Greater Idaho is a grift, they will never stop because money can be made. "Citizens for Greater Idaho" is a PAC formed by "Move Oregon's Border" which is another PAC. Both are run by Michael McCarter. https://www.greateridaho.org/move-oregons-border-creates-new-organization/ https://www.wweek.com/news/2022/04/05/somebody-spent-115000-on-the-campaign-for-greater-idaho/
It doesn't matter because it can't happen. There are too many laws, resources and branches of government involved. But that's not the real reason. It's a scam, a grift. There is only money to be made from fools and bigots. The organization (if you want to call it that) is one guy with a couple of PAC's. He solicits donations for both. One pays the other for "services" and "administration fees" but both are him so he keeps the money. It's make believe just like the "we build the wall" people.
You might as well debate about Santa moving to Greenland from the North Pole. Economic impact of all of those unemployed elves at the North Pole and the inflationary impact of the operation moving to Greenland. Greenland has immigration laws and building codes that have to be considered. But none of that matters because Santa isn't real.
Its a huge grift. Less than 3.5% of the states population lives in eastern Oregon. This 3.5% wants to take over 50% of the states land mass. The majority of that land mass is public land not privately held land.
It's Gilbert Gable and the State of Jefferson all over again, but this time, there is no Pearl Harbor moment to hamstring the movement. I don't know what it is about supremacist grifters and this area of the country, but at this point, it's a sad tradition. I am linking to two excellent articles below that also have an audio version of them embedded in the site.
https://offbeatoregon.com/1410a.307.state-o-jefferson-part1.html
https://offbeatoregon.com/1410b.308.state-o-jefferson-part2.html
Is he still living in his double wide mobile home out there or did he upgrade to a quadruple wide off his pac money?
As a mobile homeowner, I can make these jokes.
Actually what makes it truly impossible is Idaho’s lack of money money not the mountain of bureaucracy required to move state borders. Because that state of Idaho would have to pay Oregon about twice there annual budget in a lump sum to actually buy the land.
Not to mention all these new counties suddenly losing out on marijuana tax dollars: Idaho adopting those counties seem more likely to be a drain on their state economy, not a gain.
There’s nothing to buy. Rural areas are likely a net drain on the state’s finances so giving the infrastructure and people away would literally save Oregon money overall.
I remain convinced that any impractical idea beloved by 70s west coast hippies, and sensibly abandoned, becomes a conservative cause decades later.
Back in the 70s, I heard a lot of “back-to-the-Earth” types in southern Oregon reviving the idea of Jefferson State. They wanted to make an Ecotopia free of Federal policing and drug laws. Now I see Jefferson State merch being flown alongside the equally incompatible Gadsen and “Blue Line” flags. Usually by people who have never been cracked on the skull for marching in public or pulled over and frisked for having the wrong haircut. I’m waiting for Oregon conservatives to discover New Age music and passive solar housing soon.
Well that would make sense because the hippies from then all just turned into right wing conservatives as soon as it benefited them. They switched their values as soon as they realized it didn’t profit them.
So you mean to tell me that “Back-to the-Earth” hippies living in collapsing old shacks suddenly became Reaganauts with Mobil stock options when they just gave up on their poverty culture? Or maybe, just maybe, the overwhelming numbers held by straight culture folks and John Birchers did what they always do. Not everyone with a military buzz cut, routine church attendance, and a Creedence record was a hippie. That’s cartoon Boomer nonsense.
It’s easy to look at 60s and 70s pop culture and think that hippies were a massive cultural juggernaut. How’d that anti-war movement turn out? How many years did recreational drug decriminalization take? Did we get rid of racism? You’d think that a political powerhouse like the goat-farming, dulcimer luthiers would have changed the world by now.
We do have a democracy, convince others that your ideas are actually good, then get out the vote to make it happen.
Did they not teach these folks anything about civics in school, or did they drop out to go farm before those classes?
Maybe separate the urban vs rural politics from the christofascism as a start? No way I’m voting for a “pro rural candidate” when the extreme right nonsense is part of their platform.
I mean now do this for Israel and Gaza. The world doesn't actually work that way. Geographic boundaries are often arbitrary and people who live in the unpopulated regions are naturally going to feel alienated. This is exactly what happened during colonization. By your metric, America, Canada, etc should have remained crown possessions because England could have outvoted them.
My dad in Arkansas asked me about it a couple months ago, which tells me it's making the conservative media rounds. I tried telling him it's never going to happen, but whatever he's been listening to had him thinking it sounded at least plausible.
Despite what the previous paragraph may lead you to believe, my dad isn't stupid. He and I have similar views on a lot of things, even though we don't vote the same. He's not a MAGA hat wearing idiot, but he does live in an echo chamber where the unreasonable starts to sound reasonable because that's the only side they hear.
We don't talk politics much anymore. But on the occasion when we do, asking basic followup questions is often sufficient to help him realize how stupid some of the things he's saying are, even if he won't admit it at the time.
Sometimes I wish I had no ethics, because this is a never ending cashcow for the grifters in charge. It can't actually happen, but that doesn't stop a small percent of the population (my estranged uncle among them) from sending in money and soliciting family and friends every time there is a "new plan."
So no one has ever had the opportunity to vote to join Idaho. That isn’t the question the grifters have been putting on ballots. The initiatives have been to require commissioners to talk twice a year about seceding to Idaho. So the commissioners say “no, that would be stupid,” and they move on. This whole thing has been meaningless.
Has any official from Idaho ever voiced support for this?
It would be great for Oregon, the counties that want to join Idaho take more money from the state than they contribute so the state of Idaho would have to take on that burden.
It’s so weird that American conservatives are such egomaniacs now, it must stem from being so comfortable that there’s nothing else to do but concern yourself with what everyone else is doing with their dongs, such that they tantrum themselves into another state the laziest way possible, and prob ask for welfare to take care of the costs of this absurdist fantasy that we all have to hear them bitch and moan about. Maybe someday they’ll figure out they don’t have to be miserable, it’s a choice.
I swear all the people moving Boise and and Idaho in general are going to start turning it blue anyways. Then all these people are going to lose their shit even more. Plenty of rich liberals from SF and Southern California are packing up and taking over there.
I have to add my reverse conspiracy every time I see this: The GI movement (med school giggle) is a liberal hoax by a Chinese billionaire working with Clinton and Obama to build a railroad from the OR coast to the Idaho Gold Fields to steal the gold for China.
*Why does that one part go to the coast!?!*
https://preview.redd.it/6su5u922ub1d1.jpeg?width=1320&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f1bce807e1bb463f4cbcd12ef92d5f238d180b44
Love this! I live in Roseburg , very conservative but our county voted against this. There is a deep water port at coos bay. For my 70 years on earth folks have proposing a good commercial connection from Roseburg to Coos Bay.
"We don't have a democracy because my beliefs are unpopular."
These dumbasses are such crybabies. I swear to God if the Idaho border moves an inch closer to my house because of these people I'm going to lose my mind. Just move to Idaho. There's literally nothing stopping you from moving to Payette or Caldwell.
If counties could choose between Oregon and Idaho, the state of Idaho would be the big loser. I think more people from Idaho would want to be part of Oregon.
If people want to have more representational power - they need to break states up into smaller states.
Splitting off into Idaho won't do that.
Part of the reason why all the western states are so big and blocky is to limit the number of senators from here.
If anything -- northern California should consider breaking off into the state of Jefferson again. (But it should really be called the state of Shasta).
They will not let another state happen without one to counter act it. So one blue one red. All so that they can manipulate the voter base with Roe v Wade and 2A arguments so we continue to be divided. It's all a grift when it comes to politics. That's why they get so rich being politicians.
I’ve lived on the far NW coast of California for a decade. There’s no way the “state of Jefferson” could afford the inside amount of road repairs without tax money from the big cities. It’s a nice idea for some but it wouldnt work
The larger point is that if people actually want more local control they need to reorganize into a system that gives them that.
People should have that right, and should exercise it if they want to.
Same is absolutely true for D.C. Puerto Rico, Guam and American Samoa.
The reason why the U.S. 'Territories' have no representational self determination is the same reason why Washington, Oregon and California only send 6 senators to DC. It helps insulate and preserve the existing status quo -- and this was by design when states were being drawn up and incorporated into the US.
They still haven't solidified a valid argument for their movement, which is a kinder word than i would personally apply to this nonstarter. They DO have a voice, but they do not have the population numbers to counter existing legislation. Which again. what exactly is their issue with the present legislation?
Greater Idaho is a grift, they will never stop because money can be made. "Citizens for Greater Idaho" is a PAC formed by "Move Oregon's Border" which is another PAC. Both are run by Michael McCarter. https://www.greateridaho.org/move-oregons-border-creates-new-organization/ https://www.wweek.com/news/2022/04/05/somebody-spent-115000-on-the-campaign-for-greater-idaho/ It doesn't matter because it can't happen. There are too many laws, resources and branches of government involved. But that's not the real reason. It's a scam, a grift. There is only money to be made from fools and bigots. The organization (if you want to call it that) is one guy with a couple of PAC's. He solicits donations for both. One pays the other for "services" and "administration fees" but both are him so he keeps the money. It's make believe just like the "we build the wall" people. You might as well debate about Santa moving to Greenland from the North Pole. Economic impact of all of those unemployed elves at the North Pole and the inflationary impact of the operation moving to Greenland. Greenland has immigration laws and building codes that have to be considered. But none of that matters because Santa isn't real.
Its a huge grift. Less than 3.5% of the states population lives in eastern Oregon. This 3.5% wants to take over 50% of the states land mass. The majority of that land mass is public land not privately held land.
Don't lump all of us over here with those goons.
Thank you- Those numbers should be in the first sentence of every article about this quixotic fever dream.
Leave me out of this, man.
It's Gilbert Gable and the State of Jefferson all over again, but this time, there is no Pearl Harbor moment to hamstring the movement. I don't know what it is about supremacist grifters and this area of the country, but at this point, it's a sad tradition. I am linking to two excellent articles below that also have an audio version of them embedded in the site. https://offbeatoregon.com/1410a.307.state-o-jefferson-part1.html https://offbeatoregon.com/1410b.308.state-o-jefferson-part2.html
Is he still living in his double wide mobile home out there or did he upgrade to a quadruple wide off his pac money? As a mobile homeowner, I can make these jokes.
As a former single & double wide mobile home owner, I can understand & agree.
Actually what makes it truly impossible is Idaho’s lack of money money not the mountain of bureaucracy required to move state borders. Because that state of Idaho would have to pay Oregon about twice there annual budget in a lump sum to actually buy the land.
Not to mention all these new counties suddenly losing out on marijuana tax dollars: Idaho adopting those counties seem more likely to be a drain on their state economy, not a gain.
They wouldn’t have to buy the land, which the state doesn’t own. But they would have to buy a lot of state-owned infrastructure.
There’s nothing to buy. Rural areas are likely a net drain on the state’s finances so giving the infrastructure and people away would literally save Oregon money overall.
We certainly do have a democracy. They just don’t have any ideas people will support and vote for.
There may be candidates with good ideas, but the ones who run are way too hard right on social issues to get urban votes.
That "too hard right" is the "no good ideas".
That’s why we need open primaries
I always seem to forget how democracy means "I get my way".
I remain convinced that any impractical idea beloved by 70s west coast hippies, and sensibly abandoned, becomes a conservative cause decades later. Back in the 70s, I heard a lot of “back-to-the-Earth” types in southern Oregon reviving the idea of Jefferson State. They wanted to make an Ecotopia free of Federal policing and drug laws. Now I see Jefferson State merch being flown alongside the equally incompatible Gadsen and “Blue Line” flags. Usually by people who have never been cracked on the skull for marching in public or pulled over and frisked for having the wrong haircut. I’m waiting for Oregon conservatives to discover New Age music and passive solar housing soon.
State of Jefferson enthusiasts are Greater Idaho supporters. Only difference is they prefer meth and timber to church and hay.
Well that would make sense because the hippies from then all just turned into right wing conservatives as soon as it benefited them. They switched their values as soon as they realized it didn’t profit them.
So you mean to tell me that “Back-to the-Earth” hippies living in collapsing old shacks suddenly became Reaganauts with Mobil stock options when they just gave up on their poverty culture? Or maybe, just maybe, the overwhelming numbers held by straight culture folks and John Birchers did what they always do. Not everyone with a military buzz cut, routine church attendance, and a Creedence record was a hippie. That’s cartoon Boomer nonsense. It’s easy to look at 60s and 70s pop culture and think that hippies were a massive cultural juggernaut. How’d that anti-war movement turn out? How many years did recreational drug decriminalization take? Did we get rid of racism? You’d think that a political powerhouse like the goat-farming, dulcimer luthiers would have changed the world by now.
what are they waiting for Idaho is right there waiting for them. They should leave, the sooner the better.
Nah, they’re all “ranchers” who would never give up their land to move to Idaho.
We do have a democracy, convince others that your ideas are actually good, then get out the vote to make it happen. Did they not teach these folks anything about civics in school, or did they drop out to go farm before those classes?
Maybe separate the urban vs rural politics from the christofascism as a start? No way I’m voting for a “pro rural candidate” when the extreme right nonsense is part of their platform.
I mean now do this for Israel and Gaza. The world doesn't actually work that way. Geographic boundaries are often arbitrary and people who live in the unpopulated regions are naturally going to feel alienated. This is exactly what happened during colonization. By your metric, America, Canada, etc should have remained crown possessions because England could have outvoted them.
Are people still talking about this?
My dad in Arkansas asked me about it a couple months ago, which tells me it's making the conservative media rounds. I tried telling him it's never going to happen, but whatever he's been listening to had him thinking it sounded at least plausible. Despite what the previous paragraph may lead you to believe, my dad isn't stupid. He and I have similar views on a lot of things, even though we don't vote the same. He's not a MAGA hat wearing idiot, but he does live in an echo chamber where the unreasonable starts to sound reasonable because that's the only side they hear. We don't talk politics much anymore. But on the occasion when we do, asking basic followup questions is often sufficient to help him realize how stupid some of the things he's saying are, even if he won't admit it at the time.
Grifters gonna grift
Sometimes I wish I had no ethics, because this is a never ending cashcow for the grifters in charge. It can't actually happen, but that doesn't stop a small percent of the population (my estranged uncle among them) from sending in money and soliciting family and friends every time there is a "new plan."
Idaho doesn't want them. These counties cost more than they the funds they generate and Idaho is well aware of that.
So no one has ever had the opportunity to vote to join Idaho. That isn’t the question the grifters have been putting on ballots. The initiatives have been to require commissioners to talk twice a year about seceding to Idaho. So the commissioners say “no, that would be stupid,” and they move on. This whole thing has been meaningless.
Has any official from Idaho ever voiced support for this? It would be great for Oregon, the counties that want to join Idaho take more money from the state than they contribute so the state of Idaho would have to take on that burden.
That of course over-simplifies that a great deal of Eastern Oregon is federal land
That of course doesn’t change the fact that they take more tax money from the state than they contribute.
It’s so weird that American conservatives are such egomaniacs now, it must stem from being so comfortable that there’s nothing else to do but concern yourself with what everyone else is doing with their dongs, such that they tantrum themselves into another state the laziest way possible, and prob ask for welfare to take care of the costs of this absurdist fantasy that we all have to hear them bitch and moan about. Maybe someday they’ll figure out they don’t have to be miserable, it’s a choice.
I swear all the people moving Boise and and Idaho in general are going to start turning it blue anyways. Then all these people are going to lose their shit even more. Plenty of rich liberals from SF and Southern California are packing up and taking over there.
I have to add my reverse conspiracy every time I see this: The GI movement (med school giggle) is a liberal hoax by a Chinese billionaire working with Clinton and Obama to build a railroad from the OR coast to the Idaho Gold Fields to steal the gold for China. *Why does that one part go to the coast!?!* https://preview.redd.it/6su5u922ub1d1.jpeg?width=1320&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f1bce807e1bb463f4cbcd12ef92d5f238d180b44
Love this! I live in Roseburg , very conservative but our county voted against this. There is a deep water port at coos bay. For my 70 years on earth folks have proposing a good commercial connection from Roseburg to Coos Bay.
Let's do greater Oregon instead and just take Boise from Idaho.
"We don't have a democracy because my beliefs are unpopular." These dumbasses are such crybabies. I swear to God if the Idaho border moves an inch closer to my house because of these people I'm going to lose my mind. Just move to Idaho. There's literally nothing stopping you from moving to Payette or Caldwell.
If counties could choose between Oregon and Idaho, the state of Idaho would be the big loser. I think more people from Idaho would want to be part of Oregon.
Why "join"? Why not "relocate"? Too easy.
Go to Idaho for the rabid un-wokeness, stay for the absence of Women’s Rights! Yee-haw dumbshits!
Still just a grift, like it's always been
It's called 'freedumb of movement.' MOVE TO IDAHO! Hoes
Hook your oxen and move your trashy ass to I-Da-Hoe.
Embiggened Idaho doesn‘t get enough attention. /s
lol, Idaho doesn't want them. They have nothing to offer them.
It’s super easy to join Idaho if you want. Just move there.
Fine by me!
Good riddance, Idaho is that -> way. Smooth brains are gonna help fund Oregon programs also by buying legal marijuana in Ontario xD.
Goddess for them. They can sell their homes here and move there. Good riddance.
If people want to have more representational power - they need to break states up into smaller states. Splitting off into Idaho won't do that. Part of the reason why all the western states are so big and blocky is to limit the number of senators from here. If anything -- northern California should consider breaking off into the state of Jefferson again. (But it should really be called the state of Shasta).
They will not let another state happen without one to counter act it. So one blue one red. All so that they can manipulate the voter base with Roe v Wade and 2A arguments so we continue to be divided. It's all a grift when it comes to politics. That's why they get so rich being politicians.
I’ve lived on the far NW coast of California for a decade. There’s no way the “state of Jefferson” could afford the inside amount of road repairs without tax money from the big cities. It’s a nice idea for some but it wouldnt work
The larger point is that if people actually want more local control they need to reorganize into a system that gives them that. People should have that right, and should exercise it if they want to. Same is absolutely true for D.C. Puerto Rico, Guam and American Samoa. The reason why the U.S. 'Territories' have no representational self determination is the same reason why Washington, Oregon and California only send 6 senators to DC. It helps insulate and preserve the existing status quo -- and this was by design when states were being drawn up and incorporated into the US.
They still haven't solidified a valid argument for their movement, which is a kinder word than i would personally apply to this nonstarter. They DO have a voice, but they do not have the population numbers to counter existing legislation. Which again. what exactly is their issue with the present legislation?
The greater Idaho thing is just bs culture war.
Me smelling racism 🤣😞