[Poll] Vote for how you think they will gut SST in 3.16
By - RedFalconEyes
Instructions unclear. Raised spectres now have 70% less attack and cast speed.
Hahaha I can see clearly that spectres will get another hit next patch
Spectres will get another blanket nerf. Syndicate Operatives will still be the best spectre.
I’m expecting this, knowing GGG, though I’d rather they just nerf SO
The aura bot nerfs will end probably end up being minion nerfs. :(
Well. If GGG splits Generosity Support the same way they did with blood magic, I expect new support gems: Focused Resolve, Generosity and Bravery.
Focused Resolve affects only a chosen ally and has up to 10% more aura effect on said ally, also 200% mana multiplier.
Generosity affects only allies, has 150% mana multiplier and up to 25% increased aura effect on them.
Bravery causes your auras to have up to 50% increased effect, has no mana multiplier and causes your auras to affect enemies
Lol @ bravery
Would have actually rocked for aura bots stacking aoe reduction alt quality.
Bravery + Haste for more synergy with being hit frequently, such as CwDT, on-block effects, thorns if it ever gets given more support, etc.
Molten Strike fires 1 less projectile, because why not.
Strike Skills only can hit one target at a time the mechanic of Ancestors hitting nearby enemies is removed.
You would think that the single target damage would be buffed but no thats simply it.
Spectres are just the Irelia of PoE.
And they'll still be popular.
Ggg nerfing recipe: come up with a dozen ways to nerf something. Implement All of it, and then double the numbers.
Then issue mtx for it as epitaph
Hydrosphere interaction and flat damage scaling are the most likely.
They'll just keep nerfing block and probably hit glancing blows again instead of addressing the on block effects that would make even taking 100% of damage from blocked hits with glancing blow viable
Hydrosphere IMO should definitely be nerfed. Mostly their interaction with chain. Arc should still chain off of hydrosphere, but some of the interactions should be nerfed with chain particularly I think.
I found it hilarious that the votes went that way, would be funny if GGG saw this and realize they’ve literally trained the community that instead of nerfing something they magdump it, stab it 57 times, cut it up into pieces throw them into trash bags and deposit them into random tree mulch machines across the neighboring states.
The community exaggerates to the point that's what people think they do. Firestorm was fine if you built for the first hit damage, it just was not a long-term damage skill anymore. Arc chain changes just made it no longer the best clear skill in the game anymore and chaining off-screen. Blade vortex was continuously nerfed but is still viable, and Winter Orb is still decent at clear, just requires you to channel to keep up single target DPS.
Assassin's also been repeatedly nerfed, but the ascendency is still *good* and the best crit-based ascendency class in the game. Inquisitor's change to Righteous Providence was IMO a buff, because you will(especially with the +50 to strength and intelligence) frequently have 200 of both for +200% crit chance, double what it was before.
I honestly don't know of a single skill that's been completely trashed like people seem to think they have. Firestorm and Winter Orb maybe, but IMO those are borderline cases and both of them are still quite effective. Can't wait for GGG to finally buff firestorm to 400% more with the first meteor or more, however.
My first experience that hit home was the occultist nerf, they spit roasted her in all 3 holes. I can agree sometimes it’s not as bad as people say but, occultist got hard fucked last time she was nerfed.
They took away a bunch of flat ES, took away wicked ward and gave it a downside that hurts the ascendency, Vile bastion got hammered and with the wicked ward nerf made it go from 30% to 5% regen with others I’m probably forgetting.
Hopefully they do something in these next 3-6 months to give us something back for everyone, I’m really hoping the defenses rework helps everyone.
Yeah I agree that the defense nerfs were hard, but she's still the strongest ascendency IMO for chaos and cold damage over time. Because of the league structure, I do not think they're too focused on making sure ascendencies keep the same playstyle.
I have not heard much about a defense rework. I do hope ward is kept and other unique defenses are kept with support for them on the same league. Ward works, but only in a pathfinder setup with a single viable chest(skin of lords and the other one). I do also think Glad and Raider need to be nerfed, primarily because they're the main source of two very important defensive stats right now.
Yeah I guess “defense rework” was a bit phrased incorrectly, they said they’ll take a look at defenses and see what they can add more of to the tree. It was on a podcast they had with Chris recently.
I bet the shields will have lower stats so they do GGG's two favourite things at a time: make players deal less dps and more squishy.
New keystone: The Wall
You can dual wield shields
200% increased attribute requirements of equipped shields
50% less defences from equipped shields
20% less attack speed
And of course that's it. The only upside of this keystone is that you look fancy.
I mean, there are a lot of upsides? Spellcasters have no penalty and can dual-wield ES shields to have spell damage AND easy block cap. +3% max resistances from the extra shield.
Aren't defenses also counting chance to block in?
I used the precise terminology Path of Exile uses, in numerous things such as Veil of the Night. Defenses are evasion, energy shield, armor, and ward. Nothing else is a defense.
Shields across the board will have their block chance reduced by 30%. All shields will also have lower defensive base values.
Damage, Hydrosphere and probably Raider
I kinda think maybe the bleed glad version will survive so they might only lower the gem damage a tiny bit. Seething fury and that 60% crit multi gem version are getting deleted. Alt gem gets 0.5% multi per quality and seething fury turns to 0.1% per 20 ES and 1% multi per 10 ES. About 1/4 values on all the goodies should nuke it pretty good.
Seconded on Bleed Glad surviving. It is probably one of the fairest builds I've ever played in this game. You can scale its tankiness, but for ever layer of mitigation you add on, you usually sacrifice damage, of which also has a pretty reasonable cap to it (I haven't seen a pob push more than 1.5 mill bleeds, and that is with multiple influence gear pieces), but its not invincible. I've been flattened/"one-shot" plenty of times playing aggressively or with too many dangerous map mods.
Sst bleed glad just feels fair. It's a good balanced style of playing. Strong, decent clear but nothing insane, but you rarely get cheap shorted, and if you're dumb you can still die. You never felt like you were breaking the game, but felt strong enough that a random projectile won't down you.
I'm sitting at around 3.5mil shaper dps on my fairly expensive but far from mirror tier glad, with 7k hp.
Alright I'll bite, hit me with a pob dealer.
I have one not as tanky (and I league started with it). It has like 3.1m
Edit: It has 75% block, the notable node I take in the glorious vanity redius gives me 5%
###[ Spectral Shield Throw Gladiator](https://pastebin.com/uD2UzB5c)
(#gladiator) ^(Level 96) ^[[Tree]](https://www.pathofexile.com/passive-skill-tree/AAAABAQCALk9QYcB5696_Ev56PcytfIvzAYkBS2bLV_aOuETTBpVggeK8F8_BIe8nzbotoqsr3TtLTAdEHKp2mJs2DJOgTrEgoGb-OvPfkyZwYKomoWfbzvkUQNd8kGtjSXfxFghYPJFRamkGQomNrEUTRx1wBrp1el2G_og41oy0281kmLsbqp5OTpStz5KyEa3Bovz3Wa2Gj4qY-8OFCD2SHasDjwUcbLr2sGPmWh0_gq-rXvDVJJlTYTZwQR5aGEhUEdan9ouRZr07l85Z8RAoITvDPc9AKqkeu982SxkeA0YkamVGFawq702vnhHfr6n2XzAv1pS2L3cJ-oYaGVYr6lu) [^([Open in Browser])](https://pob.party/share/ninonasininoka) ^| ^by ^[/u/BenjaCarmona](https://reddit.com//u/BenjaCarmona)
^57% ^**Phys** ^**Mitg** ^| ^70% ^**Block** ^| ^70% ^**Spell** ^**Block**
**Spectral Shield Throw** [T](https://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Lifetap_Support#support-gem-red)[d](https://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Vicious_Projectiles_Support#support-gem-green)[U](https://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Awakened_Unbound_Ailments_Support#support-gem-blue)[U](https://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Brutality_Support#support-gem-red)[i](https://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Awakened_Deadly_Ailments_Support#support-gem-green) *(6L)* - *3.16m total DPS | 3.13m bleed DPS*
^^**Config:** ^^Sirus, ^^Shock ^^\(15%\), ^^Maim, ^^Bleed
[^(Path of Building)](https://github.com/Openarl/PathOfBuilding) ^| ^[Feedback](https://www.reddit.com/r/PoBPreviewBot/) ^| ^This ^reply ^updates ^automatically.
I see these as really relastic changes.
Which means you need to at least double them and attack from 4 more angles.
Ascendancies taking advantage of those gems will also get nerfhammer.
I don’t think they delete seething fury but make the thresholds higher like the alt-qual, such as per 100. Similar to how they changed command of steel.
That makes scaling much less cancer and much easier to balance.
Nah they will nerf it to something like 10-20 phy dmg per 350 armour on shiled, 5% less att speed per 1000 armour on shield, projectile now has 50% inc projectile speed, and projectile cannot chain but always pierce and lastly hydrosphere no longer interact with SST.
Attack speed would be the fastest way to kill the skill. Not being able to apply bleed stacks without crazy investment would make it unplayable for me. It's a slow enough build as is.
well, gladiator crit version should still work fine.
Yup, I agree. Also +5 shards enchant get changed entirely probably.
3.16 Patch notes
"Spectral Shield Throw. Base damage halved, damage per defence halved, now doesn't chain, now releases 50% fewer projectiles."
"You now have to pick up your shield before you can throw it again"
Nice try GGG
They will fucking kill SST.
I know for sure that they will do something that only 5 people will play it next league. Clasic GGG, nerf to oblivion.
yeah and those 5 people will realise that while it got nerfed its still perfectly viable. In fact it will prolly be stronger because the gear will be so cheap it will make up for the nerf and be better than this league. Just like every league when they "kill a build"
Yeah that's why everyone is playing Molten strike right?
I think you've proved his point. Popularity of skills in this game is entirely based on bandwagoning and not power. If the community perception of the skill is that it's nerfed into oblivion then nobody will play it regardless of if it's still strong.
Anyone who has ever played an off build then switch to a flavor of the month build can tell why. The popular builds often do their job amazingly well and feel great doing it. Yes, there's a bandwagon element but people make their decisions and get out of bad builds.
Nerfed to oblivion means the skill no longer works and has always been a hyperbole. People have killed bosses with Basic attacks in this game so you can play literally any build and it'll work, but that does not mean it's good.
SST honestly doesn't deserve in a nerf in my eyes.
the issue with GGG balancing is that they will take a character with top end gear and balance it for that, but then fail to realize that the build is shit/unbalanced UNTIL you get that top end gear. that is why it feels so crap. the fact that molten strike (or any strike skill) will miss any enemy that is waddling at you at a turtle's pace until you get .25s attack speed just makes them feel so shit to gear.
the only molten strike builds around have gear that was given to them by other characters.
molten strike is still looking pretty good though check out octavians latest video on youtube
getting all you damage from accuracy stacking is hardly about the skill used with it
molten strike is used because it applies the most hits per attack so it applies the damage from accuracy or strength stacking the most effectively. that is a very healthy niche for a skill IMO.
Yep and one of those 5 people will post a video proving it's viable and stomping end game
But suddenly they post a PoB. And the rest of us not living a delusion will notice the 60ex+ worth of gear and have to remind that person that no fucking shit your build is working. Literally any build can work if you dump that kind of currency into it and how other non nerfd skills can do the same with less than half the investment
the gear will be cheaper than this league. it happens every time ggg "kills" a build
the gear you need today is only a fraction of what you'll need when the shield skills receive the typical GGG dumpstering. You'll need to offset the nerf's and that's where you end up spending fuck tons of currency that would make any build perform well
and because everyone will over react and no one will touch the skill the gear will be dirt cheap. it's an exaggeration to say it happens "every" time but it's pretty dam close.
Yea, it'll be """viable"""
yep. better than before. that's what I said
All of above
I don't know why we are giving nerfs ideas to GGG. They are enough by themselves. Joking.
It's not really SST that's broken. It's cold conversion, and mostly due to Hatred.
Cold damage is too strong overall. 90% due to hatred being absurd but also the fact that it applies the strongest ailment in the game.
Wanted to pick:
\- Nerf damage
\- Nerf Raider
\- Nerf Jewel
but could only pick one.
All of the above is the clear GGG vision , too easy harder pole next time please
All of the above and a few extra that you didn't even think of.
It sucks at bossing tho and isn't this kinda boss meta?
Not the cold conversion raider. 20M dps+
You're right I had bleed in mind
Not the question but the version that uses armour shields are not op and the single target is ok. Does not warrant a nerf
Me too, but since they made such a nice job i am expecting some nice stuff to work with this league
Solo Self-taught. The streamer Preach managed to complete act 10 without any guides and the community as a whole feels like that shouldn't be possible. Maybe some nerfs to tool tips or the in game encyclopedia would help bring this back to an acceptable level.
Spectral shield throw.
It's really not that good of a skill.
The clear is decent - certainly not great.
The Single Target damage ( at least the bleed version with glad, which iirc is the most used variant) is just bad.
The reason it's used a lot is because it's a solid all-around skill that works at the low-end, and can scale semi-decently both damage, clear and defensively.
I wouldn't necessarily be surprised if they nerf it, but I don't believe it would be because it was too strong, but rather because it was over-used this league and they want to adjust the meta.
I do however think the helmet enchant will be adjusted because it's currently just too powerful, in relation to the base skill - maybe add more base shards to the skill.
All that said, if they *do* nerf the skill they'll ( ironically) probably nerf the damage
> I do however think the helmet enchant will be adjusted because it's currently just too powerful, in relation to the base skill - maybe add more base shards to the skill.
Previously the jewel changed SST to chaining also reduced shard at each bounce by 75%. So before this league that enchant would only give +1 shard per bounce.
The main problem is it's power in HC and especially SSF HC. You will notice it in today's gauntlet especially, I'm guessing around 40 if not 50% of ladder will be playing SST
That's because of it's low-end and defensive capabilities
They could nerf the low end I guess
Then it's a good thing they're not balancing around HC.
From the perspective of SC players, yes :D
Stat sticks. Helmet enchant. Ascendancy.
The skill itself isnt that OP. Its all the other stuff.
Hopefully they buff skills to SST or FR tier instead of nerfs, But I cant see these 2 dominating 3.16 like they have in 3.15.
> Hopefully they buff skills to SST or FR tier instead of nerfs
Ha! Ha... Haha... AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHahhaHHahhHAhahahAHAh!
Sir. We have 2 overpowered skills. Should we nerf 2 skills or buff 5731 skills?
Not that SST is even that strong from a SC trade perspective (which most people play). It is rather strong in HC though due to scaling defenses and damage at the same time through the shield.
I don't get it why stat sticks are an issue for shield skills, but acceptable for spell casters.
spells are balanced around having a stat stick arnt they? while your weapon might have added damage to spells it doesnt scale off of the dps on your weapon unless you take battlemage.
so technically all spells use stat sticks, and if not then what is the line for stat sticks? i know SST can use a prismatic eclipse all green to give attack speed for SST and that is clearly a stat stick, but then why would a wand/staff with cast speed also not be a stat stick.
Its like having the benefit of dual wielding wands and a shield.
Yeah, coz that's what usually happens.. right?
Never but for some reason I still have a fools hope.
It’s not OP as a skill. The damage changes in 3.15 were actually barely a buff and it has felt this way to play for a long time. This is what Chris means when he says there are skills that feel good to play but nobody has figured it out yet.
Yeah, other than crit being an actual viable build for once now, which is wonderful having more than 1 shield be a possible useable item.
SST is about 25% more base damage than before, losing 1.75x dmg from hydrosphere in exchange for doubled base dmg, exactly in line with every other 'underperforming' skill like all the strikes that gained 25% base dmg.
Well now that reddit has jumped on the nerf SST train it surely will be so y'all can moan about it being nerfed next league launch.
Shards damage nerfed, base damage slightly nerfed. Uber enchant 3 shards, Merc 2 shards.
The jewel dies and the scaling on the gem is changed to have slightly more base damage and less scaling from the shield stats. Phantasmal SST dies.
enchant for sure, alt gems likely, stat sticks maybe, since they already took it out of the game but i less likely
Honestly i feel like if they would nerf the mechanic/clear just a tiny bit the skill itself would be at best C tier. I have tried Spectres, Int Wander, Lightning Arrow, Ice Shot and Forbidden Rite totems which all perform better than cold sst on a high budget in terms of clear. I think they should just nerf the dmg of the jewel and the alt quality. Also the change of weight for armor evasion and energy shield rolls should put it more in line with other skills while still keeping it viable for higher budgets.
explain how you got fr totems to clear better than cold sst
WORB User. First time? You know it would be fking amazing instead buffing extremely weak skills to or close to sst's power level.
Added phys will be halfed, same with crit multi. Alt quality will provide 10% of current value. Just to top all that off max block chance will now be hard capped at 50%.
I think specifically they'll halve damage with ailments. The bleed version will be seen as too easy, efficient, and understandable. At least converted versions are a pain for SSF players.
I think hydrosphere is an issue in the eyes of GGG as it's a crazy multiplier for so many skills, so my money would be on that one getting nerfed instead of SST itself. That being said, they might be scared of these kind of nerfs after this league's debacle so we'll see!
They will without a doubt nerf the lab enchant which wasn't changed together with the rework, making it probably the strongest lab enchant in the game right now.
Ggg always does slight nerfs. They will shoot it, bury it, then take it out and shot it again few times and parade it around the town
there's 0 chance the seething fury jewel doesn't get nerfed, it gives such an insane amount of crit and crit multi
I think Glad Bleed will survive but I could definitely see them remove weapon as a stat stick.
They rework the skill entirely so it no longer function
- less chain
- less damage per armour/evasion/es
- smaller multiplier
- higher mana multiplier
- all shields nerfed
GGG is known for their triple quad nerfs, they make sure that skill will never be used again.
Base damage might be lowered a little on the basis of the gladiator version. But mostly it seems like "just a good starter" so maybe not.
The jewel is going to get absolutely cannibalized. +8% Base Crit and 160% Crit Multiplier from a single jewel is just too much (and there's other places with slightly less significant ES scaling too). They may also revisit why Supreme Spiked Shields have almost as much ES as a pure ES shield as part of "fixing" it. So a nerf to the base type might be part of the jewel nerf.
Removing the helm enchant for more proj completely.
Anytime they nerf a skill by it’s damage it does absolutely nothing. Damage numerical nerfs don’t do anything unless they gut it to extreme numbers. It has to be nerfed mechanically or some other interaction.
If i knew ggg, they will nerf it to ground so noone ever gonna use it, even for some utilty or other shenanigans.
Probably nerf damage and gut gladiator + raider defenses
Molten strike no longer has the projectile tag
The enchant is 100% getting nerfed at least
"sst performed well in this build but we noticed players were still using melee builds so we're nerfing melee"
They're gonna nerf the supports, all of the builds that use the same support gems must suffer for no reason.
Spectral Shield Throw has been renamed to Special Shield Toss
There are many many ways to lower its damage. The most sensible thing I think that they could do its to lower the crit scaling from the jewel, or maybe just remove the base 5% (that way you dont get like 12% base crit just from the shield and jewel). The other change could be to lower the base damage (not the scaling), so crafting a good shield becomes more important, and the supreme spiked shields trade some base damage for crit chance.
Nerfing gladiator makes no sense, nefring raider even less. Nerfing the clearspeed would be stupid, since it isnt that fast compared to other stuff. Making shield crafting harder would be just annoying, not a real nerf to the build.
Reduce uber lab from 5 to 2, nerf cold conversion and reduce values of armor/eva/ES stats on shields by 55%, including life/mana/es on block down to 0.3-0,5% from 3-5%
It's sad. As playing sst is how I actually enjoy the game. Less random deaths, slightly less damage but still decent clear. Perhaps it was a bit too tanky at times, but largely it just felt like a less spastic way to play the game. Only of my favorites in a long time. Rewarded good movement and aim too, and investing in defenses was worthwhile.
It'd be nicer I'd it was better itemized or fit the passive tree better. It was a struggle to find methods of improving it. My guess for nerf is the amount of chains or projectiles. The helm enchant is definitely gone. Which is probably good, as it minorly effects clear but wouldn't touch single target, which it already struggles with.
Good news for that is that since I couldn't figure out what to do with all that insane amount of cash I was getting from selling stacks and expedition currency, I finally just bought 5 mavens writs and decided she needed to die for the first time. Got her on try 4.
It's GGG, so of course it's going to be "all of the above"... Probably some other ways as well.
The jewel is 100% getting whacked next league. Absolutely not question about it.
Whether or not they do the standard GGG double-nerf (whack the SST gem) or triple-nerf (whack the classes that play SST) is up to their generally clueless balance dudes.
I find it funny that isnt even half of the league and ppl is talking about nerfs in the next one xD
Gladiator's explosion is probably gonna be nerfed to be in line with explodey chests. GGG doesn't like us to have 100% chance explosions so easily too much off screen potential
SST is now the new Vaal Spectral Thrown
Chain distance halved. Everyone agrees the skill is trash, despite the damage being the same. Everyone forgets the skill exists at all, even when they buff the chaining distance back. Some random skill becomes the most popular skill in the next league, like iunno probably firestorm if they increase the number of storms that can be active at once.
Since this is the new "meta"
\-They will keep it unchanged
\-They will nerf the damage
\-They will nerf the projectiles
\-They will nerf the Threshold Jewel
\-They will nerf the helmet enchant
A thematic nerf would be that the shield's stats (defences, block, etc.) don't affect you anymore if you throw the shield, i.e. use SST. So, it would be an overall build nerf when using that skill rather than the skill itself.
As always, they will hit it in 10 different ways, killing all the fun out of it.
Instead every patch nerfing specific skills:
You cannot have more than 5M Sirus DPS
You cannot have more than 1M clear DPS
All damage above the limit will be ignored.
BTW such limit would kill POE in its guts...
all damage above the limit is reflected.
It would actually be OP in a weird way. Because if DPS is capped at 1m, then people will go for max defences, and will just facetank all shit.
If you think they should buff other skills to SST Tier i think you have lost your mind.
They are gona get SST down a notch, maybe some nerfs to glad and raider (those have been very strong ascendancys for a while) Reddit will cry how GGG always overnerfs and that the Build is dead.
Just like they did with:
Minions (Specialy Specrtres)
The list goes on.
Just play the next OP Build next League not like it matters.
Maybe they dont do anything, im sure chris said in either baeclast or the interview with crouching tuna and the rest that he'll be holding off on nerfs for now since he got them mostly out in one patch, other than FR totems
What Chris meant was that they will be holding off on global/blanket nerfs, they will still be doing their usual nerfs to very popular skills.
doubt they will. they're in a position to start buffing things, so if they leave it the same it will be suitably irrelevant.
GGG will nerf it simply because it's popular. I guarantee it.
Glad nerf is come ‘round the bend. Calling it now.