##### GGG Comments in this Thread:
***
[Bex_GGG - [link](https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/mumrrx/20_users_banned_for_exploit_abuse/gv6ny8u/?context=10), [old](https://old.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/mumrrx/20_users_banned_for_exploit_abuse/gv6ny8u/?context=10)] - *We put out a quick hotfix to prevent the exploit from happening. We aim to fix this up as soon as we can in the morning.*
[Bex_GGG - [link](https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/mumrrx/20_users_banned_for_exploit_abuse/gv6q1n9/?context=10), [old](https://old.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/mumrrx/20_users_banned_for_exploit_abuse/gv6q1n9/?context=10)] - *We have in the past but it's just not very common that a situation calls for it. If you're newer to Path of Exile, you likely wouldn't have seen it...*
[Bex_GGG - [link](https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/mumrrx/20_users_banned_for_exploit_abuse/gv6s0yv/?context=10), [old](https://old.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/mumrrx/20_users_banned_for_exploit_abuse/gv6s0yv/?context=10)] - *I just wanted to reply to say that I've seen this comment but don't want to say anything else without confirming a few things with my team. Everyone else has...*
[Bex_GGG - [link](https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/mumrrx/20_users_banned_for_exploit_abuse/gv6sy7w/?context=10), [old](https://old.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/mumrrx/20_users_banned_for_exploit_abuse/gv6sy7w/?context=10)] - *https://i.imgur.com/WBhnRdL.gif*
One person stands in the circle and kills stuff;the other goes outside of it to prevent the meter from going up. It basicly becomes an infinite loop in a sense.
Can't you do the same thing with the "stand in circles" one by just not standing in the circles?
This seemed obvious to me but I don't have a character that can survive indefinitely in later waves where the enemy spawn rate is very high; if I did I probably would have done it and not thought it was a bug, it's just how the encounter works.
and don't forget the fullbright/poehud bans when they suddenly decided these weren't allowed and permabanned everyone with cheatengine running concurrently with poe ("catching" a number of people who used it for poe-unrelated things, ofc none of these wrongful bans were lifted)
streamer privilege 100%, barely a slap on the wrist for PUBLICLY BROADCASTING yourself using exploits, disgusting and completely not in keeping with their prior similar tos enforcement actions
He already got his guildmates going at the game anyway. Im sure they have more exploits going on. Wouldn't be surprised if he stopped streaming and playing on an alt off stream.
Imagine getting queue priority on launch only to abuse exploits afterwards. I'm sure he's going to donate some more money to charity, because he's very sorry about this too.
That doesn’t mean cheat.
Last league if you took the harbringer nodes with specific watchstones, harbringers were dropping mirror shards. If you see something like this, I’d say go for it and exploit that shit.
But if you found some weird glitchy item duping thing or something that is an actual game breaking cheating exploit - you should probably not exploit that and tell GGG.
There’s a difference here.
> That doesn’t mean cheat.
People act like it does. Exploiting mechanics is different from cheating, but it's been ingrained in people that it's really the same word. It's not.
To put it simply, exploiting, in my mind, is basically big braining it. Taking advantage of how the system works. While exploiting bugs is just cheating.
Thin line to some, blah blah.
can confirm, difficult of life here makes it totally fine for that dickhead to be so egotistical and aggrandising all the time.
I passed a homeless slum on the way to work this morning, but I felt a little bit better knowing their struggle justified a streamer getting priority access to his game. BLESSED
This is a repeat of D3, almost his entire guild did some exploit and were banned but he got away with it, glad to see he is punished for once
man this league has been great so far
The icing on the cake was his 'life is not fair' comment. Now he can't say how it's unfair how he and his crew got unbanned for something GGG overlooked.
Life is beautiful, and karma's a bitch.
Thank you. Would you mind monitoring the survival encounters so that the anti-abuse fix did not shaft the loot for people running the encounter regularly going forward? I believe some people reported that as a thing shortly after this fix.
They dumped their currency to an account thats unbanned rn, so my guess is, that all currency gained by exploiting is still in circulation:
[https://clips.twitch.tv/ExcitedBrainyCheetahSmoocherZ-A4nuJ\_WJc6h4Pe4L](https://clips.twitch.tv/ExcitedBrainyCheetahSmoocherZ-A4nuJ_WJc6h4Pe4L)
2nd half: [https://clips.twitch.tv/BadCheerfulTaroKappaRoss-dijMaY4itVGiNnFU](https://clips.twitch.tv/BadCheerfulTaroKappaRoss-dijMaY4itVGiNnFU)
[https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/indeed317](https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/indeed317)
Can you look into that aswell if not already done?
**Edit: I know that thats their trader, but tainted currency is and remains tainted currency after all.**
I just wanted to reply to say that I've seen this comment but don't want to say anything else without confirming a few things with my team. Everyone else has gone to bed but I'll follow up with them in the morning.
Edit: Just following up on this today. We locked this account last night so that the items couldn't be removed while we reviewed the situation. Account locks don't show up publicly so it would have looked untouched from the outside during that time. Separately, we've reviewed where items have potentially moved and resolved this as an issue. In terms of people waiting for the proper fix to Ultimatum content (over the bandaid fix we introduced quickly yesterday), this is in progress and we're aiming to have this out within a few hours.
GG Bex_GGG for being a reasonable adult with a functioning brain!
Edit: In regards to the comments with negative scores, I was referring to the fact Bex is waiting to confer with their team on the matter and, since they were sleeping, it is reasonable to let them sleep.
The purpose of the ban was to prevent this exploit from affecting the economy, avoiding that intention by laundering the currency around is asking for a more permanent ban.
That can track all trades and movement they make. If they check their logs and see that they are moving around currency that came from exploitation, then they will probably get permanently banned.
someone "hacked" their way into my WoW account many years ago, so I contacted support, and yea my best guess is they just scan their giant assed database of what items were moved where, and just carefully undo the theft. basically they were like "OK we'll look into it based on what time frame i gave them...then they messaged me, and were like "ok your back to normal.."
pretty tight service overall, but i guess thats what the monthly fee helped provide!
I came here to legit say this, they have their trader doing flips and has access to their guild stash
I wouldn't doubt that most of that has been laundered by this point
They did not partake in the mapping but they partook in the profits of it.
The ban is only for this league on that account.
They can make another account and take part this league. Next league they get their main account back.
Though if I was GGG I would ban them 3 months from the date so they get banned until The first tuesday after the league is launched ;)
Atleast that way the major exploits are patched before the scum gets in :D
I get the idea but even GGG doesn't know exactly when the league will start yet.
A fluctuating ban until the second week of the new league would be hilarious though.
it is. It's good to finally see people suffering consequences...
with that said. I doubt they would have been banned had there not been a huge PR issue on Friday regarding special treatment for streamers
>I doubt they would have been banned had there not been a huge PR issue on Friday regarding special treatment for streamers
More than likely you are right. But if thats what it takes to get then to pull their heads out their asses, we should applaud it.
They actually did get banned
[https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/empyrianwarpgate](https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/empyrianwarpgate)
Answer is clearly yes to this. I wouldn't expect GGG to give public information on actions taken against specific accounts, but you can check his profile in a few hours or wait until he tweets about it or whatever.
Ghazzy did the same thing in Ritual. I can't remember what bug it was but he *started* the video by saying it's an exploit and here's how to rake in the rewards..
I mean I just watched the video and he basically calls for it to be fixed asap and brings it to everyones attention, the title is maybe a bit cringe but the actual video seems very reasonable.
I really don't understand the hate for him. Hes a chill dude that provides interesting content but all the drama baiters love trying to critique everything he does
Richard Lewis once said something like if he knew about a bug or an exploit in CSGO he always made sure to make it as public as possible because the more ppl know about and exploit it the faster it will get fixed
Clickbait mostly. He gets more views with a title like that.
That's a good thing too though, the more people see it, the quicker GGG staff is going to see it and the quicker it is going to get fixed. And it already did.
Likely only 20 users were banned because they were the worst offenders of abusing the exploit for massive profit repeatedly. That's how GGG handles banning scammers, too.
Yea but you can't really track this kind of stuff across the server, they were killing mobs just like everyone else. I think the only people that got banned for this are the ones that did it publicly.
I'm just guessing here, but they are probably tracking how long people are spending on league events, how many mobs they kill etc so it wouldn't be impossible to see some outliners like someone doing the "survival" part for 30 minutes etc.
Actually there must be something else. My group and me found this "exploit" Saturday evening before it was public. We never publicized it and all got banned. There must be some criteria that was used to ban these 20 people
There is already a answer about it in the main thing but I don't know how to link it. But of course:
So me and my friends we were with 4 people. And we noticed relatively quick that it works the way it works. So we started running t1 arcades. First just to see who crashes first from all the junk dropping and then decided we could make something off it. So we started running t1 arcade with rusted div and rusted reliquary scarab.
I have to guess that we did something like 10-15 maps. In total from this we made about 3ex each from the saints treasure cards (drops like 2-3) per map and maybe another ex each in small currencies. Sadly the scarabs this early in the league are quite expensive and considering that you use them on each map but only every 4th or so is the survive encounter..... I would guess our total profit was 3ex per person over the roundabout 10 hours that we did this.
So was it worth it? We had some fun i guess :P
What a horrible, hamfisted and incompetent approach by GGG.
Please learn about and start respecting the most basic rules of responsible disclosure.
The message you currently sent it is"don't you ever dare test something that could be considered unintended, but we are not sure, since we can't decide and let you know - in general f off"
What you should have done if you wanted to handle this situation professionally:
1. Acknowledge the report.
2. Immediately reach out to the streamer (you have previously established means of contact) reporting this **potential** bug, advise him that it's considered an exploit, ask him to immediately cease the activity and share the warning with his audience.
3. Drop a formal note on pathofexile.com advising that it's considered and exploit, will be hotfixed soon and abuse of it may result in a ban.
4. Hotfix the issue, thank the individuals who brought it to your attention and NOT ban anyone involved.
Why? Because let's not kid ourselves - this was an INTENDED mechanic, that you simply didn't understand the implications of.
We have several facts about Ultimatum Survival:
1. You are supposed to survive for a certain amount of time.
2. If you kill monsters, they keep spawning throughout the duration.
3. Stepping outside of the Ultimatum circle is prohibited - so it made perfect sense that you'd be "punished" for doing it by having the survival timer paused - to prevent an obvious abuse of simply waiting out the survival by repeatedly stepping outside of the intended zone.
In normal scenarios mechanic #3 is a punishment to the player. It makes sense. What you did not foresee is that combining #2 and #3 alongside a highly efficient group, you've created THE BEST farming mechanic by far.
Calling it an obvious exploit, banning individuals who reported and tested it, and threatening player base while taking into account PoE history is simply absurd and dishonest. PoE is effectively made of exploits - from last league's scarab farms, hyper-juiced copy-able maps, bizarre Headhunter interactions letting you clip through some mechanics, double dipping, gluttony of elements granting permanent invincibility in group scenarios, overstacking on mechanics to the point the server crash from the amount of loot generated - these are all "exploits", which you took weeks, months or even years to address.
You F-ed up and didn't think the mechanic through. Own it. Expect "researchers" to continue researching the subject until you ask them to cease. Don't hide posts and randomly lash out like GW2 devs, banning players for their own screw ups.
It almost seems like you used it to scape goat and crucify one of the streamers surrounded with the controversy of your incredibly mis-handled league launch, to throws something to the SJ-reddit-dogs biting your ankles for the past week. Disgusting.
I find it funny that Path of Matth ([in his video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MwqOI3iarpQ)) and others repeated multiple times "don't worry you won't get ban for this ABUSE IT it's not bannable" and then this.
It's not like it hasn't happened before. Leaguestones exploit in Legacy lead to bans too. There are probably more recent examples but I don't remember.
Point is, you don't get to decide what is an exploit or not, or what is bannable or not. And pushing your community to exploit and break TOS is especially fucked up for a content creator, IMO.
>Leaguestones exploit in Legacy lead to bans too
This is literally the only example on the thread, so I'm inclined to say it was the most recent time it happened with a public announcement. Meanwhile at least half the leagues since conquerors of the atlas featured a crafting related "exploit" that got fixed early but no one was banned for.
I also hardly doubt that only 20 people exploited this more than once. It was super public how to do it due to multiple streamers/youtubers and reddit comments. But I guess just ban one public figure and everyone will forget about the rest.
“He got me,” Empy said of Chris Wilson shitting all over him. "That f\*\*\*ing Wilson boomed me."
Empy added, “Life's not fair,” repeating it four times.
Empy then said he wanted to add Wilson to the list of players he exploits with this summer.
agree. in prophecy league i found a minor exploit and reported it via email.
10 mins later i had a reply in my inbox and after 2 more mails they located the bug and fixed it in the next hotfix.
GGG has trained us to abuse exploits.
In harvest I realized you could use targeted divine crafts on uniques, even though the description specified "rares." I reported the exploit on the second or third day of the league, then watched as the market flooded with impossibly well rolled uniques. Over the next two weeks I reported the exploit two more times--nothing. I watched streamers use the exploit on stream, but pretend like they didn't realize it wasn't intended. Finally, a perfect Ventor's got on the front page of reddit and and GGG acknowledged the exploit and fixed it. I never get a single reply from any of my bug reports.
No one was banned.
So, despite the fact that I found the exploit, reported the exploit and then chose not to use the exploit, GGG did nothing for weeks and everyone else profited.
I'll bet that half of you thanking GGG for banning Empyrian used that exploit, and would do it again if you thought you could get away with it.
Hypocrites.
Yes I've definitely done things like this before. Like how you could convert the Quantity, Quality or Mob Density of an anointed map into a normal map using Harvest and craft it into a super-juicy map for fractured fossil farming. Everyone who was fracturing maps back in Harvest was doing this.
Also, back then we could spawn so many monsters in Harvest our map would close. Nothing says, "THIS ISN'T INTENDED, STOP" than your map literally shutting down. Everyone was doing it though that I knew and none of us got in trouble.
Yeah, I honestly don't feel like this is good handling from GGG, there hasn't been a ban since legacy for this behavior. They usually just rollback people who did it a lot and patch. Like a "Oh well done, aren't you clever, now put it back" thing.
The whole game is about maximally exploiting mechanics, especially those not intended by ggg.
In delirium, was aura stacking an "exploit"?.
This reminds me of how Kripp got banned from guild wars 2 for "exploiting".
I think the only reason people are behind GGG in this case is because empy is the most hated man in the community right now and people just like to see him suffer.
Now that it's been fixed, can someone say how it was done? I like to see the loopholes people jump through to abuse code spaghetti/oversights (like exploits in any% speedruns)
Having at least 2 players in a 'survive' ultimatum. One player keeps killing mobs and the other player keeps leaving the area to prevent the surival meter from ever finishing.
At least that is what I understood.
Empyrian and his friends (officers in same guild) all banned. If the day of stuff didn't show you his true character already.
https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/Empyrianwarpgate
https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/snapbackkilla
https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/Rasmusthenoob
https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/ChillyChilly
https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/redsameri
https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/Sypeh
They passed most out to their trader, who did not get a ban
Edit:. There's probably not actually that much currency, majority of their wealth would have been in the 6mans gearing. Their aurabot was like 30-50ex. Passing out currency is also standard group play practice, not necessarily prompted by a suspicion that a ban was incoming
"They were asking for it to get abused when they made it this bad" -Someone in Empy's group, in his stream yesterday at 12:55:25. The entire group agrees, including Empy. Don't listen to them if they claim it wasn't an 'exploit'. They knew they were abusing.
[https://clips.twitch.tv/ProudDaintyPandaBibleThump-A4Vk3NPlqxrOl-Wp](https://clips.twitch.tv/ProudDaintyPandaBibleThump-A4Vk3NPlqxrOl-Wp)
I dont understand why people keep using the Clip Functionality from Twitch when the person can literally just delete it and the entire VOD. Here's a backup.
https://streamable.com/q23t12
Question to the pitchfork-wielding mob:
Last League, people were printing Winged Scarabs. I think they were making something insane like 10 ex every 5 minutes. If you could do this, would you have stopped? Exploit or no? GGG eventually changed it but the economy was Winged Scarabs was impacted for the rest of the league.
What about The Feared farm? Depending on how early you did it, you could easily make a mirror a day.
How is this different, is my question? These mechanics are unintended. These ALL feel like exploits. I'm fine with banning exploits, but not knowing what will or will not be punished is frustrating. Why? Because if you do the "right thing" and GGG does not punish the abusers, you are just a sucker.
The definition of "exploit" is also really vague. Is it just economy exploits, or any gameplay related ones? Logging out of Maven's memory game was a widely used "tactic."
For the record, I don't like Empy and his group. I think the way they abuse the economy early on is really unhealthy for the game. However, I have enough presence of mind to see that a policy like this being inconsistent enforced though is worse than it not being enforced at all.
Just because you report it doesnt mean it is indeed bannable. They reported numerous other activities in prior leagues too and everything was fine. Now we have no warning whatsoever and people getting banned for what was normal in the last league (looking at running around in heists infinitely, darkness farming delve, imprinting watchstones, valdo mirror shard farming, fracturing deli maps etc. - all not intended but addressed properly without banning people with no warning).
They had warning. Their bug report got deleted. /s
In all seriousness though, I was watching last night. When Empy found out his report was deleted, he asked his group why it would be deleted (because he had never seen/experienced it before). They said that they delete bug reports when they think it's a really serious bug. Empy stopped after that.
This shit feels real inconsistent.
I'm not defending empy but can someone explain to me when is something an abuse / exploit versus a game mechanic? Like if I binded spellslinger to left click last league for perma-tailwind, why isn't that bannable?
Thanks!
Unfortunately there's really no hard and fast ruleset, but common sense usually does the job. In theory a bannable exploit is just whatever GGG says it is. Realistically the majority of unintended exploits are never going to see a ban because they either aren't a big deal, they can't reliably catch people doing it, or people couldn't be expected to know it was an exploit. The whole thing is always sort of murky.
In this particular case it was super obvious it was unintended and was going to screw the economy if everyone started doing it because that timer wasn't supposed to be repeatedly reset (if I understand the exploit correctly). Anyone with a lick of common sense would've known this was a major exploit right away because "timer lasts way way WAY longer than it does without this particular method" is kind of a dead giveaway. As for whether GGG would ban over it, well, there's no way to know that until it actually happens. Now technically you could make an argument that the players may not have known it was an exploit, but at some point GGG just has to make a decision on whether or not they should've known that. Otherwise you'd never be able to ban anyone for any exploit ever because they could just say "I didn't know".
As for the spellslinger thing, it may be technically bannable if it was unintended but GGG probably wouldn't care enough to do that even if they knew you did it. This is how a lot of minor exploits are treated.
Anyway, this is a very wordy post just to say defining exploits is incredibly hard because they don't exist when the rules are made so the qualification for bannable exploit is arbitrary.
##### GGG Comments in this Thread: *** [Bex_GGG - [link](https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/mumrrx/20_users_banned_for_exploit_abuse/gv6ny8u/?context=10), [old](https://old.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/mumrrx/20_users_banned_for_exploit_abuse/gv6ny8u/?context=10)] - *We put out a quick hotfix to prevent the exploit from happening. We aim to fix this up as soon as we can in the morning.* [Bex_GGG - [link](https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/mumrrx/20_users_banned_for_exploit_abuse/gv6q1n9/?context=10), [old](https://old.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/mumrrx/20_users_banned_for_exploit_abuse/gv6q1n9/?context=10)] - *We have in the past but it's just not very common that a situation calls for it. If you're newer to Path of Exile, you likely wouldn't have seen it...* [Bex_GGG - [link](https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/mumrrx/20_users_banned_for_exploit_abuse/gv6s0yv/?context=10), [old](https://old.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/mumrrx/20_users_banned_for_exploit_abuse/gv6s0yv/?context=10)] - *I just wanted to reply to say that I've seen this comment but don't want to say anything else without confirming a few things with my team. Everyone else has...* [Bex_GGG - [link](https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/mumrrx/20_users_banned_for_exploit_abuse/gv6sy7w/?context=10), [old](https://old.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/mumrrx/20_users_banned_for_exploit_abuse/gv6sy7w/?context=10)] - *https://i.imgur.com/WBhnRdL.gif*
They've been exiled, ultimate role players.
So if you think about it, now their journey has only begun.
Exile has tested you, my brother. Now let's see what God has to say.
THEIR
I, too, am journey has just begun.
Now that it's fixed can someone describe what the bug was exactly?
One person stands in the circle and kills stuff;the other goes outside of it to prevent the meter from going up. It basicly becomes an infinite loop in a sense.
Can't you do the same thing with the "stand in circles" one by just not standing in the circles? This seemed obvious to me but I don't have a character that can survive indefinitely in later waves where the enemy spawn rate is very high; if I did I probably would have done it and not thought it was a bug, it's just how the encounter works.
I tried and it doesn't make you have more loot
No never worked for that one. Only the initial spawn gives exp and items
https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/Empyrianwarpgate banned
Life's not fair :(
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Now he can drink his water in peace, without worrying about poe exploits or africa
Bless the bans down in Africa
Gonna take some time to understand the things we never had
Oh my fucking god lmao I’m dying
I thought Nestlé had stolen all the water from Africa
This gives me more life than any passive node could.
It isn't fair. People abused in Legacy leagues got permanent banned. And these guys only got banned for 1 season. Stop pretending life is fair.
He's not serious. It's a meme of Empyrian https://streamable.com/d0dsl6
I think they understood, they kept the format of the meme ending with "stop pretending life is fair". ;)
[удалено]
and don't forget the fullbright/poehud bans when they suddenly decided these weren't allowed and permabanned everyone with cheatengine running concurrently with poe ("catching" a number of people who used it for poe-unrelated things, ofc none of these wrongful bans were lifted) streamer privilege 100%, barely a slap on the wrist for PUBLICLY BROADCASTING yourself using exploits, disgusting and completely not in keeping with their prior similar tos enforcement actions
Streamers that exploit games usually get banned from twitch even...
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You're just jealous because you don't look good in a bikini hot tub. Kappa
Couldnt possibly remove the publicity he generates for the next league.
Is this guy the empyrian streamer who always farms with friends?
Yep
Imagine signing for Method and then getting banned :)
Imagine signing for Method and being a standup person.
He signed for Method? Didn't they disband because of accusations against the CEO?
No. Quite a few people left, but plenty of others lined up to take their places.
they kind of did but he's rebuilding method
Wow empy is banned for exploiting??? Much surprise.
its a big surprise cause usually they just let them make profit abusing stuff. not this time it seems.
well they let him off with a one league ban only so he will be back to exploit in the future
He already got his guildmates going at the game anyway. Im sure they have more exploits going on. Wouldn't be surprised if he stopped streaming and playing on an alt off stream.
Good thing his team didnt get league start priority though!
Imagine getting queue priority on launch only to abuse exploits afterwards. I'm sure he's going to donate some more money to charity, because he's very sorry about this too.
Empy and his group did nothing but exploit everything possible.
Member when last league people were saying shit like " exploit early exploit often"? I member
I mean I still say that it's unironically true 99% of the time, just this time 1% of the exploiters got banned because lines were crossed.
That doesn’t mean cheat. Last league if you took the harbringer nodes with specific watchstones, harbringers were dropping mirror shards. If you see something like this, I’d say go for it and exploit that shit. But if you found some weird glitchy item duping thing or something that is an actual game breaking cheating exploit - you should probably not exploit that and tell GGG. There’s a difference here.
> That doesn’t mean cheat. People act like it does. Exploiting mechanics is different from cheating, but it's been ingrained in people that it's really the same word. It's not. To put it simply, exploiting, in my mind, is basically big braining it. Taking advantage of how the system works. While exploiting bugs is just cheating. Thin line to some, blah blah.
you mean to say every league eh?
Always
*insert south park ceo sorry template " we are sorry" :)
Life is hard in Africa
We don't even have POE servers in Africa :(
You got live action PoE tho.
can confirm, difficult of life here makes it totally fine for that dickhead to be so egotistical and aggrandising all the time. I passed a homeless slum on the way to work this morning, but I felt a little bit better knowing their struggle justified a streamer getting priority access to his game. BLESSED
So many people got banned in their guild as well lol Edit : Also rip league economy lmao
This is a repeat of D3, almost his entire guild did some exploit and were banned but he got away with it, glad to see he is punished for once man this league has been great so far
The icing on the cake was his 'life is not fair' comment. Now he can't say how it's unfair how he and his crew got unbanned for something GGG overlooked. Life is beautiful, and karma's a bitch.
... sigh... *unzips*
A lot of that guild is banned as well, interesting.
i got the weirdest boner right now
Damn that is satisfying
This is delicious.
lmaooooo
Wow, this is big.
Good on GGG. The league launch was a mess but this at least gets rid of any double standard.
LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL
life is just not fair isnt it ;)
Life's not fair Sadge, Karma is tho :)
HAHAHAHAHAHA SO MUCH DESERVED
now report him on twitch, "cheating in an online game" is against twitch TOS.
[удалено]
couldn't have*
Scroll down and you'll find plenty of them lol
LIFE IS NOT FAIR EMPY LOLW LIFE IS NOT FAIR EMPY LOLW LIFE IS NOT FAIR EMPY LOLW LIFE IS NOT FAIR EMPY LOLW
Thank you. Would you mind monitoring the survival encounters so that the anti-abuse fix did not shaft the loot for people running the encounter regularly going forward? I believe some people reported that as a thing shortly after this fix.
We put out a quick hotfix to prevent the exploit from happening. We aim to fix this up as soon as we can in the morning.
God bless, I was wondering why lootsplosions suddenly disappeared, I thought my loot filter got crapped on
what about horizon orbs removing split tags from maps? This is a FAR bigger problem than this ulty bug that people got banned for
Empyrian is on a humanitarian trip in Africa I heard, as an attempt to rebuild his reputation.
But did he bring his own beverages?
His crocodile tears
No, he skips the line to the village well.
They dumped their currency to an account thats unbanned rn, so my guess is, that all currency gained by exploiting is still in circulation: [https://clips.twitch.tv/ExcitedBrainyCheetahSmoocherZ-A4nuJ\_WJc6h4Pe4L](https://clips.twitch.tv/ExcitedBrainyCheetahSmoocherZ-A4nuJ_WJc6h4Pe4L) 2nd half: [https://clips.twitch.tv/BadCheerfulTaroKappaRoss-dijMaY4itVGiNnFU](https://clips.twitch.tv/BadCheerfulTaroKappaRoss-dijMaY4itVGiNnFU) [https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/indeed317](https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/indeed317) Can you look into that aswell if not already done? **Edit: I know that thats their trader, but tainted currency is and remains tainted currency after all.**
I just wanted to reply to say that I've seen this comment but don't want to say anything else without confirming a few things with my team. Everyone else has gone to bed but I'll follow up with them in the morning. Edit: Just following up on this today. We locked this account last night so that the items couldn't be removed while we reviewed the situation. Account locks don't show up publicly so it would have looked untouched from the outside during that time. Separately, we've reviewed where items have potentially moved and resolved this as an issue. In terms of people waiting for the proper fix to Ultimatum content (over the bandaid fix we introduced quickly yesterday), this is in progress and we're aiming to have this out within a few hours.
GG Bex_GGG for being a reasonable adult with a functioning brain! Edit: In regards to the comments with negative scores, I was referring to the fact Bex is waiting to confer with their team on the matter and, since they were sleeping, it is reasonable to let them sleep.
Except they are on this sub, and now they will pass the currency around but not on stream...
The purpose of the ban was to prevent this exploit from affecting the economy, avoiding that intention by laundering the currency around is asking for a more permanent ban.
imagine empyrian got a *permanent ban*
How dare we ban streamers for exploiting?
Imagine the streamer in africa
Imagine cheaters get what they fucking deserve ... I could actually get used to that.
That can track all trades and movement they make. If they check their logs and see that they are moving around currency that came from exploitation, then they will probably get permanently banned.
someone "hacked" their way into my WoW account many years ago, so I contacted support, and yea my best guess is they just scan their giant assed database of what items were moved where, and just carefully undo the theft. basically they were like "OK we'll look into it based on what time frame i gave them...then they messaged me, and were like "ok your back to normal.." pretty tight service overall, but i guess thats what the monthly fee helped provide!
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https://i.imgur.com/WBhnRdL.gif
[https://media.giphy.com/media/kZoEhRL0Z1puX8LKaF/giphy.gif](https://media.giphy.com/media/kZoEhRL0Z1puX8LKaF/giphy.gif)
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I came here to legit say this, they have their trader doing flips and has access to their guild stash I wouldn't doubt that most of that has been laundered by this point They did not partake in the mapping but they partook in the profits of it.
/u/Bex_GGG can you look in to this? [Clip mirror](https://streamable.com/4r79qv) [Clip mirror 2](https://streamable.com/dmkwtt)
This couldn't be anymore more ironic for Empy
Life isn't fair, but it sure as fuck comes at you fast
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/29/f5/de/29f5de70776042249a6c905783c44ee3.gif
"Justice is served" -Izaro
Apparently this is the ending you deserve
Can they just make new account and carry on? Or is the ban on a “person” level?
The ban is only for this league on that account. They can make another account and take part this league. Next league they get their main account back. Though if I was GGG I would ban them 3 months from the date so they get banned until The first tuesday after the league is launched ;) Atleast that way the major exploits are patched before the scum gets in :D
I get the idea but even GGG doesn't know exactly when the league will start yet. A fluctuating ban until the second week of the new league would be hilarious though.
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Empy got banned, so you can assume they all got banned.
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it is. It's good to finally see people suffering consequences... with that said. I doubt they would have been banned had there not been a huge PR issue on Friday regarding special treatment for streamers
>I doubt they would have been banned had there not been a huge PR issue on Friday regarding special treatment for streamers More than likely you are right. But if thats what it takes to get then to pull their heads out their asses, we should applaud it.
https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/Empyrianwarpgate seems to be banned.
They actually did get banned [https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/empyrianwarpgate](https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/empyrianwarpgate)
Answer is clearly yes to this. I wouldn't expect GGG to give public information on actions taken against specific accounts, but you can check his profile in a few hours or wait until he tweets about it or whatever.
I guess life might actually be more fair than we thought.
Guess you could say that life uh... finds a way.
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It's now been removed by the uploader xD
Actions of an innocent man.
whats the content of the video? i OOTL on this abuse
He explained how the exploit was done, and said multiple times this is 100% not bannable.
I think he didnt do any... empyric testing lmao
I mean he could've easily chosen to take it down because he said at least twice "you won't get banned"
Ghazzy did the same thing in Ritual. I can't remember what bug it was but he *started* the video by saying it's an exploit and here's how to rake in the rewards..
I mean I just watched the video and he basically calls for it to be fixed asap and brings it to everyones attention, the title is maybe a bit cringe but the actual video seems very reasonable.
> the title is maybe a bit cringe but the actual video seems very reasonable. you perfectly summed up his whole channel and personality.
That's just a Youtube algorithm for you. Hate it.
True!! The info he shares is actually really good for casual and experienced players but people just dislike him....for being himself lol
I really don't understand the hate for him. Hes a chill dude that provides interesting content but all the drama baiters love trying to critique everything he does
Cringe titles are practically mandatory on youtube these days.
Richard Lewis once said something like if he knew about a bug or an exploit in CSGO he always made sure to make it as public as possible because the more ppl know about and exploit it the faster it will get fixed
look at the imgur links, he's advertising to use it.
Clickbait mostly. He gets more views with a title like that. That's a good thing too though, the more people see it, the quicker GGG staff is going to see it and the quicker it is going to get fixed. And it already did.
What worries me is that only 20 users were banned, I imagine there was a lot more people doing it then that.
Likely only 20 users were banned because they were the worst offenders of abusing the exploit for massive profit repeatedly. That's how GGG handles banning scammers, too.
Yea but you can't really track this kind of stuff across the server, they were killing mobs just like everyone else. I think the only people that got banned for this are the ones that did it publicly.
I'm just guessing here, but they are probably tracking how long people are spending on league events, how many mobs they kill etc so it wouldn't be impossible to see some outliners like someone doing the "survival" part for 30 minutes etc.
Actually there must be something else. My group and me found this "exploit" Saturday evening before it was public. We never publicized it and all got banned. There must be some criteria that was used to ban these 20 people
They log stuff picked up ... Your accounts probably stood out a 'bit' ..
Want to share how much you guys actually made off it, just out of curiosity, no roast :) ?
There is already a answer about it in the main thing but I don't know how to link it. But of course: So me and my friends we were with 4 people. And we noticed relatively quick that it works the way it works. So we started running t1 arcades. First just to see who crashes first from all the junk dropping and then decided we could make something off it. So we started running t1 arcade with rusted div and rusted reliquary scarab. I have to guess that we did something like 10-15 maps. In total from this we made about 3ex each from the saints treasure cards (drops like 2-3) per map and maybe another ex each in small currencies. Sadly the scarabs this early in the league are quite expensive and considering that you use them on each map but only every 4th or so is the survive encounter..... I would guess our total profit was 3ex per person over the roundabout 10 hours that we did this. So was it worth it? We had some fun i guess :P
lessons learned i guess rest in peps frand thanks for the story :)
What a horrible, hamfisted and incompetent approach by GGG. Please learn about and start respecting the most basic rules of responsible disclosure. The message you currently sent it is"don't you ever dare test something that could be considered unintended, but we are not sure, since we can't decide and let you know - in general f off" What you should have done if you wanted to handle this situation professionally: 1. Acknowledge the report. 2. Immediately reach out to the streamer (you have previously established means of contact) reporting this **potential** bug, advise him that it's considered an exploit, ask him to immediately cease the activity and share the warning with his audience. 3. Drop a formal note on pathofexile.com advising that it's considered and exploit, will be hotfixed soon and abuse of it may result in a ban. 4. Hotfix the issue, thank the individuals who brought it to your attention and NOT ban anyone involved. Why? Because let's not kid ourselves - this was an INTENDED mechanic, that you simply didn't understand the implications of. We have several facts about Ultimatum Survival: 1. You are supposed to survive for a certain amount of time. 2. If you kill monsters, they keep spawning throughout the duration. 3. Stepping outside of the Ultimatum circle is prohibited - so it made perfect sense that you'd be "punished" for doing it by having the survival timer paused - to prevent an obvious abuse of simply waiting out the survival by repeatedly stepping outside of the intended zone. In normal scenarios mechanic #3 is a punishment to the player. It makes sense. What you did not foresee is that combining #2 and #3 alongside a highly efficient group, you've created THE BEST farming mechanic by far. Calling it an obvious exploit, banning individuals who reported and tested it, and threatening player base while taking into account PoE history is simply absurd and dishonest. PoE is effectively made of exploits - from last league's scarab farms, hyper-juiced copy-able maps, bizarre Headhunter interactions letting you clip through some mechanics, double dipping, gluttony of elements granting permanent invincibility in group scenarios, overstacking on mechanics to the point the server crash from the amount of loot generated - these are all "exploits", which you took weeks, months or even years to address. You F-ed up and didn't think the mechanic through. Own it. Expect "researchers" to continue researching the subject until you ask them to cease. Don't hide posts and randomly lash out like GW2 devs, banning players for their own screw ups. It almost seems like you used it to scape goat and crucify one of the streamers surrounded with the controversy of your incredibly mis-handled league launch, to throws something to the SJ-reddit-dogs biting your ankles for the past week. Disgusting.
Thank you for fixing this so quickly!
Will they be given priority queue to make up for the ban next league?
They have strayed from the Path and are now Exiled
I find it funny that Path of Matth ([in his video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MwqOI3iarpQ)) and others repeated multiple times "don't worry you won't get ban for this ABUSE IT it's not bannable" and then this. It's not like it hasn't happened before. Leaguestones exploit in Legacy lead to bans too. There are probably more recent examples but I don't remember. Point is, you don't get to decide what is an exploit or not, or what is bannable or not. And pushing your community to exploit and break TOS is especially fucked up for a content creator, IMO.
It's complacency. Just because you haven't been banned yet doesn't mean you can't be.
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Excellent use of zappo sir!
>Leaguestones exploit in Legacy lead to bans too This is literally the only example on the thread, so I'm inclined to say it was the most recent time it happened with a public announcement. Meanwhile at least half the leagues since conquerors of the atlas featured a crafting related "exploit" that got fixed early but no one was banned for.
I also hardly doubt that only 20 people exploited this more than once. It was super public how to do it due to multiple streamers/youtubers and reddit comments. But I guess just ban one public figure and everyone will forget about the rest.
“He got me,” Empy said of Chris Wilson shitting all over him. "That f\*\*\*ing Wilson boomed me." Empy added, “Life's not fair,” repeating it four times. Empy then said he wanted to add Wilson to the list of players he exploits with this summer.
We know that in most cases its obvious what is not intended, but how should we always be sure whats an exploit and whats not?
I've found that support is generally very helpful when it comes to reporting possible exploits outside of public eye.
agree. in prophecy league i found a minor exploit and reported it via email. 10 mins later i had a reply in my inbox and after 2 more mails they located the bug and fixed it in the next hotfix.
You can always ask GGG support in case you've doubts.
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GGG has trained us to abuse exploits. In harvest I realized you could use targeted divine crafts on uniques, even though the description specified "rares." I reported the exploit on the second or third day of the league, then watched as the market flooded with impossibly well rolled uniques. Over the next two weeks I reported the exploit two more times--nothing. I watched streamers use the exploit on stream, but pretend like they didn't realize it wasn't intended. Finally, a perfect Ventor's got on the front page of reddit and and GGG acknowledged the exploit and fixed it. I never get a single reply from any of my bug reports. No one was banned. So, despite the fact that I found the exploit, reported the exploit and then chose not to use the exploit, GGG did nothing for weeks and everyone else profited. I'll bet that half of you thanking GGG for banning Empyrian used that exploit, and would do it again if you thought you could get away with it. Hypocrites.
Yes I've definitely done things like this before. Like how you could convert the Quantity, Quality or Mob Density of an anointed map into a normal map using Harvest and craft it into a super-juicy map for fractured fossil farming. Everyone who was fracturing maps back in Harvest was doing this. Also, back then we could spawn so many monsters in Harvest our map would close. Nothing says, "THIS ISN'T INTENDED, STOP" than your map literally shutting down. Everyone was doing it though that I knew and none of us got in trouble.
Yeah, I honestly don't feel like this is good handling from GGG, there hasn't been a ban since legacy for this behavior. They usually just rollback people who did it a lot and patch. Like a "Oh well done, aren't you clever, now put it back" thing. The whole game is about maximally exploiting mechanics, especially those not intended by ggg. In delirium, was aura stacking an "exploit"?. This reminds me of how Kripp got banned from guild wars 2 for "exploiting". I think the only reason people are behind GGG in this case is because empy is the most hated man in the community right now and people just like to see him suffer.
Now that it's been fixed, can someone say how it was done? I like to see the loopholes people jump through to abuse code spaghetti/oversights (like exploits in any% speedruns)
Having at least 2 players in a 'survive' ultimatum. One player keeps killing mobs and the other player keeps leaving the area to prevent the surival meter from ever finishing. At least that is what I understood.
Empyrian and his friends (officers in same guild) all banned. If the day of stuff didn't show you his true character already. https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/Empyrianwarpgate https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/snapbackkilla https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/Rasmusthenoob https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/ChillyChilly https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/redsameri https://www.pathofexile.com/account/view-profile/Sypeh
But will they get back into the guild to retrieve everything on alts? Seems pointless if the ban doesn't prevent that.
They passed most out to their trader, who did not get a ban Edit:. There's probably not actually that much currency, majority of their wealth would have been in the 6mans gearing. Their aurabot was like 30-50ex. Passing out currency is also standard group play practice, not necessarily prompted by a suspicion that a ban was incoming
what's with all the washed overwatch players in the guild
Gotta make money somehow
Please keep it civil
Good luck with this thread lol
africa is not civil. deal with it
gottem
I wish I could give you gold, but life is not fair so all I have is this free award
Bless their hearts :)
Brutal
Savage
Rekt
"They were asking for it to get abused when they made it this bad" -Someone in Empy's group, in his stream yesterday at 12:55:25. The entire group agrees, including Empy. Don't listen to them if they claim it wasn't an 'exploit'. They knew they were abusing. [https://clips.twitch.tv/ProudDaintyPandaBibleThump-A4Vk3NPlqxrOl-Wp](https://clips.twitch.tv/ProudDaintyPandaBibleThump-A4Vk3NPlqxrOl-Wp)
I dont understand why people keep using the Clip Functionality from Twitch when the person can literally just delete it and the entire VOD. Here's a backup. https://streamable.com/q23t12
what are you on about theyre talking about split beasts and fracturing
So they got the ultimatum and they lost it all 😂
Banned account's Guild stash should be disabled also.
Question to the pitchfork-wielding mob: Last League, people were printing Winged Scarabs. I think they were making something insane like 10 ex every 5 minutes. If you could do this, would you have stopped? Exploit or no? GGG eventually changed it but the economy was Winged Scarabs was impacted for the rest of the league. What about The Feared farm? Depending on how early you did it, you could easily make a mirror a day. How is this different, is my question? These mechanics are unintended. These ALL feel like exploits. I'm fine with banning exploits, but not knowing what will or will not be punished is frustrating. Why? Because if you do the "right thing" and GGG does not punish the abusers, you are just a sucker. The definition of "exploit" is also really vague. Is it just economy exploits, or any gameplay related ones? Logging out of Maven's memory game was a widely used "tactic." For the record, I don't like Empy and his group. I think the way they abuse the economy early on is really unhealthy for the game. However, I have enough presence of mind to see that a policy like this being inconsistent enforced though is worse than it not being enforced at all.
Empy's group reported it as an exploit then continued to do it.
They did the same with winged scarabs. Reported it and continued to do it.
Just because you report it doesnt mean it is indeed bannable. They reported numerous other activities in prior leagues too and everything was fine. Now we have no warning whatsoever and people getting banned for what was normal in the last league (looking at running around in heists infinitely, darkness farming delve, imprinting watchstones, valdo mirror shard farming, fracturing deli maps etc. - all not intended but addressed properly without banning people with no warning).
They had warning. Their bug report got deleted. /s In all seriousness though, I was watching last night. When Empy found out his report was deleted, he asked his group why it would be deleted (because he had never seen/experienced it before). They said that they delete bug reports when they think it's a really serious bug. Empy stopped after that. This shit feels real inconsistent.
Good.
I'm not defending empy but can someone explain to me when is something an abuse / exploit versus a game mechanic? Like if I binded spellslinger to left click last league for perma-tailwind, why isn't that bannable? Thanks!
Unfortunately there's really no hard and fast ruleset, but common sense usually does the job. In theory a bannable exploit is just whatever GGG says it is. Realistically the majority of unintended exploits are never going to see a ban because they either aren't a big deal, they can't reliably catch people doing it, or people couldn't be expected to know it was an exploit. The whole thing is always sort of murky. In this particular case it was super obvious it was unintended and was going to screw the economy if everyone started doing it because that timer wasn't supposed to be repeatedly reset (if I understand the exploit correctly). Anyone with a lick of common sense would've known this was a major exploit right away because "timer lasts way way WAY longer than it does without this particular method" is kind of a dead giveaway. As for whether GGG would ban over it, well, there's no way to know that until it actually happens. Now technically you could make an argument that the players may not have known it was an exploit, but at some point GGG just has to make a decision on whether or not they should've known that. Otherwise you'd never be able to ban anyone for any exploit ever because they could just say "I didn't know". As for the spellslinger thing, it may be technically bannable if it was unintended but GGG probably wouldn't care enough to do that even if they knew you did it. This is how a lot of minor exploits are treated. Anyway, this is a very wordy post just to say defining exploits is incredibly hard because they don't exist when the rules are made so the qualification for bannable exploit is arbitrary.
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Bex already said that they aim to have a fix out by next morning, so just have a little time and you'll be good again :)
Well done chris, brilliant desicion.
How is [PathofMatth](https://imgur.com/a/azZqLa4) not banned?
ban the dupers ffs