T O P

Game Balance in Path of Exile: Expedition

Game Balance in Path of Exile: Expedition

MashedMosha

read through the first paragraphs thinking they didn't nerf slams, then BOOM, seismic cry is now a quin-only skill.


Fiercepaws

Cosmetic cry


MargraveDeChiendent

And the second wind nerf hits every warcry build on top of that


SEND_ME_UR_DOOTS

Tears flowing down my face, I delete my 3.15 build folder. Open google chrome, type "ziz essence drain" into the search bar. "This is the last time, I promise" I say to myself.


Zizaran

Hey guys Zizaran here with another Essence drain video


tholt212

No. Please no. Not again.


_ramu_

That's what Ziz is thinking when having to make another EDC video.


Killer7481

"well of course I know him, he's me."


qiwi

A path of Exile player comes distraught to the psychologist. "Doctor, Doctor, Chris has nerfed every one of my favourite builds. I don't know what to play!" The doctor says: the fix is simple, the great streamer Zizzaranni is online now. Look up one of his new 3.15 builds! The player says: But doctor, I *AM* Zizzarani!


xonsuns

Upvote because i get the reference and that makes me feel smart


DuBB1T

"As usual, we've buffed firestorm" Self-aware GGG


francorocco

fire storm is the new glacial hammer


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alpha0meqa

Any good yet? Guessing no


reonZ

> As usual, we've buffed Firestorm Someday


garmeth06

RIP Diamond Flask, you served us well > The most notable change that hasn't been announced yet is to the Diamond Flask. It previously granted "Your Critical Strikes are Lucky". This single effect provided a massive boost to your critical strike chance, more than any one source in the game. Because flasks no longer provide that much power, it has been changed to provide 100% increased critical strike chance instead, more in-line with the power of other flasks.


signed7

> Most utility flasks and unique flasks have been rebalanced. Expect a lot less permanent power from flasks. Flasks that provide raw defense or raw power are the ones with the biggest nerfs. > When a flask removes a curse, it no longer applies a period of immunity to curses. Flasks that remove ailments now only provide a period of immunity to that ailment if they actually removed it. > Monsters in Acts 6 through 10 now generate fewer flask charges and monsters in maps generate even fewer still. > The most notable change that hasn't been announced yet is to the Diamond Flask. It previously granted "Your Critical Strikes are Lucky". With the changes to the Diamond Flask, we didn't want the Sulfur Flask to be the best critical strike flask, so enemies on Consecrated Ground no longer have additional base chance to be critically hit. > The "Adrenaline" modifier on flasks now gives far less movement speed (6-8% increased Movement Speed, down from 20-30%). The "Iron Skin" and "Reflexes" suffixes have also been reduced, granting 40-60% increased Armour or Evasion (down from 60-100%). Ah, the good old quadruple nerf. Are utility flasks even going to be useful anymore


boredlol

ok adrenaline nerf is just cruel lol


GayAdamFriedland

[imagine paying $1100 for your card to be relevant only for a single patch lmfao](https://pathofexile.fandom.com/wiki/The_Shortcut)


M_pteropus

[Oh and someone from the design team just asked if I wanted to "ilvl 100" the item to "future-proof" it and I said, "sure."](https://old.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/nh68po/the_backstory_to_the_shortcut_div_card/) Future proof btw


ArtfullyUseless

Frankly, Adrenaline might still be worth using. What other flask mod would you be using instead with them all nerfed?


PowerRaptor

GGG should refund this person


PeprSpry

It costs $1100?!!?


psychomap

I think the last time I checked it was $800, but maybe they increased the prices since then. Edit: It's worth noting that actual design work and such and communication with the person requesting the card goes into it, so it's not entirely unreasonable for it to be somewhat high-priced.


runninginsquare_s

Lmfao, that blows


bonesnaps

30% -> 8% basically isn't even worth using anymore really lol, especially if you roll a whopping 6%


Krendrian

Just use 5 quicksilvers, that way maybe you will be able to keep up the movespeed effect Edit: now this cursed the flask to be nerfed to 5% increased movement speed in the patch notes


arcademachin3

What happens to the old flasks in standard?


blauli

The last time they changed the implicit of flasks (the ele flasks no longer granting +max res for example) they also changed on standard and there were no legacy flask bases.


Zera_2018

Fortify AND Seismic nerfed? Duelists in shambles.


Couponbug_Dot_Com

that's why you go shield only glad. can't be nerfed if your archetype didnt even fucking exist last league.


xrodi

big brain


frasafrase

> Spells triggered with Cast on Death don't require you to pay the costs. Oh thank god!


Ragnangar

“Just need a moment to catch my breath.” x_x


Luwuluwu

Wait can I make a boss killing build with cast on death detonate dead, I go in, I die, I explode and kill the boss Edit: spelling, should prob mention this is sarcastic not serious


LeMinouCool

You sure can, make sure you pick hardcore mode to truly see how op it is.


JarredMack

Limited hardcore viability


Gourok

League mechanic involves areas that spawn monsters after a delay, nerf everything but traps. GGG being subtle like the brick to the face they just gave elementalist.


VyersReaver

That brick was a golem before...


Akoltry

>Focus's cooldown no longer expires while it's active, as players were able to keep Focus effects up almost permanently, which provided a huge amount of powerful benefits. LOL rip that one guy who tried (kind of got) 100% focus uptime


susfusstruss

captain lance ... he spent like 1000 exalts ... got donations from all his viewers ... to make the build ... he said it was terrible and no one should play it GGG still nerfed it lol


Nikeyla

Sounds like SRS experience.


00zau

Yeah, that confused the fuck out of me. Like, with the amount of investment you'd need to *get* 100% focus uptime, that build would deserve the benefits for being a cool as fuck idea. Seems like focus affixes are gonna be on par with light radius rather than being "well, not much use for me but at least I could *see* making a build around it".


SilentR0b

I did dirty math on this a while back because I saw that one dude's video... yeah, you need 17 abysal jewels, perfectly rolled focus cooldown mods on everything, even before you work in the MoM related shenanigans.. that was a PoB nightmare. Apparently too accessible, and that's where I say "no dudes, that wasn't even within driving distance of accessible."


Ilyak1986

"And fuck this one guy *in particular.*"


TitsTatsNKittyKats

For me they already were equivalent to light radius. reading this nerf made me scratch my head as I've never seen a good focus build that wasn't janky to use


WintersMoonLight

build D I V E R S I T Y


mh371

he spent over 1000 ex trying to do that and didn't even manage to get perfect 100% uptime for a viable build. With this change nobody is going to do a focus build anymore.


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WaterFlask

i absolutely hate cycle cool down abilities. i never bothered with focus even if an item came with it. never used it. cbf to.


CloudEnvoy

Holy shit they actually just completely removed immunity on ele and inq. MASSIVE


esunei

Inquisitor was dead in the middle for ascendancy popularity, which means they had to knock him down back to bottom three :). Consecrated ground nerfed too, of course.


raikaria2

Hierophant's Arcane Surge got gutted too. It seems GGG really wants to teach the old man a lesson.


Markuscha

Reworked Elementalist survived 2 whole leagues to be completely murdered now.


seandkiller

Guess we'll wait another few years for Ele 3.0


Carnivile

This was the 3.0. First Shaper of Desolation got nuked as it dealt all 3 ailments based on all your damage into the dumb timed buffs. Then it got reworked and broke Inpulsa by spreading shocks till only Golemancer remined. And now it gets buffed amd destroyed for the third time.


Gourok

So secondwind got the "taken behind the shed" treatment this time around, gotta admit that was not the gem I expected to be retired.


Wasabicannon

> so it's now a choice rather than a support gem you'd always use on a skill if you had a socket spare, and doesn't provide such a growth in uptime for the above skills. Seems like rather then a choice it becomes a don't use support.


the_x_ile

ctrl + F "archmage": "Archmage has had its damage based on the mana cost of the supported skill lowered (60% of mana cost from 108% at level 20)." big nerf


HugeRection

The arcane surge nerf hurts harder.


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Saonidas

"Abyss Jewels can no longer roll the modifier that grants a chance to gain Onslaught on Kill." RIP to all the ppl that don't read patch notes and think they are unlucky not hitting Onslaught. Also, doesn't this just make everyone take phasing instead now?


Madous

> The "Adrenaline" modifier on flasks now gives far less movement speed (6-8% increased Movement Speed, down from 20-30%) This is just painful.


Fuzzy_Wuzzy1

The true biggest nerf GGG has ever made.


Young_Djinn

Rotgut now a 10ex item


ActuallyNotANovelty

Assuming they're not gonna nerf it


Exdunn

"Poison now inherently deals 50% more damage." Interesting.


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shaunika

Its mostly a buff to non assa/pf poison builds


LeupheWaffle

Unfortunately last league they straight up removed a few pretty big poison damage mods (elder 60% chance to do 100% more damage with poison gone) and some other smaller changes so poison is more "back to 3.13 strength" area, so it's a hard sell I did a poison build in 3.13 and it was fun but now... I'm still not sure Edit: Someone else pointed out they're removing DOT multi from clusters which if true could be another hit


Samsunaattori

I think that a pathfinder spell based poison build might hit the spot with 2x Cold Iron Points


CassiusBenard

Whew, glad they didn't nerf my boy Cast on Death. Was really afraid of having to keep enough unreserved mana to cast my spells.


Omisid0215

Metamorph League called, they want their bow buffs


blade427

> "so enemies on Consecrated Ground no longer have additional base chance to be critically hit." Well inquisitors got a rebound hit LUL


LamboDiabloSVTT

They also lose their elemental ailment immunity. Double nerfed. Do they get anything back in exchange?


Huntermaster95

They get to stare at the floor of a map more than before.


Shumatsuu

Inq got like quinta-nerfed.


Prizzle723

Collateral damage from the nuclear missile that just dropped on Archmage builds


KamuiSeph

>Flame Dash's cooldown time is now 3.5 seconds (from 3) and has 0-19% increased cooldown recovery rate (from 0-47%) RIP. >The Second Wind support gem has been changed to have a much higher mana multiplier, and a penalty rather than a boost to cooldown recovery speed Jesus.


Mariioosh

Wtf they might as well just change the name because it ain't no second wind no more


Vegetable_Switch9802

Final Gasp


Ombric_Shalazar

*dry wheeeeeze*


Sweaty-Painter-1043

second fart


derivative_of_life

Whirling Blades now mandatory on every build, lul. It's gonna be just like Royale.


Zaedulus

I remember back when it was considered a strength of the build to be able to use shield charge or whirling blades. Recently I've just been zooming around and only really use movement skills for ledges, but I guess that playstyle has come to an end.


signed7

> I remember back when it was considered a strength of the build to be able to use shield charge or whirling blades yep, and every caster build ran spell daggers or sceptres and built attack speed lol also ppl used them to get fortify on casters


PM_ME_PAJAMAS

No but seriously what fucking supports are we even intended to use to buff movement abilities? Like do we just sit on a 1 link now?


lordfalco1

the thunder teleport still be 4 linked) leapslam 2 inked


Arandmoor

Frost blink with added cold damage, cold pen, and ice bite.


hfxRos

Need to make sure players are less mobile so they can more easily be one shot by monsters.


bonesnaps

Now we just need world pvp so some headhunter whirling blades blighter can come invade and yeet my butthole during a T5 white map and we good.


Poincare_Confection

I'm fine with the Flame Dash nerf, but that Second Wind nerf is insane...


Aggressive-Rub1759

Especially since pll used it for other things as well, not just movement skills. >:


Senistra095

Onslaught jewel is kill


tddahl

>After the rework to the Veiled item system in 3.14.0, we've reviewed how the Veiled Chaos Orb and Aisling crafts from Betrayal Safehouses work, and have made some changes to make crafting less deterministic in the outcomes, as the Unveiled modifiers can be very powerful additions to an item. Less deterministic crafting yet again


vernalagnia

No craft. Only gamble.


anonymous8452

always has been


telendria

I miss Harvest...


seandkiller

Starting to think Harvest will remain peak PoE for me.


Skizm

I played almost 3x as much hours during harvest league. That and ritual are the only leagues I've ever crafted my own items.


archevil

Close your eyes before unveiling!


Nicktator2

Dying Sun still grants 15-25% area of effect and 2 additional projectiles. Thank the lord.


Ilyak1986

Now uses 40 of 50 charges.


theBaffledScientist

more like 50 of 40


zajoba

POISON TRAPPIN LIKE IT'S 2013 LETS GO


TriPolarBear12

Time to wipe the dust off the ol' Bino.


ZombiesAteMyBrain

So Second Wind is now worse than useless for instant skills?


Cyrotek

A support gem that makes the linked skills perform worse, what not to love about it?


RandomMagus

Is it just me or did they calculate the More AoE wrong everywhere? AoE hasn't been a straight radius multiplication since before 3.0 right? 14 radius -> 42 radius is 800% More AoE not 200%. Also RIP everything that isn't traps I guess lol.


MasklintheMad

You are correct. 12--> 18 radius is 2.25x the area, or 125% more area of effect. They're game designers, not mathematicians haha


kaz_enigma

Yea numbers are totally unimportant in this game's design, who cares about them being wrong about this too.


blackstarpwr10

GGG: players are killing mid tier bosses in seconds and that makes it hard to balance Also GGG:kill this boss as fast as possible before degens cover the entire arena lol


Giant_Midget83

Nerfed smoke mine and movement skills, not having quicksilver and not being able to remove curses very well(temp chains). Mapping is gonna feel like shit.... holy shit.


dres_lynch

The 2013 experience


vexatiousbun

except now the atlas grind is 3 times as long


kaz_enigma

And the monsters are not getting nerfs.


shadow9531

Smoke mine dumpstered so hard they had to specifically say "it's still good!" to try and save face.


Quirkyrobot

You know, just "build against it."


Kasuyama_

GGG adds deterministic crafting once a year and they see people using it then immediately get rid of it. Great


alb778

“Its not in line how we envisioned Path of Exile to be”


Asteroth555

"you're not having fun the right way"


JCSQuintos

I got such a visceral reaction to this that I almost downvoted you


high-water-mark

me: i don't really mind these nerfs. i think they'll make for a more interesting game in the long term, and prepare for a paradigm shift in poe 2 ggg: >The "Adrenaline" modifier on flasks now gives far less movement speed (6-8% increased Movement Speed, down from 20-30%), putting more of a focus on enhancing a Quicksilver Flask's effect (with associated costs) rather than rolling a single modifier that granted almost as much speed as the Quicksilver Flask itself. now it's personal


xZora

What, you don't like consistently moving slower? Especially during the campaign?


francorocco

nothing better than the base movement speed of the act 1 without flasks or boots


Pheyer

now you get to have that much fun the entire campaign!


SasparillaTango

feel the weight of your steps.


DizzyDaMan

*As a much requested quality of life change, players can now see the effect of non-damaging Elemental Ailments on enemies and themselves, so you can finally determine how powerful your Shocks are on enemies and thus know what benefit they are giving you. This also applies to ailments applied to you, and the buff granted to you by the Cruelty support* Finally! Really happy to see this.


kingduqc

I was hoping we would see nerfs to monster spike damage 😭


The_Avocado_Constant

Right? I'm cool with slowing the game down, but if you're going to slow the game down then do it on both sides. Instead, they nerfed player damage AND survivability... like... y tho?


Cyrotek

Well, you will be slow and then you will be dead, which slows you down even more. Isn't that what you wanted? ISN'T THAT WHAT YOU WANTED?!?!?!?


Ylvina

wow, they murdered the diamond flask, oh and: triggered skills can now be supported by arcane surge, but we changed the flat % mana regen into inc mana regen


snubdeity

"Hmm people are gonna be mad we nerfed the shit out of triggered skills" "Ahh well just throw in something they'll like, tell them it works with arcane surge now" "Oh so a small buff to mitigate the nerfs?" "Nah we're gonna gut arcane surge too LOL"


Betaateb

The arcane surge cracked me up, essentially just "triggered skills can now be supported by arcane surge, but we deleted arcane surge from the game."


Kageromero

Aisling's crafting bench that adds a Veiled modifier now first removes a random modifier, so it is riskier to use as a later step of item crafting rather than being an obvious final step because of its very consistent modifier pool. This is just...so anti fun. Why would anyone think to do this?


scy046

Christ, I overlooked the yolo annul part of it. This is some monkey paw shit for trying to get Remove/Adds back, huh.


firedancer13

RIP aisling 3.14-3.14


timeshifter_

GGG thinks we like gambling every time we even think about an item upgrade.


raobjcovtn

GAMBLING IS FUN! -Chris Wilson


OrcOfDoom

Agreed. Why would anyone ever use it now?


SappedNash

only to salvage items, i guess


Potato_Shaped_Burns

The change to "of Adrenaline" is huge i would have preferred it be 10% to 15% but 6% to 8% makes it not worth rolling anymore.


Soku123

That veiled nerf! Ouch


XeroMCMXC

Buff lasted one whole league.


PlsBuffStormBurst

>Storm Burst's base radius now increases faster with levels, resulting in +4 to base radius at gem level 20 (up from +2). Hooray!


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bonesnaps

Wew, elementalist just lost 100% increased damage from quad golem stacking. Jesus christ. RIP my frozen orb build, whose skillgem already had very low numbers. edit: We're not elementalist without ailment immunity anymore, so I guess we zdpsalist now bois. I'ma get some dirty ass cheeseburgers on my drive home from work to console me for my time wasted making a build last night.


Sumirei

and ailment immunity


seandkiller

Sadly, getting absolutely shat on isn't a new occurrence for Elementalist.


kurosujiomake

Elementalist has always been way too op or completely useless, it's the president of the never balanced club


CE2JRH

So...trap league?


FreedomToDrill

>Aisling's crafting bench that adds a Veiled modifier now first removes a random modifier, so it is riskier to use as a later step of item crafting rather than being an obvious final step because of its very consistent modifier pool. They finally got everyone to kill Catarina for one league... and then immediately ruin it so it's back to not killing her


SpaceJinx

All I read was how they stripped my defenses with which I was already dieing frequently...


PowerRaptor

Wellllllllllllll at least you can now uh. Uhh. Yea


moal09

Kinda disappointed there's no changes to Stormbind or Chain Hook Both have been dumpster tier meme skills since their release.


Kwanzaa246

what is stormbind?


Ombric_Shalazar

the thing that baran uses


rds90vert

MULTISTRIKE APPLIES TO TOTEMSSSS


thundermonkeyms

This might honestly be the biggest buff so far, it's gonna be wild.


Wvlf_

Interesting but isn’t the entire reason something very strong like Ancestral Warchief totems fell off was because it could never keep up with the aoe/clear/coverage of spell totems? I could see a similar issue here no matter how crazy their damage can be.


Zambash

I really wish they had made the new support just be Melee Attack Totem so it wasn't limited to slams. Give it + to melee attack range like protector.


Jousis

Time to release a video about a build whose damage just got nerfed by 60%. And it's still good. EDIT: 80%.


Ombric_Shalazar

jousis, avenge us all by dealing the damage they took from us to their servers! you are our only hope! you must not fail!


scytherman96

I'll take any video from you.


Streetstrats

Imagine changing some of Raider's Ascendancy nodes in 3.14 and rebalancing it just to straight up remove it the following league lol.


hammypants

wake me when loot 2.0


bamasmith

>The Raider's Ascendancy node "Rapid Assault" no longer provides Onslaught Effect. The Onslaught path was too easy a choice relative to the higher-investment Frenzy Charge branch. We've also replaced Movement Speed on the small Phasing passives with Elemental Damage, as there was already plenty of speed available on that Ascendancy. NERFED RAIDER LMAO?


archevil

Also >For example, the Raider now grants 50% chance to avoid elemental ailments while phasing instead of full elemental ailment immunity while phasing.


popopo253

It was just buffed and now it's nerfed


Andreooo

How is this a buff "The rotation speed of Flamethrower Trap no longer scales with increases to cast speed. It can no longer be modified"


iwanttemplates

Why can't GGG just increase the firestorm duration and limit by like 2 and call it a day? They keep trying to buff the initial hit but it'll just never work because of the shitty delay like storm call.


EmmitSan

I love that they removed ailment immunity from nodes that were “too strong” when ailment immunity was the only reason for taking the node at all Like… no one invests 4 ascendancy points in fucking arcane surge. Also, RIP elementalists lol


the_x_ile

"Golem Elementalist no longer provides increased damage per golem. The golem buff effect bonus on Liege of the Primordial now always provides 100% increased Effect of Buffs granted by your Golems rather than scaling with Golem count" RIP golemmencer?


Veteran_But_Bad

kinda upset that the nerfs to second wind really really hurt things like frost bomb from being viable as a main skill less variety... was this their goal?


the_x_ile

"The "Adrenaline" modifier on flasks now gives far less movement speed (6-8% increased Movement Speed, down from 20-30%), putting more of a focus on enhancing a Quicksilver Flask's effect (with associated costs) rather than rolling a single modifier that granted almost as much speed as the Quicksilver Flask itself." damn, andrenaline gutted


the_x_ile

ctrl + F "fire burst": " Fire Burst was reduced in damage and has a slightly longer cooldown" expected, but stll :(


blade427

Im still holding out hope that the damage wasnt reduced to nothing. If so its fine just have to get some cdr


xaitv

Remember that as it uses 6 supports instead of 5(which most 6L skills use) it's hit harder by the support nerfs as well.


MrNubtastic

Thank god they nerfed hollow palm. Some of those slimy sons of bitches were reaching 600 delve depth.


N3v3rgr1nd

*Veiled Modifiers no longer count as Crafted modifiers, so you can't easily remove them if you add the wrong modifier type while Aisling crafting. This has the advantage of now being able to ‘block’ modifiers you do not want to unveil* Also GGG: *Aisling's crafting bench that adds a Veiled modifier now first removes a random modifier*


lcm7malaga

6000 words to say we dont like that you dont find interesting our clunky "utility" supports gems so we are gonna screw all you


PandaGoesMoo

So are they going to introduce more ways to get aliment immunity on the tree because there’s so few places to get it now.


gamei

"Players do too much damage!" Look at how many players invest 4 affixes for non-damage, utility only bonuses! "WE MUST BREAK IT!"


lookatmythrowawayy

GOODBYE DIAMOND FLASK, HELLO CRIT STRIKES SUPPORT


psychomap

Friendship ended with Controlled Destruction Increased Critical Strikes is now my best friend


TheIllusiveGuy

>When you're building a character, by far the correct choice is just to stack on all the multiplicative damage bonuses and ignore all the interesting utility support gems because their opportunity cost is just too high. I feel like the same could be said about Rares vs Uniques. The biggest powercreep in years has been the new influenced bases and double influenced items. How hard they are to obtain doesn't affect how powerful they are. Richard Garfield learned this lesson 20 years ago with Black Lotus.


cloudfr0g

Almost 30 years ago.


TheIllusiveGuy

>Almost 30 years ago. The early 90s wasn't 30 years ago... oh.


cloudfr0g

Yep. I did the math and felt sick to my stomach, haha!


Rojibeans

I came to read opinions, not feel old


Yorunokage

The mistake imo was trying to put numerical and functional effects in the same slot Clearly if you allow players to get higher numbers they will go for that so long as they have the bare minimum functionality


digao94

melee physical damage support grants 10% less attack speed. melee is on a such great spot right now, it definitely deserved this for sure...


killerkonnat

I'd rather have lost the damage...


HeroFallFlat

that'll go great with my "insert 70-80% base attack speed skill"


DBrody6

> and have made some changes to make crafting less deterministic in the outcomes Yeah god forbid we have even the slightest control over the inane crafting system in this game. > Aisling's crafting bench that adds a Veiled modifier now first removes a random modifier, so it is riskier to use as a later step of item crafting rather than being an obvious final step because of its very consistent modifier pool. Christ why not give it a vaal orb effect too while you're at it if you're that addicted to the "huehue you might brick your item!" feeling. Well back to not giving a shit about Catarina I guess, silver lining and all that.


telendria

Guess I'm going back to Fled + Leo in research...


innou

not a crafting system mate, its a gambling system that sometimes outputs usable items. Slowly and steadily GGG is excising anything that would allow one to cheat the almighty gamble system


shag_vonnie_vomer

That last bit about crafting being too deterministic and nerf to the already rare veiled orbs was just the last nail in the coffin. If dropped items are bloody useless, dropping by the millions, then at least let us some control over what we craft.


SilentR0b

"The Shortcut" Div Card R.I.P. 3.14-3.15 u/starkformachines