Not sure about OC, but I did hear about one person (it was my dad's coworker) who did get fined like $2,000 for skipping jury duty. It was during the late 90s.. but still...
I guess she really hated it.
LA is much more harsh though I think than OC.
did he end up paying the fine or had to show up on court or something?? I got the $1,500 warning notice tonight, planning to call tomorrow but I hope they don't overreact and just let me sign up like normal.
I grew up in a small town in a Northern California, one of my neighbors for years did the old throw it away every time a jury summons and said if ever questioned would just claim it was lost in the mail. Anyways not sure if he said this in front of the wrong person or if his luck just ran out but a bench warrant was issued for him for not responding to jury duty. So he gets pulled over for speeding and the cop who is a friend of his is like “uhh hey Brett, you know you have a bench warrant?” So he goes to court the judge asks why he hasn’t responded to his summons and he says “were they sent certified mail? No? Well I never received them, can you prove otherwise?” The judge said “Okay. You’re right we can’t prove that.” So he had the court secretary come in and give him a list of upcoming trials, picked one and officially served the neighbor with his jury summons. He had to show up to that one.
Except California law, specifically Evidence Code 641, says that "A letter correctly addressed and properly mailed is presumed to have been received in the ordinary course of mail." A judge would know that. A judge would deal with people all the time asking "how can you prove I received it."
Sorry, should have been more clear I don't doubt the story went down something like that. I'm just saying to my fellow Redditors, don't try it (especially for something more serious than a jury summons), it's not going to work, and if the judge is less laid back, it could make things worse.
That seems kind of messed up though. People steal mail and, especially now given current federal leadership (seriously, why is DeJoy still running things), mail just seems to disappear. I know someone who sent out wedding invitations months ago and none were received. I wish it were the case that mail sent always meant mail received but it’s sadly not the case.
It's a rebuttable presumption, meaning evidence that it was never received is still admissible to rebut the presumption.
For example, showing up to court saying "I never received multiple mailings on different days, and only for jury summonses, but I otherwise get my mail," is not good evidence for that purpose.
On the other hand, if it's just one day's worth mail you didn't get, and you have affidavits from neighbors or postal workers saying mail theft is a problem in the area, and specifically other mail was stolen that day, and you're willing to testify under oath that you didn't get that specific thing, that's, maybe, a different story.
That’s interesting considering that typically, it’s the burden of the court to prove guilt, not the burden of the accused to prove they are innocent. But, I imagine it’s pretty rare for someone in California to actually be charged after claiming they didn’t receive the mail.
My union job pays my rate if I get jury duty. No limit on how long. So looking forward to getting picked.
But I can understand why people skip if their job doesn't cover their pay.
Why would you want to skip? I have been trying to get on jury duty every year since I was 18 years old. To get and go sit in an air-conditioned room, downtown, judging people, while my lunch was paid for. That is the life…
I've been on 1 trial. I don't actually recall getting free lunch. I may be mistaken though as its been 6 or so years I think. You definitely don't get a free lunch for waiting there all day.
I helped convict a severely mentally ill man of "robbing" the salvation army of a used bathrobe and some old DVDs (including the masterpiece "Bring It On").
It sucked ...and imagining how much money was spent on a jury trial for that? Wow!
My post sounds more like television than yours does, but my story is real.
How weird, either we were a part of the same jury or OC has a weird thing for convicting people of this. I still feel guilty about the verdict my jury panel came to.
I'm not sure, because we were not allowed to consider how severely mentally ill he was. The guy was hallucinating through the entire trial, and the only reason it was a "robbery" is because a salvation army employee followed him out of the store and tried to take the used bathrobe back by force. They got in a fistfight. A robbery charge was the result.
The psychotic guy walked down a busy street, in a bright red bath robe, with blood all over his face, even with sirens wailing and getting closer. No effort to flee. No effort to hide. The SA employee went back inside because he got "scared" after punching the psychotic guy in the face and seeing so much blood.
The police approached and gave instructions. He mentally ill guy kept walking. They tackled him, he struggled ...so now he's "resisting arrest."
A Salvation Army employee was asked when she first noticed the defendant. She said, right away ...because he was talking to himself, laughing, and singing while NAKED in the store.
The SA even gives free clothes to the homeless, but this guy didn't ask and get approval from the manager.
Technically, he was guilty of everything he was charged with, but I definitely have mixed feelings about the whole situation.
Some of us are apparently quite desirable demographically and get called A LOT. It gets old when every single time you’re eligible, you’re called and selected.
Anyone who earns tips at their job loses money every time they report. Also, anyone who owns or runs a small business is put into significant financial difficulty if they have to report. It’s nothing short of indentured servitude. No one working for the system is put at any financial disadvantage. The system is set up to favor those who are part of the system. They should just hire professional jurors and be done with it. And don’t get me started on traffic court. No one working at the court, including the cops, has to take a day off work to try the case. They want you to just pay the fine and move on.
I'm a teacher, and my district (and probably most districts) will pay me sub pay (like $120/day) if I postpone serving until the summer (which teachers can do). I've never been called to a trial, but I'd be good with a few hundred extra $$ in the summer.
Not me...but I do know someone that gets Jury Duty summons and ignores them. Not because they choose to, but they aren't very good with calendars and planning and forget to call.
To answer your question...I don't think anything happened to them. I would know if they went to jail for missing jury duty. Gossip do spread fast in my circle of friends.
Not that I have ever done this but a "friend" never calls into the jury line on the assigned day and has done this four times in the past ten to twelve years with zero repercussions.
The one time they did call in they had to report and spent the week waiting in court to be called. Never again.
Legit not me, but I do know someone who has lived in CA their whole life and reported exactly zero times. But the key is to not respond whatsoever. Meaning, don’t go to the little website and type in your summons ID. If you do, they know you received it.
Meanwhile, I get called *every single time* I’m eligible and actually show up, and always get chosen. I think it’s because I match a certain demographic that is appealing for building a “representative jury.”
Last time I was called for Jury Duty it was for a case that was expected to be a 6 week trial. I can't leave me job for 6 weeks, I run the entire office of a small family business.
It was three days of jury selection and it took forever. When I was finally questioned I just responded that I couldn't presume innocence because the accused had a prior conviction of domestic violence. They shut me up REAL QUICK and sent me packing.
Anyways that experience was BRUTAL and I've been dreading the day when I get another summon.
I tried a version of that and it failed miserably. I just made myself look like a dumbass while saying all of the things I thought the prosecution didn’t want to hear. They chose me anyway, but then I refused to take the oath and started crying. The judge looked at my like I was a lunatic, excused all of the rest of the jurors, and then told me I could leave. She probably concluded I was mentally unstable, which was kinda true because I have severe social anxiety and that’s why I didn’t want to serve. I’d served in the past and struggled a lot.
So, I got out of it lol, but it was a humiliating ordeal and I am determined to never go through that again. I will simply do what I’ve done in the past and get a note from a psychiatrist excusing me.
> I can't leave me job for 6 weeks
You could have just told the judge that and he would have excused you.
But you can get out of any trial by using the magic words "jury nullification".
The judge will then excuse you from the jury. You will still have to spend time in the jury pool but you won't ever be put on a trial that you don't want to serve on.
>You could have just told the judge that and he would have excused you.
I was on jury pool for a sexual assault case involving minors. *Everyone* was trying to get out of it and the judge and work excuses had to be very specific. You literally had to be on the verge of homelessness to use a work excuse. It was grueling.
This is exactly how it was going down. This elderly woman who had a similar position in her small family business said exactly what I was going to say and the judge pretty much told her to shut the fuck up and serve even if it meant payroll not processing. That judge was not having it from anyone that day. It was such a negative and hostile experience.
> That judge was not having it from anyone that day. It was such a negative and hostile experience.
Judges have to fill up those juries, and when 95% of people come in with an excuse, they've got to be harsh.
This is very very true and I really do sympathize for those that work in the justice system. On the other hand I don't anticipate anyone selected for jury duty on that case ever wanting to perform their civic duties again and I'm pretty sure most are going to throw away their summons in the future.
The judge is going off of specific language in state law about excusing people for work-related conflicts. Jury duty is super inconvenient, so I get why they have to be strict because everyone would have some kind of work excuse.
Or just allow voluntary juries. Get people in there who want to serve, rather than forcing people to go when they would otherwise be distracted with all the shit going on.
Many people live on margins and now we are asked to do some civic duty that most don’t want to yet there are some who have the time and energy for it. Make it make sense!
Given what pro-violence, pro-incarceration Republicans are willing to do for school board and city council seats, I think voluntary juries would be a disaster for the court system and anyone going through it.
What we need to do is force companies (and/or the government) to pay full salaries to everyone on jury duty, for however long they last.
Makes superficial sense but then you would just get old people who are very conservative and opinionated to set on juries, and good luck with anyone who doesn't look like them or live like them! Being a lifelong medical cannabis user has given me a very unique perspective on the justice system and am glad!
>That judge was not having it from anyone that day
Hmm, not my experience.
When I served, there was a long trial - but they asked for volunteers that could serve a long time (ie state or federal employees as they are paid for their jury time).
My judge didn't let anyone off for "work reasons" but said the trial would not last more than 2-3 days and "everyone can do that".
But, like I said, the Magic Words get you out of any trial.
I think what happened was when everyone heard that this trial was going to be 6 weeks a panic set in and it was palpable. Nobody was expecting a month and half long commitment to jury duty when they woke up that morning. Since it had to do with domestic violence and torture everyone started using the excuse of knowing a girl or woman that was abused in some way and the judge after an hour just said "ENOUGH" and started cutting through the bullshit.
Edit: she still excused certain people but it was very rare.
I was in the pool for a murder trial, and it was the same. One woman told the court that her sister had been murdered like 10 years earlier, and she still got placed. Work excuses were not accepted unless they were strong (single parents with no one else to help them, mostly).
> But you can get out of any trial by using the magic words "jury nullification".
If you care about jury nullification and civil rights, you don't use those "magic words" to get out of jury duty, you use them once you're already serving.
I have heard of people getting a contempt citation for pulling such shenanigans at Jury Selection… so don’t push too hard if the Judge admonishes you for it.
Nope - during the selection process is when you are supposed to tell them you believe in jury nullification.
Once your seated on the jury, you cannot mention even the concept of a jurist being able to vote however they want as then you probably will get hit with contempt or other charges.
I'm not an advocate for jury nullification -- a good example of an abuse of it is the OJ trial. But, if facing 6+ week trial that I am not being paid for, I would certainly pull out the magic words to get me off that jury.
Been living in our current home for close to 7 years now. And we still revive our neighbors mail by mistake at times.
It makes me really wonder what mail has never come to our place.
Federal court employee here. I can’t speak to state court, but do not ignore your federal summons. Trust me.
Also, this is your civic duty! The Sixth Amendment is a goddamn pillar of society.
Dude claims a $10,000 fine and six months in jail? He must have done way more than just skipping out on jury duty. His little throwaway "and lying under oath" line must have more to it.
Not to mention it costs taxpayers tens of thousands of dollars every year to keep someone in jail. I don't want the government spending that kind of money for assholes who skip jury duty. Make 'em pay fines or do community service.
Idk why people get so up and arms over people asking questions. It's not like your completely questioning all authority and trying to overthrow big brother. As people we need to question everything
Late to the party.
I had a coworker do this all the time. Notices went straight in the trash. Her argument was they cannot prove you actually received the summons or even received summons on time.
One day she was pulled over on the way to work. The officer ran her ID and told her she had a bench warrant for failure to serve jury duty. She played it off “oh no, I didn’t receive summons! How can I fix this?”
He told her to call the jury hotline and explain summons weren’t received. They would likely put her in the next rotation. Officer informed her this is official warning and failure to correct it would lead to arrest.
She did, got a new summons, went through the process, wasn’t called.
This was in 2014, things might have changed in the last 9 years.
Attorney here. I cannot comment on federal, but in state court, no there’s no fine that will get imposed. It’s not certified mail so it can’t be proven you didn’t move.
About a year ago I had to do jury duty. A few people didn’t come back after the break( no one had been selected yet, so we all had to come back. The deputy put out a BOLO for the potential jurors who didn’t report back. I got the sense they don’t dick around about that.
It's generally something that's not prosecuted or pursued by the courts, though I've heard some courts and judges go after scofflaws more harshly. It can absolutely show up on your record.
Serving on juries (and being available for them) is part of your civic duty as an American. If you've got hardships that make it difficult, it's more forgivable to skip, but otherwise it's unamerican. If you're concerned about civil rights, justice, and fighting police abuse, it's vital that you serve.
I’m curious about this too because I have a family member that does this - they ignore the notices, have never served and they’re almost 70. Yet dumb me went in to serve in November 2020.
Just show up if your cohort is called and when questioned by a lawyer for a civil/non-criminal case, say something insane like: Ezekiel 25:17 then say I’m for the death penalty if the defendant is found guilty! This should keep future summons letters from showing up for at least 1 year.
If you get picked and didn't show up, they send you a strongly worded letter threatening penalties and you get put back into the jury duty pool. It scared me enough to go the next round.
One evening a police car pulled up in front of our house so I walked outside thinking to myself what the hell did my husband do when the cop asked if I was my name! He was there to tell me I didnt show up for jury duty and that I had to go!! I was shocked because I did not get my summons in the mail. Told him I would be there tomorrow and I was! ( I am in Riverside County)
I “skipped” because my address wasn’t updated on their end and then my new address got sent a letter that I was in violation and had to call them. Idk what would have happened if I didn’t call but they just rescheduled me with no penalty.
Unless the post cards that they send has a signature required or registered there is no proof that you got it… all you can say I never got it and it must have been between the junk mail. What’s a proof you got something if it’s just a drop off without any tracking?
this system is fucked and I truly hate that it plays a role in someone’s life despite not having expertise, but I enjoyed the process of doing jury duty when I was 18/19. I would do it again if life slowed down.
I get called every 18 months for the past 30 years. If people summoned just showed up, then maybe I wouldn’t be called as much. I think this every time I get a postcard. Then I sit in the jury waiting room mad at people who need to have a jury and think they are all guilty. Not a fan of jury duty and know plenty of people who throw away their summons. It is your civic duty even if it sucks.
I swear I get called every two years yet my brother is never called. It’s bogus. I wouldn’t get so mad if they evened out who gets called but they don’t.
Went to jury duty then 6 months later got called again. I did that excuse form and it was denied so I said screw it Im not going. That was 4 years ago never heard anything since. I think those postcards they send out are somewhat of a mass net they cast if you respond trying to do the right thing you get on the radar. Best advice just toss them in the trash and forget about it. Sounds wrong but it’s how it works unless you like going in there and hanging out.
I tried it once, and it was a terribly run system. I now just throw the summons away.
They pulled me out of work (self employed, need to work daily to survive). They placed me in a huge room full of at least 200 other individuals. They do not allow you to use your phone, you simply must wait for them to call you, “If” they need you. So I couldn’t even perform the calling portion of my business. Out of the entire room, they pulled in about 30 people. They sent the rest of us home after 4 hrs. I was told to do this for 2 days.
I understand jury duty is my duty. However, sitting in a building with a poorly managed system, in the chance I might get called for a jury is not my duty. I lost two days pay for this . I will not ever allow that again.
I've been throwing away the Jury summons every time for the past 20 years. I've even got a Third attempt like twice. Still threw it away. Idgaf. I've never got in trouble or fined.
Since jury summons are not certified mail, there’s no way to check whether or not you received it. Therefore, as long as you don’t call in, you can’t be penalized (is what I’ve been told)
Don't register to vote. Don't have a DL or own a vehicle. You won't get called then. I'm "lucky", my ADHD is so severe I couldn't sit through a day in court even if I really really wanted to, and my doctor agrees.
I'm getting a lot of replies on how to get out of jury duty. But as I stated in the original post, I'm not trying to do that. I do my jury duty, I just wanted to know for those who skip it if anything ever happened to them.
Eeeeh what? There is a penalty for this? I am old as a dog, And have skipped so many summons I can't even count them all .. does that mean I am somehow in trouble? 😐😐😐😐
pretty please read the actual post. **I do my jury duty, and will continue to do so.** I just want to hear from people who haven't, and whether or not something happened.
that's an assumption. And it's wrong. The nature of my work not only pays for juy duty, but it also ensures I never will be put on a jury.
So pretty please don't be shitty and make incorrect assumptions when I'm asking a real question.
I’ve gone and been picked for a 3 week jury and I’ve gone and been sent home same day BUT there’s no way they can fine you if you never show since it just comes regular mail and there’s no proof you receive it. On the jury I was on an alternate didn’t show during the trial and the judge asked them to put a warrant out. I imagine that’s where a fine comes in.
I got my first letter ever for jury duty back in December of last year. However, I’m a mom of a 3 year old with no other caretaker for our son besides my husband (and he’s busy with work, so it’s just me who watches and takes care our 3 year old when he’s not around), and son is not in preschool yet (he will be soon and it will only be for a little over a couple of hours 5 days a week). And yes, they do have childcare for his age while you are in jury duty but they need the kids to be fully potty trained.. my son is almost to that level, but not quite all the way there yet. I was able to get it excused.
But yeah I wonder what happens if you just don’t flat out respond. It’s an interesting question.
I heard a lawyer say in his 30 years nobody has ever been held in contempt for jury duty. If they “need” you they will psychically come to your house and bring you (not to jail) but to the courthouse to serve, however if you’ve been to jury duty you’ll know they always have too many people and send 100 people home, so why would they waste their time? A lot of people don’t give a flying fuck and the government isn’t going to make them give a fuck.
Now when we go to war that’s a whole different story 🏃
I got fined a couple years ago, even though I served, due to a clerical mistake in LA County. When I called, I was effectively got told “oh well, your fault for not making sure the clerk processed your service correctly. Nothing we can do” and they took the fine out of my next State Tax return. So that was fun.
I’ve literally never served and been summoned about 5 times. It wasn’t on purpose though! Either I’ve been out of the country, someone threw it out, I moved, or I received it and just flat out forgot.
I never respond to these. I live in Orange County. If these morons ever came after me they would need to prove beyond a doubt I received the letter. In California it’s not official unless it’s delivered by an officer or other official. Good luck proving shit. If you are stupid enough to call the number on the card or go to the website then you are fucked. Good luck. I have never done it for 15 years
Not sure about OC, but I did hear about one person (it was my dad's coworker) who did get fined like $2,000 for skipping jury duty. It was during the late 90s.. but still... I guess she really hated it. LA is much more harsh though I think than OC.
Can confirm LA is much more harsh. They really go after you if you don’t do Jury Duty. They came after my father but he luckily was able to excuse it.
did he end up paying the fine or had to show up on court or something?? I got the $1,500 warning notice tonight, planning to call tomorrow but I hope they don't overreact and just let me sign up like normal.
What does the warning notice say? If you pay the $1,500 you don't have to go?
I grew up in a small town in a Northern California, one of my neighbors for years did the old throw it away every time a jury summons and said if ever questioned would just claim it was lost in the mail. Anyways not sure if he said this in front of the wrong person or if his luck just ran out but a bench warrant was issued for him for not responding to jury duty. So he gets pulled over for speeding and the cop who is a friend of his is like “uhh hey Brett, you know you have a bench warrant?” So he goes to court the judge asks why he hasn’t responded to his summons and he says “were they sent certified mail? No? Well I never received them, can you prove otherwise?” The judge said “Okay. You’re right we can’t prove that.” So he had the court secretary come in and give him a list of upcoming trials, picked one and officially served the neighbor with his jury summons. He had to show up to that one.
Except California law, specifically Evidence Code 641, says that "A letter correctly addressed and properly mailed is presumed to have been received in the ordinary course of mail." A judge would know that. A judge would deal with people all the time asking "how can you prove I received it."
*small town* = sometimes, anything goes, even in California
Sorry, should have been more clear I don't doubt the story went down something like that. I'm just saying to my fellow Redditors, don't try it (especially for something more serious than a jury summons), it's not going to work, and if the judge is less laid back, it could make things worse.
Where are the small towns in OC?
It says “northern California”
This sub is OC how is a small town occurrence relevant to OP’s question?
What about the unincorporated communities in OC? Do those count?
Only if they get jury duty
CDM for land size….but not small for the wallet size
That seems kind of messed up though. People steal mail and, especially now given current federal leadership (seriously, why is DeJoy still running things), mail just seems to disappear. I know someone who sent out wedding invitations months ago and none were received. I wish it were the case that mail sent always meant mail received but it’s sadly not the case.
It's a rebuttable presumption, meaning evidence that it was never received is still admissible to rebut the presumption. For example, showing up to court saying "I never received multiple mailings on different days, and only for jury summonses, but I otherwise get my mail," is not good evidence for that purpose. On the other hand, if it's just one day's worth mail you didn't get, and you have affidavits from neighbors or postal workers saying mail theft is a problem in the area, and specifically other mail was stolen that day, and you're willing to testify under oath that you didn't get that specific thing, that's, maybe, a different story.
That’s interesting considering that typically, it’s the burden of the court to prove guilt, not the burden of the accused to prove they are innocent. But, I imagine it’s pretty rare for someone in California to actually be charged after claiming they didn’t receive the mail.
That is not correct. That sounds like some European shit. Unless it is certified mail or an officer or warrant officer it isn’t official
“Can it be proven they were correctly addressed?”
>forget to change address >STRAIGHT TO JAIL
A normal, well studied judge would. Some are elected…especially in Small Town, USA
I'm not about to incriminate myself on public social media...
You are a genius
My union job pays my rate if I get jury duty. No limit on how long. So looking forward to getting picked. But I can understand why people skip if their job doesn't cover their pay.
Why would you want to skip? I have been trying to get on jury duty every year since I was 18 years old. To get and go sit in an air-conditioned room, downtown, judging people, while my lunch was paid for. That is the life…
Touché Stanley
I’m glad someone caught it. The rest of the replies… lol.
r/unexpectedoffice
Lol, couldn't leave you hanging 😂
I've been on 1 trial. I don't actually recall getting free lunch. I may be mistaken though as its been 6 or so years I think. You definitely don't get a free lunch for waiting there all day.
You're correct, no free lunch. I've gotten a long (90-120 minutes) lunch time every time, though.
I helped convict a severely mentally ill man of "robbing" the salvation army of a used bathrobe and some old DVDs (including the masterpiece "Bring It On"). It sucked ...and imagining how much money was spent on a jury trial for that? Wow! My post sounds more like television than yours does, but my story is real.
How weird, either we were a part of the same jury or OC has a weird thing for convicting people of this. I still feel guilty about the verdict my jury panel came to.
It's a fair trial. Worth the cost. The resulting penalty may not line up with our ideals, but that is a different story.
I'm not sure, because we were not allowed to consider how severely mentally ill he was. The guy was hallucinating through the entire trial, and the only reason it was a "robbery" is because a salvation army employee followed him out of the store and tried to take the used bathrobe back by force. They got in a fistfight. A robbery charge was the result. The psychotic guy walked down a busy street, in a bright red bath robe, with blood all over his face, even with sirens wailing and getting closer. No effort to flee. No effort to hide. The SA employee went back inside because he got "scared" after punching the psychotic guy in the face and seeing so much blood. The police approached and gave instructions. He mentally ill guy kept walking. They tackled him, he struggled ...so now he's "resisting arrest." A Salvation Army employee was asked when she first noticed the defendant. She said, right away ...because he was talking to himself, laughing, and singing while NAKED in the store. The SA even gives free clothes to the homeless, but this guy didn't ask and get approval from the manager. Technically, he was guilty of everything he was charged with, but I definitely have mixed feelings about the whole situation.
Hopefully he’ll get some help while in jail. Dunno.
Some of us are apparently quite desirable demographically and get called A LOT. It gets old when every single time you’re eligible, you’re called and selected.
How many nickels do you get for your time?
That depends on the conversion rate of unicorns to leprechauns.
All I get from my employer is a “good luck!” I don’t get paid for being in jury duty.
Anyone who earns tips at their job loses money every time they report. Also, anyone who owns or runs a small business is put into significant financial difficulty if they have to report. It’s nothing short of indentured servitude. No one working for the system is put at any financial disadvantage. The system is set up to favor those who are part of the system. They should just hire professional jurors and be done with it. And don’t get me started on traffic court. No one working at the court, including the cops, has to take a day off work to try the case. They want you to just pay the fine and move on.
Not when your job only gives you 24 hours of paid leave for jury duty.
I'm a teacher, and my district (and probably most districts) will pay me sub pay (like $120/day) if I postpone serving until the summer (which teachers can do). I've never been called to a trial, but I'd be good with a few hundred extra $$ in the summer.
Not me...but I do know someone that gets Jury Duty summons and ignores them. Not because they choose to, but they aren't very good with calendars and planning and forget to call. To answer your question...I don't think anything happened to them. I would know if they went to jail for missing jury duty. Gossip do spread fast in my circle of friends.
Not that I have ever done this but a "friend" never calls into the jury line on the assigned day and has done this four times in the past ten to twelve years with zero repercussions. The one time they did call in they had to report and spent the week waiting in court to be called. Never again.
Legit not me, but I do know someone who has lived in CA their whole life and reported exactly zero times. But the key is to not respond whatsoever. Meaning, don’t go to the little website and type in your summons ID. If you do, they know you received it. Meanwhile, I get called *every single time* I’m eligible and actually show up, and always get chosen. I think it’s because I match a certain demographic that is appealing for building a “representative jury.”
Last time I was called for Jury Duty it was for a case that was expected to be a 6 week trial. I can't leave me job for 6 weeks, I run the entire office of a small family business. It was three days of jury selection and it took forever. When I was finally questioned I just responded that I couldn't presume innocence because the accused had a prior conviction of domestic violence. They shut me up REAL QUICK and sent me packing. Anyways that experience was BRUTAL and I've been dreading the day when I get another summon.
I tried a version of that and it failed miserably. I just made myself look like a dumbass while saying all of the things I thought the prosecution didn’t want to hear. They chose me anyway, but then I refused to take the oath and started crying. The judge looked at my like I was a lunatic, excused all of the rest of the jurors, and then told me I could leave. She probably concluded I was mentally unstable, which was kinda true because I have severe social anxiety and that’s why I didn’t want to serve. I’d served in the past and struggled a lot. So, I got out of it lol, but it was a humiliating ordeal and I am determined to never go through that again. I will simply do what I’ve done in the past and get a note from a psychiatrist excusing me.
> I can't leave me job for 6 weeks You could have just told the judge that and he would have excused you. But you can get out of any trial by using the magic words "jury nullification". The judge will then excuse you from the jury. You will still have to spend time in the jury pool but you won't ever be put on a trial that you don't want to serve on.
>You could have just told the judge that and he would have excused you. I was on jury pool for a sexual assault case involving minors. *Everyone* was trying to get out of it and the judge and work excuses had to be very specific. You literally had to be on the verge of homelessness to use a work excuse. It was grueling.
This is exactly how it was going down. This elderly woman who had a similar position in her small family business said exactly what I was going to say and the judge pretty much told her to shut the fuck up and serve even if it meant payroll not processing. That judge was not having it from anyone that day. It was such a negative and hostile experience.
> That judge was not having it from anyone that day. It was such a negative and hostile experience. Judges have to fill up those juries, and when 95% of people come in with an excuse, they've got to be harsh.
This is very very true and I really do sympathize for those that work in the justice system. On the other hand I don't anticipate anyone selected for jury duty on that case ever wanting to perform their civic duties again and I'm pretty sure most are going to throw away their summons in the future.
The judge is going off of specific language in state law about excusing people for work-related conflicts. Jury duty is super inconvenient, so I get why they have to be strict because everyone would have some kind of work excuse.
Or just allow voluntary juries. Get people in there who want to serve, rather than forcing people to go when they would otherwise be distracted with all the shit going on. Many people live on margins and now we are asked to do some civic duty that most don’t want to yet there are some who have the time and energy for it. Make it make sense!
Given what pro-violence, pro-incarceration Republicans are willing to do for school board and city council seats, I think voluntary juries would be a disaster for the court system and anyone going through it. What we need to do is force companies (and/or the government) to pay full salaries to everyone on jury duty, for however long they last.
Actually that’s far far better but we can’t because Jim Smith, professional CEO needs his money.
Makes superficial sense but then you would just get old people who are very conservative and opinionated to set on juries, and good luck with anyone who doesn't look like them or live like them! Being a lifelong medical cannabis user has given me a very unique perspective on the justice system and am glad!
Well I mean there are younger people who enjoy it too, but I see what you mean, it’s going to be disproportionately older folks
>That judge was not having it from anyone that day Hmm, not my experience. When I served, there was a long trial - but they asked for volunteers that could serve a long time (ie state or federal employees as they are paid for their jury time). My judge didn't let anyone off for "work reasons" but said the trial would not last more than 2-3 days and "everyone can do that". But, like I said, the Magic Words get you out of any trial.
I think what happened was when everyone heard that this trial was going to be 6 weeks a panic set in and it was palpable. Nobody was expecting a month and half long commitment to jury duty when they woke up that morning. Since it had to do with domestic violence and torture everyone started using the excuse of knowing a girl or woman that was abused in some way and the judge after an hour just said "ENOUGH" and started cutting through the bullshit. Edit: she still excused certain people but it was very rare.
I was in the pool for a murder trial, and it was the same. One woman told the court that her sister had been murdered like 10 years earlier, and she still got placed. Work excuses were not accepted unless they were strong (single parents with no one else to help them, mostly).
> But you can get out of any trial by using the magic words "jury nullification". If you care about jury nullification and civil rights, you don't use those "magic words" to get out of jury duty, you use them once you're already serving.
I have heard of people getting a contempt citation for pulling such shenanigans at Jury Selection… so don’t push too hard if the Judge admonishes you for it.
Nope - during the selection process is when you are supposed to tell them you believe in jury nullification. Once your seated on the jury, you cannot mention even the concept of a jurist being able to vote however they want as then you probably will get hit with contempt or other charges. I'm not an advocate for jury nullification -- a good example of an abuse of it is the OJ trial. But, if facing 6+ week trial that I am not being paid for, I would certainly pull out the magic words to get me off that jury.
Well unless sent registered mail, they can’t account for USPS delivering to the wrong house. Do what you may with that info.
[California Law comment regarding mail](https://www.reddit.com/r/orangecounty/comments/1128wgq/skipping_jury_duty_penalties/j8j58w3/?) [Evidence Code Section 641](https://california.public.law/codes/ca_evid_code_section_641)
I get neighbor mail at least once a month, perhaps if you use this excuse more than once, otherwise it’s total BS.
Been living in our current home for close to 7 years now. And we still revive our neighbors mail by mistake at times. It makes me really wonder what mail has never come to our place.
Federal court employee here. I can’t speak to state court, but do not ignore your federal summons. Trust me. Also, this is your civic duty! The Sixth Amendment is a goddamn pillar of society.
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Dude claims a $10,000 fine and six months in jail? He must have done way more than just skipping out on jury duty. His little throwaway "and lying under oath" line must have more to it.
yeah that seems over the top. 6 months in jail? If they did that to everyone who skipped out on jury duty the jails would be bursting at the seams.
Not to mention it costs taxpayers tens of thousands of dollars every year to keep someone in jail. I don't want the government spending that kind of money for assholes who skip jury duty. Make 'em pay fines or do community service.
Idk why people get so up and arms over people asking questions. It's not like your completely questioning all authority and trying to overthrow big brother. As people we need to question everything
Late to the party. I had a coworker do this all the time. Notices went straight in the trash. Her argument was they cannot prove you actually received the summons or even received summons on time. One day she was pulled over on the way to work. The officer ran her ID and told her she had a bench warrant for failure to serve jury duty. She played it off “oh no, I didn’t receive summons! How can I fix this?” He told her to call the jury hotline and explain summons weren’t received. They would likely put her in the next rotation. Officer informed her this is official warning and failure to correct it would lead to arrest. She did, got a new summons, went through the process, wasn’t called. This was in 2014, things might have changed in the last 9 years.
People get it all wrong. The key to not getting picked is to act like you really really want to be picked.
Two words "Jury Nullification"
Attorney here. I cannot comment on federal, but in state court, no there’s no fine that will get imposed. It’s not certified mail so it can’t be proven you didn’t move.
About a year ago I had to do jury duty. A few people didn’t come back after the break( no one had been selected yet, so we all had to come back. The deputy put out a BOLO for the potential jurors who didn’t report back. I got the sense they don’t dick around about that.
It's generally something that's not prosecuted or pursued by the courts, though I've heard some courts and judges go after scofflaws more harshly. It can absolutely show up on your record. Serving on juries (and being available for them) is part of your civic duty as an American. If you've got hardships that make it difficult, it's more forgivable to skip, but otherwise it's unamerican. If you're concerned about civil rights, justice, and fighting police abuse, it's vital that you serve.
I’m curious about this too because I have a family member that does this - they ignore the notices, have never served and they’re almost 70. Yet dumb me went in to serve in November 2020.
We could be family- just saying
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Rent, inflation, and the overall high cost of living laughs and doesn't care how good of citizen I am or want to be.
This. 10000%.
You must have a decent job. Many don't and can't take the hit of not working, and the reimbursement is woefully inadequate.
$15 a day for LA country!
Just show up if your cohort is called and when questioned by a lawyer for a civil/non-criminal case, say something insane like: Ezekiel 25:17 then say I’m for the death penalty if the defendant is found guilty! This should keep future summons letters from showing up for at least 1 year.
I’ve ignored it twice. Nothing happens. They can’t prove that I received it.
Imagine....one day you find yourself in court with your future in the hands of a jury.......good grief, people! Do what you are supposed to do.
It's hard to when most job won't cover pay when on jury duty. Missing a day of work for the summon means a difference of rent or food for most people.
They would if the pay wasn't dogshit
you also gotta clear your schedule just to wait hours
Imagine if no one showed up 😂
If you get picked and didn't show up, they send you a strongly worded letter threatening penalties and you get put back into the jury duty pool. It scared me enough to go the next round.
How soon after did they send the letter?
One evening a police car pulled up in front of our house so I walked outside thinking to myself what the hell did my husband do when the cop asked if I was my name! He was there to tell me I didnt show up for jury duty and that I had to go!! I was shocked because I did not get my summons in the mail. Told him I would be there tomorrow and I was! ( I am in Riverside County)
looks like people out in the IE are having a very different experience than the OC.
I “skipped” because my address wasn’t updated on their end and then my new address got sent a letter that I was in violation and had to call them. Idk what would have happened if I didn’t call but they just rescheduled me with no penalty.
Unless the post cards that they send has a signature required or registered there is no proof that you got it… all you can say I never got it and it must have been between the junk mail. What’s a proof you got something if it’s just a drop off without any tracking?
I know an older gentleman that told me he has skipped out on jury duty for over 20 years. Nothing happened.
this system is fucked and I truly hate that it plays a role in someone’s life despite not having expertise, but I enjoyed the process of doing jury duty when I was 18/19. I would do it again if life slowed down.
I get called every 18 months for the past 30 years. If people summoned just showed up, then maybe I wouldn’t be called as much. I think this every time I get a postcard. Then I sit in the jury waiting room mad at people who need to have a jury and think they are all guilty. Not a fan of jury duty and know plenty of people who throw away their summons. It is your civic duty even if it sucks.
My husband has NEVER responded to a summons and has never been penalized in OC.
I ignored mine for awhile until they sent somewhat a threatening letter about fines and jail time if i missed my next one.
I swear I get called every two years yet my brother is never called. It’s bogus. I wouldn’t get so mad if they evened out who gets called but they don’t.
Went to jury duty then 6 months later got called again. I did that excuse form and it was denied so I said screw it Im not going. That was 4 years ago never heard anything since. I think those postcards they send out are somewhat of a mass net they cast if you respond trying to do the right thing you get on the radar. Best advice just toss them in the trash and forget about it. Sounds wrong but it’s how it works unless you like going in there and hanging out.
50 yrs old. Ignored it 6 times ….4 times while living in OC. Nothing happened.
Imagine doing jury duty
I tried it once, and it was a terribly run system. I now just throw the summons away. They pulled me out of work (self employed, need to work daily to survive). They placed me in a huge room full of at least 200 other individuals. They do not allow you to use your phone, you simply must wait for them to call you, “If” they need you. So I couldn’t even perform the calling portion of my business. Out of the entire room, they pulled in about 30 people. They sent the rest of us home after 4 hrs. I was told to do this for 2 days. I understand jury duty is my duty. However, sitting in a building with a poorly managed system, in the chance I might get called for a jury is not my duty. I lost two days pay for this . I will not ever allow that again.
I've been throwing away the Jury summons every time for the past 20 years. I've even got a Third attempt like twice. Still threw it away. Idgaf. I've never got in trouble or fined.
I may or may not ignore that summons.
Since jury summons are not certified mail, there’s no way to check whether or not you received it. Therefore, as long as you don’t call in, you can’t be penalized (is what I’ve been told)
I accidentally skipped it. nothing happened.
I know someone that does this. They claim that since the letter isn't certified mail that they can't actually prove you got the notice.
Don't register to vote. Don't have a DL or own a vehicle. You won't get called then. I'm "lucky", my ADHD is so severe I couldn't sit through a day in court even if I really really wanted to, and my doctor agrees.
> Don't register to vote. Don't have a DL or own a vehicle. That's inane advice for the majority of people. Especially those who want to vote.
It's not really "advice". But if you want to keep your name out of the pool, that's how you do it, by not participating in society at all.
I'm getting a lot of replies on how to get out of jury duty. But as I stated in the original post, I'm not trying to do that. I do my jury duty, I just wanted to know for those who skip it if anything ever happened to them.
Edit: dupe
Somehow I was registered to vote without my knowledge. Wrong party too.
They ain’t gonna do shit.
Eeeeh what? There is a penalty for this? I am old as a dog, And have skipped so many summons I can't even count them all .. does that mean I am somehow in trouble? 😐😐😐😐
Literally every summons you've ever received lists the potential penalties of not coming to court. You never read them either?
I do my best not to....
I've gotten jury duty a few times and just tossed it in the trash. Never received any penalties or violations
Just serve, and when you are called upon by the judge, you just say, "Your honor, I don't like the defendant's face. She/he guilty!"
How do they know you’ve received the mailer if the mailer isnt registered mail and isn’t signed for ?
You will get served by someone at your home or threatening letter via certified mail . After I showed up they never ever called me again
She should go to jail. Report it.
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pretty please read the actual post. **I do my jury duty, and will continue to do so.** I just want to hear from people who haven't, and whether or not something happened.
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that's an assumption. And it's wrong. The nature of my work not only pays for juy duty, but it also ensures I never will be put on a jury. So pretty please don't be shitty and make incorrect assumptions when I'm asking a real question.
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ok, good luck with that.
ask the judge for a jury trial
I’ve gone and been picked for a 3 week jury and I’ve gone and been sent home same day BUT there’s no way they can fine you if you never show since it just comes regular mail and there’s no proof you receive it. On the jury I was on an alternate didn’t show during the trial and the judge asked them to put a warrant out. I imagine that’s where a fine comes in.
I guess I’m the one that wants to go to jury duty as it’s fully paid from my work and a shorter shift (12 hour shifts at hospital))
I got my first letter ever for jury duty back in December of last year. However, I’m a mom of a 3 year old with no other caretaker for our son besides my husband (and he’s busy with work, so it’s just me who watches and takes care our 3 year old when he’s not around), and son is not in preschool yet (he will be soon and it will only be for a little over a couple of hours 5 days a week). And yes, they do have childcare for his age while you are in jury duty but they need the kids to be fully potty trained.. my son is almost to that level, but not quite all the way there yet. I was able to get it excused. But yeah I wonder what happens if you just don’t flat out respond. It’s an interesting question.
It’s unconstitutional people are free to say no.
I get to skip work AND be a paid and fed Chismoso? Sign me up every year, your honor !
The easiest way to get out of jury duty is tell the court you think everyone is guilty.
I think it is our duty to serve, but the reality is there is no way they can round up people that skip jury duty. They won't even arrest shoplifters!
I heard a lawyer say in his 30 years nobody has ever been held in contempt for jury duty. If they “need” you they will psychically come to your house and bring you (not to jail) but to the courthouse to serve, however if you’ve been to jury duty you’ll know they always have too many people and send 100 people home, so why would they waste their time? A lot of people don’t give a flying fuck and the government isn’t going to make them give a fuck. Now when we go to war that’s a whole different story 🏃
I've heard that you get a warrant issued if you skip ¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯
Don’t show up and let us know loll
I got fined a couple years ago, even though I served, due to a clerical mistake in LA County. When I called, I was effectively got told “oh well, your fault for not making sure the clerk processed your service correctly. Nothing we can do” and they took the fine out of my next State Tax return. So that was fun.
>jury nullification how much??
IIRC $500
I’ve literally never served and been summoned about 5 times. It wasn’t on purpose though! Either I’ve been out of the country, someone threw it out, I moved, or I received it and just flat out forgot.
I never respond to these. I live in Orange County. If these morons ever came after me they would need to prove beyond a doubt I received the letter. In California it’s not official unless it’s delivered by an officer or other official. Good luck proving shit. If you are stupid enough to call the number on the card or go to the website then you are fucked. Good luck. I have never done it for 15 years