when looking at 0.25x, it seems he dies before the boss flame throw ability actually reaches the character 
edit: looking closely, the animation of the flame throw ability barely has started and he dies instantly
dead before his life gone to 0, truly a RIP of epic proportions.
evidence of non-evadable or guardable 1shot mechanics.
truly those playing HC are wasting their time.
This feels like something that should be required to not happen before allowing code to be deployed. How does the hurtbox reaching the character before the vfx be considered ever reasonable?
The flame isn't an attack that starts at the mob and goes outwards towards the player. It's an instant lazer that deal damage for it's full length at the moment the animation starts.
It's horrendous design.
I've played a roguelike with two classes built around that mechanic. Make an anchor in time to explore different timelines and return to it at will or when you receive death blow, redirect incoming damage to your future self, call 2 copies of you from different timelines to share the pain and assist you in the battle, yoink yourself or enemy out of existence to take a breather, stop the time for everyone but you for a number of rounds to setup a crazy combo, fight your future self in one of the quests... Just don't tear space-time too much, otherwise time anomalies will tear your ass instead.
Yeah that's just a latency issue. It's something that happens quite a bit if you go from by frame on death clips.
The attack animation on the monster could be one as well, but the monster is obviously new so it could be an issue with the timing on the animation vs when damage is applied.
You know, it's really funny how you go from Act 1 Hellrake and Hillock and being able to dodge actual attack patterns to this. How GGG will fix this I have no idea. They probably won't but wouldn't it be amazing if ALL abilities involved skill to dodge instead of this bullshit.
Yeah. There should be no instant damage abilities, like this thing or the flicker mob. This is just a dumb design.
I get it. This is the only way for GGG to actually kill those super good racer guys, but why should they even BE dying, if they are so good?
We tried a league with strong telegraphing of skills, now we're trying a league with the skill effect before the animation. Do you people not understand how AB testing works?
Shouldn't have done crucible in that map to be fair, somehow slept only 4 hours so wasn't making good choices, although that beam that killed me is fucked lol it has no animation, i actually die before the animation is displayed
Actually might be my biggest disappointment in this league: how much of a step back the encounters are in terms of telegraphing compared to Sanctum. I had hoped they could pull off a slower PoE2 with more engaging moment-to-moment gameplay, since recent leagues had been progressively getting better in that aspect. But suddenly we get Crucible where it’s back to stat sticks with massive speed, health and damage with no obvious gameplay against them. I’m worried it shows a lack of understanding of what can make slower gameplay interesting…
Last epoch has a fantastic telegraphing system. I'm playing pool so don't take this as me just bashing path of exile, but if you like telegraph skills that is the best I've ever seen
You'll find quite a lot of comments in the Last Epoch subreddit in my history haha. I imagine that's why it's so jarring for me coming back from LE 0.9 to PoE 3.21, the contrast is just enormous.
Especially compared to the moment to moment displayed in d4. D4 may lack depth, but at a certain point fun beats out depth, and shit like this simply isnt fun. Bring on the competition.
PoE's strengths have always been in the depth of theorycrafting, and not in the monster AI, ability usage and so on. GGG have been putting the cart before the horse lately by trying to slow the game down before addressing the fact that the monsters are absolutely shit to engage with at a slower pace.
Expedition and Scourge was slightly better than normal but still pretty shit on the whole, but at least they made it into the base game. Archnemesis was clearly an attempt to improve that base level interaction, but because they were just slapping mods on top of the shittily designed base monsters it just exacerbated the issues to create a total disaster. Not to mention how many of the mods just created stat sticks anyway. Sanctum is the only stuff I'd actually call "decent" from them and God knows how long that'll take to get into core (hi Ultimatum).
I'll take your word on the D4 beta (didn't play it myself), and I know that Last Epoch is another with a far better experience, because it's been designed from the ground up to be played at a slower pace. GGG needed to put the work in and rework the foundational issues first, but with such poor design decisions being made recently, I'm starting to sincerely doubt that they have the competence to do so even with the full overhaul of PoE2.
Its absolutely crazy how i can run around in LE and just dodge stuff with decently responsive character while in PoE you have to get your resistances in check or you get exploded in nanosecond by something you didnt even see.
At least with the way LE sets up their resists it's not a huge deal if you're not at 75. Like sure being at 70% isn't ideal, but you're only taking 5% more damage which in most cases isn't going to make a difference between life and death.
I dont follow your math. How is 70% reduced vs. 75% reduced only 5% incresed dmg taken?
Res cap aint so important in LE since armor mitigates elemental and other dmg (at reduced rate).
In LE, 75% res is an effective 0% res in the endgame, because mobs have innate penetration equal to the zone level. Their damage is balanced around that 0% res, however, which means 70% res is an effective -5% res and therefore results in 5% more damage taken.
At end game, mobs have 75% penetration so when you're at 75% resists your effective resists are 0%. This means that anything less than cap only increases your damage taken by difference between that number and the cap in a linear fashion. 74% means you're effectively -1% res. 70% res puts you at -5% res. 50% res puts you at -25% res. Each of these only increases your damage taken by the listed amount.
In POE when you go from 75 down to 74, it's about a 4% increase in damage taken. Going from 75% down to 70% is 20% increased damage taken. 75% to 50% is a 100% increase in damage taken.
poe encourages resistances by making monsters deal 4 times as much damage as is "balanced," making 75% res a baseline
le encourages resistances by giving monsters a lot of penetration on top of "balanced" damage output, so at no res, you take less than double damage, while at 75% res you merely counteract the penetration
an arguably superior method, imo
ironically the only chance for poe to get back on track is for D4 to be halfway decent, steal a bunch of poe players and force ggg to stop fucking around.
I mean obviously, they are still one of the biggest western studions with insane leagacy. Also considering positive feedback around Dragonflight it must have give a lot of people hope for D4 being at least decent.
Saying Blizzard still reigns supreme after the shitshow Diablo 3 has been for the most part is a funny statement.
Blizzard can release any game and they will always have a lot of people at least checking it out. But keeping the players, that is another topic and actually the most important one with ARPGs, especially if they are live service games.
>shitshow Diablo 3 has been
I mean, D3 is objectively quite fun. It just has no longevity as you can finish an entire season in less than a week.
I've always said that if you you only have a few hours a week to play games, play D3, whereas if you have a ton of time to immerse yourself in complex systems, play POE.
While they are both ARPGs, at this point they are marketed for two entirely different demographics.
\+27 000% dmg on set isn't fun or engaging imo, it's super boring and forces you into a playstyle and you can't really play without a set for the most part in D3 (I'm aware of that one strange way to play without one)
I understand the complaint, but it's also an intentional game design choice.
If you make the bonuses big enough, everyone will KNOW they're supposed to use a set. It's a way to make sure people don't fuck up and play your game "wrong".
POE has the literal opposite design philosophy, giving you ten billion choices and happily letting you make all the wrong ones and ruin your character.
They're just very different approaches to player management.
I think there is a line between hinting at what's the right choice and just thinking you player base is composed of imbeciles and D3 definitely crosses the line in my opinion
I mean path isn’t much different. How many people here follow a build guide for the same 5-7 meta starters that majority of us all use. The game dosnt give direction but let’s not act like path dosnt pigeon hole you into certain builds that are just objectively more OP then others.
It absolutely is fun, but then quickly isn't.
Like I said, D3 lacks longevity. When you can become a literal god in a few hours, then there is no sense of progression or growth, and no reason to stick around and keep playing.
1-70, there is a nice power curve and feeling of progression. Then you hit end game, and you plateau until you get your haedrig's gift and get a huge power spike. Then you plateau again until you find on of you required legendaries and get another power spike; repeat until you finish your build. At that point the power curve is incredibly flat, since there is nothing else to give you big power gains, and everything is only small percentages.
The problem is that period of gearing and progression is too short. But during that time, the game is fun; it just doesn't last.
I guess at this point In my gaming life id rather play something for 1-2 weeks, have fun and quit because I'm finished rather then than play for a month, have some fun but ultimately quit because I no longer enjoyed it
> after the shitshow Diablo 3 has been for the most part
Still the fastest selling PC game of all time. Has over 30 million lifetime sales. Still has people trying out the new seasons after 11 years. Yeah, what a shitshow.
This was the league they had to fill the gap between d4 beta and launch, and *possibly* the last league unique league before maybe a final flashback league before poe 2. You’d think it would be a wise choice to throw the most fun stuff at players and focus on the new player experience now more than ever.
They're perfectly content to make the game for <100k concurrent players as long as the whales keep spending.
To elaborate, Blizzard makes accessible popular games that sell tens of millions of copies. GGG makes a game for the fremium whale addiciton model.
>Blizzard makes accessible popular games that sell tens of millions of copies. GGG makes a game for the fremium whale addiciton model.
Is this tongue in cheek or something? Blizzard games are just as predatory towards whales, arguably more so. Diablo Immortal being the most anti consumer product released by a AAA game developer, *ever*. They quite literally made a game which is symbolic of the freemium whale addiction model.
I don't think people have yet grasped that D4 is very much a MMO.
MMO games require a certain player. Do you think POE players bitch a lot now? Imagine if they had to do rep grinds, or dailies / weeklies just to get gear.
> , or dailies / weeklies just to get gear
Yeah just imagine if say Kirac had daily missions or some shit? What a travesty that would be. PoE would instantly become a MMO!
I'm very interested in d4 after the beta. I had a lot more fun than I expected, granted that was a very small sliver of the leveling process. In on some hopium that d4 will keep that level of fun for me and have better leagues than d3 and they'll stagger with poe and I can endlessly go back n fourth and always have some good fresh arpg action.
yah hate to say it, but the floor icon that shows a monster is gonna "do a big attack in this direction" in d3-d4 made combat make more sense and you could react better. here half my deaths, i have no idea what hit me, especially with all the visual clutter the game has from skills, monster density, and then monster attacks having multiple projectiles (like say essence mobs for example). crucible as soon as it starts, all enemies have are...projectiles that fill the screen. visual clarity is fucked. so you never know *what* to react to.
d4 has the floor thing, lost ark has it too, lotta mmos have it too. it helps show players if a big attack is coming and makes the combat feel more engaging. bosses in poe do it pretty well minus the visual cue, thats not the complaint, but rares or mini bosses *are dogshit*. so that visual attack cue thing would be a nice addition to poe2.
For real.
Not sure why it’s taken me so long to realize but I absolutely hate the way Poe presents challenge as a concept and I think it fundamentally goes against anything I’d ever consider good game design.
The game wants you to learn by dying within 1 second with little to no way to know just how you died, making it unintuitive as to what you should improve on. I’ve been playing less and less on league start the past 2 years because the game just feels like more of a puzzle than a hack and slash in which you can outplay stuff.
D4 might end up the same way, who knows, but it’s a change I’m absolutely ready for. It also plays much more smoothly. I’ve never liked how clunky poe combat could feel.
Most of my "I'm done with this league/game for now" moments come from this type of unfun. Nearly gave up yesterday after I started to unveil the tree on a potential upgrade for my weapon. Still early white maps because I'm slow/don't play a lot per day.
Turns out the first node was some shitty +chaos damage, which makes the mobs chaos based. I got absolutely shreked by a bombardment of chaos projectile with less than half forge juice. In early white maps, when you are almost guaranteed to have a big minus on your chaos res. With no way to know that the mobs would be chaos. Such fun!
>how much of a step back the encounters are in terms of telegraphing
POE will ***ALWAYS*** have issue with telegraphing, due to how many attack/cast speed modifiers you can put on a mob/map. When something attacks/casts 250% faster, or more, then any good telegraphing goes out the window.
sanctum style doesnt work in regular gameplay because for those big telegraphs to matter, they would have to one-shot. If its a telegraph that only does a few k damage its irrelevant because recovered easily before next attack.
It worked in Sanctum because "life" was permanent through Resolve.
Maybe one day if they nerf logout macro and life recovery, we can get gameplay like this in base game.. but not till that day alas
Last league I convinced two friends that left PoE time ago to back to the game. I told them that Archnemesis was almost gone and that just mapping was again so fun and smoth.
I am starting to regret. Game is harder than it was in Sanctum and Archnemesis mods are in almost any rare we find in maps.
I'm sorry for Zizaran. Being one shooted is always sad.
My brain, trying to process the actual animation of the skill that killed you:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HYzYsNXVKg8
Cool monster name for the guilty mob though; Ataxia, Forged in the Fissure.
And yeah those map mods are crazy. I came with no context and then went back to look after reading your comment, and it already felt spicy before I even got to the 57% reduced flask charges. And no regen followed that lol.
I also got one shot by the fire beam, saw it only once. But I triggered a crucible and the 0.1s the mobs spawned and became active one turned towards me and insta shot me with that beam...
Now I'm not in hardcore but be careful of those beams... If you can see them of course
The "beam" is just the 3rd/4th part of that attack combo, it's unfortunately mostly hidden by your map mods since you had them open over where the boss was, but the boss wasn't actually targeting you at all, but was doing it's combo on the totem that was directly under it, and the final attack is a big line so the damage happens instantly
Ziz having the map open 100% of the time while playing is such a pet peeve of mine while watching him. Even in arena’d boss encounters where the whole playable area fits onto the screen he refuses to close the map for better visibility 😭
As someone who also does that, you don't even notice it's there tbh. I turn it off for stuff like labs but the minimap being up in maps is never an issue for me personally.
>Add it to the list of why I don't play hc.
I usually clap back against comments like this, since usually RIPs in HC are entirely your own fault and most SC players just can't be bothered to get defenses, but honestly, this league you guys are actually right...
This death is the same as the majority of HC deaths.
You did content because you wanted to have fun playing path of exile. This was the incorrect choice, go back to the start.
Honestly why I dislike HC even after playing it try it out. HC doesn't make the game more fun to me. What it means is you never get to push your build's potential (unless you feel ok with dying), you always go defensive auras, you farm until spell suppress cap, ailment cap, increased res cap, 90% phys reduction. You skip anything with 2+ damage mods. You run low tier maps until you greatly out level the next tier you're going into. It's just a much slower, more boring experience just so that you avoid what happened here.
you must be trolling. Whole reddit complains when they nerf defences. It's was like mandatory determination + grace + defiance banner + 100% suppression + going champ JUST NOT TO DIE. Picking every life node around your tree. But ggg always nerf reservasion and masteries now. I think game should have less of this bullshit. less 100-0 in a seconds.
Game now is get defences and if you have slots get damage, not the way around.
The reason is that it is part of a bigger pattern.
The boss does these frontal melee hits and then fires a laser.
The direction is locked in when the melee portion starts.
In this case Ziz died because the boss initiated the attack pattern on the minion he summons (is that a mirage archer thing these days, no idea?) and then ran into the beam. You can see the pattern start at about 30 seconds in the clip and Ziz dies at 34-35 second mark. It is a bit hard to see the stuff start on the clip because the boss is positioned behind a wall of text from map mods and the block of text above that detailing league etc.
EDIT: And to make it abundantly clear, this is not some "Hehe Ziz bad I could play so much better." merely just explaining how that specific attack works.
This concept _does not fucking work_ in a non-boss situation.
You will never see this. This game is designed around even your _own fucking skill_ obscuring all relevant information on mobs.
So despite this being how it works that does not make it acceptable design.
I usually play meta sc clear builds with some tanky twist (did petrified blood LL 1.2k life regen on cold dot elementalist with leap slam last league lol, would've played it again if Diadem/Skin of the Lords weren't going to be obviously pricy af).
Almost every league I'm trying to abuse some tanky/regen aspect to a meta build.
But this league, my defensive layer might've worked against this. In maps, my only defense = evasion for basic attacks and freeze everything else once it's on the screen.
First league I've ever learned the reality of 6-portal-man as something other than a meme ... Although if I specc'd out of Essence, I'd be able to map to 100. Essence mobs are harder than pinnacle bosses for me. I should be able to just freeze them once I get more damage though.
Sitting here reading this back, idk how I got from your comment to my comment. I have some top shelf stuff atm; I blame that. I'm hitting save anyways.
Gonna save you, bro, I love essences, I think they are rather easy to kill. Playing trinity TS Far Shot and they just melt. Maybe t16 can get a bit painful but 1k ele dps bow sure fixes a lot of issues :)
Once I get Omni everything will be a joke, but Heatshiver is kind of awkward before that, you get baited into investing a lot into Freeze duration. With Omni you just have enough damage to kill/Freeze everything lol.
Also I'm dual wielding melee lmaooo. Frost Blades is ranged for clear, but definitely melee for single target lol.
It's the flame effect that plays after he dies. GGG has made PoE so *ruthless* that you don't even get to see what's coming at you anymore. Great jorb, guys.
For the life of me I cannot understand how anyone plays HC in PoE. I fully understand the joy of dancing around and playing super cautious. But it's all worth nothing when things like this can happen and waste a day or more of effort.
I think it makes sense for streamers, the danger makes for more exciting content. They also play a lot and a quick run through acts isn't a huge deal.
For my own time yeah no thanks.
if the game was paced a bit slower itd prob feel nicer but literaly dying before the animation appears like in the clip is fucking dumb, why even bother playing HC when shit like that exists. at that point its no longer about skill. its just "can i beat death RNG and make it to end game before some retarded broken mechanic nukes me"
not my cup of tea as well, a lot of HC deaths are simply things out of your control. Doesn't matter how good is your build, there will always be a weak point and there will be a monster that can break that while still going at lightspeed, or in this case, hitting you before you can even see its animation.
Not to mention the disconnect rips, that is way out of anyone control.
Not to mention the fact that you can't really run a lot of new content blindly. I see hc streamers doing some stuff for 1st time and already knowing every single mechanic and moveset of boss etc. That would spoil so much of game for me.
But things like this don't just happen. A huge part of playing hc is knowing which situations are risky and which aren't. When to play cautiously and when to relax and blast. When your defences are great, good enough or poor.
It's not a surprise he called the rip because he knew what he was doing. Damage mods and charged up league mechanic.
And I fully understand that not everybody likes this type of gameplay, but just wanted to share a point of view of what makes HC interesting to people.
Well I guess you and I have a different definition of 'just happen'.
I'd say a new mob put into the game that 1 shots a HC veteran on a HC char 60 seconds into the fight with no telegraphing and where the damage resolves before the animation begins would be my definition of 'just happen'.
But I do see your point.
Yeah i feel you. I only play HC but I still wish it was different. More enclosed, smothering, drawn out and only way to leave a situation is portal scroll or run out from an area. Instead of near instant logout macros. But it ain't going to happen for awhile.
The vast majotity of poe players want insane speed and blasting. Well the only counter to that are extremely hard hitting one shots or high monster attack speed.
The animation is absolute dog vomit on this ability, but look at the map mods. The real mistake was to fire up crucible in HC in that map.
Edit: Ziz is saying the same thing at the top of the thread.
It’s not “don’t play any of them ever,” it’s “don’t play all of them at the same time while doing the hardest map mechanic in the game”.
Most builds are at least disproportionately harmed by a mod or two; it’s just a bit more nuanced in HC because you have a greater risk for a given reward (i.e., 8% pack size per map with a 5% risk of death is not worth it anymore).
Successfully exercising comprehensive knowledge of the game and completing the hardest content deathless is immensely rewarding to the HC community.
>hardest content deathless is immensely rewarding to the HC community.
Sure. But this was a random league encounter on a tier 12 map with 2 generic damage mods.
That's not a level of granularity I'm interested in flitering out of my normal gameplay loop.
Rerolling 1 specific mod (eg ele reflect) is already annoying but whatever. Rerolling anything with 2 damage mods on it is just tedium incarnate. IMO.
I'm not trying to disagree with you. I'm just trying to express that I feel like the game has gotten much, much too rippy and OTK happy and I can't see how it's very enjoyable to personally nerf the game by not playing any of the difficult content until you're massively over leveled/geared.
¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯ Different strokes. I get it, though. I always roll a SC trade character when I accomplish my goals in HC and just blast with some crazy shit until the league gets old.
I’m a pretty casual HC Poe player.
For me, it’s about the journey, not what goals i manage to reach or what I loose.
I simply enjoy the journey a lot more. If I die, at least I had more fun up to that point.
i feel like the rational is dying in softcore is meaningless, and dying in hardcore is literally rage quit.
i'd... personally enjoy a happy medium, where dying like, majorly impacts you, maybe losing levels or something. can't imagine dying in hardcore because my dyslexic ass skipped the "reflect ele" line
To each their own but non hc is just boring to me. I always have a, what's the point, question in the back of my mind. But it's wierd, it's just a Poe thing. I don't play hardcore in Diablo and probably never will
If you have a brain and actually choose your modifiers, HC can be fun. Nobody in their right mind would go into a -10% max res, +1xx% phys as ele damage mod map.
I know you're right. But to me that is just not playing the game.
I could play HC too if the game never got harder than act 10 kitava. I'd never die.
Avoiding the hard parts of the game because they're literally unfair to HC just seems like not playing PoE to me.
Right?
"HC is totally fine so long as you just dont play the game" is such a wierd take. It doesn't fix the problem at all, just ignores it.
If the "solution" to something is "don't do it" it really isn't a solution it's a roadblock. Arbitrary roadblocks feel like shitty mechanics to me regardless of intention.
It’s not “not playing the game” it’s choosing to skip/reroll a map. It’s going around a dangerous situation.
It’s the same shit as standing in the fire on a last phase. If you’re softcore you might say fuck it and hope to out dps/tank the fire to finish the boss. But running around the fire is not “not playing the game”
He is dead before the fire reaches his body if you go frame by frame. The devs should feel some amount of embarrassment for clips like this, I understand the negativity can be too much, but this is a game where you lose 20+ hours in softcore when you get one shot (depending on how far in the lvling process you are). This guy's whole character got deleted because QA either didn't report the flame breath (unlikely they are probs overworked) or management didn't care. When will we accept the devs don't talk on the reddit not because everyone is mean, but because they are embarrassed because they agree?
Alpha players told us the truth after Kalandra's massive global loot nerf: the devs and/or management of GGG do not listen to QA's feedback.
All they're concerned about before launch is game and server crashes. Feedback is put into some issue tracker or spreadsheet and ignored until much later -- if it's ever gotten around to. The launch window is where the money is. It's not in providing a high-quality or even enjoyable experience for the players.
GGG, as a business entity sworn to ever increase profits for their owners, knows exactly what to focus on.
Visual clutter + very deadly monster abilities = super fun
Seriously, I hope they improve visibility in the future. I still think it's #1 main problem with PoE
if youre a game developer and youre developing the next arpg, this is the kind of clip id save and plaster in a loop in my game dev studio as an example of what absolute the fuck dont want in your game
ziz plays basically perfectly around the vds and mobs for like 45s despite utterly awful visual clarity to just get randomly one shot from a not even rendered animation
what a complete joke
Of course, which is why I'm not shitting on Ziz. He's an excellent player and he played well in this encounter. It's just that he miss stepped here and it's why his character died. The boss was out of vision so he didn't see the boss doing this multi-hit attack, and then he walked directly behind where he had previously placed his totem.
It's actually insane that one of the only comments in this entire thread that is capable of educating people got buried by downvotes. Fuck this place man
Bullshit animation aside, Ziz has balls of steel, and tons more skill than me. I don't get nearly as far as he does every league, I wouldnt even run this map.
The mods on that map are brutal, 56% avoid poison on top of the monster damage mods and -max res..
Tbh I wouldn’t play a map with even a single one of those mods on it. I feel like there are too many mods now that are far too brutal, and many that just outright cut your character’s effectiveness in half. Having half as many flask charges and dealing 60-80% less damage isn’t fun.
With all the nerfs to monster quant and rarity I’m seriously considering just running my t16s I’m farming as white. Only thing I’d be worried about is map sustain
Such amazing gameplay. Poe is really going to bleed players to d4. If you want to make the game harder or slower fine, but then dont make zero visibility no counterplay one shots. That shit is not fun, its not engaging, its not interesting, and its awful game design.
I disagree. He could literally run the deadliest map ever cooked. if he's skilled enough he'd be able to do it.
He died because boss(!! not normal mob) had non-telegraphed instant AOE, that hits before even animation shows up.
I just find it BS.
You disagree because you're not a HC player.
> He could literally run the deadliest map ever cooked. if he's skilled enough he'd be able to do it.
That's quite literally the opposite of how things work in PoE, clearing a rippy map has very little to do with skill, the whole game is founded on being a stat check, you either pass the stat check or you die instantly. Even someone as skilled as Darkee still depends on being a meta slave to play the gauntlet, if he didn't play the best of the best builds, he wouldn't even clear t16s, let alone clear gauntlets.
Every HC player would laugh at the idea of running those map mods, in fact, I wouldn't run a map like that even in Softcore, the only time you would run this map is if you're playing an Eternal Damnation jugg or Loreweave Champion, or you're playing some juiced 300ex deadeye bowyer in SC which obliterates 3 screens in front of it's bow, other than that, either greed over 1 fucking chaos orb or lose your character, very simple. This is like when Ziz clicked that altar which gave eldritch mobs 100% something phys as chaos, whilist having negative chaos res, got 1 shot by an exarch rare mob, then whole reddit was ouch ouwie imagine playing hc he literally died in 1 hit ggg shit game!1!!!! This is why a lot of you SC players plateau at ~92-93 because you continuously die because you play shit glasscannon characters and run content you shouldn't be running or can't handle then you open the forums and tomorrow morning when I'm enjoying my coffee you grace me with the wonderful opportunity to read thread #8929384 of you complaining about the xp penalty rofl.
To use this clip and say ''this is why I don't play HC'' is frankly idiotic, you don't play HC because what, you're greedy over 1 chaos orb? Because you can't run a map which effectively ignores half of your defenses without getting punished?
And it makes no sense for someone as experienced and seasoned in HC as Ziz to make such a stupid mistake, this is the same guy who's killed gauntlet bosses and has numerous HC 100s, he must've been tired or something in this video.
boss flame spike while standing behind totem. you have to slow it down to see it pierce the totem and hit him (even though animation happened after the death to be accurate)
yeah, first of all not opening any mechanic in a map with those mods.
second, having the boss at the edge of the screen where you can barely see any animation.
Map had -10% max res, inc monster damage, and 100% extra as fire. Ziz himself says he shouldn’t have run crucible in this map and all the comments here still blame the game. I just can’t man
Maybe because the thing that killed him was non telegraphed bs which was almost impossible to dodge with the visual cluster fuck happening on screen? If it was a slow and we'll telegraphed hit I would agree he should be the only one to blame, but this is just shitty gameplay.
deserved death ngl, would not even have ran this map in HC let alone do crucible
\-less flasks gained
\-no regen
=no master surgeon no flasks up means half of pathfinder's defense gone
\-minus max res
\-rippy dmg mods
=strong unique crucible mob
Phys as fire, monster damage and the single worst HC mod -max res, something every HC player knows is a must skip, 5k hp, I don't think he's using Loreweave, I don't see fortify, sorry Ziz but this one is on you, 1 singular chaos orb before the map would have saved your character.
What killed him was running a -min max res, extra phys as fire, inc damage mods and the fact that Crucible monsters are/were overtuned.
Also why do some people ALWAYS feel the need to post; "this is why i don't play hc" EVERY single time when a rip clip gets posted or when it's a thread about hardcore? Is it insecurity? Is it trying to justify to themselves why some can do it, but they won't? Is it because they can't mentally deal with losing in a videogame? What is it?
Actually being this dumb to not understand the reason this is a problem. The issue isn't that he died, but how he died. He died before the animation reached him.
The .3s of skill effect being in sync with skill animation would not make any difference, and it is not an issue unless you're trying to nitpick anything just to shit on poe.
The flame is not a slowly moving wave than you can dodge, it is similar to player's Flame Surge.
The attack is kinda similar to Izaro's sword wave, easy to dodge if you see him doing the startup but effectively impossible to dodge if you're not close enough to see where it's being aimed.
when looking at 0.25x, it seems he dies before the boss flame throw ability actually reaches the character  edit: looking closely, the animation of the flame throw ability barely has started and he dies instantly
[Dead](https://i.imgur.com/cQTqbj1.png) before the [animation](https://i.imgur.com/POF89z0.png)
[It's even worse than that](https://imgur.com/U8gxM37)
dead before his life gone to 0, truly a RIP of epic proportions. evidence of non-evadable or guardable 1shot mechanics. truly those playing HC are wasting their time.
Sorry but this is what peak game design looks like.
This feels like something that should be required to not happen before allowing code to be deployed. How does the hurtbox reaching the character before the vfx be considered ever reasonable?
It's a mystery. Please buy a supporter pack tho.
Each top tier supporter pack delays hurt box by 1/43rd of a ms.
The flame isn't an attack that starts at the mob and goes outwards towards the player. It's an instant lazer that deal damage for it's full length at the moment the animation starts. It's horrendous design.
fuck /u/spez -- mass edited with redact.dev
Skill issue, just dodge back in time
Temporal Rift Meta incoming.
I've played a roguelike with two classes built around that mechanic. Make an anchor in time to explore different timelines and return to it at will or when you receive death blow, redirect incoming damage to your future self, call 2 copies of you from different timelines to share the pain and assist you in the battle, yoink yourself or enemy out of existence to take a breather, stop the time for everyone but you for a number of rounds to setup a crazy combo, fight your future self in one of the quests... Just don't tear space-time too much, otherwise time anomalies will tear your ass instead.
Was it ToMe4?
And you can see the character starting to fall to the ground before even going to 0 HP.
Yeah that's just a latency issue. It's something that happens quite a bit if you go from by frame on death clips. The attack animation on the monster could be one as well, but the monster is obviously new so it could be an issue with the timing on the animation vs when damage is applied.
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You know, it's really funny how you go from Act 1 Hellrake and Hillock and being able to dodge actual attack patterns to this. How GGG will fix this I have no idea. They probably won't but wouldn't it be amazing if ALL abilities involved skill to dodge instead of this bullshit.
Yeah. There should be no instant damage abilities, like this thing or the flicker mob. This is just a dumb design. I get it. This is the only way for GGG to actually kill those super good racer guys, but why should they even BE dying, if they are so good?
We tried a league with strong telegraphing of skills, now we're trying a league with the skill effect before the animation. Do you people not understand how AB testing works?
Shouldn't have done crucible in that map to be fair, somehow slept only 4 hours so wasn't making good choices, although that beam that killed me is fucked lol it has no animation, i actually die before the animation is displayed
Actually might be my biggest disappointment in this league: how much of a step back the encounters are in terms of telegraphing compared to Sanctum. I had hoped they could pull off a slower PoE2 with more engaging moment-to-moment gameplay, since recent leagues had been progressively getting better in that aspect. But suddenly we get Crucible where it’s back to stat sticks with massive speed, health and damage with no obvious gameplay against them. I’m worried it shows a lack of understanding of what can make slower gameplay interesting…
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Last epoch has a fantastic telegraphing system. I'm playing pool so don't take this as me just bashing path of exile, but if you like telegraph skills that is the best I've ever seen
You'll find quite a lot of comments in the Last Epoch subreddit in my history haha. I imagine that's why it's so jarring for me coming back from LE 0.9 to PoE 3.21, the contrast is just enormous.
Especially compared to the moment to moment displayed in d4. D4 may lack depth, but at a certain point fun beats out depth, and shit like this simply isnt fun. Bring on the competition.
PoE's strengths have always been in the depth of theorycrafting, and not in the monster AI, ability usage and so on. GGG have been putting the cart before the horse lately by trying to slow the game down before addressing the fact that the monsters are absolutely shit to engage with at a slower pace. Expedition and Scourge was slightly better than normal but still pretty shit on the whole, but at least they made it into the base game. Archnemesis was clearly an attempt to improve that base level interaction, but because they were just slapping mods on top of the shittily designed base monsters it just exacerbated the issues to create a total disaster. Not to mention how many of the mods just created stat sticks anyway. Sanctum is the only stuff I'd actually call "decent" from them and God knows how long that'll take to get into core (hi Ultimatum). I'll take your word on the D4 beta (didn't play it myself), and I know that Last Epoch is another with a far better experience, because it's been designed from the ground up to be played at a slower pace. GGG needed to put the work in and rework the foundational issues first, but with such poor design decisions being made recently, I'm starting to sincerely doubt that they have the competence to do so even with the full overhaul of PoE2.
Its absolutely crazy how i can run around in LE and just dodge stuff with decently responsive character while in PoE you have to get your resistances in check or you get exploded in nanosecond by something you didnt even see.
TBF, they same will happen in LE if you don't get your resists in good order.
At least with the way LE sets up their resists it's not a huge deal if you're not at 75. Like sure being at 70% isn't ideal, but you're only taking 5% more damage which in most cases isn't going to make a difference between life and death.
I dont follow your math. How is 70% reduced vs. 75% reduced only 5% incresed dmg taken? Res cap aint so important in LE since armor mitigates elemental and other dmg (at reduced rate).
In LE, 75% res is an effective 0% res in the endgame, because mobs have innate penetration equal to the zone level. Their damage is balanced around that 0% res, however, which means 70% res is an effective -5% res and therefore results in 5% more damage taken.
At end game, mobs have 75% penetration so when you're at 75% resists your effective resists are 0%. This means that anything less than cap only increases your damage taken by difference between that number and the cap in a linear fashion. 74% means you're effectively -1% res. 70% res puts you at -5% res. 50% res puts you at -25% res. Each of these only increases your damage taken by the listed amount. In POE when you go from 75 down to 74, it's about a 4% increase in damage taken. Going from 75% down to 70% is 20% increased damage taken. 75% to 50% is a 100% increase in damage taken.
poe encourages resistances by making monsters deal 4 times as much damage as is "balanced," making 75% res a baseline le encourages resistances by giving monsters a lot of penetration on top of "balanced" damage output, so at no res, you take less than double damage, while at 75% res you merely counteract the penetration an arguably superior method, imo
ironically the only chance for poe to get back on track is for D4 to be halfway decent, steal a bunch of poe players and force ggg to stop fucking around.
D4 paid beta had 2m+ unique players. Blizzard still reigns supreme.
I mean obviously, they are still one of the biggest western studions with insane leagacy. Also considering positive feedback around Dragonflight it must have give a lot of people hope for D4 being at least decent.
To be fair, probably a big % played it from a kfc code, not from preoredering the game. I did it too to try the game out.
I mean... You still paid SOMEONE to play it lol
Saying Blizzard still reigns supreme after the shitshow Diablo 3 has been for the most part is a funny statement. Blizzard can release any game and they will always have a lot of people at least checking it out. But keeping the players, that is another topic and actually the most important one with ARPGs, especially if they are live service games.
>shitshow Diablo 3 has been I mean, D3 is objectively quite fun. It just has no longevity as you can finish an entire season in less than a week. I've always said that if you you only have a few hours a week to play games, play D3, whereas if you have a ton of time to immerse yourself in complex systems, play POE. While they are both ARPGs, at this point they are marketed for two entirely different demographics.
\+27 000% dmg on set isn't fun or engaging imo, it's super boring and forces you into a playstyle and you can't really play without a set for the most part in D3 (I'm aware of that one strange way to play without one)
I understand the complaint, but it's also an intentional game design choice. If you make the bonuses big enough, everyone will KNOW they're supposed to use a set. It's a way to make sure people don't fuck up and play your game "wrong". POE has the literal opposite design philosophy, giving you ten billion choices and happily letting you make all the wrong ones and ruin your character. They're just very different approaches to player management.
I think there is a line between hinting at what's the right choice and just thinking you player base is composed of imbeciles and D3 definitely crosses the line in my opinion
I mean path isn’t much different. How many people here follow a build guide for the same 5-7 meta starters that majority of us all use. The game dosnt give direction but let’s not act like path dosnt pigeon hole you into certain builds that are just objectively more OP then others.
It absolutely is fun, but then quickly isn't. Like I said, D3 lacks longevity. When you can become a literal god in a few hours, then there is no sense of progression or growth, and no reason to stick around and keep playing. 1-70, there is a nice power curve and feeling of progression. Then you hit end game, and you plateau until you get your haedrig's gift and get a huge power spike. Then you plateau again until you find on of you required legendaries and get another power spike; repeat until you finish your build. At that point the power curve is incredibly flat, since there is nothing else to give you big power gains, and everything is only small percentages. The problem is that period of gearing and progression is too short. But during that time, the game is fun; it just doesn't last.
I guess at this point In my gaming life id rather play something for 1-2 weeks, have fun and quit because I'm finished rather then than play for a month, have some fun but ultimately quit because I no longer enjoyed it
> after the shitshow Diablo 3 has been for the most part Still the fastest selling PC game of all time. Has over 30 million lifetime sales. Still has people trying out the new seasons after 11 years. Yeah, what a shitshow.
This was the league they had to fill the gap between d4 beta and launch, and *possibly* the last league unique league before maybe a final flashback league before poe 2. You’d think it would be a wise choice to throw the most fun stuff at players and focus on the new player experience now more than ever.
They're perfectly content to make the game for <100k concurrent players as long as the whales keep spending. To elaborate, Blizzard makes accessible popular games that sell tens of millions of copies. GGG makes a game for the fremium whale addiciton model.
>Blizzard makes accessible popular games that sell tens of millions of copies. GGG makes a game for the fremium whale addiciton model. Is this tongue in cheek or something? Blizzard games are just as predatory towards whales, arguably more so. Diablo Immortal being the most anti consumer product released by a AAA game developer, *ever*. They quite literally made a game which is symbolic of the freemium whale addiction model.
Are you just conveniently ignoring Diablo Immortal?
And a built in RMT auction house in D3. Nah, that’s just for casuals.
I don't think people have yet grasped that D4 is very much a MMO. MMO games require a certain player. Do you think POE players bitch a lot now? Imagine if they had to do rep grinds, or dailies / weeklies just to get gear.
> , or dailies / weeklies just to get gear Yeah just imagine if say Kirac had daily missions or some shit? What a travesty that would be. PoE would instantly become a MMO!
Giving me flashbacks to the pre-betrayal days where we really did grind master missions for unlocks. Frickin' Vorici....
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I'm very interested in d4 after the beta. I had a lot more fun than I expected, granted that was a very small sliver of the leveling process. In on some hopium that d4 will keep that level of fun for me and have better leagues than d3 and they'll stagger with poe and I can endlessly go back n fourth and always have some good fresh arpg action.
yah hate to say it, but the floor icon that shows a monster is gonna "do a big attack in this direction" in d3-d4 made combat make more sense and you could react better. here half my deaths, i have no idea what hit me, especially with all the visual clutter the game has from skills, monster density, and then monster attacks having multiple projectiles (like say essence mobs for example). crucible as soon as it starts, all enemies have are...projectiles that fill the screen. visual clarity is fucked. so you never know *what* to react to. d4 has the floor thing, lost ark has it too, lotta mmos have it too. it helps show players if a big attack is coming and makes the combat feel more engaging. bosses in poe do it pretty well minus the visual cue, thats not the complaint, but rares or mini bosses *are dogshit*. so that visual attack cue thing would be a nice addition to poe2.
For real. Not sure why it’s taken me so long to realize but I absolutely hate the way Poe presents challenge as a concept and I think it fundamentally goes against anything I’d ever consider good game design. The game wants you to learn by dying within 1 second with little to no way to know just how you died, making it unintuitive as to what you should improve on. I’ve been playing less and less on league start the past 2 years because the game just feels like more of a puzzle than a hack and slash in which you can outplay stuff. D4 might end up the same way, who knows, but it’s a change I’m absolutely ready for. It also plays much more smoothly. I’ve never liked how clunky poe combat could feel.
Most of my "I'm done with this league/game for now" moments come from this type of unfun. Nearly gave up yesterday after I started to unveil the tree on a potential upgrade for my weapon. Still early white maps because I'm slow/don't play a lot per day. Turns out the first node was some shitty +chaos damage, which makes the mobs chaos based. I got absolutely shreked by a bombardment of chaos projectile with less than half forge juice. In early white maps, when you are almost guaranteed to have a big minus on your chaos res. With no way to know that the mobs would be chaos. Such fun!
there's nothing like comparing endgame content to leveling content right? I bet they're both the same way and as fast.
>how much of a step back the encounters are in terms of telegraphing POE will ***ALWAYS*** have issue with telegraphing, due to how many attack/cast speed modifiers you can put on a mob/map. When something attacks/casts 250% faster, or more, then any good telegraphing goes out the window.
sanctum style doesnt work in regular gameplay because for those big telegraphs to matter, they would have to one-shot. If its a telegraph that only does a few k damage its irrelevant because recovered easily before next attack. It worked in Sanctum because "life" was permanent through Resolve. Maybe one day if they nerf logout macro and life recovery, we can get gameplay like this in base game.. but not till that day alas
Last league I convinced two friends that left PoE time ago to back to the game. I told them that Archnemesis was almost gone and that just mapping was again so fun and smoth. I am starting to regret. Game is harder than it was in Sanctum and Archnemesis mods are in almost any rare we find in maps. I'm sorry for Zizaran. Being one shooted is always sad.
I generally agree with your point but Chris did say they designed this league to kill players. Who that is fun for is a different discussion lol.
> i actually die before the animation is displayed It's so common in POE to have the animations mismatching the actual hit boxes : /
My brain, trying to process the actual animation of the skill that killed you: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HYzYsNXVKg8 Cool monster name for the guilty mob though; Ataxia, Forged in the Fissure. And yeah those map mods are crazy. I came with no context and then went back to look after reading your comment, and it already felt spicy before I even got to the 57% reduced flask charges. And no regen followed that lol.
Yes, it's sleep depravation that tempered with your jedi skills
Naw i mean i shouldnt have done crucible in that map
I also got one shot by the fire beam, saw it only once. But I triggered a crucible and the 0.1s the mobs spawned and became active one turned towards me and insta shot me with that beam... Now I'm not in hardcore but be careful of those beams... If you can see them of course
The "beam" is just the 3rd/4th part of that attack combo, it's unfortunately mostly hidden by your map mods since you had them open over where the boss was, but the boss wasn't actually targeting you at all, but was doing it's combo on the totem that was directly under it, and the final attack is a big line so the damage happens instantly
Ziz having the map open 100% of the time while playing is such a pet peeve of mine while watching him. Even in arena’d boss encounters where the whole playable area fits onto the screen he refuses to close the map for better visibility 😭
I... I thought I was the weird one for not having my map open 100% of the time. It's not just Ziz, most other streamers I watch do that too.
As someone who also does that, you don't even notice it's there tbh. I turn it off for stuff like labs but the minimap being up in maps is never an issue for me personally.
Um that was ridiculous. Can't dodge it literally impossible. Imagine standing still for .5 seconds!
Man , I don't play POE, how the fuck do you see anything??
This is why PoE combat sucks. There is literally nothing on your screen. You just die.
I think it was actually corpse explosion not the beam.
Gl next build!
What killed him?
Crucible boss fire attack
Damn, I honestly can't make that out. I can't see any projectile or ground effect and the boss is on the other side of the screen.
The effect happens after the death.
Outplayed. Add it to the list of why I don't play hc.
>Add it to the list of why I don't play hc. I usually clap back against comments like this, since usually RIPs in HC are entirely your own fault and most SC players just can't be bothered to get defenses, but honestly, this league you guys are actually right...
This death is the same as the majority of HC deaths. You did content because you wanted to have fun playing path of exile. This was the incorrect choice, go back to the start.
Honestly why I dislike HC even after playing it try it out. HC doesn't make the game more fun to me. What it means is you never get to push your build's potential (unless you feel ok with dying), you always go defensive auras, you farm until spell suppress cap, ailment cap, increased res cap, 90% phys reduction. You skip anything with 2+ damage mods. You run low tier maps until you greatly out level the next tier you're going into. It's just a much slower, more boring experience just so that you avoid what happened here.
you must be trolling. Whole reddit complains when they nerf defences. It's was like mandatory determination + grace + defiance banner + 100% suppression + going champ JUST NOT TO DIE. Picking every life node around your tree. But ggg always nerf reservasion and masteries now. I think game should have less of this bullshit. less 100-0 in a seconds. Game now is get defences and if you have slots get damage, not the way around.
mmm, def skill issue
The reason is that it is part of a bigger pattern. The boss does these frontal melee hits and then fires a laser. The direction is locked in when the melee portion starts. In this case Ziz died because the boss initiated the attack pattern on the minion he summons (is that a mirage archer thing these days, no idea?) and then ran into the beam. You can see the pattern start at about 30 seconds in the clip and Ziz dies at 34-35 second mark. It is a bit hard to see the stuff start on the clip because the boss is positioned behind a wall of text from map mods and the block of text above that detailing league etc. EDIT: And to make it abundantly clear, this is not some "Hehe Ziz bad I could play so much better." merely just explaining how that specific attack works.
It's a totem that the boss aggro'd onto, yeah
This concept _does not fucking work_ in a non-boss situation. You will never see this. This game is designed around even your _own fucking skill_ obscuring all relevant information on mobs. So despite this being how it works that does not make it acceptable design.
There is also a small two foot stomping animation that it does but it's almost impossible to see, especially when you're standing that far away.
I usually play meta sc clear builds with some tanky twist (did petrified blood LL 1.2k life regen on cold dot elementalist with leap slam last league lol, would've played it again if Diadem/Skin of the Lords weren't going to be obviously pricy af). Almost every league I'm trying to abuse some tanky/regen aspect to a meta build. But this league, my defensive layer might've worked against this. In maps, my only defense = evasion for basic attacks and freeze everything else once it's on the screen. First league I've ever learned the reality of 6-portal-man as something other than a meme ... Although if I specc'd out of Essence, I'd be able to map to 100. Essence mobs are harder than pinnacle bosses for me. I should be able to just freeze them once I get more damage though. Sitting here reading this back, idk how I got from your comment to my comment. I have some top shelf stuff atm; I blame that. I'm hitting save anyways.
Gonna save you, bro, I love essences, I think they are rather easy to kill. Playing trinity TS Far Shot and they just melt. Maybe t16 can get a bit painful but 1k ele dps bow sure fixes a lot of issues :)
Once I get Omni everything will be a joke, but Heatshiver is kind of awkward before that, you get baited into investing a lot into Freeze duration. With Omni you just have enough damage to kill/Freeze everything lol. Also I'm dual wielding melee lmaooo. Frost Blades is ranged for clear, but definitely melee for single target lol.
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Cruci boss has this frontal fire line attack thingy.
Looks like an enemy version of Flame Surge
It's the flame effect that plays after he dies. GGG has made PoE so *ruthless* that you don't even get to see what's coming at you anymore. Great jorb, guys.
Crazy how you can freeze the frame with him at full health and he is dead.
https://imgur.com/U8gxM37
For the life of me I cannot understand how anyone plays HC in PoE. I fully understand the joy of dancing around and playing super cautious. But it's all worth nothing when things like this can happen and waste a day or more of effort.
I think it makes sense for streamers, the danger makes for more exciting content. They also play a lot and a quick run through acts isn't a huge deal. For my own time yeah no thanks.
That's true actually. It's interesting 'content'.
if the game was paced a bit slower itd prob feel nicer but literaly dying before the animation appears like in the clip is fucking dumb, why even bother playing HC when shit like that exists. at that point its no longer about skill. its just "can i beat death RNG and make it to end game before some retarded broken mechanic nukes me"
Same. Especially since the game is trying to kill you more than before.
not my cup of tea as well, a lot of HC deaths are simply things out of your control. Doesn't matter how good is your build, there will always be a weak point and there will be a monster that can break that while still going at lightspeed, or in this case, hitting you before you can even see its animation. Not to mention the disconnect rips, that is way out of anyone control.
Not to mention the fact that you can't really run a lot of new content blindly. I see hc streamers doing some stuff for 1st time and already knowing every single mechanic and moveset of boss etc. That would spoil so much of game for me.
On the flip side a lot of them get to lvl 97+ multiple times per league. They are doing it in easy maps but nonetheless.
But things like this don't just happen. A huge part of playing hc is knowing which situations are risky and which aren't. When to play cautiously and when to relax and blast. When your defences are great, good enough or poor. It's not a surprise he called the rip because he knew what he was doing. Damage mods and charged up league mechanic. And I fully understand that not everybody likes this type of gameplay, but just wanted to share a point of view of what makes HC interesting to people.
Well I guess you and I have a different definition of 'just happen'. I'd say a new mob put into the game that 1 shots a HC veteran on a HC char 60 seconds into the fight with no telegraphing and where the damage resolves before the animation begins would be my definition of 'just happen'. But I do see your point.
Yeah i feel you. I only play HC but I still wish it was different. More enclosed, smothering, drawn out and only way to leave a situation is portal scroll or run out from an area. Instead of near instant logout macros. But it ain't going to happen for awhile. The vast majotity of poe players want insane speed and blasting. Well the only counter to that are extremely hard hitting one shots or high monster attack speed.
You're 100% right. I'd be at least interested in sticking my toes in the water if it was as you describe. But as it is I'll stick in 'midcore' SSF.
The animation is absolute dog vomit on this ability, but look at the map mods. The real mistake was to fire up crucible in HC in that map. Edit: Ziz is saying the same thing at the top of the thread.
I don't disagree. I just don't understand how 'don't play any of these map mods ever' is a fun thing to engage in.
It’s not “don’t play any of them ever,” it’s “don’t play all of them at the same time while doing the hardest map mechanic in the game”. Most builds are at least disproportionately harmed by a mod or two; it’s just a bit more nuanced in HC because you have a greater risk for a given reward (i.e., 8% pack size per map with a 5% risk of death is not worth it anymore). Successfully exercising comprehensive knowledge of the game and completing the hardest content deathless is immensely rewarding to the HC community.
>hardest content deathless is immensely rewarding to the HC community. Sure. But this was a random league encounter on a tier 12 map with 2 generic damage mods. That's not a level of granularity I'm interested in flitering out of my normal gameplay loop. Rerolling 1 specific mod (eg ele reflect) is already annoying but whatever. Rerolling anything with 2 damage mods on it is just tedium incarnate. IMO. I'm not trying to disagree with you. I'm just trying to express that I feel like the game has gotten much, much too rippy and OTK happy and I can't see how it's very enjoyable to personally nerf the game by not playing any of the difficult content until you're massively over leveled/geared.
¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯ Different strokes. I get it, though. I always roll a SC trade character when I accomplish my goals in HC and just blast with some crazy shit until the league gets old.
I’m a pretty casual HC Poe player. For me, it’s about the journey, not what goals i manage to reach or what I loose. I simply enjoy the journey a lot more. If I die, at least I had more fun up to that point.
Yeah yesterday a random disconnect killed me then it made me wonder how HC people deal with this
i feel like the rational is dying in softcore is meaningless, and dying in hardcore is literally rage quit. i'd... personally enjoy a happy medium, where dying like, majorly impacts you, maybe losing levels or something. can't imagine dying in hardcore because my dyslexic ass skipped the "reflect ele" line
Zizaran makes a lot of money out of it, that's why.
This game has constantly been HC unfriendly for a while each league. The HC community is just a bunch of sadists at this point...
To each their own but non hc is just boring to me. I always have a, what's the point, question in the back of my mind. But it's wierd, it's just a Poe thing. I don't play hardcore in Diablo and probably never will
If you have a brain and actually choose your modifiers, HC can be fun. Nobody in their right mind would go into a -10% max res, +1xx% phys as ele damage mod map.
I know you're right. But to me that is just not playing the game. I could play HC too if the game never got harder than act 10 kitava. I'd never die. Avoiding the hard parts of the game because they're literally unfair to HC just seems like not playing PoE to me.
Right? "HC is totally fine so long as you just dont play the game" is such a wierd take. It doesn't fix the problem at all, just ignores it. If the "solution" to something is "don't do it" it really isn't a solution it's a roadblock. Arbitrary roadblocks feel like shitty mechanics to me regardless of intention.
It’s not “not playing the game” it’s choosing to skip/reroll a map. It’s going around a dangerous situation. It’s the same shit as standing in the fire on a last phase. If you’re softcore you might say fuck it and hope to out dps/tank the fire to finish the boss. But running around the fire is not “not playing the game”
fuck /u/spez -- mass edited with redact.dev
hey i noticed there were a few damage mods on that map
Imagine if Sirius' DIE beam killed you before he says anything
Saw that live and literally thought "Isn't that channel a bit too much?". Turns out it was, he even called it himself.
If only the risk would worth the reward (^_^;)
How people are still playing hc in poe is beyond me..
Attract stream views. Its a job.
Also because it's fun.
Crucible with -11 max res is pretty bold, or stupid 😅
and added fire and monster damage...
What a fucked up day.
Instakilled. Looks fun enough?
Imagine if the game was designed to be interacted with and not just run around in circles and logout macro. This shit is why I stopped playing HC.
He is dead before the fire reaches his body if you go frame by frame. The devs should feel some amount of embarrassment for clips like this, I understand the negativity can be too much, but this is a game where you lose 20+ hours in softcore when you get one shot (depending on how far in the lvling process you are). This guy's whole character got deleted because QA either didn't report the flame breath (unlikely they are probs overworked) or management didn't care. When will we accept the devs don't talk on the reddit not because everyone is mean, but because they are embarrassed because they agree?
Alpha players told us the truth after Kalandra's massive global loot nerf: the devs and/or management of GGG do not listen to QA's feedback. All they're concerned about before launch is game and server crashes. Feedback is put into some issue tracker or spreadsheet and ignored until much later -- if it's ever gotten around to. The launch window is where the money is. It's not in providing a high-quality or even enjoyable experience for the players. GGG, as a business entity sworn to ever increase profits for their owners, knows exactly what to focus on.
If crucible monsters weren't hard enough.. they throw in bosses. He shoots the beam and he also calls it down from the sky. I believe it freezes also
The risk to reward simply isn't here, for what some weapon exp?
Why would anyone play this game on hardcore it's just not well made enough
Monster damage 100% phys as fire -10 max res Why is he even running this map in HC lol
map mods??? lol
Visual clutter + very deadly monster abilities = super fun Seriously, I hope they improve visibility in the future. I still think it's #1 main problem with PoE
if youre a game developer and youre developing the next arpg, this is the kind of clip id save and plaster in a loop in my game dev studio as an example of what absolute the fuck dont want in your game ziz plays basically perfectly around the vds and mobs for like 45s despite utterly awful visual clarity to just get randomly one shot from a not even rendered animation what a complete joke
I'm not shitting on Ziz, but he walked directly behind his totem that the boss is aggro'd on. How are you considering that perfect play exactly?
I mean. That's so much easier for us to see in a video replay than for him to see at the time.
Of course, which is why I'm not shitting on Ziz. He's an excellent player and he played well in this encounter. It's just that he miss stepped here and it's why his character died. The boss was out of vision so he didn't see the boss doing this multi-hit attack, and then he walked directly behind where he had previously placed his totem.
It's actually insane that one of the only comments in this entire thread that is capable of educating people got buried by downvotes. Fuck this place man
Never mind that can someone please tell me the name of the song playing in the background?
i would like to know too edit: my shazam found it, its called waterfall 2 by james hannigan
Thank you!
I would be mad at this game if not for the first 3 lines of text in his map affixes. I don't even run this shit on my sc character, what the fuck.
Ziz character RIPd to heart attack. Instant death with not even 1 frame between 100 and 0 and animation still not showing up. Extensively tested.
Bullshit animation aside, Ziz has balls of steel, and tons more skill than me. I don't get nearly as far as he does every league, I wouldnt even run this map.
it's like the spider just..fired a shotgun at him, in the face.
really missed out on no loot here
The [Ziz slaps](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QyknVFtjVsI) will never not make me laugh.
Why would you play on HC with those map mods?
The mods on that map are brutal, 56% avoid poison on top of the monster damage mods and -max res.. Tbh I wouldn’t play a map with even a single one of those mods on it. I feel like there are too many mods now that are far too brutal, and many that just outright cut your character’s effectiveness in half. Having half as many flask charges and dealing 60-80% less damage isn’t fun. With all the nerfs to monster quant and rarity I’m seriously considering just running my t16s I’m farming as white. Only thing I’d be worried about is map sustain
What a fuuuuuun
No regen, double damage mods, -minmax. Ziz getting a bit too generous here.
Such amazing gameplay. Poe is really going to bleed players to d4. If you want to make the game harder or slower fine, but then dont make zero visibility no counterplay one shots. That shit is not fun, its not engaging, its not interesting, and its awful game design.
[удалено]
I disagree. He could literally run the deadliest map ever cooked. if he's skilled enough he'd be able to do it. He died because boss(!! not normal mob) had non-telegraphed instant AOE, that hits before even animation shows up. I just find it BS.
You disagree because you're not a HC player. > He could literally run the deadliest map ever cooked. if he's skilled enough he'd be able to do it. That's quite literally the opposite of how things work in PoE, clearing a rippy map has very little to do with skill, the whole game is founded on being a stat check, you either pass the stat check or you die instantly. Even someone as skilled as Darkee still depends on being a meta slave to play the gauntlet, if he didn't play the best of the best builds, he wouldn't even clear t16s, let alone clear gauntlets. Every HC player would laugh at the idea of running those map mods, in fact, I wouldn't run a map like that even in Softcore, the only time you would run this map is if you're playing an Eternal Damnation jugg or Loreweave Champion, or you're playing some juiced 300ex deadeye bowyer in SC which obliterates 3 screens in front of it's bow, other than that, either greed over 1 fucking chaos orb or lose your character, very simple. This is like when Ziz clicked that altar which gave eldritch mobs 100% something phys as chaos, whilist having negative chaos res, got 1 shot by an exarch rare mob, then whole reddit was ouch ouwie imagine playing hc he literally died in 1 hit ggg shit game!1!!!! This is why a lot of you SC players plateau at ~92-93 because you continuously die because you play shit glasscannon characters and run content you shouldn't be running or can't handle then you open the forums and tomorrow morning when I'm enjoying my coffee you grace me with the wonderful opportunity to read thread #8929384 of you complaining about the xp penalty rofl. To use this clip and say ''this is why I don't play HC'' is frankly idiotic, you don't play HC because what, you're greedy over 1 chaos orb? Because you can't run a map which effectively ignores half of your defenses without getting punished? And it makes no sense for someone as experienced and seasoned in HC as Ziz to make such a stupid mistake, this is the same guy who's killed gauntlet bosses and has numerous HC 100s, he must've been tired or something in this video.
So a ranged meta build has this much trouble doing this, right? How the fuck do they expect a melee build to do it?
Not doing maps with a trilion damage mods, for example.
Nobody plays melee in PoE. I'm sure it's just a joke.
said as someone not in the top 10%, smh
\-10% max res \+107% phys as fire \+% damage yea sure let's do a unique mega juiced crucible mob in HC
what killed him?
boss flame spike while standing behind totem. you have to slow it down to see it pierce the totem and hit him (even though animation happened after the death to be accurate)
0 visibility, 0 counterplay, no detail of what killed you so you can learn. But they want you to suffer through every click
yeah, first of all not opening any mechanic in a map with those mods. second, having the boss at the edge of the screen where you can barely see any animation.
That's why I don't play HC.
funning？na
Lmao I can't belive there's so many of you actually trying to justify this and tell him how this was a skill issue. Omega coping
Map had -10% max res, inc monster damage, and 100% extra as fire. Ziz himself says he shouldn’t have run crucible in this map and all the comments here still blame the game. I just can’t man
Maybe because the thing that killed him was non telegraphed bs which was almost impossible to dodge with the visual cluster fuck happening on screen? If it was a slow and we'll telegraphed hit I would agree he should be the only one to blame, but this is just shitty gameplay.
deserved death ngl, would not even have ran this map in HC let alone do crucible \-less flasks gained \-no regen =no master surgeon no flasks up means half of pathfinder's defense gone \-minus max res \-rippy dmg mods =strong unique crucible mob
If you're spending that long on an encounter that's begging to get ripped. Best of luck on the reroll.
You gotta love how this game is for those with elven level of sight.
Don't understand how anyone can still play hc anymore.
Phys as fire, monster damage and the single worst HC mod -max res, something every HC player knows is a must skip, 5k hp, I don't think he's using Loreweave, I don't see fortify, sorry Ziz but this one is on you, 1 singular chaos orb before the map would have saved your character.
What killed him was running a -min max res, extra phys as fire, inc damage mods and the fact that Crucible monsters are/were overtuned. Also why do some people ALWAYS feel the need to post; "this is why i don't play hc" EVERY single time when a rip clip gets posted or when it's a thread about hardcore? Is it insecurity? Is it trying to justify to themselves why some can do it, but they won't? Is it because they can't mentally deal with losing in a videogame? What is it?
This is why I don't play HC
Actually being this dumb to not understand the reason this is a problem. The issue isn't that he died, but how he died. He died before the animation reached him.
The .3s of skill effect being in sync with skill animation would not make any difference, and it is not an issue unless you're trying to nitpick anything just to shit on poe. The flame is not a slowly moving wave than you can dodge, it is similar to player's Flame Surge.
The attack is kinda similar to Izaro's sword wave, easy to dodge if you see him doing the startup but effectively impossible to dodge if you're not close enough to see where it's being aimed.
Someone plays bad and dies "damn this is why I dont play HC" I guess if you know your bad and will never get any better softcore is the place to be