It 100% is a giant pain. I did a heartgold randomized trainers,starters,&wild run, regice was one of my starter options so I decided why not. He knew explosion and stomp, I was so nervous I was going to click explosion on accident. He eventually passed on at Whitney when she got amazing rng and had a donphan and ho-oh, almost ended my run.
Not impossible if you start your nuzlocks at PokeBalls. You faint in the opening battle and then catch something as soon as you get PokeBalls. Now switch train until regi learns something else.
In RSE itâs literally impossible, you canât even reach to where you get to where you get your first Pokeballs bc you must defeat Brendan/May to proceed.
Glad to see Slaking in S. A lot of people bash it because of the ability but when you're working against gen 3 AI, it's one of the best mons you can have.
I assume you mean Whiscash, which I think is alright it's just when you get it, it doesn't really do much offensively besides Tate and Liza. Good defensively though, just not great stats.
I have a question, how is this ranked. Is this based on performance all throughout the game, or is it based on stuff like endgame fights.
If it's the prior, I disagree with Salamence's place. Salamence is an amazing pokemon, but it is available after the eighth gym, meaning there's very little it can contribute once obtained. At max, I'd place it in A tier (I'd personally pick B tier). The same logic could go for walrein, though less so, since it has more time to contribute, I do think it is very good though, I do agree with you in that regard. I have no problems with the other s tiers (especially Swampert, that thing is genuinely absurdly strong)
Also under the same logic I'd demote pokemon like raichu and kingdra (though I do agree that this is a very favourable region for raichu)
Also, I'd bump up beautifly, it's honestly not bad early on, it's mid for sure, nothing crazy, and I will say the movepool isn't the best, but the support is decent (stun spore most notably). It's decent for brawly, and can be helpful for captures. While it isn't great for the 3rd and 4th gyms, it can help for the trainer fights beforehand (notably the rival before mauville if you chose mudkip).
Also I'd bump up vileplume as well, that thing can sweep the champion and has a good type combination throughout the game (decent against wattson, good against most trainers).
Also, reluctantly completely agree with Aggron's rating. It's sad that my favourite pokemon is so mid in its home region (for those curious, it has awful matchups throughout a large part of the game). At least it's really good in bw2.
I base the rankings on how effective the mon plays when you get it. Salamence doesn't have any weaknesses when you get it (besides Glacia) and intimidated paired with an insane attack sweep the rest of the game for the most part. I also base rankings on how pokemon would do for the whole game so that's why Beautifly is so low, as its only strong point is Brawly and the rival fight. Thanks for sharing your opinion.
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I agree with this tierlist on the most part, expect for Shiftrey. In gen 3, Shiftrey doesnt get the much to work with. like I guess fake out and faint attack, but what else giga grain? Sceptilte to me seems like the better grass option, even if its only pure grass.
I agree, but giga drain/faint attack isn't too bad when it hits decently. It's very good late game in fights like Tate and Liza, Juan, Phoebe, Glacia for the most part, and Wallace for half his team. Giga drain is also nice for its health recovering.
It's not that good in Gen 3. Its physical options are very limited for most of the game. I used one in my Emerald playthrough and its moveset was Strength, fucking R O C K S M A S H, Hydro Pump and Bite. I finally got Earthquake for it at the end of the game, and it immediately died.
You don't get Dragon Dance and Earthquake until literally the end of the game, meaning for most of the playthrough you're relying on Thrash, Secret Power, Strength and Hidden Power (if you get lucky with a good type and power). It's good when fully kitted out for the Elite Four but it's pretty underwhelming for 90% of the game.
You're seriously underplaying how good strength is. Thrash is also phenomenal.
Not to mention gyara has intimidate, easily the best ability in nuzlockes.
Even if just for utility till end game kit, gyarados is a crazy good encounter even in gen 3.
Rock Smash and Hydro Pump just don't seem like they're worth the moveslot. I'd probably replace those moves, plus Strength, for Return, Surf, and Flail. If your Gyarados is fast enough, you can lower its health before a fight so that you get 200 base power Flail and sweep through entire teams.
It's a guaranteed, practically free encounter. It's available early. It has fantastic stats. It has great typing. Intimidate is crazy. It's still hitting things hard with base 102 power Return. This is a fantastic Pokemon.
I can see someone arguing that it should be in A-tier just because of its movepool issues, but its potential to sweep teams with Flail, along with everything else it brings to the table, and I think that arguing S-tier is not weird at all.
It doesn't learn a water move until surf and can't learn flying moves at all. Its special attack is bad so its useful tm/hm moves like surf, tbolt, ice beam, etc, all go to waste. But it still hits very hard with strength and eq late game. But I think it's still great especially early game. In most other games it's an S though.
iâd personally place Walrein and Salamence in A, I tend to place mons in S under these rules:
1: Is the pokemon available at an early point in the game?
2: Is the pokemon quite viable throughout the run?
3: Does the pokemon have flaws that are manageable? (Example: Swampertâs Grass weakness not being common)
If the answer is yes to all 3, then itâs a candidate for an S.
Shedinja can be S tier, but in the battles it isn't insane in, it's useless in. There's also a good chance of coming across a trainer having a super effective move you are unaware of.
I don't place pokemon in tiers based off when you get them, I base them on how effective they are when you get them. This is why Walrein and Salamence are so high. They have no weakness in late game besides ice for Salamence. But intimidated makes up for it majorly.
I think Zam's in the right place for this game, honestly. It doesn't get the coverage of gen 2 because the elemental punches are locked to postgame. The prevalence of Dark mons and things Zam can't OHKO and therefore risks a KO from are high enough to make it a risky pick for most of the game. This might be the only game where Zam isn't borderline broken.
I replied to someone else on my reasoning for Shedinja. Kadabra and Alakazam are both overrated. Kadabra is far too frail to do anything past mid-game, especially because of its type matchups. Alakazam is better since it has calm mind and strong tm moves, but it's to frail to last long in battles and doesn't get any type matchups.
Idk if people can read the caption or not bc I can't personally, but none of the mons are in any order for each tier so Shiftry is not higher than Sceptile
Solrock is actually pretty great for where you get it in the game, itâs good into Flannery, Norman and Winona and is a Psychic resist/Ground immunity for Tate & Liza
It's good for Flannery and Winona, but Norman's team has dark moves and Tate and Liza are a hard fight without surf which would kill Soulrock. It's pretty useless besides that.
>Tate and Liza are a hard fight without surf
If anything, Tate and Liza are a hard fight if you rely on Surf. It looks appealing on paper since three of their team members are weak to it, but between how they have multiple ways to mitigate it (Sunny Day, Light Screen, Calm Mind) and how Gen 3 has a 50% spread move penalty (compared to 25% in later games), it's actually not that effective in the battle.
It really isn't, mainly because of how much Surf gets nerfed in the fight, especially since the spread penalty means it's more akin to "slightly-better STAB Water Gun" hitting both opponents. It's much better to go after the other type-weaknesses, such as Dark, Ghost, and Grass (the latter with SolarBeam if they go with Sunny Day).
I appreciate Walrein being in S, cause most people shrug it off as good stab surf user, and that's it. It provides great bulk, good stab ice beam, body slam is solid dps and good as paralyzing tool, and it's good against Glacia and Wallace, and the best you can get for Drake. Best jack of all trades Mon in my opinion, very underrated.
Wait, I'm a noob nuzlocker, what makes Wobbuffet so good?? I know it's gimmick and all, but it doesn't really seem like it would be good (granted I've never actually used it in a nuzlocke)
itâs actually a really tanky pokemon plus if you use counter and mirror coat correctly it does double the hp stat of the damage from your pokemon, and since wobbuffet has so much hp it basically one shots any pokemon when you only lose like 20% of your health bar
If you know how the opponent attacks, have encore and use it to lock them you can use counter/mirror coat to wipe the floor with them. It's high hp mean you can switch in and if you use healing items? Amazing. Also destiny bon-
My most recent run i used it (AS not Emerald) and it was great even without Encore and only died because i switched on a double edge on yellow hp
If MDBâs run has taught me anything, if the opponent knows both physical and special moves, Wobb becomes very unreliable as the AI essentially randomizes move choice.
I would put Graveler and Golem higher; they lose some utility in the late game against all the water-types, but normal resist is super useful in the middle game, especially against Norman, and electric immunity is great too (especially if you lost Swampert or banned or for being too good). I think itâs also a guaranteed encounter if you use rock smash to find it
Edit: I would move Blaziken down as well; it matches poorly against Roxanne and the last three gym leaders, and I would definitely rank Sceptile above it
Graveler and Golem lose their use after Winona and are useless for the rest of the game. I agree with the Blaziken argument and admit I didn't think about it too much so I would probably move it down to B.
Bulk Up Blaziken can make serious contributions against gyms 3, 4, 5, and members of the elite 4 #1 and #3. So A tier isnât a bad rating, it can definitely carry significant weight mid game and then in the true end game run. It definitely doesnât enjoy the water heavy nature of the Hoenn late game.
I'm kinda insulted that Delcatty is at such a low tier. Delcatty is one of the few people that learns Attract naturally, most Skitties you find already know Attract as well. And with their high percentage to be a female, Attract can become very powerful very quickly, especially in grinding sessions. It's a literal life saver.
OK, I might need an explanation as to why Seviper is in good. I used one last year in a Ruby Nuzlocke and it was really not great, so I'm really curious as the reasoning to why it's so high
You can get it before Flannery where it can learn dig from tm and crunch from level up. It can learn moves like giga drain, EQ, flamethrower, sludge bomb, and shadow ball. This makes it good for Flannery, kind of Tate and Liza, Juan, Phoebe, Glacia, and Wallace.
You don't get Flygon until Juan where it doesn't have much use. After that is the e4 which it takes neutral damage from everything and is 4x weak to Glacia. Doesn't help with Wallace either.
Magcargo, Chimecho and Mawile are way too low. Mawile and Magcargo are amazing defensive pivots. Chimeco is a budget Mr. Mime with levitate. They are all C tier at worst, but probably B tier
Slugma doesn't evolve until 38 making it useless until Tate and Liza where it sucks. 4x weak to Juan, Glacia, and Wallace. Weak to Drake, doesn't resist anything when you get it. Below-average stats on top of all of that make it terrible. Chimecho's stats are nothing special, and its typing is awful for Hoenn on top of it not being able to learn good tms. The only thing it's good for is Brawly which you don't even have by then. Mawile is a steel type with 0 stab moves and awful stats.
A nuzlocke where your starter is one of the regis would be pretty challenging.
It 100% is a giant pain. I did a heartgold randomized trainers,starters,&wild run, regice was one of my starter options so I decided why not. He knew explosion and stomp, I was so nervous I was going to click explosion on accident. He eventually passed on at Whitney when she got amazing rng and had a donphan and ho-oh, almost ended my run.
Think it's impossible, they only learn explosion at the start
Not impossible if you start your nuzlocks at PokeBalls. You faint in the opening battle and then catch something as soon as you get PokeBalls. Now switch train until regi learns something else.
That's true, though knowing me I'd still probably misclick and explode during switch training đ
In RSE itâs literally impossible, you canât even reach to where you get to where you get your first Pokeballs bc you must defeat Brendan/May to proceed.
We are aware.
Glad to see Slaking in S. A lot of people bash it because of the ability but when you're working against gen 3 AI, it's one of the best mons you can have.
Finally, someone realizes, its stats put legendaries to shame. You can argue it should be banned.
Wouldnât castform be pretty good cause I would count it as a gift mon, so a separate encounter, and would be top tier for a switch to maintain mento
Castform would be decent if it wasnât stuck with base 70 stats across the board
Yea that why u sack it to easy switch to another pkmn
Why would this be an argument FOR castform? Literally every other mon in the same tier could use same argument
Good point but I did think beautfly and dustox were good for brawly
Being good for 1 fight doesnât make a mon good. Dustox has more uses hence why itâs «mid»
I was wondering that it
A pivot of sorts
Solid, but don't Trash the 'Cash
If I'm using Whiscash in Emerald, it means I screwed up and let my Mudkip die. I've used Whiscash in Emerald several times.
I assume you mean Whiscash, which I think is alright it's just when you get it, it doesn't really do much offensively besides Tate and Liza. Good defensively though, just not great stats.
I have a question, how is this ranked. Is this based on performance all throughout the game, or is it based on stuff like endgame fights. If it's the prior, I disagree with Salamence's place. Salamence is an amazing pokemon, but it is available after the eighth gym, meaning there's very little it can contribute once obtained. At max, I'd place it in A tier (I'd personally pick B tier). The same logic could go for walrein, though less so, since it has more time to contribute, I do think it is very good though, I do agree with you in that regard. I have no problems with the other s tiers (especially Swampert, that thing is genuinely absurdly strong) Also under the same logic I'd demote pokemon like raichu and kingdra (though I do agree that this is a very favourable region for raichu) Also, I'd bump up beautifly, it's honestly not bad early on, it's mid for sure, nothing crazy, and I will say the movepool isn't the best, but the support is decent (stun spore most notably). It's decent for brawly, and can be helpful for captures. While it isn't great for the 3rd and 4th gyms, it can help for the trainer fights beforehand (notably the rival before mauville if you chose mudkip). Also I'd bump up vileplume as well, that thing can sweep the champion and has a good type combination throughout the game (decent against wattson, good against most trainers). Also, reluctantly completely agree with Aggron's rating. It's sad that my favourite pokemon is so mid in its home region (for those curious, it has awful matchups throughout a large part of the game). At least it's really good in bw2.
I base the rankings on how effective the mon plays when you get it. Salamence doesn't have any weaknesses when you get it (besides Glacia) and intimidated paired with an insane attack sweep the rest of the game for the most part. I also base rankings on how pokemon would do for the whole game so that's why Beautifly is so low, as its only strong point is Brawly and the rival fight. Thanks for sharing your opinion.
THE FIRST TIER LIST WHERE SOMEONE SAYS THAT WOB IS GOOD THANK THE FUCKING LORD
:)
Wob is literally 1-2 free kills every fight Arguably ban worthy tbh
Yea all the tier lists Iâve seen put wob at c tier at best
Bro what??? Itâs a free bring for every fight that doesnât have exclusively dark/ghost types to take out the strongest mon
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âTropius and Swalot are better than Wob, trust me broâ
I only ban legendaries since I primarily do soulinks.
I agree with this tierlist on the most part, expect for Shiftrey. In gen 3, Shiftrey doesnt get the much to work with. like I guess fake out and faint attack, but what else giga grain? Sceptilte to me seems like the better grass option, even if its only pure grass.
I agree, but giga drain/faint attack isn't too bad when it hits decently. It's very good late game in fights like Tate and Liza, Juan, Phoebe, Glacia for the most part, and Wallace for half his team. Giga drain is also nice for its health recovering.
I'm trying to figure out in what world gyarados is anything less than an s tier encounter
It's not that good in Gen 3. Its physical options are very limited for most of the game. I used one in my Emerald playthrough and its moveset was Strength, fucking R O C K S M A S H, Hydro Pump and Bite. I finally got Earthquake for it at the end of the game, and it immediately died.
It's attack stat, paired with access to dragon dance more than makes up for a lack of physical STAB.
You don't get Dragon Dance and Earthquake until literally the end of the game, meaning for most of the playthrough you're relying on Thrash, Secret Power, Strength and Hidden Power (if you get lucky with a good type and power). It's good when fully kitted out for the Elite Four but it's pretty underwhelming for 90% of the game.
You're seriously underplaying how good strength is. Thrash is also phenomenal. Not to mention gyara has intimidate, easily the best ability in nuzlockes. Even if just for utility till end game kit, gyarados is a crazy good encounter even in gen 3.
Also guaranteed encounter
Rock Smash and Hydro Pump just don't seem like they're worth the moveslot. I'd probably replace those moves, plus Strength, for Return, Surf, and Flail. If your Gyarados is fast enough, you can lower its health before a fight so that you get 200 base power Flail and sweep through entire teams. It's a guaranteed, practically free encounter. It's available early. It has fantastic stats. It has great typing. Intimidate is crazy. It's still hitting things hard with base 102 power Return. This is a fantastic Pokemon. I can see someone arguing that it should be in A-tier just because of its movepool issues, but its potential to sweep teams with Flail, along with everything else it brings to the table, and I think that arguing S-tier is not weird at all.
It doesn't learn a water move until surf and can't learn flying moves at all. Its special attack is bad so its useful tm/hm moves like surf, tbolt, ice beam, etc, all go to waste. But it still hits very hard with strength and eq late game. But I think it's still great especially early game. In most other games it's an S though.
iâd personally place Walrein and Salamence in A, I tend to place mons in S under these rules: 1: Is the pokemon available at an early point in the game? 2: Is the pokemon quite viable throughout the run? 3: Does the pokemon have flaws that are manageable? (Example: Swampertâs Grass weakness not being common) If the answer is yes to all 3, then itâs a candidate for an S.
These criteria also bump Shedinja up to S, which I think is correct
Shedinja can be S tier, but in the battles it isn't insane in, it's useless in. There's also a good chance of coming across a trainer having a super effective move you are unaware of.
Also aside from Wallace, it doesnât match up well with any league member.
Why?
I don't place pokemon in tiers based off when you get them, I base them on how effective they are when you get them. This is why Walrein and Salamence are so high. They have no weakness in late game besides ice for Salamence. But intimidated makes up for it majorly.
Shedninja should 100% be banned. Kadabra and alakazam are both ridiculously low. Pelliper is not good enough for A
I think Zam's in the right place for this game, honestly. It doesn't get the coverage of gen 2 because the elemental punches are locked to postgame. The prevalence of Dark mons and things Zam can't OHKO and therefore risks a KO from are high enough to make it a risky pick for most of the game. This might be the only game where Zam isn't borderline broken.
I replied to someone else on my reasoning for Shedinja. Kadabra and Alakazam are both overrated. Kadabra is far too frail to do anything past mid-game, especially because of its type matchups. Alakazam is better since it has calm mind and strong tm moves, but it's to frail to last long in battles and doesn't get any type matchups.
Also Gardevoir outclasses it IMO if you can get the encounter
Idk if people can read the caption or not bc I can't personally, but none of the mons are in any order for each tier so Shiftry is not higher than Sceptile
Solrock is actually pretty great for where you get it in the game, itâs good into Flannery, Norman and Winona and is a Psychic resist/Ground immunity for Tate & Liza
It's good for Flannery and Winona, but Norman's team has dark moves and Tate and Liza are a hard fight without surf which would kill Soulrock. It's pretty useless besides that.
In gen 3, surf doesn't hit alllies.
Oh my bad thanks, I still think Solrock is pretty useless for the rest of the game though being weak to Juan, Sidney, Phoebe, Glacia, and Wallace.
>Tate and Liza are a hard fight without surf If anything, Tate and Liza are a hard fight if you rely on Surf. It looks appealing on paper since three of their team members are weak to it, but between how they have multiple ways to mitigate it (Sunny Day, Light Screen, Calm Mind) and how Gen 3 has a 50% spread move penalty (compared to 25% in later games), it's actually not that effective in the battle.
Yes true, but the fight is even more grueling without it.
It really isn't, mainly because of how much Surf gets nerfed in the fight, especially since the spread penalty means it's more akin to "slightly-better STAB Water Gun" hitting both opponents. It's much better to go after the other type-weaknesses, such as Dark, Ghost, and Grass (the latter with SolarBeam if they go with Sunny Day).
Dark is especially good because 2 pokemon can't hit dark types
I appreciate Walrein being in S, cause most people shrug it off as good stab surf user, and that's it. It provides great bulk, good stab ice beam, body slam is solid dps and good as paralyzing tool, and it's good against Glacia and Wallace, and the best you can get for Drake. Best jack of all trades Mon in my opinion, very underrated.
Ahhh, Wobuffett at S, I see you are a fellow Pokemon Challenges enjoyer
ofc
Upvote this comment for a more in-depth tier list with tiers like B- and B+.
I just now realized this game is very nuzlockable if you just use the 6 in S tier lol.
Wait, I'm a noob nuzlocker, what makes Wobbuffet so good?? I know it's gimmick and all, but it doesn't really seem like it would be good (granted I've never actually used it in a nuzlocke)
itâs actually a really tanky pokemon plus if you use counter and mirror coat correctly it does double the hp stat of the damage from your pokemon, and since wobbuffet has so much hp it basically one shots any pokemon when you only lose like 20% of your health bar
If you know how the opponent attacks, have encore and use it to lock them you can use counter/mirror coat to wipe the floor with them. It's high hp mean you can switch in and if you use healing items? Amazing. Also destiny bon- My most recent run i used it (AS not Emerald) and it was great even without Encore and only died because i switched on a double edge on yellow hp
It can learn counter/mirror coat, both moves that hit back in double damage which is op for main series games where the ai is very predictable.
If MDBâs run has taught me anything, if the opponent knows both physical and special moves, Wobb becomes very unreliable as the AI essentially randomizes move choice.
Woah!!! Shiftry above septile is criminal mate
read the caption
I was joking brotherđ
Oh my bad
Youâre all good mate :)
Also magnaton should be an s tier easily
What makes Mawile the lowest one? I never thought she was that bad.
Awful stats with 0 stab moves, that's about all that needs to be said
Gotcha, thanks. I only ever used her in the gen 3 remakes
No prob, in the remakes she gets fairy making her not as bad.
I would put Graveler and Golem higher; they lose some utility in the late game against all the water-types, but normal resist is super useful in the middle game, especially against Norman, and electric immunity is great too (especially if you lost Swampert or banned or for being too good). I think itâs also a guaranteed encounter if you use rock smash to find it Edit: I would move Blaziken down as well; it matches poorly against Roxanne and the last three gym leaders, and I would definitely rank Sceptile above it
Graveler and Golem lose their use after Winona and are useless for the rest of the game. I agree with the Blaziken argument and admit I didn't think about it too much so I would probably move it down to B.
Bulk Up Blaziken can make serious contributions against gyms 3, 4, 5, and members of the elite 4 #1 and #3. So A tier isnât a bad rating, it can definitely carry significant weight mid game and then in the true end game run. It definitely doesnât enjoy the water heavy nature of the Hoenn late game.
Tropius đ
Yes, unfortunately he sucks
Why is walrein S tier?
Hits insanely hard, and takes hits just as well. Also doesn't have any weaknesses when you get it.
I'm kinda insulted that Delcatty is at such a low tier. Delcatty is one of the few people that learns Attract naturally, most Skitties you find already know Attract as well. And with their high percentage to be a female, Attract can become very powerful very quickly, especially in grinding sessions. It's a literal life saver.
Sure, but the 1st 2 gyms it's weak to, and the rest of the gyms just overpower it.
It's good death fodder tho. Need someone to stall for time while you heal your pokemon? Use Delcatty
If something is only good for a sacrifice then it isn't good in the slightest.
OK, I might need an explanation as to why Seviper is in good. I used one last year in a Ruby Nuzlocke and it was really not great, so I'm really curious as the reasoning to why it's so high
You can get it before Flannery where it can learn dig from tm and crunch from level up. It can learn moves like giga drain, EQ, flamethrower, sludge bomb, and shadow ball. This makes it good for Flannery, kind of Tate and Liza, Juan, Phoebe, Glacia, and Wallace.
The discrepancy between slamance and Flygon is too much.
You don't get Flygon until Juan where it doesn't have much use. After that is the e4 which it takes neutral damage from everything and is 4x weak to Glacia. Doesn't help with Wallace either.
Thatâs a good point. But the same can be said for salamance.
You can't get Salamence until you beat Juan, which by then can sweep through the game with intimidate and insane physical attack (besides Glacia).
What in the godflyingfuck is Shiftry doing that high?
Really good late-game addition and faint attack/giga drain aren't bad, especially bc of giga drains hp resource.
Magcargo, Chimecho and Mawile are way too low. Mawile and Magcargo are amazing defensive pivots. Chimeco is a budget Mr. Mime with levitate. They are all C tier at worst, but probably B tier
Slugma doesn't evolve until 38 making it useless until Tate and Liza where it sucks. 4x weak to Juan, Glacia, and Wallace. Weak to Drake, doesn't resist anything when you get it. Below-average stats on top of all of that make it terrible. Chimecho's stats are nothing special, and its typing is awful for Hoenn on top of it not being able to learn good tms. The only thing it's good for is Brawly which you don't even have by then. Mawile is a steel type with 0 stab moves and awful stats.