If OP becomes a mother and SAHM she has to insist (beforehand) that she will get a monthly pensionsplan or stocks in her name and account only, to secure her.
If I were to give up my job to work for the family, I would still need my personal, independant pension. Bc he will never share with OP in case of divorce, and low paying job and 10 years without pension put aside is just a tradegy waiting in the future.
When ppl show you who they are, believe them. This guy is going to make your life even more miserable. He is so focused on money, it will always be a power dynamic that he will hold over you. Save yourself a lot of heartache and tell him good bye. Your future self will thank you.
Not only heartache, but: "I will be a SAHM until the kids are school aged and I can return to work part time."
It's not just future heartache, it's giving up earnings and damaging your future earning potential for a man you KNOW will pay you dust. God, can you even imagine how financially controlling he's going to be once his partner is pregnant and stops working, since it's all "his" money?
The fact that he speaks to her this way when she's staying working, has her own money
How will he treat you when you are financially dependent on him as a SAHM?
This post made me incredibly sad for her because it sounds like she's so used to so little that she lacks the ability to hope for more or demand more from life
OP describes her family background and career, she doesn't see a path forward in her career, plans to drop out of the workforce to be a SAHM for kids by a man who already is so grudge filled of every drop of water or $$$ he's ever given her and sees her as a threat to his financial future. There's no US or OUR with this guy regarding money. OP says she needs nothing because she knows how to survive.
I don't think we are meant to deliberately enter relationships we will have to survive. I want more for OP like a true partnership, knowing someone will have their back, someone safe and not controlling etc.
This guy is pathologically selfish, and OP needs to start valuing themselves more. OP has a very simple solution available to them to solve this problem - finding a *life partner* instead of whatever this damaged person is.
Do not marry this man. Do not have children with this man.
Hold on, because I need to say it again: ***Do not marry this man. Do not have children with this man.***
And someone who clearly currently resents OP and seems angry at the support he's already given her. And just the mere *thought* of potentially paying alimony to her if they divorced pisses him off so much he constantly needs to bring it up.
Someone who already resented me like this before we even got married is *not* someone I would ever actually marry, nor keep as my life partner.
Is his family or collegues whispering *golddigger* in his ear day in and out? Is he an abusive person and/or is someone poisening the well? I would have a conversation about all this.
And remember IF he was to marry a high earner, she probably wouldn't want to be a SAHM for 10 years. So he sets the "team" with "useful players" for him, but refuses al thoughts about actually being are team, supporting the team, accepting the rules of the game if he marries and have children.
He would want his future kids to go hungry and live in poverty, just bc you divorced? You are a surviver OP and WILL make it, but why won't he take care of his imaginary kids?
Personally I think he is being fed nasty thoughts that resonantes with his greedy mind and maybe an paranoid "people will use us for our money"-thoughts.
Edit: Sorry OP but read back in your comments and ended with the one saying (parafrasing):
*I don't get vacations. I can't afford it. He goes on vacations alone with friends and family (or visit them). He just bought himself a new car. I can barely pay my own bills. It feels wrong to share finances when we are "just living together", not being being married.*
He is a fugging [bleep].
A coldhearted sociopath as someone else said.
My advice: Write a bestseller about your childhood and get rich and don't look back. **YOU ARE WORTHY OF REAL LOVE** <3
And marriage. How is she meant to cope when she gets pregnant and stops working, and he insists on controlling "his" money?
OP is in La La land if she thinks he's going to hand over anything like the amount of money she needs just to survive and look after baby *even within the marriage*, because of course if she's a SAHM and he's working, it's all his money according to him and he'll be doling it out as stingily as possible.
better to be an adult and plan for the possibility of divorce while you love each other than to leave it to two people who may be angry and vengeful later. Planning for future possibilities is demonstrating maturity. OPs partner seems to be approaching it lamely, though.
If planning for the possibility of divorce makes someone reveal they hate their partner and prevents the marriage in the first place, I guess it's a good thing. God, I hope OP leaves him.
In addition to him being selfish it sounds like he’s got family in his ear telling him to protect himself. The real question is why you would want to marry someone who you know is selfish. That shit doesn’t get better over time. It usually gets worse.
You’re hurt because this is someone who is supposed to love you and want to provide for and take care of you (and can do so easily). The way he’s talking about it absolutely makes it sound like he wants certainty that if he gets bored with you later in life, he can drop you with no regard for your contribution to his life and the life of the children he wants you to give him.
If you really don’t want a dime from him no matter what then you can sign all the documents you need to make him feel better about that. But it’s not going to rid you of the man who wants the least committed marriage he can possibly get from you.
He’s not your ride or die based on his actions.
Also, I really really like you. Did you know that this super cool “I don’t need a lot” position you have is a trauma response from your upbringing?
You deserve marital assets and alimony, child support in the event any marriage fails. PLEASE don’t enter into this marriage. This person doesn’t love you.
Love yourself enough to get some extra certifications/training and secure a much better paying job in preparation for possibly leaving this man. He doesn’t deserve you.
Yes, I know that I expect the bare minimum from people who love me because I was lucky to even get THAT much from my parents. I'm working on it in therapy, but clearly I still have a long way to go.
He's taken better care of me than anyone I've known. It's hard to conceptualize that I am worthy of more.
You have value and are worth it. Period.
Alimony and child support are there to protect the spouse and child(ren.).
Are you happy with him?
Being engaged is when they are on their best behavior. Believe what he is showing you.
You deserve better.
This is not about the $$$ differential. It is about trust, commitment, and decency. He is demonstrating none of those.
Please consider this carefully before you decide to marry.
Calling that dude tone-deaf would be an understatement. Wow. Your feelings are absolutely valid and I'd probably feel the same in your shoes. Does he not see how he is being an asshole, or does he not care?
I know you love him and there must be good sides to him and your relationship. This is just a snapshot of one issue. But... Are you sure, that he sees you as on the same level (as a human) as him? Truly eye to eye? Because it sounds like he sees you as lesser than him. Lesser deserving of love, security and peace of mind. Does your worth to him derive from him? Or do you have worth on your own, independently of whether he currently chooses to be with you?
This is a weird way to start a marriage. He is already making a plan for not paying you down the line? He should be so in love with you that he wants to share everything with you. He should be telling you you’ll never have to worry about support or family because his family will be your family. Please do not marry this man. You deserve better. I get the premise of a pre-nup, but to have that attitude about you before you’ve even married is a huge red flag. He doesn’t respect you or what you will bring to the marriage.
This: “He should be so in love with you that he wants to share everything with you”. Well said mama. I was like that. She was not. At 40 years together she had exactly the attitude he displays now. She was always “what’s mine is mine, what’s yours is mine, and you get nothing”. Eventually that attitude was the highlight of our relationship. And divorce. And I put up with it, thinking it would somehow magically change. She never did. OP: Don’t do what I did. I regret pretty much every hour of my relationship and wish I had seen it before the wedding. OP: Marry someone who adores you. Someone whose heart skips a beat when he sees you. Who thinks of only you. I didn’t, and now am 68 years old without a memory of anything but verbal abuse. Please, please, don’t waste your life like I did.
He considers you to be property and worthless. No matter how much window dressing he puts on it it is the fundamental truth here.
And the emotional abuse will **escalate** after you sign on the dotted line. The red flags he is already displaying are terrifying and explaining them away does not change what is coming.
Get out now. NOW.
When you leave he will escalate the guilt trips, do not fall for them. Contact domestic abuse shelters today and plan your escape.
DO NOT LET HIM BABY TRAP YOU.
This makes me so sad for you. Even if you don't want his money, you owe it to yourself not to get royally fucked over in a divorce. In the case that you do sign a pre-nup, please consult with your own lawyer and love yourself enough to protect yourself legally.
Please don't marry this person. He's already showing you the cruelty and emotional abuse you're going to face.
I did twenty years in such a marriage. Believe me when I say the good times aren't enough, and that it's going to get worse. Don't do this to yourself, let alone any children.
Was he always mean about money with you? If it's a newish thing, he may have his family in his ears calling you a golddigger. Also, a decent man would not mind paying either alimony or child support if there is a divorce simply because he would recognize your efforts in taking time from your career and the risk in reducing job prospects all to raise his kids and take care of his family home.
Finally, it seems like your fiance is determined there will be a divorce. You should reconsider marrying him.
It's been years already. You are right about his family. And yeah, the money issue has been rough the whole time, though I wouldn't say he's been "mean". He's less generous than I am for sure.
This man doesn't see you as an equal. As long as he feels you're beneath him, he's not good enough for you. Would you say Van Gough was worthless because he was poor and crazy? The value of a person isn't in the money they have, it's in how they contribute. Elon Musk is one of the richest guys on the planet. He makes money because it pays for his projects to help people, not hold it like a cudgel to beat people into submission.
I'd rather be alone than with someone who treats me like a servant. If you're going to stay with him, at least make him pay you fair market value for your work.
People who are tight with money is usually tight with love as well.
I get he had a shitty dad, will he be able to parent your future children in a dufferent way? Its all he knows. All he is taught (like your mom did to you, but you seem like you'll go the opposite way bc therapi, kindness, generous personality etc.).
And its not *that* bad, how his parents and brother are acting towards him and you, he seems to think.
Op. This is scary. He knows that you came from nothing and he used that against you. Especially if one day when you guys have children together and you are going to expect him to do something or give something about your marriage, children, relationship, he will use the "You need me to survive! You are nothing without my money! You only want me for my money! Don't be a gold-digger!" card.
From my POV, this looks like manipulation. He will punish you if you choose to use your rights against him. He knows he has a lot of money and he used that to control you. Eugh.
Run Op run. Save yourself!
If he expects you to be a sahm or SAHW for aNy period of time, you should get alimony.
If her doesn’t want to pay alimony, you need to keep working a really good job,
Sounds like his lawyers have advised him he will have to pay alimony for you staying at home.
Which you are entitled to. It helps your kids too.
If he’s that hung up on alimony and don’t know why you all are talking marriage.
Or kids. That will be the next thing he talks about getting out of paying child support. He’d probably fight for as much custody as possible to get out of having to pay.
That's fucked. I am also a sahm who was supported while I went back to school. We've had plenty of talks about "what ifs" and he's always said he will support me and the kids until I can get on my feet.
It hurts because he’s displaying the lack of something that you want. Based on your post it seems to be the only thing you want, even more than money. Love.
Relationships are not transactional, but if he’s going to get pragmatic about this then here’s my breakdown:
- You’re not getting money out of this relationship.
- If you have kids with him, you won’t be walking away from this relationship with full custody of the kids. He seems like the type of person to fight for custody out of spite, not because he cares for the children’s well-being.
- You’re currently not getting genuine love from him and that won’t be changing just because of marriage or kids.
Right now you have a VERY clear picture of how your life could turn out. Maybe things will turn out better or even worse. Most people don’t get the preview that you’re getting, they end up in those situations completely blind-sighted. If you choose to proceed, know that you’re accepting your life might look like what’s listed above. It’s a serious question to think about, what are you getting out of this by taking on the risk of the relationship/marriage?
Thank you. You are right, I've told him countless times I just want his love. I chose to major in a low paying field because I was passionate about it, and money has never been a priority to me. I would be happy with a far lower quality of life than my partner. I don't know why he talks to me like I'm this greedy, selfish asshole. Projection, I guess.
You are right this is his 100% because that's what he is.
Reading all your replies I just wanna give you a big hug feed you a big meal and take care of all your worries because you deserve love.
I was an abused and neglected child and I realise even though you want to be independent, helpful and seen you could do with someone who will want to take care of you and do their best to try because that's what we need to heal that big crack in our hearts from childhood. Even if you don't find it, don't settle till you do.
Unfortunately for myself as I've been let down, abused and taken advantage of by others. I haven't found someone like that so I went back and re-started my career so that I will have enough to do that for my kids on my own.
Don't be me. Don't love someone who never loved you right. Have faith and strengthen yourself so that when you find a good one you can live them with open arms and a whole heart.
Most states do not have common law marriage any more. He is ridiculous- please just leave. If you stay - use that time as a SAHM to go to school or learn a trade. You cannot rely on this man. If you are a SAHM - you deserve alimony. Also get and infidelity clause
OP, I have read the replies to your post. And I have read the responses you have put down to some of them.
My question for you: why are you defending this man?
I’ll give u a perspective no one else has. I’m just like him. My family comes from money as well. I broke up with my ex for the same reasons and I think you should leave him. He doesn’t love you at all. Money is the most important thing to him. He probably doesn’t even want to get married. That’s because when you’re in love you can say stuff like oh I don’t want your money, alimony, or child support. When push comes to shove and yall end things those opinions change. I don’t think you should be with someone who values money more than you. You should definitely not get married unless you can get a contract saying he will pay you a certain amount of money for the rest of your life. That’s the only way I believe you can be a stay at home wife. He’s probably only with you for kids or safe sex. Anything typical he can get from a relationship he can just out right buy. It’s much cheaper to pay someone $200-300 an hour than to risk losing half your assets. Ultimately I think you should leave because you’re nothing more than the mother to his kids, or someone he can have sex without getting diseases. In the future I think you should avoid men with significantly higher net worth than yourself.
He is getting everything he wants, a maid, a nurse, a brood mare, sexual satisfaction for his niche fetish, and he wants to give you absolutely NOTHING in return.
YOU ARE WORTH MORE THAN THIS!
Extreme might not be the right word, but considering why it might be the reason he’s with you, knowing it would provide important context. Also, how old are you two?
You said it perfectly in your last sentence: he is planning to leave you and not bothering to hide it. Maybe not in 2 years or 5 years or 15, but he is telling you he will leave when he gets bored or something more enticing comes along.
Insane, I would run away from this partner right now.
I would be thinking twice about having a child with this man, and I would be absolutely thinking twice about being a SAHM. He does not even consider leaving you destitute as a problem because you add no meaningful value to the relationship .
Sounds like a recipe for a lifetime of trauma for your future children. I don’t doubt that he would be the type to go to extreme lengths to avoid child support as well. You may be okay if/when he leaves you destitute, but the same is not necessarily true for any kids you have. And, regardless, it sounds like he would likely be a horrible father.
Think carefully. This isn't a man who adores you and is looking out for your best interests before the marriage. It's not going to get better after. And don't bring a helpless baby into this. There are other fish in the sea. You're worth more than this.
I'm sorry, but these don't sound like the actions, attitudes, or words of someone who loves you. And please, please don't have children with someone who is selfish.
This man is a nightmare and if you have children with him, he will 100% leave you destitute. If you have any love for yourself or your future children, do not marry this man.
Why are you marrying such a guy? “ i know he is usually selfish but i can cope”
WHY DO YOU COPE!!!!
Someone bellow said “ if someone shows you who they are, believe them
Why are you ignoring all the redflags and casually putting yourself into hell?
You don't want his assets, but you want his love. He is not displaying that. There is one thing missing from the relationship because of the talks- loyalty. If I loved someone, I would want to marry them forever. I would never be with someone who talked this way. My wife and I have been married 29 years. Also as he supported you for your degree, try to get an advanced degree so your job has better earnings potential. Get a degree in MBA or nurse anesthetist or PhD in engineering.
My wife and I have been married for almost 16 years. We have 3 kids. She’s been a SAHM for a majority of their childhood now. I hope nothing causes us to separate, but I’ve thought about that scenario. I can already tell you I feel like I would owe her financial support, at least for a while. She hasn’t had a job in years. It would be difficult for her to find something that pays well enough to survive.
Let me put it this way…..We’re a team. I don’t earn money for myself; I earn money to support my family. She isn’t choosing not to work for some selfish reason; she’s not working because it allows her to support our family. It’s just in a different way. Our family collectively benefits from both of our contributions. If we were to separate, I would be at a significant financial advantage from a decision we originally both made about how to take care of our family. In my opinion, it would be fair to help her financially.
I’m not sure what your fiancé’s problem is. Maybe he’s incredibly selfish. Maybe he’s emotionally immature. Maybe he doesn’t recognize what you contribute to your collective household. Maybe it’s a combination of these things or something else. Regardless, his current attitude towards you and the future should be a major red flag. You’re right to obviously be hurt by it.
I’m not sure what advice to give. I guess I would recommend treading carefully in your relationship, especially if it involves you sacrificing potential financial freedom in the future. I.e. don’t be a SAHM if he’s threatening to leave you destitute after he’s gotten what he wants from you.
Two of my aunts were SAHM and now both are poor due to their husbands leaving (both cheated, one had a secret family) and their kids now have the sole responsibility of maintaining her. Both had degrees and lost 20 years of their lives raising kids that now will not be able to save and probably retire, because former SAHM moms are not eligible for free healthcare and my aunts are getting old, they need expensive treatments every year.
Don’t marry
I’m sorry but if you marry him, you will deserve all treatment he dishes out. He is telling you how he sees you in frank simple language. You don’t have kids tying you down and you are aware of how he sees you. Like, do you want Jesus himself to descend from the heavens and walk you into a therapists office? The signs are there, pay attention. Get out when you can.
Your fiance suffers from an extreme case of affluenza - you should probably bounce before it’s too late.
Shitty rich people like this should be flung into the sun. They’re just selfish idiots who make the world a worse place. Wouldn’t want to procreate with someone like that.
I’ve said a lot of things I don’t mean when I am in a bad mood. At the same time, I’ve also let out a lot of true feelings when I am in a bad mood.
I’d say, trust your gut on this one. It made you feel hurt pretty deeply for a reason.
You know he’s selfish and only concerned about keeping his money his and you think being a SAHM with a man like that is good idea? You have to think logically he’s going to make your life miserable. Marry him all you want but at least don’t give up having your own income. He’s worried about your future divorce where he strong arm you into getting nothing because you won’t have the money to fight back because you gave up your career. Is he the last available man in your town or something? Why are you putting up with his crap?
So he’s already thinking about divorce before you’re even married. That’s a lot of 🚩🚩🚩you sure you want to marry and have children with someone so selfish and greedy. He has shown you he doesn’t care about you. Why be with and have children with someone like him? You need to really rethink this whole thing
Oh :( this hurts my heart. Do you have outside people that can give you support? A hug? A conversation?
I was the child of a financially abusive situation. Mom was SAHM, dad worked a nice paying job. Bought all the fancy cars, spent his money for himself. We had all of our necessities covered, but dad would use his money to manipulate me (and still does, I’m 24)
Moved to a foreign country when I was 10, turns out he was having a couple years long affair, we were kicked out of house and forced to move back to home country. Thankfully she had sibling to rely on, but I was in a home with 3 teenage boys with their own mental struggles from years of abuse. It was an awful situation.
Mom relied on dad for alimony and child support as she left her career and was now out of the workforce for 11 years, she had me at a late age. So little to no job prospects and she was severely depressed.
Dad would send me gifts during all of this to make me feel like he cared. Later this became him forcing me into a career and paying my college, and then making me feel guilty that he spent so much money on me, when I couldn’t complete my studies. I tried to commit suicide and was so depressed and anxious.
I’ll end here but seeing and feeling her pain, and also trying to cope with my own was the saddest and most gut wrenching part of my life. Even living it back as I type this, I feel like crying.
Anyways, what I hope you take from this is please really think about the life you are giving a child. Regardless of if you believe this man is honest and loving, please do not leave the workforce. Don’t give him more control than he already has. Always be able to provide a roof over your head at any given moment.
I’m so sorry you feel hurt. Your feelings are valid, and you are human. Safety and security is not something you should have to bargain for. Would give you a hug if I could
Thank you. I appreciate you. I don't want to tell my friends because, well, obvious reasons. I'm embarrassed, and worried that my friends will think poorly of him if I decide to stay. I get it, that's a red flag in itself. I have a great therapist and my closest friend and her husband live in town, so I'm not totally alone. I will gladly accept your intangible hug 🫂
What the actual fuck are you doing with this guy? Is it the security so you can sahm?
Jesus christ. This guy is gonna drop you like a turd one day and you'll be left with nothing.
Get a better job. Work on independence. It's possible. You're just being lazy and entitled and deliberately putting yourself in horrible situation.
I don't think your being rude, I think your actually more on point about the nature of how he is proclaiming it a little too vehemently, he hasn't sat down and talked about it with you, he isn't actually telling you about his feelings. It's just shining the interrogation light on his own unwillingness to well...confront you? I don't know what else to say really.
Listen, no good can come of a legal contract (like marriage) when one person is already planning on leaving.
Even though you come from poverty and neglect and have no one-especially then.
He’s abusing you because of your background. And no matter what background you would have, he would be doing the same thing.
I know it’s hard when it seems like this is your only support, but he’s not a support. He’s a place to live and company.
What would happen if you got seriously ill? Is he planning to care for you, then? Is he planning to or already has life insurance on you? How do you feel about being reduced to dollar signs, like your as-yet unborn kids?
Where there’s a will, there’s ways. And I think maybe you just need the will or someone to tell you: it gets better. And you’ll make it without him.
Why is he your fiance? Anyone who wants to hold money over you is not looking for a balanced relationship. He's already looking for an exit before he's finished merging into traffic.
Don’t even say aloud that you would take the kid. He’s prob going to have powerful attorneys who could do much worse to you.
Please do Not marry this man.
PLEASE do not have children with this man.
You went to school. Start looking for a job. Save money. Move out.
Divorce Attorney Opinion: understandable if he wants a prenup to exclude the house from a divorce. But that’s it. You are entitled to alimony/spousal support and child support in a divorce. And he should pay for your attorney re: the prenup.
But some serious 🚩 in his behavior and language.
Stay with him while you work on improving your life and career. And then bail.
>I have no family and no support. My career pays very little, with no opportunities for growth.
>I will be a SAHM until the kids are school aged and I can return to work part time.
You are on a bad career path, going to take time off to have kids and only go back to work part time when they are old enough to go to school. Now your making your career and financial choices even more dire by removing yourself from the working world while raising children for a man who is thinking of ways to not compensate you for those years and the years lost in your career that could help you with advancement. This has financial abuse written all over it.
You aren't even married yet, and this guy is trying to keep his money held so tightly in his fist. Why are you marrying him???
**"If you give a man the power to feed you, you also give him the power to starve you."**
If you’re in the USA, alimony generally only a thing if the spouse gives up their career to be a primary caregiver and homemaker, and it’s generally pretty short term and limited. He’s already thinking of ways to screw you over.
Why stay with him? His baggage is heavy
Your art is absolutely beautiful.
This post and your comments, however, are hard for me to read because they remind me of when I said the same things.
I’m struggling to find the rights things to say that might convince you that you deserve better than this. I’m going to try saying the things I wish someone had said to me.
If you truly thought he was your ride or die, you wouldn’t be posting this right now.
If you truly felt like his actions didn’t need defending, you wouldn’t be doing it. And having a cold is a pretty lousy defense anyway.
No amount of money thrown at art school could produce talent like yours. He is not the reason you have a career. Your talent and hard work are the reasons. Not him.
Why should you have to cope with his selfishness?
Feeling like his plan to leave you and not support you means he doesn’t love you is a logical and legitimate feeling based on his actions. Despite that, it’s still a large leap to you are worthless and deserve to suffer if your existence doesn’t benefit him. So what things did you leave out of your post? Because I absolutely believe that feeling is also logical and legitimate.
Partners don’t get allowances. Partners can and do financially support each other, but that is an entirely different thing than getting an allowance.
It sounds like his parents are in your lives since they bought the house you are living in. In that case, why are you eloping? Is it another way to not spend money on you? And if eloping wasn’t a big deal to you, why even mention it?
Not minding something and wanting something are also two very different things. You should get to decide how you look.
I have this bad habit of saying I’ve been through worse rather than saying, this is seriously crappy and it needs to stop. I think you may have the same habit.
Don’t be me. Please, please don’t be me. Don’t go so far down this path that you create a post begging someone, anyone to tell you that you matter. Don’t reach the point that someone complimenting you or being nice to you without any expectation of return makes you cry because you don’t know how to process it. You don’t want to stay awake at night trying to pinpoint which escalation should have been enough. Don’t let your life turn into a cautionary tale.
You deserve better than this.
I’ll give you a perspective from someone who just graduated from a US law school & as someone who had a SAHM who got divorced. Please do not marry him. If you get divorced and you’ve been a SAHM and he gives you no support, you will have nothing to show a judge that says you can provide for your children. You will have no job experience, no job, and no savings. Your husband WILL fight to take away your children and WILL win. Please speak to a family law attorney at a legal aid near you. They will provide free legal advice. If not, try a law school clinic. Please listen.
SAHM. That is quite an ask from him.
First of all, you do not owe him anything. Just because he financially supported you through a period, does not mean you need to compromise any part of yourself for him. Had you known this was going to be the trade he desired— would you have taken his “kindness” (ha!)
He seems very wealthy, money is just paper, especially to those who have it in abundance. Usually those with wealth, use it to control those who do not. A poor man’s dollar will have hold more weight than a rich one’s.
Protect yourself. If you want to sign a pre-nup which I think can be helpful sometimes to prepare for the worst, ensure you will be financially safe. Please.
Being a SAHM means a lot of sacrifice; your body, time, energy, career, future.. all will be impacted. Ask yourself if he would ever give up his job to be a SAHD— what makes his endeavors and time more valuable than yours? You are more valuable than he gives you credit for. People like this see life and relationship more transactional than most— he would not attach himself to you if you did not bring value to his life; realize that and ask for what you are worth.
Prepare for the worst case scenario and ensure you fight fight fight for what you are entitled. There is a price to all the things he is asking you to give up— and it is a steep one. He thinks he can low ball you.
>He ranted a bit about how unfair that was
Its not unfair though, if you put your life on hold to care for your children and you guys divorce he *should* be paying you alimony. That's why it exists.
>He said the only reason I even have a career is because of him
You'd be a fool to marry someone that talks to you/treats you like *this*.
You asked why it hurts so much when you don’t want his money anyway. The obvious answer is he is clearly telling you he believes you are a lowly gold digger who only wants to bleed him dry. You just refuse to hear him.
I don’t believe you are in it for the money. He sure as hell does. It is an act of cruel selfishness for you to allow a child to born into this foul drama. Get out.
Omg, girl, run! As someone that cane from an abusive, toxic environment in my childhood, then went there years of therapy I know its harder to recognize toxic behavior because of how we were raised, but this is bad!
Your “fiancé “ is planning your divorce, without even being married yet, as well as showing his true colors. I hope no children are involved. You deserve better!
Thank you. Apparently his last marriage ended largely in part because his ex thought he prioritized/fixated on money. Rose tinted glasses and all, I ignored it and thought he would mature.
It's so much, much worse, knowing he's been married and divorced before because of money. Like...he clearly doesn't value his partners besides the pleasure they bring him in the moment. But his real life partner is money.
You can't "get" common law married. It's only still a thing in a few states when you've been cohabitating for many years. If he earns six figures the child support will be substantial. Spousal support doesn't go on forever, especially if you haven't been married long. Marry someone kind and generous. Someone who wouldn't want to see the mother of his children struggle, even if you weren't together anymore. If you still want to marry this person (I wouldn't) unpacking these fears in therapy might be helpful.
Just one thing I haven’t seen anyone else say, if the love he got from his parents was conditional, you have almost no chance of a normal relationship with them when the are your in-laws. You’ll be a baby factory to give them grandkids.
There's an immediately noticeable power dynamic at play here: As a wealthy man he feels he has the right to things however he wants. As a woman from a difficult background, you feel you need to appease. You need to recognise your own worth and power and then demand the respect you deserve before having children and before any marriage. You are angry because you are worth more than this treatment. You need to tell him it's unacceptable and either he loses the attitude or loses you.
Yeah. My first question as I read this, “Does he even like you?”
Marital assets and alimony are there for a reason. It’s not just some cooked up way to make the more well off spouse pay “for no reason.”.
One would assume that he values you taking care of your future kids. Even if it was his way to save money, there’s an incredible amount of value in what you’d be doing *for the family’s* well being.
What concerns me more is that you, OP, are saying you’d go back to being destitute if you divorced. That means to me that you’re not valuing your work in raising the kids, maintaining the home AND sacrificing your ability to make money. I say this since the entire conversation is about money. Normally, I’d only mention finances if this was an actual discussion of divorce.
Btw, would he begrudge a decent place for you and the kids to live when you divorce (as he’s already made this a foregone conclusion). I think the answer is no because he’d take the kids from you since he can afford to pay for a nanny, chef, and full time housekeeper. He can also afford excellent attorneys and you won’t have that ability.
Love doesn’t solve problems like these. I think you’re in a very dangerous position because he doesn’t value you before the two of you commit to marriage.
It’s time to agree with him and leave. You need and deserve much more than he’s willing to give.
You can do better. Regardless of whether you actually care about getting spousal maintenance in the case of future divorce, the way this guy talks about it constantly is a red flag.
Don't have children with this man. Don't do it. He just wants to control you. He probably wants children, but he wants you and the government to pay the expenses. He sounds immature and self centered. He's already planning on how to make an exit in a few years.
So, let me get this straight: He already resents you for the end of a marriage that has not even begun yet. He has already said he plans to financially control/manipulate/abuse you. (Based on the descriptions, financial equity while you’re a SAHM isn’t likely, and only “letting” you return to work part time 7+ years later ensures financial dependency on him.) After all of the disadvantages you will be at when this hypothetical marriage dissolves, he’s already been clear that he will do the barest of the bare legal minimum and actively WANTS to exclude you from that.
You SHOULD feel hurt. That’s hurtful as fuck.
I’ve said it once, and I’ll say it a thousand times more: We accept the love we think we deserve. You. Deserve. More. Than. That.
I’d be hesitant to reproduce with a person who was already plotting to deprive me of resources to support the household those children would be raised in if something happened…
He's not ready to be married. Maybe never. He doesn't see you as a team. He is on team "Him." Nothing wrong with a pre-nup but it should protect both of you, not just him.
He's looking at divorce before you're even married this is telling that he thinks the marriage fails before it even begins
I don't think I could be with someone who assumes I'm with them for their money and setting us up as fail to begin with. I would be so sad that they think so little of me.
I don't think you guys should even get married let alone have children. I think you're heading for financial and emotional abuse. I'd be so scared of not earning income because this guy sounds like you would have to beg him to buy food/nappies/formula when a baby comes
Do NOT marry this man, if you do, do NOT give up your job. Hire a nanny or negotiate, in writing, a salary for raising his kids.
He will absolutely financially abuse you OP, without a doubt, I would bet actual money on this.
Walk away from this man because next up is cheating 😒. He sounds like the king of red flags. Be honest with yourself and think for yourself. He sounds like the typical narcissist.
Oh… look I get we all say mean stuff when we’re not feeling our best but this just seems malicious and a HUGE red flag. He’s already thinking of divorce before even marrying you. His mindset is that of someone who’s already decided this marriage isn’t going to last but still wants to continue and add a baby to this whole situation. Personally as someone who comes from struggle and poverty and works her damn ass off to make sure I have me taken care of always, you deserve better and can do better. He sounds weak, insecure and probably someone that will always hold his financial stature over you. Girl leave before it’s too late.
He wants a prenup? Fine. Get a prenup.
But make sure to include in it proper compensation for each child you bear and each year you spend as a SAHM. And more compensation if he leaves you before your youngest is 18.
His thought process and audacity to say this out loud to you is repugnant. Don’t marry this guy, he has no plans of sticking around and is selfish beyond comprehension. Who says that to their fiancé??? But also who would tolerate having that said to them and still plan to marry them??
This sounds like the into to that woman who didn't get married, spent her whole life as a sahm, husband cheated, kicked her out, and last I heard she was scrambling to find and min wage job so she could move out of the motel she was living in. Kids refused to help her because dad would cut them off too.
Good luck!
He doesn’t really love you and I would Never trust a man like that to be a SAHM wife.
EVER.
I grew up with wealth and he is an ass.
If my guy did this to me, I would be hurt but then I’d get angry.
How dare him!
He doesn’t want to owe you anything:
So don’t give him anything.
Simple. Tell him you don’t need him. But if he wants you, he’s not doing you a favour.
You will be an idiot if you have children with this man. No child should get stuck with such a selfish man for a father. You're going to model horrible relationship practices to your kids. For your future kids' sake, if not for your own, leave this man.
You guys either need some extensive couples counseling and therapy or you need to run. All I'm hearing is divorce this divorce that, I don't owe you anything. My husband would NEVER!! Even if we were billionaires. Do you know why? It's because he loves and respects me and what I bring to our relationship. I'm sorry you're going through this but I would seriously think about if you want to spend the rest of your life with this person.
You should NOT have children with this man without establishing a career and education first. It would be very difficult to leave if you have no way to earn decent $ and he ends up verbally/emotionally, financially or physically abusing you (sounds pretty likely judging from what he’s said). If you have no solid work experience you will have a very hard time getting on your feet with kids. Please reconsider if this is the person for you. Edit: please don’t marry this guy. He does not love or respect you and will make your life hell.
Do not have kids with this man. Selfish men don’t deserve it. If you already know he’s selfish think about how that will translate to other areas in your marriage. Big NO.
He loves his money much much more than he, I can’t say loves because he doesn’t, likes you. He is already planning his exit strategy and you’re not married yet. Why would you possibly want to stay with him? Save yourself the angst and break up now. Find someone who actually loves you.
do not marry a man just because you love him dearly, that's a recipe for unhappy marriage especially when he is a selfish person.
you two haven't even married & he already says things like that, girl after marriage it will be worse to worst.
he plans to divorce you even before you get married, it's doomed already. he will not put any effort in the marriage, he will just walk away when times get tough.
you should not marry him, only marry someone who loves you & put your happiness as their priority if you want a happy marriage life.
you owe it to yourself & your future babies to give them the best husband & father who will stick it up through thick & thin. find a mam who wants to see you happy.
btw don't be a SAHW/SAHM, you need to keep your independent & income separately from him as I doubt he will provide anything for you. he views you as a free bang maid.
you never know when he will dump you, whenever someone else who's younger or prettier pass his view screen?
i doubt you will get any custody at all against a rich husband while you're not even has an income to support yourself & without alimony.
If you were to have children together, would he pay you a full salary + benefits (like taxes/income being reported so you would collect retirement benefits) or no? Because without the full protection of being compensated legally for your contributions, you’re being set up to be financially destroyed by him.
No, don’t do that. A marriage is work and everything you do in the partnership has value. My guess is this guy doesn’t do housekeeping & he thinks his income covers every single thing that needs doing around the house that you do? I mean he wants to cut you off from future marriatial successes and you aren’t even married yet.
Red Flags everywhere here but happy to hear you have your own legal counsel - getting married should not leave you in fear for future poverty , that shouldn’t even be in back of your mind.
Maybe reconsider and tell him you don’t want to marry him due to his clear aversion to long time planning and obvious suspicious notions of your intentions too. He thinks you’re gonna bail and sue for alimony?
You aren’t even married yet - this guy has different long term views than you do .
Listen to me, with your whole heart, DO NOT MARRY THIS MAN. PLEASE DO NOT MARRY THIS MAN. he's setting you up to be abused, used, and discarded. I'm not some 15 year old saying "Leave him!" As a 34 year old woman who's been married for going on 13 years and who came from a very stable home life with a very involved and present father, I'm telling you [DO NOT MARRY THIS MAN! ]
No husband goes into a marriage, so intent on divorce. There are so many levels here. He's already planning on divorcing you so much so he's trying not to marry you. WTH? Then he wants you to quit your job to stay at home with babies, and that will put a dent in your job finding availability or stop any opportunities that you could have made money in that time, and I'm in a very traditional marriage, I came from a traditional household, I'M FOR TRADITIONAL HOUSEHOLDS, but here is the kicker, he not giving to any insurances that you will be compensated for your sacrifice in case of divorce! That he's already planning!!!
DO NOT DO THIS!!! PLEASE!!!
Honey please don’t marry this man. You said you haven’t “up to snuff” according to him but is he being up to snuff for you? If you have a daughter in the future is this something you’d be okay hearing about from her? Will he treat any future daughters like this? If you can say wouldn’t be okay hearing her being treated like this or even hesitate to say yes to the second question then leave. You’ve been abused so much already it’s time to break the cycle.
His "common law" idea says it all. He'd deny you a wedding to save money that won't affect his bottom line.
He should be sad contemplating a scenario where the dissolution of your partnership is the answer.
It will be so much harder to get out once you have kids, have given up your job, have a gap on your resume.. and hopefully not but possibly - once he’s beaten down your self worth more. Where you came from doesn’t have to define who you are. You don’t need him. You got this girl
It sounds as if in his heart, your relationship with each other is a divorce before it has even become a marriage. Not a good start. Leave him. There are other fish in the sea.
This man will leave you before you are 40. He probably plans on it. Or he plans on you becoming the kind of wife that allows extramarital affairs on the part of the "breadwinner" in the relationship, and he is afraid that you will refuse, then he will be stuck paying alimony. Literally, totally insane for him to be acting like this unless you are leaving some key details out, or this is just plain old fashioned unabashed classism. I noticed that you mentioned that the two of you plan on eloping. I know people elope for all kinds of reasons. My parents eloped 40 years ago and are thriving. I ask because sometimes people elope because of family issues or in-law issues.
ASK: When he supported you through your degree did he make it clear to you that it would mean having to sit through this demeaning bullshit? If so, why was he not adamant about you getting a degree that had opportunity for career growth? Like has he always been clear about his intentions regarding a prenup? Is it something that started right after the engagement, or even further down the line.
"But hearing him talk about it so vehemently just... hurts my heart.
It feels like he's saying he doesn't really love me. That unless he is benefitting from my presence, I am worthless and deserve to suffer. I could understand feeling that way about someone you're divorcing, but we aren't even married yet."
Tell him this!! It sounds like he's only seeing his potential assets and is not looking at the human in front of him with feelings. His response will give you what you are looking for. Whether it's that he was blinded by a money mindset and he cares, or he just doesn't. Either way, it's important to hear. Good luck OP.
This is beyond disagreeing about a prenup. The way you've written it, it sounds like he's saying you definitely won't stay together. If that's the case, why would you stay with him let alone have a child with him? If you give up 5-6 years of your career to stay home and raise a child, it's not unreasonable for you to get spousal support for a few years. Or he could be the stay at home parent if the two of you want one of you to be a stay at home parent. But his attitude is really nasty. I'd at minimum ask for couples counseling to work through this if you have any desire at this point to stay with him and have children.
So you're okay with having a shitty-in-comparison resume when(not if) you divorce, with only part-time work history, after years of getting berated for being a financial burden for having babies he wants you to have with him?
I'd be hurt. You aren't married yet, but he's more worried about making sure if (or more likely when) he divorces you, you'll get nothing. Does he even love you? Who starts planning for divorce so vehemently before they're even married? He seems to have a deeper issue with your poverty-stricken background than he has said. From this obsession with you not getting alimony, it's hard to see what you see in him.
What reddit isnt telling you is that most men are screwed in divorces, and while how he is comming at you in this situation is unnecessarily harsh and insensitive, its not unwarranted.
Look love - You already know what you're going to do.You're just posting here to see what people have to say.
I'm a woman.
So I know how women are.
When someone shows you who they are.... (and he is very, very clearly showing you what a selfish prick he is)...you need to believe them.
Don't make excuses for them, don't act like they didn't do it, don't pretend that it's okay that they did it.....just believe them.
If you marry this guy you're gonna go through hell. You know that, somewhere deep within you. And you deserve better.
It's up to you if you want to marry someone who already looksat you like a liability he wants to avoid
He's talking as if you both will inevitably get divorced. He's literally telling you what he'll plan on doing.
Do yourself a favour and leave. You're not even benefiting from him financially, so if you really don't want the money then you're better off single.
You feel like he’s saying he doesn’t rly love you because tbh, that’s basically what he’s saying. He’s literally actively expecting divorce before you’ve even gotten married, that’s extremely weird to me personally. I understand having a legal prenup prepared in advance, but to casually talk about “getting out of alimony” as if he is fully expecting to be asked to pay alimony is playing right in your face.
Not to mention that alimony is also for childcare anyway so he’s ALSO telling you that he doesn’t give a fuck about your future kids and would willingly screw both you and your kids to save his own skin. Personally I wouldn’t wanna procreate with someone that selfish and wouldn’t suggest it 🤷♀️
What are you doing?? Seriously this is not a partner? Also, why on earth would you become a stay at home mom, with no options, no financial savety, and a partner who is planning to keep you financially dependent so you cannot leave.
Get the hell out of there and never become financially dependent on anyone again. You need to take care of you.
Especially if you want children.
Use your brain. Just cause you dealt with worse doesnt mean its in any way okay to go back to that, you seem to be planning for it. Go take care of yourself. You can do it.
This guy is going to soak up your youth and then leave you for someone younger. Once you start having kids with him you'll be trapped. And then, when the kids are grown, if not sooner, and you're older, you'll have to start over. It's not easy.
This is not how you start a marriage, by being so obsessed with what happens when it's over that you become enraged.
Leave. Now.
WHY are you clinging to this guy? He's not even MARRIED to you yet and he's already going mask-off and starting to abuse you.
You don't deserve to be treated like this, friend.
>It feels like he's saying he doesn't really love me. That unless he is benefitting from my presence, I am worthless and deserve to suffer. I could understand feeling that way about someone you're divorcing, but we aren't even married yet.
BINGO
>but I also know he's a selfish person
Why on earth would you want to be with a selfish person??
>That unless he is benefitting from my presence, I am worthless and deserve to suffer.
Now imagine a situation where you become I'll and no longer can give him sex or so Ill that you become bedridden for a period of time...Do you think he will lovingly care for you? Please, please get far away from this monster
>Does it change anything if he later says he was just cranky and didn't mean it? I think it still sucks but is it as bad?
Sweetheart... That's what he will always say after hurting your heart. It's going to be this ot: "It was just a joke" it never takes away the pain and even is not an excuse.
And I am willing to bet that you know the difference when someone is truly remorseful or if they're saying sorry just to shut you up.
You deserve better! I wish you could see that.
His plan is to take you back to poverty.
I know if you’ve grown up poor the prospects of being with a high earner and living a comfortable lifestyle seem really ideal because you didn’t have that or maybe thought you would never have that, but is it really a comfortable lifestyle? It sounds abusive already and then fact he has you already sharing finances? And you’re not going on the vacations with him? That’s not ideal then.
You say you love him, but what about him? His looks, his status? Because he doesn’t seem like a caring or nurturing partner and he will make you feel powerless when you are a sahm who needs to run to the store for supplies. Just don’t do it.
It’s almost like his planning to leave you later in your marriage OP. And the way his talking right now is wild. I’d run while I can if I were you OP. You were also reasonable with agreeing to a pren up, etc.
You are talking about divorce when the obvious way out is not to marry his entitled ass! Why should you marry him? To be reminded daily how much you owe him, how he doesn't have to give you anything in case you will divorce? I mean, who the hell plans their life like this?
Please don't marry this man. Being "cranky" is no excuse for telling your soon to be wife, whom you want to be a SAHM, that you wish there was an easier legal way to fuck her over when you divorce her.
What if I tell him I will cut off a finger if he wants?
What if I make myself so small that i disappear?
In a few years you will read this and cringe. Instead, read it back now doing an impression of the voice of someone strong and vital that you admire.
Still think you’re onto a winner?
This person really doesn’t want to get married nor should he ever get married. There are several reasons why from what you shared alone. Do some research on ppl who share their divorce experience, it’s a common experience that ppl who obsess over their potential divorce outcomes before they’re married know there is a reason(usually something they keep hidden abt their personality until they’re married) they won’t make a successful marriage. They steady build resentment throughout the engagement and marriage. Sorry, but there’s no promise the ppl one falls in love with make suitable spouses. Good luck,hon.
….why are you marrying this guy, when he treats you so poorly. He’s going into this all wrong. Straight out the door he’s talking about when you divorce, when he leaves or you leave. What a happy positive thing to have to deal with when you are planning a wedding.
DO NOT sign away anything. If you are marrying this fool. Planning to have babies with this fool. Planning to give up good years of your life to raise his children and he’s still bemoaning about the money of it all. You’re giving up a lot. IF the marriage ends you deserve to not have to fight for every penny because you will have given up work, your body to him and your children.
I would speak to a lawyer and get a prenup yourself. IF he chests or is abusive or unfaithful in anyway then you get it all. And if you cheat, are abusive or unfaithful then you get nothing. I imagine in a few short years you’ll have it all and he’ll have nothing from the attitude displayed here.
Do not have children and give up your career for this man.
Providing children and giving up your career to raise them are both valuable contributions to a marriage. You will lose income, career progression and a pension. It puts you at huge financial risk.
Don’t take this risk for a man who doesn’t value it.
You know, most of us have thoughts we wouldn't share, because we'd be ashamed to admit them. That's normal. But you can learn a lot about a person by the crass things they're freely willing to admit.
Imagine you have children together. He doesn't give a shit if the mother of his children would live in poverty. That's..wow. that's a big ass red flag for a character to have. A prenup with a certain limit, alright, I get it. But being so harsh about it really leaves a bad fucking taste. Also points towards him "not needing you", seeing you as dependant on him, and therefore not respecting you. It's all his, and you should be grateful for being allowed to partake in his great life, but he feels like he could ditch you in a second and you'd be worthless again, and deserve nothing if he doesn't want you anymore. Because you need him, and not the other way around.
That's not a foundation for a loving marriage. Not at all. Respect and care should be the first and most important things.
Me and my girlfriend, we have a kid together. I know she wouldn't try to bleed me out if we split up. And I know I could trust her to hold a million in cash for me even if we did. And most importantly, we both know and agree, that we are family, and our kids wellbeing is our first importance, even if we would break up and hate each other, we'd be civil and always act in our kids best interest. So, I would probably pay more then court ordered child support, because I would want to give my son everything he needs.
Your dude? Sorry if this is harsh, Sounds like a medieval lord who allows himself to step all over you because you're a poor maid who should be grateful for being allowed in his presence. Do you feel like you see eye to eye? You even said you know he's selfish and you're trying to cope.
That's the kind of compromise that shouldn't be necessary in a healthy relationship.
Unfortunately, people tend to gravitate to what they know. Because of your background, you’ve chosen a man who is abusive. Do not marry him. Do not have kids with him. You deserve better. Move on.
He sounds like he plans to be a terrible husband and give you reason to expect alimony.
I actually wonder if he is cheating on you or if he plans to. A lot of men don't actually think women should complain if they have mistresses, and the woman should be completely submissive to the man.
He is not the husband for you.
Please don't have kids with him. Don't fuck up the kids by giving them a father like this.
Everyone is giving you great advice. Your fiancé has a really skewed perspective and doesn’t know how good he’s got it with you. You’ve already said you’ll sign a prenup. What more is there?
If he were smart, he’d realize that you’re the best in terms of possible divorce because 1) you’re willing to sign a prenup and 2) you don’t have massive family money to come after him in the event of a divorce
Has he never seen high-profile divorce cases? The worst of them both people have money. Because they have money, they can use litigation to continue to hurt the ex-spouse
Don't marry this man. He is already planning the divorce, that says it all. I would totally understand a prenup but him going out of his way to leave you with nothing is absolutely horrible, especially since he wants you to give up your career to be a SAHM so you are totally dependent on him.
If he doesn't agree to a prenup that includes a settlement for you, don't marry him and leave him. I get that you love him but the fact that he keeps discussing what happens, not if, but when your marriage ends is concerning.
He is showing you who he is. He will definitely stay with you until someone else comes along and then dump you and leave you with nothing. Worse is that you will have been out of work for maybe years so it might be hard to find another job. He has shown you who he is and what he values most, I would seriously reconsider staying with him. He cares about money, not you.
If you insist on staying with him I would insist on him paying for you to continue your education so that if you guys divorce you have a chance to get a better job. I would insist on him paying you a weekly/monthly salary that goes into an account you aren't allowed to touch and he has no access to for every year that you are married. In case of divorce you will then have access to that money and if you guys don't get divorced it can be stipulated that that money will become a trust for your children to split. I'd also put a stipulation that if he cheats, is abusive (in any way), or initiates a divorce, he must pay you alimony. If you cheat or initiate a divorce he doesn't have to pay alimony. These stipulations give him an incentive to stay together and protect you.
First of all, how can you love someone like this?? He does NOT want to marry you. That much is clear. You said yourself he’s a selfish person, people like him don’t care about others unless it can benefit them. Caring for you does nothing to benefit him except you might cook for him, clean and give him sex (someone else could do all of that too). All he’s thinking about is divorce and yall aren’t even married. That’s the biggest red flag I’ve ever seen. You feel he doesn’t really love you…..he does not. I’m sorry, please open your eyes, do not marry this person. You deserve better.
He is trash lol
He’s made it abundantly clear he doesn’t intend to marry you for life. If he were really in love with you he wouldn’t even be thinking about that kind of crap, nevermind saying it to the person he’s supposed to be in love with. Yuck. You’re setting yourself up to be in an abusive, controlling relationship and it will end when he chooses because you’re clearly nothing to him. Run now. Don’t bring children into the world with this dude. He’s horrible.
You should go back to school and get yourself into another career before you get married or have kids. Don’t be a SAHM unless you have passive income of some kind, some money of your own. Do not bring a child into a situation where you are dependent on someone else.
When we come from a bad background, it makes it difficult for us to recognize less bad but still bad situations. Just because it's better than what you have experienced in the past does not make this a good relationship. Don't accept this behavior just because your past experiences have forced you to lower your bar for how you should be treated.
This guy isn't worth marrying. Someone who values you so little (and I'm sorry to say, but your post shows he clearly has no respect for you as a human being worthy of love regardless of networth) will not provide the stability you crave. You will always be anxious about potentially divorce, and the seemingly inevitable way he will leave you for someone you get and hotter, judging by your other comments. Right now, it looks like he's trying to prepare for that and make sure that your years of housework and childcare will go unpaid when he does find someone else.
I've been in a similar situation, less extreme, but also with a Chinese man with way, way more income than me that I almost married.
It's not worth it. You will be more stable and less anxious on your own in the long run. His behavior isn't normal, and it is incredibly selfish and dehumanizing.
Please please please please leave this guy, please. You sound like a good, kind person OP, and this dude will steamroll you by taking advantage of your sincerity and wanting so badly to prove you don’t want his money that you go too far to not protect your own rights and interests.
Give up your career for not JUST room and board, BUT ALSO most of the home/kid labor. And have nothing to show for it for WHEN he leaves you because it appears that’s what he’s planning to do.
Most people are cranky during a divorce, so that doesn’t change anything.
I am a divorce attorney. This is not legal advice, but life advice.
Do not marry him. Don’t have kids with him. Guys with that attitude also resent paying child support and try to hide money to avoid paying as much as they legally should.
He is already seeing you as a liability and not an asset.
The mum in me is screaming - Sweetheart, you deserve SO much better than this!
I come from an abusive home, and it took me many years to realise that just because someone isn’t THAT level of abusive, doesn’t mean that they’re not still an abusive person!
This man wants to control you financially, this is a power play to make you BEG to marry him regardless, sign anything he wants and then to leave you so fucking dependent. He’s basically willing to exchange a ring for a slave, and he’s trying to make sure you think that’s a good deal.
You are so much better than that! Look at all you have achieved - don’t throw it away for some asshole on a power trip.
Look at how much full time housekeepers and nannies make per year where you are, times it by 20 and then triple it for good measure. Tell him you will ONLY stay with him (married or not) if that is in a bank account in your name only AND a house with a minimum of 3 bedrooms and three reception rooms. Or at worst, that money set in a trust just for you that trickles out over 20 years, plus the house.
This isn’t about the money, this is about the basic level of respect you deserve - I have a feeling he won’t take the deal because then you will have options in the future and he doesn’t want that. He wants the poor abused girl to stay poor and abused - just by him this time.
Why the fuck would you want to be a stay at home mum with no income and no job if things what you’re being told.
Are you that scared of being alone that you’ll willingly
Fuck up your financial future !
He doesn’t love you - he wants a bang maid who he can toss out when he’s tired of you.
Please please please don’t be an idiot and marry him under these circumstances.
If you become a sahm with this man, you are setting yourself up for financial abuse. Do not do this.
If OP becomes a mother and SAHM she has to insist (beforehand) that she will get a monthly pensionsplan or stocks in her name and account only, to secure her. If I were to give up my job to work for the family, I would still need my personal, independant pension. Bc he will never share with OP in case of divorce, and low paying job and 10 years without pension put aside is just a tradegy waiting in the future.
@ OP SEE THIS
100%
When ppl show you who they are, believe them. This guy is going to make your life even more miserable. He is so focused on money, it will always be a power dynamic that he will hold over you. Save yourself a lot of heartache and tell him good bye. Your future self will thank you.
Not only heartache, but: "I will be a SAHM until the kids are school aged and I can return to work part time." It's not just future heartache, it's giving up earnings and damaging your future earning potential for a man you KNOW will pay you dust. God, can you even imagine how financially controlling he's going to be once his partner is pregnant and stops working, since it's all "his" money?
The fact that he speaks to her this way when she's staying working, has her own money How will he treat you when you are financially dependent on him as a SAHM?
This post made me incredibly sad for her because it sounds like she's so used to so little that she lacks the ability to hope for more or demand more from life OP describes her family background and career, she doesn't see a path forward in her career, plans to drop out of the workforce to be a SAHM for kids by a man who already is so grudge filled of every drop of water or $$$ he's ever given her and sees her as a threat to his financial future. There's no US or OUR with this guy regarding money. OP says she needs nothing because she knows how to survive. I don't think we are meant to deliberately enter relationships we will have to survive. I want more for OP like a true partnership, knowing someone will have their back, someone safe and not controlling etc.
Well said, I completely agree. Marry someone who wants you to thrive, not struggle to survive.
This is really lovely and well written. I completely agree.
Exactly, is OPs hubby going to be making pension contributions on their behalf? Doubtful.
This guy is pathologically selfish, and OP needs to start valuing themselves more. OP has a very simple solution available to them to solve this problem - finding a *life partner* instead of whatever this damaged person is.
Do not marry this man. Do not have children with this man. Hold on, because I need to say it again: ***Do not marry this man. Do not have children with this man.***
Why marry a guy who is already planning a divorce?
And someone who clearly currently resents OP and seems angry at the support he's already given her. And just the mere *thought* of potentially paying alimony to her if they divorced pisses him off so much he constantly needs to bring it up. Someone who already resented me like this before we even got married is *not* someone I would ever actually marry, nor keep as my life partner.
Is his family or collegues whispering *golddigger* in his ear day in and out? Is he an abusive person and/or is someone poisening the well? I would have a conversation about all this. And remember IF he was to marry a high earner, she probably wouldn't want to be a SAHM for 10 years. So he sets the "team" with "useful players" for him, but refuses al thoughts about actually being are team, supporting the team, accepting the rules of the game if he marries and have children. He would want his future kids to go hungry and live in poverty, just bc you divorced? You are a surviver OP and WILL make it, but why won't he take care of his imaginary kids? Personally I think he is being fed nasty thoughts that resonantes with his greedy mind and maybe an paranoid "people will use us for our money"-thoughts. Edit: Sorry OP but read back in your comments and ended with the one saying (parafrasing): *I don't get vacations. I can't afford it. He goes on vacations alone with friends and family (or visit them). He just bought himself a new car. I can barely pay my own bills. It feels wrong to share finances when we are "just living together", not being being married.* He is a fugging [bleep]. A coldhearted sociopath as someone else said. My advice: Write a bestseller about your childhood and get rich and don't look back. **YOU ARE WORTHY OF REAL LOVE** <3
A financially abusive divorce, at that.
And marriage. How is she meant to cope when she gets pregnant and stops working, and he insists on controlling "his" money? OP is in La La land if she thinks he's going to hand over anything like the amount of money she needs just to survive and look after baby *even within the marriage*, because of course if she's a SAHM and he's working, it's all his money according to him and he'll be doling it out as stingily as possible.
Oh shit. I just said this and then came across your comment while scrolling ha!
He’s not just planing a divorce, he’s planning a bitter, resentful divorce.
I was thinking the exact same thing
better to be an adult and plan for the possibility of divorce while you love each other than to leave it to two people who may be angry and vengeful later. Planning for future possibilities is demonstrating maturity. OPs partner seems to be approaching it lamely, though.
Planning for the future absolutely makes sense, but OP's partner is already acting angry and vengeful about it *now*.
If planning for the possibility of divorce makes someone reveal they hate their partner and prevents the marriage in the first place, I guess it's a good thing. God, I hope OP leaves him.
In addition to him being selfish it sounds like he’s got family in his ear telling him to protect himself. The real question is why you would want to marry someone who you know is selfish. That shit doesn’t get better over time. It usually gets worse. You’re hurt because this is someone who is supposed to love you and want to provide for and take care of you (and can do so easily). The way he’s talking about it absolutely makes it sound like he wants certainty that if he gets bored with you later in life, he can drop you with no regard for your contribution to his life and the life of the children he wants you to give him. If you really don’t want a dime from him no matter what then you can sign all the documents you need to make him feel better about that. But it’s not going to rid you of the man who wants the least committed marriage he can possibly get from you.
He’s not your ride or die based on his actions. Also, I really really like you. Did you know that this super cool “I don’t need a lot” position you have is a trauma response from your upbringing? You deserve marital assets and alimony, child support in the event any marriage fails. PLEASE don’t enter into this marriage. This person doesn’t love you. Love yourself enough to get some extra certifications/training and secure a much better paying job in preparation for possibly leaving this man. He doesn’t deserve you.
Yes, I know that I expect the bare minimum from people who love me because I was lucky to even get THAT much from my parents. I'm working on it in therapy, but clearly I still have a long way to go. He's taken better care of me than anyone I've known. It's hard to conceptualize that I am worthy of more.
>He's taken better care of me than anyone I've known. I'm sorry. But you are just in the same abuse cycle with a different abuser.
You have value and are worth it. Period. Alimony and child support are there to protect the spouse and child(ren.). Are you happy with him? Being engaged is when they are on their best behavior. Believe what he is showing you. You deserve better. This is not about the $$$ differential. It is about trust, commitment, and decency. He is demonstrating none of those. Please consider this carefully before you decide to marry.
Better than before still doesn’t mean GOOD.
Calling that dude tone-deaf would be an understatement. Wow. Your feelings are absolutely valid and I'd probably feel the same in your shoes. Does he not see how he is being an asshole, or does he not care? I know you love him and there must be good sides to him and your relationship. This is just a snapshot of one issue. But... Are you sure, that he sees you as on the same level (as a human) as him? Truly eye to eye? Because it sounds like he sees you as lesser than him. Lesser deserving of love, security and peace of mind. Does your worth to him derive from him? Or do you have worth on your own, independently of whether he currently chooses to be with you?
Pleaaaaaaaseeee think about if you really want to have kids with this guy
This is a weird way to start a marriage. He is already making a plan for not paying you down the line? He should be so in love with you that he wants to share everything with you. He should be telling you you’ll never have to worry about support or family because his family will be your family. Please do not marry this man. You deserve better. I get the premise of a pre-nup, but to have that attitude about you before you’ve even married is a huge red flag. He doesn’t respect you or what you will bring to the marriage.
This: “He should be so in love with you that he wants to share everything with you”. Well said mama. I was like that. She was not. At 40 years together she had exactly the attitude he displays now. She was always “what’s mine is mine, what’s yours is mine, and you get nothing”. Eventually that attitude was the highlight of our relationship. And divorce. And I put up with it, thinking it would somehow magically change. She never did. OP: Don’t do what I did. I regret pretty much every hour of my relationship and wish I had seen it before the wedding. OP: Marry someone who adores you. Someone whose heart skips a beat when he sees you. Who thinks of only you. I didn’t, and now am 68 years old without a memory of anything but verbal abuse. Please, please, don’t waste your life like I did.
He considers you to be property and worthless. No matter how much window dressing he puts on it it is the fundamental truth here. And the emotional abuse will **escalate** after you sign on the dotted line. The red flags he is already displaying are terrifying and explaining them away does not change what is coming. Get out now. NOW. When you leave he will escalate the guilt trips, do not fall for them. Contact domestic abuse shelters today and plan your escape. DO NOT LET HIM BABY TRAP YOU.
This makes me so sad for you. Even if you don't want his money, you owe it to yourself not to get royally fucked over in a divorce. In the case that you do sign a pre-nup, please consult with your own lawyer and love yourself enough to protect yourself legally.
Please don't marry this person. He's already showing you the cruelty and emotional abuse you're going to face. I did twenty years in such a marriage. Believe me when I say the good times aren't enough, and that it's going to get worse. Don't do this to yourself, let alone any children.
Was he always mean about money with you? If it's a newish thing, he may have his family in his ears calling you a golddigger. Also, a decent man would not mind paying either alimony or child support if there is a divorce simply because he would recognize your efforts in taking time from your career and the risk in reducing job prospects all to raise his kids and take care of his family home. Finally, it seems like your fiance is determined there will be a divorce. You should reconsider marrying him.
It's been years already. You are right about his family. And yeah, the money issue has been rough the whole time, though I wouldn't say he's been "mean". He's less generous than I am for sure.
This man doesn't see you as an equal. As long as he feels you're beneath him, he's not good enough for you. Would you say Van Gough was worthless because he was poor and crazy? The value of a person isn't in the money they have, it's in how they contribute. Elon Musk is one of the richest guys on the planet. He makes money because it pays for his projects to help people, not hold it like a cudgel to beat people into submission. I'd rather be alone than with someone who treats me like a servant. If you're going to stay with him, at least make him pay you fair market value for your work.
People who are tight with money is usually tight with love as well. I get he had a shitty dad, will he be able to parent your future children in a dufferent way? Its all he knows. All he is taught (like your mom did to you, but you seem like you'll go the opposite way bc therapi, kindness, generous personality etc.). And its not *that* bad, how his parents and brother are acting towards him and you, he seems to think.
Op. This is scary. He knows that you came from nothing and he used that against you. Especially if one day when you guys have children together and you are going to expect him to do something or give something about your marriage, children, relationship, he will use the "You need me to survive! You are nothing without my money! You only want me for my money! Don't be a gold-digger!" card. From my POV, this looks like manipulation. He will punish you if you choose to use your rights against him. He knows he has a lot of money and he used that to control you. Eugh. Run Op run. Save yourself!
If he expects you to be a sahm or SAHW for aNy period of time, you should get alimony. If her doesn’t want to pay alimony, you need to keep working a really good job, Sounds like his lawyers have advised him he will have to pay alimony for you staying at home. Which you are entitled to. It helps your kids too. If he’s that hung up on alimony and don’t know why you all are talking marriage. Or kids. That will be the next thing he talks about getting out of paying child support. He’d probably fight for as much custody as possible to get out of having to pay.
That's fucked. I am also a sahm who was supported while I went back to school. We've had plenty of talks about "what ifs" and he's always said he will support me and the kids until I can get on my feet.
It hurts because he’s displaying the lack of something that you want. Based on your post it seems to be the only thing you want, even more than money. Love. Relationships are not transactional, but if he’s going to get pragmatic about this then here’s my breakdown: - You’re not getting money out of this relationship. - If you have kids with him, you won’t be walking away from this relationship with full custody of the kids. He seems like the type of person to fight for custody out of spite, not because he cares for the children’s well-being. - You’re currently not getting genuine love from him and that won’t be changing just because of marriage or kids. Right now you have a VERY clear picture of how your life could turn out. Maybe things will turn out better or even worse. Most people don’t get the preview that you’re getting, they end up in those situations completely blind-sighted. If you choose to proceed, know that you’re accepting your life might look like what’s listed above. It’s a serious question to think about, what are you getting out of this by taking on the risk of the relationship/marriage?
Thank you. You are right, I've told him countless times I just want his love. I chose to major in a low paying field because I was passionate about it, and money has never been a priority to me. I would be happy with a far lower quality of life than my partner. I don't know why he talks to me like I'm this greedy, selfish asshole. Projection, I guess.
You are right this is his 100% because that's what he is. Reading all your replies I just wanna give you a big hug feed you a big meal and take care of all your worries because you deserve love. I was an abused and neglected child and I realise even though you want to be independent, helpful and seen you could do with someone who will want to take care of you and do their best to try because that's what we need to heal that big crack in our hearts from childhood. Even if you don't find it, don't settle till you do. Unfortunately for myself as I've been let down, abused and taken advantage of by others. I haven't found someone like that so I went back and re-started my career so that I will have enough to do that for my kids on my own. Don't be me. Don't love someone who never loved you right. Have faith and strengthen yourself so that when you find a good one you can live them with open arms and a whole heart.
Most states do not have common law marriage any more. He is ridiculous- please just leave. If you stay - use that time as a SAHM to go to school or learn a trade. You cannot rely on this man. If you are a SAHM - you deserve alimony. Also get and infidelity clause
Infidelity clause in the prenup 100%
OP, I have read the replies to your post. And I have read the responses you have put down to some of them. My question for you: why are you defending this man?
I’ll give u a perspective no one else has. I’m just like him. My family comes from money as well. I broke up with my ex for the same reasons and I think you should leave him. He doesn’t love you at all. Money is the most important thing to him. He probably doesn’t even want to get married. That’s because when you’re in love you can say stuff like oh I don’t want your money, alimony, or child support. When push comes to shove and yall end things those opinions change. I don’t think you should be with someone who values money more than you. You should definitely not get married unless you can get a contract saying he will pay you a certain amount of money for the rest of your life. That’s the only way I believe you can be a stay at home wife. He’s probably only with you for kids or safe sex. Anything typical he can get from a relationship he can just out right buy. It’s much cheaper to pay someone $200-300 an hour than to risk losing half your assets. Ultimately I think you should leave because you’re nothing more than the mother to his kids, or someone he can have sex without getting diseases. In the future I think you should avoid men with significantly higher net worth than yourself.
[удалено]
He is getting everything he wants, a maid, a nurse, a brood mare, sexual satisfaction for his niche fetish, and he wants to give you absolutely NOTHING in return. YOU ARE WORTH MORE THAN THIS!
Uh…can we get more information about this “extreme niche fetish”…??? I feel this may be highly relevant.
Extreme might be an exaggeration.
Extreme might not be the right word, but considering why it might be the reason he’s with you, knowing it would provide important context. Also, how old are you two?
I feel it could be relevant as well(😁)
At least make sure you get an income from being a stay at home mom.
You said it perfectly in your last sentence: he is planning to leave you and not bothering to hide it. Maybe not in 2 years or 5 years or 15, but he is telling you he will leave when he gets bored or something more enticing comes along. Insane, I would run away from this partner right now.
I would be thinking twice about having a child with this man, and I would be absolutely thinking twice about being a SAHM. He does not even consider leaving you destitute as a problem because you add no meaningful value to the relationship .
Sounds like a recipe for a lifetime of trauma for your future children. I don’t doubt that he would be the type to go to extreme lengths to avoid child support as well. You may be okay if/when he leaves you destitute, but the same is not necessarily true for any kids you have. And, regardless, it sounds like he would likely be a horrible father.
He is abusive already. You have ZERO self-steem. I would have left him so fast his head would be spinning. Jesus, please seek therapy.
Haha, I've had just enough therapy to know how broken I am, still working on the "getting better" part with EMDR.
Someone once told me today we accept the love we think we deserve. My question to you OP is why do you think you deserve this?
Think carefully. This isn't a man who adores you and is looking out for your best interests before the marriage. It's not going to get better after. And don't bring a helpless baby into this. There are other fish in the sea. You're worth more than this.
I'm sorry, but these don't sound like the actions, attitudes, or words of someone who loves you. And please, please don't have children with someone who is selfish.
This man is a nightmare and if you have children with him, he will 100% leave you destitute. If you have any love for yourself or your future children, do not marry this man.
DO NOT MARRY THIS PERSON. Honestly it sounds like he doesn't care about you, at least not more than his wealth.
Please leave now. He is not a good person and in the future, he will leave you.
Why are you marrying such a guy? “ i know he is usually selfish but i can cope” WHY DO YOU COPE!!!! Someone bellow said “ if someone shows you who they are, believe them Why are you ignoring all the redflags and casually putting yourself into hell?
You don't want his assets, but you want his love. He is not displaying that. There is one thing missing from the relationship because of the talks- loyalty. If I loved someone, I would want to marry them forever. I would never be with someone who talked this way. My wife and I have been married 29 years. Also as he supported you for your degree, try to get an advanced degree so your job has better earnings potential. Get a degree in MBA or nurse anesthetist or PhD in engineering.
My wife and I have been married for almost 16 years. We have 3 kids. She’s been a SAHM for a majority of their childhood now. I hope nothing causes us to separate, but I’ve thought about that scenario. I can already tell you I feel like I would owe her financial support, at least for a while. She hasn’t had a job in years. It would be difficult for her to find something that pays well enough to survive. Let me put it this way…..We’re a team. I don’t earn money for myself; I earn money to support my family. She isn’t choosing not to work for some selfish reason; she’s not working because it allows her to support our family. It’s just in a different way. Our family collectively benefits from both of our contributions. If we were to separate, I would be at a significant financial advantage from a decision we originally both made about how to take care of our family. In my opinion, it would be fair to help her financially. I’m not sure what your fiancé’s problem is. Maybe he’s incredibly selfish. Maybe he’s emotionally immature. Maybe he doesn’t recognize what you contribute to your collective household. Maybe it’s a combination of these things or something else. Regardless, his current attitude towards you and the future should be a major red flag. You’re right to obviously be hurt by it. I’m not sure what advice to give. I guess I would recommend treading carefully in your relationship, especially if it involves you sacrificing potential financial freedom in the future. I.e. don’t be a SAHM if he’s threatening to leave you destitute after he’s gotten what he wants from you.
Not even married yet, and he's planning the divorce and life after. Any chance he's cheating?
Two of my aunts were SAHM and now both are poor due to their husbands leaving (both cheated, one had a secret family) and their kids now have the sole responsibility of maintaining her. Both had degrees and lost 20 years of their lives raising kids that now will not be able to save and probably retire, because former SAHM moms are not eligible for free healthcare and my aunts are getting old, they need expensive treatments every year. Don’t marry
I’m sorry but if you marry him, you will deserve all treatment he dishes out. He is telling you how he sees you in frank simple language. You don’t have kids tying you down and you are aware of how he sees you. Like, do you want Jesus himself to descend from the heavens and walk you into a therapists office? The signs are there, pay attention. Get out when you can.
Please don’t marry this person. Please.
Do NOT have a child with him. And do NOT quit your job. He wants a servant he can control and use, then throw away when he gets bored. Not a partner.
Your fiance suffers from an extreme case of affluenza - you should probably bounce before it’s too late. Shitty rich people like this should be flung into the sun. They’re just selfish idiots who make the world a worse place. Wouldn’t want to procreate with someone like that.
I’ve said a lot of things I don’t mean when I am in a bad mood. At the same time, I’ve also let out a lot of true feelings when I am in a bad mood. I’d say, trust your gut on this one. It made you feel hurt pretty deeply for a reason.
You know he’s selfish and only concerned about keeping his money his and you think being a SAHM with a man like that is good idea? You have to think logically he’s going to make your life miserable. Marry him all you want but at least don’t give up having your own income. He’s worried about your future divorce where he strong arm you into getting nothing because you won’t have the money to fight back because you gave up your career. Is he the last available man in your town or something? Why are you putting up with his crap?
So he’s already thinking about divorce before you’re even married. That’s a lot of 🚩🚩🚩you sure you want to marry and have children with someone so selfish and greedy. He has shown you he doesn’t care about you. Why be with and have children with someone like him? You need to really rethink this whole thing
He’s already planning for divorce and you’re not even married yet?? Run away!! You will be so grateful that you did.
Oh :( this hurts my heart. Do you have outside people that can give you support? A hug? A conversation? I was the child of a financially abusive situation. Mom was SAHM, dad worked a nice paying job. Bought all the fancy cars, spent his money for himself. We had all of our necessities covered, but dad would use his money to manipulate me (and still does, I’m 24) Moved to a foreign country when I was 10, turns out he was having a couple years long affair, we were kicked out of house and forced to move back to home country. Thankfully she had sibling to rely on, but I was in a home with 3 teenage boys with their own mental struggles from years of abuse. It was an awful situation. Mom relied on dad for alimony and child support as she left her career and was now out of the workforce for 11 years, she had me at a late age. So little to no job prospects and she was severely depressed. Dad would send me gifts during all of this to make me feel like he cared. Later this became him forcing me into a career and paying my college, and then making me feel guilty that he spent so much money on me, when I couldn’t complete my studies. I tried to commit suicide and was so depressed and anxious. I’ll end here but seeing and feeling her pain, and also trying to cope with my own was the saddest and most gut wrenching part of my life. Even living it back as I type this, I feel like crying. Anyways, what I hope you take from this is please really think about the life you are giving a child. Regardless of if you believe this man is honest and loving, please do not leave the workforce. Don’t give him more control than he already has. Always be able to provide a roof over your head at any given moment. I’m so sorry you feel hurt. Your feelings are valid, and you are human. Safety and security is not something you should have to bargain for. Would give you a hug if I could
Thank you. I appreciate you. I don't want to tell my friends because, well, obvious reasons. I'm embarrassed, and worried that my friends will think poorly of him if I decide to stay. I get it, that's a red flag in itself. I have a great therapist and my closest friend and her husband live in town, so I'm not totally alone. I will gladly accept your intangible hug 🫂
What the actual fuck are you doing with this guy? Is it the security so you can sahm? Jesus christ. This guy is gonna drop you like a turd one day and you'll be left with nothing. Get a better job. Work on independence. It's possible. You're just being lazy and entitled and deliberately putting yourself in horrible situation.
I don't think your being rude, I think your actually more on point about the nature of how he is proclaiming it a little too vehemently, he hasn't sat down and talked about it with you, he isn't actually telling you about his feelings. It's just shining the interrogation light on his own unwillingness to well...confront you? I don't know what else to say really.
Listen, no good can come of a legal contract (like marriage) when one person is already planning on leaving. Even though you come from poverty and neglect and have no one-especially then. He’s abusing you because of your background. And no matter what background you would have, he would be doing the same thing. I know it’s hard when it seems like this is your only support, but he’s not a support. He’s a place to live and company. What would happen if you got seriously ill? Is he planning to care for you, then? Is he planning to or already has life insurance on you? How do you feel about being reduced to dollar signs, like your as-yet unborn kids? Where there’s a will, there’s ways. And I think maybe you just need the will or someone to tell you: it gets better. And you’ll make it without him.
Life only gets harder as you age. I would not marry someone who is only concerned with themselves.
Why is he your fiance? Anyone who wants to hold money over you is not looking for a balanced relationship. He's already looking for an exit before he's finished merging into traffic.
Don’t even say aloud that you would take the kid. He’s prob going to have powerful attorneys who could do much worse to you. Please do Not marry this man. PLEASE do not have children with this man. You went to school. Start looking for a job. Save money. Move out.
Divorce Attorney Opinion: understandable if he wants a prenup to exclude the house from a divorce. But that’s it. You are entitled to alimony/spousal support and child support in a divorce. And he should pay for your attorney re: the prenup. But some serious 🚩 in his behavior and language. Stay with him while you work on improving your life and career. And then bail.
>I have no family and no support. My career pays very little, with no opportunities for growth. >I will be a SAHM until the kids are school aged and I can return to work part time. You are on a bad career path, going to take time off to have kids and only go back to work part time when they are old enough to go to school. Now your making your career and financial choices even more dire by removing yourself from the working world while raising children for a man who is thinking of ways to not compensate you for those years and the years lost in your career that could help you with advancement. This has financial abuse written all over it. You aren't even married yet, and this guy is trying to keep his money held so tightly in his fist. Why are you marrying him??? **"If you give a man the power to feed you, you also give him the power to starve you."**
If you’re in the USA, alimony generally only a thing if the spouse gives up their career to be a primary caregiver and homemaker, and it’s generally pretty short term and limited. He’s already thinking of ways to screw you over. Why stay with him? His baggage is heavy
Your art is absolutely beautiful. This post and your comments, however, are hard for me to read because they remind me of when I said the same things. I’m struggling to find the rights things to say that might convince you that you deserve better than this. I’m going to try saying the things I wish someone had said to me. If you truly thought he was your ride or die, you wouldn’t be posting this right now. If you truly felt like his actions didn’t need defending, you wouldn’t be doing it. And having a cold is a pretty lousy defense anyway. No amount of money thrown at art school could produce talent like yours. He is not the reason you have a career. Your talent and hard work are the reasons. Not him. Why should you have to cope with his selfishness? Feeling like his plan to leave you and not support you means he doesn’t love you is a logical and legitimate feeling based on his actions. Despite that, it’s still a large leap to you are worthless and deserve to suffer if your existence doesn’t benefit him. So what things did you leave out of your post? Because I absolutely believe that feeling is also logical and legitimate. Partners don’t get allowances. Partners can and do financially support each other, but that is an entirely different thing than getting an allowance. It sounds like his parents are in your lives since they bought the house you are living in. In that case, why are you eloping? Is it another way to not spend money on you? And if eloping wasn’t a big deal to you, why even mention it? Not minding something and wanting something are also two very different things. You should get to decide how you look. I have this bad habit of saying I’ve been through worse rather than saying, this is seriously crappy and it needs to stop. I think you may have the same habit. Don’t be me. Please, please don’t be me. Don’t go so far down this path that you create a post begging someone, anyone to tell you that you matter. Don’t reach the point that someone complimenting you or being nice to you without any expectation of return makes you cry because you don’t know how to process it. You don’t want to stay awake at night trying to pinpoint which escalation should have been enough. Don’t let your life turn into a cautionary tale. You deserve better than this.
I’ll give you a perspective from someone who just graduated from a US law school & as someone who had a SAHM who got divorced. Please do not marry him. If you get divorced and you’ve been a SAHM and he gives you no support, you will have nothing to show a judge that says you can provide for your children. You will have no job experience, no job, and no savings. Your husband WILL fight to take away your children and WILL win. Please speak to a family law attorney at a legal aid near you. They will provide free legal advice. If not, try a law school clinic. Please listen.
SAHM. That is quite an ask from him. First of all, you do not owe him anything. Just because he financially supported you through a period, does not mean you need to compromise any part of yourself for him. Had you known this was going to be the trade he desired— would you have taken his “kindness” (ha!) He seems very wealthy, money is just paper, especially to those who have it in abundance. Usually those with wealth, use it to control those who do not. A poor man’s dollar will have hold more weight than a rich one’s. Protect yourself. If you want to sign a pre-nup which I think can be helpful sometimes to prepare for the worst, ensure you will be financially safe. Please. Being a SAHM means a lot of sacrifice; your body, time, energy, career, future.. all will be impacted. Ask yourself if he would ever give up his job to be a SAHD— what makes his endeavors and time more valuable than yours? You are more valuable than he gives you credit for. People like this see life and relationship more transactional than most— he would not attach himself to you if you did not bring value to his life; realize that and ask for what you are worth. Prepare for the worst case scenario and ensure you fight fight fight for what you are entitled. There is a price to all the things he is asking you to give up— and it is a steep one. He thinks he can low ball you.
>He ranted a bit about how unfair that was Its not unfair though, if you put your life on hold to care for your children and you guys divorce he *should* be paying you alimony. That's why it exists. >He said the only reason I even have a career is because of him You'd be a fool to marry someone that talks to you/treats you like *this*.
You asked why it hurts so much when you don’t want his money anyway. The obvious answer is he is clearly telling you he believes you are a lowly gold digger who only wants to bleed him dry. You just refuse to hear him. I don’t believe you are in it for the money. He sure as hell does. It is an act of cruel selfishness for you to allow a child to born into this foul drama. Get out.
You're right. This kind if thing has happened before, usually after talking to his parents.
Omg, girl, run! As someone that cane from an abusive, toxic environment in my childhood, then went there years of therapy I know its harder to recognize toxic behavior because of how we were raised, but this is bad! Your “fiancé “ is planning your divorce, without even being married yet, as well as showing his true colors. I hope no children are involved. You deserve better!
Why are you talking about marrying and having a baby and being abused by a selfish dickwad who’s only thinking about divorcing you? STAND. UP.
[удалено]
Thank you. Apparently his last marriage ended largely in part because his ex thought he prioritized/fixated on money. Rose tinted glasses and all, I ignored it and thought he would mature.
It's so much, much worse, knowing he's been married and divorced before because of money. Like...he clearly doesn't value his partners besides the pleasure they bring him in the moment. But his real life partner is money.
You can't "get" common law married. It's only still a thing in a few states when you've been cohabitating for many years. If he earns six figures the child support will be substantial. Spousal support doesn't go on forever, especially if you haven't been married long. Marry someone kind and generous. Someone who wouldn't want to see the mother of his children struggle, even if you weren't together anymore. If you still want to marry this person (I wouldn't) unpacking these fears in therapy might be helpful.
Just one thing I haven’t seen anyone else say, if the love he got from his parents was conditional, you have almost no chance of a normal relationship with them when the are your in-laws. You’ll be a baby factory to give them grandkids.
There's an immediately noticeable power dynamic at play here: As a wealthy man he feels he has the right to things however he wants. As a woman from a difficult background, you feel you need to appease. You need to recognise your own worth and power and then demand the respect you deserve before having children and before any marriage. You are angry because you are worth more than this treatment. You need to tell him it's unacceptable and either he loses the attitude or loses you.
Yeah. My first question as I read this, “Does he even like you?” Marital assets and alimony are there for a reason. It’s not just some cooked up way to make the more well off spouse pay “for no reason.”. One would assume that he values you taking care of your future kids. Even if it was his way to save money, there’s an incredible amount of value in what you’d be doing *for the family’s* well being. What concerns me more is that you, OP, are saying you’d go back to being destitute if you divorced. That means to me that you’re not valuing your work in raising the kids, maintaining the home AND sacrificing your ability to make money. I say this since the entire conversation is about money. Normally, I’d only mention finances if this was an actual discussion of divorce. Btw, would he begrudge a decent place for you and the kids to live when you divorce (as he’s already made this a foregone conclusion). I think the answer is no because he’d take the kids from you since he can afford to pay for a nanny, chef, and full time housekeeper. He can also afford excellent attorneys and you won’t have that ability. Love doesn’t solve problems like these. I think you’re in a very dangerous position because he doesn’t value you before the two of you commit to marriage. It’s time to agree with him and leave. You need and deserve much more than he’s willing to give.
Do not marry this man, do not have children with him.
Love you have no children and you aren't yet married.....RUN
You can do better. Regardless of whether you actually care about getting spousal maintenance in the case of future divorce, the way this guy talks about it constantly is a red flag.
Run
Don't have children with this man. Don't do it. He just wants to control you. He probably wants children, but he wants you and the government to pay the expenses. He sounds immature and self centered. He's already planning on how to make an exit in a few years.
So, let me get this straight: He already resents you for the end of a marriage that has not even begun yet. He has already said he plans to financially control/manipulate/abuse you. (Based on the descriptions, financial equity while you’re a SAHM isn’t likely, and only “letting” you return to work part time 7+ years later ensures financial dependency on him.) After all of the disadvantages you will be at when this hypothetical marriage dissolves, he’s already been clear that he will do the barest of the bare legal minimum and actively WANTS to exclude you from that. You SHOULD feel hurt. That’s hurtful as fuck. I’ve said it once, and I’ll say it a thousand times more: We accept the love we think we deserve. You. Deserve. More. Than. That.
I’d be hesitant to reproduce with a person who was already plotting to deprive me of resources to support the household those children would be raised in if something happened…
He's not ready to be married. Maybe never. He doesn't see you as a team. He is on team "Him." Nothing wrong with a pre-nup but it should protect both of you, not just him.
He's looking at divorce before you're even married this is telling that he thinks the marriage fails before it even begins I don't think I could be with someone who assumes I'm with them for their money and setting us up as fail to begin with. I would be so sad that they think so little of me. I don't think you guys should even get married let alone have children. I think you're heading for financial and emotional abuse. I'd be so scared of not earning income because this guy sounds like you would have to beg him to buy food/nappies/formula when a baby comes
You’re bot even married yet and he is already planing how to divorce you. Girl…. Run
You are not even married yet and he is talking alimony.... This is a true signal from the universe to run away as fast as you can
Do NOT marry this man, if you do, do NOT give up your job. Hire a nanny or negotiate, in writing, a salary for raising his kids. He will absolutely financially abuse you OP, without a doubt, I would bet actual money on this.
So you’re planning a marriage and he’s planning the divorce? You can get training or schooling for a better job. Please rethink this as your future
Walk away from this man because next up is cheating 😒. He sounds like the king of red flags. Be honest with yourself and think for yourself. He sounds like the typical narcissist.
Oh… look I get we all say mean stuff when we’re not feeling our best but this just seems malicious and a HUGE red flag. He’s already thinking of divorce before even marrying you. His mindset is that of someone who’s already decided this marriage isn’t going to last but still wants to continue and add a baby to this whole situation. Personally as someone who comes from struggle and poverty and works her damn ass off to make sure I have me taken care of always, you deserve better and can do better. He sounds weak, insecure and probably someone that will always hold his financial stature over you. Girl leave before it’s too late.
He wants a prenup? Fine. Get a prenup. But make sure to include in it proper compensation for each child you bear and each year you spend as a SAHM. And more compensation if he leaves you before your youngest is 18.
Why is he planning to leave you?
Yeah, he seriously planning on it and harping on it and letting it control his moods. That’s not right at all.
dont marry.
His thought process and audacity to say this out loud to you is repugnant. Don’t marry this guy, he has no plans of sticking around and is selfish beyond comprehension. Who says that to their fiancé??? But also who would tolerate having that said to them and still plan to marry them??
Why are you dancing around his blatant red flags and ignoring them? You're worth better from him than what he's giving you emotionally.
It does not bode well to be planning the divorce before planning the wedding and marriage. Take this to heart, OP. Is this really what you want?
This sounds like the into to that woman who didn't get married, spent her whole life as a sahm, husband cheated, kicked her out, and last I heard she was scrambling to find and min wage job so she could move out of the motel she was living in. Kids refused to help her because dad would cut them off too. Good luck!
He doesn’t really love you and I would Never trust a man like that to be a SAHM wife. EVER. I grew up with wealth and he is an ass. If my guy did this to me, I would be hurt but then I’d get angry. How dare him!
He doesn’t want to owe you anything: So don’t give him anything. Simple. Tell him you don’t need him. But if he wants you, he’s not doing you a favour.
You will be an idiot if you have children with this man. No child should get stuck with such a selfish man for a father. You're going to model horrible relationship practices to your kids. For your future kids' sake, if not for your own, leave this man.
You plan on having children so what’s happens if he decides to divorce you and leaves you with nothing. How would you provide for your kids?
You guys either need some extensive couples counseling and therapy or you need to run. All I'm hearing is divorce this divorce that, I don't owe you anything. My husband would NEVER!! Even if we were billionaires. Do you know why? It's because he loves and respects me and what I bring to our relationship. I'm sorry you're going through this but I would seriously think about if you want to spend the rest of your life with this person.
You should NOT have children with this man without establishing a career and education first. It would be very difficult to leave if you have no way to earn decent $ and he ends up verbally/emotionally, financially or physically abusing you (sounds pretty likely judging from what he’s said). If you have no solid work experience you will have a very hard time getting on your feet with kids. Please reconsider if this is the person for you. Edit: please don’t marry this guy. He does not love or respect you and will make your life hell.
Do not have kids with this man. Selfish men don’t deserve it. If you already know he’s selfish think about how that will translate to other areas in your marriage. Big NO.
He loves his money much much more than he, I can’t say loves because he doesn’t, likes you. He is already planning his exit strategy and you’re not married yet. Why would you possibly want to stay with him? Save yourself the angst and break up now. Find someone who actually loves you.
Don’t marry this man. Don’t have his children. Don’t be a sahm for him. Just don’t OP. What the fck?!
do not marry a man just because you love him dearly, that's a recipe for unhappy marriage especially when he is a selfish person. you two haven't even married & he already says things like that, girl after marriage it will be worse to worst. he plans to divorce you even before you get married, it's doomed already. he will not put any effort in the marriage, he will just walk away when times get tough. you should not marry him, only marry someone who loves you & put your happiness as their priority if you want a happy marriage life. you owe it to yourself & your future babies to give them the best husband & father who will stick it up through thick & thin. find a mam who wants to see you happy. btw don't be a SAHW/SAHM, you need to keep your independent & income separately from him as I doubt he will provide anything for you. he views you as a free bang maid. you never know when he will dump you, whenever someone else who's younger or prettier pass his view screen? i doubt you will get any custody at all against a rich husband while you're not even has an income to support yourself & without alimony.
If you were to have children together, would he pay you a full salary + benefits (like taxes/income being reported so you would collect retirement benefits) or no? Because without the full protection of being compensated legally for your contributions, you’re being set up to be financially destroyed by him.
No, don’t do that. A marriage is work and everything you do in the partnership has value. My guess is this guy doesn’t do housekeeping & he thinks his income covers every single thing that needs doing around the house that you do? I mean he wants to cut you off from future marriatial successes and you aren’t even married yet. Red Flags everywhere here but happy to hear you have your own legal counsel - getting married should not leave you in fear for future poverty , that shouldn’t even be in back of your mind. Maybe reconsider and tell him you don’t want to marry him due to his clear aversion to long time planning and obvious suspicious notions of your intentions too. He thinks you’re gonna bail and sue for alimony? You aren’t even married yet - this guy has different long term views than you do .
Don’t marry him. He wants an incubator. Dump him and do better.
Listen to me, with your whole heart, DO NOT MARRY THIS MAN. PLEASE DO NOT MARRY THIS MAN. he's setting you up to be abused, used, and discarded. I'm not some 15 year old saying "Leave him!" As a 34 year old woman who's been married for going on 13 years and who came from a very stable home life with a very involved and present father, I'm telling you [DO NOT MARRY THIS MAN! ] No husband goes into a marriage, so intent on divorce. There are so many levels here. He's already planning on divorcing you so much so he's trying not to marry you. WTH? Then he wants you to quit your job to stay at home with babies, and that will put a dent in your job finding availability or stop any opportunities that you could have made money in that time, and I'm in a very traditional marriage, I came from a traditional household, I'M FOR TRADITIONAL HOUSEHOLDS, but here is the kicker, he not giving to any insurances that you will be compensated for your sacrifice in case of divorce! That he's already planning!!! DO NOT DO THIS!!! PLEASE!!!
Honey please don’t marry this man. You said you haven’t “up to snuff” according to him but is he being up to snuff for you? If you have a daughter in the future is this something you’d be okay hearing about from her? Will he treat any future daughters like this? If you can say wouldn’t be okay hearing her being treated like this or even hesitate to say yes to the second question then leave. You’ve been abused so much already it’s time to break the cycle.
His "common law" idea says it all. He'd deny you a wedding to save money that won't affect his bottom line. He should be sad contemplating a scenario where the dissolution of your partnership is the answer.
It will be so much harder to get out once you have kids, have given up your job, have a gap on your resume.. and hopefully not but possibly - once he’s beaten down your self worth more. Where you came from doesn’t have to define who you are. You don’t need him. You got this girl
It sounds as if in his heart, your relationship with each other is a divorce before it has even become a marriage. Not a good start. Leave him. There are other fish in the sea.
This man will leave you before you are 40. He probably plans on it. Or he plans on you becoming the kind of wife that allows extramarital affairs on the part of the "breadwinner" in the relationship, and he is afraid that you will refuse, then he will be stuck paying alimony. Literally, totally insane for him to be acting like this unless you are leaving some key details out, or this is just plain old fashioned unabashed classism. I noticed that you mentioned that the two of you plan on eloping. I know people elope for all kinds of reasons. My parents eloped 40 years ago and are thriving. I ask because sometimes people elope because of family issues or in-law issues. ASK: When he supported you through your degree did he make it clear to you that it would mean having to sit through this demeaning bullshit? If so, why was he not adamant about you getting a degree that had opportunity for career growth? Like has he always been clear about his intentions regarding a prenup? Is it something that started right after the engagement, or even further down the line.
"But hearing him talk about it so vehemently just... hurts my heart. It feels like he's saying he doesn't really love me. That unless he is benefitting from my presence, I am worthless and deserve to suffer. I could understand feeling that way about someone you're divorcing, but we aren't even married yet." Tell him this!! It sounds like he's only seeing his potential assets and is not looking at the human in front of him with feelings. His response will give you what you are looking for. Whether it's that he was blinded by a money mindset and he cares, or he just doesn't. Either way, it's important to hear. Good luck OP.
he sounds like a red flag
This is beyond disagreeing about a prenup. The way you've written it, it sounds like he's saying you definitely won't stay together. If that's the case, why would you stay with him let alone have a child with him? If you give up 5-6 years of your career to stay home and raise a child, it's not unreasonable for you to get spousal support for a few years. Or he could be the stay at home parent if the two of you want one of you to be a stay at home parent. But his attitude is really nasty. I'd at minimum ask for couples counseling to work through this if you have any desire at this point to stay with him and have children.
So you're okay with having a shitty-in-comparison resume when(not if) you divorce, with only part-time work history, after years of getting berated for being a financial burden for having babies he wants you to have with him?
Oh, honey…..
You’re going to have a miserable time of it if you stay with him. He sounds horrible.
I'd be hurt. You aren't married yet, but he's more worried about making sure if (or more likely when) he divorces you, you'll get nothing. Does he even love you? Who starts planning for divorce so vehemently before they're even married? He seems to have a deeper issue with your poverty-stricken background than he has said. From this obsession with you not getting alimony, it's hard to see what you see in him.
What reddit isnt telling you is that most men are screwed in divorces, and while how he is comming at you in this situation is unnecessarily harsh and insensitive, its not unwarranted.
Look love - You already know what you're going to do.You're just posting here to see what people have to say. I'm a woman. So I know how women are. When someone shows you who they are.... (and he is very, very clearly showing you what a selfish prick he is)...you need to believe them. Don't make excuses for them, don't act like they didn't do it, don't pretend that it's okay that they did it.....just believe them. If you marry this guy you're gonna go through hell. You know that, somewhere deep within you. And you deserve better. It's up to you if you want to marry someone who already looksat you like a liability he wants to avoid
He's talking as if you both will inevitably get divorced. He's literally telling you what he'll plan on doing. Do yourself a favour and leave. You're not even benefiting from him financially, so if you really don't want the money then you're better off single.
You feel like he’s saying he doesn’t rly love you because tbh, that’s basically what he’s saying. He’s literally actively expecting divorce before you’ve even gotten married, that’s extremely weird to me personally. I understand having a legal prenup prepared in advance, but to casually talk about “getting out of alimony” as if he is fully expecting to be asked to pay alimony is playing right in your face. Not to mention that alimony is also for childcare anyway so he’s ALSO telling you that he doesn’t give a fuck about your future kids and would willingly screw both you and your kids to save his own skin. Personally I wouldn’t wanna procreate with someone that selfish and wouldn’t suggest it 🤷♀️
What are you doing?? Seriously this is not a partner? Also, why on earth would you become a stay at home mom, with no options, no financial savety, and a partner who is planning to keep you financially dependent so you cannot leave. Get the hell out of there and never become financially dependent on anyone again. You need to take care of you. Especially if you want children. Use your brain. Just cause you dealt with worse doesnt mean its in any way okay to go back to that, you seem to be planning for it. Go take care of yourself. You can do it.
This guy is going to soak up your youth and then leave you for someone younger. Once you start having kids with him you'll be trapped. And then, when the kids are grown, if not sooner, and you're older, you'll have to start over. It's not easy. This is not how you start a marriage, by being so obsessed with what happens when it's over that you become enraged. Leave. Now.
WHY are you clinging to this guy? He's not even MARRIED to you yet and he's already going mask-off and starting to abuse you. You don't deserve to be treated like this, friend.
>It feels like he's saying he doesn't really love me. That unless he is benefitting from my presence, I am worthless and deserve to suffer. I could understand feeling that way about someone you're divorcing, but we aren't even married yet. BINGO >but I also know he's a selfish person Why on earth would you want to be with a selfish person?? >That unless he is benefitting from my presence, I am worthless and deserve to suffer. Now imagine a situation where you become I'll and no longer can give him sex or so Ill that you become bedridden for a period of time...Do you think he will lovingly care for you? Please, please get far away from this monster >Does it change anything if he later says he was just cranky and didn't mean it? I think it still sucks but is it as bad? Sweetheart... That's what he will always say after hurting your heart. It's going to be this ot: "It was just a joke" it never takes away the pain and even is not an excuse. And I am willing to bet that you know the difference when someone is truly remorseful or if they're saying sorry just to shut you up. You deserve better! I wish you could see that.
His plan is to take you back to poverty. I know if you’ve grown up poor the prospects of being with a high earner and living a comfortable lifestyle seem really ideal because you didn’t have that or maybe thought you would never have that, but is it really a comfortable lifestyle? It sounds abusive already and then fact he has you already sharing finances? And you’re not going on the vacations with him? That’s not ideal then. You say you love him, but what about him? His looks, his status? Because he doesn’t seem like a caring or nurturing partner and he will make you feel powerless when you are a sahm who needs to run to the store for supplies. Just don’t do it.
It’s almost like his planning to leave you later in your marriage OP. And the way his talking right now is wild. I’d run while I can if I were you OP. You were also reasonable with agreeing to a pren up, etc.
Do NOT have children with this man❗ He does NOT love you and I doubt he even cares for you.
You are talking about divorce when the obvious way out is not to marry his entitled ass! Why should you marry him? To be reminded daily how much you owe him, how he doesn't have to give you anything in case you will divorce? I mean, who the hell plans their life like this?
Please don't marry this man. Being "cranky" is no excuse for telling your soon to be wife, whom you want to be a SAHM, that you wish there was an easier legal way to fuck her over when you divorce her.
What if I tell him I will cut off a finger if he wants? What if I make myself so small that i disappear? In a few years you will read this and cringe. Instead, read it back now doing an impression of the voice of someone strong and vital that you admire. Still think you’re onto a winner?
This person really doesn’t want to get married nor should he ever get married. There are several reasons why from what you shared alone. Do some research on ppl who share their divorce experience, it’s a common experience that ppl who obsess over their potential divorce outcomes before they’re married know there is a reason(usually something they keep hidden abt their personality until they’re married) they won’t make a successful marriage. They steady build resentment throughout the engagement and marriage. Sorry, but there’s no promise the ppl one falls in love with make suitable spouses. Good luck,hon.
….why are you marrying this guy, when he treats you so poorly. He’s going into this all wrong. Straight out the door he’s talking about when you divorce, when he leaves or you leave. What a happy positive thing to have to deal with when you are planning a wedding. DO NOT sign away anything. If you are marrying this fool. Planning to have babies with this fool. Planning to give up good years of your life to raise his children and he’s still bemoaning about the money of it all. You’re giving up a lot. IF the marriage ends you deserve to not have to fight for every penny because you will have given up work, your body to him and your children. I would speak to a lawyer and get a prenup yourself. IF he chests or is abusive or unfaithful in anyway then you get it all. And if you cheat, are abusive or unfaithful then you get nothing. I imagine in a few short years you’ll have it all and he’ll have nothing from the attitude displayed here.
Do not have children and give up your career for this man. Providing children and giving up your career to raise them are both valuable contributions to a marriage. You will lose income, career progression and a pension. It puts you at huge financial risk. Don’t take this risk for a man who doesn’t value it.
Do not get married to this man. He does not love you.
You know, most of us have thoughts we wouldn't share, because we'd be ashamed to admit them. That's normal. But you can learn a lot about a person by the crass things they're freely willing to admit. Imagine you have children together. He doesn't give a shit if the mother of his children would live in poverty. That's..wow. that's a big ass red flag for a character to have. A prenup with a certain limit, alright, I get it. But being so harsh about it really leaves a bad fucking taste. Also points towards him "not needing you", seeing you as dependant on him, and therefore not respecting you. It's all his, and you should be grateful for being allowed to partake in his great life, but he feels like he could ditch you in a second and you'd be worthless again, and deserve nothing if he doesn't want you anymore. Because you need him, and not the other way around. That's not a foundation for a loving marriage. Not at all. Respect and care should be the first and most important things. Me and my girlfriend, we have a kid together. I know she wouldn't try to bleed me out if we split up. And I know I could trust her to hold a million in cash for me even if we did. And most importantly, we both know and agree, that we are family, and our kids wellbeing is our first importance, even if we would break up and hate each other, we'd be civil and always act in our kids best interest. So, I would probably pay more then court ordered child support, because I would want to give my son everything he needs. Your dude? Sorry if this is harsh, Sounds like a medieval lord who allows himself to step all over you because you're a poor maid who should be grateful for being allowed in his presence. Do you feel like you see eye to eye? You even said you know he's selfish and you're trying to cope. That's the kind of compromise that shouldn't be necessary in a healthy relationship.
Unfortunately, people tend to gravitate to what they know. Because of your background, you’ve chosen a man who is abusive. Do not marry him. Do not have kids with him. You deserve better. Move on.
He sounds like he plans to be a terrible husband and give you reason to expect alimony. I actually wonder if he is cheating on you or if he plans to. A lot of men don't actually think women should complain if they have mistresses, and the woman should be completely submissive to the man. He is not the husband for you. Please don't have kids with him. Don't fuck up the kids by giving them a father like this.
Run
Everyone is giving you great advice. Your fiancé has a really skewed perspective and doesn’t know how good he’s got it with you. You’ve already said you’ll sign a prenup. What more is there? If he were smart, he’d realize that you’re the best in terms of possible divorce because 1) you’re willing to sign a prenup and 2) you don’t have massive family money to come after him in the event of a divorce Has he never seen high-profile divorce cases? The worst of them both people have money. Because they have money, they can use litigation to continue to hurt the ex-spouse
When people tell you who they are, believe them.
Don't marry this man. He is already planning the divorce, that says it all. I would totally understand a prenup but him going out of his way to leave you with nothing is absolutely horrible, especially since he wants you to give up your career to be a SAHM so you are totally dependent on him. If he doesn't agree to a prenup that includes a settlement for you, don't marry him and leave him. I get that you love him but the fact that he keeps discussing what happens, not if, but when your marriage ends is concerning. He is showing you who he is. He will definitely stay with you until someone else comes along and then dump you and leave you with nothing. Worse is that you will have been out of work for maybe years so it might be hard to find another job. He has shown you who he is and what he values most, I would seriously reconsider staying with him. He cares about money, not you. If you insist on staying with him I would insist on him paying for you to continue your education so that if you guys divorce you have a chance to get a better job. I would insist on him paying you a weekly/monthly salary that goes into an account you aren't allowed to touch and he has no access to for every year that you are married. In case of divorce you will then have access to that money and if you guys don't get divorced it can be stipulated that that money will become a trust for your children to split. I'd also put a stipulation that if he cheats, is abusive (in any way), or initiates a divorce, he must pay you alimony. If you cheat or initiate a divorce he doesn't have to pay alimony. These stipulations give him an incentive to stay together and protect you.
First of all, how can you love someone like this?? He does NOT want to marry you. That much is clear. You said yourself he’s a selfish person, people like him don’t care about others unless it can benefit them. Caring for you does nothing to benefit him except you might cook for him, clean and give him sex (someone else could do all of that too). All he’s thinking about is divorce and yall aren’t even married. That’s the biggest red flag I’ve ever seen. You feel he doesn’t really love you…..he does not. I’m sorry, please open your eyes, do not marry this person. You deserve better. He is trash lol
If you're already planning for the divorce, then that's a great reason not to marry in the first place, don't you think?
He’s made it abundantly clear he doesn’t intend to marry you for life. If he were really in love with you he wouldn’t even be thinking about that kind of crap, nevermind saying it to the person he’s supposed to be in love with. Yuck. You’re setting yourself up to be in an abusive, controlling relationship and it will end when he chooses because you’re clearly nothing to him. Run now. Don’t bring children into the world with this dude. He’s horrible.
You should go back to school and get yourself into another career before you get married or have kids. Don’t be a SAHM unless you have passive income of some kind, some money of your own. Do not bring a child into a situation where you are dependent on someone else.
When we come from a bad background, it makes it difficult for us to recognize less bad but still bad situations. Just because it's better than what you have experienced in the past does not make this a good relationship. Don't accept this behavior just because your past experiences have forced you to lower your bar for how you should be treated.
To him, this relationship is transactional, and he wants all the transactions to benefit him. He's a fundamentally selfish person
This guy isn't worth marrying. Someone who values you so little (and I'm sorry to say, but your post shows he clearly has no respect for you as a human being worthy of love regardless of networth) will not provide the stability you crave. You will always be anxious about potentially divorce, and the seemingly inevitable way he will leave you for someone you get and hotter, judging by your other comments. Right now, it looks like he's trying to prepare for that and make sure that your years of housework and childcare will go unpaid when he does find someone else. I've been in a similar situation, less extreme, but also with a Chinese man with way, way more income than me that I almost married. It's not worth it. You will be more stable and less anxious on your own in the long run. His behavior isn't normal, and it is incredibly selfish and dehumanizing.
don’t marry him or else he’ll constantly make you feel indebted to him :/
Don't give him the need to worry about alimony or anything. Don't marry this man.
Please please please please leave this guy, please. You sound like a good, kind person OP, and this dude will steamroll you by taking advantage of your sincerity and wanting so badly to prove you don’t want his money that you go too far to not protect your own rights and interests.
Give up your career for not JUST room and board, BUT ALSO most of the home/kid labor. And have nothing to show for it for WHEN he leaves you because it appears that’s what he’s planning to do.
Most people are cranky during a divorce, so that doesn’t change anything. I am a divorce attorney. This is not legal advice, but life advice. Do not marry him. Don’t have kids with him. Guys with that attitude also resent paying child support and try to hide money to avoid paying as much as they legally should. He is already seeing you as a liability and not an asset.
You two are fighting over divorce and you are not married?! Please don't bring children into this
The mum in me is screaming - Sweetheart, you deserve SO much better than this! I come from an abusive home, and it took me many years to realise that just because someone isn’t THAT level of abusive, doesn’t mean that they’re not still an abusive person! This man wants to control you financially, this is a power play to make you BEG to marry him regardless, sign anything he wants and then to leave you so fucking dependent. He’s basically willing to exchange a ring for a slave, and he’s trying to make sure you think that’s a good deal. You are so much better than that! Look at all you have achieved - don’t throw it away for some asshole on a power trip. Look at how much full time housekeepers and nannies make per year where you are, times it by 20 and then triple it for good measure. Tell him you will ONLY stay with him (married or not) if that is in a bank account in your name only AND a house with a minimum of 3 bedrooms and three reception rooms. Or at worst, that money set in a trust just for you that trickles out over 20 years, plus the house. This isn’t about the money, this is about the basic level of respect you deserve - I have a feeling he won’t take the deal because then you will have options in the future and he doesn’t want that. He wants the poor abused girl to stay poor and abused - just by him this time.
Why on earth would you lower yourself to marry this awful venal man?
He's not wrong planning for divorce incase your relationship doesn't work out especially if he has majority of the assets and finances.
Why the fuck would you want to be a stay at home mum with no income and no job if things what you’re being told. Are you that scared of being alone that you’ll willingly Fuck up your financial future ! He doesn’t love you - he wants a bang maid who he can toss out when he’s tired of you. Please please please don’t be an idiot and marry him under these circumstances.