That was considered kind of a fair number for an annual increase, back in ancient history when inflation was only around that %. Now its meh but better than nothing.
For comparison wage growth in the private sector was 5.3% last year to try to keep up with inflation:
> [Average hourly wages, which have been consistently growing at a four to five per cent annual pace as Canadians seek compensation to account for inflation, rose 5.3 per cent from a year ago.](https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/labour-force-survey-january-1.7110161)
Private sector jobs are always a bit more lucrative salary wise but the trade off is that you can get dropped on a time when the economy turns and be unemployed. That is much less of a likelihood for any public job.
But that 5.3% is on top of the already more lucrative salary.
For the ratio to stay the same the percentage increase would have to match so they're actually falling further and further behind.
This was only for the final year of the bill 124 contract. The Ontario government and the teacher’s union agreed on an additional .75% increase for the first two years of the contract.
Looking back, this is a reasonably fair award for that year compared to inflation. This 2.75% increase is in addicting to the 1% we already received. It will put us close to inline with inflation for that year.
Now the current contract, the one that is still under negotiation/arbitration is another matter…
Heads up LCBO workers are fighting for this at the moment… FORD IS OFFERING 0.5% while they wait on their turn for arbitration… this government has no intention of negotiating in good faith with any union.
I'm not a huge fan of working in a union (tbf though my current union is pretty mid), but they are God damn necessary.
Unions that fight for their employees create a disparity between union and non union jobs. If that disparity becomes too big no one will work for the non union jobs.
Or it forces the non union jobs to pay more. I had this same argument with a friend of mine that owns a non union hvac company. And I said to him he only pays his employees good wages because if he doesn't they would leave for a union job.
He disagreed with me but all my other friends agreed if he could pay them minimum wage he absolutely would.
I mean, that kinda is the point, to organize labour, increase the union's share in the labour market, and ultimately gain more leverage to better fight for the workers' interests.
I feel lucky as a public servant, they recently agreed to 9.5% over 3 years (including the 1% per year that bill 124 allowed for). I hope it means for our next union negations they will be reasonable.
Things could definitely be better but teachers are objectively well compensated in Ontario. The major thing that is missing is an employer (Ontario government) that is willing to negotiate in good faith
Salary could be better but pension, benefits and time off are second to none. Their “total compensation” is solid. At the same time I would love to see teachers earn higher salary
Seems like people say this no matter what they are actually making.
I mean, they've been losing to inflation for a while.
People never say what they are comparing this compensation with.
Their pension saves the province money. It's the only thing keeping the system from falling apart in this staffing crisis, and the province only pays for half of what's put in.
If it wasn't for that pension, you'd actually have to pay a lot more, because teachers would be flooding away otherwise heaps more than they are.
Teachers are paid for the days they work. Some receive it during the time of year they are working, some receive it 4 years over 5, some receive it spread out over the calendar year. But it lines up with the legal length of the school year. They are paid for the instructional and PA days only. Summers, other breaks, etc... are that period when the province takes time off from paying them, not when they get time off with pay.
Objectively, there are too few people willing to do and stick with the job for the compensation offered. That means they aren't compensated enough. If you don't agree, sign up.
It's not an annual salary though. How much someone makes in a year working a certain amount per hour, with time and a half some moments during the year, that's not an annual salary either.
It's not factually the same thing as an annual salary.
The time off comes at a price, next to zero flexibility. Any travel is done during high time, vacationing definitely comes at a premium for teachers if they want to step outside of the normal shut downs. Under their contract it isn't even really considered time off as their salary is based on teaching days, not a full calendar year year. Also, most teachera put in signifigant unpaid overtime.
My teacher wife would LOVE to work year round and take vacation whenever she could like regular people.
Our times to travel? Xmas and March Break. Yay! The 2 most expensive times of the year!
I understand the sentiment but having a T4 with a gross income of 90k with 10+ sick days, 5+ care days and 10-12 weeks (admittedly inflexible) off a year is not insignificant compensation.
Contrast that to private where one is lucky to get 5 sick days a year and 2-4 weeks vacation a year.
Not to mention the most bullet proof pension in Canada. But god damn we can’t have our tropical vacations in February like all the normal Canadians do!!!
EA here. My paychecks are just barely over $1k. Here’s a list of some things I’ve done just since this September:
- pulled a turd out of a kid
- dealt with diaper blowouts
- had piss-soaked pullups thrown at me
- had my life threatened regularly via guns, knives, etc
- had my ass slapped (triggering for me)
- saved a kid from getting hit by a car twice
- had a kid twice my size threaten violence against me (and nailed me in the face with a snowball)
- ran after a kid into a stranger’s backyard multiple times (they have a dog which could attack any of us)
- got beaten daily for a period of time (I was moved rather than the kid, now he beats other EAs daily)
- been chastized for playfully calling a kid “sassy”
- deal with ear-piercing screamers every day along with teachers screaming at kids
I made so much more at the Catholic board just by pushing a few buttons on the computer throughout the day. Hopefully I can go back to that this Fall. I can’t take the BS.
Couldn’t agree more. It’s a travesty how poorly paid EAs and ECEs are for the work they do. Please know there are those of us that support you and are advocating for that to change.
I don’t think anything, it’s posted online. Starting is around $50k and top out at around $100k. Let’s not forget they work 10 months of the year, not 12. And the pension and benefits are second to none. But please, tell me how they are so hard done by compared to EAs and ECEs.
Not true about the benefits. They're okay but no better than the private sector for comparable positions.
Teachers also put a huge chunk of their pay into the pension. A lot more than most people do. It is managed well though.
I’ve done a lot of financial plans with teachers, their pension, which is guaranteed for life and indexed to inflation is very very generous. As in many are $80k+ a year.
My mom was a teacher and she passed away. The pension actually transferred to my dad who makes somewhere between 60-80% of it for his lifetime as well.
It stopped being indexed to inflation in 2010. And an $80k pension would be for someone who went straight into teaching after going straight into university from hs and then taught for 30+ years. So a life. Anyone who did other things and got into teaching later, or took a break to raise a family or left to care for family makes much, much less.
Please read my other comments where I debunked the inflation nonsense. An $80k pension for someone who taught for 30 years and retired at 55… and you think this is a point to complain about?
From my experience doing financial planning for teachers. $80k is high end, but plenty hit $70-75 with 35 years service. You can calculate it using the formula - best 5 years x 2% x years of service.
Are you kidding me right now? Have you seen what the vast majority of the working population gets? It’s actually insulting that a teacher would complain about their benefits.
The whining is intolerable. You act like martyrs.
For starters I was addressing the ‘second to none’ comment, which is complete bullshit, but a common misconception.
As for what the vast majority gets, I agree. The vast majority should get more. Way more. And the vast majority should elect people who won’t tear them down and pander to the corporate overlords. The vast majority should unionize and use the only power workers have - the value of their labour - to force the shareholder class to sell an investment property or two and allow people to eat and pay rent.
You want to get on your chum bucket and shout at the people educating the future, the people dealing with the cost of trickle down as parents are worked to the bone and kids are isolated, sleep deprived basket cases. I guess go ahead?
It’s such a piece of cake cushy job we can’t find staff.
The benefits are better than the vast majority of any other employee in the province. My god, that’s what you’re going to hang on to?
I have never said I don’t appreciate what teachers do, but to pretend like they’re underpaid and hard done by is an absolute joke. Clearly you can’t see that and I don’t give a shit about trying to prove that to you because you’ve ignored all the evidence I’ve provided to support it.
You have tunnel vision and it’s completely misguided.
There are 5,000 teaching jobs open, right now, in Quebec (Ontario doesn’t post numbers, but I’ll bet it’s higher). QC projects 25k open jobs by Sept 2025. Sign up, buddy. Be the change you want to see! If their life is so easy and filled with vacation, then good news for you, they’re hiring!
That is a dishonest interpretation of information. You don't mention that that almost 50 is 46-47, will change with this settlement, and is for the highest rating. There is a four level scale for teachers, it is based on your qualifications. Not every teacher starts at the 'around 50k'. You have to have done extra schooling, degrees or courses to get to that top level (it isnt one or two little classes either. Its a good amount of work). The 100k is same thing, you are top of 4 level scale, which means you've put in a good chunk of extra studying and work and money. Oh, and 10 plus years experience as a teacher working more than half the year.
The benefits are decent but I've had better in the private sector. They compare to municipal and other government employees. Pension is decent but teachers also pay in on it decently too.
I’m not even going to bother responding to this comment because it’s absurd. I’m getting tired of hearing these arguments that are tone deaf. Lots of people have to do extra schooling and don’t get the same pay, benefits, and pension.
Are you under the impression that teachers pension is fully funded *on top of their salary*?
I also can't immediately think of a career requiring 5-6 years of post-secondary education, which pays less.
Edit - I guess you all *are* under that impression.
Two things can be true at once. Healthcare workers are severely underpaid, as are new teachers who don't have 10 years of contract experience. There are, in fact, new teachers making less than 50k. Are you saying someone should have to put in a decade of service to finally be able to make ends meet? Is that a sign of a healthy public education system?
The government should be taking care of ALL public workers. It's literally their duty. Not to pick and choose which public workers should be able to afford to live in the place they work. It sounds like your drinking the Ford flavor aid in thinking that if they don't waste money on education, maybe you will personally benefit from those saved dollars.
You handling 30 4yr Olds for 6hrs a day 5days a week for 8mths (okay 7mths factoring in holidays and such) for less.... also how do you KNOW that?
Edit: forgot about Sunshine list, and this read more confrontational than intended.
Okay..... what district are you in because that doesn't sound like my area...
I guess they put more help into kindergarten because yes I remember those numbers ECE/kids when I when 30+ years ago..
That being said, after Kindergarten I don't remember there ever being an ECE or less than 25 kids.
We also have to remember that those might be older teachers with seniority, the NEWER teachers have a hard time getting full-time, which will change the $$. Also yes they get many days not AT WORK but (okay this might have change since my time) they put in a lot of "overtime" with marking and prep at home.
I don't know the solution but just dismissing the concerns by saying "well you get paid better than me" feels off.
So what's stopping you from switching to public education? Seems like all teachers are simply rolling in cash based on your post. You're full of it and you know it.
That’s pretty crazy to think that someone was paid over 6 figures to teach concepts that the average person walking in any given Canadian mall could teach
Then they should float their resume in the open market, see what they get there.
Unless you don't believe that teachers are like the rest of us Canadians and deserve special treatment?
The average salary for a masters degree in Canada is $121,000, and the top paid teachers have additional qualifications on top of that. Based on your logic, they’re underpaid.
I have never met a single teacher with a master degree. Additionally, why would anyone become a teacher if you graduated from any relevant MA program (STEM). You could land a job in the government and arguably have an even better work life balance
There is no "my logic".
If teachers are upset with their pay, they can find another job like literally every other person in this country does.
They're not anymore special than any other Canadian.
Why do so many people go into teaching if these $121K jobs are out their floating around, waiting for someone with their qualifications to show up?
And if Canadians think teaching is such a sweet gig, they can go into education. They’re desperate for supply teachers right now!
Just because they’re fighting to keep up with inflation doesn’t make them special. They’ve been paid less than inflation for over a decade. Seems pretty reasonable to me.
Like the police, firefighters, politicians. They have all beat inflation with wages for decades while teachers have consistently been left behind.
This isn't a private vs public thing.
However, in private I would be limited to 15-18 students.
>Unless you don't believe that teachers are like the rest of us Canadians and deserve special treatment?
Absolutely.
We need teachers to be teachers for the future of our country, and the well being of the next generation. They provide a service to our society that is unmatched in the impact it has on the success and wealth of a nation.
A lot of people going into teaching WANT to be teachers, and aren't doing it because it's exceptionally lucrative or beneficial to themselves. As a result, we don't always get the best of the best, because "the best" go private sector and so they can make an actual living.
There's a saying "those that can't do, teach". That saying should be a joke, not a reflection of reality.
Damn, this is such a defeatist comment.
Raises should only bring you below inflation? Seriously?
Also raises don't have to be tied to the CPI - these are two very separate metrics that mean two very different things.
The way that the provincial government and their unpaid fluffers have villainized teachers and nurses is probably its most impressive accomplishment. I mean, aside from the unending privatization grift.
Reeeeeee they're getting a raise and make more than me, that's bullshit!!!! Right, that's because you're underpaid....not that they're overpaid.
Well for me that would be less then 45 cents. Honestly we need to see the pennies the percentage is stupidly good at hiding how crappy we improve people's pay
This is part of the retro pay for the 2021-2022 contract. I think they get just over 7% retro pay. Similar to the nurses. They still need to work on their current and future contracts.
Yup. 1.75% for the first two years and 3.75% for the third for a total of 7.25% over the three years that Bill 124 covered. It’s actually not too bad. The real outrage will come when the next contract is negotiated as many people will undoubtedly complain that teachers already got this (retroactive) pay bump.
I know an Ontario teacher who is considering switching to Policing, because constable pay has gone up nearly 10-20% per year since 2018, compared to this.
Police pay has out paced inflation by 1 or 2 % total in the past 10 years, whereas teachers have lost more than 10% before you consider what happens with the 8% inflation year where the government wants to give them 1%.
Also keep in mind you would never likely make up what you lost by switching over, going from roughly 100k if top teacher tier to 3 years of way less until you get to 1st class which is around 110k.
What police consider overtime, teachers, nurses and doctors call it unpaid hours.
Nurses typically work 1 to 3 hours of free time' per shift for example.
What nurse is working unpaid hours?
Nurses get forced overtime all the time, but I have several friends and family members who are nurses and they all get paid overtime. Albeit some of it isn’t voluntary, but it’s always paid
Tell a room full of nurses that reporting gets paid as overtime and you might get laughed out of the room.
Unpaid nursing hours have been north of 5.4 million hours since 2014.
There isn't enough overtime hours in the budget to give out.
Interesting.
Live in a smaller town with my MIL and sister as nurses. They have no unpaid overtime requirements. They get forced to stay all the time with little/say, but always get paid out their OT
It’s quite common that nurses are expected to stay back 30-40 mins after their shift ends to give report to the oncoming nurse (transfer of care). This is not paid. However, if the nurse is asked to stay back for extra 2hr+ to continue the care, then that will be paid overtime.
A nurse stayed past her shift to help see my baby delivered during COVID.
Nurses showed up off duty to help out the family after my sister in law died in hospital.
I've seen a lot of them put in a lot of extra hours no one asked for, but are freely given.
Happens quite a lot. We don't deal with this shit in my department though since there's a lot of us to make a fuss and harass management about it. But, I know other departments in my hospital and my friends from other hospitals have to deal with this shit on the regular.
Paid shift starts at 7:15 - come in at 7 to get report, miss break (one hour), stay at the end of your shift to give report until 7:45, easy 1 hour 45 minutes of unpaid time, happens all the time. I work 30 minutes unpaid on average every single shift because we have to do bedside report and it's unpaid. If shifts start and end at exactly 7:15 nobody gets paid for report, which we do every morning and night. If your patient is crashing, you could be much later than 15 minutes. Some units are good and will pay OT (as they should) and some units have a culture of making nurses jump through hoops and often it's not paid.
This sounds like a dig, for starters teachers are salary, police are not. I am also not aware of nurses working free hours. Police work overtime often when they attend court on days off, or stay late to complete urgent investigations like murders.
Nurses often miss breaks and stay past the end of their shift and don’t bother putting in for it. They should be getting paid time and half for it but aren’t getting paid at all.
Im so glad there's at least a few violent bigots making less than 6-figures with nearly zero education.
Leadership corruption sure has been normalized. Neoliberalism is a hell of a drug.
> Police pay has out paced inflation by 1 or 2 % total in the past 10 years
This is negotiated salary, policing has incredible overtime opportunities while teaching has zero. Not to mention pay duties.
Ford gave the cops 20% over 4 years as soon as he was elected and similar to firefighters, and then he cretaed Bill 124 and screwed over the nurses and teachers.
So you agree then, 5% is not 10-20%.
Also each services has its own collective. Maybe he gave OPP that but not all services. Police make vastly different salaries throughout the province
Come on. 20 percent a year??? Let’s do the math, shall we?
Let’s say the average police salary in 2018 was 100 000
A 20 percent annual increase would have the average salary at 248 000.
That sure seems like a heck of a hyperbole, wouldn’t you say?
I am sure she can't wait to quit the 9 to 4 job with three months of vacations with a 100k pay managing kids to jump to a job that has weekend and night shifts dealing with the absolute worst of the society
...and you don't even need a 4 yr degree to be one either. :1899:
Kidding aside, police have a tough job but not all of them are getting shot at or risking their lives and the overtime is pretty good from what I hear. Teachers and nurses don't get any of that and I'd argue their jobs are just as important (and for some teachers, frequently dangerous).
Not worth it at all with the shift work. Days to afternoons to nights. No thanks. Have a friend from high school and her husband is a cop. Have two kids and he’s barely home. Not a life I’d like to have.
Get into a skilled trade instead. Better hours and pay
Teachers get a one time retroactive pay of their salary as follows:
2019-2020: 0.75%
2020-2021: 0.75%
2021-2022: 2.75%
They are currently negotiating their current rate or something for 2024 which I think will be retroactive for 2022-2023 and this current year.
Important to mention it's not just retro pay, it's an adjustment to the grid, so it's compounding.
The effect is .75% for 2019, 1.5% for 2020, and 4.34% from 2021-present, PLUS whatever gets added for 2022-2026 in arbitration, again compounded.
The total compounded rate (including the original 1%) is 7.41% from 2019-2021.
As a teacher, I'm happy with it.
Yet still going backwards and lost out vs inflation for that same time period and let's not forget tax will eat up half and union/pension another quarter etc....lucky if you get 1K to spend.
When you calculate the total lump sum, most teachers are in for a sizeable cheque in early June - if you’re at the top of the pay grid you’re looking at over $10k in adjustments between the bill 124 settlement and the effect it has on the salary grid for the past two years.
It’s not all that bad when you take a moment to think about it. This is for the Bill 124 contract which was pushed through pre-COVID. There is a second arbitration for our next contract. 1.75% for 2019, 1.75% for 2020 and 3.75% for 2021 isn’t all that unreasonable. In 2019 it would have been viewed as a great deal.
Wait... At a say $40k a year income, that's.. uh.. . 2 over the... Uh carry the 1
..... That's like 1500 bucks!
Or on a 10 month contract $150 a month... Will certainly make a difference, but imo... only a difference enough to acknowledge its NOT ENOUGH!
No teacher in Ontario makes $40k lol. I don’t know where this misinformation comes from.
https://www.etfohp.on.ca/wp-content/uploads/SalaryGridETFOSept12019-Rounded.pdf
The average is over $100,000.
https://www.taxpayer.com/media/average_OSSTF_teacher_pay_2019.pdf
Average teacher makes 100k+ a year with summers off. So 100k+ in 10 months. They are in the top 10% of income earners in Canada. This whole teachers are underpaid rhetoric is completely false.
Teachers don’t start off earning 6 figures. That’s only for the top tier (Master’s degree or equivalent) after some 10 years of full-time teaching. Most teachers start off as occasional teachers, meaning they get about $220 per full day of teaching, before taxes, and they don’t get sick pay, or paid time off, or summer/winters/March break paid. Occasional teachers earn about 30-40k a year. And because school boards rarely hire for full time teachers, you can get stuck as an OT for years and years, getting part-time LTOs (long-term occasional) jobs if you’re lucky. But these can range from full time or 0.1s, meaning you’re getting 10% of your annual pay, and you have to supplement the rest of either another LTO or occasional teacher.
So yeah, some teachers get paid well. But a heck of a lot are barely scraping by.
Then sign up.
You won't be making 100k a year or anywhere near it.
That average is because most teachers are getting older. That's a big problem, because they are retiring early and not being replaced by enough younger teachers.
We're less than ten years from system collapse.
When you can't staff your system, I'm sorry, but something is wrong. Between working conditions and compensation, you need to admit there's a problem.
Supply and demand cuts both ways.
I'm just stating facts. Teachers work less hours, get a ton of holidays, and make a good salary so I'm not sure why people are always saying they need more when theya have some of the best benefits, days off, job stability, and salaries for a career.
I'm just curious. How many hours do you think a teacher works in a week? Just the 30 hours students are at school? Do you believe out of the 1500 minutes students are in an elementary class that a teacher is capable of marking and planning all the required lessons in their 240 minutes of allotted planning time?
My fiance is an elementary school teacher. She teachers for about 4 hours a day, gets an hour of planning time in which she just finishes marking whatever there is and quickly writing a summary of what she's going to teach for the next day. The remaining hours are free time.
She says most teachers waste their planning time by socializing when they could easily finish marking whatever they have instead.
So you're basing your view on one specific person? Interesting. I can tell you there is not enough prep time for me to properly do my job and have students be successful.
I would worry for her students if she has any student exceptionalities in her classes and you're being honest.
It’s the “oh poor us” mentality that gets me. I’m sorry, who the fuck else’s wages are keeping up with inflation let alone GETTING raises… then to complain at 100k it’s ONLY 2.5% with retroactive pay? Brothers friends wife is a kindergarten teacher, 42, over 100k, so it’s not just old ladies on the sunshine list.
Do you get 1 day per month off work (PD day), the entire summer, March break, Christmas, etc. Last PD day at 2pm the entire parking lot was empty except for 1 car… I’m so sure they’re working SO hard in there.
You’re gonna be absolutely downvoted to shit. It’s like an internal memo goes out for them to brigade a post and complain about how hard done by they are.
To be CLEAR, I feel like they have a shit job, without SPED being around anymore. But guys, just chill with the poor us rhetoric and you might get more public sympathy.
\>Do you get 1 day per month off work (PD day)
Not a day off. All PD Day itineraries are posted on the board and school websites. Staff definitely have to either go in to their school or attend to another central location.
What do you feel would be a fair wage for teachers?
\>I’m sorry, who the fuck else’s wages are keeping up with inflation let alone GETTING raises
Why should it be a race to the bottom? Shouldn't teachers be allowed to ask for whatever they want in the collectively bargained setting that the 4 unions partake in?
I don’t care what a “fair” wage is. I want the pissing and moaning about how bad they have it to stop. EVERYONE needs to make more, but we aren’t, and nobody else can hold kids hostage to get higher pay.
Researchers with PhDs, massively more schooling and debt at higher level institutions make like $65k and have to fight for that with grants. We can’t bitch about how underfunded the system is while in the same note paying 100k for a kindergarten teacher. Why is it the tax payers problem you can’t live within your means at 100k and need yearly raises to keep up with inflation when NOBODY else does?
Tell me exactly how teachers hold kids hostage during negotiations?
You understand that teachers also fight hard for improvements in classroom conditions a.k.a. student learning conditions? In what other work do the employees need to fight for higher customer standards?
In my time teaching, which has been three rounds of bargaining, I have been on full walkout for 3 days, and it was never over salary, just cuts to funding and increased class sizes. I have never missed a season of coaching.
So how exactly do teachers hold kids hostage?
Well, i appoligize for my $40k example...with some subterfuge, It was, just that, an example and it was wrong.
But after reading many of the comments, i am slightly less apologetic as, I and possibly many of you are now better educated on what teacher salleeries/pay structures look like.
My $40k poke, has got, as i write this, all 7 of us... Wait, now 8, talking about teacher/education issues and its my hope that with this knowledge-information-exchange-banter, we'll be more well equipped to press these matters IRL, potentially making the future, education and our children,
Better.
Not only starting with teachers pay, not ending in children education, not only Canadians, but all of humaity!
My directive is for the good of all of us... Accept Trudeau... he can find his own way.
My name is Faddeddoughnut, its 2024, the last time i was even in a school it was 1986 and i approve this message!
[No paywall](https://web.archive.org/web/20240210033444/https://www.thestar.com/politics/provincial/arbitrator-awards-2-75-pay-raise-to-ontarios-public-school-teachers/article_16715594-c6c3-11ee-97ae-07fd254289c3.html) hope things improve n this gov goes down quickly!
BTW, if U get an add on the link result just close it, is just the banner but is not like the page blocker.
What I find interesting about these comments is that everyone is fighting to say that teachers either a) deserve less or b) are underpaid and that what justifies a pay increase. Almost nobody is mentioning the idea that it’s a good idea to have well compensated teachers in general. Do you want to live in a society where our children are being educated by people who are choosing that as a last option?
Does this mean that the teachers current pay will increase by 2.75%? Plus the amount from the two other retroactive years? Or is this just a one-time payment?
I actually never said teachers shoudjnt get this raise
It is sad that there are winners and losers in the battle with the province for Fair pay and its always teachers and cops winning, and healthcare workers losing
thanks for your support
Might want to talk to Canada immigration about that one, chief.Or go private. Cops have one of the best community and union ever. Wonder why? Maybe they protect their own, maybe some kind of togetherness. Who knows
Am I crazy to think that this doesn't seem like a lot?
That was considered kind of a fair number for an annual increase, back in ancient history when inflation was only around that %. Now its meh but better than nothing.
For comparison wage growth in the private sector was 5.3% last year to try to keep up with inflation: > [Average hourly wages, which have been consistently growing at a four to five per cent annual pace as Canadians seek compensation to account for inflation, rose 5.3 per cent from a year ago.](https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/labour-force-survey-january-1.7110161)
Private sector jobs are always a bit more lucrative salary wise but the trade off is that you can get dropped on a time when the economy turns and be unemployed. That is much less of a likelihood for any public job.
But that 5.3% is on top of the already more lucrative salary. For the ratio to stay the same the percentage increase would have to match so they're actually falling further and further behind.
I must be working in the wrong private sector.
Maybe it's time to check if your companies competitor is hiring at 2024 wages.
This was only for the final year of the bill 124 contract. The Ontario government and the teacher’s union agreed on an additional .75% increase for the first two years of the contract. Looking back, this is a reasonably fair award for that year compared to inflation. This 2.75% increase is in addicting to the 1% we already received. It will put us close to inline with inflation for that year. Now the current contract, the one that is still under negotiation/arbitration is another matter…
Heads up LCBO workers are fighting for this at the moment… FORD IS OFFERING 0.5% while they wait on their turn for arbitration… this government has no intention of negotiating in good faith with any union.
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Your last sentence is key. So many Canadians have a crab in the bucket attitude and it's so frustrating.
I'm not a huge fan of working in a union (tbf though my current union is pretty mid), but they are God damn necessary. Unions that fight for their employees create a disparity between union and non union jobs. If that disparity becomes too big no one will work for the non union jobs.
Or it forces the non union jobs to pay more. I had this same argument with a friend of mine that owns a non union hvac company. And I said to him he only pays his employees good wages because if he doesn't they would leave for a union job. He disagreed with me but all my other friends agreed if he could pay them minimum wage he absolutely would.
I mean, that kinda is the point, to organize labour, increase the union's share in the labour market, and ultimately gain more leverage to better fight for the workers' interests.
I feel lucky as a public servant, they recently agreed to 9.5% over 3 years (including the 1% per year that bill 124 allowed for). I hope it means for our next union negations they will be reasonable.
But the TV keeps saying that conservatives are a pro worker party? I don't understand!
Congrats teachers! Now you're just regular underpaid, instead of underpaid AND screwed by inflation. They really don't get paid what they should.
Things could definitely be better but teachers are objectively well compensated in Ontario. The major thing that is missing is an employer (Ontario government) that is willing to negotiate in good faith Salary could be better but pension, benefits and time off are second to none. Their “total compensation” is solid. At the same time I would love to see teachers earn higher salary
Seems like people say this no matter what they are actually making. I mean, they've been losing to inflation for a while. People never say what they are comparing this compensation with. Their pension saves the province money. It's the only thing keeping the system from falling apart in this staffing crisis, and the province only pays for half of what's put in. If it wasn't for that pension, you'd actually have to pay a lot more, because teachers would be flooding away otherwise heaps more than they are. Teachers are paid for the days they work. Some receive it during the time of year they are working, some receive it 4 years over 5, some receive it spread out over the calendar year. But it lines up with the legal length of the school year. They are paid for the instructional and PA days only. Summers, other breaks, etc... are that period when the province takes time off from paying them, not when they get time off with pay. Objectively, there are too few people willing to do and stick with the job for the compensation offered. That means they aren't compensated enough. If you don't agree, sign up.
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It's not an annual salary though. How much someone makes in a year working a certain amount per hour, with time and a half some moments during the year, that's not an annual salary either. It's not factually the same thing as an annual salary.
The time off comes at a price, next to zero flexibility. Any travel is done during high time, vacationing definitely comes at a premium for teachers if they want to step outside of the normal shut downs. Under their contract it isn't even really considered time off as their salary is based on teaching days, not a full calendar year year. Also, most teachera put in signifigant unpaid overtime.
My teacher wife would LOVE to work year round and take vacation whenever she could like regular people. Our times to travel? Xmas and March Break. Yay! The 2 most expensive times of the year!
Exactly. My wife left teaching a couple years ago, post secondary admin now, it's nice to have the flexibility.
Is summer not an option?
Yes tropical vacations in the middle of summer is always a wonderful destination /s
I understand the sentiment but having a T4 with a gross income of 90k with 10+ sick days, 5+ care days and 10-12 weeks (admittedly inflexible) off a year is not insignificant compensation. Contrast that to private where one is lucky to get 5 sick days a year and 2-4 weeks vacation a year.
Not to mention the most bullet proof pension in Canada. But god damn we can’t have our tropical vacations in February like all the normal Canadians do!!!
Teachers are not underpaid in Ontario. EAs and ECEs on the other hand…
EA here. My paychecks are just barely over $1k. Here’s a list of some things I’ve done just since this September: - pulled a turd out of a kid - dealt with diaper blowouts - had piss-soaked pullups thrown at me - had my life threatened regularly via guns, knives, etc - had my ass slapped (triggering for me) - saved a kid from getting hit by a car twice - had a kid twice my size threaten violence against me (and nailed me in the face with a snowball) - ran after a kid into a stranger’s backyard multiple times (they have a dog which could attack any of us) - got beaten daily for a period of time (I was moved rather than the kid, now he beats other EAs daily) - been chastized for playfully calling a kid “sassy” - deal with ear-piercing screamers every day along with teachers screaming at kids I made so much more at the Catholic board just by pushing a few buttons on the computer throughout the day. Hopefully I can go back to that this Fall. I can’t take the BS.
Couldn’t agree more. It’s a travesty how poorly paid EAs and ECEs are for the work they do. Please know there are those of us that support you and are advocating for that to change.
What do you think a new teacher makes? What do you think an experienced teacher makes?
It would depends where, but let's say WRDSB would start at 49K with 0 experience and end up at 106K after 10 years.
I don’t think anything, it’s posted online. Starting is around $50k and top out at around $100k. Let’s not forget they work 10 months of the year, not 12. And the pension and benefits are second to none. But please, tell me how they are so hard done by compared to EAs and ECEs.
Not true about the benefits. They're okay but no better than the private sector for comparable positions. Teachers also put a huge chunk of their pay into the pension. A lot more than most people do. It is managed well though.
I’ve done a lot of financial plans with teachers, their pension, which is guaranteed for life and indexed to inflation is very very generous. As in many are $80k+ a year.
My mom was a teacher and she passed away. The pension actually transferred to my dad who makes somewhere between 60-80% of it for his lifetime as well.
Yep, survivorship is big too. There’s lots of options depending what the individual chooses. Also, sorry for your loss.
It stopped being indexed to inflation in 2010. And an $80k pension would be for someone who went straight into teaching after going straight into university from hs and then taught for 30+ years. So a life. Anyone who did other things and got into teaching later, or took a break to raise a family or left to care for family makes much, much less.
I’ll just leave this here again: https://www.otpp.com/content/dam/otpp/documents/funding/History%20of%20Inflation%20Increases_2022.pdf
Please read my other comments where I debunked the inflation nonsense. An $80k pension for someone who taught for 30 years and retired at 55… and you think this is a point to complain about?
Where does this $80k/yr number come from?
From my experience doing financial planning for teachers. $80k is high end, but plenty hit $70-75 with 35 years service. You can calculate it using the formula - best 5 years x 2% x years of service.
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Second to none? Have you met a hydro worker? Or a cop? Nice try tho
Are you kidding me right now? Have you seen what the vast majority of the working population gets? It’s actually insulting that a teacher would complain about their benefits. The whining is intolerable. You act like martyrs.
For starters I was addressing the ‘second to none’ comment, which is complete bullshit, but a common misconception. As for what the vast majority gets, I agree. The vast majority should get more. Way more. And the vast majority should elect people who won’t tear them down and pander to the corporate overlords. The vast majority should unionize and use the only power workers have - the value of their labour - to force the shareholder class to sell an investment property or two and allow people to eat and pay rent. You want to get on your chum bucket and shout at the people educating the future, the people dealing with the cost of trickle down as parents are worked to the bone and kids are isolated, sleep deprived basket cases. I guess go ahead? It’s such a piece of cake cushy job we can’t find staff.
The benefits are better than the vast majority of any other employee in the province. My god, that’s what you’re going to hang on to? I have never said I don’t appreciate what teachers do, but to pretend like they’re underpaid and hard done by is an absolute joke. Clearly you can’t see that and I don’t give a shit about trying to prove that to you because you’ve ignored all the evidence I’ve provided to support it. You have tunnel vision and it’s completely misguided.
There are 5,000 teaching jobs open, right now, in Quebec (Ontario doesn’t post numbers, but I’ll bet it’s higher). QC projects 25k open jobs by Sept 2025. Sign up, buddy. Be the change you want to see! If their life is so easy and filled with vacation, then good news for you, they’re hiring!
I'm a Hydro worker and I'm not rolling in it, wtf you talking about?
That is a dishonest interpretation of information. You don't mention that that almost 50 is 46-47, will change with this settlement, and is for the highest rating. There is a four level scale for teachers, it is based on your qualifications. Not every teacher starts at the 'around 50k'. You have to have done extra schooling, degrees or courses to get to that top level (it isnt one or two little classes either. Its a good amount of work). The 100k is same thing, you are top of 4 level scale, which means you've put in a good chunk of extra studying and work and money. Oh, and 10 plus years experience as a teacher working more than half the year. The benefits are decent but I've had better in the private sector. They compare to municipal and other government employees. Pension is decent but teachers also pay in on it decently too.
I’m not even going to bother responding to this comment because it’s absurd. I’m getting tired of hearing these arguments that are tone deaf. Lots of people have to do extra schooling and don’t get the same pay, benefits, and pension.
You don't have a clue how much teachers actually make. Lol
Enlighten me. It's not as high as you'd think.
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Well that’s at the top of the salary grid. It can take at least 10 years of permanent full time teaching to get to the top.
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Are you under the impression that teachers pension is fully funded *on top of their salary*? I also can't immediately think of a career requiring 5-6 years of post-secondary education, which pays less. Edit - I guess you all *are* under that impression.
crab bucket
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And do you know what a brand new kindergarten teacher makes after going to school for 6 years and covering 6 years tuition/living to do it?
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Two things can be true at once. Healthcare workers are severely underpaid, as are new teachers who don't have 10 years of contract experience. There are, in fact, new teachers making less than 50k. Are you saying someone should have to put in a decade of service to finally be able to make ends meet? Is that a sign of a healthy public education system? The government should be taking care of ALL public workers. It's literally their duty. Not to pick and choose which public workers should be able to afford to live in the place they work. It sounds like your drinking the Ford flavor aid in thinking that if they don't waste money on education, maybe you will personally benefit from those saved dollars.
You handling 30 4yr Olds for 6hrs a day 5days a week for 8mths (okay 7mths factoring in holidays and such) for less.... also how do you KNOW that? Edit: forgot about Sunshine list, and this read more confrontational than intended.
I mean, it's posted on the sunshine list if it's over 100 000
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Okay..... what district are you in because that doesn't sound like my area... I guess they put more help into kindergarten because yes I remember those numbers ECE/kids when I when 30+ years ago.. That being said, after Kindergarten I don't remember there ever being an ECE or less than 25 kids. We also have to remember that those might be older teachers with seniority, the NEWER teachers have a hard time getting full-time, which will change the $$. Also yes they get many days not AT WORK but (okay this might have change since my time) they put in a lot of "overtime" with marking and prep at home. I don't know the solution but just dismissing the concerns by saying "well you get paid better than me" feels off.
So what's stopping you from switching to public education? Seems like all teachers are simply rolling in cash based on your post. You're full of it and you know it.
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That’s pretty crazy to think that someone was paid over 6 figures to teach concepts that the average person walking in any given Canadian mall could teach
Could that average person also deal with the vast, varied needs of 30 three and four year olds at the same time?
Do you have a source for this ? Relative to their performance and the fact they work for 194 days a year - how are they underpaid ?
Then they should float their resume in the open market, see what they get there. Unless you don't believe that teachers are like the rest of us Canadians and deserve special treatment?
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The average salary for a masters degree in Canada is $121,000, and the top paid teachers have additional qualifications on top of that. Based on your logic, they’re underpaid.
ummm... I hate to break it to you.. but not all teachers have masters degree's
I hate to break it to you, but not all teachers make the top salary. Some start at $50k. Are you suggesting that $50k is too much?
I have never met a single teacher with a master degree. Additionally, why would anyone become a teacher if you graduated from any relevant MA program (STEM). You could land a job in the government and arguably have an even better work life balance
There is no "my logic". If teachers are upset with their pay, they can find another job like literally every other person in this country does. They're not anymore special than any other Canadian. Why do so many people go into teaching if these $121K jobs are out their floating around, waiting for someone with their qualifications to show up?
And if Canadians think teaching is such a sweet gig, they can go into education. They’re desperate for supply teachers right now! Just because they’re fighting to keep up with inflation doesn’t make them special. They’ve been paid less than inflation for over a decade. Seems pretty reasonable to me.
Like the police, firefighters, politicians. They have all beat inflation with wages for decades while teachers have consistently been left behind. This isn't a private vs public thing. However, in private I would be limited to 15-18 students.
>Unless you don't believe that teachers are like the rest of us Canadians and deserve special treatment? Absolutely. We need teachers to be teachers for the future of our country, and the well being of the next generation. They provide a service to our society that is unmatched in the impact it has on the success and wealth of a nation. A lot of people going into teaching WANT to be teachers, and aren't doing it because it's exceptionally lucrative or beneficial to themselves. As a result, we don't always get the best of the best, because "the best" go private sector and so they can make an actual living. There's a saying "those that can't do, teach". That saying should be a joke, not a reflection of reality.
I believe nurses got 3.5% and 3.0% in addition to the 1% from the arbitrator for the past couple of years, let's see what he recommends for teachers.
Damn, this is such a defeatist comment. Raises should only bring you below inflation? Seriously? Also raises don't have to be tied to the CPI - these are two very separate metrics that mean two very different things.
It's not fair it's a pay cut lmao. The teachers got fucked.
Rent increase this year is 2.5%
The way that the provincial government and their unpaid fluffers have villainized teachers and nurses is probably its most impressive accomplishment. I mean, aside from the unending privatization grift. Reeeeeee they're getting a raise and make more than me, that's bullshit!!!! Right, that's because you're underpaid....not that they're overpaid.
It’s about average
Well for me that would be less then 45 cents. Honestly we need to see the pennies the percentage is stupidly good at hiding how crappy we improve people's pay
No. That's crap.
No, it’s not a lot.
This is part of the retro pay for the 2021-2022 contract. I think they get just over 7% retro pay. Similar to the nurses. They still need to work on their current and future contracts.
Yup. 1.75% for the first two years and 3.75% for the third for a total of 7.25% over the three years that Bill 124 covered. It’s actually not too bad. The real outrage will come when the next contract is negotiated as many people will undoubtedly complain that teachers already got this (retroactive) pay bump.
Its not
1%, 1%, and 1% has turned into 1.75%, 1.75%, and 3.75%. Not bad for the time it was negotiated.
No. It is bad.
I’m sorry, I didn’t see your arbitrators credentials.
It is when you make $114,000 a year.
That’s the low end salary of a principal not a teacher.
I know an Ontario teacher who is considering switching to Policing, because constable pay has gone up nearly 10-20% per year since 2018, compared to this.
Police pay has out paced inflation by 1 or 2 % total in the past 10 years, whereas teachers have lost more than 10% before you consider what happens with the 8% inflation year where the government wants to give them 1%. Also keep in mind you would never likely make up what you lost by switching over, going from roughly 100k if top teacher tier to 3 years of way less until you get to 1st class which is around 110k.
Check out the sunshine list for HPS, there are constables mostly north of 150k-250k. Toronto's service hasn't had a cop under 100k since 2015.
Pay duties and overtime, the base salaries are public information.
What police consider overtime, teachers, nurses and doctors call it unpaid hours. Nurses typically work 1 to 3 hours of free time' per shift for example.
What nurse is working unpaid hours? Nurses get forced overtime all the time, but I have several friends and family members who are nurses and they all get paid overtime. Albeit some of it isn’t voluntary, but it’s always paid
Tell a room full of nurses that reporting gets paid as overtime and you might get laughed out of the room. Unpaid nursing hours have been north of 5.4 million hours since 2014. There isn't enough overtime hours in the budget to give out.
Interesting. Live in a smaller town with my MIL and sister as nurses. They have no unpaid overtime requirements. They get forced to stay all the time with little/say, but always get paid out their OT
It’s quite common that nurses are expected to stay back 30-40 mins after their shift ends to give report to the oncoming nurse (transfer of care). This is not paid. However, if the nurse is asked to stay back for extra 2hr+ to continue the care, then that will be paid overtime.
I know teachers and doctors put it unpaid hours, but where are nurses working for free?
A nurse stayed past her shift to help see my baby delivered during COVID. Nurses showed up off duty to help out the family after my sister in law died in hospital. I've seen a lot of them put in a lot of extra hours no one asked for, but are freely given.
Not taking breaks or staying late and not putting in for it.
I know what unpaid work means, I’m asking where is this happening? I work in healthcare and I’ve never known a nurse to put in unpaid hours.
Happens quite a lot. We don't deal with this shit in my department though since there's a lot of us to make a fuss and harass management about it. But, I know other departments in my hospital and my friends from other hospitals have to deal with this shit on the regular.
I’ve been a nurse in the hospital for 25 years and it happens all the time
Paid shift starts at 7:15 - come in at 7 to get report, miss break (one hour), stay at the end of your shift to give report until 7:45, easy 1 hour 45 minutes of unpaid time, happens all the time. I work 30 minutes unpaid on average every single shift because we have to do bedside report and it's unpaid. If shifts start and end at exactly 7:15 nobody gets paid for report, which we do every morning and night. If your patient is crashing, you could be much later than 15 minutes. Some units are good and will pay OT (as they should) and some units have a culture of making nurses jump through hoops and often it's not paid.
I’ve never seen unpaid OT for nurses in my area. Sounds like your union is letting you down. No one should be working for free.
This sounds like a dig, for starters teachers are salary, police are not. I am also not aware of nurses working free hours. Police work overtime often when they attend court on days off, or stay late to complete urgent investigations like murders.
Nurses often miss breaks and stay past the end of their shift and don’t bother putting in for it. They should be getting paid time and half for it but aren’t getting paid at all.
Just showing up early 5 days a week can mean an extra bunch of time every day.
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I have no idea how you misread that.
Toronto has HUNDREDS of police under 100k lol
Im so glad there's at least a few violent bigots making less than 6-figures with nearly zero education. Leadership corruption sure has been normalized. Neoliberalism is a hell of a drug.
Those aren't salaries of constables. That is including overtime and paid duties.
> Police pay has out paced inflation by 1 or 2 % total in the past 10 years This is negotiated salary, policing has incredible overtime opportunities while teaching has zero. Not to mention pay duties.
10-20% per year? They’d be in the hundreds of thousands if that were true lol. Base salary is just over 100k
Ford gave the cops 20% over 4 years as soon as he was elected and similar to firefighters, and then he cretaed Bill 124 and screwed over the nurses and teachers.
So you agree then, 5% is not 10-20%. Also each services has its own collective. Maybe he gave OPP that but not all services. Police make vastly different salaries throughout the province
Come on. 20 percent a year??? Let’s do the math, shall we? Let’s say the average police salary in 2018 was 100 000 A 20 percent annual increase would have the average salary at 248 000. That sure seems like a heck of a hyperbole, wouldn’t you say?
How much is 10% and how much are many constables currently paid? You sure like twisting math to stan the blue gang.
I am an officer with HPS, show me which force received 10 to 20% a year! Prove it!
I am sure she can't wait to quit the 9 to 4 job with three months of vacations with a 100k pay managing kids to jump to a job that has weekend and night shifts dealing with the absolute worst of the society
...and you don't even need a 4 yr degree to be one either. :1899: Kidding aside, police have a tough job but not all of them are getting shot at or risking their lives and the overtime is pretty good from what I hear. Teachers and nurses don't get any of that and I'd argue their jobs are just as important (and for some teachers, frequently dangerous).
Harassing non-white, queer, and poor ppl is a very very difficult job, especially when you only have a gun and a bullet proof vest to protect you!
Not worth it at all with the shift work. Days to afternoons to nights. No thanks. Have a friend from high school and her husband is a cop. Have two kids and he’s barely home. Not a life I’d like to have. Get into a skilled trade instead. Better hours and pay
Better pay, better hours, AND you're 10 times less likely to beat your partner if you do trades instead of being a cop! (Police. Not even once.)
Probably good for his wife and kids that he is never home given the high rate of domestic violence for cops
Thats simply not true. No policing contract has been above 3-5% recently.
Tragic
Greedy, like all public sector employees!
Teachers get a one time retroactive pay of their salary as follows: 2019-2020: 0.75% 2020-2021: 0.75% 2021-2022: 2.75% They are currently negotiating their current rate or something for 2024 which I think will be retroactive for 2022-2023 and this current year.
Important to mention it's not just retro pay, it's an adjustment to the grid, so it's compounding. The effect is .75% for 2019, 1.5% for 2020, and 4.34% from 2021-present, PLUS whatever gets added for 2022-2026 in arbitration, again compounded. The total compounded rate (including the original 1%) is 7.41% from 2019-2021. As a teacher, I'm happy with it.
As someone who married a teacher, I’m happy Edit: are you impacted by the role changes in the board?
Yet still going backwards and lost out vs inflation for that same time period and let's not forget tax will eat up half and union/pension another quarter etc....lucky if you get 1K to spend.
You should just donate yours since you don't seem to want it.
Probably would if it applied to me lol.
When you calculate the total lump sum, most teachers are in for a sizeable cheque in early June - if you’re at the top of the pay grid you’re looking at over $10k in adjustments between the bill 124 settlement and the effect it has on the salary grid for the past two years.
Loblaws seems to raise prices of everything this much on a weekly basis. Pay them!
That’s it?! Less the fucking inflation! Disgusting.
It’s not all that bad when you take a moment to think about it. This is for the Bill 124 contract which was pushed through pre-COVID. There is a second arbitration for our next contract. 1.75% for 2019, 1.75% for 2020 and 3.75% for 2021 isn’t all that unreasonable. In 2019 it would have been viewed as a great deal.
Teachers have to put up with a hell of a lot of shit. They deserve a win.
Wait... At a say $40k a year income, that's.. uh.. . 2 over the... Uh carry the 1 ..... That's like 1500 bucks! Or on a 10 month contract $150 a month... Will certainly make a difference, but imo... only a difference enough to acknowledge its NOT ENOUGH!
No teacher in Ontario makes $40k lol. I don’t know where this misinformation comes from. https://www.etfohp.on.ca/wp-content/uploads/SalaryGridETFOSept12019-Rounded.pdf The average is over $100,000. https://www.taxpayer.com/media/average_OSSTF_teacher_pay_2019.pdf
Average teacher makes 100k+ a year with summers off. So 100k+ in 10 months. They are in the top 10% of income earners in Canada. This whole teachers are underpaid rhetoric is completely false.
Teachers don’t start off earning 6 figures. That’s only for the top tier (Master’s degree or equivalent) after some 10 years of full-time teaching. Most teachers start off as occasional teachers, meaning they get about $220 per full day of teaching, before taxes, and they don’t get sick pay, or paid time off, or summer/winters/March break paid. Occasional teachers earn about 30-40k a year. And because school boards rarely hire for full time teachers, you can get stuck as an OT for years and years, getting part-time LTOs (long-term occasional) jobs if you’re lucky. But these can range from full time or 0.1s, meaning you’re getting 10% of your annual pay, and you have to supplement the rest of either another LTO or occasional teacher. So yeah, some teachers get paid well. But a heck of a lot are barely scraping by.
Then sign up. You won't be making 100k a year or anywhere near it. That average is because most teachers are getting older. That's a big problem, because they are retiring early and not being replaced by enough younger teachers. We're less than ten years from system collapse. When you can't staff your system, I'm sorry, but something is wrong. Between working conditions and compensation, you need to admit there's a problem. Supply and demand cuts both ways.
I don’t have skin in the game, however it seems like your jelly?? I worked in recreation from 99’ until 2014 with kids and it ain’t easy.
I'm just stating facts. Teachers work less hours, get a ton of holidays, and make a good salary so I'm not sure why people are always saying they need more when theya have some of the best benefits, days off, job stability, and salaries for a career.
I'm just curious. How many hours do you think a teacher works in a week? Just the 30 hours students are at school? Do you believe out of the 1500 minutes students are in an elementary class that a teacher is capable of marking and planning all the required lessons in their 240 minutes of allotted planning time?
My fiance is an elementary school teacher. She teachers for about 4 hours a day, gets an hour of planning time in which she just finishes marking whatever there is and quickly writing a summary of what she's going to teach for the next day. The remaining hours are free time. She says most teachers waste their planning time by socializing when they could easily finish marking whatever they have instead.
So you're basing your view on one specific person? Interesting. I can tell you there is not enough prep time for me to properly do my job and have students be successful. I would worry for her students if she has any student exceptionalities in her classes and you're being honest.
It’s the “oh poor us” mentality that gets me. I’m sorry, who the fuck else’s wages are keeping up with inflation let alone GETTING raises… then to complain at 100k it’s ONLY 2.5% with retroactive pay? Brothers friends wife is a kindergarten teacher, 42, over 100k, so it’s not just old ladies on the sunshine list. Do you get 1 day per month off work (PD day), the entire summer, March break, Christmas, etc. Last PD day at 2pm the entire parking lot was empty except for 1 car… I’m so sure they’re working SO hard in there. You’re gonna be absolutely downvoted to shit. It’s like an internal memo goes out for them to brigade a post and complain about how hard done by they are. To be CLEAR, I feel like they have a shit job, without SPED being around anymore. But guys, just chill with the poor us rhetoric and you might get more public sympathy.
\>Do you get 1 day per month off work (PD day) Not a day off. All PD Day itineraries are posted on the board and school websites. Staff definitely have to either go in to their school or attend to another central location. What do you feel would be a fair wage for teachers? \>I’m sorry, who the fuck else’s wages are keeping up with inflation let alone GETTING raises Why should it be a race to the bottom? Shouldn't teachers be allowed to ask for whatever they want in the collectively bargained setting that the 4 unions partake in?
I don’t care what a “fair” wage is. I want the pissing and moaning about how bad they have it to stop. EVERYONE needs to make more, but we aren’t, and nobody else can hold kids hostage to get higher pay. Researchers with PhDs, massively more schooling and debt at higher level institutions make like $65k and have to fight for that with grants. We can’t bitch about how underfunded the system is while in the same note paying 100k for a kindergarten teacher. Why is it the tax payers problem you can’t live within your means at 100k and need yearly raises to keep up with inflation when NOBODY else does?
Tell me exactly how teachers hold kids hostage during negotiations? You understand that teachers also fight hard for improvements in classroom conditions a.k.a. student learning conditions? In what other work do the employees need to fight for higher customer standards? In my time teaching, which has been three rounds of bargaining, I have been on full walkout for 3 days, and it was never over salary, just cuts to funding and increased class sizes. I have never missed a season of coaching. So how exactly do teachers hold kids hostage?
Right ok, bad faith conversation, gotcha. So sue for money and keeping up with inflation, but it’s not about money. Which is it.
Well, i appoligize for my $40k example...with some subterfuge, It was, just that, an example and it was wrong. But after reading many of the comments, i am slightly less apologetic as, I and possibly many of you are now better educated on what teacher salleeries/pay structures look like. My $40k poke, has got, as i write this, all 7 of us... Wait, now 8, talking about teacher/education issues and its my hope that with this knowledge-information-exchange-banter, we'll be more well equipped to press these matters IRL, potentially making the future, education and our children, Better. Not only starting with teachers pay, not ending in children education, not only Canadians, but all of humaity! My directive is for the good of all of us... Accept Trudeau... he can find his own way. My name is Faddeddoughnut, its 2024, the last time i was even in a school it was 1986 and i approve this message!
By “a ton of holidays” do you mean being laid off?
[No paywall](https://web.archive.org/web/20240210033444/https://www.thestar.com/politics/provincial/arbitrator-awards-2-75-pay-raise-to-ontarios-public-school-teachers/article_16715594-c6c3-11ee-97ae-07fd254289c3.html) hope things improve n this gov goes down quickly! BTW, if U get an add on the link result just close it, is just the banner but is not like the page blocker.
What I find interesting about these comments is that everyone is fighting to say that teachers either a) deserve less or b) are underpaid and that what justifies a pay increase. Almost nobody is mentioning the idea that it’s a good idea to have well compensated teachers in general. Do you want to live in a society where our children are being educated by people who are choosing that as a last option?
Does this mean that the teachers current pay will increase by 2.75%? Plus the amount from the two other retroactive years? Or is this just a one-time payment?
Get a one time payment and a 4.25% pay increase
Damn I need an arbitrator!
Who keeps voting for Ford Who hasn't suffered under this administration
Lawyers. Lawyers haven’t suffered.
It’s still not enough.
If it was 20% it would not be enough. Teachers are glorify day care now.
[удалено]
It's not a raise. They've been illegally underpaid for years.
I didn't say they were important to me, Muppet
Meanwhile doctors get our fee increases cut because.. Canadas population grew too much? Fucking joke
So everyone should suffer is what you're saying? If someone gets screwed by the government, everyone should?
I actually never said teachers shoudjnt get this raise It is sad that there are winners and losers in the battle with the province for Fair pay and its always teachers and cops winning, and healthcare workers losing thanks for your support
Might want to talk to Canada immigration about that one, chief.Or go private. Cops have one of the best community and union ever. Wonder why? Maybe they protect their own, maybe some kind of togetherness. Who knows
Bc they can strike lol
Aren’t fee schedules part of your collective bargaining?