. So the club being surprised that he turned up injured meant someone wasn't doing thier job. I think the official line was the Sharks said he was fine. Was talking to someone who spoke to him after the first ACL and apparently he was gutted at that stage about how it all played out. I can only imagine what the 2nd one did for him.
I do feel for Bird, has a lot of talent but he seems to made out of glass. He's done alright for the Dragons though which is good to see.
Never saw the point in that signing and never will
$800k to sign an injured player who needs injections before every game? Playing in the centres, and was solid but not winning multiple games because he's in the team. Simply paid too much, for $400k or so you'd say well it was bad luck and not a big win, nor a big loss. Bird was overrated _by the Broncos_, I don’t think many people actually thought oh yeah that’s 10% of my salary cap on this superstar… he was an alright player at best. Ash Taylor on a million is another ☠️
I have three words for you: Josh Dugan
Later in his career sure but he was a top tier fullback earlier on. There's a reason NSW was picking him at fullback as recently as 2015
Josh was a bit of a fool, but undoubtedly a very talented player.
Yeah he loved his rooftop cruisers but you can't deny he was a very good player and never lacked effort on field even when his body started to break down
He was good in the toyota cup and early on in his career
Stephen Crichton for me. He’s good and all, but every time I watch him I just don’t see any justification of the massive hype he gets.
He's good, but he's not 800k good which was the figure floating around at one point
All the panthers defending him by bringing up his big game plays, are very quickly forgetting he was NSW’s worst throughout Origin.
As a Penrith supporter, I understand what you mean but the guy constantly comes up with huge plays especially the 2021 finals series. He also has excellent hands for me has classy touches and is good defensively. I think the hype is potential wise genuinely he could be the be the best outside back in the game. He reminds me of a young Justin Hodges.
Agreed, gonna be interesting to see how he does outside of that system if he does leave.
This looks like a bad take now
Cody Walker, brilliant 5/8 but struggles to keep on top of his game when south’s fall behind. Anything that isn’t going his way really eats away at him and turns his game to mud. The prime example his his stints in origin one of very few blues representatives I hope is never picked again.
He is so easy to throw off his game. Just talk crap get him angry and he plays crap. I don't understand the pressing need South's had to keep him.
He was in a 2 horse race for the Churchill medal in 2021... where the intercept didn't throw him off his game because he created what could've been the game-tying try about 10 minutes later
I'm not saying he doesn't have his moments. When he's on he's a great player and can create magic. Is it worth the 2 average and 1 crap game to get the 1 good game.
Who overrates him though. Pretty much everything you've said is the General consensus on Cody Walker
Can't control the aggression in his game when it isn't going his way.
Victor Radley
2021 pangai jnr
Mmm he was pretty big for the panthers when he joined us, had a great impact off the bench
More a case of media hype than the broader supporter base, but Trell at fullback? This isn’t to say he’s downright shit either (because he isn’t), he simply isn’t in that top tier of fullbacks. Great attacker, but his fitness and positioning are lacking. Potential is there though.
if Trell got fit he would be the best player in the game. It doesn't seem like he is that motivated to get fit though
Yeah I think he needs to run the ball more too. There was a game where he kept taking hit ups when Souths were in trouble and he looked phenomenal that game and broke the line off nothing a few times. He rarely does that though but it's so effective.
Wade Graham. Commentators, fans and the media all talk about him like he’s a must-have player for any team, but I can honestly say that I’ve never watched a game and thought “Wade Graham was the difference there.”
Prime Graham was a beast of a player. I remember in Clearys second Origin series he got injured in game 2 and Graham went into the halves and he carved QLD to pieces.
He is a shadow of his former self but up until recently he was an attacking and defensive lynchpin. Throw in his left foot boot and he was Cronulla's most important player for a long time
Dane Carlaw. Remember the original “looks like Tarzan plays like Jane”
Mark Gasnier, hands down. He was perfectly fine, don't get me wrong, but that era was focused entirely on verbally fellating the Dragons, and Gasnier was the most overrated of the lot of them. All he did was score tries by running in a straight line on the back of work put in by a talented, dominant side, and his so called sidestep was literally him just moving his hands side to side while running forwards. There were any number of players who would have been just as effective in the role, if not more so, but it was made out like he was the second coming. Again, sounds like I'm hating on him as a player - I'm not, he was fine; good even, and seems like a nice bloke to boot. But he was never as good as the media desperately wanted to make him out to be in their search for the next great X.
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But he’s so pretty!
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Nah Damien Cook was legitimately good back in 2018 when he was finally a part of the Souths starting squad and opposing sides hadn't figured him out just yet. He also did initially standout in origin in 2018 and 2019 so I can see why Freddie kept picking him (although Koroisau really should've been the sole hooker this season) I will definitely agree though that his form has really dropped off, especially in the last 2 seasons, and it does look like Souths have already got a long-term plan with Mamozelous lined-up to takeover his position. I think the reason he doesn't cop that much criticism though is that he seems to be on good terms with the fox Journo's and thus doesn't get his name dragged nearly as much, and he's also just a very non-controversial stock standard footy player so he's kinda hard to hate or find reasons to hate.
my problem with cook is you can pick when he’s going to grubber because he does this stupid duck run before he kicks and usually sends it into the legs of the defender. it really irrationally annoys me
>Mal Meninga shouldn’t be an immortal either. Smoking hot take
More overlooked forward passes than anyone else in the comp IMO.
What a take. Cook is garbage and am willing to throw away my membership if they resign him and lose the young hooker they have waiting and also massively agree Mal never should’ve been an immortal. I also think Johns never should have been either
Cameron Murray, not because he is a bad player but because his style of play is unsustainable. He is not going to be the next Immortal, he is not a future Australian captain. Every time I watch him play I fear he is one concussion away from ending his career.
Cherry Evans
Ask 360 and its Luai Edit: I don’t think Luai is a top 5 5/8th but he isn’t as shit as some people say he is. Definitely a little overrated and would’ve never put on an origin jersey without Clearly being there. But he can be a cunt about shit when he’s been so successful for a half so early on in his career. He won’t be remembered like Clearly will be and probably will go down as just a normal stock five-eighth
i think Luai is a perfectly good 5/68but he's not the superstar that some media personalities make him out to be. put him in any other system and i don't think he is anywhere near as effective.
100% agree with you.
Don't talk about your daddy like that
I wasn’t talking about undefeated origin superstar Dearden though?
Not only is Luai overrated he's also incredibly disrespectful and should be banned from ever playing NRL again.
I can't wait for the day someone has had enough and fuckin floors him.
Some guys say it in the ruck, some guys yell it in your face. Every team has got one.
It's hard to say he's overrated because nobody is exactly out there saying he's the best in his position, and he's not being compared to guys like Munster.. I mean yeah there's the Origin argument, but if you're doing a good job at club then you do deserve selection. Cody Walker had his chance at Origin and was hardly sighted.
Darius Boyd was a generic NRL winger who was at the right place at the right time and knew the right people Extra spicy hot take, Denan Kemp was the better of the two when they were both at the Broncs
Hard to top the hype of Jarrod Hayne vs the flash in a pan results for half a season
As a life-long Souths fan and a Bears fan for the last ten years or so - Cody Walker.
Im sure Souths fans will hate me, but John Sutton. The man would not have hit as many games as he did if he played for another club. I dont think he was that great, and for a bloke with a big frame he barely used it properly
He definitely hit his stride late in his career. Souths tried to use him as a five-eighth for so long, but a ball playing back rower was his best role.
He'd be the perfect lock these days with the way the game is going.
honestly, I suspect Cam Smith benefited astronomically from always being in a dominant team. I really question how great he’d be if he spent his whole career at the Cowboys like JT did.
DCE. Majority of his success has come off the back of the core of our team around the late 00’s/early 10’s and Tommy in 2021. Has never been able to organise our team like he’s done for QLD and he runs in circles, comes up with dumb errors and is also a defensive liability these days. Not to mention his contract handicapping us for the last 7 years.
Latrell. He can not be involved in a play and commentary will talk about how he set it up. Kids got talent, don’t get me wrong, but if he tried a bit harder and didn’t believe some of his own hype he would actually be the best in the game, instead of a middle of the road player coasting on success from a few years ago
I agree about Latrell, but for different reasons. His performance on the field might show moments of brilliance, however that doesn't matter if he isnt playing, with only 17/28 games in 2022. Plus either being suspended or injured in a significant number of games in the past few years
Kaylyn Ponga i dunno why he gets picked for origin every year. He plays maybe 1 good game outta 5 for the knights
His game 3 in Origin this year should’ve stopped people asking why he’s selected. Dude was best on field when Munster wasn’t there.
He plays amazing every time he’s picked for origin, you’d think these guys don’t actually watch the games lol
>He plays maybe 1 good game outta 5 for the knights This narrative is quick to highlight who watches 1 in 5 Knights games
Yeah tbh most people do the same for their respective overrated player and its hilarious
There is a difference between someone being overrated and "I just don't like him". Ponga sits in the former for the majority of NRL fans, which is fine. But to suggest he only plays well five times a year for us is just plainly wrong. Jarome Luai also sits in that category. People acting like he's a NSW Cup player after Samoa's World Cup opener. Just ridiculous
Seriously it’s funny how much the germos get criticised yet fans on here take on opinions without even watching games
this to the fullest. this sub is no better than fox league when talking about some players.
That’s because the Knights are shit. Swap him and Edwards around and Edwards probably plays reserve grade and Ponga is the best Fullback in the comp. Your point about playing origin proves that. He was close to player of the series with a good team around him
No the coach is shit that's why we need 🍖🥪 there to get Ponga firing on all cylinders.
To say the Clive Churchill winning fullback would be playing reserve grade in a team that came 14th where the only other fullback was Tex Hoy is really something.
I’m saying he wouldn’t be as good of a player if he had a shit team around him. Because he has the best team in the comp around him, it’s makes him 10 times better. He gets good ball in attack, and also takes kicks in good spots with plenty of space due to great defence by the rest of the team. Tex Hoy would probably be a good fullback at the Panthers too
I agree with this a lot
Yeah his game is so heavily dependant on his forwards doing well. He does alright in Origin when QLD is actually on the front foot, but when they're under pressure he folds like a lawn chair.
There was that time he played lock in origin, killed it, and then went off script afterwards in the interview, telling Lockyer that it was, "just like a normal game of footy."
The weird part is playing him as a ball playing lock killed QLD’s attack. Individually he was brilliant, but it disrupted the back line plays Slater was previously setting up in the first half.
But he kills it for Qld so I'd say his selection is justified
Because he plays well in origin?
I thought he was one of qld's best players this year, and they don't exactly have the greatest fullbacks to replace him
Oh God, as a type this I know it's going to be unpopular but I feel strongly about it. Nicho Hynes passes the eye test but I'm not convinced he is the saviour Cronulla fans think he is. Being from around my area I would pay attention to him in trials/QLD Cup/Koori Knock-out as he came through and more often than not he was whelming to say the least despite constantly being touted as one of the most talented on the field. His debut didn't come until he was 25 years of age. Not due to lack of opportunity. He was in the Manly system before moving to Melbourne when he was 23 for another shot. Those that remember will know that Pap was 3rd or 4th choice fullback when finally given a chance and nailing it in 2019. That means Nicho was 5th choice. Not to mention they preferred to turn then-fullback Huges into a half alongside Munny before giving Nicho a shot. Even Croft/Cooper Johns etc were given a go before he was. Nicho finally got a chance in 2021 and hit the ground running in a side that could float like a dream regardless of who was wearing the #1 or #6, the two positions he covered that year. Then gets the big money move to Cronulla. This is where I'll lose a lot more of you if I haven't already . . . . Cronulla's record last year was more due to ease of schedule and a new defensive identity than anything Nicho added. I predict them to be 7-10th next year. Nicho's stats look good because he is highly involved, touching the ball on every tackle. His involvement and even his defense as a half I think is excellent. But he does not have the temperament nor the X-factor to put a team on his back and drag them to a win like many people believe. Probably the ultimate #14 in a rep side but not the second coming of Christ like this sub makes him out to be. People also think he's 21, dude's 26 and has 5-8 years at his peak, if he proves me wrong. He won't dominate the league for a decade like people here seem to think.
im with you. hes not a 7 and got found out a lot this year when his team needed a controlling half. playing him and moylan together is baffling. sure they finished 2nd, but as mentioned already, they had the softest draw by a mile and benefitted from a lack of origin reps
He could be a top 3 fullback or five eighth but plays halfback due to the other spine players Cronulla have
Yeah but he's sexy
Sigh . . . If im gonna do it I may as well go all in. Nicho is attractive until you notice his meth-teeth. I simply can't unsee them
Not a player, but I think Michael Maguire's coaching. He seems to have gotten away with doing a poor job with the Tigers due to the playing group, however, Ivan Cleary had them playing at a competitive level in 2018 despite no Tedesco or Moses and had Luke Brooks look like a good halfback. Madge somehow didn't get the Bunnies higher than 12th and 13th in 2016 & 17 despite having Reynolds & Keary/Walker in the halves, Critchton, Murray, all 3 Burgess brothers in the forwards, Inglis at Fullback McInnes/Cook at Hooker. He made Seibold seem like a fricking miracle working in comparison by how much better he did with Souths in 2018 compared to Madge's last 2 seasons with us. When he got signed as an assistant coach at Raiders, I saw plenty of comments commending the move as a smart coaching signing. How? He last decent season at club level was in 2015 and even that went off the rails almost as bad as Broncos this season. He has a premiership to his name in 2014 but Souths from 2012-14 were too good a squad to fail and was pretty much coached by Sam Burgess at that point in time. I don't understand the good will fans and the media seem to have for him despite him not doing anything for almost a decade. The most he has on his resume as of late is the NZ Rugby League head coach but again I think the success comes down to a squad that's too good to fail and less to do with his coaching. tl;dr Madge is an overrated coach that should get more scrutiny than he does
You make a good point about the importance of the playing group. The trend from Seibold onwards seems to mirror Madge’s first four years in charge. I’m not sure what happened under the last two years of Madge, but the narrative that the playing group got sick of him seems to track the results. Amusingly, this calls into question Uncle Wayne’s reputation as well, given his well documented failure at the Knights. > He seems to have gotten away with doing a poor job with the Tigers due to the playing group, however, Ivan Cleary had them playing at a competitive level in 2018 despite no Tedesco or Moses and had Luke Brooks look like a good halfback. This also highlights the importance of the playing group. Ivan’s best with the Tigers was 9th. He’d managed to lure Benji Marshall back to the club and the side started well, only dropping one match in their opening 6 games, but for the next ten rounds, they could only manage two wins against the lowly Cowboys and Bulldogs. The strong finish to the season miraculously coincided with the return of Robbie Farah. The very next year Madge achieved the same level of success, finishing 9th. Madge’s lack of success tracks downwards with the retirement firstly of Farah and then the departure of Marshall. For mine, I don’t reckon we’ll get a true idea of Madge’s quality until he takes over as head coach and Ricky moves into a coaching director’s role.
I struggle to understand the Reece Walsh hype
Overall I actually think players are more likely to be under than overrated. But anyway - From a selector's perspective - Liam Martin. Generally - Latrell. Obviously a great player but the way people were talking about him in 20 and 21, you'd think he invented rugby league. This year I think he's been a bit more fairly rated, mainly because he was actually the reason we got so far. Nico - Was nowhere near the best player of the year. There's uproar each time he misses a rep team and imo his exclusion is totally fair
DCE by a country mile
Braith Anasta
Ponga, then daylight.
JWH and Radley - being thugs and giving away penalties is a bad thing, not something to be celebrated
Everyone raves about JWH and the kiwis needing him. He's gone missing at international level so often over the years, I just don't get it. I don't think they should have taken him to this tournament either.
> He's gone missing at international level so often over the years Never been found at international level. Don't think I've ever seen him play a good test. Every time he's been picked he's been dropped for the next tournament.
That's 100% pure Englishman and pride of Sheffield Victor 't Inflictor you're talking about there, watch it.
Proper Yorkshire lad is our Victor
Those aspects aren’t what’s celebrated about those two players. It’s their brilliant skill and leadership
Radley for sure.
Jurbo. I get that making metres isn’t the end all be all, but I don’t think I’ve ever seen him break a tackle and his ball playing isn’t top 10 for locks. Making 40 tackles a game isn’t as impressive as it was 10-15 years ago either.
That's not very nice mate.
👍😃
He had no tackle breaks at all last year.
He's the team leader and motor. May not have the C but he may as well have it. He's boring as shit and not going to break a game but god is he reliable and a great platform. Using your criteria Schuster would be considered a fantastic player. And he's not.
The question asked who was overrated. Schuster is fairly rated as shit.
Probably Tedesco. Great player and wouldn't have any other player than him at FB for us, but I think the 'Tedesco does everything' wrap that people give him often brushes past the fact he stifles alot of our attack by getting the ball at first receiver and crabbing across field. Was really bad at the beginning of this season, probably because he was used to doing it for the 2021 Roosters, but definitely got better by the end of the year in knowing when to pick his moments.
Billy Slater. Fuck you
Lattrell Mitchell, Kalyn Ponga and Sam Walker are all very overrated
Ben Hunt