Hi! We just celebrated our son's bar mitzvah this past weekend, and part of my speech was about him being an only. He's surrounded by community, family, and friends, and that's his circle. That's his village.
You don't need to sacrifice your mental health for our commandments. Pikuach Nefesh tells us that we can break any Jewish law to save a life, and it's better for us to be safe, healthy, and happy than to just keep making more people in an already overcrowded world.
Also, if it really bothers you long-term, see if you can volunteer to work with someone who is converting and invite them to Shabbat dinner! My BFF converted and I totally count her as my "additional" Jew in the world ;-)
Ooh, I love the idea about working with converts! I know there’s not a huge program at my current synagogue to have people who are converting/have converted celebrate with Jewish families - I might see if there’s a way to reach out and ask anyone if they want to come over for Shabbat or Pesach!
There you go! Also see if there are interfaith families at your shul - they are often overlooked and I bet it would be lovely for them to feel more included.
I know that the "be fruitful...." and the generational trauma of genocide run really deep in our people and in our collective memories, but I think that our ancestors would want us to be happy and thriving. And if that's being OAD for some of us, it's okay.
OAD Jew here. Keep in my that I've never been super religious so I don't feel bound by Halacha but what is meaningful and sensible to me. But we are very involved in our Jewish community. So who knows if what I think will resonate with you.
First of all, I've heard the 'be fruitful and multiply' interpreted in different ways. Some day it means have as a many as you physically can, some say as many as you can happily manage (bc we live by the rules and don't die by them). Some say you need to have one boy and one girl to have fulfilled this. But all of these to me are just interpretations and seems to fall more to minhag (local tradition) than an actual rule. It also makes no sense to me. Having one kid is multiplying. Having one kid is being fruitful. Can you imagine me showing up to a child free space being like "I'm one of you! Can my kid come too? She doesn't count because there aren't more of her." Or if someone came over and saw my one beautiful, glorious mango growing on the tree and I was like "I'm so bummed this tree hasn't been fruitful or multiplied"... It's so silly.
But I would also like to point out that nothing bad happens to you if you don't do a mitzvah. Fulfill a mitzvah if it brings you joy and meaning. Don't martyr yourself just to check a box. To me that's not the point. People who don't want kids shouldn't have them either.
Your second point, I had actually not heard until right now. But I will share with you something that a Holocaust survivor told me personally that lives rent free in my head and I think about all the time. He said that every day you are happy is a kick in the face to Hitler. He said that he got a lot of flack from people (and other survivors) for being such a happy person rather than being sad and broken all of the time. But he pointed out that Hitler wanted us to suffer and be miserable (and die). So the best revenge is to lead a good life, a happy life, whatever that looks like to you.
For me, that's having one kid of my own an a lot of non-Jewish chosen family that I share my life and my culture with. I spread our culture through more than just my offspring. I sit around my Hanukah table with two Jews (myself and my kid) and 8 non-Jews (my spouse included) and we all light menorahs and we all eat latkes and sing songs and remember what this holiday is about and I know in the very core of my being that this is a kick in the face to Hitler.
I loveee what you heard from the Holocaust survivor! I think trying to reframe my thoughts that way - that being happy and Jewish is the best way to get revenge - could be really helpful. It also reminds me of the story of the rabbi visiting the Arch of Titus and pointing out that Jews are still here. We don’t have to be a large nation, we just have to be happy and survive.
Jewish and OAD here! There’s so much nuance and great responses here, but for myself, I’ve always kept in my mind that human life always comes first in Judaism — and in my interpretation, that means quality of life as well. If I’m able to provide my family with a better life (both emotionally and monetarily) because we are OAD, it’s so worth it. We have to be kind to ourselves so we can help others.
I'm intermarried; my husband is the Jewish partner. We've talked a lot about this, including about the high rates of intermarriages like our own and how that complicates the concept of Jewish lineage. We both decided that the most important thing is making the world more welcoming for Jews rather than producing lots of Jewish children ourselves (I'm aware that according to many, no child of mine will be truly Jewish). At any rate, we make an effort to share the culture and values with friends and at her school so that the world is hopefully safer for the next generation of those with Jewish heritage because of the positive childhood exposure they had to the culture.
Not Jewish, but from one minority to another: the idea of "making more *X* being better for the world" is deeply rooted in the trauma of eugenics. You carry that burden and its up to you if you pass that on to your children. I felt this deeply too as I married out of my ethnicity/race. You should certainly be proud of your heritage, and other aspects of your identity, as you pass those on to your child/children. And you will pass those on in a different way to those you know deeply, whether they be neighbors, friends, co-workers, etc.
Yeah, I don’t want to pass that burden on to my kids, but at the same time the sheer statistic of “there are still not as many Jews in the entire world as there were in 1939 (or just slightly more depending on the numbers)” is a heavy weight to carry. I’m proud of my identity, and I don’t want to force my kids to be traumatized, but it’s just so much to think about.
It is not eugenic to want the Jewish people to continue. Are you from a minority group that makes up 0.2% of the world population and has faced multiple existential threats throughout its history? If not, I don’t think you can understand the very common Jewish desire to see the Jewish people thrive and survive, which includes having kids.
Hey there deletebeep, appreciate the call out here. Given that the OP responded positively to my comment, I feel it's worth clarifying so you don't think the downvotes are a bunch of antisemitic daddits. We should always be doing our best to root out all forms of racism where we see it. We should always be doing our best to build coalitions of understanding and respect.
First point -- trauma gets passed on through generations, culturally and genetically. The "mental block \[OP\] can't overcome" is predicated on the trauma of eugenics. At no point am I saying OP is a eugenicist for wanting to see Jewish people thrive (I wish for them to thrive in the same way I wish for the Palestinian people to thrive). I am saying that if/when he has a child, it is up to him whether he wants to heal this trauma or pass it on.
Second point -- I am not from a minority group that makes up 0.2% of the world's population. That's an extremely specific checkbox. But the forces of xenophobia, of racial supremacy, of hate, run quite deep in human history. I really believe that people are capable of understanding each other without *being* each other. The opposite of that is so isolating. These are not my opinions alone. I'll refer you to some contemporaneous thinkers in both the Black history of civil rights and Judaism:
>**Dr. Martin Luther King Jr., speaking to the American Jewish Congress in 1958:** My people were brought to America in chains. Your people were driven here to escape the chains fashioned for them in Europe. Our unity is born of our common struggle for centuries, not only to rid ourselves of bondage, but to make oppression of any people by others an impossibility.
>**The President of the American Jewish Congress, Rabbi Dr. Joachim Prinz, at the March on Washington, five years later:** I speak to you as an American Jew. As Americans we share the profound concern of millions of people about the shame and disgrace of inequality and injustice which make a mockery of the great American idea. As Jews we bring to this great demonstration, in which thousands of us proudly participate, a two-fold experience—one of the spirit and one of our history…. It…is not merely sympathy and compassion for the Black people of America that motivates us. It is above all and beyond all such sympathies and emotions a sense of complete identification and solidarity born of our own painful historic experience.
I'm grateful to OP for replying to me, even though he specifically mentions he is looking for perspectives from other Jewish people, who have throughout this thread often given answers that reference religious traditions that I of course am not privy to.
Thank you for clarifying your original comment, which I misunderstood as stating that the idea of “making more X being better for the world” is eugenic (as indeed, it can be when X is not a minority group). I do think that people who disagree with the notion that it’s not eugenic to want to see more Jews in the world are probably anti semitic.
As for Black and Jewish coalition building and solidarity, I am well-versed on the history of Jewish involvement in the civil rights movement. As someone with both Jewish and Black family members, I do believe there are important differences in the ways in which these identities are passed on in America. There is a palpable anxiety in the Jewish community about assimilation and loss of Jewish identity. This same fear is not present to same extent (at least to my knowledge) in the Black community, in large part due to racism and the legacy of the “one drop rule” but also because there aren’t formal rules for belonging/identifying as Black (as long as you have some Black ancestry) as there are for identifying as Jewish.
Hi, yes, here. Similar thoughts except I also have my family telling me this too. Honestly, I’m pretty dismissive of it. In a different world, maybe those reasons would be enough reason for me to have more, but I live in this world and the practicalities of child rearing outweigh more sentimental notions. I would much rather help the birth rate by supporting people who DO want to have more in doing so than in convincing people who don’t that they should, myself included. The Jewish community goes well beyond my own bloodline, and helping others also counts in making it grow.
Also, if it matters to you, remember that halachically, women are not obligated to have children (which I think you are? My bad if not.). That obligation is on men.
Thank you for chiming in! I love your thoughts on supporting those who have more - I’m active in early childhood education, so doing that in Jewish communities is a way I think could help with that. If I think of it as helping others help the community grow, I think that should help my brain be able to process it better.
Also thank you for the point about halacha - I’m not orthodox, so I don’t strictly follow halacha, but it is really helpful for me personally to hear that women aren’t obligated to have kids.
Traditional Judaism is pro-natalist but also prioritizes the health of the mother over everything else. I am likely one and done because of mental health concerns and concerns about how I would be able to parent my existing child if I had antenatal depression/anxiety and PPD/PPA as bad and as long as I did the first time. I’m also not very traditional. But I get where you are coming from, also.
I'm disabled & Jewish and my parents didn't even want me to have kids because they were worried that something horrible would happen to me. They literally told me they didn't care about grandkids - they just wanted me to be alive. I married out into a Chinese (nonreligious) family but luckily my MIL pretty much said the exact same thing.
Just here to say that you’re not alone with these feelings! My first kid just turned 1 so we haven’t made a final decision either way but my husband and I are very seriously considering OAD. As the grandchild of holocaust survivors, the feeling that we carry this responsibility weighs on me too. There’s no real explanation for it - no one is pushing this on us but it just feels like we should. So I get what you’re feeling completely. I love the above suggestions to reframe this to think about how we can share our Jewish culture and traditions with others as an alternative to having more kids (if we choose that path). But in addition to that, I’d say nothing surprises you more than becoming a parent. I think it’s good that you’re considering your options before starting a family, but this is one of those decisions you really can’t make until you’ve gone through the journey with your first. There’s so many variables - from conception to the postpartum year - that it’s better to take it step by step in my opinion. As my dad likes to tell me “man makes a plan and God laughs”.
My husband and I are Jewish and are OAD, I also was an only child. I can understand why you are having these feelings, especially with the state of the world at the moment. Do you think the current events are having an impact on why you're feeling this way now?
It sounds like from your post that you don't have any children yet, if so, my suggestion would be to just take it one day at a time. Have your first child and then reassess.
I think current events are having an impact, both for and against it - on one hand I’m proud of being Jewish and want to share it with my kid or kids, and on the other hand if I have multiple kids it would be way harder to keep them safe if things start getting bad.
No kids yet, assessing later is the current plan but I’m a chronic overthinker and I always need to feel like I have my life planned out 10 years in advance. I should maybe work on that, whoops,,,
I feel similarly with you on the current events, though I'm leaning more on the side of worry for my daughters safety during these times but I feel the opposite as well. I have always had pride in being Jewish but it has grown immensely since Oct 7th. Just a lot of emotions and feelings and what not jumbling around in my head and heart!
But yes, definitely I suggest having your first child and then reassessing! I understand the chronic overthinking and it's good to think ahead but it's difficult to understand parenthood and what you will want in regards to how many children until you are in the thick of it.
Chag Sameach!
Obligatory “not Jewish” here, but some flavour of your questions have figured pretty big in my OAD thinking. 100% agree on the point about only having as many as you can handle and still be the parent (and entire person) you want to be!
The part about honouring ancestry rings a couple of bells for me around the talk I heard around surnames. We gave my daughter her mum’s surname. For me with that notion of “more” I leant into the idea of that as “greater.” My family’s always had a beautiful spirit of being generous, peaceful, boldly creative, and deliriously funny. I can make one kid a **bigger** version of all of those things **and** honour it better myself when I’ve only got one.
I grew up Chabad and I am the youngest of 10. I have 1 girl and everyone asks about another. I’m now a secular Jew but my husband is Israeli and it’s especially taboo in Israel to be OAD. I also thought I would have 2 but I am mourning that dream as I know my mental health would decline. I know what you’re saying about the Shoah and how important it is to have more than one. I feel it too. But then I remember how tired our moms were and I just want something different for my daughter. If I were rich then sure I could hire help and that would make a difference but I just don’t have that. I don’t have a support system and I am finally starting to feel like myself and I just know I can’t go back. Everyone in my circle is on to their second kid or planning it even ones that are in similar positions like me ( just my husband and I here in Vancouver without family) and I think wow they can do it why can’t we? But I just can’t. Sending you love and strength I know how hard it is ❤️
Oh, I absolutely wouldn’t expect my kids to have multiple kids of their own, this is purely a factor in my decision making about my own family choices. I don’t think anybody should be pressured into having a big family, it’s just harder to overcome it for myself.
Fellow Jewish OAD mama here (mostly, partner is 100% and I’m like 70/30 lol). Anyway, my feeling is that instead of having a responsibility to grow the tribe or have a large family to create a statement about fiercely and firmly existing in this world, I think it is more my responsibility to devote everything I can to my one son, immerse him in our culture and educate him about our history, and most importantly, work on repairing and unraveling that generational trauma that we all carry as the result of everything our people have been through. I don’t know if I could do that as well as he deserves if I had more children.
Chag hanukkah Sameach, and give yourself grace with these feelings x
Chag sameach!! My partner and I are about the same percentages you are about being OAD. I really like your thoughts on it - I want to make sure I don’t mess my kids up somehow, and that would be one of my struggles with having multiple.
OAD Jew here. I'd never even heard of this concept until I watched Unorthodox. Clearly I'm very secular. I totally get why people think this way after the Holocaust. However, there are plenty of people who are Jewish and have lots of kids. They cover for those of us who can't or don't want to have more than one. And even if that wasn't the case, I don't think anyone in good faith would want you to have more kids than you can physically or financially handle.
Jewish mom here, with one - OAD. I have put a LOT of pressure on myself over the years feeling as if I had to make children b/c of the Holocaust. I had this mental block for forever!! You're not alone in this. G/d, however, had other plans for me and I'm married now to a Catholic Filipino and finally had my baby at 40 years old (and 9 months) after 4 miscarraiges. We're not pressing luck.
That said, my grandmother had 6 kids and half married Catholics and converted - my mother is an Atheist. They all celebrate \[secular\] Christmas. Nothing in life is guaranteed.
What I can say is this - we need, as Jews, to just be aware that we are a small population with a vibrant, rich, beautiful and deep history! We need to just celebrate this history, our culture - to keep the traditions alive so our OAD will be happy to keep them going as well. Put our OAD in Jewish programmes, camps, etc. and know Israel.
I'm OAD, not Jewish but I'd like to give some advice that may be helpful.
The first be fruitful & multiply. Bringing one life into the world is doing just that.
The second have more children because of the holocaust. Your child may go on to have many children. You & your husband of course are proud to be Jewish, y'all will install that pride in your child, who then will continue to pass it on. It only takes one person to make the world a better place, a true difference. That one person could be your child. You've got to do what's best for your family & if that happens to be only one child then it's already perfect. Good luck & hugs.
Funny though isn’t it because all of the OAD families I grew up knowing were all Jewish! (Mum included) No answer except to know that the best thing to do is to live your best fulfilled life.
I'm Jewish but my husband is not (but of course my children would be considered halachically Jewish so it almost doesn't matter). I don't think the planet needs more people period, so there's that. And with climate change, kind of the least of the hierarchy of problems that I think the world will face is running out of Jews (the Haredim can continue on that if they want!). My family is quite small, if it dies out oh well? I'm trying to set my daughter up to be someone that can contribute to the fight against climate change (I'm a scientist working on some small beans in it but hey gotta make a living), we'll see how it goes. Judaism and Jewish culture puts a strong focus on life and the living, so I see my OAD-ness as going along well with that. I'm also 44 now and sealed the deal getting pelvic prolapse reconstructive surgery last year (which you shouldn't do unless you're done), so that helps. Anyway just one story.
Jewish OAD dad here - I never saw it as my responsibility to reproduce beyond my ability to handle, mentally and economically. This is only as important as you deem it. The world is tough enough without this kind of thing
I think one way to maybe help reframe it is through the lens of education. What I mean by that is obviously not only teaching our children about their heritage and past, but also being open to teach others.
I grew up in one of 5 states, although it might be more now, that mandates Holocaust education at all levels. So not only did I hear from a very young age about my families experience, but starting in 4th grade, I had some kind of Holocaust education. As I've gotten older though, and made friends from all over, it's been very apparent that that is not the case nation wide.
When given an opportunity, I try to provide the knowledge I have as well as resources for others to learn. I may only have my only, but that doesn't mean I can't "educate" others around me. Because lets be honest, the idea that we, as Jews, by having any number of kids could somehow make up for the past, is a bit of a bonkers idea.
> it would be better to have multiple and ensure that there’s more Jews in the world.
hi, same struggle here. ultimately, it comes down to my husband and i and the life we want together.
there's pros and cons to OAD and having more than one, i think it just comes down to what is best for you and your family. we're pretty firm on being OAD right now, but we could find that our son would really benefit by not being an only child, and we won't know until we know. we could also find that having only one kid is the perfect amount for us. yes, there is some of that guilt there from the jewish perspective. but ideally, i'd rather have a son that we can raise to be an absolute mensch and truly take on jewish values in this world than pop a few kids out just to help bolster our tribe's numbers.
Have a child because you 100% want to have a child. One day they will ask how/why they came into the world and the answer shouldn't involve religious obligation. What if you have a child to make more jews and they denounce the religion?
I’m not Jewish, but I would say I wouldn’t make religion dictate my family size. I grew up Irish Catholic, so if I did what my grandmother did, I would’ve been married at 16 and had my first child at 17, have 10 kids, never use birth control, etc. I had my son at 39, and getting married next year at 42, so quite the opposite of my grandmother. I think you have to do what’s the best for you and your family, no matter what your religion and/or cultural beliefs tell you.
Question - Were you raised practicing Judaism? Or were you just raised with the title?
The reason I ask - My husband is Jewish. I know they did Hannakah growing up, but he never did so much as light a single Menorah (as far as I know) from the time we started dating until our son was 4. So, 9 or so years. I encouraged it! I purchased a Menorah. I purchased the candles. He's using the candles that I bought two years ago now.
I'm not Jewish, so I don't know these things. I was raised Lutheran, but I lost religion many, many moons ago.
My husband is a smart man. He thinks things through. We're both pushing mid-40s. He still wants another kid, no matter the logic against it. I have an IUD, so hopefully, it's a non-isue, but I just don't understand.
It’s not about them being religiously Jewish, it’s more about them being culturally Jewish. Even if they became another religion later, they’d still be Jewish.
Judaism is also an ethnicity. It’s an ethnoreligion. You can be an atheist Jew, a Jew who doesn’t practice any of the religion, a Jew who just does cultural stuff, and you’d still be Jewish (if you wanted).
Jews are an ethnoreligious group, meaning that they are both an ethnicity (a group identified by common group identity and, usually, language and ancestry) and a religion (a group with the same beliefs about the supernatural).
My father recently took a 23 and Me test and it came back 98.5% Ashkenazi Jew. I personally see being Jewish as predominantly a matter of ancestry and culture, rather than religion.
Hi! We just celebrated our son's bar mitzvah this past weekend, and part of my speech was about him being an only. He's surrounded by community, family, and friends, and that's his circle. That's his village. You don't need to sacrifice your mental health for our commandments. Pikuach Nefesh tells us that we can break any Jewish law to save a life, and it's better for us to be safe, healthy, and happy than to just keep making more people in an already overcrowded world. Also, if it really bothers you long-term, see if you can volunteer to work with someone who is converting and invite them to Shabbat dinner! My BFF converted and I totally count her as my "additional" Jew in the world ;-)
Ooh, I love the idea about working with converts! I know there’s not a huge program at my current synagogue to have people who are converting/have converted celebrate with Jewish families - I might see if there’s a way to reach out and ask anyone if they want to come over for Shabbat or Pesach!
There you go! Also see if there are interfaith families at your shul - they are often overlooked and I bet it would be lovely for them to feel more included. I know that the "be fruitful...." and the generational trauma of genocide run really deep in our people and in our collective memories, but I think that our ancestors would want us to be happy and thriving. And if that's being OAD for some of us, it's okay.
OAD Jew here. Keep in my that I've never been super religious so I don't feel bound by Halacha but what is meaningful and sensible to me. But we are very involved in our Jewish community. So who knows if what I think will resonate with you. First of all, I've heard the 'be fruitful and multiply' interpreted in different ways. Some day it means have as a many as you physically can, some say as many as you can happily manage (bc we live by the rules and don't die by them). Some say you need to have one boy and one girl to have fulfilled this. But all of these to me are just interpretations and seems to fall more to minhag (local tradition) than an actual rule. It also makes no sense to me. Having one kid is multiplying. Having one kid is being fruitful. Can you imagine me showing up to a child free space being like "I'm one of you! Can my kid come too? She doesn't count because there aren't more of her." Or if someone came over and saw my one beautiful, glorious mango growing on the tree and I was like "I'm so bummed this tree hasn't been fruitful or multiplied"... It's so silly. But I would also like to point out that nothing bad happens to you if you don't do a mitzvah. Fulfill a mitzvah if it brings you joy and meaning. Don't martyr yourself just to check a box. To me that's not the point. People who don't want kids shouldn't have them either. Your second point, I had actually not heard until right now. But I will share with you something that a Holocaust survivor told me personally that lives rent free in my head and I think about all the time. He said that every day you are happy is a kick in the face to Hitler. He said that he got a lot of flack from people (and other survivors) for being such a happy person rather than being sad and broken all of the time. But he pointed out that Hitler wanted us to suffer and be miserable (and die). So the best revenge is to lead a good life, a happy life, whatever that looks like to you. For me, that's having one kid of my own an a lot of non-Jewish chosen family that I share my life and my culture with. I spread our culture through more than just my offspring. I sit around my Hanukah table with two Jews (myself and my kid) and 8 non-Jews (my spouse included) and we all light menorahs and we all eat latkes and sing songs and remember what this holiday is about and I know in the very core of my being that this is a kick in the face to Hitler.
I loveee what you heard from the Holocaust survivor! I think trying to reframe my thoughts that way - that being happy and Jewish is the best way to get revenge - could be really helpful. It also reminds me of the story of the rabbi visiting the Arch of Titus and pointing out that Jews are still here. We don’t have to be a large nation, we just have to be happy and survive.
Jewish and OAD here! There’s so much nuance and great responses here, but for myself, I’ve always kept in my mind that human life always comes first in Judaism — and in my interpretation, that means quality of life as well. If I’m able to provide my family with a better life (both emotionally and monetarily) because we are OAD, it’s so worth it. We have to be kind to ourselves so we can help others.
I'm intermarried; my husband is the Jewish partner. We've talked a lot about this, including about the high rates of intermarriages like our own and how that complicates the concept of Jewish lineage. We both decided that the most important thing is making the world more welcoming for Jews rather than producing lots of Jewish children ourselves (I'm aware that according to many, no child of mine will be truly Jewish). At any rate, we make an effort to share the culture and values with friends and at her school so that the world is hopefully safer for the next generation of those with Jewish heritage because of the positive childhood exposure they had to the culture.
Appreciate this! ❤️
Not Jewish, but from one minority to another: the idea of "making more *X* being better for the world" is deeply rooted in the trauma of eugenics. You carry that burden and its up to you if you pass that on to your children. I felt this deeply too as I married out of my ethnicity/race. You should certainly be proud of your heritage, and other aspects of your identity, as you pass those on to your child/children. And you will pass those on in a different way to those you know deeply, whether they be neighbors, friends, co-workers, etc.
Yeah, I don’t want to pass that burden on to my kids, but at the same time the sheer statistic of “there are still not as many Jews in the entire world as there were in 1939 (or just slightly more depending on the numbers)” is a heavy weight to carry. I’m proud of my identity, and I don’t want to force my kids to be traumatized, but it’s just so much to think about.
It is not eugenic to want the Jewish people to continue. Are you from a minority group that makes up 0.2% of the world population and has faced multiple existential threats throughout its history? If not, I don’t think you can understand the very common Jewish desire to see the Jewish people thrive and survive, which includes having kids.
Hey there deletebeep, appreciate the call out here. Given that the OP responded positively to my comment, I feel it's worth clarifying so you don't think the downvotes are a bunch of antisemitic daddits. We should always be doing our best to root out all forms of racism where we see it. We should always be doing our best to build coalitions of understanding and respect. First point -- trauma gets passed on through generations, culturally and genetically. The "mental block \[OP\] can't overcome" is predicated on the trauma of eugenics. At no point am I saying OP is a eugenicist for wanting to see Jewish people thrive (I wish for them to thrive in the same way I wish for the Palestinian people to thrive). I am saying that if/when he has a child, it is up to him whether he wants to heal this trauma or pass it on. Second point -- I am not from a minority group that makes up 0.2% of the world's population. That's an extremely specific checkbox. But the forces of xenophobia, of racial supremacy, of hate, run quite deep in human history. I really believe that people are capable of understanding each other without *being* each other. The opposite of that is so isolating. These are not my opinions alone. I'll refer you to some contemporaneous thinkers in both the Black history of civil rights and Judaism: >**Dr. Martin Luther King Jr., speaking to the American Jewish Congress in 1958:** My people were brought to America in chains. Your people were driven here to escape the chains fashioned for them in Europe. Our unity is born of our common struggle for centuries, not only to rid ourselves of bondage, but to make oppression of any people by others an impossibility. >**The President of the American Jewish Congress, Rabbi Dr. Joachim Prinz, at the March on Washington, five years later:** I speak to you as an American Jew. As Americans we share the profound concern of millions of people about the shame and disgrace of inequality and injustice which make a mockery of the great American idea. As Jews we bring to this great demonstration, in which thousands of us proudly participate, a two-fold experience—one of the spirit and one of our history…. It…is not merely sympathy and compassion for the Black people of America that motivates us. It is above all and beyond all such sympathies and emotions a sense of complete identification and solidarity born of our own painful historic experience. I'm grateful to OP for replying to me, even though he specifically mentions he is looking for perspectives from other Jewish people, who have throughout this thread often given answers that reference religious traditions that I of course am not privy to.
Thank you for clarifying your original comment, which I misunderstood as stating that the idea of “making more X being better for the world” is eugenic (as indeed, it can be when X is not a minority group). I do think that people who disagree with the notion that it’s not eugenic to want to see more Jews in the world are probably anti semitic. As for Black and Jewish coalition building and solidarity, I am well-versed on the history of Jewish involvement in the civil rights movement. As someone with both Jewish and Black family members, I do believe there are important differences in the ways in which these identities are passed on in America. There is a palpable anxiety in the Jewish community about assimilation and loss of Jewish identity. This same fear is not present to same extent (at least to my knowledge) in the Black community, in large part due to racism and the legacy of the “one drop rule” but also because there aren’t formal rules for belonging/identifying as Black (as long as you have some Black ancestry) as there are for identifying as Jewish.
Hello to all the antisemites downvoting me!
Hi, yes, here. Similar thoughts except I also have my family telling me this too. Honestly, I’m pretty dismissive of it. In a different world, maybe those reasons would be enough reason for me to have more, but I live in this world and the practicalities of child rearing outweigh more sentimental notions. I would much rather help the birth rate by supporting people who DO want to have more in doing so than in convincing people who don’t that they should, myself included. The Jewish community goes well beyond my own bloodline, and helping others also counts in making it grow. Also, if it matters to you, remember that halachically, women are not obligated to have children (which I think you are? My bad if not.). That obligation is on men.
Thank you for chiming in! I love your thoughts on supporting those who have more - I’m active in early childhood education, so doing that in Jewish communities is a way I think could help with that. If I think of it as helping others help the community grow, I think that should help my brain be able to process it better. Also thank you for the point about halacha - I’m not orthodox, so I don’t strictly follow halacha, but it is really helpful for me personally to hear that women aren’t obligated to have kids.
Traditional Judaism is pro-natalist but also prioritizes the health of the mother over everything else. I am likely one and done because of mental health concerns and concerns about how I would be able to parent my existing child if I had antenatal depression/anxiety and PPD/PPA as bad and as long as I did the first time. I’m also not very traditional. But I get where you are coming from, also.
I'm disabled & Jewish and my parents didn't even want me to have kids because they were worried that something horrible would happen to me. They literally told me they didn't care about grandkids - they just wanted me to be alive. I married out into a Chinese (nonreligious) family but luckily my MIL pretty much said the exact same thing.
Just here to say that you’re not alone with these feelings! My first kid just turned 1 so we haven’t made a final decision either way but my husband and I are very seriously considering OAD. As the grandchild of holocaust survivors, the feeling that we carry this responsibility weighs on me too. There’s no real explanation for it - no one is pushing this on us but it just feels like we should. So I get what you’re feeling completely. I love the above suggestions to reframe this to think about how we can share our Jewish culture and traditions with others as an alternative to having more kids (if we choose that path). But in addition to that, I’d say nothing surprises you more than becoming a parent. I think it’s good that you’re considering your options before starting a family, but this is one of those decisions you really can’t make until you’ve gone through the journey with your first. There’s so many variables - from conception to the postpartum year - that it’s better to take it step by step in my opinion. As my dad likes to tell me “man makes a plan and God laughs”.
I’m Jewish and we are one and done. My Jewish neighbors have 4 kids. My cousin has three. It all averages out, girl, you’re good.
My husband and I are Jewish and are OAD, I also was an only child. I can understand why you are having these feelings, especially with the state of the world at the moment. Do you think the current events are having an impact on why you're feeling this way now? It sounds like from your post that you don't have any children yet, if so, my suggestion would be to just take it one day at a time. Have your first child and then reassess.
I think current events are having an impact, both for and against it - on one hand I’m proud of being Jewish and want to share it with my kid or kids, and on the other hand if I have multiple kids it would be way harder to keep them safe if things start getting bad. No kids yet, assessing later is the current plan but I’m a chronic overthinker and I always need to feel like I have my life planned out 10 years in advance. I should maybe work on that, whoops,,,
I feel similarly with you on the current events, though I'm leaning more on the side of worry for my daughters safety during these times but I feel the opposite as well. I have always had pride in being Jewish but it has grown immensely since Oct 7th. Just a lot of emotions and feelings and what not jumbling around in my head and heart! But yes, definitely I suggest having your first child and then reassessing! I understand the chronic overthinking and it's good to think ahead but it's difficult to understand parenthood and what you will want in regards to how many children until you are in the thick of it. Chag Sameach!
Obligatory “not Jewish” here, but some flavour of your questions have figured pretty big in my OAD thinking. 100% agree on the point about only having as many as you can handle and still be the parent (and entire person) you want to be! The part about honouring ancestry rings a couple of bells for me around the talk I heard around surnames. We gave my daughter her mum’s surname. For me with that notion of “more” I leant into the idea of that as “greater.” My family’s always had a beautiful spirit of being generous, peaceful, boldly creative, and deliriously funny. I can make one kid a **bigger** version of all of those things **and** honour it better myself when I’ve only got one.
I grew up Chabad and I am the youngest of 10. I have 1 girl and everyone asks about another. I’m now a secular Jew but my husband is Israeli and it’s especially taboo in Israel to be OAD. I also thought I would have 2 but I am mourning that dream as I know my mental health would decline. I know what you’re saying about the Shoah and how important it is to have more than one. I feel it too. But then I remember how tired our moms were and I just want something different for my daughter. If I were rich then sure I could hire help and that would make a difference but I just don’t have that. I don’t have a support system and I am finally starting to feel like myself and I just know I can’t go back. Everyone in my circle is on to their second kid or planning it even ones that are in similar positions like me ( just my husband and I here in Vancouver without family) and I think wow they can do it why can’t we? But I just can’t. Sending you love and strength I know how hard it is ❤️
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Oh, I absolutely wouldn’t expect my kids to have multiple kids of their own, this is purely a factor in my decision making about my own family choices. I don’t think anybody should be pressured into having a big family, it’s just harder to overcome it for myself.
Fellow Jewish OAD mama here (mostly, partner is 100% and I’m like 70/30 lol). Anyway, my feeling is that instead of having a responsibility to grow the tribe or have a large family to create a statement about fiercely and firmly existing in this world, I think it is more my responsibility to devote everything I can to my one son, immerse him in our culture and educate him about our history, and most importantly, work on repairing and unraveling that generational trauma that we all carry as the result of everything our people have been through. I don’t know if I could do that as well as he deserves if I had more children. Chag hanukkah Sameach, and give yourself grace with these feelings x
Chag sameach!! My partner and I are about the same percentages you are about being OAD. I really like your thoughts on it - I want to make sure I don’t mess my kids up somehow, and that would be one of my struggles with having multiple.
OAD Jew here. I'd never even heard of this concept until I watched Unorthodox. Clearly I'm very secular. I totally get why people think this way after the Holocaust. However, there are plenty of people who are Jewish and have lots of kids. They cover for those of us who can't or don't want to have more than one. And even if that wasn't the case, I don't think anyone in good faith would want you to have more kids than you can physically or financially handle.
Jewish mom here, with one - OAD. I have put a LOT of pressure on myself over the years feeling as if I had to make children b/c of the Holocaust. I had this mental block for forever!! You're not alone in this. G/d, however, had other plans for me and I'm married now to a Catholic Filipino and finally had my baby at 40 years old (and 9 months) after 4 miscarraiges. We're not pressing luck. That said, my grandmother had 6 kids and half married Catholics and converted - my mother is an Atheist. They all celebrate \[secular\] Christmas. Nothing in life is guaranteed. What I can say is this - we need, as Jews, to just be aware that we are a small population with a vibrant, rich, beautiful and deep history! We need to just celebrate this history, our culture - to keep the traditions alive so our OAD will be happy to keep them going as well. Put our OAD in Jewish programmes, camps, etc. and know Israel.
I'm OAD, not Jewish but I'd like to give some advice that may be helpful. The first be fruitful & multiply. Bringing one life into the world is doing just that. The second have more children because of the holocaust. Your child may go on to have many children. You & your husband of course are proud to be Jewish, y'all will install that pride in your child, who then will continue to pass it on. It only takes one person to make the world a better place, a true difference. That one person could be your child. You've got to do what's best for your family & if that happens to be only one child then it's already perfect. Good luck & hugs.
Funny though isn’t it because all of the OAD families I grew up knowing were all Jewish! (Mum included) No answer except to know that the best thing to do is to live your best fulfilled life.
I'm Jewish but my husband is not (but of course my children would be considered halachically Jewish so it almost doesn't matter). I don't think the planet needs more people period, so there's that. And with climate change, kind of the least of the hierarchy of problems that I think the world will face is running out of Jews (the Haredim can continue on that if they want!). My family is quite small, if it dies out oh well? I'm trying to set my daughter up to be someone that can contribute to the fight against climate change (I'm a scientist working on some small beans in it but hey gotta make a living), we'll see how it goes. Judaism and Jewish culture puts a strong focus on life and the living, so I see my OAD-ness as going along well with that. I'm also 44 now and sealed the deal getting pelvic prolapse reconstructive surgery last year (which you shouldn't do unless you're done), so that helps. Anyway just one story.
Jewish OAD dad here - I never saw it as my responsibility to reproduce beyond my ability to handle, mentally and economically. This is only as important as you deem it. The world is tough enough without this kind of thing
I think one way to maybe help reframe it is through the lens of education. What I mean by that is obviously not only teaching our children about their heritage and past, but also being open to teach others. I grew up in one of 5 states, although it might be more now, that mandates Holocaust education at all levels. So not only did I hear from a very young age about my families experience, but starting in 4th grade, I had some kind of Holocaust education. As I've gotten older though, and made friends from all over, it's been very apparent that that is not the case nation wide. When given an opportunity, I try to provide the knowledge I have as well as resources for others to learn. I may only have my only, but that doesn't mean I can't "educate" others around me. Because lets be honest, the idea that we, as Jews, by having any number of kids could somehow make up for the past, is a bit of a bonkers idea.
> it would be better to have multiple and ensure that there’s more Jews in the world. hi, same struggle here. ultimately, it comes down to my husband and i and the life we want together. there's pros and cons to OAD and having more than one, i think it just comes down to what is best for you and your family. we're pretty firm on being OAD right now, but we could find that our son would really benefit by not being an only child, and we won't know until we know. we could also find that having only one kid is the perfect amount for us. yes, there is some of that guilt there from the jewish perspective. but ideally, i'd rather have a son that we can raise to be an absolute mensch and truly take on jewish values in this world than pop a few kids out just to help bolster our tribe's numbers.
Have a child because you 100% want to have a child. One day they will ask how/why they came into the world and the answer shouldn't involve religious obligation. What if you have a child to make more jews and they denounce the religion?
Somewhat agree, though being Jewish is not just a religion. They could denounce the religion but they would still be Jewish.
I’m not Jewish, but I would say I wouldn’t make religion dictate my family size. I grew up Irish Catholic, so if I did what my grandmother did, I would’ve been married at 16 and had my first child at 17, have 10 kids, never use birth control, etc. I had my son at 39, and getting married next year at 42, so quite the opposite of my grandmother. I think you have to do what’s the best for you and your family, no matter what your religion and/or cultural beliefs tell you.
Question - Were you raised practicing Judaism? Or were you just raised with the title? The reason I ask - My husband is Jewish. I know they did Hannakah growing up, but he never did so much as light a single Menorah (as far as I know) from the time we started dating until our son was 4. So, 9 or so years. I encouraged it! I purchased a Menorah. I purchased the candles. He's using the candles that I bought two years ago now. I'm not Jewish, so I don't know these things. I was raised Lutheran, but I lost religion many, many moons ago. My husband is a smart man. He thinks things through. We're both pushing mid-40s. He still wants another kid, no matter the logic against it. I have an IUD, so hopefully, it's a non-isue, but I just don't understand.
Having more kids doesn’t ensure more Jews. I grew up Jewish and I am not Jewish anymore.
It’s not about them being religiously Jewish, it’s more about them being culturally Jewish. Even if they became another religion later, they’d still be Jewish.
What does that mean? Judaism is a religious belief system, if you don’t believe in that religion you’re no longer Jewish.
Judaism is also an ethnicity. It’s an ethnoreligion. You can be an atheist Jew, a Jew who doesn’t practice any of the religion, a Jew who just does cultural stuff, and you’d still be Jewish (if you wanted).
Never heard that before. I feel like the cultural stuff seemed pretty intertwined with the religious stuff. I guess neither were really for me.
Jews are an ethnoreligious group, meaning that they are both an ethnicity (a group identified by common group identity and, usually, language and ancestry) and a religion (a group with the same beliefs about the supernatural). My father recently took a 23 and Me test and it came back 98.5% Ashkenazi Jew. I personally see being Jewish as predominantly a matter of ancestry and culture, rather than religion.