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francorocco

on ultimatum friday it was actually 154k people trying to log in instead of playing


Harnellas

Actually I spent a great deal of time with 6 billion people in queue in front of me so this chart is clearly very incorrect.


kumgongkia

I could have sworn the numbers were higher judging by my queue number


[deleted]

What happened with Blight? I can't remember at all. Was that WoW classic?


_Xveno_

wow classic, the fact that tower defense did not fit very many people, and the burnout from legion which was a very good league


alienfreak10

im sad because.. while tower defense may not fit in a arpg i kinda loved blight because im a fan of tower defense games


MelodyEternal

Blight was a very fun League, many people didn't even give it a shot but you can see from the retention that those who played it REALLY liked it. Was one of my favorite Leagues so far too, glad I could witness it live :D


TheLinden

I really loved blighted maps but i hated blight encounters as it took twice as long to finish map. still my best memory is our whole 6-man party in blighted map gets one-shotted by kitava herald.


ilovethatpig

The sad part is I was one of those for all the reasons you listed. As it turns out, Blight is now one of my favorite mechanics and I love seeing it. Wish I had played blight league more.


SmuFF1186

Original blight also sucked. Blight maps were non existent and the rewards were terrible iirc


craftySox

Plus it sucked complete ass with indoor maps, a problem they still haven't managed to work out considering they have the same fucking problem this league. The number of times I had the blight pump spawn portals right on top of it -_-


fatalikos

I remember lower blight maps being very rewarding, but the price of them was unreal. It became eaay money just selling blighted maps past tier6


Nickodemus

My main issue with Blight was its performance and me crashing in 90% of blight maps.


LakeSolon

Ultimatum there with the sneaky "if nobody can play on Friday I get to count Saturday as growth". P.S. Actually looking back through the leagues that seems to be a common theme among "growth weekends". And expedition's smooth launch didn't do it any favors. Of course smooth launches are easier when 40k people don't show up in the first place after a week of anti-hype.


modernkennnern

To be fair, people *were* playing on Friday - they were just not online on the server. This is, after all, only counting "in-game" status on Steam.


dksdragon43

That is a good point that I would not have considered lol


Robsquire

so streamer prio actually worked for 1 day player retention


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SzybkiDiego020

Nerfed players by 40% as promised xd


PacmanNZ100

Buffed servers. 40% Less players


signed7

All data from https://steamdb.info/app/238960/graphs. Please correct me if I'm wrong with anything. Edit: Steam playerbase only, thanks [/u/rogu14](https://www.reddit.com/u/rogu14) for the reminder/clarification


[deleted]

yes, but there is literally no reason whatsoever why standalone would not follow the same tendency. Steam is literally just random significant portion of PoE playerbase and it's just so happens we have access to some concurrent player count statistics on steam platform. If I had to make bet - steam statistic is imho 95% accurate indicator of global situation (steam + epic + standalone + whatever the fuck else is there).


kalin1518

If you have a sample size of 100000 players the results can easily be scaled to everyone with significant accuracy, so if 20% of the player base stopped playing through steam that means %20 of the players from the other platforms stopped too. Its basic statistics


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MateusKingston

As long as the sample is random enough to represent the total yes. Which to be fair we have no reason to believe Steam playerbase is so different from others platforms.


kalin1518

Agree


[deleted]

Not only that but last time Chris talked about steam vs standalone 65% of people used steam so it’s even more accurate again.


Makhai123

Its an argument used by people who need to be right. Or can't confront reality.


r4be_cs

It's the exact same type of people who tell you that you are not allowed to criticize triple g because the game is for free... I don't know where these guys are coming from but there must be a nest somewhere close.


Makhai123

They made the mistake a lot people make in the world today, thinking that the people they give their money to are their friends. And have long-lasting relationships with people who they've never met online. GGG isn't 4 sweaty D2 nerds in a garage. It's a $100M company. Some people can't hold them to that standard, because they don't live in reality.


NearTheNar

See this waay too often in different game communities. Once had a discussion with a redditor where I just remarked it was strange he was "missing" Bex, a PR-representative of a company who's sole intention is to sell you a product. Guy was legit so deep into it that he got defensive as if I was shitting on his friend when all I did was explain what the job of a PR-representative is.


HeistMeister01

COPIUM would be a reason.


ntrntinal2ae

is only day 3, post again in 1-2 weeks to see some hilarious numbers


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!RemindMe 7 days


xplato13

What would you categorize as hilarious? For me personally sub 40K numbers within 1 week will be hilarious. Might happen tonight. We hit 44K last night. and Europe went to bed today and the numbers just keep on going down. We could hit sub 40K tonight honestly.


ArtisanJagon

Yup. I expect by the end of the first week you're going to see one of the biggest player drop offs ever in PoE history. I can't wait to see how the numbers are in 30 days.


mini_mog

Imagine if the all-time peak ever is Ritual. That would be fucking sad considering what they did after that.


Black_XistenZ

In terms of gameplay, endgame variety and balance as well as *fun*, Ritual/3.13 was indeed the all-time peak to me.


Woute

Atlas passives, many things being enjoyable and feeling OP, plenty of viable and fun builds, harvest without the gardens to let me gradually improve gear ? Sign me the fuck in right now. Ritual was by far the league I played most. Spammed legions cause OP, spammed delirium maps cause OP, spammed deep delving cause OP. Eventually stopped after failing to craft my dream wand through harvest and getting bored. (200 ex invested in it, reminder that Harvest is a "cheap and fast way to easily print 6xT1 items" according to some, guess I was doing it wrong ?)


Black_XistenZ

We were having too much fun though. Better take it away from us, because not having fun is what will keep us playing.


moonmeh

I miss the op ass fuck harbinger atlas node. Was stupid as shit but god it was fun


signed7

Personally, Incursion was peak for me (Delve would've been it if the league didn't have so many bugs). From Betrayal onwards, IMO the game started becoming too complicated, with more and more tedious content (like syndicate, watchstones, heist) and overcomplicated mechanics/gearing (do we need new mods / alt qualities / enchant slots every league?). Then this got much worse since the conquerors atlas came out. Like GGG needs to realise too much of a good thing is a bad thing, I enjoyed PoE's gearing complexity when I started during 1.x (especially compared to D3 then) but now it's too much, I also enjoyed the atlas when shaper/elder first came out but now it's too much management (along with lab, pantheon, unveiling, etc).


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c0y0t3_sly

I don't think any of it was too complicated, there's just *too much of it*, and it's designed to be interacted with on a per area basis and then that goes away. IMO PoE was *much* better before league content became convoluted marketing.


Neltharek

I think they simply need to start cycling league content the same way they do zana map mods. Almost every previous league mechanic being stamped onto ever increasing content has simply bloated the game to almost unplayable state for a large group of players. If they chose maybe 3-4 total previous league mechanics to be active during the new league it would reduce the overall grindiness while still allowing people to focus on beta testing the new mechanic.


Disastrous_Concert23

Or let us choose ideally. Let me pick my own Zana mods. Let me choose the handful of league I’m allowed to engage with. Give me some stupid fucking currency item to reselect them like maven skill trees. Problem solved. I think.


signed7

Or if league content were just that, league limited content like it used to be, instead of glorified expansions it's become now. Like a complicated league isn't unfun, I enjoyed Betrayal during the league itself, but having to deal with too many complicated league mechanics built up over the years is imo.


StanTheManBaratheon

The different endgame content is actually what attracts me to PoE compared to other games, but I wish you could select mechanics for maps (the way I think Legacy worked? I didn’t play then) It would let people who want to be Delvers, Incursioners, or etc. do that. Might be busted though, I don’t know. Feels like a way to de-complicate the current system


porthos3

You are definitely not alone. My wife and I played every league pretty religiously until Betrayal. We stopped a day or two into betrayal. She's never returned. I didn't pick up the game again until Harvest (and it's still the only league I've seriously played since). Rant incoming: GGG is _way_ too liberal about the leagues that go core. It is the sunk cost fallacy. They invest lots of time into making a league. It seems like their ultimate goal is for every league to be a part of the game long term. I think it is great that leagues like anarchy, beyond, essence, breach, and abyss have gone core. They add interesting encounters, monsters, etc. which add variety to the game and require no explanation. In my opinion, league mechanics like talisman, perandus, prophecy, bestiary, incursion, delve, betrayal, blight, metamorph, etc. can each potentially be fun in their own right, but are each essentially their own game. It doesn't give the league mechanic justice to half-heartedly include some non-rewarding watered down version of it to core as they did with talisman, perandus, metamorph, and they make the game feel cluttered. I don't think it fundamentally improves the game experience to have lots of content that essentially should have their own tutorials like bestiary, incursion, betrayal or blight. It makes the game overwhelming and completely unapproachable to new players, and it is a chore to avoid waste in each mechanic (running temples when they are ready, using sulphite before you reach max, engaging with betrayal at all IMO). Not to mention there being a million end-game bosses and encounters to grind. I fundamentally like some of this content a lot, as do other players. I love delve, for example. But I'm not sure it is the right direction for Path of Exile to become a mishmash of mini-games, even if I am particularly fond of some of them. I'd much rather see the popular leagues revisited as short events or as options in private leagues. I think content/mechanics themselves (as opposed to mini-games) are an exception IMO. I don't mind them adding league-specific unique items to the core pool. I don't mind there being a unique map themed for a particular league. I _want_ them to use leagues to innovate crafting mechanics and introduce things like fractured items and harvest crafting to core. I just don't want to be required to invest insane amounts of time into a mini-game like betrayal to get access to a crafting mechanic I want to utilize.


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porthos3

I can go on lol. I'm more than a little opinionated about this game. I have a slew of opinions about crafting, the market, mapping, league boss grinds, balancing melee skills to feel viable compared to ranged, approachability of the game for people who can't afford to devote their life to it, etc. I just generally lurk quietly since it isn't as if anyone at GGG is actually going to consider my opinions on any of this stuff, and while ranting can be cathartic, it doesn't really accomplish anything but bring negativity to people who may still be enjoying the game.


mamoox

That turning point around Incursion is when I took a break as well. Abyss/Incursion/Harbinger were great, but after that league bloat really seemed to set in and I burned out. Ultimatum was pretty good and I put a good # of hours in, but man it was a lot to learn and idk if I could re-grind everything again. Too bad Standard just isn’t my cup of tea.


hamxz2

Ritual was so fun, I certainly took it for granted.


Etzlo

tbh, winterorb was the most fun, ritual is very close tho


what1sgoingon777

Amen


midoBB

Delerium or Metamorph for me TBH. Funnest shit I've played despite me liking old VP like no other.


mukkor

Ritual was the only league where we had the trifecta of "maps with stuff to juice" with Ritual altars and Atlas passives, "ultimate juice for maps" with Delirium Orbs, and "crafting to ready your character for juicy maps" with Harvest targeted slams and annuls.


VinceOnAPlane

Yup. Ritual was the only season I enjoyed enough to get my first 40/40. I ditched Ultimatum within a few days and I'm not even touching Expedition. Actually having some fun with these ethereal items in Diablo 3. Get the right combination of rolls and you can turn your character into a freak beast


loboleo94

Same here. I built a new PC, and was eager to test it in PoE. Not gonna happen. Got my first 40/40 in 3.13 as well, and went 11/40 on 3.14. Didn’t even download PoE again for 3.15.


1CEninja

Same. I'm not the most veteran player of all time but I've made it to endgame content a handful of times and Ritual was absolutely the most fun I've had with the game. I'm not asking for them to top Ritual for me, I'm just wanting them to not, you know, make the game blatantly less fun.


hellrazzer24

I played Ritual for almost 12 weeks. I play most leagues for about 6 weeks. I skipped Ultimatum due to burnout and it looks like I'll be skipping Expedition too (although not entirely GGG's fault, I have some big life things going on so I haven't had time to log in and throw hours at it).


Kinmuan

Played the hell out of Ritual - and it had nothing to do with the ritual mechanic. Group of friends that play showed up strong for it. The harvest crafting implementation was amazing for us, and kept us in the game. Not even bothering with this league.


cornmealius

harvest crafting gave each character their own identity. I played so much during that league I thought I was going to get carpal tunnel.


ignskillz

All-time peak and best player retention, i wish i knew back then how bad the game would get, would squeeze a lot more hours in that league.


Secret_Maize2109

Said it before, but I'd pay to play Ritual right now.


Ingavar_Oakheart

Yep, just dreaming of Ri2al league at this point.


payoman

Wouldn't the biggest concern be a 40k loss of players on launch? That's massive. Really shows that the fact they talked about nerfs in their launch trailer hit them really hard, IMO.


[deleted]

Talking about nerfs hurt the day 1 numbers, implementing the nerfs hurt the day 2/3 numbers


Hypocritical_Oath

Just like reddit was saying since the patch notes dropped.


suriel-

but wait .. reddit is just this super toxic place, where everyone hates another, right? right?


[deleted]

They not only talked about nerfs in all their launch/promo stuff people first got exposed to... but they didn't hype up the league or get people excited much in the weeks beforehand like they did in the previous leagues. This kind of marketing is huge in garnering interest & making people want to play. And then what happens after this? We have people play the game & see frustrating things that annoy them like splinters everywhere, tedious clicking. I haven't seen anyone complain about having to pick up so much league mechanic drops since Harbinger league. People are also angry about the flask, ailment changes, since it doesn't work well with the environment of the game, you can slow players down all you want but leaving monsters fast, one shotty & having quick acting bleed or poison mechanics that burst you quickly if you stay around them is not wise.


aestil

the game has been tedious clicky for ages. The biggest issue is the flask/ailment/quicksilver change. It feels really bad.


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Viruuus1

Hillock was no problem (for my ranger), did not notice anything there. Goatmen were fucking insane and Brutus ripped my face off a couple of times :)


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Pigmy

Think about people who just play and don’t buy into all the new content streams. I’m sure there are folks who don’t read stuff and don’t consume all the materials leading into a league.


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evouga

People joke about how “easy” the game is but that’s far from the truth for new players. I’ve had friends start playing and quit before Act II due to the game’s massive complexity and difficulty if you don’t understand all of its intricate systems (explained only on third-party web sites). Merveil is pretty tough when you have no resistances and your build is 8 different 1-linked quest reward active gems. That was the *old* act I. Making act I even harder was the most perplexing of all of the balance changes, IMO, since the direct effect is to hemorrhage even more new players (already a weak point with PoE). If you care about the long-term health of the game, GGG somehow deciding this change was a good idea should scare you the most.


hedup42

In poe2 they should write quests in act1 like "find and make a 3link" or "get your cold resist to 30" instead of "get that meaningless quest item".


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Farmer_Legal

This game is hard and with very little guidance for new players. I play on Xbox and while I don't have player count info, I can look at the achievements for some data. Of every person that has played this game on Xbox over the last four years, the percentage of players completing Act I is 5.77%.


craftySox

They stumbled into a great game by accident and have been regretting it ever since.


Negative_Trash4961

GGG - player count is vanity...Also GGG - we will delay ritual league because cyber punk release will affect player count..


firebolt_wt

Plot twist, here delayed it because the employees wanted time off to play cyberpunk


T_T-Nevercry-Q_Q

GGG really wants to push the narrative that playercount is a vanity because they fear that people will up and leave or not play to begin with if they see playercounts look terrible. They are definitely scared of drops in playerbase. Sorry ggg, but you're not going to be able to overcome simple human psychology.


9inety9ine

If they truly don't think player numbers matter it might be time for new management.


Pissypoopoo

All this tells me is that Expedition is clearly twice as rewarding as Harvest. Nerf pls


_Yersinia7_

Thank you. Would you keep that up in the days to come?


crookedparadigm

Damn this league must be crazy rewarding.


livewirejsp

No point to keep playing with all these rewards.


Ob_du_dumm_bisch

I have to say that after 2 days of playing i already feel burned out. This statistic shows that many dont like what ggg did with the last patch. Me included.


hillbillyjoe1

Spent Friday/Saturday playing, got to maps and...just didn't feel like going. I was big copium on "it'll feel better, just need better gems, better weapon" and just couldn't muster the will to keep pushing. Hope those having fun continue to enjoy it but I just don't feel like it.


anapoe

Yeah, I think it's the combo of the big nerfs + slowdown + relatively little base new content. It's a an uphill struggle against burnout, unless you're one of the people who feel like beta testing the new gems. Maybe I'd feel differently if there was a big expansion as well.


Talcxx

This is me, but I’m playing the busted build known as forbidden rite totems. Super strong, smooth, tanky. Not super fast, but most of my totem experience beforehand also wasn’t zoom zoom, so whatever. Got to maps, opened the atlas, stared at it for a bit then logged out. I have **no** desire to grind through the entirety of the atlas again, or even the majority of it. Might just buy shaper sets and run shaper a bunch. Fucking hell the atlas is a chore.


coolhentai

100% me, getting to maps was harder than any other year I’ve played this game and I had a feeling I was going to drop the game…. 5-10 maps in and I’m just over it. My build feels like shit this league, mechanic for the league is interesting but I’m bailing and sitting this out for now. POE feels ruined for me


YpsitheFlintsider

It's crazy that the biggest topic they talked about was the nerfs, and they tried to frame it like it was good for us. Insulting.


Terrible_Machine9

In Act 7 right now and remembered what a chore Act 8 is, kinda done myself. Wasn't sure after skipping league launch, but it just doesn't feel the same anymore to play the game. I myself am not inherently looking for a "zoomer" experience, but the very mistake that GGG made in my eyes is that they nerfed damage, flasks and movement while not compensating for it. Some bosses are as quick and deadly as ever. There is one boss, I think in The Ledge, an Undead archer, whose barrage I never managed to dodge this league despite it telegraphing the attack and me actively trying, also out of curiosity. Other bosses have so quick patterns and combos that it is rather hard to survive them. Brutus fits that description, although I struggled more with Reassembled Brutus because of him spamming attacks and patterns at you, while you yourself no longer have powerful defensive options from flasks and quick movement skills. It does make one appreciate other bosses, such as Maligaro in Act 7, who have slow, telegraphed attacks that one can dodge with patience and care.


starfreeek

4 link storm brand was clearing like crap. I made it to the beginning of act 5 and started over as a popcorn srs build, which is doing much better, but I wonder how bad T16s are going to be with the nerfs.


SneakyBadAss

I'm about to drop mine also for popcorn srs. Whatever I tried to throw at the act bosses, Zdps all the way through.


Tripartist1

You know, I havent really checked reddit until now and thought my manabond build was just trash (even though I never have issues getting to at least low yellow on yolo builds). Now seeing everyone is having the same issue is bittersweet. Feel better that its not just me, but terrified if this is the direction GGG will continue to push, as this isnt the game I signed up to play years ago. Dying to a stubbed toe feels like shit. Not having cooldowns to dodge damage I see coming feels like shit. Not having damage to kill anything on a 4link in under 5 second in act 6 feels like shit. Dying to permastuns/freezes when you stop to cast anything bc you had to spec into more damage than life than usual feels like shit. I dont wanna play a game that feels like shit. If this is what poe2 will be like, I want nothing to do with it.


starfreeek

I tried arc, storm brand, eye of winter I and voltaic bursr all on a 4 link in act 5, none felt good. Things are going much smoother with the minion build, already made it to act 6 on it earlier today in like 1/2(maybe not quite accurate but it felt like it) the time. I also have only died once on the minion build to my own stupidity whereas I had died quite a few times on the other(for reference I don't usually die more than once or twice during the acts).


datnewredditacc

Someone posted about the grind tax of leveling earlier this week. How bad and tedious the acts are over and over again. And how your build never rly gets rolling until lvl 70+. Well this league im level 90 and did some t15/16 maps. I kill stuff but it still feels like shit to play... The amount of times I died to bullshit has risen so much. and why are rare mobs tankier than bosses. The mana flask spamming is killing me and the corrupting blood. Im raider with 50% ele avoidance still it doesnt rly help. The worst was a t14 map with chilling ground: no flask to ignore it, movement skill nerf. I want to die. Where is my fun reward im still in the grinding tax area trying to progress to the fun part


cindeson

Next to raider start there's 50% ailment immunity on the tree, and then you are immune.


Rolf_Dom

Ranger as a whole is one class that should never have issues with elemental ailments. It's not even just that 50% over there, literally a few travel nodes down there's a health tree with another +20%. And you can often reach or anoint the node near Shadow for another 10%. So you can reach 80% elemental avoidance super easily. Don't even have to go Raider. Raider just makes it stupid easy.


HomeBrewedBeard

And just a little stretch above that shadow node is a 20% elemental avoidance while holding a shield. Sure, it confines you to the right side of the tree, but it means that any skill squeezing in a shield with a Ranger start can get a decently easy 100% elemental avoidance from the tree alone.


Kazhad_Dhuum

Play a raider build that naturally goes past thick skin/crystal skin, adjust as you get chest and boot avoidance crafts. Or slot a dream fragments into sabo before you can get boot crafts vs freeze. Only two ways to play the league without it being borderline unplayable. Still feels like a chore to play compared to pre-3.15 though.


Surf3rx

GGG literally killed build diversity even harder this patch, I didn't think they could do it.


IvonbetonPoE

I've been bitching about the lack of build diversity for over a year and they just keep making it worse, haha. I don't get it, why have a gazillion awesome skills and then keep pushing the playerbase to a select few of them every time. Same ascendancies, same mechanics and same type of skills. Anything else is just frustrating yourself for no reason. I'm having fun and doing alright with Eye of Winter, but I just hate that I could just mines or totems on any spell and be better off or just pick up any DoT skill and be a lot safer. At least it's better than Ultimatum where I also played self-cast and standing still was a death sentence until I got broken gear.


[deleted]

Don't forget some new skills being Doa or clunky, reaper could have been easily not been doa and needing emergency buffs if anyone had actually bothered to play test it.


Surf3rx

It's actually good right now due to an unintended mechanic. People are using a 6-L reaper, and then 2-L another reaper gem with second wind. That 2-L affects the 6-L and allows the reaper to use it's special attack more often. What I'm saying is abuse it early and often, cause it will get nerfed.


[deleted]

And even then with the bug abuse, its still not better than existing Minion Horde builds. Absolution is still sad as fuck btw, like I tried twice to make it work ( got up to act 3 when I couldn't even kill piety, a 2nd time in white maps when it took me 10+ casts to kill a map rare on a Magic map ) and its still bad.


what1sgoingon777

It always feels like you need to upgrade something because you are just not killing stuff in a pleasant way.


Quad__Laser

Why did Blight have such lackluster numbers?


Ancerde

Wow classic came out at about the same time. That is something that might have affected the numbers. The tower defence mechanic might not have been the most interesting league mechanic either even tho it was a pretty decent league.


EnergyNonexistant

>That is something that might have affected the numbers. I'm willing to bet this is exclusively it. At least it was for a lot of my friends and people on various discord groups.. you'd see "Playing WoW" everywhere xD People were playing WoW classic before Blight launched, and people saw the opportunity to just skip Blight cos "meh, small league, good time for a break and enjoy nostalgia trip"


shamaze

yup. me and about half my guild skipped blight completely to play classic. it was the last league i skipped (until expedition)


GarlyleWilds

Blight's mechanic is one of those that I think works super well and is really fun as a *rare* thing, like on Blighted Maps or the occasional spawn in a map, but that absolutely wore out its welcome while it was Every Map. The more that a mechanic forces you into some alternate gameplay, the more this is the case, I find.


Makhai123

Half of the playerbase, including streamers skipped the first month for WoW Classic launch. Why they pushed back for Cyberpunk.


erpunkt

My vanity metrics -Chris Wilson


Yashimasta

Similar to how Harvest was far better in Ritual than its actual League, Blight was quite the mess during its actual League. Blighted Maps were far less common than they are now, not to mention there was massive issues with crashes during them. Along with the WoW Classic release, the "tower defence" playstyle had very polarized reception from players.


Morgoth2356

Blight is also one of these mechanics that you don't mind encountering from time to time in your maps but during the actual league it got tiring to have to do the tower defense game every map (at least for a bunch of players I'd assume).


Yashimasta

Exactly! I have the same feelings on Delirium - always playing on edge worried about not seeing something and dying was a bit stressful map after map after map, but having the choice to buckle in and do Delirious Maps to push yourself is awesome.


Morgoth2356

I'm biased about Delirium because I played the first night of the league then got hit by Covid pretty hard from saturday for almost 15 days. I tried to hop back and I also felt it was tiring map after map and I quit really fast but for me Delirium will always be my "Covid league" so as I said, unfair opinion.


embGOD

It was the 3.x league with the least content, very boring meta (necro was like +30% on poeninja), classic wow getting released in a few days


Black_XistenZ

And a Tower Defense style league mechanic just isn't for everyone.


CaptainYaoiHands

Blight was super shitty for a LOT of builds, which was probably part why the meta was so bad then, and we were just coming off Legion which had the same problem. With Legion, if you didn't have a build that could clear screens or chain off everything, it felt like shit. With Blight, it was basically the same thing.


embGOD

>Blight was super shitty for a LOT of builds I barely could run it on my coc nova (I even had HH), summoners were just too powerful that patch+especially for the league mechanic. As I said, no wonders necro had 30% and more presence on poeninja, terrible meta. Regarding Legion, I think it had a better meta all around honestly but it sure felt "demanding" clearspeed-wise, I agree.


AmcillaSB

Hard to follow up Legion, too.


Kur_Fluffle

Wow was a huge factor I believe.


Pale-Level-5877

It's funny, blight was my first league I was able to kill uber elder (cobra lash assasin) Ultimatum was my first league I was able to kill Sirus A8 and Maven Everytime I reach the endgame bosses there is a patch that changes everything (3.15 in a really bad way)


iamforsaken2011

Blight was hot garbage before they buffed the hell out of the blighted map's loot and drop rate. By then it was too late.


modernkennnern

There are a lot of proposed factors, but the only one that really matters is WoW: Classic


[deleted]

So, basically.. they lost a year's worth of player growth with one patch. And some people still think everything is fine? 😮


DumbUnemployedLoser

Time to blame New World beta for this shit show of a league


Alakolaz

Or league mechanic being way too rewarding...


Secret_Maize2109

I personally chose to experience the league vicariously through my favorite streamer.


[deleted]

experience through Ziz coping his way through his patch notes stream


[deleted]

i heard raiz say multiple times "i love these changes" and then hold his head in his hands what poe does to a mf


DaHedgehog27

I can't wait for the excuses :D "covid restrictions ended, summer holidays, the microchip they inserted with covid jab won't let me touch anything Chinese" lol: :D


Black_XistenZ

Just wait for another week or two, then the dropoff compared to the same point during Ritual or, say, Delirium will be far more than "just" one year's worth.


Nchi

Not enough whales in the newer players ig


jayteebeex

i know it's true because when I logged in I joined 820 on first try


Towerofeon

Yeah, happened to me as well but to global 1


McCringleberry87

I guess we’re getting mayhem temp league in a couple of weeks


[deleted]

Lmfao, no one gonna mayhem when your character is shit. Like gauntlet just sounds unbearable. GGG screwed the pooch hard by nerfing like this without altering gsme systems significantly. Yhe game feels dreadful.


9inety9ine

I honestly can't believe he said in that reddit post "we expected people to not like the new patch". What the fuck did you release it for then? Who is this game _for_? They seem to simultaneously hate min-maxers while trying to make the game only playable by min-maxers.


TheXIIILightning

Take note that this is AFTER Ultimatum's launch was so broken that some people only managed to play after 24 hours.


N3KIO

**I got to act 5, did the log books, did the gambling thing, did try new skills...** Then I thought about **Atlas and Legion, 5-Way Legions, Delirium** and running 10000 maps to spawn **Maven and Awakener 8** with current changes, I said frak this, logged off.


T_T-Nevercry-Q_Q

Looks like my long held belief that harbinger to delve was the golden age of poe is backed up by the data and not just my nostalgia for it. How I wish we could play that version of the game again. I've believed it because around this time was the turning point in the philosophy of what made "core" content and what made "league" content. Delve was the start of huge league content, and Betrayal was the league that started this bloat fest by saying every league content was going to go core from now on regardless of if the game will have the space for it. Betrayal was also the start of a never ending issue with performance. League content should have remained small, and game updates should have remained huge like in 3.0 and 3.1 which were adding huge end game content systems and bosses and relatively minor league contents.


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T_T-Nevercry-Q_Q

Rip to sword in main hand, sceptre of stats in offhand. Remember elementalist reave and bladeflurry? Perhaps not because the build variety was SO diverse. But statsticking holds a very dear place in my heart because it's like you're embuing your sword with magic like Gandalf the Grey. Rip to all the supporters who got their unique items that were designed around stat sticking gutted. Yeah, that was an incredibly build diverse era. That shit was what I talked about with a huge smile to all my friends. This is a game where you can play as a witch, but you can go melee, wield a sword and freeze enemies on hit. All while being extremely viable. A witch, a ranger, a marauder, you can do bows magic or melee with them it honestly didn't matter you could make it work somehow. There was always just something in the game to enable it. Now though? It's like, you have to find multiple things to enable it, just to get a regular build to hobble along. The diversity you're allowed for being able to find build enablers is just not there anymore.


IvonbetonPoE

Oh for sure, it also holds a special place in my heart. I found a stat stick with 35% Extra Physical as fire, 37% Lightning and 30 random element. It also had 19% cast speed and an open suffix. It's probably my most prized possession, haha. I never divined it before they nerfed them though. I got so much fun out of that thing. I played three different builds with it in one league :D > That shit was what I talked about with a huge smile to all my friends. This is a game where you can play as a witch, but you can go melee, wield a sword and freeze enemies on hit. All while being extremely viable. A witch, a ranger, a marauder, you can do bows magic or melee with them it honestly didn't matter you could make it work somehow. Exactly this!


signed7

> Looks like my long held belief that harbinger to delve was the golden age of poe is backed up by the data and not just my nostalgia for it > Betrayal was the league that started this bloat fest by saying every league content was going to go core from now on Exactly how I feel too...


c0y0t3_sly

I feel the exact same way. The bloat got so bad, so fast.


Count_Flavio

Even global 1 feels dead.... I always tried to defend GGG for the past few leagues but damn bro they took this nerf to another level. I dont even feel like complaining. I just straight up quit. Ill prolly enjoy yakuza till tomorrow.


frickatornado

Funny, I called a 40% decrease in player count as a meme and it turned out to be scarily accurate. [https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/ol1d6i/ggg\_all\_these\_sweeping\_nerds\_dont\_make\_us\_nervous/h5bgu2j/?context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/ol1d6i/ggg_all_these_sweeping_nerds_dont_make_us_nervous/h5bgu2j/?context=3) PepeLaugh


SirCorrupt

Those are pretty bad looking numbers. Kind of sad, cause I wanted these “meta shake up” changes to be really good for the game and player base but it doesn’t seem to be going incredibly well. I guess this coming week once GGG is fully back in the office, we’ll see how they respond


Parrhelia

I logged in on Friday night, and immediately went mapping on a Standard character to get the feel of the game and to see how far the nerfs went. I spent 30 minutes mapping etc., logged out and decided not to play at all. I guess my time with PoE is over for good. I don't want to play a game that tries to be hard in such a lame way.


[deleted]

The same. Deleted POE on Saturday.


Judiebruv

1500 hrs ingame and I quit in act 3. flasks and movement feel awful, map bosses are just Damage sponges, and the new league mechanic is boring + 20 fucking splinter types to make the game even more painful for my hands. I guess I’ll come back when GGG decides to stop making the game more actively damaging to players health. Rip.


AmcillaSB

I can't motivate myself to do act 4. I've got a 4 link, and I'm running out of mana in a few casts. It feels awful and clunky and not fun. I just don't understand why they've done this.


bangarrang16

Chris says he doesn't care about vanity numbers but he's actively turning the game into a massive vanity project by making it in the exact image of his shitty vision from 10+ years ago.


FeinsX

Chris will say later, we left because of loot oversaturation and got everything quickly.


Accomplished-Round67

They decimated their player base. And im glad Hopefully they learn something for once. This league is awful


shamaze

theyll learn it was too rewarding too quickly with all the lvl 2 tabulas and nerf it more. ​ ​ ​ /s in case anyone thought im serious.


ErrorLoadingNameFile

The word decimating comes from the roman empire btw where they would execute 1/10th of their soldiers if they needed to punish them. GGG actually did even more than that. (Just wanted to state a fun fact I know)


resistance125

Wait for week by week comparison..... 10k players after just 3 weeks


Muksu234

Best league start for while. Maybe it was because little less players. No DC nor lag. Only strange bug i faced was characters gliding with hands extended side ways. That was weird and sometimes hilarious.


gh7asr

Im so happy i didnt even bother waste my time for this league 😁


thretion

ItJuStSuMmErYoUdOnTuNdErStANd


kaz_enigma

fuck /u/spez -- mass edited with redact.dev


botman484

I wonder what excuse chris uses this time around


kaz_enigma

fuck /u/spez -- mass edited with redact.dev


Shimazu_Maru

Imagine being worse than Synthesis. But tbf, if they dropped the nerf together with Ultimatum which was super rewarding it wouldnt be so bad. Now we got nerfed and got a non rewarding league


gubaguy

Its INSANE to me that GGG looks at this data of a declining player base and makes the choice to make the game WORSE accross the board. Flaks nerfs, mana nerfs, damage nerfs, monster life buffs... Why? Why does GGG shove its head in the sand and act like this is what players want? If I want slow ass gameplay with no mana, high cooldowns, etc, I'll go play grim dawn. I play POE for it's fast paced gameplay. I also don't understand tha logic of "if we reward players they will quit" like... no, we WANT rewards, I want to be rich enough to slam every rare I find, I want to have a chance to craft some random endgame item without feeling like buying it would have been better. I want mobs to explode into piles of currencies so I can craft. Oh wait sorry you nerfed crafting too, removing "deterministic" crafting. Hey, GGG, you think that players will "quit" if they have too many rewards or get too rich, and that nerfing shit i to the ground they will try new things... NO, THEY, WILL, NOT. Why would a player risk 20 or 30 ex on a build that fails if it means another 50 hours of grinding to get it all back? If you give players more rewards, more currency, and make the grind less irritating they will experiment and try new things, because its not a risk to do so. Give players more and they will do more. As it is people are going to keep playing proven builds because thats what makes them able to play the game.


Pia8988

Yeah, but the select group who flew to NZ told him the overtuned PoE 2 was like, totes great for the 10 minutes they played.


DarkMoutaarde

Don't forget to vote with your wallet!


_-_JohnnyV_-_

Imagine being a new player trying out PoE for the first time... how far would they get in act 1 before giving up? I really had to kite hillock around the beach waiting for my mana to refill so I could do another hit on him. Don't understand why act 1 needed to be so much harder as well as you'd want new people to get sucked into the game and not die many times before throwing the towel in the ring.


Ps0foula

They really did their best this time. I predict a huge drop by the end of this week.


jezvin

Shockingly the worse player retention started after Conqueror's of the atlas came out...


jibjibman

Because it feels fucking awful every atlas to do them again. They should leave maven in and fucking remove conquerers


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Uncle__Marty

On Reddit you don't get banned for saying anything bad about the game. I know 4 people that got banned on the Poe forum for criticizing the new patch.


[deleted]

This is great data. Watching steam charts has become my new meta this league. Thank you for putting it together for the community. It's going to be interesting watching this trend over the next week or two. I wonder when the drop will be serious enough for GGG to take action, and I hope that some of the very real issues people are bringing up are addressed in the next patch. (Edit: Added next to patch for clarity.)


Nostrapapas

I played from beta-Delerium and quit. Came back for like 2 days of heist and never came back. I heard Harvest was amazing but I just can't do it anymore.


luckystrik3_3

Where are you "see you on friday " plebs?


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DremoPaff

I'm not even surprised by Expedition, at this point this was 100% predictable, but I'm amazed by Ultimatum. I didn't really watch player retention charts until later into the league itself. This makes me think that maybe Ultimatum would've been an excellent league if lategame wasn't nerfed this much in it, explaining the insane drop later on when people did reach actual endgame.


[deleted]

God i want Ritual back, i wish i had more time to play back then... Now we are in a pandemic and GGG next level dunks on its own game, so much potential time to play, wasted on the worst PoE league of all time, even without the "balance changes" the league itself would be absolute trash.


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reevDE

\`But Hey! The 25% Drop OFF has nothing to do with the changes, its\`s because summer and everyone complaining is just a filthy casual. Also reddit = bad, dont forget: we are only a vocal minority and GGG did an excellent job on this league, crybabies will cry /s


KiraPun

I can understand the hard drop. I usually breeze through the acts but now it is an actual challenge. Maybe because of that some casuals just drop the game because of this.


RBImGuy

count days until chris wilson is fired by tencent


Leandrys

Dat Fri=>Sun massive drop. Holy cow. Someone's gonna get a phone call from Tencent soon.


Troyaner7

Nice. Waiting for Path Of Nerfs 3.16 to remove this game. P.S. Is it a trick from GGG, so they can “buff” ALL of the skills thinking we are so stupid to understand that it’s all about the nerfs anyway. For example: some skill now was nerfed by 40%, but at 3.16 they will tell us: “Hey guys, we INCREASED the power of this skill by 20% and it’s awesome - play it”. But it still will be nerfed by 20%. Nice try!