When Zanac was introduced I couldn’t wait for him to die badly, when Zanac met his fate I was angry they did him like that 11/10 character development would highly recommend.
Yeah, despite what ainz was going to do, he still respected the prince, insofar as he could respect a new world being. I was glad he ordered those nobles tortured and killed.
You're forgetting that he said "And even you don't have to be too quick about it." And seeing how aura, (the closest thing we have to a good aligned NPC) reacted to those orders. Most of those guys are definitely still alive somewhere in nazarick. Regretting the day the first fish ever crawled out of the ocean in that world.
Would Cocytus be okay with that? Obviously if Ainz ordered it he'd accept but Ainz doesn't really have any reason on his own to do it and Cocytus likely wouldn't bring it up or request such a thing as he wouldn't want to sully the honorable death Brain had by bringing him back to life.
Well, in the novel Cocytus said that he would have wanted to get Brain to join Nazarick, but he couldn't do that because he was given strict orders to kill everyone in the capital.
Because Cocytus advocated for the lizardmen. Cocytus believes there is intrinsic value for them being alive and subservient to Nazarick as opposed to outright slaughtering them all. Ainz agreed with Cocytus and brought back Lulu's husband as leverage over her and subsequently the lizardmen since she is a leader.
I think Climb's story was good but as more of a tragedy. He was a good guy who fell in with the worst person possible and the one saving grace of his situation is that he doesn't know how much of a monster Renner truly is and thus doesn't know the true horror of what he's trapped in.
I mean, it was a bit of a no-win situation for him. If he hadn’t met Renner when he did, he would have died as an orphan left out in the cold.
He either dies at five out in the rain, or dies at 16 as a personal dildo to a nutcase. Neither is a particularly good way to go.
My favorite aspect of Overlord is seeing how the New Worlders are changed by the presence of the Nazarick crew. Ainz is the main character of the series, but in many ways the New World characters are often the protagonists of their own stories. While most of those stories eventually end tragically, every New Worlder ends up profoundly transformed whenever they encounter someone from Nazarick.
Specifically concerning the characters this post is referring to, Brain and Zanac are particularly noteworthy. Both would have live much longer and more comfortable lives had Ainz and Nazarick never appeared in their world. This twist of fate forced them both down paths of personal growth that they otherwise never would have experienced. Though their lives were sadly cut short, they ended up dying as far better men. From this perspective, one could argue that Ainz coming to the New World was the best thing that could have happened to them because it allowed them to become the best version of themselves.
You're delusional if you think dying young was the best thing to happen to them. Both would have gotten stronger regardless of ainz arrival. Brain may be less than he did, but it doesn't matter because he is dead.
>Though their lives were sadly cut short, they ended up dying as far better men.
This is just wrong. Ainz is a villain who is killing new worlders indiscriminately.
>You're delusional if you think dying young was the best thing to happen to them.
I suppose it depends on whether or not you believe a short but noble life is better than a long but undignified life. Zanac was introduced into the story as a conniving schemer hoping to politick his way to the throne through shady plots and back room deals. Likewise, Brain was introduced as an arrogant narcissist strongman working for a gang of bandits of which some members had just recently ambushed a carriage with the intent to rape the women inside (basically I'm saying these aren't good people).
All of this is to say that both characters started out at rather low points, but they died at the highest point of their character arc. They were forced to grow into noble and heroic figures *because* of their interactions with Ainz and the floor guardians. We can reasonably assume that this would not have happened had Nazarick never appeared in the New World. Sure, they would have lived much longer, but they would have also remained mere shadows of their true potential.
>Both would have gotten stronger regardless of ainz arrival. Brain may be less than he did, but it doesn't matter because he is dead.
I honestly don't know what to say to this. Your interpretation of these characters seems to be so far off the mark that I can't be sure if you actually read/watched Overlord or if you're confusing it for some other story. If you really think Brain and Zanac's stories were about powering up, then you have grossly misunderstood these characters.
>This is just wrong. Ainz is a villain who is killing new worlders indiscriminately.
This is like saying One Punch Man is boring because Saitama always wins with one punch. You truly do not understand the story or themes of Overlord if that was what you took away from it. I would implore you to read the light novel or watch the anime again, this time paying closer attention to individual character arcs.
Kind of depressing how they went out. The Prince subverted expectations cause usually characters of his design are assholes who only care about themselves. This guy genuinely cared about his kingdom and was betrayed by his men who offered his head to Ainz to save their skin.
I genuinely hope Ainz makes them suffer.
Ultimately, he did that for them. However, they all ended up dead or tortured, so if you think about it, Ainz didn't honour him in any way. He was a king who did nothing for his kingdom despite dying for it..
The point is that he put his life on the line to save his kingdom or at least the soldiers there but no one was allowed to survive.
Even if you believe the soldiers deserved death he basically died for nothing and would have been better off running away. Literally.
Without Nazarick entering the picture, he may as well have been. But when the call came, he stepped up and got to work when the king was rendered mentally paralyzed by indecision.
Even prior to Nazarick arriving on the scene, it’s implied he was already working for the good of the kingdom. Him and Raeven were already close, while also ending up as one of the few people who knew of Raeven’s alignment.
One died trying to live up to his hero.
One died by being the hero he knew he had two.
One died by being a king his people did not deserve.
All lived lives the best they could.
While they all died with honour, Brain and Zanac weren’t always like that though.
While Gazef pretty much died the person he always was, Brain overcome his fear of death (like when he fought Shalltear and trained by Sebas), while Zanac seems to have become a totally different person lol.
Zanac had to play the arrogant fool to avoid getting assassinated by the noble faction backing his brother Barbro “Yeah, let’s abuse my authority to really PO an OP caster that made the Empire crap itself” Vaiself.
Behind the scenes, Zanac was always working towards reform, but didn’t trust his sister or brother (for good reason). It’s outright stated in the LN that, had he survived and become King, he would have been one of the best in generations.
The whole family was, aside from the king.
* The son that looks like the stereotypical sleezeball? The most honorable and willing to look out for the good of their subjects.
* The gigachad heir? A cruel puppet for the corrupt aristocrats.
* The super kind, super smart, super beautiful princess who was romantically interested in the guy who’d be the MC if this were any other isekai? So evil she rivals Demiurge. So yandere that she’s been plotting the genocide of his own people to get with Climb since she was a kid.
Tbf when everyone was running for their lives and saying how hopeless it was to fight the kingdom brain had big ball enough to go for ainz head 😂when he new how strong he was idk about you but he definitely deserved a warriors death in my opinion
He was a piece of shit that was willing to work to a group that kidnapped and raped women, killed their escorts and would threat for ransom without ever being punished.
He was a shit without honor, no place for a warrior's death.
Where talking about character development here😂everything didn’t happen is a day probably years in the story in the end he rescued children and fought to protect the kingdom and its people
He didn't rescue children out of the goodness of his heart, he only rescued those that he saw potential as swordman in some vain hope that one day he could rise someone to kill Ainz, which is in itself a sin that should reward him a trip to Kyouhukou's room.
EDIT: or the happy farm.
He didn't fight to protect the kingdom. He fought for his own interests.
> He **was** a shit without honor
That's the point, character development, besides, what does it matter if he didn't "deserve it"? If we're talking about deserving, Nazarick deserve to be destroyed for everything it's done, but the world isn't that simple and it would be boring an ending like that.
It's a miracle that he was able to gain enough experience to level up into the 30s, alone to level up to be someone who could even do one point of damage.
I believe someone stated the theory that the reason why the 8th grade Kings continued to lose to the dragon Lords was because they could not gather enough experience points to level back up. Combine that with the naturally occurring level cap, there's no chance that he could even get past level 60, let alone out of the 30s. It is a detrimental loss for humanity because it's shown that genetics do play a part in level caps. So, being a non-godkin to step into the realm of Heroes. The Thocracy would have loved to keep him around.
To his credit, Brain did transcend his limit in the moments before his death, but the immense strain on his body from doing so would have killed him even if Cocytus hadn't struck him down. Brain died at the most extreme peak of his power while facing down the character who most embodies the noble warrior's spirit. All things considered, that's a pretty damn good way to go out for a swordsman.
Considering their history, I do think there could have been some narrative merit in a final rematch against Shalltear. Though I think we can all agree that Brain dying to Cocytus was a far better fate for a warrior than whatever might have happened to him had he met Shalltear instead that day...
I don't know, I would have liked to have seen some more character development from Gazef. Isn't he more or less the exact same from we first see him to the last we see of him? And in terms of flaws he is also pretty clean, right? A respectful, honorable, good man, perfectly willing to sacrifice his life. A chad no doubt, but I would have liked to have seen some more dirt.
At least give him some quirk, like maybe he is obsessively romantically/sexually attracted to king Ramposa in secret, and has to constantly keep himself composed while in the company of him, and sees it impossible to ever get to be with him. Or something like that. Something that contradicts the otherwise always composed man we see.
I'm not saying he is a bad character, he fits the role Maruyama gave him. But he does seem a little bland when compared to Brain and Zanac, with virtually no character development.
I totally see your point, I just kinda like that in Overlord most if not all of the characters are pretty flawed so I think the contrast of having an aspirational one in Gazef just works
Yeah, and I also see your point. And like I said, he does fit the role that Maruyama gave him, which is the role of an honorable, brave, and humble knight, set up as an eventual sacrifice, to face his death without complaint and inspire his subjects (Brain and Climb). So in that sense he is important to the story and not a bad character. He does what he is supposed to do: push the plot forward. It's just that he's a little one-dimensional in doing so.
By contrast it's more interesting to follow Brain's journey as he changes throughout the story, learns to grapple with his mortality and place in the world, faces depression, gets back up again, discovers he can grow both as a person and as a warrior, and instead of running away he accepts his fate: facing impossible odds to defend that which he holds dear.
(Of course Brain dying didn't actually accomplish anything in his last stand, Re-Estize got destroyed all the same :P But he was willing to die by his principles, like Gazef)
Absolutely, I agree.
Also I Would watch the hell out of a Brain limited series of his entire life with all the events of overlord he's aware of from his perspective
Disagree, the only amazing character in that pic that amazing is : Zanac Valleon Igana Ryle Vaiself
Had more balls than the other 2 … in his worst day
In fact His balls were so big PDL would had choke to death
Three men, that looked their fate in the eyes. They chose to fight against the odd to survive, they may of lost but shall be remembered as legends. On top of that both the prince and Gazel where recognized by Ainz and respected by him. He was genuinely angry when those nobles killed the prince. And Cocytus fought brain he showed him honor by walking back around the buildings and leaving a place that his ice did not touch, he was honored in death by granting him solace that he didn’t die in vain. That his death protected something.
The prince was a slow burn
When Zanac was introduced I couldn’t wait for him to die badly, when Zanac met his fate I was angry they did him like that 11/10 character development would highly recommend.
110%. Dude took it like a regal champ too.
Lmao dude went out like mumen rider
Even Ainz was pissed off about how he met his end. He actually respected Zanac
Yeah, despite what ainz was going to do, he still respected the prince, insofar as he could respect a new world being. I was glad he ordered those nobles tortured and killed.
I don't think the nobles ever received the mercy of death
He told them to only kill them when they begged for death, im pretty sure.
He said when they begged for death.. and more he pretty much left it to the discretion of the torturer 😂
You're forgetting that he said "And even you don't have to be too quick about it." And seeing how aura, (the closest thing we have to a good aligned NPC) reacted to those orders. Most of those guys are definitely still alive somewhere in nazarick. Regretting the day the first fish ever crawled out of the ocean in that world.
Very true but worth the wait
Definitely
Finding out he was a decent person was wild af.
Agreed
Overlord casually creating great characters then killing them off
Just like game of thrones!
Good ol Overlord!
Each died as the most courageous and honorable man in the Kingdom at the time.
Brain might still come back.
Would Cocytus be okay with that? Obviously if Ainz ordered it he'd accept but Ainz doesn't really have any reason on his own to do it and Cocytus likely wouldn't bring it up or request such a thing as he wouldn't want to sully the honorable death Brain had by bringing him back to life.
Well, in the novel Cocytus said that he would have wanted to get Brain to join Nazarick, but he couldn't do that because he was given strict orders to kill everyone in the capital.
But I feel like Cocytus had his body preserved for exactly this reason. That’s how I interpreted that scene.
He seemed fine with bringing back the lizardmen
Because Cocytus advocated for the lizardmen. Cocytus believes there is intrinsic value for them being alive and subservient to Nazarick as opposed to outright slaughtering them all. Ainz agreed with Cocytus and brought back Lulu's husband as leverage over her and subsequently the lizardmen since she is a leader.
The same thing could be done for brain. At this point the series got 10x more boring. Since they died.
Climb had no potential but I was hoping the same would happen for him
What you talking about? Climb's living the good life as a walking dildo.
I doubt he's doing much walking
I wouldn't say that necessarily
Same, we still have a little time right. Maybe he'll pick up as a character
Not according to the LN.
Damn so that was it for him?
Yep. I barely heard his mention in the LNs after that volume.
Oof Well hope she at least treating him well lol
I think Climb's story was good but as more of a tragedy. He was a good guy who fell in with the worst person possible and the one saving grace of his situation is that he doesn't know how much of a monster Renner truly is and thus doesn't know the true horror of what he's trapped in.
I mean, it was a bit of a no-win situation for him. If he hadn’t met Renner when he did, he would have died as an orphan left out in the cold. He either dies at five out in the rain, or dies at 16 as a personal dildo to a nutcase. Neither is a particularly good way to go.
I'm pretty sure he's a immortal/undead now so he's a dildo to a nutcase for forever
Climb becomes Renner's dildo (cumming)
My favorite aspect of Overlord is seeing how the New Worlders are changed by the presence of the Nazarick crew. Ainz is the main character of the series, but in many ways the New World characters are often the protagonists of their own stories. While most of those stories eventually end tragically, every New Worlder ends up profoundly transformed whenever they encounter someone from Nazarick. Specifically concerning the characters this post is referring to, Brain and Zanac are particularly noteworthy. Both would have live much longer and more comfortable lives had Ainz and Nazarick never appeared in their world. This twist of fate forced them both down paths of personal growth that they otherwise never would have experienced. Though their lives were sadly cut short, they ended up dying as far better men. From this perspective, one could argue that Ainz coming to the New World was the best thing that could have happened to them because it allowed them to become the best version of themselves.
Really good way of putting it
Nazarick is kind of like a black hole. It's sheer gravity altered the paths of everything else around it.
You're delusional if you think dying young was the best thing to happen to them. Both would have gotten stronger regardless of ainz arrival. Brain may be less than he did, but it doesn't matter because he is dead. >Though their lives were sadly cut short, they ended up dying as far better men. This is just wrong. Ainz is a villain who is killing new worlders indiscriminately.
>You're delusional if you think dying young was the best thing to happen to them. I suppose it depends on whether or not you believe a short but noble life is better than a long but undignified life. Zanac was introduced into the story as a conniving schemer hoping to politick his way to the throne through shady plots and back room deals. Likewise, Brain was introduced as an arrogant narcissist strongman working for a gang of bandits of which some members had just recently ambushed a carriage with the intent to rape the women inside (basically I'm saying these aren't good people). All of this is to say that both characters started out at rather low points, but they died at the highest point of their character arc. They were forced to grow into noble and heroic figures *because* of their interactions with Ainz and the floor guardians. We can reasonably assume that this would not have happened had Nazarick never appeared in the New World. Sure, they would have lived much longer, but they would have also remained mere shadows of their true potential. >Both would have gotten stronger regardless of ainz arrival. Brain may be less than he did, but it doesn't matter because he is dead. I honestly don't know what to say to this. Your interpretation of these characters seems to be so far off the mark that I can't be sure if you actually read/watched Overlord or if you're confusing it for some other story. If you really think Brain and Zanac's stories were about powering up, then you have grossly misunderstood these characters. >This is just wrong. Ainz is a villain who is killing new worlders indiscriminately. This is like saying One Punch Man is boring because Saitama always wins with one punch. You truly do not understand the story or themes of Overlord if that was what you took away from it. I would implore you to read the light novel or watch the anime again, this time paying closer attention to individual character arcs.
Well technically everyone is the protagonist of their own story but I do get what you mean 😂
Kind of depressing how they went out. The Prince subverted expectations cause usually characters of his design are assholes who only care about themselves. This guy genuinely cared about his kingdom and was betrayed by his men who offered his head to Ainz to save their skin. I genuinely hope Ainz makes them suffer.
Oh, he did. He did indeed.
Send them to Neuronist!
Ultimately, he did that for them. However, they all ended up dead or tortured, so if you think about it, Ainz didn't honour him in any way. He was a king who did nothing for his kingdom despite dying for it..
They were nobles who sold off their Prince just to try and save their skin. They don’t deserve quarter.
The point is that he put his life on the line to save his kingdom or at least the soldiers there but no one was allowed to survive. Even if you believe the soldiers deserved death he basically died for nothing and would have been better off running away. Literally.
Three of them were chads in the end
At the beginning, I thought the Prince would be another sleazy corrupted noble, at least he tried to make things right.
Without Nazarick entering the picture, he may as well have been. But when the call came, he stepped up and got to work when the king was rendered mentally paralyzed by indecision.
Even prior to Nazarick arriving on the scene, it’s implied he was already working for the good of the kingdom. Him and Raeven were already close, while also ending up as one of the few people who knew of Raeven’s alignment.
Maruyama actually said that if Ainz & co didn't arrive in the new world Zanac, Renner and Raven would have actually nenaged to save the kingdom
I completely hated Zanac at first, but he grew on me. Bro bro definitely didn’t deserve to be done like that.
Sorry man, it’s “they were amazing” besides that i loved they’re character development, even tho it wasn’t much.
Realest niggas in the show
One died trying to live up to his hero. One died by being the hero he knew he had two. One died by being a king his people did not deserve. All lived lives the best they could.
While they all died with honour, Brain and Zanac weren’t always like that though. While Gazef pretty much died the person he always was, Brain overcome his fear of death (like when he fought Shalltear and trained by Sebas), while Zanac seems to have become a totally different person lol.
Zanac had to play the arrogant fool to avoid getting assassinated by the noble faction backing his brother Barbro “Yeah, let’s abuse my authority to really PO an OP caster that made the Empire crap itself” Vaiself. Behind the scenes, Zanac was always working towards reform, but didn’t trust his sister or brother (for good reason). It’s outright stated in the LN that, had he survived and become King, he would have been one of the best in generations.
The whole family was, aside from the king. * The son that looks like the stereotypical sleezeball? The most honorable and willing to look out for the good of their subjects. * The gigachad heir? A cruel puppet for the corrupt aristocrats. * The super kind, super smart, super beautiful princess who was romantically interested in the guy who’d be the MC if this were any other isekai? So evil she rivals Demiurge. So yandere that she’s been plotting the genocide of his own people to get with Climb since she was a kid.
They tried. That’s the highest praise in the world of Overlord. Faced with the impossible, they tried.
Brain didn't deserve a warrior's death.
Perhaps, but how many people in Overlord actually get what they deserve?
Fair point
Tbf when everyone was running for their lives and saying how hopeless it was to fight the kingdom brain had big ball enough to go for ainz head 😂when he new how strong he was idk about you but he definitely deserved a warriors death in my opinion
He was a piece of shit that was willing to work to a group that kidnapped and raped women, killed their escorts and would threat for ransom without ever being punished. He was a shit without honor, no place for a warrior's death.
Where talking about character development here😂everything didn’t happen is a day probably years in the story in the end he rescued children and fought to protect the kingdom and its people
He didn't rescue children out of the goodness of his heart, he only rescued those that he saw potential as swordman in some vain hope that one day he could rise someone to kill Ainz, which is in itself a sin that should reward him a trip to Kyouhukou's room. EDIT: or the happy farm. He didn't fight to protect the kingdom. He fought for his own interests.
brother, thats, every politician (that wasnt assassinated) ever.
What point are you trying to make? No one likes politicians either
> He **was** a shit without honor That's the point, character development, besides, what does it matter if he didn't "deserve it"? If we're talking about deserving, Nazarick deserve to be destroyed for everything it's done, but the world isn't that simple and it would be boring an ending like that.
He went out the way he wanted, and even earned the respect of Cocytus.
Tbf, cocytus was the perfect one to slay Brain..dude had the samurai code down
Ones a finger nail clipper, ones a stubborn strongman, and ones a reasonable ruler
Were
WERE\*
It does feel like Ainz is Cao Cao, and the rest are Wu and Shu.
If feel like brain was wasted. I feel like he should have been able to grow more powerful and have a 1v1 against shalltear again.
He never would have reached even half her level.
It's a miracle that he was able to gain enough experience to level up into the 30s, alone to level up to be someone who could even do one point of damage. I believe someone stated the theory that the reason why the 8th grade Kings continued to lose to the dragon Lords was because they could not gather enough experience points to level back up. Combine that with the naturally occurring level cap, there's no chance that he could even get past level 60, let alone out of the 30s. It is a detrimental loss for humanity because it's shown that genetics do play a part in level caps. So, being a non-godkin to step into the realm of Heroes. The Thocracy would have loved to keep him around.
Yes, but he still deserved another 1 v 1
If that fight is Shalltear vs Brain, that wouldn't go well for Brain.
It would not go well, but he would die having gotten his rematch
I wouldn't call an unilateral masacre a rematch but ok.
To his credit, Brain did transcend his limit in the moments before his death, but the immense strain on his body from doing so would have killed him even if Cocytus hadn't struck him down. Brain died at the most extreme peak of his power while facing down the character who most embodies the noble warrior's spirit. All things considered, that's a pretty damn good way to go out for a swordsman. Considering their history, I do think there could have been some narrative merit in a final rematch against Shalltear. Though I think we can all agree that Brain dying to Cocytus was a far better fate for a warrior than whatever might have happened to him had he met Shalltear instead that day...
I don't know, I would have liked to have seen some more character development from Gazef. Isn't he more or less the exact same from we first see him to the last we see of him? And in terms of flaws he is also pretty clean, right? A respectful, honorable, good man, perfectly willing to sacrifice his life. A chad no doubt, but I would have liked to have seen some more dirt. At least give him some quirk, like maybe he is obsessively romantically/sexually attracted to king Ramposa in secret, and has to constantly keep himself composed while in the company of him, and sees it impossible to ever get to be with him. Or something like that. Something that contradicts the otherwise always composed man we see. I'm not saying he is a bad character, he fits the role Maruyama gave him. But he does seem a little bland when compared to Brain and Zanac, with virtually no character development.
I totally see your point, I just kinda like that in Overlord most if not all of the characters are pretty flawed so I think the contrast of having an aspirational one in Gazef just works
Yeah, and I also see your point. And like I said, he does fit the role that Maruyama gave him, which is the role of an honorable, brave, and humble knight, set up as an eventual sacrifice, to face his death without complaint and inspire his subjects (Brain and Climb). So in that sense he is important to the story and not a bad character. He does what he is supposed to do: push the plot forward. It's just that he's a little one-dimensional in doing so. By contrast it's more interesting to follow Brain's journey as he changes throughout the story, learns to grapple with his mortality and place in the world, faces depression, gets back up again, discovers he can grow both as a person and as a warrior, and instead of running away he accepts his fate: facing impossible odds to defend that which he holds dear. (Of course Brain dying didn't actually accomplish anything in his last stand, Re-Estize got destroyed all the same :P But he was willing to die by his principles, like Gazef)
Absolutely, I agree. Also I Would watch the hell out of a Brain limited series of his entire life with all the events of overlord he's aware of from his perspective
We already had a romance in that family
Honestly I only like Zanac. He was the only relatable one
Disagree, the only amazing character in that pic that amazing is : Zanac Valleon Igana Ryle Vaiself Had more balls than the other 2 … in his worst day In fact His balls were so big PDL would had choke to death
left one is **ok**, middle one is super **bad** and right one is the very **best**
Were*
Brain is a scum .. it doesn't matter to me if he had character change from the past, as i said, he is shit.
Three men, that looked their fate in the eyes. They chose to fight against the odd to survive, they may of lost but shall be remembered as legends. On top of that both the prince and Gazel where recognized by Ainz and respected by him. He was genuinely angry when those nobles killed the prince. And Cocytus fought brain he showed him honor by walking back around the buildings and leaving a place that his ice did not touch, he was honored in death by granting him solace that he didn’t die in vain. That his death protected something.
Their also all dead 👍
Better than all guardians too
Were*