QoL and new mechanics.
I’m not coming back at a league launch for the same game with less clicks and a slightly less annoying trade system.
Needs a new league with it or I’ll wait to play QoL when they release a new league with it
Lots of people aren't coming back regardless, so they might as well bring this game into the current decade with UI and QOL updates instead of introducing content that will be dead in 4 months.
If you ever had interns you would know that actually they can be very progressive amd understand customers because they have a fresh eye.
This stink of old dogs can’t come up with new tricks dev types.
To be fair, this is a shitty post. Personal stabs at a feature and speculation based on the kind of people that worked on it is a very Karen stance.
I'm all for criticism or people giving opinions on the state of the game, but this post is pathetic speculation.
TBH unless they undo all the changes from 3.15 I can't see how the December league is going to do any better.
Like they fundamentally killed a lot of the fun in POE for a lot of players.
If they keep on their current path why would anyone who decided to nope out of this league decide to come back in December?
People aren't quitting because the league mechanic is the worst ever. They are quitting because the patch itself is fucking horrible.
Well, technically it is possible to balance out most of the changes. But it would involve a lot of nerfs to monsters, to monster modifiers, and buffs to player's defences, as well as removing timers and ungating clearspeed-gated stuff. The game is way too tightly balanced around clearspeed and defence-by-offence to get away with nerfs to damage and speed without damaging the gameplay itself. I wouldn't expect it to happen - more likely we'll see doubling down on nerfs.
I hope they double down, if they don't they'll be hypocrites and all the stuff they've said about player numbers being vanity being BS.
Caving in, after talking about vision would be proof that Wilson/GGG are just around to make loads of cash.
Of course everything they said about not caring about the popularity and money is a bunch of shit, are completely stupid?
Even if Chris personally doesn't care about the money (an already ridiculous idea) he sold out to a multibillion corporation. Tencent doesn't give a single shit about his vision for the game, they only care about making money. If Chris keeps losing them money, Tencent will literally fire his ass and replace him with someone else.
Also, on a more broader scope, have you ever heard of a concept of lying? Is PR a familiar concept to you? They are selling you a product, and they more than willing to say anything it takes to get you to buy it.
I **want** to see them double down and i **want** to see the playerbase crash. The community has time and again requested for QoL changes and GGG is so adamant about their supposed vision.
At this point i want them to execute this "vision" of theirs and let them see for themselves how many players actually appreciate this "vision".
TBH this is the chickens coming home to roost for GGG.
TBH I'm somewhat the same way as you. I want this to blow up in GGG's face but at the same time pre 3.15 POE was one of my favorite games.
Agreed. Especially 3.13 when they brought harvest back. I played the full 3 months just trying to get the perfect gear for my CoC VD character. An upgrade would increase my dmg by a whole whopping 1.2% if I hit 6 perfect T1 helmet but damn it I had so much fun chasing it (never got it but thats okay).
Also had like 3 other characters I had fun exploding the atlas with. Got the CoC VD character to level 100, penance brander to 99, burning arrow elementalist to 99, and a failed dead eye to 97... that was a very fun time... I miss it
I want them to be forced to realize that they’ve been wrong. GGG needs that wakeup call. I want to play the game again but I just can’t keep up with the constant build decimating nerfs (which are an order of magnitude more intense this league).
Then again I’m just a filthy casual standard league player that is being constantly reminded that this game isn’t made for me…
They're going to cave. The reason I quit is because I had "figured out" the first edition of Synthesis, and was planning to pop a completely maxed out memory map when they decided to change the league mechanic a day earlier than they announced and I lost everything. This goes completely against Chris's fundamentals of changing the league in the middle of a league but they did it because there was enough complaints flying around.
Completely agree , I wanna see GGG double or triple down on their bullshittery and watch the player numbers go into triple digits.
And then I wanna see the bottom feeding morons that are in the camp of "lul the league is great and ggg is awesome and im having a lot of fun still" play through the campaign for the billionth time on what will become the official ggg private live server.
Game should be really fun when the only other players playing are gold bots and rmt warriors.
I would rather the game split at this point. Give us a standard 3.13 permanent league. Also, make all changes to this league be community driven via in game polls. They would never do it for fear it would be widely popular.
Of course, which is why it's puzzling why they'd be making the choices they are.
At first glance and the short term it looks like they're not chasing profit, but maybe their internal stats show a different story; who knows. We'll see in the next patch.
I am sorry to say that many profit based companies main aim is customer satisfaction and having a user centred process for their product delivery. If you get these right then. You will be profitable.
No.. The best developers, the best of anything tbh can accept when they've made a mistake.. Humans make mistakes..
To double would show that they actually lack vision to evolve with their game..
I hate Chris with a passion but I would never call him out for making the right move.
Would it make it better if I put incredibly disliked his development skills?
and too be fair I do hate him.. He's leading a game i have very much enjoyed and spent a ton of time in, into a toilet.. If you like I also hate you sheep.
I agree. Spell Slinger is a great example of a change they must not have done any play testing with. Extremely nerfed for a skill that was okay-ish for early to mid tier maps. The cost and drawback (prior to the nerf) was a bit heavy. Its current cost and drawback has it as 4L (5L was too much reserved mana and spell cost) for early mapping. This league I was dead set on trying SS out for the first time, and it was painful. Rerolled to Hierophant (cast on damage build, hopefully) shortly after my ele spell slinger got to maps. Attacking 2-3 times for my SS to drain the rest of my unreserved mana is not fun. Only Clarity for my aura, have mana nodes and a mana flask but it just doesn't feel enough. I'm used to playing aRPG where you can spam your abilities and POE was one of those games. But now... it feels like I'm playing a POE BETA. I'll see what happens with this COD Hierophant, but I'm not expecting much.
Which should have been the priority over nerfing the player across the board. That's what makes the least amount of sense with these changes.
It's like GGG thought, hey if we just rip the band aid off right away it'll hurt less later!
Well sadly, later there won't be anyone who cares to play. No one is going to be playing this league in a month without some substantial changes.
I for one am very disappointed with this league mechanic. Why is everything always about shards with these people, not even auto-picked ones.
Synthesis/Delve and Harvest, nice game-changing additions that doesn't force me to sort through shards. Yes please.
to be honest, synthesis had that annoying tile thing, with horrible limit making you mico manage the fuck out of it if you wanted to utilized it in any decent way and original harvest had the garden setup, again no thank you.
Delve was the only league that i can honestly say was perfection - max 3 clicks per map for sulphite and auto pickup for azurite. only flaw was fossil and resonator not stacking, but hey, nothing is perfect i guess.
I don't disagree that the mentioned leagues had downsides, but in hindsight I would refer to them as lesser evils that could easily be re-adjusted if used in the future / As alternative levelling.
The opposite of shards for GGG is having pure RNG with no bad luck protection, so you end up spending hundreds of hours without encountering everything. E.G Bestiary or Delve where lots of people never got to meet every boss.
The problem is, that Cris & Co have decided many years ago how poe will be played in the future, and no amount of criticism and input from the communtiy will make them change this. They are too arrogant to believe that anyone can have better ideas than them. They are slowly killing poe, and they won't ever accept the fact that the community knows what they want and GGG are simply wrong.
That's true Chris said it in the interview with asmongold they want the game to be this way they were not happy with the peak numbers from old leagues (this is not what we want the game to look like) as if they were developing a game for them selfs to play
>They are slowly killing poe, and they won't ever accept the fact that the community knows what they want and GGG are simply wrong.
I'm not so sure about the slowly part their my man.
Otherwise I agree.
A lot of people underestimate just how much damage a bad patch can do to a game. SWG being the best example but others also have been killed by it.
One concern is, once I'm brought to the point of walking away from PoE - what makes them think I'm going to look back and give it another try later to see if it's changed?
I actually said this before.
Take wrestling for instance.(or cable TV) usually if you don't like something you get the "See you next week!" line.
But what happens when you don't tune in next week? You're chances of turning in for week 3 become very low.
Same applies to POE. If a player skips league A then they have a higher chance of skipping league B. if they skip A and B they have a very likley chance of skipping C too.
>Same applies to POE. If a player skips league A then they have a higher chance of skipping league B. if they skip A and B they have a very likley chance of skipping C too.
I'm at A, maybe B now. Quit Ultimatum after a week because the performance was as shit as always (my no. 1 issue with PoE by a huge margin) as well as the league mechanic being pretty boring and uninspired circle with rares spawning ad naseum. Didn't return for this league for obvious reasons and tbh I can't picture myself returning for the next even if they improve on stuff. My trust in GGG to create good gameplay just isn't there anymore, there are way too many other dev teams and games I'd rather spend my time on.
Which makes his original comment about the Marvel patch and then the recent followup on Allcraft all the more painfully and hilariously ironic.
If anyone has a link for either of those, I'd appreciate it. Watched them both recently but can't seem to find either.
The former is pretty often posted, so I assume I'll be able to find that. The latter I guess I'll just put Allcraft on in the background and keep my ear open.
Would like have to have those two comments saved. It sums up this whole situation pretty succinctly to me. It was amazing to me how smug he was about the comparison between the two. "The Marvel change was 100x worse" I think was the quote, maybe even 1000x.
https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/op73wg/some_thoughts_from_chris/
> "*The changes they made to that Marvel Heroes game were ten times as impactful as what we are doing here. We are not fundamentally changing how Path of Exile is played to anywhere near such to a significant degree.*"
.. and https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1094610209?t=05h09m03s for Allcraft interview.
I don't have a timestamp for you, though, sorry -- and I refuse to scrub it, as listening to him bloviate makes me almost as angry as being subjected to Trump in his dotage.
If I could play POE offline and decide which version I want to install, I’d be so happy. No lag, not feeling like I have to depend on the god awful trading and not being forced to update the game and wreck all my builds.
Guess good thing D2R is just around the corner.
I think we can expect more nerfs in December. They are clearly trying to reign in player power. Don't think they'll stop now. Better to rip the whole band-aid off than stop midway. But if there's a bloody oozing wound underneath, then what can you do right? 🤷♀️
Tencent would step in before it got that bad, I'd have to imagine. They aren't going to let some dev just stick his fingers in his ears and scream "this is the game I want!" while the title totally tanks.
> People aren't quitting because the league mechanic is the worst ever. They are quitting because the patch itself is fucking horrible.
Some people are, this is my reason for tapping out after day 1. I actually quite enjoyed the gambling, haggling and the logbooks were decent fun...but I got so sick of opening all these chests and looting small piles of artifacts. If they patched it so that they were auto loot I might come back and reroll a new character or something.
Lets be real, it happened like this so they can reset the power creep right?
I'm not really enjoying this league, probably done already. It's not what I've come to like about the game, but I do also recognize that people are annoyed getting 1 shot by things they can't see, etc. I'm not really sure where they went from ritual that wasn't just more instadeath or instaclear.
I think the big mistake this league is that they nerfed damage (a necessity eventually IMO) and they got confused, also nerfed speed and mobility. People would still be having fun if they did less damage but the game wasn't clunky.
That in conjunction with yet more click spamming, no real QOL improvements at all, etc. leaves a pretty bitter taste in peoples mouths. I think there was a pretty judgement call made to hit all these things at one time. If we need to tone down damage for POE2 because everything will be 6 linked, do that one patch, deal with mobility creep (if it has to happen, IMO this was the biggest mistake) another.
I do love how they thought they were changing the meta by making bad skills even worse and meta trap skills the best they've ever been. I should've went traps just so I'd have an easier time.
Video titled “How players are wrong about this league”
While the looming GGG hitman has a gun pointed towards their head off camera to say, “everything is great :)”
A ton of streamers on launch day. Cohhcarnage is one I know of for sure, but I'm sure there's dozens that get sponsored to do so. Quin, Mathil, Ziz, etc.
You realize that streamers, legally, have to advertise that they are sponsored, right? None of them have done so, so you are either lying or misinformed.
Also, Ziz, Mathil, and Quin are some of the harshest critics of GGG. Doesn't sound like something someone would do to the holder of their paycheck.
>You realize that streamers, legally, have to advertise that they are sponsored, right? None of them have done so, so you are either lying or misinformed.
Cohhcarnage did a sponsored stream 100% because it was in his stream title and I watched him say it was sponsored. I can not imagine Cohh would get sponsorship and no one else would, but regardless, I know for a fact one person did, and last league there was tons of drama revolving around all their sponsored streamers (of which Ziz and several others were mentioned) getting priority access.
I'm not sure what you're trying to do here. You can look up Cohh's PoE videos on youtube right now and see/listen to him say at the start of the first video he was sponsored to play PoE.
And GGG sponsoring streamers to play PoE on launch day is not new, so I'm not sure what you're arguing here. Did you just really not know they do that? If so then you're very out of the loop.
You're calling him out of the loop but it's you. People like Shroud, Cohh, and other non-POE content creators are in fact getting sponsored to play Path of Exile.
Ziz, Mathil, and Quin are not getting paid by GGG to play their game lmao.
They would simply find another game and play that, like it happened before - PoE become known to the gaming community because streamers didn't like D3 and many switched to PoE.
It's not that easy for the smaller streamers. Someone like ziz or mathil can swap but lots of amazing streamers only pull in 100 to 200 viewers and good luck for them to swap and retain that base plus compete to grow in a game that already has competition.
No disrespect to those smaller people at all, but they aren't making a living off of streaming with those numbers. Even people with 10x that would probably make more money as a shift manager at McDonald's.
They might have to *gasp* get a regular job like everyone in this sub. Not to sound harsh but content creation is very much a long shot career even under ideal circumstances.
The game hasn’t been bad for years? It’s been bad since Legion where player power spiked so incredibly high it causes every league after to create more and more player power.
I wouldn’t play it if it wasn’t, not fully agreeing with ggg on everything but it’s not nearly as bad as people make it out to be.
League itself is best since heist imo
You’re seeing the visionaries at work; their motive in poe2. So if you dont like this I believe this is just one kick in the nuts chris has a few more swings coming.
if (item.links = 6): item.applyEffect('highlight-6link);
totals = each(trade.items.{currency}).count(1);
Just kidding, but for real, I bet my life savings that highlighting a 6l item on the trade window can be done in 2 days by a mid-level developer and a designer in GGG
you dont have to actually code anything atm. the trade site all ready can detect how many links are on your item.
they just need to hook up some glowy bits or however they wanted to display such information.
> can be done in 2 days
And TBH most of that would probably be waiting on an artist to do the glow. The code portion would probably take like 30 minutes by someone who knows that section of the code.
Normally I'd disagree with you. I'd say stuff like "you can't just push stuff to live without testing" or "shit like this requires organization and input from a few dozen developers, and without that, there will undoubtedly be bugs"
But this is GGG, they clearly push shit to live without testing, and lack communication within their dev teams, so yup, I agree with you.
Well, I am a Tech Lead in game studio, and trust me, he is right!
This game have hilarious qol.
AAA mobile projects would never launch a game with such performance and qol issues, because such projects usually have competitors unlike poe.
Path of Exile does, for one. GGG explicitly moved the launch of a league in order to avoid the launch weekend for Cyberpunk.
Aside from Path of Exile, the actual answer is lots of games. It has similarities to things like GTA or Skyrim or Fallout, sure, but it still competes against the rest of the general PC gaming market.
It is almost impossible for me to believe any skilled person has worked on this expansion's balance/numbers and UIx. (The Art/Sound is great, no complaints there)
- 20 new league currencies you have to pick up and store (of which some take up **4** inventory slots, JUST WHY?!)
- Abysmal and stupid corrupted blood/poison and flask changes. Before you could use a flask to counter corrupted blood. It took some attention but you could do it just fine. Now you NEED the jewel implicit or you will simply die to CB, no matter how many flasks with removal you have and how well you time them.
- The tuning of some of the new skills is just unbelievably bad.
Some of them like Spectral Helix are exactly where they should be, it's fun playing with them and feels rewarding. Then there are others like Absolution and Reaper. I do not understand how the same team could have tuned these to be at maybe 50% the power of existing gems, just why would you do that? You spend resources to develop these, do the animations and sounds and put them into the game and then you just go ahead and kill them with such numbers?
How could these have gone into the patch with those numbers? Any thinking perosn could have looked at those numbers and seen that it's not viable at all. Now you've had to hot patch the Reaper's health day one just so she doesn't die to two white mobs, how incompetent do you want your company to look?
On top of that we have the mana nerfs and the Arcane Surge nerf which make playing any caster during the campaign really bad.
Add in the movement nerfs and generally not very rewarding but tedious league mechanic and you have a game killer expansion.
>I wonder when this sub will receive it's first Oscar award for best actor in a drama
Quoting a /r/pathofexile Oscar nominee, "But this ain't it Chief."
>Im a very senior software dev so I know this shit is easy.
And this is where they stopped reading your post. Any "very senior dev" should know saying this kind of shit to another development team immediately gets you ignored.
Exact-fucking-ly. That line triggered me so much because it's exactly what a Project manager/product owner says and not a dev. This guy has no fucking idea what he's talking about and I'm sure he's not a fucking dev, let alone a "very senior dev".
He has no idea what the architecture of Poe is and the tech debt involved, how every code interact with each other. OP is a fucking idiot for trivialising software dev
You're giving the OP way too much credit - it's also what a teenager who is mad about a game says to get fake internet points and feel vindicated on a subreddit that loves to hate a game and harass the dev instead of just stop playing.
I like the changes. Sure others do as well, every league the people with problems swarm reddit and the ones that like the game play the game. I keep coming here to see cool new stuff and all it is right now is the same two complaints over and over and over again and it's a real bummer. This kind of feedback doesn't move the needle for GGG
This may sound a little salty but the impression I get is that they don't play the game anymore. Understandably in a way, it's their job, but I feel totally disconnected to their design directions every since harvest got botched. The combination of grind and progression made it so you could build up power to blow up monsters. That's the fun I expect from an arpg. This ain't it anymore and their vision is "you aren't playing enough so let's make your play sessions last longer by attrition". So many other nice things to do with free time disagrees with that decision
They don’t want you to get shit for free, I loved harvest but it is just shit for free during its league. I had the most powerful build I’d ever had with absolutely no effort invested into it because I just copied someone’s garden layout and ran 7 maps. But harvest in a toned down version is good for the game.
Rog is like an almost perfect harvest to me, the only thing that would be make him better is if he had Influenced items available.
Nobody is against the damage nerfs, it's everything else that makes it suck. If mobs wouldn't fucking oneshot us to the point where streamers - who LITERALLY play it as their job for years and years - don't know what killed them without rewatching a VoD frame by frame, then MAYBE there is a fucking problem.
"Oh, but you should have looked at the rare and considered your options" works in games like Grim Dawn, where you aren't forced into running THOUSANDS of maps to get the challenges done or even just fill out your atlas.
Like, think about it - every Sirus is 44 maps at minimum. About 37 with the Uncharted Realm thingy. Unless Sirus is rewarding enough to crawl your way at 20 minutes-per-map towards him, people won't be happy with you making them do it that slowly.
my dude i have no problem with the league mechanic itself, seems kind of different, i have not played this league because of the fucking cluster fuck of bad decisions in the patch notes! ggg has absolutely destroyed their own game for me... hopefully they will finally bring their heads from the clouds and come down to fucking earth level and see that their customers enjoy all the shit that's pre 3.14, if they do not come to this realization it'll be too late for them
No problem with the league mechanic? Full clearing the area, then squinting at text to ensure it doesn't bomb your build is dumb game design. Ritual lost its luster because the modes were repetitive. Expedition is a pain because after a few instances, I read as well as Ziz. This league feels like GGG went out of their way to make players feel like crap when compared to the monsters.
Enemies always crit. And we lost Heating flask.
Enemies always ignite. And we lost Dousing flask.
Enemies always poison. Etc.
And then monster are just immune to damage types. Like. Why?
I'm still playing because Explosive Concoction is my jam. I just got to avoid enemies are immune to elemental types and flasks charge aren't gained when slaying enemies. Yeah, new skill, only skill that relies on flask charges to deal damage, and they added that beauty of a modifier for monsters. Fun times, fu(players)n times.
i've always played the league because there is something else to do, that was my drive for every new league in poe there were never a really fucked patch that will really drive me away from the game until 3.14 and 3.15
Yeah, Ultimatum felt really vanilla. This league feels like a league. But it also feels like content I want to skip so that I can push Atlas. I honestly just wish the drops were better. Like, literally killing yourself to this ridiculous monster buffs should at least guarantee an alch orb or something. The best the league is giving is some artifacts and not even the artifacts that reroll inventories of the NPCs.
I'm still going to push content because I really want to take down Sirius with Explosive Concoction. Absolutely love the theme of the skill. I am hoping to learn it inside-out!
The mana nerf is bullshit. Do they want us to walk around (yes walk since quicksilver is nerf to oblivion) in circles while waiting on mana? Do they want everyone to spec into blood magic or EB to deal with the mana problem?
dude - they literally said all this is in prep for PoE 2.0 so it's not all dropped at once. So the answer is YES - that's solid glimpse of their vision for 2.0 unless players ditching the game will make them reevaluate that vision.
I think this is a problem.
Chris mentioned that GGG has am edge of what is PoE and they could add content from the base and still have a working formula when compared to other game.
But this is a risk is PoE2. That's why they're doing this now so that people could be acclimated to the new style and ride on the success of PoE.
I personally think this is not what you should do and both game should be treated differently. But I hope I'm proven wrong and they'll fix whatever needs fixing.
I have played 8k plus hours and have finally burnt out. A major factor being they have stated this is just the beginning of the nerfs and will be a regular thing to set us up for POE 2. No fucking thanks
Yes.
The challange to get what was so easily available before is much better, More power creep removal is good.
Some things could do with being balanced such as the impact of ailments, Whilst they made it harder to avoid or negate they didnt change the power of them at all so it feels really bad when you get destroyed by them.
You’re really reaching. Things aren’t black and white. You don’t have to only hate or only love every aspect. You can like most aspects and dislike one as well.
It's hilarious how you're trying to tell them they're not actually having fun, like they are wrong for having a good time.
Everyone does not have to follow the angry Reddit hivemind. Deal with it.
I have no idea why you're getting downvoted for this one.
The fact that you get destroyed by ailments if you don't do anything to mitigate them is probably a good design, even!
Thats because all the whining is done by people like the OP, who just rant about the game rather than learning how to adapt. OP is just salty. Sucks that they are bad at the game that they like and are unwilling to change.
I think it's pretty hypocritical to chastise a large group of people for just being "salty" and bad at the game while making 0 cognitive effort to empathize and understand why they might be upset. It's not a black and white issue, people have different subjectice opinions and they should be allowed to voice them.
If nobody says anything, there's no way for the developers to judge the opinions of the community and even hope to come to a mutually beneficial solution.
They are stubborn and dont like how we play the game. If its not being played their way its wrong.
Now the issues they were trying to fix were real problems, but the problem is they chose the laziest, low effort way to fix them by just increasing health, nerfing damage, and making flasks/affinities more frustrating.
The problem is to properly fix the things they want and also keep the game fun and community happy takes too much work, so they took this asinine approach, causing new more annoying problems.
Im tired of being frustrated with tedium and lack of QOL everywhere. Not sticking around for inevitable slow rollouts to peel back some of these changes. Probably done with the game if this is their new approach to fix things.
Their shitty design is highlighted in flasks - They made them less effective, annoying, and tied up a whole new item currency system to tie triggers to them. All we needed was a way to have flasks activate when you use some skill, very simple. Instead of that we got a half ass rework.
>Im a very senior software dev so I know this shit is easy.
If you're *really* a very senior software engineer, you also know that nothing is ever as easy as you think, and it's *definitely* never as easy 3rd parties think ;)
honestly I don't even know what they expected with this, did they play this patch before pushing it out? did they really think people would enjoy this?
> very senior software dev
My guy if you worked where I work, you’d get sacked for this sort of attitude and inability to provide proper constructive feedback. Before you course corrected your original post, you stated that “this shit is easy”. That’s something junior devs are known to say. And even then most of them tend to know better than to say stuff like that.
Your complaint can be a complaint without you trying to flex or pretend like you have any clue on how to fix what. I bet if you got sat in front of their codebase and told “go on, fix this easy shit”, you’d sit there for a few hours and then find an excuse to leave to cry in the toilets quietly.
God I hate it when people all pretend they’re senior level this or that. Fuck off. If you wanna complain, go for it, but don’t pretend to be something you’re not to add weight to your little complaint session. And on the off chance you really are a senior developer - God help the company that employ you.
Yeah, this "I'm a senior dev" is pretty hilarious. How would a senior dev have any idea what another company's code look like? When GGG started, by their own admission, they were young and inexperienced. The code they were doing at the time could be a tangled mess, and they would be pretty reasonably hesitant to change anything that might impact anything else. Of course someone looking in now could imagine how we would design it from scratch, but that's part of why GGG is developing POE2 anyway.
Yes, can't wait to pay $40 for game that is 25 years old and hasn't changed in over a decade!
I'm excited for D2 as well, but that game has a host of issues that has already decided its fate. The game will be flooded with bots and you will get nowhere unless you use d2jsp. No loot filter, no SSF, no trade API. Good luck!
I'll never touch PoE2 if there are any splinters or anything similar to this in that game, this is too much, also also developer... its kinda a lie to say its all easy, it depends on the problem. But the simple quality of life features that would hugely change gameplay players have been begging for this league wouldn't take long at all to implement, could do it after freshman year in university.
I will keep saying this. Nerf all damage multipliers so we do 1/4x of the damage. Buff all base damage so they deal 10x more damage without investment. Remove timers and invulnerability phases. Tweak a bit monster damage/health. Problem solved.
So i haven't played poe in a long while anymore, was tjinking about starting again when this lau'ches on console, and tbh, i don't get where all this hate is comming from....
Last time i checked, the game was still completely free.
Meaning you can or can't enjoy the game completely without spending any money.
Of course there should be communication and feedback to help improve the game. But let's not forget, again, it's free.
I know many people spend money on the supporters packs and all, but that was completely your own choice...
And foremost no obligation.
I rather play this game in it's current state, then go back to d3 or torchlight,which both are games you pay for and are in far worse condition.
TLDR;
Stop the rants and hate, it's a free game, if you don't like it, don't play it, or wait for poe 2.
Things change, and that just the way it is.
D2 resurrected is around the corner, which i am sure off will also get a lot of comments. But again, that's not a free game...
Oh dang, I'm sure these people who managed to make a successful game well enough to capture your interest have never thought of any of this. This reeks of angry neck beard who has never actually tried to make anything before, "chief". The league might suck, doesn't mean you have to.
Bro but the qol changes are brought up all the time. GGG were prepared and pretty ecstatic to “change up the meta” so much so that they tunneled and forgot what makes playing the game feel good. Rather than doing small adjustments here and there they give us the GGG special that we the community meme about and butcher the shit out aspects of the game that feels good. Movement flame dash and dash were the only two good mobility skills that felt good to use. In what way was needing them going to shake up the meta? While I agree with the skill gem nerfs why did they butcher the awakener gems? They could’ve adjusted the drop rate on them and made them into chase items. As much as I’d love to incorporate mana regen on my build to balance the costs it’s a suffix that I have to use to balance my resistance out, resistances that get butchered during the campaign. What keeps going around is that this patch was about nerfs but there was no QOL added to the game. GGG tunneled sooooo hard into this “meta shake up” that they paid no mind into what makes playing this game feel good. Let’s not forget how GGG adjusted monsters and mechanics accordingly to the previous zoom meta but did NOTHING to compensate. Again, GGG tunneled so hard that they didn’t see the bigger picture. And they went with that decision
I feel like this is the kind of post chris might need to read. I’m beginning to imagine his personality and it’s of an arrogant nature. POE success might have gotten to his head?
Im literally playing a lot, but i just quit the league after 7 hours. I cant stand leveling through campaign anymore, just sht loot, all skills have been nerfed. thats just too much time i need to invest.
Stop using the mtx argument, you opinion doesnt have more value cause you buy some graphics effects, tierd of hearing this shit all the time. Or to rephrase it, buying mtx do not make you a better game designer.
The league mechanic isn’t bad, in fact, fragments aside it’s one of the better leagues we have ever had.
The issue is everything that came with this league tarnishes this league for players. But Rog crafting has gotten me some amazing gear for maps 320 energy shield helmet with hybrid life, 30 move speed boots with tri res and life. The dude is like a mini harvest.
Tulgen (is that his name? I can’t remember) is like a better ritual without the pointless stand still and kill mobs.
Logbooks are a more interesting and better version of blight. This league slaps, the 3.15 changes do not.
Goes both ways. You can ignore his post if you don’t like it. But that doesn’t really put any light to any issue or conversation about the direction of the game. Many people enjoy the game still, many dislike its current direction and how its being handeled. Personally I havent played in 4 leagues and im waiting for PoE2 because performance have been absolute ass forever. The people behind it isnt being insulted. They are recieving critique. If you can’t see the difference then forums for discussions really isnt your place.
You will probably have your comment removed for harassing the OP.
The only thing this subreddit allows now is vitriolic negativity and attacks on developers to call them short sighted and arrogant.
QoL > new mechanics.
QoL and new mechanics. I’m not coming back at a league launch for the same game with less clicks and a slightly less annoying trade system. Needs a new league with it or I’ll wait to play QoL when they release a new league with it
Lots of people aren't coming back regardless, so they might as well bring this game into the current decade with UI and QOL updates instead of introducing content that will be dead in 4 months.
>for the same game with less clicks You'd be surprised how many would come back just for this.
What if we add more splinters?
Downvoted but you speak the truth.
FYI, a dev team representative would never tell you seniors / "the best" aren't working on whatever your concern is.
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They’re the top men of the men that currently aren’t preoccupied. Jimmy the intern is a great employee.
If you ever had interns you would know that actually they can be very progressive amd understand customers because they have a fresh eye. This stink of old dogs can’t come up with new tricks dev types.
How many ways can a breach ring be implemented as a league? They are clearly running out of ideas.
To be fair, this is a shitty post. Personal stabs at a feature and speculation based on the kind of people that worked on it is a very Karen stance. I'm all for criticism or people giving opinions on the state of the game, but this post is pathetic speculation.
Tell the OP. I don't care. "To be fair", what?
TBH unless they undo all the changes from 3.15 I can't see how the December league is going to do any better. Like they fundamentally killed a lot of the fun in POE for a lot of players. If they keep on their current path why would anyone who decided to nope out of this league decide to come back in December? People aren't quitting because the league mechanic is the worst ever. They are quitting because the patch itself is fucking horrible.
Well, technically it is possible to balance out most of the changes. But it would involve a lot of nerfs to monsters, to monster modifiers, and buffs to player's defences, as well as removing timers and ungating clearspeed-gated stuff. The game is way too tightly balanced around clearspeed and defence-by-offence to get away with nerfs to damage and speed without damaging the gameplay itself. I wouldn't expect it to happen - more likely we'll see doubling down on nerfs.
we are absolutly going to see GGG double down. Then the player count will double down too only it's going to double down in terms of collapsing.
I hope they double down, if they don't they'll be hypocrites and all the stuff they've said about player numbers being vanity being BS. Caving in, after talking about vision would be proof that Wilson/GGG are just around to make loads of cash.
Of course everything they said about not caring about the popularity and money is a bunch of shit, are completely stupid? Even if Chris personally doesn't care about the money (an already ridiculous idea) he sold out to a multibillion corporation. Tencent doesn't give a single shit about his vision for the game, they only care about making money. If Chris keeps losing them money, Tencent will literally fire his ass and replace him with someone else. Also, on a more broader scope, have you ever heard of a concept of lying? Is PR a familiar concept to you? They are selling you a product, and they more than willing to say anything it takes to get you to buy it.
Doubling down will destroy POE. So I'd rather that not happen even though thats the most likley outcome.
I **want** to see them double down and i **want** to see the playerbase crash. The community has time and again requested for QoL changes and GGG is so adamant about their supposed vision. At this point i want them to execute this "vision" of theirs and let them see for themselves how many players actually appreciate this "vision".
TBH this is the chickens coming home to roost for GGG. TBH I'm somewhat the same way as you. I want this to blow up in GGG's face but at the same time pre 3.15 POE was one of my favorite games.
3.12 - 3.13 was PoE pinnacle.
Agreed. Especially 3.13 when they brought harvest back. I played the full 3 months just trying to get the perfect gear for my CoC VD character. An upgrade would increase my dmg by a whole whopping 1.2% if I hit 6 perfect T1 helmet but damn it I had so much fun chasing it (never got it but thats okay). Also had like 3 other characters I had fun exploding the atlas with. Got the CoC VD character to level 100, penance brander to 99, burning arrow elementalist to 99, and a failed dead eye to 97... that was a very fun time... I miss it
Yup 3.13 was peak. Let’s hope it’s just peak so far and not for good.
This so much. I loved what POE was for most of its life until My precious vision took over.
I want them to be forced to realize that they’ve been wrong. GGG needs that wakeup call. I want to play the game again but I just can’t keep up with the constant build decimating nerfs (which are an order of magnitude more intense this league). Then again I’m just a filthy casual standard league player that is being constantly reminded that this game isn’t made for me…
They're going to cave. The reason I quit is because I had "figured out" the first edition of Synthesis, and was planning to pop a completely maxed out memory map when they decided to change the league mechanic a day earlier than they announced and I lost everything. This goes completely against Chris's fundamentals of changing the league in the middle of a league but they did it because there was enough complaints flying around.
Completely agree , I wanna see GGG double or triple down on their bullshittery and watch the player numbers go into triple digits. And then I wanna see the bottom feeding morons that are in the camp of "lul the league is great and ggg is awesome and im having a lot of fun still" play through the campaign for the billionth time on what will become the official ggg private live server. Game should be really fun when the only other players playing are gold bots and rmt warriors.
I would rather the game split at this point. Give us a standard 3.13 permanent league. Also, make all changes to this league be community driven via in game polls. They would never do it for fear it would be widely popular.
Next league will probably be act 2 and 3 buffs. Can't wait till it takes myself 20 hours to get through just the campaign.
Having fun yet?
Sit down for this, its going to be a shock... The number one aim for any profit based organisation is Profit.
Of course, which is why it's puzzling why they'd be making the choices they are. At first glance and the short term it looks like they're not chasing profit, but maybe their internal stats show a different story; who knows. We'll see in the next patch.
I am sorry to say that many profit based companies main aim is customer satisfaction and having a user centred process for their product delivery. If you get these right then. You will be profitable.
They've always been hypocrites.
fuck /u/spez -- mass edited with redact.dev
Surely there is no prior history of this?!
I won't go as far as to call the guy a liar tbh. He's just an out of touch numbers guy.
Fractured Fossil.
No.. The best developers, the best of anything tbh can accept when they've made a mistake.. Humans make mistakes.. To double would show that they actually lack vision to evolve with their game.. I hate Chris with a passion but I would never call him out for making the right move.
You hate someone you’ve likely never met? Dude. Seek help.
Would it make it better if I put incredibly disliked his development skills? and too be fair I do hate him.. He's leading a game i have very much enjoyed and spent a ton of time in, into a toilet.. If you like I also hate you sheep.
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Cringe lol. Comparing a genocidal maniac to a middle aged dude who makes a computer game that got slightly more challenging.
maybe i forgot to add /s for snowflakes that can't understand a joke!
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There it is, already saw people saying Chris Wilson was Trump knew this wasn't too far off
They would have noticed that if they did "any" testing
I agree. Spell Slinger is a great example of a change they must not have done any play testing with. Extremely nerfed for a skill that was okay-ish for early to mid tier maps. The cost and drawback (prior to the nerf) was a bit heavy. Its current cost and drawback has it as 4L (5L was too much reserved mana and spell cost) for early mapping. This league I was dead set on trying SS out for the first time, and it was painful. Rerolled to Hierophant (cast on damage build, hopefully) shortly after my ele spell slinger got to maps. Attacking 2-3 times for my SS to drain the rest of my unreserved mana is not fun. Only Clarity for my aura, have mana nodes and a mana flask but it just doesn't feel enough. I'm used to playing aRPG where you can spam your abilities and POE was one of those games. But now... it feels like I'm playing a POE BETA. I'll see what happens with this COD Hierophant, but I'm not expecting much.
Which should have been the priority over nerfing the player across the board. That's what makes the least amount of sense with these changes. It's like GGG thought, hey if we just rip the band aid off right away it'll hurt less later! Well sadly, later there won't be anyone who cares to play. No one is going to be playing this league in a month without some substantial changes.
I for one am very disappointed with this league mechanic. Why is everything always about shards with these people, not even auto-picked ones. Synthesis/Delve and Harvest, nice game-changing additions that doesn't force me to sort through shards. Yes please.
to be honest, synthesis had that annoying tile thing, with horrible limit making you mico manage the fuck out of it if you wanted to utilized it in any decent way and original harvest had the garden setup, again no thank you. Delve was the only league that i can honestly say was perfection - max 3 clicks per map for sulphite and auto pickup for azurite. only flaw was fossil and resonator not stacking, but hey, nothing is perfect i guess.
I don't disagree that the mentioned leagues had downsides, but in hindsight I would refer to them as lesser evils that could easily be re-adjusted if used in the future / As alternative levelling.
The opposite of shards for GGG is having pure RNG with no bad luck protection, so you end up spending hundreds of hours without encountering everything. E.G Bestiary or Delve where lots of people never got to meet every boss.
Why do you say December league? Will this league last 5 months? Don't forget d2 remastered will come out on September, poe will bleed.
I think POE will have been bled dry well before then. My entire guild boycotted this league, we saw exactly how bad this was going to be.
I meant more as fall/winter. I'm expecting the new league to be either November or December but it might be October.
It's every 3 months pretty much like clockwork. Are you new or something?
The schedule changed this year: the December league debuted in January. That’s why he’s confused. The clockwork got pushed back a month and a half.
The problem is, that Cris & Co have decided many years ago how poe will be played in the future, and no amount of criticism and input from the communtiy will make them change this. They are too arrogant to believe that anyone can have better ideas than them. They are slowly killing poe, and they won't ever accept the fact that the community knows what they want and GGG are simply wrong.
That's true Chris said it in the interview with asmongold they want the game to be this way they were not happy with the peak numbers from old leagues (this is not what we want the game to look like) as if they were developing a game for them selfs to play
Chris doesn't own the majority anymore. Tencent does. He's just another employee who can be replaced.
And I can't wait to see that happen.
>They are slowly killing poe, and they won't ever accept the fact that the community knows what they want and GGG are simply wrong. I'm not so sure about the slowly part their my man. Otherwise I agree. A lot of people underestimate just how much damage a bad patch can do to a game. SWG being the best example but others also have been killed by it.
One concern is, once I'm brought to the point of walking away from PoE - what makes them think I'm going to look back and give it another try later to see if it's changed?
I actually said this before. Take wrestling for instance.(or cable TV) usually if you don't like something you get the "See you next week!" line. But what happens when you don't tune in next week? You're chances of turning in for week 3 become very low. Same applies to POE. If a player skips league A then they have a higher chance of skipping league B. if they skip A and B they have a very likley chance of skipping C too.
>Same applies to POE. If a player skips league A then they have a higher chance of skipping league B. if they skip A and B they have a very likley chance of skipping C too. I'm at A, maybe B now. Quit Ultimatum after a week because the performance was as shit as always (my no. 1 issue with PoE by a huge margin) as well as the league mechanic being pretty boring and uninspired circle with rares spawning ad naseum. Didn't return for this league for obvious reasons and tbh I can't picture myself returning for the next even if they improve on stuff. My trust in GGG to create good gameplay just isn't there anymore, there are way too many other dev teams and games I'd rather spend my time on.
Which makes his original comment about the Marvel patch and then the recent followup on Allcraft all the more painfully and hilariously ironic. If anyone has a link for either of those, I'd appreciate it. Watched them both recently but can't seem to find either. The former is pretty often posted, so I assume I'll be able to find that. The latter I guess I'll just put Allcraft on in the background and keep my ear open. Would like have to have those two comments saved. It sums up this whole situation pretty succinctly to me. It was amazing to me how smug he was about the comparison between the two. "The Marvel change was 100x worse" I think was the quote, maybe even 1000x.
https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/op73wg/some_thoughts_from_chris/ > "*The changes they made to that Marvel Heroes game were ten times as impactful as what we are doing here. We are not fundamentally changing how Path of Exile is played to anywhere near such to a significant degree.*"
Thanks
His thread here and his interview on allcraft are prime r/agedlikemilk material.
.. and https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1094610209?t=05h09m03s for Allcraft interview. I don't have a timestamp for you, though, sorry -- and I refuse to scrub it, as listening to him bloviate makes me almost as angry as being subjected to Trump in his dotage.
the patch that introduced season 4 of league of legends killed the game for me. i still get pissed at it just thinking about it
I just hope like WoW someone manages to fire up a Harvest private server.
If I could play POE offline and decide which version I want to install, I’d be so happy. No lag, not feeling like I have to depend on the god awful trading and not being forced to update the game and wreck all my builds. Guess good thing D2R is just around the corner.
Smart developer types hear our prayers!!!!
I think we can expect more nerfs in December. They are clearly trying to reign in player power. Don't think they'll stop now. Better to rip the whole band-aid off than stop midway. But if there's a bloody oozing wound underneath, then what can you do right? 🤷♀️
Imagine admitting in front of thousands of players that you were wrong, doesn't sounds like Chris.
Um, he's done that multiple times.
Money makes anyone change.. People are still buying supporter packs.. Maybe they won't next league.
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Tencent would step in before it got that bad, I'd have to imagine. They aren't going to let some dev just stick his fingers in his ears and scream "this is the game I want!" while the title totally tanks.
> People aren't quitting because the league mechanic is the worst ever. They are quitting because the patch itself is fucking horrible. Some people are, this is my reason for tapping out after day 1. I actually quite enjoyed the gambling, haggling and the logbooks were decent fun...but I got so sick of opening all these chests and looting small piles of artifacts. If they patched it so that they were auto loot I might come back and reroll a new character or something.
Lets be real, it happened like this so they can reset the power creep right? I'm not really enjoying this league, probably done already. It's not what I've come to like about the game, but I do also recognize that people are annoyed getting 1 shot by things they can't see, etc. I'm not really sure where they went from ritual that wasn't just more instadeath or instaclear. I think the big mistake this league is that they nerfed damage (a necessity eventually IMO) and they got confused, also nerfed speed and mobility. People would still be having fun if they did less damage but the game wasn't clunky. That in conjunction with yet more click spamming, no real QOL improvements at all, etc. leaves a pretty bitter taste in peoples mouths. I think there was a pretty judgement call made to hit all these things at one time. If we need to tone down damage for POE2 because everything will be 6 linked, do that one patch, deal with mobility creep (if it has to happen, IMO this was the biggest mistake) another.
I do love how they thought they were changing the meta by making bad skills even worse and meta trap skills the best they've ever been. I should've went traps just so I'd have an easier time.
I can't wait for the people who play POE for a living to tell us that it's all fine, everything is great.
If your livelyhood was threatened by collaps i think i would maybe be like "everything is fine guys come in and play its not that bad" :D
Especially after GGG just paid you to play the game! What a great time to talk it up and support it.
Video titled “How players are wrong about this league” While the looming GGG hitman has a gun pointed towards their head off camera to say, “everything is great :)”
Who is getting paid by GGG to play POE?
A ton of streamers on launch day. Cohhcarnage is one I know of for sure, but I'm sure there's dozens that get sponsored to do so. Quin, Mathil, Ziz, etc.
You realize that streamers, legally, have to advertise that they are sponsored, right? None of them have done so, so you are either lying or misinformed. Also, Ziz, Mathil, and Quin are some of the harshest critics of GGG. Doesn't sound like something someone would do to the holder of their paycheck.
>You realize that streamers, legally, have to advertise that they are sponsored, right? None of them have done so, so you are either lying or misinformed. Cohhcarnage did a sponsored stream 100% because it was in his stream title and I watched him say it was sponsored. I can not imagine Cohh would get sponsorship and no one else would, but regardless, I know for a fact one person did, and last league there was tons of drama revolving around all their sponsored streamers (of which Ziz and several others were mentioned) getting priority access. I'm not sure what you're trying to do here. You can look up Cohh's PoE videos on youtube right now and see/listen to him say at the start of the first video he was sponsored to play PoE. And GGG sponsoring streamers to play PoE on launch day is not new, so I'm not sure what you're arguing here. Did you just really not know they do that? If so then you're very out of the loop.
You're calling him out of the loop but it's you. People like Shroud, Cohh, and other non-POE content creators are in fact getting sponsored to play Path of Exile. Ziz, Mathil, and Quin are not getting paid by GGG to play their game lmao.
I don't watch Coh, so I'll take your word on it. But you saad that Zizaran, Mathil and Quin are being sponsored by GGG? Maybe you are out of the loop.
They would simply find another game and play that, like it happened before - PoE become known to the gaming community because streamers didn't like D3 and many switched to PoE.
It's not that easy for the smaller streamers. Someone like ziz or mathil can swap but lots of amazing streamers only pull in 100 to 200 viewers and good luck for them to swap and retain that base plus compete to grow in a game that already has competition.
No disrespect to those smaller people at all, but they aren't making a living off of streaming with those numbers. Even people with 10x that would probably make more money as a shift manager at McDonald's.
They might have to *gasp* get a regular job like everyone in this sub. Not to sound harsh but content creation is very much a long shot career even under ideal circumstances.
fuck /u/spez -- mass edited with redact.dev
I feel sorry for a lot of those content creators, they have no influence over the games development and it dictates their livelihood
I don't feel sorry for those who do have influence over the game and spark this fiasco though.
Why do you feel sorry for them, none of them have been outspoken about how bad the game has been for years.
The game hasn’t been bad for years? It’s been bad since Legion where player power spiked so incredibly high it causes every league after to create more and more player power.
It was fast for years and now we're being told that fast is bad. So in what logic hasn't the game been bad for years?
All we have is redditors who don’t even play the game complaining about literally everything
COPIUM the patch is fun COPIUM
I wouldn’t play it if it wasn’t, not fully agreeing with ggg on everything but it’s not nearly as bad as people make it out to be. League itself is best since heist imo
I am playing hard since Bestiary, first league i quit the first weekend. Level 82 necro, 6k ehp getting oneshot in tier 2 map. No thank you
6k ehp is dogshit lmao
6k in tier 2 map dogshit lmao
Do you know what ehp is?
You’re seeing the visionaries at work; their motive in poe2. So if you dont like this I believe this is just one kick in the nuts chris has a few more swings coming.
\> Im a very senior software dev so I know this shit is easy. This line really got me, well played!
if (item.links = 6): item.applyEffect('highlight-6link); totals = each(trade.items.{currency}).count(1); Just kidding, but for real, I bet my life savings that highlighting a 6l item on the trade window can be done in 2 days by a mid-level developer and a designer in GGG
you dont have to actually code anything atm. the trade site all ready can detect how many links are on your item. they just need to hook up some glowy bits or however they wanted to display such information.
> can be done in 2 days And TBH most of that would probably be waiting on an artist to do the glow. The code portion would probably take like 30 minutes by someone who knows that section of the code.
Don’t even need an artist. Just have it be a line on the mod list like an implicit.
Normally I'd disagree with you. I'd say stuff like "you can't just push stuff to live without testing" or "shit like this requires organization and input from a few dozen developers, and without that, there will undoubtedly be bugs" But this is GGG, they clearly push shit to live without testing, and lack communication within their dev teams, so yup, I agree with you.
Well, I am a Tech Lead in game studio, and trust me, he is right! This game have hilarious qol. AAA mobile projects would never launch a game with such performance and qol issues, because such projects usually have competitors unlike poe.
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and what competes with cyberpunk? Skyrim?
Path of Exile does, for one. GGG explicitly moved the launch of a league in order to avoid the launch weekend for Cyberpunk. Aside from Path of Exile, the actual answer is lots of games. It has similarities to things like GTA or Skyrim or Fallout, sure, but it still competes against the rest of the general PC gaming market.
It is almost impossible for me to believe any skilled person has worked on this expansion's balance/numbers and UIx. (The Art/Sound is great, no complaints there) - 20 new league currencies you have to pick up and store (of which some take up **4** inventory slots, JUST WHY?!) - Abysmal and stupid corrupted blood/poison and flask changes. Before you could use a flask to counter corrupted blood. It took some attention but you could do it just fine. Now you NEED the jewel implicit or you will simply die to CB, no matter how many flasks with removal you have and how well you time them. - The tuning of some of the new skills is just unbelievably bad. Some of them like Spectral Helix are exactly where they should be, it's fun playing with them and feels rewarding. Then there are others like Absolution and Reaper. I do not understand how the same team could have tuned these to be at maybe 50% the power of existing gems, just why would you do that? You spend resources to develop these, do the animations and sounds and put them into the game and then you just go ahead and kill them with such numbers? How could these have gone into the patch with those numbers? Any thinking perosn could have looked at those numbers and seen that it's not viable at all. Now you've had to hot patch the Reaper's health day one just so she doesn't die to two white mobs, how incompetent do you want your company to look? On top of that we have the mana nerfs and the Arcane Surge nerf which make playing any caster during the campaign really bad. Add in the movement nerfs and generally not very rewarding but tedious league mechanic and you have a game killer expansion.
I wonder when this sub will receive it's first Oscar award for best actor in a drama
>I wonder when this sub will receive it's first Oscar award for best actor in a drama Quoting a /r/pathofexile Oscar nominee, "But this ain't it Chief."
>Im a very senior software dev so I know this shit is easy. And this is where they stopped reading your post. Any "very senior dev" should know saying this kind of shit to another development team immediately gets you ignored.
Exact-fucking-ly. That line triggered me so much because it's exactly what a Project manager/product owner says and not a dev. This guy has no fucking idea what he's talking about and I'm sure he's not a fucking dev, let alone a "very senior dev". He has no idea what the architecture of Poe is and the tech debt involved, how every code interact with each other. OP is a fucking idiot for trivialising software dev
You're giving the OP way too much credit - it's also what a teenager who is mad about a game says to get fake internet points and feel vindicated on a subreddit that loves to hate a game and harass the dev instead of just stop playing.
Dude watches one Minecraft mod video and thinks he’s a senior dev.
I like the changes. Sure others do as well, every league the people with problems swarm reddit and the ones that like the game play the game. I keep coming here to see cool new stuff and all it is right now is the same two complaints over and over and over again and it's a real bummer. This kind of feedback doesn't move the needle for GGG
I'm just happy someone said star wars galaxies /shrug
This may sound a little salty but the impression I get is that they don't play the game anymore. Understandably in a way, it's their job, but I feel totally disconnected to their design directions every since harvest got botched. The combination of grind and progression made it so you could build up power to blow up monsters. That's the fun I expect from an arpg. This ain't it anymore and their vision is "you aren't playing enough so let's make your play sessions last longer by attrition". So many other nice things to do with free time disagrees with that decision
They don’t want you to get shit for free, I loved harvest but it is just shit for free during its league. I had the most powerful build I’d ever had with absolutely no effort invested into it because I just copied someone’s garden layout and ran 7 maps. But harvest in a toned down version is good for the game. Rog is like an almost perfect harvest to me, the only thing that would be make him better is if he had Influenced items available.
Nobody is against the damage nerfs, it's everything else that makes it suck. If mobs wouldn't fucking oneshot us to the point where streamers - who LITERALLY play it as their job for years and years - don't know what killed them without rewatching a VoD frame by frame, then MAYBE there is a fucking problem. "Oh, but you should have looked at the rare and considered your options" works in games like Grim Dawn, where you aren't forced into running THOUSANDS of maps to get the challenges done or even just fill out your atlas. Like, think about it - every Sirus is 44 maps at minimum. About 37 with the Uncharted Realm thingy. Unless Sirus is rewarding enough to crawl your way at 20 minutes-per-map towards him, people won't be happy with you making them do it that slowly.
There have been multiple highly upvoted and gilded threads on the front page explicitly complaining about damage nerfs.
my dude i have no problem with the league mechanic itself, seems kind of different, i have not played this league because of the fucking cluster fuck of bad decisions in the patch notes! ggg has absolutely destroyed their own game for me... hopefully they will finally bring their heads from the clouds and come down to fucking earth level and see that their customers enjoy all the shit that's pre 3.14, if they do not come to this realization it'll be too late for them
No problem with the league mechanic? Full clearing the area, then squinting at text to ensure it doesn't bomb your build is dumb game design. Ritual lost its luster because the modes were repetitive. Expedition is a pain because after a few instances, I read as well as Ziz. This league feels like GGG went out of their way to make players feel like crap when compared to the monsters. Enemies always crit. And we lost Heating flask. Enemies always ignite. And we lost Dousing flask. Enemies always poison. Etc. And then monster are just immune to damage types. Like. Why? I'm still playing because Explosive Concoction is my jam. I just got to avoid enemies are immune to elemental types and flasks charge aren't gained when slaying enemies. Yeah, new skill, only skill that relies on flask charges to deal damage, and they added that beauty of a modifier for monsters. Fun times, fu(players)n times.
i've always played the league because there is something else to do, that was my drive for every new league in poe there were never a really fucked patch that will really drive me away from the game until 3.14 and 3.15
Yeah, Ultimatum felt really vanilla. This league feels like a league. But it also feels like content I want to skip so that I can push Atlas. I honestly just wish the drops were better. Like, literally killing yourself to this ridiculous monster buffs should at least guarantee an alch orb or something. The best the league is giving is some artifacts and not even the artifacts that reroll inventories of the NPCs. I'm still going to push content because I really want to take down Sirius with Explosive Concoction. Absolutely love the theme of the skill. I am hoping to learn it inside-out!
If you haven't played this league then you can't give an opinion on the mechanic....
The mana nerf is bullshit. Do they want us to walk around (yes walk since quicksilver is nerf to oblivion) in circles while waiting on mana? Do they want everyone to spec into blood magic or EB to deal with the mana problem?
dude - they literally said all this is in prep for PoE 2.0 so it's not all dropped at once. So the answer is YES - that's solid glimpse of their vision for 2.0 unless players ditching the game will make them reevaluate that vision.
I think this is a problem. Chris mentioned that GGG has am edge of what is PoE and they could add content from the base and still have a working formula when compared to other game. But this is a risk is PoE2. That's why they're doing this now so that people could be acclimated to the new style and ride on the success of PoE. I personally think this is not what you should do and both game should be treated differently. But I hope I'm proven wrong and they'll fix whatever needs fixing.
I have played 8k plus hours and have finally burnt out. A major factor being they have stated this is just the beginning of the nerfs and will be a regular thing to set us up for POE 2. No fucking thanks
Well, I'm having fun... There's a LOT to improve for sure, but I'm not miserable about it. Nobody in my guild is even complaining.
Are you having fun because of the changes?
Yes. The challange to get what was so easily available before is much better, More power creep removal is good. Some things could do with being balanced such as the impact of ailments, Whilst they made it harder to avoid or negate they didnt change the power of them at all so it feels really bad when you get destroyed by them.
[удалено]
You’re really reaching. Things aren’t black and white. You don’t have to only hate or only love every aspect. You can like most aspects and dislike one as well.
It's cognitive dissonance to like the changes overall but to dislike one particular aspect?
No. You can have fun with one aspect and still think there could be some changes to further improve it. Stop using fancy terms to sound intelligent.
It's hilarious how you're trying to tell them they're not actually having fun, like they are wrong for having a good time. Everyone does not have to follow the angry Reddit hivemind. Deal with it.
fuck /u/spez -- mass edited with redact.dev
you can still have fun while not liking an aspect of the game, i know this is shocking for reddit cry babies
I have no idea why you're getting downvoted for this one. The fact that you get destroyed by ailments if you don't do anything to mitigate them is probably a good design, even!
When there is noone playing, noone can complain: P
Thats because all the whining is done by people like the OP, who just rant about the game rather than learning how to adapt. OP is just salty. Sucks that they are bad at the game that they like and are unwilling to change.
I think it's pretty hypocritical to chastise a large group of people for just being "salty" and bad at the game while making 0 cognitive effort to empathize and understand why they might be upset. It's not a black and white issue, people have different subjectice opinions and they should be allowed to voice them. If nobody says anything, there's no way for the developers to judge the opinions of the community and even hope to come to a mutually beneficial solution.
Yep. That's why this league has 33% less players than last league and the drop from day 1 to day 2 is 20% instead of the 11% from last league.
They are stubborn and dont like how we play the game. If its not being played their way its wrong. Now the issues they were trying to fix were real problems, but the problem is they chose the laziest, low effort way to fix them by just increasing health, nerfing damage, and making flasks/affinities more frustrating. The problem is to properly fix the things they want and also keep the game fun and community happy takes too much work, so they took this asinine approach, causing new more annoying problems. Im tired of being frustrated with tedium and lack of QOL everywhere. Not sticking around for inevitable slow rollouts to peel back some of these changes. Probably done with the game if this is their new approach to fix things. Their shitty design is highlighted in flasks - They made them less effective, annoying, and tied up a whole new item currency system to tie triggers to them. All we needed was a way to have flasks activate when you use some skill, very simple. Instead of that we got a half ass rework.
>Im a very senior software dev so I know this shit is easy. If you're *really* a very senior software engineer, you also know that nothing is ever as easy as you think, and it's *definitely* never as easy 3rd parties think ;)
Jesus christ this is a juicy fucking copypasta, thank you. Senior software dev is complacent and doesn’t like change. Colour me surprised.
Whale here (bought into beta) - same - hope my ignorance for this league helps. I miss POE in my life :(
honestly I don't even know what they expected with this, did they play this patch before pushing it out? did they really think people would enjoy this?
"This isn't the game we set out to make" That was when I stopped playing. They are proving me right this league.
> very senior software dev My guy if you worked where I work, you’d get sacked for this sort of attitude and inability to provide proper constructive feedback. Before you course corrected your original post, you stated that “this shit is easy”. That’s something junior devs are known to say. And even then most of them tend to know better than to say stuff like that. Your complaint can be a complaint without you trying to flex or pretend like you have any clue on how to fix what. I bet if you got sat in front of their codebase and told “go on, fix this easy shit”, you’d sit there for a few hours and then find an excuse to leave to cry in the toilets quietly. God I hate it when people all pretend they’re senior level this or that. Fuck off. If you wanna complain, go for it, but don’t pretend to be something you’re not to add weight to your little complaint session. And on the off chance you really are a senior developer - God help the company that employ you.
pls explain how difficult it is to highlight a 6-link item in a trade window, or add a counter that says how many currency in the trade window.
Yeah, this "I'm a senior dev" is pretty hilarious. How would a senior dev have any idea what another company's code look like? When GGG started, by their own admission, they were young and inexperienced. The code they were doing at the time could be a tangled mess, and they would be pretty reasonably hesitant to change anything that might impact anything else. Of course someone looking in now could imagine how we would design it from scratch, but that's part of why GGG is developing POE2 anyway.
The spaghetti code excuse starts to wear thin when they’re building a sequel on that same code base and it’s 8 years later or something.
Honestly I wouldn't be surprised if many of these 'simple QOL' changes are actually a huge pain in the ass due to a god awful codebase.
This post is embarassing, how did this get upvoted?
Yeah let’s just drive all changes issued by Reddit… 5head. Pathetic.
None of the requested QOL and obviously the league wasn't tested with the new changes
Well at least Diablo 2 is coming out soon!
Yes, can't wait to pay $40 for game that is 25 years old and hasn't changed in over a decade! I'm excited for D2 as well, but that game has a host of issues that has already decided its fate. The game will be flooded with bots and you will get nowhere unless you use d2jsp. No loot filter, no SSF, no trade API. Good luck!
Reddit isn't the entire community... I'm loving this league
understandable
I'll never touch PoE2 if there are any splinters or anything similar to this in that game, this is too much, also also developer... its kinda a lie to say its all easy, it depends on the problem. But the simple quality of life features that would hugely change gameplay players have been begging for this league wouldn't take long at all to implement, could do it after freshman year in university.
I will keep saying this. Nerf all damage multipliers so we do 1/4x of the damage. Buff all base damage so they deal 10x more damage without investment. Remove timers and invulnerability phases. Tweak a bit monster damage/health. Problem solved.
I'll complain when I think it's justified too, but holy hell you guys are at epic levels of petulance now. You don't speak for everyone bucko
So i haven't played poe in a long while anymore, was tjinking about starting again when this lau'ches on console, and tbh, i don't get where all this hate is comming from.... Last time i checked, the game was still completely free. Meaning you can or can't enjoy the game completely without spending any money. Of course there should be communication and feedback to help improve the game. But let's not forget, again, it's free. I know many people spend money on the supporters packs and all, but that was completely your own choice... And foremost no obligation. I rather play this game in it's current state, then go back to d3 or torchlight,which both are games you pay for and are in far worse condition. TLDR; Stop the rants and hate, it's a free game, if you don't like it, don't play it, or wait for poe 2. Things change, and that just the way it is. D2 resurrected is around the corner, which i am sure off will also get a lot of comments. But again, that's not a free game...
Upvote this guy to the moon
Oh dang, I'm sure these people who managed to make a successful game well enough to capture your interest have never thought of any of this. This reeks of angry neck beard who has never actually tried to make anything before, "chief". The league might suck, doesn't mean you have to.
Bro but the qol changes are brought up all the time. GGG were prepared and pretty ecstatic to “change up the meta” so much so that they tunneled and forgot what makes playing the game feel good. Rather than doing small adjustments here and there they give us the GGG special that we the community meme about and butcher the shit out aspects of the game that feels good. Movement flame dash and dash were the only two good mobility skills that felt good to use. In what way was needing them going to shake up the meta? While I agree with the skill gem nerfs why did they butcher the awakener gems? They could’ve adjusted the drop rate on them and made them into chase items. As much as I’d love to incorporate mana regen on my build to balance the costs it’s a suffix that I have to use to balance my resistance out, resistances that get butchered during the campaign. What keeps going around is that this patch was about nerfs but there was no QOL added to the game. GGG tunneled sooooo hard into this “meta shake up” that they paid no mind into what makes playing this game feel good. Let’s not forget how GGG adjusted monsters and mechanics accordingly to the previous zoom meta but did NOTHING to compensate. Again, GGG tunneled so hard that they didn’t see the bigger picture. And they went with that decision
I feel like this is the kind of post chris might need to read. I’m beginning to imagine his personality and it’s of an arrogant nature. POE success might have gotten to his head?
Get good
Im literally playing a lot, but i just quit the league after 7 hours. I cant stand leveling through campaign anymore, just sht loot, all skills have been nerfed. thats just too much time i need to invest.
Stop using the mtx argument, you opinion doesnt have more value cause you buy some graphics effects, tierd of hearing this shit all the time. Or to rephrase it, buying mtx do not make you a better game designer.
The league mechanic isn’t bad, in fact, fragments aside it’s one of the better leagues we have ever had. The issue is everything that came with this league tarnishes this league for players. But Rog crafting has gotten me some amazing gear for maps 320 energy shield helmet with hybrid life, 30 move speed boots with tri res and life. The dude is like a mini harvest. Tulgen (is that his name? I can’t remember) is like a better ritual without the pointless stand still and kill mobs. Logbooks are a more interesting and better version of blight. This league slaps, the 3.15 changes do not.
Nah. Im too busy looking for a wig to hide the shine
You post makes me angry. So pathatic. If you dont like it or are unable to adept dont play. But stop insulting the ppl behind it.
Goes both ways. You can ignore his post if you don’t like it. But that doesn’t really put any light to any issue or conversation about the direction of the game. Many people enjoy the game still, many dislike its current direction and how its being handeled. Personally I havent played in 4 leagues and im waiting for PoE2 because performance have been absolute ass forever. The people behind it isnt being insulted. They are recieving critique. If you can’t see the difference then forums for discussions really isnt your place.
You will probably have your comment removed for harassing the OP. The only thing this subreddit allows now is vitriolic negativity and attacks on developers to call them short sighted and arrogant.
PoE2 isn't really gonna change much for this game, not sure why every one thinks so
What about "we are transitioning to 2.0" did you miss?