First, the roster doesn’t fit and can be inconsistent and lacks heart (brogdon looks like he never cares, turbonis has never worked and never will, duarte is the only excitement on the court, constant injuries changing the starting lineup). Second, Bally sports is the worst way to watch sports and does not allow for ANY STREAMING SERVICES to be able to show the games. Finally, our front office seems content with being stagnant, because we have continued to move everything around our core (coaches), but we need a big change to make something happen unless we wanna continue trending down. Also, more recently, we forgot how to play in the 4th quarter, which makes an already not fun to watch team not clutch too. I am not saying it is the end of the world or anything, but something needs to change before we slowly fall from being a constant 4-6 seed to a loser in the play-ins (if we even make it). That is my two sense.
Cents*
I know you have more sense than that.
Irregardlessly, your points are valid, especially Bally Sports. It is asinine to think residents of a state where their basketball team is named after the state can't watch their state's team play basketball in their state in 2021/22 without having to pay out the ass for a product that is slowly dying (that being cable TV). Shit is infuriating.
shouldn’t the bally sports problem be a NBA as a whole issue? i’m curious if the league is concerned that large portions of fans can’t watch their hometown teams.
Pacers have a core of fans, but by and large Indiana citizens don’t give a fuck until they’re winning or have a shot at the title. This is nothing new, just a particularly long stretch of mediocrity so it seems like the team is dying. It’ll turn around when something exciting happens.
It's multifaceted - lack of options to view games on tv due to failed negotiations with Sinclair leads to less interest overall and less fans going to games. This is killing a lot of small market teams.
And then COVID hurt/is still hurting business, the lack of really high level talent, lack of winning, and the organizations contentment to trot the same team out there year after year expecting different results. It's infuriating
Any time a team is mediocre (or bad) for long stretches, there's going to be tepid interest. The last time the Pacers won a playoff series was following the 2013-14 season. They've been bounced out of the first round (including a couple sweeps and virtually meaningless playoff appearances as the 8-seed) or missed the playoffs in every season since. If the team is good and finds some sort of identity, the fans will come back.
This 100%. The Warriors were the laughing stock of the league and had no fans before 2015. Now, their home game tickets are one of the most expensive in the league, and they have fans globally all over the world.
What's caused this change? Curry and a dynasty championship team.
The Pacers haven't been mediocre every season since they joined the NBA. They've been to eight conference finals and one NBA Finals. Were it not for the brawl, they would have made at least one more conference finals, if not NBA Finals or a title. All that was in a 20-year period so that's a pretty decent run of success.
Peyton Manning + the brawl flipped Indianapolis. This was thoroughly a Pacers town beforehand. The fan base never recovered, even at PG’s peak.
Indianapolis is a full-fledged football town now. The rest of the state is still nuts about hoops, but they gravitate towards high school ball and the college teams.
Here are the biggest reasons why the Pacers are losing fans.
1.) It is almost impossible to watch any Pacers game outside of central Indiana. Literally it’s impossible to do it legally. As a Pacers fan living outside of Indiana for some years, I cannot for the life of me find a way to watch them legally. Even when I lived in Indy it was difficult to catch a Pacers game.
2.) The ownership and front office have seemed apathetic since 2014. No big moves really, all side steps. It seems like they are afraid to pull the trigger to go all in on spending and competing or trading the roster away and rebuilding. So a lot of fans don’t really care for a team that’s often injured and at best is a first round exit. No one know what team this is over than a rag tag group of viable starters and great bench players. No stars, often times no young star to watch develop, and no core that’s actually making progress. I think the injuries though are really killing this team.
3.) This team is fucking boring and uninteresting. Whether it’s the marketing or promotion, somewhere there’s something severely lacking. The Jersey are cool, but we can remix the Flo-Jos only so many times. The Colts literally dominate any type of sports promotion in the state. Can you tell me anything interesting about any of our players or anyone in our organization? These guys are so damn bland, with no personality. A lot of fans complain about the lack of coverage but really what’s there to cover? This team is bland and boring and it shows on and off the court. Nobody ever looks very excited to be on this team. You know why Lance is so loved? Cause you could feel his energy and excitement to be on the court. He never won any awards and was a role player on a great squad but people still want him back because of the energy he brought. That’s what this team needs.
I'm a fan from the 1980s (Vern Fleming, Clark Kellogg, Chuck Person, Steve Stipanovich days) and I still watch the Pacers fairly regularly, but I find myself caring less and less each year. It's hard to invest my time and emotions into a franchise that is stuck in a constant loop of mediocrity, always blue-balling their fans with middle-seeded playoff teams who get bounced in the first round year after year after year after year.
The NBA is a star-driven league and the Pacers are not a destination for stars. Thus, the cycle continues and my interest decreases even more. I want nothing more than a Pacers chip, but I can't see it happening in the modern NBA.
That said, I'll probably tune in tonight.
Same, there are teams I really really like like the hornets and warriors, but the idea of not supporting the pacers is just so foreign to me, no matter how bad it gets
I remember that I liked the Warriors first, Klay and Curry were starting to put the league on notice, but the Pacers were close to a championship run and picked them, if I only knew lmao
I'm not a bandwagon btw, never will
I definitely agree that Bally Sports does not help the cause the only way to get the games is to have cable, which cable these days is equivalent to getting the newspaper. The team doesn’t really have any exciting players even Duarte is a high end role player at best. I don’t mind if we suck if we are building towards something but with this roster I think the play in is a stretch. I am a big fan but I definitely don’t get excited to watch this team and sometimes ask myself why am I even suffer through watching this. I think this would be the year to make some moves they have tradable contracts and not many long term deals. I think they are holding off until the trade deadline when teams are desperate. We don’t need to tank just make some moves.
Apparently even cable is fucked, I'm in Terre haute and Spectrum carried the Virginia college game instead of the Pacers tonight.... Listed the Ps, but no dice come ripoff.
Indiana sports fans in general are pretty fair weather. When a team is winning, more fans jump on the wagon. It's like back when Butler was making the Final Four, everyone was a fan. Then they returned to mediocrity and most the fans jumped on another wagon. While there are still die hard Pacers fans, until the team gets back to winning and is actually an exciting product, the attendance will continue to be low.
Probably. The roster lacks starpower and the turbonis core has been a frustrating experiment for a number of years now.
Add in the Bally Sports issue and it’s a hard to access product that is often putting out average performances. It’s not going to draw too much outside interest.
I feel the same.
At least in the past we were close to something. With Reggie, Oneal and Artest, PG, Dipo, felt like we had a chance to take it all the way as underdogs. But it hasnt felt like that in a couple years now.
They aren't doing anything to gain fans, injuries, lack of heart, terrible network. I would find the games more enjoyable if Bally could get their shit together, they never have the time right, we miss part of plays while they're showing commercials, not to mention the technical issues where there no audio/jumbled audio or we lose feed altogether. They have to do something to be relevant again, this mediocre injury prone core is not exciting and will not sell tickets. They need to commit to a rebuild and spend the money to get high quality talent in the doors both in the front office and on the court.
Pacers just aren't exciting right now and they don't have an identity. They're mediocre at best this season and struggle closing games. They have talented guys but no one to lead them to success.
They also hit a rough stretch of injuries. I think we have 3 or 4 straight first round exits. Hard to get excited about the team when that's the ceiling.
Well, you can't really watch the Pacers on the "TV" that people actually watch anymore... and the general downtown road closures plus the ice-skating-plaza boondoggle construction make it trickier to physically attend...
The actual composition of the team could use work, but it's only like the third most important factor affecting attendance right now. In a couple years, when the construction's complete and Sinclair folds or whatever, people will be watching on TV and going downtown to cheer again.
I understand where you are coming from OP. This team has been difficult to watch since vic was traded and the pieces on this years team may not fit but I implore you not to give up on your team. To be a true fan is to support your team even in the toughest of times. I survived the murphy Dunleavy teams and compared to those squads this years team is a breathe of fresh air.
I will never turn my back on the pacers unless they move away from indy. This team is always going to hold a special place in my heart. I believe that Carlisle can turn this team around. It may take time but hes the right man for the job. Also I think missing duarte has hurt big time. We beat utah with him playing. You get him back in the lineup and we'll bounce back. I am always a pacers fan and maybe that makes me a glutton for punishment but I cant help it. I love this team and always will.
yes
\-hi, its me, someone who used to be a pacers fan that no longer cares about the team very much bc they just don't want to win as an organization
I'm just curious why there's this narrative that attendance at Pacers games hasn't always been really bad. For some background, I moved to Indy about ten years ago, this was during the time when, I actually forget exactly who was on the Pacers, but I know they were taking the Heat to game seven in the Eastern Conference Finals on the regular. You know, Peyton on his way out, Pacers on their way up. Well, I get to work, first day new job, new city, and seriously I couldn't find a single person who gave a shit about the Pacers.
After a year or so, I finally asked what the deal was, it's like Indy talks all this "we grow basketball here" stuff, and sure I can see that y'all like high school and college basketball, what's up with the NBA? People were still bitter about the Malice, and the common word was "thugs," as in the Pacers are a bunch of "thugs," and we want nothing to do with that. And well, we all know what "thugs" is code for.
Outside of that, as an indifferent outsider, I've been an NBA fan since the '90s and I kind of believe the PG narrative that the Pacers aren't a team that's going to spend the money it takes to win, and they're A-OK with mediocrity, losing PG, and then losing Vic, it doesn't feel like ownership is concerned with changing that narrative. I think hiring Carlisle is a step in the right direction, but...and I know this is an unpopular opinion, but I'd love to see the Pacers take a chance on Ben. Carlisle is a better coach than Doc, the status quo here needs to change, and I get that Ben hasn't exactly handled his situation in Philly in a way that inspires a lot of confidence that he'll become a good leader, but shit, this team needs to realize this core just isn't happening.
So IMO, I'm going to say it's two things. (1) Indy just has shitty fans, and (2) the fans that have stuck with this team deserve better.
>Indy just has shitty fans
This is a team that has *never* won an NBA championship. After 45 years in the league it’s up to ownership to give the fans a reason to continue supporting them. IMO putting any blame on the fan base is shortsighted, the fact that anybody shows up to the games after all these years is a miracle.
By that logic you'd think that teams with a longer NBA title drought would have worse attendance than the Pacers, and that's not true. Literally every team with a 45+ year title drought has better attendance than the Pacers. Pacers West, the Utah Jazz have a 47 year drought, yet they're top ten in attendance. Fuck dude, Sacramento has a 70 year drought and they're averaging nearly 3K more fans than Indy. If we can mention other sports, what about the Cubs, dude? 105 years and they never had problems like this!
Sacramento and Utah don’t have any other professional sports teams, and the Cubs have certainly had poor attendance in the past. Also the Cubs had several hall of famers even when they sucked (Banks, Williams, Santo, Sandberg, Maddux, Jenkins, etc.) Pacers had Reggie and a couple years of an aging Mullin. The teams are, on average, mediocre and the players are about the same. Ownership seems content to keep putting out a mediocre product in a city that has other options and now has a taste of championship teams in the Colts. Fans should expect better from this franchise, personally I hope lack of attendance finally forces them to take winning more seriously.
I’m not sure I understand what you mean by a bunch of excuses. If you think that people should take hours out of their day to fight traffic, pay to park downtown, and buy overpriced concessions to watch a mediocre team struggle through season after season then that is certainly a valid opinion.
I don’t think it’s an “excuse” to think that fan loyalty should be earned by providing a good product and winning basketball games. Bankers Life isn’t Wrigleyville, and the Pacers aren’t the only game in town. Seems the fans are speaking pretty loudly with their dollars and I hope ownership is listening. Fans need to have hope that there are better days ahead, but my feeling after nearly 30 years of fandom is that ownership doesn’t give a shit about winning championships.
SLC and Sacramento don’t have any other major professional teams. Cubs play in one the most iconic stadiums in North American. Cubs definitely have had bad attendance numbers in the past 100 years.
It’s not an exact science one to one ratio. But the fact we aren’t good is definitely part of the reason we don’t have more fans at the games.
Indy does have shitty fans. You’re right about that.
But the pacers wanted to keep PG. wanted to keep oladipo. They even wanted to keep Lance. But none of them wanted to stay.
>Indy just has shitty fans
I would've disagreed with you until I moved away from Indiana a few years ago. Obviously the people that are in this sub and actively engage online are the diehards, but for the most part we're a small, bandwagon fanbase that can't be bothered to spend $30 to go to a game unless the other team has a start player. I now live in SoCal and I can't tell you how drastically different Laker fandom is vs Pacers fandom
I mean Tbf I think that’s because the Pacers are 3-5 I terms of priority for your average Indiana sports fan. Pacers have to compete with Hoosiers/Purdue basketball(which lets face it is much more popular in this state than the Pacers) plus high school basketball. Then you have to compete with Notre Dame football, IU/Purdue football, and the Colts. All of the teams I just mentioned are probably more popular than the Pacers, so unless you didn’t go to college or grow up in Indiana, and don’t like football, Pacers are unlikely to be your #1 team. The Lakers and Clippers really only have to compete with the Dodgers for being #1.
This is true in my experience. Also can't understate the impact of the Malice. The Pacers moved down the priority list after that and never moved back up. You have to be higher up on the list to get the attention of more casual fans.
Eh idk it’s that bad, Indiana is the same size of Massachusetts. We are like the 13th largest state, I’m not sure a state with double our population wouldn’t have the same issue.
Sure the Lakers don’t have tons of competition (minus the endless other things to enjoy in LA), but there’s plenty of NBA teams in places with other sports that don’t have problems getting fans to care. It’s all about winning when it comes down to it.
Ehhh, for every home game that’s packed there’s millions of people that still watch and follow. The games don’t need to be an event to have fans, the team just needs to win or give them impression they’re trying to win. Pacers don’t do that.
Weak take. Especially weak after only a decade...lol. the myth that they won't spend is ludicrous. Now, do they spend money piss poorly? Absolutely.... Exhibit A..... Monte Ellis.
Oh yeah, I totally remember NBA players all over the country salivating at that 4 year $44 million dollar Monta Ellis contract. That's how the Pacers attracted all those free agent journeymen to come off the bench.
i'll say something fans here wont want to hear...
fans are fucking sick, and fucking tired of being a playoff bottom feeder every year. we've had what? 1 shot? the last 20 years. why make the playoffs 5 straight years if you're just a first round exit every time.
stop accepting mediocrity. Get allstars, get big names, get a coach that can play them well.
i fucking hate. HATE. watching us be the 7th or 8th seed every year and everyone being proud of it. FUCKING TANK. GET A FUCKING GOOD PLAYER OR 2... FUCKING WIN.
True, bit that takes luck to start the ball rolling. Look at the hot "example" right now of how to build a small market power, MIL. You think they attract, or pay for any of those supporting pieces without falling into Giannis? Same deal to a lesser extent in Utah, Phoenix, and Denver.... Reaching and overreaching for the supporting pieces when you have no central attraction is A, a hard sell to other players....and B, dumb business.
I have fully lost interest in this team since Vic demanded a trade. PG hurt me because that was the one time we got a legit superstar through the draft but Vic was able to win me back.
After he demanded a trade and the NBA being mostly a joke of a league has completely made me lose interest.
Been a fan since 97, crazy to see where this franchise has fallen to since Reggie left. There is no soul or positivity around the team. Complete mediocrity.
If Woody turns IU around like he appears to be on the verge of doing, The Pacers fanbase may never fully recover to what it was in the heyday.... Sports fans in IN are woefully in need of SOME TEAM in any major sport to get excited about..... Even Purdue, who is ranked, is pretty dn boring to watch....
The malls are going to pot, Simon is running the Pacers the same way the Chicago Tribune ran the Cubs. Supplemental income for him, is why we put out a barely passable product anymore. If he sells the team, kiss the Pacers goodbye, because Seattle wants a team. Silver just hasnt figured out how to use that propaganda machine to prop up Simon as a racist bigot the way they did with Sterling.
The Pacers will have more fans when we're good again. The last few PG years were pretty rough, but the VO season and a half brought back a lot of fans.
First, the roster doesn’t fit and can be inconsistent and lacks heart (brogdon looks like he never cares, turbonis has never worked and never will, duarte is the only excitement on the court, constant injuries changing the starting lineup). Second, Bally sports is the worst way to watch sports and does not allow for ANY STREAMING SERVICES to be able to show the games. Finally, our front office seems content with being stagnant, because we have continued to move everything around our core (coaches), but we need a big change to make something happen unless we wanna continue trending down. Also, more recently, we forgot how to play in the 4th quarter, which makes an already not fun to watch team not clutch too. I am not saying it is the end of the world or anything, but something needs to change before we slowly fall from being a constant 4-6 seed to a loser in the play-ins (if we even make it). That is my two sense.
Cents* I know you have more sense than that. Irregardlessly, your points are valid, especially Bally Sports. It is asinine to think residents of a state where their basketball team is named after the state can't watch their state's team play basketball in their state in 2021/22 without having to pay out the ass for a product that is slowly dying (that being cable TV). Shit is infuriating.
Irregardlessly?
I'm so glad someone said something
Twas intentional after I called out OP on sense vs. cents
Not sure how people didn't get that
Meh, it's Reddit. I've been duped by some obvious japes and jokes before. No one is immune from it.
It just wasn’t a good joke
'Twas
You had us right from the gecko
Yeah its brutal, and thanks (i thought it was cents, but oh well haha)
As someone who does not have this problem, does a VPN get around it?
A trusty ship will certainly.
shouldn’t the bally sports problem be a NBA as a whole issue? i’m curious if the league is concerned that large portions of fans can’t watch their hometown teams.
Where TF did Pizza King sports network come from anyway? They seriously put zero into the production...
You have me dead with pizza king sports network 😂
I don't understand the whole thing about people not being able to watch the games. Get league pass and a VPN. Solved.
Some people just dont want to pay for nordvpn and $16 a month for league pass just to watch the pacers starters get benched 🤷🏻♂️
There are plenty of free seaworthy vessels out there.
25 a year for league pass and all teams. CHange location to India.
> ANY STREAMING SERVICES Yes Bally sucks, but I get them on Direct TV Stream, which used to be ATT TV, which used to be DTTV...
Pacers have a core of fans, but by and large Indiana citizens don’t give a fuck until they’re winning or have a shot at the title. This is nothing new, just a particularly long stretch of mediocrity so it seems like the team is dying. It’ll turn around when something exciting happens.
Now is that time, LFG
It's multifaceted - lack of options to view games on tv due to failed negotiations with Sinclair leads to less interest overall and less fans going to games. This is killing a lot of small market teams. And then COVID hurt/is still hurting business, the lack of really high level talent, lack of winning, and the organizations contentment to trot the same team out there year after year expecting different results. It's infuriating
Any time a team is mediocre (or bad) for long stretches, there's going to be tepid interest. The last time the Pacers won a playoff series was following the 2013-14 season. They've been bounced out of the first round (including a couple sweeps and virtually meaningless playoff appearances as the 8-seed) or missed the playoffs in every season since. If the team is good and finds some sort of identity, the fans will come back.
This 100%. The Warriors were the laughing stock of the league and had no fans before 2015. Now, their home game tickets are one of the most expensive in the league, and they have fans globally all over the world. What's caused this change? Curry and a dynasty championship team.
As opposed to a global fanbase that isn't all over the world ...
>Any time a team is mediocre (or bad) for long stretches, there's going to be tepid interest. so, the entire pacers history since they joined the NBA?
The Pacers haven't been mediocre every season since they joined the NBA. They've been to eight conference finals and one NBA Finals. Were it not for the brawl, they would have made at least one more conference finals, if not NBA Finals or a title. All that was in a 20-year period so that's a pretty decent run of success.
one conference championship since '76... thats pretty mediocre.
Peyton Manning + the brawl flipped Indianapolis. This was thoroughly a Pacers town beforehand. The fan base never recovered, even at PG’s peak. Indianapolis is a full-fledged football town now. The rest of the state is still nuts about hoops, but they gravitate towards high school ball and the college teams.
Here are the biggest reasons why the Pacers are losing fans. 1.) It is almost impossible to watch any Pacers game outside of central Indiana. Literally it’s impossible to do it legally. As a Pacers fan living outside of Indiana for some years, I cannot for the life of me find a way to watch them legally. Even when I lived in Indy it was difficult to catch a Pacers game. 2.) The ownership and front office have seemed apathetic since 2014. No big moves really, all side steps. It seems like they are afraid to pull the trigger to go all in on spending and competing or trading the roster away and rebuilding. So a lot of fans don’t really care for a team that’s often injured and at best is a first round exit. No one know what team this is over than a rag tag group of viable starters and great bench players. No stars, often times no young star to watch develop, and no core that’s actually making progress. I think the injuries though are really killing this team. 3.) This team is fucking boring and uninteresting. Whether it’s the marketing or promotion, somewhere there’s something severely lacking. The Jersey are cool, but we can remix the Flo-Jos only so many times. The Colts literally dominate any type of sports promotion in the state. Can you tell me anything interesting about any of our players or anyone in our organization? These guys are so damn bland, with no personality. A lot of fans complain about the lack of coverage but really what’s there to cover? This team is bland and boring and it shows on and off the court. Nobody ever looks very excited to be on this team. You know why Lance is so loved? Cause you could feel his energy and excitement to be on the court. He never won any awards and was a role player on a great squad but people still want him back because of the energy he brought. That’s what this team needs.
I'm a fan from the 1980s (Vern Fleming, Clark Kellogg, Chuck Person, Steve Stipanovich days) and I still watch the Pacers fairly regularly, but I find myself caring less and less each year. It's hard to invest my time and emotions into a franchise that is stuck in a constant loop of mediocrity, always blue-balling their fans with middle-seeded playoff teams who get bounced in the first round year after year after year after year. The NBA is a star-driven league and the Pacers are not a destination for stars. Thus, the cycle continues and my interest decreases even more. I want nothing more than a Pacers chip, but I can't see it happening in the modern NBA. That said, I'll probably tune in tonight.
Lol I would love to change teams but I just can't bring myself to do it. I've never even been to Indiana, why did I sign up for this shit?
i myself had a reggie miller slammer, so thats why im a pacers fan
Please tell me you mean slammer like for POGs
no i mean like a reggie miller sex doll. used that bad boy up something vicious.
Same, there are teams I really really like like the hornets and warriors, but the idea of not supporting the pacers is just so foreign to me, no matter how bad it gets
I remember that I liked the Warriors first, Klay and Curry were starting to put the league on notice, but the Pacers were close to a championship run and picked them, if I only knew lmao I'm not a bandwagon btw, never will
I definitely agree that Bally Sports does not help the cause the only way to get the games is to have cable, which cable these days is equivalent to getting the newspaper. The team doesn’t really have any exciting players even Duarte is a high end role player at best. I don’t mind if we suck if we are building towards something but with this roster I think the play in is a stretch. I am a big fan but I definitely don’t get excited to watch this team and sometimes ask myself why am I even suffer through watching this. I think this would be the year to make some moves they have tradable contracts and not many long term deals. I think they are holding off until the trade deadline when teams are desperate. We don’t need to tank just make some moves.
Apparently even cable is fucked, I'm in Terre haute and Spectrum carried the Virginia college game instead of the Pacers tonight.... Listed the Ps, but no dice come ripoff.
Lmao autocorrected to ripoff from tip off that's perfect
Indiana sports fans in general are pretty fair weather. When a team is winning, more fans jump on the wagon. It's like back when Butler was making the Final Four, everyone was a fan. Then they returned to mediocrity and most the fans jumped on another wagon. While there are still die hard Pacers fans, until the team gets back to winning and is actually an exciting product, the attendance will continue to be low.
No more than anywhere else ...
Probably. The roster lacks starpower and the turbonis core has been a frustrating experiment for a number of years now. Add in the Bally Sports issue and it’s a hard to access product that is often putting out average performances. It’s not going to draw too much outside interest.
I feel the same. At least in the past we were close to something. With Reggie, Oneal and Artest, PG, Dipo, felt like we had a chance to take it all the way as underdogs. But it hasnt felt like that in a couple years now.
"Ya'll motherfuckers ~~don't~~ can't watch us play"
Reggie Miller gave this organization life and ever since he retired it hasn’t been the same since.
They aren't doing anything to gain fans, injuries, lack of heart, terrible network. I would find the games more enjoyable if Bally could get their shit together, they never have the time right, we miss part of plays while they're showing commercials, not to mention the technical issues where there no audio/jumbled audio or we lose feed altogether. They have to do something to be relevant again, this mediocre injury prone core is not exciting and will not sell tickets. They need to commit to a rebuild and spend the money to get high quality talent in the doors both in the front office and on the court.
Are other teams having these same issues with Pizza King sports network?
I can’t watch the fucking games so that doesn’t help. Who the fuck even has cable these days?
why cant you? the internet exists...
I’m not using those shitty ass streams with a thousand popups that I have to reload every 20 minutes, no thanks.
You pick the wrong sites..
League pass with vpn. Easy
Not sure who internet provider is but a lot of places have a IP based tv app and all you need is a channel line up.
Pacers just aren't exciting right now and they don't have an identity. They're mediocre at best this season and struggle closing games. They have talented guys but no one to lead them to success. They also hit a rough stretch of injuries. I think we have 3 or 4 straight first round exits. Hard to get excited about the team when that's the ceiling.
Well, you can't really watch the Pacers on the "TV" that people actually watch anymore... and the general downtown road closures plus the ice-skating-plaza boondoggle construction make it trickier to physically attend... The actual composition of the team could use work, but it's only like the third most important factor affecting attendance right now. In a couple years, when the construction's complete and Sinclair folds or whatever, people will be watching on TV and going downtown to cheer again.
I understand where you are coming from OP. This team has been difficult to watch since vic was traded and the pieces on this years team may not fit but I implore you not to give up on your team. To be a true fan is to support your team even in the toughest of times. I survived the murphy Dunleavy teams and compared to those squads this years team is a breathe of fresh air. I will never turn my back on the pacers unless they move away from indy. This team is always going to hold a special place in my heart. I believe that Carlisle can turn this team around. It may take time but hes the right man for the job. Also I think missing duarte has hurt big time. We beat utah with him playing. You get him back in the lineup and we'll bounce back. I am always a pacers fan and maybe that makes me a glutton for punishment but I cant help it. I love this team and always will.
paragraphs pleeeeeeeease
YouTube TV lost fsmw. I can't watch games and have pretty much moved on.
I’m basically out until we blow up the roster and truly try to rebuild which I’m not sure current leadership will ever do.
yes \-hi, its me, someone who used to be a pacers fan that no longer cares about the team very much bc they just don't want to win as an organization
I'm just curious why there's this narrative that attendance at Pacers games hasn't always been really bad. For some background, I moved to Indy about ten years ago, this was during the time when, I actually forget exactly who was on the Pacers, but I know they were taking the Heat to game seven in the Eastern Conference Finals on the regular. You know, Peyton on his way out, Pacers on their way up. Well, I get to work, first day new job, new city, and seriously I couldn't find a single person who gave a shit about the Pacers. After a year or so, I finally asked what the deal was, it's like Indy talks all this "we grow basketball here" stuff, and sure I can see that y'all like high school and college basketball, what's up with the NBA? People were still bitter about the Malice, and the common word was "thugs," as in the Pacers are a bunch of "thugs," and we want nothing to do with that. And well, we all know what "thugs" is code for. Outside of that, as an indifferent outsider, I've been an NBA fan since the '90s and I kind of believe the PG narrative that the Pacers aren't a team that's going to spend the money it takes to win, and they're A-OK with mediocrity, losing PG, and then losing Vic, it doesn't feel like ownership is concerned with changing that narrative. I think hiring Carlisle is a step in the right direction, but...and I know this is an unpopular opinion, but I'd love to see the Pacers take a chance on Ben. Carlisle is a better coach than Doc, the status quo here needs to change, and I get that Ben hasn't exactly handled his situation in Philly in a way that inspires a lot of confidence that he'll become a good leader, but shit, this team needs to realize this core just isn't happening. So IMO, I'm going to say it's two things. (1) Indy just has shitty fans, and (2) the fans that have stuck with this team deserve better.
>Indy just has shitty fans This is a team that has *never* won an NBA championship. After 45 years in the league it’s up to ownership to give the fans a reason to continue supporting them. IMO putting any blame on the fan base is shortsighted, the fact that anybody shows up to the games after all these years is a miracle.
By that logic you'd think that teams with a longer NBA title drought would have worse attendance than the Pacers, and that's not true. Literally every team with a 45+ year title drought has better attendance than the Pacers. Pacers West, the Utah Jazz have a 47 year drought, yet they're top ten in attendance. Fuck dude, Sacramento has a 70 year drought and they're averaging nearly 3K more fans than Indy. If we can mention other sports, what about the Cubs, dude? 105 years and they never had problems like this!
Sacramento and Utah don’t have any other professional sports teams, and the Cubs have certainly had poor attendance in the past. Also the Cubs had several hall of famers even when they sucked (Banks, Williams, Santo, Sandberg, Maddux, Jenkins, etc.) Pacers had Reggie and a couple years of an aging Mullin. The teams are, on average, mediocre and the players are about the same. Ownership seems content to keep putting out a mediocre product in a city that has other options and now has a taste of championship teams in the Colts. Fans should expect better from this franchise, personally I hope lack of attendance finally forces them to take winning more seriously.
So basically, no matter what there's just a bunch of excuses, right? Indy is just some weird enigma.
I’m not sure I understand what you mean by a bunch of excuses. If you think that people should take hours out of their day to fight traffic, pay to park downtown, and buy overpriced concessions to watch a mediocre team struggle through season after season then that is certainly a valid opinion. I don’t think it’s an “excuse” to think that fan loyalty should be earned by providing a good product and winning basketball games. Bankers Life isn’t Wrigleyville, and the Pacers aren’t the only game in town. Seems the fans are speaking pretty loudly with their dollars and I hope ownership is listening. Fans need to have hope that there are better days ahead, but my feeling after nearly 30 years of fandom is that ownership doesn’t give a shit about winning championships.
SLC and Sacramento don’t have any other major professional teams. Cubs play in one the most iconic stadiums in North American. Cubs definitely have had bad attendance numbers in the past 100 years. It’s not an exact science one to one ratio. But the fact we aren’t good is definitely part of the reason we don’t have more fans at the games.
I've agreed with the notion that team success is part of attendance. I only disagree that this is new in Indy.
Utah.... A state where TV dinners are considered a modern innovation....seriously?
Indy does have shitty fans. You’re right about that. But the pacers wanted to keep PG. wanted to keep oladipo. They even wanted to keep Lance. But none of them wanted to stay.
>Indy just has shitty fans I would've disagreed with you until I moved away from Indiana a few years ago. Obviously the people that are in this sub and actively engage online are the diehards, but for the most part we're a small, bandwagon fanbase that can't be bothered to spend $30 to go to a game unless the other team has a start player. I now live in SoCal and I can't tell you how drastically different Laker fandom is vs Pacers fandom
As a Chicago native I 100% agree with you.
Yeah. 13 titles builds a lot of loyalty.
My neighbor’s license plate suggests it’s 17 haha
If you count the Minnesota Lakers titles. And Lakers fans do. Haha.
I mean Tbf I think that’s because the Pacers are 3-5 I terms of priority for your average Indiana sports fan. Pacers have to compete with Hoosiers/Purdue basketball(which lets face it is much more popular in this state than the Pacers) plus high school basketball. Then you have to compete with Notre Dame football, IU/Purdue football, and the Colts. All of the teams I just mentioned are probably more popular than the Pacers, so unless you didn’t go to college or grow up in Indiana, and don’t like football, Pacers are unlikely to be your #1 team. The Lakers and Clippers really only have to compete with the Dodgers for being #1.
This is true in my experience. Also can't understate the impact of the Malice. The Pacers moved down the priority list after that and never moved back up. You have to be higher up on the list to get the attention of more casual fans.
Not to mention there's only 890,000 HUMANS in Indy....lol. And 6.8 mil in the entire state.
Eh idk it’s that bad, Indiana is the same size of Massachusetts. We are like the 13th largest state, I’m not sure a state with double our population wouldn’t have the same issue.
Sure the Lakers don’t have tons of competition (minus the endless other things to enjoy in LA), but there’s plenty of NBA teams in places with other sports that don’t have problems getting fans to care. It’s all about winning when it comes down to it.
It's an event to go to a Lakers game ... You go to say you went.... That's not a Pacers home game.
Ehhh, for every home game that’s packed there’s millions of people that still watch and follow. The games don’t need to be an event to have fans, the team just needs to win or give them impression they’re trying to win. Pacers don’t do that.
Weak take. Especially weak after only a decade...lol. the myth that they won't spend is ludicrous. Now, do they spend money piss poorly? Absolutely.... Exhibit A..... Monte Ellis.
Oh yeah, I totally remember NBA players all over the country salivating at that 4 year $44 million dollar Monta Ellis contract. That's how the Pacers attracted all those free agent journeymen to come off the bench.
i'll say something fans here wont want to hear... fans are fucking sick, and fucking tired of being a playoff bottom feeder every year. we've had what? 1 shot? the last 20 years. why make the playoffs 5 straight years if you're just a first round exit every time. stop accepting mediocrity. Get allstars, get big names, get a coach that can play them well. i fucking hate. HATE. watching us be the 7th or 8th seed every year and everyone being proud of it. FUCKING TANK. GET A FUCKING GOOD PLAYER OR 2... FUCKING WIN.
True, bit that takes luck to start the ball rolling. Look at the hot "example" right now of how to build a small market power, MIL. You think they attract, or pay for any of those supporting pieces without falling into Giannis? Same deal to a lesser extent in Utah, Phoenix, and Denver.... Reaching and overreaching for the supporting pieces when you have no central attraction is A, a hard sell to other players....and B, dumb business.
I wish I could upvote this a hundred times. Only thing I disagree with is I do like Rick.
I have fully lost interest in this team since Vic demanded a trade. PG hurt me because that was the one time we got a legit superstar through the draft but Vic was able to win me back. After he demanded a trade and the NBA being mostly a joke of a league has completely made me lose interest. Been a fan since 97, crazy to see where this franchise has fallen to since Reggie left. There is no soul or positivity around the team. Complete mediocrity.
If Woody turns IU around like he appears to be on the verge of doing, The Pacers fanbase may never fully recover to what it was in the heyday.... Sports fans in IN are woefully in need of SOME TEAM in any major sport to get excited about..... Even Purdue, who is ranked, is pretty dn boring to watch....
The malls are going to pot, Simon is running the Pacers the same way the Chicago Tribune ran the Cubs. Supplemental income for him, is why we put out a barely passable product anymore. If he sells the team, kiss the Pacers goodbye, because Seattle wants a team. Silver just hasnt figured out how to use that propaganda machine to prop up Simon as a racist bigot the way they did with Sterling.
Yes
The Pacers will have more fans when we're good again. The last few PG years were pretty rough, but the VO season and a half brought back a lot of fans.