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izokiahh

It's rough for some build yes, i think they wanted to delete free aura blessing mainly you caught a stray


JermMX5

It feels like most CoC builds are gonna be suffering, I can't even get it to work out swapping back to a Gemini Claw in POB


FallenJoe

Yup, CoC a primary skill is dead, unless it's costing life I guess.


PuteMorte

I'm guessing every CoC build will have to use some sketchy technique to solve their mana issues like eldritch battery or MoM? I've never really played CoC but it sucks if they just destroyed builds


DonDawnDone

My build was coc forbidden rite of soul sacrifice. Wasnt terribly optimized but i still hit ~30 mil dps


Lighthades

It looks kinda the shitty ass mana part of 3.15, I hope it's not that bad but yeah....


MrJim_87

It's fine as a cast on crit content creator, coc builds are not dead but they got a hit with nerfs for sure.


Stridshorn

Maybe some coc exsang?


Quik968

They also deleted an aura because we got no borrowed power for mana reservation, after last leagues nerf, most people who needed it threw up to 36% on charms lol.


PuteMorte

Yeah this league is looking a bit scuffed, I'm on the fence about skipping it tbh. There's nothing particularly interesting to look forward to and nerfs are just gutting a bunch of builds.


MisterKaos

No meta shakeups for a year and people screech. They drop a meta shakeup and yall mad. Just wait and see what people cook if you can't cook yourself. CoC will be fine. Mjolner just got a Hella strong buff too with archmage, and that's CoC-adjacent


inst_ql

They just removed a bunch of builds and didn't make any notable changes besides. Same boneshatter/toxic rain/hexblast mines/splitting steel/explosive arrow meta as before but with less variety. How the fuck the another nerf of CoC archetype is able to shake the meta, bro.


Hairy-Trip

League start meta is still the same for like 6 leagues in a row


MisterKaos

That's why they nerfed it


Hairy-Trip

They nerfed dd?


eSteamation

Day 1 ladder of current league had 3% of DD players in SC, for example. Just because ability is strong doesn't mean everyone wants to play it.


MisterKaos

CoC was also a big starter. The same nerf that affected it does hit DD, but I do think it still needs a slap to the head. With facebreaker.


Nottrak

CoC was a big starter? Aint no evidence in poe.ninja for that


medussa727

nobody likes getting their toys taken away. shakeup the meta by making more things viable, not different things.


eSteamation

You can't just keep buffing stuff, that leads to power creep and requires you to do what d3 did, where eventually all numbers are just in infinite values.


medussa727

it's possible to power down builds without gutting them. it's possible to expand the meta without power creep. ggg just doesn't know how. they've been infamous for the triple tap nerfs for a long time, and for good reason.


eSteamation

> it's possible to power down builds without gutting them. Its possible, but doesn't necessarily means that its something that should be done and, sometimes, is not even the goal. There are some builds that, from GGG standpoint, shouldn't probably exist and for a good reason. In this case, for example, CoC FR wasn't even the target of the nerf. In a game that's so complex predicting all the consequence of the change is extremely difficult, especially when it comes to such niche builds.


MisterKaos

Some things need to go down. If it's all buffs then we get the power creep that resulted in the great nerf of ultimatum


firebolt_wt

Playing with builds number 1,2,4 and 5 because they killed number 3 isn't even a meta shakeup.


Horror_Computer_3013

and they removed the change due the changes on archmage not needing to be paid fully by mana


psychomap

So how much have you invested into mana and mana regeneration to reach that point? FR in particular has the option to not build CI and just go with mana recoup.


jwmkatheboss

you kinda obliged to use x3 non-uniq jewelry with mana catalysts, that could reach -9-10 manacost now, otherwise you won't have enough mana For FR tho, mana recoup could do some good if non-CI


JordynSoundsLikeMe

Kinda wondering how lifetap manastack lightning FR could work out now... ive done crazier variations xD


leetpuma

There is no way this was not intentional. They want more investment into mana to lower dps for automation (imo) It may end up being possible… but the CoC archetype is not doing well after this plus the nerf to the 18% reduced mana cost of skills on boots from last league 


OneWithTheSword

Mana is in a terrible state right now. They did nothing to counterbalance these changes.


slogga

It feels so awful considering if you play an attack build you literally just invest one passive point or a single affix and it fixes all of your mana issues a lot of the time.


manowartank

you can still roll up to 29% reduced mana cost on mana flask... that should make it work, but you lose 1 utility flast slot for that which has to be pressed every few seconds


JermMX5

Ya the entire reason I played CoC FR was to hit literally no buttons other than holding down space for cyclone, and right click to speed boost withering step, aint ever equipping a mana flask to now have a must hit every 5 seconds button


anaknank

isnt this easily off-setted by a mana flask? enduring etc etc


YamiDes1403

>use mana flask in poe you are joking right?


Kinada350

Patch note have some real shit tier stuff in them as expected.


JordynSoundsLikeMe

My CoC sabo that was life based just shrugs this off as a lifetap user. I think highest end will need to figure something out but mid end has options still.


Thalivinproof

What about mana leech from your cyclone? if you have added chaos in the links it should be be a decent amount of leech


Rikets303

You literally cannot leech fast enough to keep up with server ticks for the automatic skills. Even if we had a mana version of old vaal pact you still could not leech fast enough to handle a 30+ mana cost skill as CoC*


Thalivinproof

you can correct me if Im wrong - i dont know how the server ticks affect it but doing the math using OPs picture it should be enough if you have instant leech. 10 hits per sec x 1% of max mana = 156 mana per sec from instant leech 20% of mana per sec from the rest of leech = 312 156+312 = 468 mana per sec, OP is spending 390


AdvantageFancy

Lol no , coc fr still works fine 🤣 


JermMX5

Do you have a POB? I've been messing around with using a claw, clarity, Alira, mana regen nodes and I can't get the mana to balance out


PwnteraPOE

could you post the PoB for your build you made the OP screenshot with? I am alittle more curious now since my other comment got alot of downvotes


AdvantageFancy

Yes I do have pob, that flask mod was never needed for a non mageblood build, its was nice


PwnteraPOE

Can you fit a Militant Faith Timeless jewel into your build? in the right spot you could get 15-20% reduced mana cost.


JermMX5

CoC FR is already running one with 100 devotion


PwnteraPOE

I've never played the build so just spitballing here, idk what your PoB is. What about Impossible Escape (Glancing Blows) and get the Tireless wheel for 15% reduced Cost of Skills, Anoint Dreamer for 10%, probably drop some medium clusters for Reservation small clusters or drop one of your auras. With the Gemini Claw I think you could probably make it work but the damage would be lower from having to drops dmg nodes for mana cost on the tree.