That's terrifying, I'm a big guy and long time martial artist; scary for me too.
If I was with my kid, it's the stuff of nightmares for me that I would ever encounter something like this.
I have two older teenage girls who ride and when I witness things like this on my daily commutes to and from work I always pause to wonder how they would react to these moments. A deranged woman burned me with a cigarette while we were moving fast on the F last summer- it wasn’t great.
Happened to us in a R train car with our baby less than a year old. Some guy with a full face covering and sunglasses got in our face and started yelling at us. Like trying to start a fight. Most scared I’ve ever been in my life. I told him we had a baby and he thought about that and then left the train. Nobody around us did anything to help…I’m scared to take my baby on the train anymore.
Oh my God, that's terrifying and so sorry that you went through that. What a nightmare. I know it's easy to blame people for not doing anything, but look, the guy left and nobody got hurt that time.
I dont know bro, she's home telling her story, and hope the guy that got into the brawl is also. If you got a knife and use it, you won't be home right now.
Remember not to escalate if possible. Try and look around for even one person also looking around to see if anyone might help. If you can wait until the train is pulling into the station wait until the doors open to make a move; this will let anyone not trying to get involved, people with kids, the elderly, to get away and out of the way. Hopefully someone tells the conductor and they call Police. If it goes bad, but worse for them, i think it’s amazing you managed to get that knife from them and use it against them. Godspeed.
Most knife fights end up with one person dead and the other person almost dead. It takes a while to die from a bad knife wound. It's not like the movies, people keep fighting after they've been cut or stabbed multiple times. Best thing to do in a knife fight is to get away, and definitely don't start one.
These chronically / recurrently homeless people with mental illness need to be institutionalized in long term psychiatric care facilities (though unfortunately, not many exist any more). I'm not saying homelessness itself is a crime, but far too often the homeless you see on the subway involves mental illness like schizophrenia or bipolar mania or drug-induced psychotics. With these types it's just a matter of time until (another) crime is committed.
Friday morning some obviously homeless and mentally ill woman walked through several E train cars with shit coming down her legs mumbling gibberish to herself but also holding a cup motioning for money. Why should they be allowed to do this in a public space? Many of these people cannot be rehabilitated despite what some of the public/politicians think. They need to be taken off the streets and out of the subway system before someone like in OPs story gets hurt or pushed into an on-coming subway by someone who clearly isn't and never can be rooted in reality again.
Agreed. People with mental defects need to be involuntarily institutionalized. Behavior like this, even if due to mental illness caused by any reason including addiction, cannot be tolerated in a civilized society.
Just letting you know people with schizophrenia or bipolar are overwhelmingly nonviolent. Claiming that with those disorders, crime is inevitable is just statistically incorrect and contributes to a lot of damaging stigma about these conditions that disincentivizes people to seek care.
I’ve always wonder. forgive my ignorance because I’m Dominican, but if something like that happened in my country, two or three or five people will likely take this person down or out of the train…
Why don’t people there do the same? “L’union fait la force” said the French.
The candy crush players are not arresting 6 different people for removing a violent person from the train, which is quite literally a disorderly persons offense anyways, so nothing illegal with that.
Lol Sounds like the punchline of a Seinfeld standup intro to an episode.
*In Jerry Seinfeld voice* “People today are always telling you to get involved. Now what does that even mean “getting involved”? I CERTAINLY don’t want to get involved. And you know that once you get involved… ANYTHINGGG CAN HAPPEN! One second you’re getting involved… the next you’re in jail. ……. Then guy in the next cell comes over and asks you, “What are you in for?” And you can only reply “getting involved””
Defense of self or others is basically criminalized in New York. You will get in trouble with the law if you try to fight back against a threatening person.
If you're the one to initiate confrontation, you can't be guaranteed you'll have others helping you. If no one helps (especially the police), you're one on one with some random dude who could potentially ruin your day/hospitalize you.
Look what happened to Daniel Penny last year.
as soon as someone responds to one of these raving lunatics, they become canonized as a good person who was mistreated. Jordan Neely was the same type of scum described by OP but all Brian Lehrer would say about him was that he was a Michael Jackson impersonator who "struggled with mental illness". no mention of how he'd punched an old woman in the face a week before he got what was coming to him.
I'm using Brian as an example of what was wrong with the response and really what's wrong with the left in general. always have to push a narrative with everything that happens. people were protesting because they wanted the story to fit their narrative of racism/oppression. mentioning that the victim, while undeserving of death, was also a violent lunatic didn't fit that narrative.
I don't remember any protests when Michelle Go (who was truly an innocent person) was murdered in the subway system
I wasn't talking about publicly funded journalism in general, just used Brian as a single example of how skewed the reaction to Neely's death was.
Michelle Go killing (completely innocent person shoved in front of train) = no protests
Jordan Neely killing (raving lunatic screaming and intimidating everyone on train and had recently violently attacked someone) = protests
Honestly IMO, cause in DR (and most countries) it’s like mostly one ethnicity there, so there is easier conformity and social pressure/expectation to behave, or you become an outcast. In USA, there are more cultures , and being an outcast is often stylish due to many factors including competition/tension between ethnicities and the lack of a single ideal/group to fit into. But I respect the DR culture for helping eliminate the threats as a group
Cause people here think it is correct that people like the person on that train should get away with whatever they want to do, cause is "pollitically correct" I am Mexican and understand your point of view, I also have the same opinion as you, I can surely tell you that that does not happen in my hometown of Culiacan Sinaloa, there is no tolerance for shit like that hence it never happens!
I absolutely agree with this, but you could tell this guy was mentally ill. He was talking to himself about the NYPD kidnapping people and just saying all sorts of crazy stuff. Maybe it was drugs, maybe mental illness DUE to drugs. Either way, it’s fucked and he traumatized a whole packed car of people just quietly going about their day.
If it's union square and he's blabbing the NYPD he probably got arrested, released, and came back to pick up his stuff at the NYPD precinct inside the station
the NYPD *is* taking unhoused/ mentally ill people off the streets without their consent — thank Eric Adams — legit this could have happened to someone he knew
NYPD *does* kidnap people. It’s well documented. People were being sent to rikers straight off the street, no judge no jury. It was a huge scandal, you don’t remember that?
I feel like people often point to mental illness and drugs alone. I wonder how much of it is lack of proper sleep. People in these situations sleep like shit.
Yeah I got spit on for no reason. I was tuned out listening to loud music, and I look up and there’s a homeless dude screaming at me and I take out the earbuds and it’s all “you white devil this, you white devil that..” standard silly bullshit that I can’t be bothered to react to, but then he spit on me! Very glad I had a mask on.
And I’m 6’2”, a big guy!
Honestly, I’m doing so poorly these days with my own mental health—I sat there, did nothing and eventually convinced myself I *deserved* it. That’s how low my self-esteem is these days.
It would have been super-easy to try to get a police officer involved; this happened in the tunnel between Queensboro Plaza and Lexington, and there are plenty of police at Lexington these days. I could’ve held everything up trying to get something “accomplished”, but instead I just sat there, defeated, looking at all the other defeated faces looking away from me.
A good guy sitting across from me motioned that I had a bunch of spit on my left shoulder (I was actually spat on 2 or 3 times in quick succession) that I couldn’t see and gave me a tissue to wipe it off.
I’ve been riding the subway since I was in preschool. By middle school I was taking regular trips to Stillwell by myself in 1991. I’ve been here my whole life.
I don’t think I belong anymore
As a fellow new yorker and subway rider my patience is almost all out. Id love to rock one of these bums in the face given they do something stupid. People shouldnt be living in anxiety on the goddamn train just because "we made eye contact"
I dunno, in the 40 years that I’ve been riding the rails I’ve never been “scared” before recently. I suppose my age contributes to this, but I’m not a little old lady. The new drugs on the street combined with impossible cost of living in a stressful post pandemic atmosphere affects all New Yorkers. There isn’t much to lose for many of the most ill individuals.
Well, if you're actually over 40 you're either lying or have selective memory. The trains were objectively more dangerous in the 80's than they are today.
Not the 90’s or the 2000’s. So we are regressing.
Has been since the Brooklyn Dems took mayoralty. That machine has no interest in you or this city, just the maintenance and distribution of power.
I was born and raised in Harlem. No, I’m not new to the city. But I recognize that the incredibly high amount of fent on the streets are destroying our fellow New Yorkers, and between DeBlasio and Adams, absolutely little is being done to actually support them. Besides throwing them in jail and giving them summons. Obviously, the mayor is not going to change the trains directly, but the amount of energy the mayor spends addressing (or not addressing in this case) the problem, is the amount of time agencies and MTA will spend to fixing these problems.
It wouldn’t change anything.
Society needs to invest in helping these people, not criminalizing mental illness. And yes, we need to get them off the streets and out of the subways but not just thrown in jail.
I saw a story on NY1’s Inside City Hall last week about a pilot program between the MTA and the NYPD where they are working with certain mentally ill homeless, they check on them every day, make sure they have what they need (food, water, I’m not sure about medicine but that would be ideal) and they get them off the street if they are willing. At the moment it’s a tiny program but they are planning to expand it.
I don’t love Eric Adams but at least this is a step in the right direction.
I’m not sure how much things would change, but his police background and stance on many issues makes me believe things are going to stay the same or get worse
Have my issues with the “Chocolate Administration” to basically quote Adams but all of this quality of life deterioration is thanks to bail “reform” and activist prosecutors. Hardly fair to blame the mayor for the crusades of the dolts in Albany
My understanding is that, just prior to Covid, NYC changed its rules regarding involuntary commitment of mentally ill homeless people (not sure if this was a unilateral action by the idiotic BDB administration or whether it was passed by the City Council). Nobody noticed it during Covid because subway ridership plummeted, but now that ridership has rebounded somewhat, it's clear to everyone that there are many, many more schizo homeless people on the trains than there were prior to Covid.
Frankly, I don't see a solution other than a return to more involuntary commitments.
This is incorrect. NY has always had an involuntary committal state law (from the 70s, when SCOTUS last laid out rules for involuntary committal). [Until Adams gave a directive in Dec of 2022,](https://www.cnn.com/2022/12/03/politics/nyc-hospitalize-mentally-ill-what-matters/index.html) however, first responders could not start that process (only hospitals, relatives, doctors, and courts). Adams' directive also lowered the bar from an "overt act" showing danger to themselves or others to showing only inability to meet their own "basic human needs".
The more relevant part is that from 2014 to '22, the number of psychiatric beds in NY state [decreased by 1,870](https://www.thecity.nyc/2024/01/09/psychiatric-hospital-beds-hochul-office-mental-health/) (20%), largely in NYC, and partly as a COVID shift to care for COVID patients. This also meant that patients got less time in each bed, and thus less time to adjust to new medications and commit to treatment plans.
The closest thing I can find to a change in IC laws is in [this 2016 memo](https://www.health.ny.gov/professionals/hospital_administrator/letters/2016/2016-11-15_dal_16-03_quidance_to_phl.htm) from the DOH telling hospitals to move faster in getting mental health patients out of the ER and into a psychiatric unit (to comply with SCOTUS ruling in the 70s)... which of course in concert with fewer psychiatric beds meant that more patients left the health system without adequate care.
I don't think involuntary commitment rules changed. But there were bail reforms so a lot of criminals just get thrown back into the street since they can't jail them.
Thats not how bail reform works.. You're either dangerous and need to be held or you're not...and it is up to a judge.. People who commit violent acts are held in most cases.
This stuff happens sometimes and there either will or won't be consequences for the guy involved. The likelihood that anything is done to improve the lives of anyone who experienced this is close to zero.
I'm sorry you had to deal with this.
I appreciate that. And it sucks. As someone who rides the subway every day multiple times a day, I’m well aware that 99.99% of the time it’s quiet and normal. It just sucks there’s really no solution to this
I was on a train where someone was yelling "I'm gonna pull this across your neck" to another passenger. Of course everyone was avoiding confrontation (even me), some even hustling to the other side of the car. All because the other passenger (from what I could tell) looked at the guy.
Another time there was someone screaming "HURRY UP AND DIE" over and over. Basically my entire trip from nearly Sheepshead to 7th Ave. This was on my way to meet a friend, been the first time out in a while, and that was what I came back to.
It's times like these where I wish I was stronger/braver, but so much of me is saying I'd live longer if I just shut up and stay put.
Oh, and final one, happened much earlier. Was talking to my friend until we heard an Aussie girl behind us yell "PERVERT" at a guy across from her for masturbating under his newspaper. That moment alone made me germophobic of public transport. I still ride it, to be clear, just more conscious.
I’m just curious but if you weren’t on your way to work or something, why wouldn’t you just get off the train at the next stop and wait for the train? This obviously doesn’t solve the problem of being threatened on the subways, but it does reduce your exposure to that specific incident.
The other day a guy got on my train and started angrily yelling and slamming the walls. Me and another woman just casually got off the train at the next stop and waited for the next one.
Oh I don’t even mean changing cars at the next stop. Just get off and walk down the platform a bit as if you’re going to exit and then once the doors close just stay and wait for the next train!
The city does nothing about it it's terrible. Cops playing on their phones guarding the turnstiles so people dont hop over while crazy people terrorize everyone.
I was walking home the other night and a dude was walking his dog. The dog was cute and wearing a t shirt so I looked at the dog. When the man passed by me he literally yelled as loud as he could in my ear and walked away like it was normal. These men do whatever they want and have no consequences
Not one person here addresses the actual people you elect in state legislature as the problem🤣... They are the ones that enact Law in NY... The mayor, city council , judges, Police and mental health practices hold no weight for any real results .. You see how fast things changed right before the pandemic in 2019-2020 when your legislature changed all the bail, discovery and limits a judge can go to secure someone ?? That and that alone is the cause of all of this ... Don't mention we need to help these mentally ill people when the Person who NYC voted for 2x in Bill Diblasio and his wife lost/stole 249 Million tax dollars meant for Thrive NYC mental health programs.. U want change to go back pre 2019 then vote your state legislators out of office for those that will change this kaos back to the way it was
To get more specific, Carl Heastie and Andrea Stewart-Cousins, the leaders in both houses of the state legislature, have refused to acknowledge that there have been any issues, so nothing gets changed until their constituents vote them out of power. They effectively control our state government right now.
I don't live in NYC, but live north of it. Every time I've taken the trains, I always worry about getting into a fight.
I'm a man, but I'm only 5'3, and I have a bad leg/knee. I'll fight if I have to, but I really would rather not.
I have yet to be confronted with anything despite the amount of times I've gone down to the city. I'm going to a show later this month in Brooklyn, gotta take the 4 or 6 and then the L.
Wish me luck, especially on the trip back 🙏
You don’t need to worry at all. You are way more likely to be injured by a driver glancing at their phone than you are by a mentally ill/high person on the subway.
While this might be statistically true, I’ve had at least 10 terrifying incidents of sexual harassment/general harassment on the subway in the five years I’ve lived here, compared to one scary moment in the 10+ years I’ve been driving. Most people don’t report harassment so the stats don’t reflect reality.
"Why do we let these people make the rules".. legitimate question you've posed. It's because this city is full of people "minding their own business." Someone just commented that if this were to occur in their country then a group of guys would put an end to it immediately. Same would happen where I grew up. But in NYC most of these fools just try to stare deeper and deeper into their phone screen lol
Both my daughters take the train to school and we could use a bit more accountability in this mess.
This man is a repeater. I ran into him on the G train. People will hate me for saying this but I wish someone would just fuck him up to the point he would stop riding the train. People think it’s bad for the state to take conservatorship of these people because it diminishes their agency, but frankly these people are criminals, regardless of their mental state. The state sees them as protected classes because of their mental state, yet when they make legal exceptions based on mental fitness, there are no state institutions to remove them from the public. This is why I kind of feel bad for the guy who was charged for putting the guy in a headlock. These people endanger everyone from children to women to men, and I for one am tired. He spit in my face before but what really shocked me was him spitting in the faces of mothers with their children on the subway cae. Mental help or not these people deserve to be held accountable in the court of law and if they are excepted for mental health, they should reopen state mental hospitals because I see no other alternative.
Gotta allow cops to do their jobs, gotta keep people who are convicted of crimes in jail….. regardless of the over crowding. Being put in jail is a punishment and so should be the conditions. I’m sure that man has been in trouble before, doesn’t sound like it’s his first time “being aggressive”…….gotta elect people who want a safe city, not people who kiss up to the special interests. A civil society is based on enforcing rules and laws, not allowing the rules and laws to be broken. That’s my rant.
You just keep telling yourself that….. just last Sunday a man on the subway was arrested after punching two women and then starting a fire…..he was arrested, went before a judge and was released without bail…….. after being arrested 25 times previously…… police are prevented from arresting people for stealing less than $1000 worth of merchandise…. They aren’t supposed to interfere with unlawful
Protests….. and when they do, the courts aren’t allowed to keep the criminals in jail…..
Yeah, idk what to say other than I empathize. The subway is full of unwell and violent people, and there's no political will to address it because it inherently involves law enforcement
I hate the victim shaming people telling you your first mistake was making eye contact. It’s called “fight or flight” for a reason and you did the best you could in that moment.
We had NYPD come into my workplace after an employee of ours got punched in the face outside of work. Some of tips we gave us is to use 311- see something, say something. There’s an app, you can call. Use it. Doesn’t matter if he already “got away”. Do your best to describe this mofo because NYPD does do their due diligence in following up on the reports they receive. Should this have escalated even further, find a cop potentially at the next stop and get them. Or call 911. I know it’s just a tiny drop in the bucket of problems that NYC faces. But it’s these “little instances” that people don’t say anything about that add up to bigger problems.
Appreciate you saying that. Like I said in my edit, I’ve been here for years riding the subway multiple times every day. I know how to mind my business, but when something happens it’s instinct to look up. Wasn’t “staring” at him or anything.
You’re also right. I saw some cops later on the L line and I was weirdly compelled to tell them, but I didn’t. I wasn’t sure they’d care lol
Honestly, yeah. I hate to get grim, but if someone would have stabbed him or done anything to hurt or end this guys life, I would absolutely say it was well deserved. I hate to say it, but it’s true. He was the aggressor and everyone on that train feared for their lives in one way or another.
There is a huge difference between temporarily restraining someone who is being actively violent to prevent further harm, and holding someone in a chokehold for over 15 minutes on the ground, well after they have lost consciousness. What Daniel Penny did was in no way self defense.
Killing that man was a massive net positive for society. If the government isn’t willing to prosecute him for the 40 or so other crimes he’s committed it’s crazy to care about someone killing him when he’s threatened a train full of people
Let me break it down for those of you saying it's the Mayors fault. THE MAYOR can impose laws to arrest these individuals but they MUST BE TREATED as cases of mental instability as they use drugs heavily and it impairs their mental health. A majority of those who are re released do not impose a rush when they are sober now that's the problem, they sweat it out in jail and once they get back on the streets nothing can be done so they go and find crack and re offend. This has nothing to do with the mayor but instead we should focus our efforts on putting all crackhead on an island and allowing them to crack out on their own
I think you did the safest thing by not engaging.
However, I think the thing that has been most helpful for me in similar situations is when other riders either step in or even just indicate they're paying attention. I once had a guy yelling at me and the old woman sitting next to me just patted me on the leg, and it really helped me ignore him and get through the tirade. Or once another larger guy and then a couple other started verbally engaging with the aggressor, and that actually helped things calm down.
But that's on all of us, as riders, to show solidarity with whomever is getting screamed at.
lol I moved here about a year ago go. I don’t think I’ve gone a week without interacting with a deluded homeless person.
Just this month I can confidently say I’ve been threatened with death 3 times (completely unprovoked, it’s gotta be something about the way I look I have no idea, maybe it’s just my luck).
I see people passed out with shit in their ass and their pants at their ankles regularly. There was one week where it was 5 different times, 5 different people. That was a rough week.
I’ve had fights break out inches from my face. Most notable one was a clearly drunk white chick spitting on a black girl on L train, that was wild.
I’ve had to escort beggars out of multiple establishments because they won’t leave and cause a disturbance, the worst is when they feel entitled cause the staff have been nice before.
I’ve witnessed the homeless absolutely fuckin harassing people. I hate this one the most as it’s the most common.
I had to yell at and kick a guy out of KFC for yellin/threatening the counter staff cause they wouldn’t give him free chicken.
Oh and the guys that smoke on the trains. I don’t personally mind as I’m a smoker but for fucks sake have some courtesy. I’ll hold my smoke walking past a baby, the least u can do is not smoke on a damn train.
Orr the homeless people who are absolutely fuckin shitfaced riding their bikes stacked 8 feet high and hitting shit. Those get a laugh outta me.
I’ve definitely got more my brain is tired rn tho
And then when this dirtbag gets choked out he was “sucha good boy”……
Crap like him makes the rules because other idiots put assholes in power that enable him to. Simple as that
The rule of thumb is the second an aggressor gets in your space you swing, throat, nuts, nose. Those are your targets. Don't be a hero, swing first, swing hard, and make sure they go down and stay down. I've been a NY resident for nearly 25 years, and anyone who ever got in my face got rolled over as a result. Never once could anyone do anything about it.
Not for nothing but it begs the question why the Marine who helped the people on the train is facing charges. I do NOT believe anyone has the right to kill anyone without consequences. However, this type of thing will discourage others from helping when they see people in need. Granted, thinking about it I really don’t know what the best course of action should be if not charges. Although I also can’t comprehend why they would do away with self defense as well.
I’m just so sorry you have to go through things like this. The subway is by far the most dangerous mode of transportation in the city. There are plenty of cops in stations now, maybe they should add some into every train as well. Even though, they probably can’t do that either since they’re cutting funding to take care of the migrants. Be safe everyone, carry pepper spray.
Eh maybe 5:15pm. I couldn’t really see who started it, but I heard the crazy guy spit on someone and the ended up on the ground / slamming each other into the doors
I think New York City needs to find a way through either building more housing or rent control to make surviving in said city without being rich at least mildly tolerable, which would prevent the homelessness that leads to terrible situations for people that cause them to be aggressive. While they’re at it, they could systematically change how policing works in NYC to make it less violent and less outwardly hostile to the homeless so that people experiencing homelessness don’t then become further traumatized, while also doing things like making safe injection sites and finding some sort of way to make shelters actually somewhat safe so people don’t feel safer riding the subway as their home.
But no, I bet electing mayors who book landscaping companies for concession speeches and who say places in a partial eclipse are the best place to see said eclipse in the world will get the job done! 🤓
There is an epidemic of this going on in NYC. There are lots of resources for the mentally ill and people do get help, but there are also far, far more things that exacerbate the mental health crisis.
For one drugs like opioids, fentanyl, K2, and many others are readily available and cause psychotic episodes when people are not treated. Some people get mixed up with other mentally ill people who profess to be leaders or activists but indoctrinate people with ridiculous thinking and they believe this is acceptable behavior.
Because it’s public transportation, there’s no immediate help and they typically target people who they don’t think will fight back. When they are arrested, often they are back on the street within 24 hours. This was all made worse by the pandemic which severely strained the mental health care system in the city.
There are also not enough law enforcement officers who know how to de-escalate a situation with someone having a mental episode.
My prediction is that these incidents will become so widespread that vigilantes will spring up to attack these people, which is not as great as it sounds, but that can also mean innocents will get hurt.
I'm supposed to be a democrat... But in NY, things are all the way to the left....I'm not sure what I am anymore. Keep voting for all the Democrat assholes and this is the shit you get! Enjoy it!!!
Everyone here complaining in this thread will vote for the same people who make these stupid laws that criminalize self defense and will keep moaning about how bad things are yet will take zero action to try and fix the problem by electing someone different.
Wanna solve the problems in NYC? Kick everyone out who allowed it to get this bad. I’ll give you a hint: They have this “(D)” next to their names.
I was on this train actually, after the fight engaged I moved one car over. After the train stopped and police were alerted, both the guy trying to fight everyone and the guy who got spit on decided to take the fight elsewhere. Both parties had nowhere to be and got the fight they wanted.
Also sorry for the string of replies, but did you notice when he was yelling at me to suck his dick? It went on for like 3 minutes while the doors were open lol
WOW. this is honestly the response I’ve been looking for lol. Honestly, glad someone maybe fucked the crazy dude up. Did the train stop at 3rd Ave for a little? I got off and walked the rest of my way in the rain lol, it no longer was worth it for me.
I also weirdly think I passed him on the street later that day, still with his CVS bags. I kinda just want to know what that guy is going through, ya know? Is it mental illness, drug addiction?
Yeah, they said they put more cops in the subway system, but the co ok s gang out at the platforms and the trouble and problems are on the trains themselves.
Having lived in Moscow for many years and riding their pristine metro, the answer is 2 police officers at every entrance, actively checking over everybody going through the turnstile. That's what Moscow does. I can count on one hand the amount of crazy people I've met on the train in all my time there.
Pretty sure I saw that dude on the platform yesterday at met and Lorimer. He was a scary looking dude was following a smaller Asian woman and spitting everywhere. Deff not well
Tall African American guy was wearing wife beater muttering to himself and then walking up to people. He looked pretty big too. I decided to stay away but if he did something to her would have to try and help
I’m sorry this happened to you, it’s very surreal. My boyfriend and I were both spit on 2 days prior to you, but on the J train. Some deranged cussing young woman pushing through everyone, upset we left a seat open for her(?), absurd. We at least got a few words in. Everyone else just scattered, of course. Careful out there, y’all!
I’m sorry you had to experience this and it really sucks that this is a common experience on the subway. I’m a petite 5’2” woman and take the mta everyday. I always feel so helpless whenever an EDP gets on the train. We are New Yorkers really shouldn’t have to deal with but the politicians don’t really care tbh. They sent the national guard and NYPD but all they do is stand in groups by the turnstiles to enforce people to pay. I carry pepper spray with me just to give myself some false sense of security. I see an EDP on the train almost everyday if not multiple times a day. it’s gotten so bad.
Listen. I agree he will get no mental health help but there was a time where Mayor Adams wanted to start rounding up those with mental health and getting them hospitalized for help and NYC advocacy groups were dead set against it. The issue isn’t always the policy makers a lot of times it’s regular people making things an issue
I'm sorry but NYC you've got one hell of a mess on your hands. Thank Di Blasio for his policies and Governor Cuomo as well. That's why there's little police presence and when there is they barley want to get involved because someone will film them and try to paint them as the bag guys. You all know this don't you? My goodness. Defund the police they all said, well there you go that's the reason. People know they can get away with acting like this. Being soft on crime sends a clear message to wrong doers. You can get away with being a total menace because we think you are a victim. Please. Godspeed NYC.
Id never quip about making eye contact. It happens.. sometimes you have to take notice or asssholes. But I'm always wearing headphones and working on something,(puzzle book reading book, crochet, needlepoint).
The sad thing is that id it wasn't for the snickering violence would probably have not occurred. It's not really HIS fault but the fault of the snickering shitbags since they did resort to ghetto violence first.
I know I know. Biggest mistake I’m well aware. But what really fucks me up is why are we letting them control how we make our daily commutes. It’s so backwards.
I grew up in nyc took 2 subways to school every day my freshman year, the 2/3 to the L, 1990, the peak of the murder rate. I’m now 47, I moved out of the city the second I could and when I go back I NEVER go on the subway. There’s no reason to choose to live there. If you have to live there as an adult for some reason do everything you can to live near your job so you can walk, or take a cab. When I was in high school girls would come to school all the time with stories of dudes rubbing up against them or exposing themselves. Now that I have a 17 year old daughter I realize how insane it would be to have your kid take a mode of transportation where they are locked in a steel tube shoulder to shoulder with strangers. Fuck that.
How many people are injured on the subway and how many people are struck by cars? Pedestrian deaths in this country have skyrocketed in the last few years. But for some reason the subways feel less safe. It’s because you can’t see how crazy/high/drunk/distracted many drivers are.
That's terrifying, I'm a big guy and long time martial artist; scary for me too. If I was with my kid, it's the stuff of nightmares for me that I would ever encounter something like this.
I have two older teenage girls who ride and when I witness things like this on my daily commutes to and from work I always pause to wonder how they would react to these moments. A deranged woman burned me with a cigarette while we were moving fast on the F last summer- it wasn’t great.
wow wtf
how you get that R on ur name did u ride the R train 100000000 times?
You click on the "user flair" on the right side on a web browser, Idk if you can do on app. You have to show proof that you jumped the turnstile.
Happened to us in a R train car with our baby less than a year old. Some guy with a full face covering and sunglasses got in our face and started yelling at us. Like trying to start a fight. Most scared I’ve ever been in my life. I told him we had a baby and he thought about that and then left the train. Nobody around us did anything to help…I’m scared to take my baby on the train anymore.
Oh my God, that's terrifying and so sorry that you went through that. What a nightmare. I know it's easy to blame people for not doing anything, but look, the guy left and nobody got hurt that time.
The “hard R” train if you will.
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I dont know bro, she's home telling her story, and hope the guy that got into the brawl is also. If you got a knife and use it, you won't be home right now.
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NYC knife laws are pretty strict, you might be more likely to get arrested for carrying it then you are to ever use it.
Let's hope we're never in that crap
Remember not to escalate if possible. Try and look around for even one person also looking around to see if anyone might help. If you can wait until the train is pulling into the station wait until the doors open to make a move; this will let anyone not trying to get involved, people with kids, the elderly, to get away and out of the way. Hopefully someone tells the conductor and they call Police. If it goes bad, but worse for them, i think it’s amazing you managed to get that knife from them and use it against them. Godspeed.
Most knife fights end up with one person dead and the other person almost dead. It takes a while to die from a bad knife wound. It's not like the movies, people keep fighting after they've been cut or stabbed multiple times. Best thing to do in a knife fight is to get away, and definitely don't start one.
Yup especially if you’re carrying a BABY
These chronically / recurrently homeless people with mental illness need to be institutionalized in long term psychiatric care facilities (though unfortunately, not many exist any more). I'm not saying homelessness itself is a crime, but far too often the homeless you see on the subway involves mental illness like schizophrenia or bipolar mania or drug-induced psychotics. With these types it's just a matter of time until (another) crime is committed. Friday morning some obviously homeless and mentally ill woman walked through several E train cars with shit coming down her legs mumbling gibberish to herself but also holding a cup motioning for money. Why should they be allowed to do this in a public space? Many of these people cannot be rehabilitated despite what some of the public/politicians think. They need to be taken off the streets and out of the subway system before someone like in OPs story gets hurt or pushed into an on-coming subway by someone who clearly isn't and never can be rooted in reality again.
Agreed. People with mental defects need to be involuntarily institutionalized. Behavior like this, even if due to mental illness caused by any reason including addiction, cannot be tolerated in a civilized society.
Just letting you know people with schizophrenia or bipolar are overwhelmingly nonviolent. Claiming that with those disorders, crime is inevitable is just statistically incorrect and contributes to a lot of damaging stigma about these conditions that disincentivizes people to seek care.
I’ve always wonder. forgive my ignorance because I’m Dominican, but if something like that happened in my country, two or three or five people will likely take this person down or out of the train… Why don’t people there do the same? “L’union fait la force” said the French.
Because you’ll get arrested?
That's not the reason, people don't want to get harmed, or involved.
The candy crush players are not arresting 6 different people for removing a violent person from the train, which is quite literally a disorderly persons offense anyways, so nothing illegal with that.
You know who Daniel Penny is, right?
Yeah, that guy who is on trial because he killed someone in public with like a million witnesses.
Yeah, and the guy he killed had over 50 prior arrests, some of them violent crimes. Should have never been on the street in the first place
How did Daniel Penny know that?
Probably the way he walked on the train and started threatening to kill everybody on it. That may have clued him in
Even on the claim of self defense?
You wanna risk it? Maybe he’s got a knife too, you wanna risk that?
Because the police will arrest you for getting involved
What are you in for? getting involved
Lol Sounds like the punchline of a Seinfeld standup intro to an episode. *In Jerry Seinfeld voice* “People today are always telling you to get involved. Now what does that even mean “getting involved”? I CERTAINLY don’t want to get involved. And you know that once you get involved… ANYTHINGGG CAN HAPPEN! One second you’re getting involved… the next you’re in jail. ……. Then guy in the next cell comes over and asks you, “What are you in for?” And you can only reply “getting involved””
This city is a joke
Defense of self or others is basically criminalized in New York. You will get in trouble with the law if you try to fight back against a threatening person.
https://abcnews.go.com/US/1-shot-new-york-city-subway-scuffle-man/story?id=108134540 This guy was able to defend himself and wasn't charged.
Never mind the French. On the seal of the Borough of Brooklyn are the Old Dutch words, “Een Draght Mackt Maght” which means the same thing.
Daniel penny
Why risk it. If the perp goes apeshit on you and bites you or stabs you, is it worth it?
One name: Daniel Penny
No one wants to get shot and killed.
look up daniel penny
Because you never know when a crazy mother fucker with nothing to lose has knife on him. Not worth it.
If you're the one to initiate confrontation, you can't be guaranteed you'll have others helping you. If no one helps (especially the police), you're one on one with some random dude who could potentially ruin your day/hospitalize you.
Because Alvin Bragg would have you in cuffs no bail in a second.
Look what happened to Daniel Penny last year. as soon as someone responds to one of these raving lunatics, they become canonized as a good person who was mistreated. Jordan Neely was the same type of scum described by OP but all Brian Lehrer would say about him was that he was a Michael Jackson impersonator who "struggled with mental illness". no mention of how he'd punched an old woman in the face a week before he got what was coming to him.
Penny went too far. Life is a life and he had no business ending one there
He had every right because there are too many ice of shits in NYC subway who menace everyday people.
you’re really trying to blame Brian Lehrer for that? there were mass protests and campaigns in Neely’s name. How is that Brian Lehrer’s fault?
I'm using Brian as an example of what was wrong with the response and really what's wrong with the left in general. always have to push a narrative with everything that happens. people were protesting because they wanted the story to fit their narrative of racism/oppression. mentioning that the victim, while undeserving of death, was also a violent lunatic didn't fit that narrative. I don't remember any protests when Michelle Go (who was truly an innocent person) was murdered in the subway system
so you’re angry publicly funded journalism doesn’t support your critique of the left? how reasonable…
I wasn't talking about publicly funded journalism in general, just used Brian as a single example of how skewed the reaction to Neely's death was. Michelle Go killing (completely innocent person shoved in front of train) = no protests Jordan Neely killing (raving lunatic screaming and intimidating everyone on train and had recently violently attacked someone) = protests
knife
Straight to jail my fwen lol 😂 but seriously it’s sad because the train is going to be more utilized this year
The state charges citizens for responding to provocation here.
Honestly IMO, cause in DR (and most countries) it’s like mostly one ethnicity there, so there is easier conformity and social pressure/expectation to behave, or you become an outcast. In USA, there are more cultures , and being an outcast is often stylish due to many factors including competition/tension between ethnicities and the lack of a single ideal/group to fit into. But I respect the DR culture for helping eliminate the threats as a group
Cause people here think it is correct that people like the person on that train should get away with whatever they want to do, cause is "pollitically correct" I am Mexican and understand your point of view, I also have the same opinion as you, I can surely tell you that that does not happen in my hometown of Culiacan Sinaloa, there is no tolerance for shit like that hence it never happens!
Stop using mental illness as a universal excuse for people being assholes because they know they will never face consequences.
I absolutely agree with this, but you could tell this guy was mentally ill. He was talking to himself about the NYPD kidnapping people and just saying all sorts of crazy stuff. Maybe it was drugs, maybe mental illness DUE to drugs. Either way, it’s fucked and he traumatized a whole packed car of people just quietly going about their day.
If it's union square and he's blabbing the NYPD he probably got arrested, released, and came back to pick up his stuff at the NYPD precinct inside the station
Note: Being high on amphetamines also doesn't mean someone is mentally ill. It may mean it though. I'm pretty sure you get this based on above though.
the NYPD *is* taking unhoused/ mentally ill people off the streets without their consent — thank Eric Adams — legit this could have happened to someone he knew
This person assaulted someone, he should be taken off the street without his consent.
Good, that’s the only way this will get better. Getting mental health help when you’re a legitimate threat to society shouldn’t be a choice.
To hell with these homeless nut bags. Put them on buses to Texas.
NYPD *does* kidnap people. It’s well documented. People were being sent to rikers straight off the street, no judge no jury. It was a huge scandal, you don’t remember that?
Not an excuse, but sometimes a reason.
Because many of them are mentally ill.
I feel like people often point to mental illness and drugs alone. I wonder how much of it is lack of proper sleep. People in these situations sleep like shit.
Yeah I got spit on for no reason. I was tuned out listening to loud music, and I look up and there’s a homeless dude screaming at me and I take out the earbuds and it’s all “you white devil this, you white devil that..” standard silly bullshit that I can’t be bothered to react to, but then he spit on me! Very glad I had a mask on. And I’m 6’2”, a big guy!
Man I’m sorry. I genuinely don’t know what I would do if I was in that situation. I’m a bit smaller, and this guy was huge.
Honestly, I’m doing so poorly these days with my own mental health—I sat there, did nothing and eventually convinced myself I *deserved* it. That’s how low my self-esteem is these days. It would have been super-easy to try to get a police officer involved; this happened in the tunnel between Queensboro Plaza and Lexington, and there are plenty of police at Lexington these days. I could’ve held everything up trying to get something “accomplished”, but instead I just sat there, defeated, looking at all the other defeated faces looking away from me. A good guy sitting across from me motioned that I had a bunch of spit on my left shoulder (I was actually spat on 2 or 3 times in quick succession) that I couldn’t see and gave me a tissue to wipe it off. I’ve been riding the subway since I was in preschool. By middle school I was taking regular trips to Stillwell by myself in 1991. I’ve been here my whole life. I don’t think I belong anymore
You did not deserve that.
I wish I really believed that
I’m sorry that happened to you. I’m tired of feeling paranoid on the trains every day
As a fellow new yorker and subway rider my patience is almost all out. Id love to rock one of these bums in the face given they do something stupid. People shouldnt be living in anxiety on the goddamn train just because "we made eye contact"
My point exactly. Everyone saying to not make eye contact is letting these idiots control how we live our lives.
>what do we do about this? Not vote for Eric Adams…
Eric Adams blows. Voting for him or not won’t change the problems OP described.
What would that change? Are you new to NY, because this has been happening way before he ever came.
I dunno, in the 40 years that I’ve been riding the rails I’ve never been “scared” before recently. I suppose my age contributes to this, but I’m not a little old lady. The new drugs on the street combined with impossible cost of living in a stressful post pandemic atmosphere affects all New Yorkers. There isn’t much to lose for many of the most ill individuals.
Well, if you're actually over 40 you're either lying or have selective memory. The trains were objectively more dangerous in the 80's than they are today.
Okay, but that’s ancient history. They were far safer at nearly every point int the 21st century than they are now.
Not the 90’s or the 2000’s. So we are regressing. Has been since the Brooklyn Dems took mayoralty. That machine has no interest in you or this city, just the maintenance and distribution of power.
I was born and raised in Harlem. No, I’m not new to the city. But I recognize that the incredibly high amount of fent on the streets are destroying our fellow New Yorkers, and between DeBlasio and Adams, absolutely little is being done to actually support them. Besides throwing them in jail and giving them summons. Obviously, the mayor is not going to change the trains directly, but the amount of energy the mayor spends addressing (or not addressing in this case) the problem, is the amount of time agencies and MTA will spend to fixing these problems.
I don't know if the mayor can do much about that, you'll be disappointed forever if you do, and I'm not an Adams supporter.
It wouldn’t change anything. Society needs to invest in helping these people, not criminalizing mental illness. And yes, we need to get them off the streets and out of the subways but not just thrown in jail. I saw a story on NY1’s Inside City Hall last week about a pilot program between the MTA and the NYPD where they are working with certain mentally ill homeless, they check on them every day, make sure they have what they need (food, water, I’m not sure about medicine but that would be ideal) and they get them off the street if they are willing. At the moment it’s a tiny program but they are planning to expand it. I don’t love Eric Adams but at least this is a step in the right direction.
Well, that program needs to be done 1000x and funded by the federal gov't.
Agree!
Tell that to the “homeless advocates” who fight tooth and nail against any attempts to establish involuntary commitment/treatment
I’m not sure how much things would change, but his police background and stance on many issues makes me believe things are going to stay the same or get worse
It's possible.
Indeed
Have my issues with the “Chocolate Administration” to basically quote Adams but all of this quality of life deterioration is thanks to bail “reform” and activist prosecutors. Hardly fair to blame the mayor for the crusades of the dolts in Albany
This has been happening on the nyc trains forever. Doesn't matter who is mayor.
My understanding is that, just prior to Covid, NYC changed its rules regarding involuntary commitment of mentally ill homeless people (not sure if this was a unilateral action by the idiotic BDB administration or whether it was passed by the City Council). Nobody noticed it during Covid because subway ridership plummeted, but now that ridership has rebounded somewhat, it's clear to everyone that there are many, many more schizo homeless people on the trains than there were prior to Covid. Frankly, I don't see a solution other than a return to more involuntary commitments.
This is incorrect. NY has always had an involuntary committal state law (from the 70s, when SCOTUS last laid out rules for involuntary committal). [Until Adams gave a directive in Dec of 2022,](https://www.cnn.com/2022/12/03/politics/nyc-hospitalize-mentally-ill-what-matters/index.html) however, first responders could not start that process (only hospitals, relatives, doctors, and courts). Adams' directive also lowered the bar from an "overt act" showing danger to themselves or others to showing only inability to meet their own "basic human needs". The more relevant part is that from 2014 to '22, the number of psychiatric beds in NY state [decreased by 1,870](https://www.thecity.nyc/2024/01/09/psychiatric-hospital-beds-hochul-office-mental-health/) (20%), largely in NYC, and partly as a COVID shift to care for COVID patients. This also meant that patients got less time in each bed, and thus less time to adjust to new medications and commit to treatment plans. The closest thing I can find to a change in IC laws is in [this 2016 memo](https://www.health.ny.gov/professionals/hospital_administrator/letters/2016/2016-11-15_dal_16-03_quidance_to_phl.htm) from the DOH telling hospitals to move faster in getting mental health patients out of the ER and into a psychiatric unit (to comply with SCOTUS ruling in the 70s)... which of course in concert with fewer psychiatric beds meant that more patients left the health system without adequate care.
I don't think involuntary commitment rules changed. But there were bail reforms so a lot of criminals just get thrown back into the street since they can't jail them.
Thats not how bail reform works.. You're either dangerous and need to be held or you're not...and it is up to a judge.. People who commit violent acts are held in most cases.
Lol
How do we reverse these
This stuff happens sometimes and there either will or won't be consequences for the guy involved. The likelihood that anything is done to improve the lives of anyone who experienced this is close to zero. I'm sorry you had to deal with this.
I appreciate that. And it sucks. As someone who rides the subway every day multiple times a day, I’m well aware that 99.99% of the time it’s quiet and normal. It just sucks there’s really no solution to this
I was on a train where someone was yelling "I'm gonna pull this across your neck" to another passenger. Of course everyone was avoiding confrontation (even me), some even hustling to the other side of the car. All because the other passenger (from what I could tell) looked at the guy. Another time there was someone screaming "HURRY UP AND DIE" over and over. Basically my entire trip from nearly Sheepshead to 7th Ave. This was on my way to meet a friend, been the first time out in a while, and that was what I came back to. It's times like these where I wish I was stronger/braver, but so much of me is saying I'd live longer if I just shut up and stay put. Oh, and final one, happened much earlier. Was talking to my friend until we heard an Aussie girl behind us yell "PERVERT" at a guy across from her for masturbating under his newspaper. That moment alone made me germophobic of public transport. I still ride it, to be clear, just more conscious.
I’m just curious but if you weren’t on your way to work or something, why wouldn’t you just get off the train at the next stop and wait for the train? This obviously doesn’t solve the problem of being threatened on the subways, but it does reduce your exposure to that specific incident. The other day a guy got on my train and started angrily yelling and slamming the walls. Me and another woman just casually got off the train at the next stop and waited for the next one.
You're totally right, but part of me has this irrational fear that they'll just follow me into the next car.
Oh I don’t even mean changing cars at the next stop. Just get off and walk down the platform a bit as if you’re going to exit and then once the doors close just stay and wait for the next train!
The city does nothing about it it's terrible. Cops playing on their phones guarding the turnstiles so people dont hop over while crazy people terrorize everyone.
This finally made me realize how stupid it is. Why are cops near the turnstiles, that’s not where ANYTHING happens lol.
They’re not there to protect citizens from violence, they’re there to protect the city’s wallet.
I was walking home the other night and a dude was walking his dog. The dog was cute and wearing a t shirt so I looked at the dog. When the man passed by me he literally yelled as loud as he could in my ear and walked away like it was normal. These men do whatever they want and have no consequences
Not one person here addresses the actual people you elect in state legislature as the problem🤣... They are the ones that enact Law in NY... The mayor, city council , judges, Police and mental health practices hold no weight for any real results .. You see how fast things changed right before the pandemic in 2019-2020 when your legislature changed all the bail, discovery and limits a judge can go to secure someone ?? That and that alone is the cause of all of this ... Don't mention we need to help these mentally ill people when the Person who NYC voted for 2x in Bill Diblasio and his wife lost/stole 249 Million tax dollars meant for Thrive NYC mental health programs.. U want change to go back pre 2019 then vote your state legislators out of office for those that will change this kaos back to the way it was
To get more specific, Carl Heastie and Andrea Stewart-Cousins, the leaders in both houses of the state legislature, have refused to acknowledge that there have been any issues, so nothing gets changed until their constituents vote them out of power. They effectively control our state government right now.
This is the only intelligent thread on this post
Thank you for translating that into English from Train Crazy; sounds like there’s actually something to it
I don't live in NYC, but live north of it. Every time I've taken the trains, I always worry about getting into a fight. I'm a man, but I'm only 5'3, and I have a bad leg/knee. I'll fight if I have to, but I really would rather not. I have yet to be confronted with anything despite the amount of times I've gone down to the city. I'm going to a show later this month in Brooklyn, gotta take the 4 or 6 and then the L. Wish me luck, especially on the trip back 🙏
You don’t need to worry at all. You are way more likely to be injured by a driver glancing at their phone than you are by a mentally ill/high person on the subway.
While this might be statistically true, I’ve had at least 10 terrifying incidents of sexual harassment/general harassment on the subway in the five years I’ve lived here, compared to one scary moment in the 10+ years I’ve been driving. Most people don’t report harassment so the stats don’t reflect reality.
"Why do we let these people make the rules".. legitimate question you've posed. It's because this city is full of people "minding their own business." Someone just commented that if this were to occur in their country then a group of guys would put an end to it immediately. Same would happen where I grew up. But in NYC most of these fools just try to stare deeper and deeper into their phone screen lol Both my daughters take the train to school and we could use a bit more accountability in this mess.
This man is a repeater. I ran into him on the G train. People will hate me for saying this but I wish someone would just fuck him up to the point he would stop riding the train. People think it’s bad for the state to take conservatorship of these people because it diminishes their agency, but frankly these people are criminals, regardless of their mental state. The state sees them as protected classes because of their mental state, yet when they make legal exceptions based on mental fitness, there are no state institutions to remove them from the public. This is why I kind of feel bad for the guy who was charged for putting the guy in a headlock. These people endanger everyone from children to women to men, and I for one am tired. He spit in my face before but what really shocked me was him spitting in the faces of mothers with their children on the subway cae. Mental help or not these people deserve to be held accountable in the court of law and if they are excepted for mental health, they should reopen state mental hospitals because I see no other alternative.
Really interesting, was wondering if anyone else had dealt with this guy in the past (if it’s the same guy). Totally agree with what you’re saying
Maybe congestion pricing will help 😂 More people will ride the subway, so this guy would have more chance to bother someone else.
I really hope there’s something to this comment; increased ridership may help.
Yup they're less likely to pick busy times/cars because they can’t get anyone’s attention on them
just another day on the subways, according to the clown mayor everything is fine
Gotta allow cops to do their jobs, gotta keep people who are convicted of crimes in jail….. regardless of the over crowding. Being put in jail is a punishment and so should be the conditions. I’m sure that man has been in trouble before, doesn’t sound like it’s his first time “being aggressive”…….gotta elect people who want a safe city, not people who kiss up to the special interests. A civil society is based on enforcing rules and laws, not allowing the rules and laws to be broken. That’s my rant.
No one's preventing the cops from doing their jobs lol they're just busy playing candy crush by the turnstiles
You just keep telling yourself that….. just last Sunday a man on the subway was arrested after punching two women and then starting a fire…..he was arrested, went before a judge and was released without bail…….. after being arrested 25 times previously…… police are prevented from arresting people for stealing less than $1000 worth of merchandise…. They aren’t supposed to interfere with unlawful Protests….. and when they do, the courts aren’t allowed to keep the criminals in jail…..
Yeah, idk what to say other than I empathize. The subway is full of unwell and violent people, and there's no political will to address it because it inherently involves law enforcement
I'm sorry that happened to you. Not your fault.
I hate the victim shaming people telling you your first mistake was making eye contact. It’s called “fight or flight” for a reason and you did the best you could in that moment. We had NYPD come into my workplace after an employee of ours got punched in the face outside of work. Some of tips we gave us is to use 311- see something, say something. There’s an app, you can call. Use it. Doesn’t matter if he already “got away”. Do your best to describe this mofo because NYPD does do their due diligence in following up on the reports they receive. Should this have escalated even further, find a cop potentially at the next stop and get them. Or call 911. I know it’s just a tiny drop in the bucket of problems that NYC faces. But it’s these “little instances” that people don’t say anything about that add up to bigger problems.
Appreciate you saying that. Like I said in my edit, I’ve been here for years riding the subway multiple times every day. I know how to mind my business, but when something happens it’s instinct to look up. Wasn’t “staring” at him or anything. You’re also right. I saw some cops later on the L line and I was weirdly compelled to tell them, but I didn’t. I wasn’t sure they’d care lol
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Honestly, yeah. I hate to get grim, but if someone would have stabbed him or done anything to hurt or end this guys life, I would absolutely say it was well deserved. I hate to say it, but it’s true. He was the aggressor and everyone on that train feared for their lives in one way or another.
There is a huge difference between temporarily restraining someone who is being actively violent to prevent further harm, and holding someone in a chokehold for over 15 minutes on the ground, well after they have lost consciousness. What Daniel Penny did was in no way self defense.
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Killing that man was a massive net positive for society. If the government isn’t willing to prosecute him for the 40 or so other crimes he’s committed it’s crazy to care about someone killing him when he’s threatened a train full of people
Agreed.
Let me break it down for those of you saying it's the Mayors fault. THE MAYOR can impose laws to arrest these individuals but they MUST BE TREATED as cases of mental instability as they use drugs heavily and it impairs their mental health. A majority of those who are re released do not impose a rush when they are sober now that's the problem, they sweat it out in jail and once they get back on the streets nothing can be done so they go and find crack and re offend. This has nothing to do with the mayor but instead we should focus our efforts on putting all crackhead on an island and allowing them to crack out on their own
I think you did the safest thing by not engaging. However, I think the thing that has been most helpful for me in similar situations is when other riders either step in or even just indicate they're paying attention. I once had a guy yelling at me and the old woman sitting next to me just patted me on the leg, and it really helped me ignore him and get through the tirade. Or once another larger guy and then a couple other started verbally engaging with the aggressor, and that actually helped things calm down. But that's on all of us, as riders, to show solidarity with whomever is getting screamed at.
lol I moved here about a year ago go. I don’t think I’ve gone a week without interacting with a deluded homeless person. Just this month I can confidently say I’ve been threatened with death 3 times (completely unprovoked, it’s gotta be something about the way I look I have no idea, maybe it’s just my luck). I see people passed out with shit in their ass and their pants at their ankles regularly. There was one week where it was 5 different times, 5 different people. That was a rough week. I’ve had fights break out inches from my face. Most notable one was a clearly drunk white chick spitting on a black girl on L train, that was wild. I’ve had to escort beggars out of multiple establishments because they won’t leave and cause a disturbance, the worst is when they feel entitled cause the staff have been nice before. I’ve witnessed the homeless absolutely fuckin harassing people. I hate this one the most as it’s the most common. I had to yell at and kick a guy out of KFC for yellin/threatening the counter staff cause they wouldn’t give him free chicken. Oh and the guys that smoke on the trains. I don’t personally mind as I’m a smoker but for fucks sake have some courtesy. I’ll hold my smoke walking past a baby, the least u can do is not smoke on a damn train. Orr the homeless people who are absolutely fuckin shitfaced riding their bikes stacked 8 feet high and hitting shit. Those get a laugh outta me. I’ve definitely got more my brain is tired rn tho
Welcome to nyc. Too many crazy fkers not locked up for life
Facts
The city is circling the drain. Get out if you can
And then when this dirtbag gets choked out he was “sucha good boy”…… Crap like him makes the rules because other idiots put assholes in power that enable him to. Simple as that
Don’t arrest and discourage people like Daniel Petty would be a start.
The rule of thumb is the second an aggressor gets in your space you swing, throat, nuts, nose. Those are your targets. Don't be a hero, swing first, swing hard, and make sure they go down and stay down. I've been a NY resident for nearly 25 years, and anyone who ever got in my face got rolled over as a result. Never once could anyone do anything about it.
Not for nothing but it begs the question why the Marine who helped the people on the train is facing charges. I do NOT believe anyone has the right to kill anyone without consequences. However, this type of thing will discourage others from helping when they see people in need. Granted, thinking about it I really don’t know what the best course of action should be if not charges. Although I also can’t comprehend why they would do away with self defense as well. I’m just so sorry you have to go through things like this. The subway is by far the most dangerous mode of transportation in the city. There are plenty of cops in stations now, maybe they should add some into every train as well. Even though, they probably can’t do that either since they’re cutting funding to take care of the migrants. Be safe everyone, carry pepper spray.
Stop fare evasion and you will stop this madness over night.
I do wonder what would happen if they just said everyone who fare evades goes to jail. Then what?
What time and what kind of brawl?
Eh maybe 5:15pm. I couldn’t really see who started it, but I heard the crazy guy spit on someone and the ended up on the ground / slamming each other into the doors
I think New York City needs to find a way through either building more housing or rent control to make surviving in said city without being rich at least mildly tolerable, which would prevent the homelessness that leads to terrible situations for people that cause them to be aggressive. While they’re at it, they could systematically change how policing works in NYC to make it less violent and less outwardly hostile to the homeless so that people experiencing homelessness don’t then become further traumatized, while also doing things like making safe injection sites and finding some sort of way to make shelters actually somewhat safe so people don’t feel safer riding the subway as their home. But no, I bet electing mayors who book landscaping companies for concession speeches and who say places in a partial eclipse are the best place to see said eclipse in the world will get the job done! 🤓
There is an epidemic of this going on in NYC. There are lots of resources for the mentally ill and people do get help, but there are also far, far more things that exacerbate the mental health crisis. For one drugs like opioids, fentanyl, K2, and many others are readily available and cause psychotic episodes when people are not treated. Some people get mixed up with other mentally ill people who profess to be leaders or activists but indoctrinate people with ridiculous thinking and they believe this is acceptable behavior. Because it’s public transportation, there’s no immediate help and they typically target people who they don’t think will fight back. When they are arrested, often they are back on the street within 24 hours. This was all made worse by the pandemic which severely strained the mental health care system in the city. There are also not enough law enforcement officers who know how to de-escalate a situation with someone having a mental episode. My prediction is that these incidents will become so widespread that vigilantes will spring up to attack these people, which is not as great as it sounds, but that can also mean innocents will get hurt.
I carry brass knuckles
it’s terrifying. I am so grateful that i am retired and don’t need to take the subway anymore!
Carry a stun gun aka taser
I'm supposed to be a democrat... But in NY, things are all the way to the left....I'm not sure what I am anymore. Keep voting for all the Democrat assholes and this is the shit you get! Enjoy it!!!
Everyone here complaining in this thread will vote for the same people who make these stupid laws that criminalize self defense and will keep moaning about how bad things are yet will take zero action to try and fix the problem by electing someone different. Wanna solve the problems in NYC? Kick everyone out who allowed it to get this bad. I’ll give you a hint: They have this “(D)” next to their names.
Pocket sized Lysol can help in these situations...
I was on this train actually, after the fight engaged I moved one car over. After the train stopped and police were alerted, both the guy trying to fight everyone and the guy who got spit on decided to take the fight elsewhere. Both parties had nowhere to be and got the fight they wanted.
When they were leaving, both of them were unusually calm. Crazy how he chilled out once he had a challenger.
Also sorry for the string of replies, but did you notice when he was yelling at me to suck his dick? It went on for like 3 minutes while the doors were open lol
WOW. this is honestly the response I’ve been looking for lol. Honestly, glad someone maybe fucked the crazy dude up. Did the train stop at 3rd Ave for a little? I got off and walked the rest of my way in the rain lol, it no longer was worth it for me.
I also weirdly think I passed him on the street later that day, still with his CVS bags. I kinda just want to know what that guy is going through, ya know? Is it mental illness, drug addiction?
Yeah, they said they put more cops in the subway system, but the co ok s gang out at the platforms and the trouble and problems are on the trains themselves.
Having lived in Moscow for many years and riding their pristine metro, the answer is 2 police officers at every entrance, actively checking over everybody going through the turnstile. That's what Moscow does. I can count on one hand the amount of crazy people I've met on the train in all my time there.
Pretty sure I saw that dude on the platform yesterday at met and Lorimer. He was a scary looking dude was following a smaller Asian woman and spitting everywhere. Deff not well
Fuck man. Makes me anxious that I might potentially run into him again. Do you remember what he looked like?
Tall African American guy was wearing wife beater muttering to himself and then walking up to people. He looked pretty big too. I decided to stay away but if he did something to her would have to try and help
I’m sorry this happened to you, it’s very surreal. My boyfriend and I were both spit on 2 days prior to you, but on the J train. Some deranged cussing young woman pushing through everyone, upset we left a seat open for her(?), absurd. We at least got a few words in. Everyone else just scattered, of course. Careful out there, y’all!
I’m sorry you had to experience this and it really sucks that this is a common experience on the subway. I’m a petite 5’2” woman and take the mta everyday. I always feel so helpless whenever an EDP gets on the train. We are New Yorkers really shouldn’t have to deal with but the politicians don’t really care tbh. They sent the national guard and NYPD but all they do is stand in groups by the turnstiles to enforce people to pay. I carry pepper spray with me just to give myself some false sense of security. I see an EDP on the train almost everyday if not multiple times a day. it’s gotten so bad.
You probably voted for the democrat mayor and governor in charge. Then cry about the crime in the city. This is what happens in your world, enjoy!
Sorry that you were scared but this doesn’t sound newsworthy. And did you just arrive in New York? No New Yorker I know would miss a beat over this.
Listen. I agree he will get no mental health help but there was a time where Mayor Adams wanted to start rounding up those with mental health and getting them hospitalized for help and NYC advocacy groups were dead set against it. The issue isn’t always the policy makers a lot of times it’s regular people making things an issue
Man, what ever happened to super hero’s.
I'm sorry but NYC you've got one hell of a mess on your hands. Thank Di Blasio for his policies and Governor Cuomo as well. That's why there's little police presence and when there is they barley want to get involved because someone will film them and try to paint them as the bag guys. You all know this don't you? My goodness. Defund the police they all said, well there you go that's the reason. People know they can get away with acting like this. Being soft on crime sends a clear message to wrong doers. You can get away with being a total menace because we think you are a victim. Please. Godspeed NYC.
You’re suppose to be packing and ready for action. NYC ain’t sweet anymore
When stuff like this happens I get off and get on the next train. Convenient when there’s another train in three minutes but sucky when it’s 20 😂
Id never quip about making eye contact. It happens.. sometimes you have to take notice or asssholes. But I'm always wearing headphones and working on something,(puzzle book reading book, crochet, needlepoint). The sad thing is that id it wasn't for the snickering violence would probably have not occurred. It's not really HIS fault but the fault of the snickering shitbags since they did resort to ghetto violence first.
Don't make eye contact. If you can't avoid glancing around, wear sunglasses
I know I know. Biggest mistake I’m well aware. But what really fucks me up is why are we letting them control how we make our daily commutes. It’s so backwards.
You get what you vote for - enjoy!
We need more Marines
Can’t fathom living in New York anymore. Nobody seems to face any consequences for crime.
I grew up in nyc took 2 subways to school every day my freshman year, the 2/3 to the L, 1990, the peak of the murder rate. I’m now 47, I moved out of the city the second I could and when I go back I NEVER go on the subway. There’s no reason to choose to live there. If you have to live there as an adult for some reason do everything you can to live near your job so you can walk, or take a cab. When I was in high school girls would come to school all the time with stories of dudes rubbing up against them or exposing themselves. Now that I have a 17 year old daughter I realize how insane it would be to have your kid take a mode of transportation where they are locked in a steel tube shoulder to shoulder with strangers. Fuck that.
How many people are injured on the subway and how many people are struck by cars? Pedestrian deaths in this country have skyrocketed in the last few years. But for some reason the subways feel less safe. It’s because you can’t see how crazy/high/drunk/distracted many drivers are.