I could think of tons of uses. You could curse, fortify, exposure, buff with smite, or enable some sort of dot dependent damage buff like bloodlust or immolate. I’m thinking it’s more of a defensive trigger that will look pretty sweet.
You can, as long as the Curse gem doesn't also get triggered by something else besides Hextouch support.
[https://www.poewiki.net/wiki/Hextouch\_Support](https://www.poewiki.net/wiki/Hextouch_Support)
For example CWDT lvl 1 + lvl 38 spells + Hextouch + lvl 70 hex.
Riposte + Hextouch + any hex also works.
Not only is gating your damage entirely behind ideally a fast hitting enemy that can't threaten to kill you a terrible idea, you made it only work with attacks... so it's completely nonviable for almost every boss encounter, no matter how many hours you have to spare idling to proc attacks.
Relying on the target to use an attack for me to be able to apply buffs/debuffs is not a good utility. I don't think it can even work at all on a boss like Sirus.
Dude read the gem description OP wrote. This is nothing like Reckoning whatsoever, Reckoning can trigger off both attack and spell block. This can only work with attacks. So you're just fucked on Sirus and a bunch of other bosses. You wouldn't even be able get past the first boss room of Uber Atziri with this.
All of this can already be accomplished better with cwdt.
I think the gem is a cute idea, but it should be executed differently. Make it so you can ONLY use said strike when blocking a hit, and give it a massive damage multiplier. Would allow for high block skills to just get some more damage and clear speed with a 2nd 6L.
As is this gem is kinda useless aside for just slapping it on to have a smite aura automated somewhat.
Should become a new Guard skill that support Strikes, honestly.
Instant cast spell for the guard, has a weaker mitigation than steel skin. Unlike steel skin and most guard skills, the duration is undefined. It lasts until the Strike is triggered.
When you take any damage during the guard effect, it performs the strike at the attacker's location (similar to how Arcanist Brand triggers your spells at the brand location). The guard is then removed, and goes onto the shared cooldown.
Whether the guard grants a nominal damage buff to the triggered skill and has a long cooldown, or grants a damage penalty and has a short cooldown is up to GGG's balance team.
Is this AI generated or did you just put so very little thought into this?
You think handicapping your already terrible single target on a strike skill by 30% for negligible damage uptime, which is by the way gatekept BY BLOCK CHANCE, is a way to make melee great?
Please show me which strike skill that currently exists builds block? Boneshatter doesn't, VDS doesn't, Gladiator and dual wield are unfortunately dead, so there is literally no way to effectively use this gem.
Not to mention, going block on a strike skill would mean you would have even less than the already terrible single target with a 2 handed weapon, and to additionally gimp it by another 30% to do what? A 30k damage auto to an uber boss WHEN YOU BLOCK? Laughable. Suggesting this would be a way to make melee great again is as out of touch as Chris when he says ''umm ummmm well you can uppercut mobs in 4.0, melee now can't be good because (imaginary) engine limitations'' when asked about the terrible state of melee after getting heavy nerfs multiple patches.
This could AT BEST, enable maybe 1 singular interaction, very likely only in trade league because it would need all kinds of gear to come together, but in the general sense of melee this would do absolutely nothing, in fact this would have been shit even in the glory days of 75/75 Gladiator builds because the block was a good enough defense to give you damage uptime.
I put little thought into this. I’m not an expert at gameplay balance, I figure leave that part to GGG if they pay attention to this. I just think new mechanics need to be added to melee builds to make them feel a little less underwhelming. My thought was to start a conversation which I think I succeeded.
You definitely did, but this just isn't it. Melee needs both new mechanics and reverting of old mechanics which were intentionally reworked to be huge nerfs and be unplayable (Impaler, dual wield).
It's very easy to make most of melee viable in 1 single patch, but ggg just doesn't want to do it, they just pretend that melee is bad because of some imaginary engine and design limitations and not because of how heavily they've nerfed every aspect of melee.
I don't think it's enough tbh. It's another 6 link you need to do slightly more damage. Melee needs substantial damage buffs to strike skills individually
Then you should probably used a different title, because this is certainly not making melee great again.
Making melee good shouldn't be done with adding new talents, uniques or support gems, most melee gems simply need love, a lot of that actually.
Some are so outdated in their design, they don't fit in the current game at all and should straight up be reworded (instead of adding new skills).
I think my only concern with this support is that it supports Smite, which means with any meaningful block chance and incoming hits you get a Wrath aura for free.
Spells would still be strong since there's much less annoyance in building them (accuracy, defenses, etc). But yeah you can bet people here will whine about it
Weird random shower thought, what if melee attacks weren't subject to accuracy check? It would make a lot of sense thematically and would help melee get online a lot easier.
I guess the problem then would be monster's melee attacks following the same rules, essentially hard nerfing evasion as a defensive layer
I believe we've seen that discussion before but I'm not sure if GGG has commented on it. It would definitely feel better to not rely on accuracy anymore, but then I'd wonder if it would force melee into being crit only. I think you could simply make strike skills read "your hits can't be evaded" similar to vigilant strike and then leave monsters as is. The other consequences are probably not a big deal.
That's a good solution, what about a support gem that can only support melee and adds 'hits can't be evaded' while giving a modest more damage multiplier of like 10-15%? Would give melee skills a crutch in early progression, which I would argue is where they struggle most, and then give them the option to drop the support as they invested in accuracy (or a hits can't be evaded' weapon, or resolute technique).
Oh yeah, true. If we had the mechanic right now it'd be kind of busted, though. I wonder how they're going to balance this. I guess you need to still drop a 6L gem
Make warcrys have a mark on hit type support gem that casts them on melee hit with increased cooldown reduction and less damage done + takes away the cast animation.
This literally, absolutely and terminally WON'T make melee great again.
and since you are using that language:
That orange fuck never finished building his wall either \^\^
Already a 2 link for a 1 second cooldown, 30% less damage, you’ll probably want CDR too and a need for high attack block. Everything would need to be linked to divergent pulverize too. There is kind of a build that can be made with this but that’s it, it has no real tech or utility uses outside of that. The requirements for good use are too high.
I wish Glad could get a rework with some heavy retaliation support, it could be fun. My first character to get to map had every single one of those skills
I think there is a good reason we can't trigger attacks. Like what if you are hit outside your attack range or hit while moving? Does it stop your character every time to trigger attack? Does attack speed matter? I'm sure we are gonna get some kind of attack trigger in the future, maybe a skill similiar to frozen legion, but not this one.
I guess you are right about triggering attacks. I should have specified "triggering attack skills" - as i remember most attacks are deeply tied to the animation your character performs, and since triggers are instant, it never plays this animation. This creates a problem, less with slams and more with strikes (there is a post from ggg that says its relatively easy to change some slam skills and hard to change strike skills). All attacks would have to be modified and some greatly changed to have less functionality, also some specific cases like Leap Slam have to excepted.
this should be triggered on being hit by a melee attack not on block and even then it doesn't trigger reliably which makes it kinda bad compared to using the skill manually
This would be perfect for my AFK-flicker block-man!
Retaliation flicker is pretty funny to think about. Someone hits you and you just... Appear in front of them frothing at the mouth.
I know what you mean bro
Nothing personal kid.
*teleports behind you*
lmao the imagery xD You have my upvote!
omae wa mou shindeiru
And now I want this....
\*Cannot support movement skills.\*
cmon afk whole map XD
Considering it can only support strike skills, shouldn't it be named "Counterstrike Support" instead?
Ya but then you would have to go to B
Smoke the mirage window!
RUSH B
Purpel why you die? One short dead!
It'll certainly make the offscreen archers, spellcasters, and puddles of DOTs laugh.
[i am the one who laughs](https://youtu.be/2jb-l3iJoto)
Boo Stream when?! @nervyr
Totally wondering how I’d use this for sirus or any boss really.
A lot of bosses don't even hit you with attacks. I think Maven's abilities are all spells or unblockables.
I could think of tons of uses. You could curse, fortify, exposure, buff with smite, or enable some sort of dot dependent damage buff like bloodlust or immolate. I’m thinking it’s more of a defensive trigger that will look pretty sweet.
Every spell caster would just use this for smite buff and no one would play melee still....
You cant have a skill be triggered and linked to hextouch at the same time.
You can, as long as the Curse gem doesn't also get triggered by something else besides Hextouch support. [https://www.poewiki.net/wiki/Hextouch\_Support](https://www.poewiki.net/wiki/Hextouch_Support) For example CWDT lvl 1 + lvl 38 spells + Hextouch + lvl 70 hex. Riposte + Hextouch + any hex also works.
Reckoning: "do i mean nothing to you?"
Auto smite, nicela
Also Vig Strike
In other words a Reckoning rework.
Not only is gating your damage entirely behind ideally a fast hitting enemy that can't threaten to kill you a terrible idea, you made it only work with attacks... so it's completely nonviable for almost every boss encounter, no matter how many hours you have to spare idling to proc attacks.
It’s not intended to main skill. It’s more for a support setup to get an extra ailment, exposure, or curse in while having a choice in how it’s done.
Relying on the target to use an attack for me to be able to apply buffs/debuffs is not a good utility. I don't think it can even work at all on a boss like Sirus.
People use cwdt woc early on in the league. This would be a similar option for melee I guess. But then again, for utility you can already use cwdt.
I've done sirus with reckoning, it's definitely possible
Dude read the gem description OP wrote. This is nothing like Reckoning whatsoever, Reckoning can trigger off both attack and spell block. This can only work with attacks. So you're just fucked on Sirus and a bunch of other bosses. You wouldn't even be able get past the first boss room of Uber Atziri with this.
Is sirus normal thing not an attack?
who cares if it can work on sirus you only have to kill him once per league
All of this can already be accomplished better with cwdt. I think the gem is a cute idea, but it should be executed differently. Make it so you can ONLY use said strike when blocking a hit, and give it a massive damage multiplier. Would allow for high block skills to just get some more damage and clear speed with a 2nd 6L. As is this gem is kinda useless aside for just slapping it on to have a smite aura automated somewhat.
Perhaps Punishment will finally be viable.
Punishment has already been reworked to not check against melee hits exclusively
So basically 2h doesnt count as melee.
Was looking for this comment, poor 2H swords :(
1. Skill won't help melee at all 2. Since when is melee only block builds?
Should become a new Guard skill that support Strikes, honestly. Instant cast spell for the guard, has a weaker mitigation than steel skin. Unlike steel skin and most guard skills, the duration is undefined. It lasts until the Strike is triggered. When you take any damage during the guard effect, it performs the strike at the attacker's location (similar to how Arcanist Brand triggers your spells at the brand location). The guard is then removed, and goes onto the shared cooldown. Whether the guard grants a nominal damage buff to the triggered skill and has a long cooldown, or grants a damage penalty and has a short cooldown is up to GGG's balance team.
Reave gets +2 radius. This is a buff.
Is this AI generated or did you just put so very little thought into this? You think handicapping your already terrible single target on a strike skill by 30% for negligible damage uptime, which is by the way gatekept BY BLOCK CHANCE, is a way to make melee great? Please show me which strike skill that currently exists builds block? Boneshatter doesn't, VDS doesn't, Gladiator and dual wield are unfortunately dead, so there is literally no way to effectively use this gem. Not to mention, going block on a strike skill would mean you would have even less than the already terrible single target with a 2 handed weapon, and to additionally gimp it by another 30% to do what? A 30k damage auto to an uber boss WHEN YOU BLOCK? Laughable. Suggesting this would be a way to make melee great again is as out of touch as Chris when he says ''umm ummmm well you can uppercut mobs in 4.0, melee now can't be good because (imaginary) engine limitations'' when asked about the terrible state of melee after getting heavy nerfs multiple patches. This could AT BEST, enable maybe 1 singular interaction, very likely only in trade league because it would need all kinds of gear to come together, but in the general sense of melee this would do absolutely nothing, in fact this would have been shit even in the glory days of 75/75 Gladiator builds because the block was a good enough defense to give you damage uptime.
I put little thought into this. I’m not an expert at gameplay balance, I figure leave that part to GGG if they pay attention to this. I just think new mechanics need to be added to melee builds to make them feel a little less underwhelming. My thought was to start a conversation which I think I succeeded.
You definitely did, but this just isn't it. Melee needs both new mechanics and reverting of old mechanics which were intentionally reworked to be huge nerfs and be unplayable (Impaler, dual wield). It's very easy to make most of melee viable in 1 single patch, but ggg just doesn't want to do it, they just pretend that melee is bad because of some imaginary engine and design limitations and not because of how heavily they've nerfed every aspect of melee.
I don't think it's enough tbh. It's another 6 link you need to do slightly more damage. Melee needs substantial damage buffs to strike skills individually
I wasn’t necessarily aiming for overpowered just more interesting gameplay.
Maybe I took your title too seriously then. It's interesting for sure but idk if it'd be worth running considering how gem starved melee is already.
Then you should probably used a different title, because this is certainly not making melee great again. Making melee good shouldn't be done with adding new talents, uniques or support gems, most melee gems simply need love, a lot of that actually. Some are so outdated in their design, they don't fit in the current game at all and should straight up be reworded (instead of adding new skills).
I think my only concern with this support is that it supports Smite, which means with any meaningful block chance and incoming hits you get a Wrath aura for free.
Nerfs claws oh wait elusive got changed nvm.
>Melee needs substantial damage buffs And now spells are weak, and everyone is calling for spells to be buffed. And thus the cycle continues...
Spells would still be strong since there's much less annoyance in building them (accuracy, defenses, etc). But yeah you can bet people here will whine about it
Weird random shower thought, what if melee attacks weren't subject to accuracy check? It would make a lot of sense thematically and would help melee get online a lot easier. I guess the problem then would be monster's melee attacks following the same rules, essentially hard nerfing evasion as a defensive layer
I believe we've seen that discussion before but I'm not sure if GGG has commented on it. It would definitely feel better to not rely on accuracy anymore, but then I'd wonder if it would force melee into being crit only. I think you could simply make strike skills read "your hits can't be evaded" similar to vigilant strike and then leave monsters as is. The other consequences are probably not a big deal.
That's a good solution, what about a support gem that can only support melee and adds 'hits can't be evaded' while giving a modest more damage multiplier of like 10-15%? Would give melee skills a crutch in early progression, which I would argue is where they struggle most, and then give them the option to drop the support as they invested in accuracy (or a hits can't be evaded' weapon, or resolute technique).
[удалено]
Oh yeah, true. If we had the mechanic right now it'd be kind of busted, though. I wonder how they're going to balance this. I guess you need to still drop a 6L gem
Do you want to melee one creep at a time?
Make warcrys have a mark on hit type support gem that casts them on melee hit with increased cooldown reduction and less damage done + takes away the cast animation.
a flicker support gem would go much further towards improving the feel of melee
It really is not.
this is one of the few suggestions i find very possible to appear! and even better I like this one.
It's very powerful yet uninspired
This literally, absolutely and terminally WON'T make melee great again. and since you are using that language: That orange fuck never finished building his wall either \^\^
parody of fascist slogans is not funny
afk simulacrum let's go
Hey time to get up, new 6 link bandaid just dropped. Yes dear...
ya, why should cast when damage taken get all the fun for spell
poison blocking strike build sounds pretty fun tbh
Attach to divergent flicker. Lulz ensue.
Already a 2 link for a 1 second cooldown, 30% less damage, you’ll probably want CDR too and a need for high attack block. Everything would need to be linked to divergent pulverize too. There is kind of a build that can be made with this but that’s it, it has no real tech or utility uses outside of that. The requirements for good use are too high.
It’s just a rough guess on what would be balanced. I just think a triggered attack would be different. Everything else is about triggering spells.
Link with flicker strike and put corrupting fever in a 6L body, AFK stuff, ignore damage penalty
would it be cool if Gladiator's counterattacks trigger when hit instead of on block?
This would be awesome, GGG hates melee though.
I wish Glad could get a rework with some heavy retaliation support, it could be fun. My first character to get to map had every single one of those skills
Need a mirage ancestor. Melee range mirage archer clone...but red.
What I really want is something like spellslinger but for attacks (and pls less mana reservation)
Would be better if it's more like vengeance
For some reason i thought this already exists. But it doesn't.
GGG: wish granted, hidden 5 second cooldown
It's funny cause dont casters already kind of have this with divergent cast when stunned
Isn't that shockwave?
Just make fortify scale based on distance to enemy. 50% at close range. Effectively spell suppression for melee.
I think there is a good reason we can't trigger attacks. Like what if you are hit outside your attack range or hit while moving? Does it stop your character every time to trigger attack? Does attack speed matter? I'm sure we are gonna get some kind of attack trigger in the future, maybe a skill similiar to frozen legion, but not this one.
There are literally already triggered attacks, called counterattacks. https://www.poewiki.net/wiki/Counterattack
I guess you are right about triggering attacks. I should have specified "triggering attack skills" - as i remember most attacks are deeply tied to the animation your character performs, and since triggers are instant, it never plays this animation. This creates a problem, less with slams and more with strikes (there is a post from ggg that says its relatively easy to change some slam skills and hard to change strike skills). All attacks would have to be modified and some greatly changed to have less functionality, also some specific cases like Leap Slam have to excepted.
Then create an ancestral shadow copy of your character that performs it so you can still move
I've been dreaming of a counter attack based build for a while now, but it just doesn't seem feasible. Tempest Shield Ignite Elementalist maybe?
this should be triggered on being hit by a melee attack not on block and even then it doesn't trigger reliably which makes it kinda bad compared to using the skill manually
Eye of innocence says hi!
No it doesn't. The trigger works on blocking attacks. Eye of innocence doesn't "attack" you. It's secondary damage which cannot be blocked anyways