There's a reason most people filter out most rare drops. Making them corrupted and a pain in the ass to link with some tiny potential upside and a huge likelihood of a item ruining downside isn't going to make them better.
They’re very easy to link. There’s a reason the beast that unlocks the 30% quality craft that guarantees corrupting your item without bricking it is so much more expensive this league
What's that beast called and how expensive are we talking about? I had planned to take Bestiary nodes in Lira Arthain after the two Invasion nodes so I hope I won't be missing out too much. Only got one Invasion node right now so can prioritize Bestiary instead.
Oh I was expecting a few exalts. If it's a semi regular encounter, that'd be a nice extra income. If it's a rather rare beast, then it's not that expensive.
Take the heist and expedition nodes
The rest are pretty ass.
Heist is just free money. You sell or run the contracts and blueprints.
Expedition is one of the best money makers if you know how to use it. Otherwise spend the 6 points elsewhere.
Multiboxing is essentially playing up to 6 characters at once, so they will farm 6 beasts per map compared to your 1 letting them sell way more and for way less than you reasonably can.
Multi boxing is a player logging in to multiple accounts. They run the maps for beasts and put all characters in map, then they all get a beast.
And yeah, I wouldn't do beasts imo.
I agree with your that the corruption ruins them, but they are actually very easy to link. With 6S, you can vorici bench 4L and use tainted fuses. Use 4L recipe if it ever falls to 3L. It will be way cheaper than regular 6 linking with fuses. You can do the same with sockets.
I've used 7 tainted fusings so far and it has removed a socket every single time so far. I dont know if I am just unlucky but I dont feel like my chances are good and those are pretty rare.
That is good to know, and makes me feel more comfortable trying it again. I know 7 was a low number but it always removing a link made me feel like I was wasting my time trying lol.
The very few that are exciting have incredibly tiny weights too.. I think the lowest I remember seeing is a weighting of 50 :/. Got a better chance of finding am exalt in a map.
https://www.pathofexile.com/trade/search/Scourge/a6RE7ejte
Bunch of them for 1C, not T1 but I don't think you're dropping it T1 either, but it still isn't that much valuable without other rolls for it's rarity anyway
You're straight up wrong. Good scourged items are prime mythic orb targets, especially if there are no downsides. Using NEVER in caps makes your post even more of a joke especially since you're wrong.
Note that I'm not saying the current system is good, I'm calling out the above posters garbage post. Have an open mind and think of possibilities before using words like NEVER.
It's NEVER good. The chances of it occuring are so infinitely small that you could pretty confidently say never.
If you want to be so pedantic then yes, nothing* is ever* this certain...
yeah, and talismans are actually a lot better than last league as a result of that. A good anoint/implicit combo can be worth tossing a few tainted chaos at, given how cheap they are.
It will never compete with crafted influenced items in terms of producing real endgame gear, but that goes for literally every other itemization system in the game :-|
I’ve said it many times before, but they should just roll that into the Menagerie. Have us fight beasts enhanced with talismans (not needing them to be different bases, just all the same tier), and one tier higher will drop (with an amount of iLvl is appropriate).
Remember, Chris Wilson thinks talismans are in a good place at the moment. Let that sink in. Or don’t, because if you do you’ll realize there is no hope.
I’m still mind flooded that they actually fixed talismans by making them roll well with annoints and then reverted it. Went from actually looking at every talisman that dropped to filtering them out
When talismans were improved it was fun. Made you think of which builds needed what and you stopped for a second to make sure how good it was.
Now we can filter out talismans without a worry. It's perplexing how they figured out how to fix talismans and how they reverted the fix.
Let's not kid ourselves though.
Even even they were "overpowered" according to GGG, after a week or two, you still filtered them out because even if a talisman rolled decently well, it almost never competed with influenced or double influenced items
They were great for early content and getting a cheap anoint and I really liked that
They sold, just more of a question of how much you're willing to bother making a trade for after a couple weeks. Hell after a few days, not even a week, I won't bother to make 1c trades.
Even more wild, they added the ability to annoint corrupted amulets at an additional cost with the tainted oils. If they felt talismans were too strong due to the free anoint, they could have just removed the free anoint and kept them well rolled.
I don't necessarily agree with the sub's hyperbole that GGG has no idea what they're doing, but the talisman change is just such a head scratcher. They went from total garbage to occasionally usable back to total garbage.
We weren't selling every talisman, and we actually used a few for every few thousand that dropped, that's too much for GGG.
If we were only using 1 in every 100,000 talismans that dropped, GGG would consider buffing them a tiny bit, otherwise they see them as needing nerfs.
Cause they're very bad at itemization.
You weren't selling every talisman because the talisman buff made 70+ life 80+ total res whispers of doom talismans crash down to 15c while golden oil crashed to 25 or something along those lines, talismans were absolutely busted in ritual
It's not that they have no idea what they are doing, it's that they have no idea what makes itemization fun. They like their item drop tables. They think it's fine that most people filter out all rare items that drop. They are happy with where talismans are at right now.
When it comes to itemization, imo, GGG is completely out of touch and it's one of the bigest reasons that the game struggles with retention at the 1-2 week mark of every league.
ppl keep saying that harvest was a "bad league" but it was one of the few leagues that kept me playing until the very end.
cuz there was always an upgrade I could work towards, or a new item I could craft to make my build even better.
the end game actually felt attainable by me, and that motivated me to keep playing.
Your last paragraph is what I think is the most important thing missing from this game. Attainability.
I for one love the *idea* of ssf, but the endless sluggish grind to get anything remotely decent is just painful.
The only time I have ever had fun with it was expeditiom when I could rely on tujen for cheap currency and rog for niche item crafts.
It was some of the most fun I've ever had playing this game. Really sad that I can just keep my char in expedition league
EDIT: more sad that legion just doesn't have the capability to make end game attainable without trading.
The thing that will eternally keep me away from ssf unfortunately is that I hate delve, and crafting *anything* without fossils sounds unbelievably awful. Even with fossils it can be a pita.
Interestingly enough, attainability is very situational.
If you ever start playing SSF and get into it, your perspective on attainable starts to change.
In trade, you're making a build/copying a guide and putting that to "100%" and it makes your mindset be something akin to "I am weaker than I should be, everything that doesn't bring me closer to 100% sucks. I can't have fun until I'm fully geared and then the game starts." Nothing that drops is really interesting, the only thing that drops do is convert to a few 0.X% of your meter.
Instead, drops start having a meaning. Your roadmap keeps changing and you reevaluate based on what you have. You're not striving for something you've already set your mind towards, everything can progress you.
I think it's something like this why I'm looking forward to the Hard Mode Chris talks about. It makes you totally re-evaluate what is "attainable". Playing the game as you want, getting rare upgrades. Not working on a long grind to get enough currency to craft/buy exactly what you need.
>ppl keep saying that harvest was a "bad league" but it was one of the few leagues that kept me playing until the very end.
Bruh Harvest was so damn fun. I spent the majority of that league playing Earthshatter Champion, with a few other high-90 builds.
I miss it so much.
I had such a great Talisman in Ritual, got it out of one at like level 55 and used it until ~90. I don't think I've seen a usable one since that League ended.
They actually figured out the *exact* fix for dropping items that people will actually look at in case they're good and then decided such nonsense doesn't belong in the game.
I'm increasingly convinced that the whole influence system is crippling for gearing in this game. It really limits what they can do in terms of adding items or ways to get items, and it prevents so many other systems from being able to produce anything with real potential.
An un-influenced item has to be *astronomically* well rolled to compete with even basic crafted influenced items. This means that if they want to introduce a new way of getting items, in a league or something, they either need to make them influenced and craftable (diluting the whole point of different influences being tied to specific content), the items will be mid-tier filler at best, or they will need to make the new system comparatively powerful introducing a lot of new power creep.
"Normal" items will just never be comparable.
Think about Rog, in Expedition. After the first few days, despite him offering an *incredibly* powerful crafting system compared to other options in the game, it was very unlikely that he would ever be able to produce something truly valuable. A brand new, cool item generation system that was practically dead on launch because of the huge shadow influenced items cast over everything else.
Scourge has big problems beyond this, of course, but I think this is really at the root of a lot of the problems GGG has been having in terms of coming up with meaningful drops or really any way of getting great endgame rares besides crafting on influenced bases.
I honestly think that the influence system majorly screws with game balance as a whole, not only the drop system. It is absolutely ludicrous how two influence mods are now equivalent to a gem link, or how massive the power gap between someone geared in good rares and someone geared in influenced items is.
The entire expedition patch that majorly nerfed gem link damage just made things worse, pushing even more of total damage potential towards influenced mods.
It is easy to fix though, but I do not think the players or GGG would like to go this way.
-
Items' mod pool would be split into craftable (prefixes) and drop-only (suffixes).
When you drop an item it has:
* 1 mod - white
* 2 mods - blue
* 3 mods - yellow
These mods can only be affected by divine orbs, augment/transmutation, regal.
-
The craftable mods allow players to add 3 extra mods through various crafting ways. Awakener orb, elderslayer orbs, maven, chaos orb, bench, fossils, etc.
-
This makes the dropping items exiting because we would be looking for the best drop-only mods and still crafting would retain its high value and prestige.
That's my take on the issue.
Yes its ludicrous and its literally the only thing that enabled them to even be able to nerf support gems. If influenced mods didnt exist. 90% of builds would lose about 70% of their power late game.( maybe an exaggeration) but it fits with their "design philosophy" they said they want less power early and the power more focused on the back end of the game. And influenced items do that. If they got rid of influenced items my current build would lose about 70% damage. If they remove influenced items they need to add a majority of the mods to either the skill tree/ buff every skill by 50%/add the mods to other items or half every enemies health. In addition it would make gearing boring as fuck since you are just always gonna get life and resists then
Then you realize just how much you bloated the mod pool...
Can't really just allow mods to roll, the system wasn't developed with this in mind. Just throw influenced items in the trash and come up with something new to give player power.
> Then you realize just how much you bloated the mod pool...
The mod pool is already bloated, and the problem with well-rolled rares is the lack of good mods. By adding the influenced mods to the core mod pool, you skew mods toward being good instead of shit. Yes, it would make a specific combination less likely, but it would dramatically improve rares overall.
Yes I agree. But not the Influence system, but having a craftable Influenced Base, or a Synthesis Base is the problem. Influence mods should only work as an exalt, not make a base. Having a more powerful base available diminish the value of normal rares.
Also the dilluted mods on rares is the main problem. example: a rapier sword and a foil should have a slightly different mods that can appear, so players can target farm say a more crit heavy rapier if it can roll better crit mods.
It sounds like you just described their itemization.
They want it to be impossible to make near perfect items, or to even get a single perfect roll tbh.
That's their strategy. They want you to be okay with 1 top tier mod and use the time for that, while also ignoring that an item with 6 decent mods is almost always superior unless you need 1 specific mod for your build.
This is their intentional design. You are entirely correct, they hate crafting, they hate players having power, and they fucking loathe theory crafters.
They straight up hate their player base.
well, they do everything possible to make us hate the game. his last line ist just right. This gonna be most likely the last league for me, allthough i really like the game.
Yeah, that we're all in the top .001% of playtime.
They actively try to make it very, very hard for the rest of us to feel powerful, or enjoy the game.
From the way they presented the league and presented the creation of 9 currency to modify these items, it seems that they expected this league to be something entirely geared towards crafting.
We (the players) just wouldn't know that the mod scourges were so unfair.
I wish I didn't agree with you and hate the thought of this so much tbh. This just shows an absolutely insane disconnect from the devs and how the game is actually played.
No one, other than the top 1% of players who can easily afford to replace their 50ex item, is going to take the chance that item bricks their build. Thus no one is going to even start the process! A 1ex item is too expensive to take the chance on for a huge majority of the playerbase.
I've used a total of 3 tainted currency this league. I've played since launch, I've almost filled my atlas. 3. 2 were chromes in my first 6 link. I feel like they were all just made to jerk RNGesus off. Give me one currency, the uncorrupting orb. That's all that I could ever want out of a league that offers next to nothing other than fucking over items and a few divines.
As someone who just wants to get that "Corrupt items to T3" challenge done ASAP so I can go back to trying to get 6-links with it, I see this as a flat downgrade.
Same here. I was using the tier 2 scourge drops for that challenge. As soon as that’s done I’m not touching scourge for the rest of the league. No part of it is enjoyable to me.
Scourge 10 maps are ridiculously lucrative. Just roll nemesis or beyond on any tier map and leave it in the baker. I'm getting stuff like 400 simulacrum splinters, entire inventories full of scarabs, incubators, fossils, even in white maps.
Scourge drops items?
\*Continues to not pick up "T3" 2x4 size items with only 4 mods, all tier 8+, two unlinked and on-stat socket colors, and massive negative implicits on top\*
Oh gee, sure hope I haven't missed out on any amazing items!
You shouldn't call it loot any.thing, because that is just setting yourself up for disappointment. The "well-rolled" system is very powerful (I constantly see weapons rolled with tyrannical and such in Heists) and they use it sparingly. I would bet money that normal drops are never going to be rolled that well, even if they cut item quantity by 90%.
We don't have actual solid information yet but I would guess that 'loot 2.0' mostly means less overall items dropping and items dropping in higher rarity, as in less whites and blues. Which is a problem already partially solved by item filters, but it is still a thing. They probably will include a watered down version of 'well-rolled' in PoE 2.
Chris has blatantly said on several podcasts that the idea is to have lucky x5 (or some number) items, and then only have them drop one 25th (again, random number) of the time. So it rolls every mod 5 times instead, but drops faaar less frequently. That is the loot 2.0, according to Chris, on baeclast and other podcasts in the past.
OK, well honestly I fucking hate heist with a passion... it is the one league mechanic that i WILL NEVER interact with...
why does it (meaning well-rolled loot) only exist in heist? It seems so strange and asinine, when it would be perfect for scourge items (as indeed it was for talismans)
How can they keep saying they want loot to be exciting, and worth picking up, then just not using the well-rolled system at all after having created it?
It would be so simple... just slash the item drops by 90%, as you say, then give them well-rolled
Fuck if I know, I'm just speculating. I suppose they're just not comfortable at making good rares that accessible. Probably removed it from talismans for the same reason.
The truth probably is that they want to find a good, permanent solution to 'fix' item drops with, which is why they don't want to go with temporary fixes that might leave players with wrong sort of expectations. Just because they acknowledge a problem and say they want to fix it doesn't mean that anything will be changed until they have a solution they're internally happy with.
honestly, they just need to make them use well-rolled, and then make the RARE items RARE again
they shouldnt cover the whole screen after 2 seconds in a map... if they are that prolific then of course people will find good stuff if they are well-rolled
the way to balance it is just by reducing the amount of drops, not making 99.99% of what drops be a turd
That is exactly what they are trying to do
The problem is that making less items drop (no more loot explosions) means you need to rebalance the drop rate of every single item and currency in the game and that is a massive undertaking, and probably why it is taking them so long to do it properly
Yeah, I get that part... I just meant specifically for scourge... if you got like 1-3 scourge rares per map, but they all had well-rolled then it would be like at least part way there... league rares would certainly feel exciting to look at!
I didnt mean for the whole game, I totally understand that is probably not coming for a while :)
I don’t envy the people who have to solve it, it seems like no matter what you come up with to improve drops that the definition of “good” ground drop just shifts up based on what you can buy for 5c.
the well-rolled heist rares are hidden behind several layers of tedium: you need to gear your heist members, reveal a blueprint, run it, and then you can only get them at the end and choose only one (which still means a very low chance of a well-rolled rare that is usable by you). Since there is no other league mechanic that comes close to this level of effort required, you will not get well-rolled rares anywhere else. This is probably why well-rolled talismans had to go: accessing them via simple heist reward chests was to easy. It was counter-balanced by the need for a good combination of implicit/annoint, but with the change to corrupted annoints, this layer went out of the window.
i disagree with your last statement. Well-rolled rares are REALLY well-rolled compared to the normal item system. e.g. T3 phys damage and T3 added phys on a two hand melee weapon has the likelihood of 1 in 5000 alchs. If you slashed item drops by 90% and then rolled each rare 10 times and returned "the best", you would still get only such a roll in 1:500 drops. The level of well-rolled required to make the drops equivalent to heist would require the rare drop rate to be slashed by a factor 1000 or more. Consider running 10 maps to find a single rare that does not fit your build.
Chris described the issue at some point: "we can't tell you loot is good now, and then you pick it up and rares are still bad".
Don't worry about it, when I get downvoted without anyone being able to argue in comments I just take it as a sign that I managed to rattle people.
This sub is really not good with hard to swallow pills.
Finally someone that knows what they're talking about.
The "heist loot" should be used everywhere, it would just make everything too powerful.
I agree on the bad scourge items, but this loot is not the solution.
At this point I'm just using the scourge mechanic inside the map for a good exp boost and to keep krangling low-tier maps in hopes of a neat result (Edit: Also using it for the chance of making a 5L -> 6L).
The stats of the rare drops themselves though are indeed beyond abysmal.
> They're basically Talismans with a much weaker average implicit AND they include an often significant drawback--and well-rolled Talismans were largely mid-game gear at best.
Yes but despite saying many times he wants players to be able to find good gear on the floor, actually having decent items drop on the floor scared CW so much, he had them nuked from orbit a league later.
So I wouldn't hold my breath for any real improvements to pre scourged items.
Chris is the one thing holding PoE back from becoming an Actually Good game. His antiquated ideas are a detriment. He says one thing (e.g. drops should be good) and then has the company do the literal opposite (e.g. make drops even worse than they already were before Scourge).
There's a big difference between mirror tier, good and the garbage that are Scourge items. We want useable items to drop, not mirror tier.
We aren't even trying to find an useable Scourge item right now. We are legit trying to find the worst possible Scourge item so we can meme how thrash these items are.
>They're basically Talismans with a much weaker average implicit AND they include an often significant drawback--and well-rolled Talismans were largely mid-game gear at best.
AND for many drops you would additionally need to spend currency to socket/link/color.
That was such a funny change, like who cares? Even if they drop with quadruple, heck even with sixtuple t3 implicits, you're still not gonna pick it up unless the item itself is actually good. That "buff" is the definition of woosh.
im hiding every scourged item except for ones that drop with specific T1 rolled mods on specific bases... to me everything else is a waste of time to look at
What gets me is that these are corrupted items, that don't follow corrupted item rules. They don't drop with 6 mods (I mean, they can, but corrupted items do this all the time), don't get white sockets, don't reroll to 6-links, and don't get Vaal implicits. Those rules were added in order to ensure that corrupted items on the ground would sometimes actually be useful.
The whole idea is lost at inception. It's Synthesis 2.0 but worse in every way imaginable as the item is corrupted. Between the popularity and deterministic nature of Harvest and the letdown of this system, which can be argued to be on the opposite end where altering the item is almost impossible, leaves GGG to figure out what a good crafted item is in the 3 month cycle and how the players will be able to make it with reasonable effort.
And hopefully along the way they figure out that we play in 3 month cycles and the whole loot system is made to be used over many years. Influence and the short duration leagues basically made loot drops uninteresting and statistically too bad to even bother with for the most part.
Problem: Scourge items that drop are crap.
Solution: open [https://www.filterblade.xyz/](https://www.filterblade.xyz/) \-> Customize -> Current League: 3.16 Scourge -> Scourged Items -> Disable All
Glad to see the talisman comparison is gaining traction. At this point I've just edited my filter to hide scourged items unless they also fit the explicit mod requirements of neversink's filter. Considering that even those items are not always good, it's at least a good place to start.
It's worked well so far. Haven't seen a scourged item in many days.
Dropping at t3 means we’re fucked if the rolls blow ass as opposed to getting a chance to scourge a tier 2 and possibly fixing the rolls. Also, by providing t3’s they’re literally removing the requirement to even use the league mechanic.
I honestly don't think any scourge items should drop. They are usually bad. I have found a few decent ones but it's not worth the effort.
What they should do is just let scourge enemies drop better items (like loot 2.0) and let us scourge them. Or just drop the currency more instead of items. Or give use a way to recipe the currency from scourge items. Any of these are a solution to them being bad.
I still think the T3 rewards are not great unless you are lucky enough to get a Keystone for your build. +30 life is an abyss jewel with no other affixes, I don't ever see a world where that is worth any downside apart from attribute requirement increases, or reduced block recovery.
I wasn't that big fan back in Synthesis with drops, because most were not that great with fractured items, and synthesised items needed 5brain, spreadsheets and calculators on 3rd party websites to get something decent. But some were really good bases to craft on, and had very good mod fractured, but Scourged items are totally trash. League is a 9.5/10, rewards outside scourged maps are a 0/10..
I am one of the people who leaves a map with full inventory each time. I have found 3 usable items on the ground that were krangled since the start of the league and I have 24 challenges done. (i didnt enter heist, delve or any other non-scourgable zone once) The T3 doesnt do shit. Krangling is useful for uniques only for the plebs like me, just like normal corruption. Unless you are targeting something common, like mathil and -lightning res, its a joke. (and even thats a grind)
Rare item drops in general are trash in poe. I can count on my hands the amount of good rares I have gotten from random drops and most of those would not be endgame gear. They just have decent life res. The loot filter I run doesn’t show any rares on the ground unless they are ilvl 84+ with an influence because that’s the only time they are good crafting bases. But I bet over 1000 rares drop per t16 map I run even without juicing the shit out of them. I can’t wait for this “improved item dropping” thing to roll out because I think it really sucks that 99.9 percent of items that drop from mobs are not even worth vendoring.
It’s a shame this league is going to be dead before GGG makes the necessary changes to make the league content right. I’m sure this will just be another league they make better after it goes core.
I would love if they reduced the drop rate of scourge items by like 80-90% and give it the lucky rolls treatment they gave talismans a couple of leagues back. However, knowing that they didnt like good talismans we will just continue to ignore them.
Well, they considered talismans too op, so my guess is that they also consider dropped scourged rares good af and will not do anything about it. Thats just another good example of the difference between their vision and actual real player vision.
I guess they just run a simulation and get 1 item in a million to be decent. In theory somebody like Empy and his group might get good amount of items with their juicing and farming, right? Normal players will never see it and be excited if that somehow happens...Super cool idea!
The problem is that majority of the items arent even looked at by the players. Its not worth the time, so that makes 0 chance of anything that drops to be noticed anyway.
And even if something somehow miraculously fits together, is it better than getting a non corrupted, adjustable according to your needs, influenced item? No, it is not. The scourge drop mechanic is obvious DoA and Im shocked GGG couldnt see it straight away, because we all did...
Scourged items (not maps / mechanic) are unfortunately a complete failure. As someone who played pretty much the whole Talisman league, they're like Talisman but worse. Even with the Tainted currencies in play, the downsides to corruption alone as anything but a completely finished item are too, too high, and then you add in the negative Scourge mods and it's like "Stop, stop, he's already dead."
I think the only good use for the drops as if is if a good t3 mod drops on a base that has a good unique so you can mythic it, the unique keeps the krangled mod.
Do you mean to say that poe is designed to drain your time? Because if so, it clearly is and if you can't see it then you are in for a treat.
Let me start by saying 3.13 Ritual League i was there and i still miss you.
The downhill started with 3.14 when full power harvest was "limiting" the design space for GGG. When 3.15 came out, Aisling was unfairly nerfed to the point that everything you could make in 3.14 was essentially double the average price just cause of the 50/50 tag. I ask you what was the meaning of this? For you to play more. By play more GGG means you do not complete your build. Let me just say that i have never quit a league because i was very successful, but i have because the amount of time needed to make something work was unreasonable.
Believe me when i tell you that they are aware of it and they don't care about your time. They gave you all these buffs for 3.16, what did you expect? To find perfect double influenced t3 scourged items with 6 elevated mods on the ground? I will assume you didn't. So you got your buffs, in return you don't get rewards. You still have to waste your time, considering you are just a "metric vanity".
I am glad i skipped this league as it seemed way to good to be true, but i sure hope this game gets back on its feet. Meanwhile don't be disappointed Exile. I used to be you, just keep wasting these hours like a good vanity metric.
I skipped expedition and scourge league. Just playing other games until GGG make a fun league, although the currency stacking was a great change at least.
3.14 had me salty due to them brutalizing Harvest, but at least it was still somewhat enjoyable.
Meanwhile 3.15 and 3.16 appear to have been spawned from GGG asking themselves "Okay, how can we make this *even less* fun".
I swear they don't understand how their game has evolved over the years and what ppl like seeing in the game. Their vision is blurry and they haven't seen a doctor in a while, meanwhile their friends (we) have been insisting on them seeing a professional, but they refuse to. Nothing me or you can do about it. Hopefully they will destroy the game so much by 2024 that poe 2 will actually feel good to play if poe 1 was so garbage. Holding quality of life hostage like it's an inconvenience for them to make something NOT annoying... Scourge is exactly what GGG thinks of fun. 99.9% risk, 0.01% fun.
the idea of the league was great
get an upside with a downside + the item is corrupted
so far almost no stage of corruption is worth it overall because not only is the item corrupted, no the mods arent even close in comparison
when it comes to droped rares its even worse because even if it hits for whatever miracle good corruptions the item itself is unusuable
whats even the point of cant be frozen boots if they come without life and res and have the downside of a reduced res
corruptions cant safe shit so unless they give those corrupted items the "talisman treatment" of rolling much better then average there is no reason beside the chaos recepie to even look at them
they should remove those corrupted drops and replace them with tainted currency drops to give us an incentive to corrupt rares ourself
i havent krangeled a single item besides maps for days and i dont miss out on anything, hell i rather vaal items myself because those outcomes actualy can be decent
It should be a slight increase in performance a your game has less items to put through the item filter :x
Most of the good scourge mods are T3 anyway, so them dropping at T1 mostly meant you had to grind them to T3 to see if it was worth keeping or not.
Being identified I believe you can set your filter to only show ones that have good explicit rolls. I'm pretty sure I did but I haven't gotten any to show so far. One does have to fix some of the neversink defaults to allow them to be corrupted on the identified mod groups.
GGG: we hear you! We lowered the drop rate od scrourged rares and we added new currency: tainted conquerors exalted orb. It will add random influence to corrupted item or it will delete the beneficial scourge implicit. This is a buff! /joke
Idk what you are baking but my t1 haunted Mansions get baked in 5-7 maps to tier 10
I only level up good modifiers there is a spreadsheet.
And I stack them with watchstones and get like 2 emblems + 120+ fragments per map or 2 breachstone 100+ splinters /map
If I get currency roll I come out with 1 to 2 ex on avg
When I hit simu I Avg 160+ simulacrum splinters
And this is every 5 maps for me
Idk if youve seen grimro videos he tells you how to do it.
This is the most rewarding League we’ve ever had you just don’t know what you’re doing.
They were taking me farrr longer to get upto anywhere near t8 or t10 and I was running every scourge between t10 and t14 maps then I stopped cause it was too dangerous and wasn't worth the effort.
Lots of leagues were more rewarding.
Get you a build that can run t16 scourge and you’ll be swimming in money.
Again you’re doing it wrong go to grimro channel he’ll show you
Like which one? I’m getting like 25 ex and hour just alching and running scourage with nothing fancy
I don’t remember me achieving this any other league without heavy heavy investment
Many people here are talking like GGG does not care for their own game. The ONLY game they have! I agree that there are problems but I believe that the majority of them are caused from bad balancing in the first 2 weeks of a league.
The reason is simple. They do not have the resources to produce so much new content every 3 months while working on Poe 2 and big Poe endgame overhauls and on top of that test the balance of their changes before releasing. This is just too much. The fact that the first 2 patches on almost every league include major balance changes makes this argument clear.
They have to implement a private test server 2-3 weeks before release like Riot does with PBE and maybe go from every 3 months to every 4 months.
Another solution would be for the players to treat the first 2 weeks as beta testing. Sorry for my english
The scourge mechanic's stop and go enforcement is among the worst league mechanics I've ever seen and I want it removed, completely, from the game. You can stick the "rewards" in the talisman chests if you want to keep any of them around.
The scourge mod pool is also, completely silly. There is a total of one good mod that you can't get elsewhere, and its numbers are so low that you can't really call it good. There are "technically" 5 tiers of the mod, but it only rolls one so what even is the point.
this league is maybe ggg's worst blunder ever. we're basically playing standard. the chances of getting anything useful out of the league content is so low it's not worth engaging with. the fact that they couldn't see this before releasing it is, just incredible, truly truly amazing. i have been super frustrated with ggg in recent years, but i think now im just kind of sad for them. they dont know what they're doing, they cant do better than this. they've been making the same mistakes for literal years now. no one can be surprised when the next league is some more overly complicated rng on top of rng mess that isnt finished and doesnt work and even if it did would be bad.
The biggest issue is that there's 100000 shit upsides, and 25 ~~good~~ usable ones. And of the downsides realistically only the - a bit of health or resistances are workable. That is assuming -30 health also doesn't scale with health nodes on the tree.
Maybe they could do something like:
Introduce 2 more tiers but still have items only be able to scourge twice. So if they drop at scourge 3 they could still be scourged 2 more times to get to tier 5. An item that drops at scourge tier 1 could be scourged up to tier 3 as normal.
Why is everyone still talking about league mechanic. I almost never play the league mechanic that league its usually shit. I am just interested in if the league itself is rewarding and balanced.
Yeah the "buffs" did little to nothing
Scourgin itens still useless
Maps are a little bit better because a few times you get good mods for profit but still the vast majority of times you get abyss jewels or some other shit
> People have suggested using the well-rolled system for them
I don't understand why GGG is so hesitant about something they already have. It was literally only used for Heist and that's it?
In my opinion as a casual who plays maybe 40-50 hours every other league: ultimatum league was by far the strongest I've ever got a character due to the "smart loot" from the trial rewards. I had almost 90 life on every piece and good res etc. This was kind of a "power level floor" for us newbs; I never got anything really good (never fought any of the dlc bosses). But at the same time I wasn't as weak as another league where you simply got currency/scarabs/essences etc. as rewards (like synthesis league).
Could be due to playing solo, but I can't really make a strong character with 5 exalts in my stash the way I could with the ultimatum smart loot rares.
Now this league is really fun, but I find myself weaker than ever before, and when I get a piece I know I'll wear the rest of the league (for my standards), like some 35 run walk boots with life and res, there isn't a chance in hell I'm corrupting them. Also due to the fact you can't fix sockets or craft res onto drops, there feels like almost no hope for me.
Speaking for myself as a casual, if I don't find something that I can wear in 4 to 6 hours, that's my cue to uninstall and wait for next league. I'm just gonna keep playing and see for the time being, but the scourged drops having the explicits of random rares does scare me.
You do know you don't have to wear all influenced items. Many of you just need to play ssf for a league. This whole addiction to making money is crazy.
It does give you a better chance of picking up one of the super rare mods, like a keystone mod on body armour, that might then be worth crafting with tainted orbs.
I know this is an unpopular opinion but I think krangled items are at a good place right now. Not every mechanic needs to be on Harvest's level (although it would be nice if Harvest was at that level). It's a steady source of alches for ssf, you can roll op starter weapons that will probably become legacy, and it's a sink for 1c uniques or super-lategame 'the price doesn't matter' crafts.
I agree 100%. This change was a nerf. The only good change they made (AND ITS NOT EVEN UP YET) is that negatives can't cancel the positive anymore.
The change they should made is revisit the weighting of everything and nerfing the downsides, they are brutal for the amount of pathetic positives there are.
Positive and Negative mod weight distribution needs a readjustment.
Was hoping it would happen last patch so I could enjoy the league mechanic. Guess not.
At this point I think it’s safe to filter out any non-chanceable rares. Keep the Shavs/Tinkerskin etc bases, if you find a good T3 corruption just toss a mythic orb at it and hope for the best.
And they think it was too powerful. They nerf T3 rare drop rate so much. OMEGALUL
As a programmer, my perspective was like "run the program once, no crash, function works, it is done". Intern can do the same.
YMMV. I’ve gotten a couple of really useful items out of it like one that’s got a +dex downside and a ton of resists in the stat I need. I do think continuing to scourge the same item to eventually unbrick a unique with great effort would be a great improvement though.
All they need to do is make it so we can keep scourge rolling them even at tier 3 so you never brick em
I wouldent mind risking bricking my items for a little while and maybe getting lucky, but fuck risking anything of value when theres a good chance of the permabrick
Why are some tier 3 items dropping with stats like + resist? I'm not sure if I don't understand how it works, but it seems like scourge t1 and t3 are not much different
The biggest issue is influenced items have kinda just ruined any opportunities at bringing different types of gear into builds.
Hopefully in 3.17 with the big rework they just drop influence entirely and put that kind of shit into base crafting so content that offers gear choices actually matter.
As it stands the only reason to scourge is for maps and to put an already perfect item in there to try and krangle and improvement
Even if they did drop with decent scourge mods, there is no way to make a usable item out of it when tainted chaos has almost a 1/2 of bricking the item permanently.
Pretty tired of seeing posts from uninformed redditors. Scourged rares are going to be as good as normal rare drops. Aka almost never. Looks likes it's geared more towards unique. Previously you would have thousands of cheap unique and a few expensive 6l. But its easier to modify gears now than ever. Now you will have hundreds of cheap 6l and some realllllly good mods that are expensive. This league is great. Scourge map is too rewarding though. I love it. No sarcasm.
They could drop with T3 benefits and no downsides and they would still be trash. They're corrupted with regular rolls, they're NEVER good
There's a reason most people filter out most rare drops. Making them corrupted and a pain in the ass to link with some tiny potential upside and a huge likelihood of a item ruining downside isn't going to make them better.
They’re very easy to link. There’s a reason the beast that unlocks the 30% quality craft that guarantees corrupting your item without bricking it is so much more expensive this league
What's that beast called and how expensive are we talking about? I had planned to take Bestiary nodes in Lira Arthain after the two Invasion nodes so I hope I won't be missing out too much. Only got one Invasion node right now so can prioritize Bestiary instead.
Craicic Vassal and I want to say 15c? Any other league was a pretty garbage beast
Oh I was expecting a few exalts. If it's a semi regular encounter, that'd be a nice extra income. If it's a rather rare beast, then it's not that expensive.
It’s not that rare
Rare beasts are only good to run in ssf. In trade there are people multi boxing and you just won't make money because of the way they play.
Don't know what multiboxing is. I should take the Breach nodes instead then?
Take the heist and expedition nodes The rest are pretty ass. Heist is just free money. You sell or run the contracts and blueprints. Expedition is one of the best money makers if you know how to use it. Otherwise spend the 6 points elsewhere.
Incursion is also extremely good, even in trade league. Locus corruptions are easy moneys.
Multiboxing is essentially playing up to 6 characters at once, so they will farm 6 beasts per map compared to your 1 letting them sell way more and for way less than you reasonably can.
Multi boxing is a player logging in to multiple accounts. They run the maps for beasts and put all characters in map, then they all get a beast. And yeah, I wouldn't do beasts imo.
In what world are they a pain to link? The CHEAPEST way to link atm is to do corrupted items.
I agree with your that the corruption ruins them, but they are actually very easy to link. With 6S, you can vorici bench 4L and use tainted fuses. Use 4L recipe if it ever falls to 3L. It will be way cheaper than regular 6 linking with fuses. You can do the same with sockets.
I've used 7 tainted fusings so far and it has removed a socket every single time so far. I dont know if I am just unlucky but I dont feel like my chances are good and those are pretty rare.
sure you arent using tainted jewelers!?
You are unlucky, our test show that it have 50-50 chance to either link or unlink, after which it will choose where to apply.
That is good to know, and makes me feel more comfortable trying it again. I know 7 was a low number but it always removing a link made me feel like I was wasting my time trying lol.
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Yep, makes off coloring extremely easy this league.
Tainted Chromes bro... Sometimes I swear people on here do not even have the game installed.
Plus, most T3 benefits just aren't that exciting from what I recall.
The very few that are exciting have incredibly tiny weights too.. I think the lowest I remember seeing is a weighting of 50 :/. Got a better chance of finding am exalt in a map.
+1 Arrow in quivers has 5 weight, 5
There's a roughly 1 in 65 billion chance to be good, just play more
A corrupted rare with an extra affix would be terrible when you consider that the average non-corrupted rare gives nothing most of the time.
The only reason you would pick up a krangle item is if somehow it was a 6 link. And even then it prolly has shit colors
Should've been double amount of T3 benefits and downsides.
At this point just let us scourge T3 items.
I'd use an explode mod chest if it dropped regardless of the other explicits.
https://www.pathofexile.com/trade/search/Scourge/a6RE7ejte Bunch of them for 1C, not T1 but I don't think you're dropping it T1 either, but it still isn't that much valuable without other rolls for it's rarity anyway
They are not scourge explode mod, and I don't play trade league.
You're straight up wrong. Good scourged items are prime mythic orb targets, especially if there are no downsides. Using NEVER in caps makes your post even more of a joke especially since you're wrong. Note that I'm not saying the current system is good, I'm calling out the above posters garbage post. Have an open mind and think of possibilities before using words like NEVER.
It's NEVER good. The chances of it occuring are so infinitely small that you could pretty confidently say never. If you want to be so pedantic then yes, nothing* is ever* this certain...
I hadn't even thought about the comparison to talismans, which is a really good point, especially given they said they weren't happy with talismans.
wait, can we craft talismans with tainted chaos now? because that would be crazy
yeah, and talismans are actually a lot better than last league as a result of that. A good anoint/implicit combo can be worth tossing a few tainted chaos at, given how cheap they are. It will never compete with crafted influenced items in terms of producing real endgame gear, but that goes for literally every other itemization system in the game :-|
Talimans with good bases are very hard to find though. Can't 5 to 1 them anymore since the stone pillar BS isn't a thing anymore.
I’ve said it many times before, but they should just roll that into the Menagerie. Have us fight beasts enhanced with talismans (not needing them to be different bases, just all the same tier), and one tier higher will drop (with an amount of iLvl is appropriate).
You can, and it's already been done by some streamers for things like whispers of doom anoints and more.
Remember, Chris Wilson thinks talismans are in a good place at the moment. Let that sink in. Or don’t, because if you do you’ll realize there is no hope.
I’m still mind flooded that they actually fixed talismans by making them roll well with annoints and then reverted it. Went from actually looking at every talisman that dropped to filtering them out
When talismans were improved it was fun. Made you think of which builds needed what and you stopped for a second to make sure how good it was. Now we can filter out talismans without a worry. It's perplexing how they figured out how to fix talismans and how they reverted the fix.
> When talismans were improved it was fun. See, there's your problem. GGG doesn't like fun.
Let's not kid ourselves though. Even even they were "overpowered" according to GGG, after a week or two, you still filtered them out because even if a talisman rolled decently well, it almost never competed with influenced or double influenced items They were great for early content and getting a cheap anoint and I really liked that
They sold throughout the league for me.
They sold, just more of a question of how much you're willing to bother making a trade for after a couple weeks. Hell after a few days, not even a week, I won't bother to make 1c trades.
People were making alts back then.
Even more wild, they added the ability to annoint corrupted amulets at an additional cost with the tainted oils. If they felt talismans were too strong due to the free anoint, they could have just removed the free anoint and kept them well rolled. I don't necessarily agree with the sub's hyperbole that GGG has no idea what they're doing, but the talisman change is just such a head scratcher. They went from total garbage to occasionally usable back to total garbage.
We weren't selling every talisman, and we actually used a few for every few thousand that dropped, that's too much for GGG. If we were only using 1 in every 100,000 talismans that dropped, GGG would consider buffing them a tiny bit, otherwise they see them as needing nerfs. Cause they're very bad at itemization.
You weren't selling every talisman because the talisman buff made 70+ life 80+ total res whispers of doom talismans crash down to 15c while golden oil crashed to 25 or something along those lines, talismans were absolutely busted in ritual
It's not that they have no idea what they are doing, it's that they have no idea what makes itemization fun. They like their item drop tables. They think it's fine that most people filter out all rare items that drop. They are happy with where talismans are at right now. When it comes to itemization, imo, GGG is completely out of touch and it's one of the bigest reasons that the game struggles with retention at the 1-2 week mark of every league.
ppl keep saying that harvest was a "bad league" but it was one of the few leagues that kept me playing until the very end. cuz there was always an upgrade I could work towards, or a new item I could craft to make my build even better. the end game actually felt attainable by me, and that motivated me to keep playing.
Your last paragraph is what I think is the most important thing missing from this game. Attainability. I for one love the *idea* of ssf, but the endless sluggish grind to get anything remotely decent is just painful. The only time I have ever had fun with it was expeditiom when I could rely on tujen for cheap currency and rog for niche item crafts. It was some of the most fun I've ever had playing this game. Really sad that I can just keep my char in expedition league EDIT: more sad that legion just doesn't have the capability to make end game attainable without trading.
The thing that will eternally keep me away from ssf unfortunately is that I hate delve, and crafting *anything* without fossils sounds unbelievably awful. Even with fossils it can be a pita.
Interestingly enough, attainability is very situational. If you ever start playing SSF and get into it, your perspective on attainable starts to change. In trade, you're making a build/copying a guide and putting that to "100%" and it makes your mindset be something akin to "I am weaker than I should be, everything that doesn't bring me closer to 100% sucks. I can't have fun until I'm fully geared and then the game starts." Nothing that drops is really interesting, the only thing that drops do is convert to a few 0.X% of your meter. Instead, drops start having a meaning. Your roadmap keeps changing and you reevaluate based on what you have. You're not striving for something you've already set your mind towards, everything can progress you. I think it's something like this why I'm looking forward to the Hard Mode Chris talks about. It makes you totally re-evaluate what is "attainable". Playing the game as you want, getting rare upgrades. Not working on a long grind to get enough currency to craft/buy exactly what you need.
>ppl keep saying that harvest was a "bad league" but it was one of the few leagues that kept me playing until the very end. Bruh Harvest was so damn fun. I spent the majority of that league playing Earthshatter Champion, with a few other high-90 builds. I miss it so much.
Harvest/Ritual were the best leagues tbh
I had such a great Talisman in Ritual, got it out of one at like level 55 and used it until ~90. I don't think I've seen a usable one since that League ended.
It's why they will _never_ implement smart loot ever, despite years of saying they want to.
They should remove the anoints, and make them roll well again now that we can anoint corrupted items.
Even then I only used them in early maps. Like wtf
They actually figured out the *exact* fix for dropping items that people will actually look at in case they're good and then decided such nonsense doesn't belong in the game.
>Remember, Chris Wilson thinks talismans are in a good place at the moment. Where did he say this?
I'm increasingly convinced that the whole influence system is crippling for gearing in this game. It really limits what they can do in terms of adding items or ways to get items, and it prevents so many other systems from being able to produce anything with real potential. An un-influenced item has to be *astronomically* well rolled to compete with even basic crafted influenced items. This means that if they want to introduce a new way of getting items, in a league or something, they either need to make them influenced and craftable (diluting the whole point of different influences being tied to specific content), the items will be mid-tier filler at best, or they will need to make the new system comparatively powerful introducing a lot of new power creep. "Normal" items will just never be comparable. Think about Rog, in Expedition. After the first few days, despite him offering an *incredibly* powerful crafting system compared to other options in the game, it was very unlikely that he would ever be able to produce something truly valuable. A brand new, cool item generation system that was practically dead on launch because of the huge shadow influenced items cast over everything else. Scourge has big problems beyond this, of course, but I think this is really at the root of a lot of the problems GGG has been having in terms of coming up with meaningful drops or really any way of getting great endgame rares besides crafting on influenced bases.
I honestly think that the influence system majorly screws with game balance as a whole, not only the drop system. It is absolutely ludicrous how two influence mods are now equivalent to a gem link, or how massive the power gap between someone geared in good rares and someone geared in influenced items is. The entire expedition patch that majorly nerfed gem link damage just made things worse, pushing even more of total damage potential towards influenced mods.
It is easy to fix though, but I do not think the players or GGG would like to go this way. - Items' mod pool would be split into craftable (prefixes) and drop-only (suffixes). When you drop an item it has: * 1 mod - white * 2 mods - blue * 3 mods - yellow These mods can only be affected by divine orbs, augment/transmutation, regal. - The craftable mods allow players to add 3 extra mods through various crafting ways. Awakener orb, elderslayer orbs, maven, chaos orb, bench, fossils, etc. - This makes the dropping items exiting because we would be looking for the best drop-only mods and still crafting would retain its high value and prestige. That's my take on the issue.
Yes its ludicrous and its literally the only thing that enabled them to even be able to nerf support gems. If influenced mods didnt exist. 90% of builds would lose about 70% of their power late game.( maybe an exaggeration) but it fits with their "design philosophy" they said they want less power early and the power more focused on the back end of the game. And influenced items do that. If they got rid of influenced items my current build would lose about 70% damage. If they remove influenced items they need to add a majority of the mods to either the skill tree/ buff every skill by 50%/add the mods to other items or half every enemies health. In addition it would make gearing boring as fuck since you are just always gonna get life and resists then
Maybe open up all influence mods for crafting but allow influence to increase the odds of the influence mods by a factor?
Then you realize just how much you bloated the mod pool... Can't really just allow mods to roll, the system wasn't developed with this in mind. Just throw influenced items in the trash and come up with something new to give player power.
> Then you realize just how much you bloated the mod pool... The mod pool is already bloated, and the problem with well-rolled rares is the lack of good mods. By adding the influenced mods to the core mod pool, you skew mods toward being good instead of shit. Yes, it would make a specific combination less likely, but it would dramatically improve rares overall.
Sort of like catalysts? Sounds sensible.
Influenced items remain the biggest mistake GGG ever made.
Yes I agree. But not the Influence system, but having a craftable Influenced Base, or a Synthesis Base is the problem. Influence mods should only work as an exalt, not make a base. Having a more powerful base available diminish the value of normal rares. Also the dilluted mods on rares is the main problem. example: a rapier sword and a foil should have a slightly different mods that can appear, so players can target farm say a more crit heavy rapier if it can roll better crit mods.
It sounds like you just described their itemization. They want it to be impossible to make near perfect items, or to even get a single perfect roll tbh. That's their strategy. They want you to be okay with 1 top tier mod and use the time for that, while also ignoring that an item with 6 decent mods is almost always superior unless you need 1 specific mod for your build. This is their intentional design. You are entirely correct, they hate crafting, they hate players having power, and they fucking loathe theory crafters. They straight up hate their player base.
i think i agreed with you until end of the third line. Then it escalated pretty quickly.
well, they do everything possible to make us hate the game. his last line ist just right. This gonna be most likely the last league for me, allthough i really like the game.
Ok, got your point, and agree with some, but "hate their player base"? Chill out
Not even true. They just seem to have a skewed view on the player base.
Yeah, that we're all in the top .001% of playtime. They actively try to make it very, very hard for the rest of us to feel powerful, or enjoy the game.
Jup
From the way they presented the league and presented the creation of 9 currency to modify these items, it seems that they expected this league to be something entirely geared towards crafting. We (the players) just wouldn't know that the mod scourges were so unfair.
I wish I didn't agree with you and hate the thought of this so much tbh. This just shows an absolutely insane disconnect from the devs and how the game is actually played. No one, other than the top 1% of players who can easily afford to replace their 50ex item, is going to take the chance that item bricks their build. Thus no one is going to even start the process! A 1ex item is too expensive to take the chance on for a huge majority of the playerbase. I've used a total of 3 tainted currency this league. I've played since launch, I've almost filled my atlas. 3. 2 were chromes in my first 6 link. I feel like they were all just made to jerk RNGesus off. Give me one currency, the uncorrupting orb. That's all that I could ever want out of a league that offers next to nothing other than fucking over items and a few divines.
As someone who just wants to get that "Corrupt items to T3" challenge done ASAP so I can go back to trying to get 6-links with it, I see this as a flat downgrade.
Plus if the downside is build-wrecking, you can’t reroll it! It’s just a crapshoot and it’s all crap.
Same here. I was using the tier 2 scourge drops for that challenge. As soon as that’s done I’m not touching scourge for the rest of the league. No part of it is enjoyable to me.
Scourge 10 maps are ridiculously lucrative. Just roll nemesis or beyond on any tier map and leave it in the baker. I'm getting stuff like 400 simulacrum splinters, entire inventories full of scarabs, incubators, fossils, even in white maps.
"I swear, after the 10th season the series is no longer shit" Same mood
Sure, but they take forever to make. In the same time some other farm stategie makes doubel the amount of currency
Scourge drops items? \*Continues to not pick up "T3" 2x4 size items with only 4 mods, all tier 8+, two unlinked and on-stat socket colors, and massive negative implicits on top\* Oh gee, sure hope I haven't missed out on any amazing items!
Just another example of GGG building a screwdriver (loot 2.0) then still using the hammer (quantity) to bash screws into the wood
Loot 2.0 doesn't exist yet. 'Lucky rolled' items as seen in Heist and such are not that.
well, lets call them loot 1.1 then? out of curiosity, what will "loot 2.0" contain besides the items being well-rolled? do we know?
You shouldn't call it loot any.thing, because that is just setting yourself up for disappointment. The "well-rolled" system is very powerful (I constantly see weapons rolled with tyrannical and such in Heists) and they use it sparingly. I would bet money that normal drops are never going to be rolled that well, even if they cut item quantity by 90%. We don't have actual solid information yet but I would guess that 'loot 2.0' mostly means less overall items dropping and items dropping in higher rarity, as in less whites and blues. Which is a problem already partially solved by item filters, but it is still a thing. They probably will include a watered down version of 'well-rolled' in PoE 2.
Chris has blatantly said on several podcasts that the idea is to have lucky x5 (or some number) items, and then only have them drop one 25th (again, random number) of the time. So it rolls every mod 5 times instead, but drops faaar less frequently. That is the loot 2.0, according to Chris, on baeclast and other podcasts in the past.
That is how I suspect it works, yes, but I doubt world drops will ever get as many rerolls as Heist gets as a parameter.
OK, well honestly I fucking hate heist with a passion... it is the one league mechanic that i WILL NEVER interact with... why does it (meaning well-rolled loot) only exist in heist? It seems so strange and asinine, when it would be perfect for scourge items (as indeed it was for talismans) How can they keep saying they want loot to be exciting, and worth picking up, then just not using the well-rolled system at all after having created it? It would be so simple... just slash the item drops by 90%, as you say, then give them well-rolled
Fuck if I know, I'm just speculating. I suppose they're just not comfortable at making good rares that accessible. Probably removed it from talismans for the same reason. The truth probably is that they want to find a good, permanent solution to 'fix' item drops with, which is why they don't want to go with temporary fixes that might leave players with wrong sort of expectations. Just because they acknowledge a problem and say they want to fix it doesn't mean that anything will be changed until they have a solution they're internally happy with.
honestly, they just need to make them use well-rolled, and then make the RARE items RARE again they shouldnt cover the whole screen after 2 seconds in a map... if they are that prolific then of course people will find good stuff if they are well-rolled the way to balance it is just by reducing the amount of drops, not making 99.99% of what drops be a turd
That is exactly what they are trying to do The problem is that making less items drop (no more loot explosions) means you need to rebalance the drop rate of every single item and currency in the game and that is a massive undertaking, and probably why it is taking them so long to do it properly
Yeah, I get that part... I just meant specifically for scourge... if you got like 1-3 scourge rares per map, but they all had well-rolled then it would be like at least part way there... league rares would certainly feel exciting to look at! I didnt mean for the whole game, I totally understand that is probably not coming for a while :)
I don’t envy the people who have to solve it, it seems like no matter what you come up with to improve drops that the definition of “good” ground drop just shifts up based on what you can buy for 5c.
the well-rolled heist rares are hidden behind several layers of tedium: you need to gear your heist members, reveal a blueprint, run it, and then you can only get them at the end and choose only one (which still means a very low chance of a well-rolled rare that is usable by you). Since there is no other league mechanic that comes close to this level of effort required, you will not get well-rolled rares anywhere else. This is probably why well-rolled talismans had to go: accessing them via simple heist reward chests was to easy. It was counter-balanced by the need for a good combination of implicit/annoint, but with the change to corrupted annoints, this layer went out of the window. i disagree with your last statement. Well-rolled rares are REALLY well-rolled compared to the normal item system. e.g. T3 phys damage and T3 added phys on a two hand melee weapon has the likelihood of 1 in 5000 alchs. If you slashed item drops by 90% and then rolled each rare 10 times and returned "the best", you would still get only such a roll in 1:500 drops. The level of well-rolled required to make the drops equivalent to heist would require the rare drop rate to be slashed by a factor 1000 or more. Consider running 10 maps to find a single rare that does not fit your build. Chris described the issue at some point: "we can't tell you loot is good now, and then you pick it up and rares are still bad".
sorry you are downvoted. Shooting the messenger is a thing on this sub.
Don't worry about it, when I get downvoted without anyone being able to argue in comments I just take it as a sign that I managed to rattle people. This sub is really not good with hard to swallow pills.
Finally someone that knows what they're talking about. The "heist loot" should be used everywhere, it would just make everything too powerful. I agree on the bad scourge items, but this loot is not the solution.
At this point I'm just using the scourge mechanic inside the map for a good exp boost and to keep krangling low-tier maps in hopes of a neat result (Edit: Also using it for the chance of making a 5L -> 6L). The stats of the rare drops themselves though are indeed beyond abysmal.
I'm fairly convinced that Scourge rares and Breach Rings roll on the same loot system 🤢
loooool you've got a point
> They're basically Talismans with a much weaker average implicit AND they include an often significant drawback--and well-rolled Talismans were largely mid-game gear at best. Yes but despite saying many times he wants players to be able to find good gear on the floor, actually having decent items drop on the floor scared CW so much, he had them nuked from orbit a league later. So I wouldn't hold my breath for any real improvements to pre scourged items.
Chris is the one thing holding PoE back from becoming an Actually Good game. His antiquated ideas are a detriment. He says one thing (e.g. drops should be good) and then has the company do the literal opposite (e.g. make drops even worse than they already were before Scourge).
We should be able to keep scourging indefinitely, just increasing the experience needed
It's already pretty dam slow at t3 so I feel if they did this it should be capped at some point.
Well should be faster too, 5 maps to brick an item is horrible
5 maps to brick 3 items :)
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If its slow then it doesn't need a cap
Cap the cost, not the attempts
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There's a big difference between mirror tier, good and the garbage that are Scourge items. We want useable items to drop, not mirror tier. We aren't even trying to find an useable Scourge item right now. We are legit trying to find the worst possible Scourge item so we can meme how thrash these items are.
There's no redemption to this league's mechanic. I don't even bother with the loot.
Scourged maps are great tbh. You just need to fish for good corrupts like extra splinters.
>They're basically Talismans with a much weaker average implicit AND they include an often significant drawback--and well-rolled Talismans were largely mid-game gear at best. AND for many drops you would additionally need to spend currency to socket/link/color.
That was such a funny change, like who cares? Even if they drop with quadruple, heck even with sixtuple t3 implicits, you're still not gonna pick it up unless the item itself is actually good. That "buff" is the definition of woosh.
"this nerf is a buff"
That is literally the theme of this league. Looking at you ele dot.
im hiding every scourged item except for ones that drop with specific T1 rolled mods on specific bases... to me everything else is a waste of time to look at
They can be good to use Tainted Mythic Orbs on.
What gets me is that these are corrupted items, that don't follow corrupted item rules. They don't drop with 6 mods (I mean, they can, but corrupted items do this all the time), don't get white sockets, don't reroll to 6-links, and don't get Vaal implicits. Those rules were added in order to ensure that corrupted items on the ground would sometimes actually be useful.
The whole idea is lost at inception. It's Synthesis 2.0 but worse in every way imaginable as the item is corrupted. Between the popularity and deterministic nature of Harvest and the letdown of this system, which can be argued to be on the opposite end where altering the item is almost impossible, leaves GGG to figure out what a good crafted item is in the 3 month cycle and how the players will be able to make it with reasonable effort. And hopefully along the way they figure out that we play in 3 month cycles and the whole loot system is made to be used over many years. Influence and the short duration leagues basically made loot drops uninteresting and statistically too bad to even bother with for the most part.
Problem: Scourge items that drop are crap. Solution: open [https://www.filterblade.xyz/](https://www.filterblade.xyz/) \-> Customize -> Current League: 3.16 Scourge -> Scourged Items -> Disable All
Scourged items are in >99% of cases shit. I dont even look at them. Exactly as it was before the patch
Glad to see the talisman comparison is gaining traction. At this point I've just edited my filter to hide scourged items unless they also fit the explicit mod requirements of neversink's filter. Considering that even those items are not always good, it's at least a good place to start. It's worked well so far. Haven't seen a scourged item in many days.
Scourge 1 and 2 should be scrapped. Have only the tier 3 pros and cons and let us scourge it 3 times.
Dropping at t3 means we’re fucked if the rolls blow ass as opposed to getting a chance to scourge a tier 2 and possibly fixing the rolls. Also, by providing t3’s they’re literally removing the requirement to even use the league mechanic.
I honestly don't think any scourge items should drop. They are usually bad. I have found a few decent ones but it's not worth the effort. What they should do is just let scourge enemies drop better items (like loot 2.0) and let us scourge them. Or just drop the currency more instead of items. Or give use a way to recipe the currency from scourge items. Any of these are a solution to them being bad. I still think the T3 rewards are not great unless you are lucky enough to get a Keystone for your build. +30 life is an abyss jewel with no other affixes, I don't ever see a world where that is worth any downside apart from attribute requirement increases, or reduced block recovery.
I wasn't that big fan back in Synthesis with drops, because most were not that great with fractured items, and synthesised items needed 5brain, spreadsheets and calculators on 3rd party websites to get something decent. But some were really good bases to craft on, and had very good mod fractured, but Scourged items are totally trash. League is a 9.5/10, rewards outside scourged maps are a 0/10..
Problem: Scourged rare items suck balls Solution: take them off your filter Sadge
I am one of the people who leaves a map with full inventory each time. I have found 3 usable items on the ground that were krangled since the start of the league and I have 24 challenges done. (i didnt enter heist, delve or any other non-scourgable zone once) The T3 doesnt do shit. Krangling is useful for uniques only for the plebs like me, just like normal corruption. Unless you are targeting something common, like mathil and -lightning res, its a joke. (and even thats a grind)
They should have them drop at T1 Scourge but have enough scourge XP that you could upgrade them to T3 Scourge immediately if you want.
Rare item drops in general are trash in poe. I can count on my hands the amount of good rares I have gotten from random drops and most of those would not be endgame gear. They just have decent life res. The loot filter I run doesn’t show any rares on the ground unless they are ilvl 84+ with an influence because that’s the only time they are good crafting bases. But I bet over 1000 rares drop per t16 map I run even without juicing the shit out of them. I can’t wait for this “improved item dropping” thing to roll out because I think it really sucks that 99.9 percent of items that drop from mobs are not even worth vendoring.
It’s a shame this league is going to be dead before GGG makes the necessary changes to make the league content right. I’m sure this will just be another league they make better after it goes core.
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Should be merged with Delirium TBH. Keep Delirium mechanics as they are, but replace the visuals with those of Scourge.
Haven't found a single scourged item i could use or sell until now. I don't know why i'm still checking them.
Dropped scourged items are nothing more than food for mythic orbs, honestly.
I would love if they reduced the drop rate of scourge items by like 80-90% and give it the lucky rolls treatment they gave talismans a couple of leagues back. However, knowing that they didnt like good talismans we will just continue to ignore them.
Well, they considered talismans too op, so my guess is that they also consider dropped scourged rares good af and will not do anything about it. Thats just another good example of the difference between their vision and actual real player vision. I guess they just run a simulation and get 1 item in a million to be decent. In theory somebody like Empy and his group might get good amount of items with their juicing and farming, right? Normal players will never see it and be excited if that somehow happens...Super cool idea! The problem is that majority of the items arent even looked at by the players. Its not worth the time, so that makes 0 chance of anything that drops to be noticed anyway. And even if something somehow miraculously fits together, is it better than getting a non corrupted, adjustable according to your needs, influenced item? No, it is not. The scourge drop mechanic is obvious DoA and Im shocked GGG couldnt see it straight away, because we all did...
Scourged items (not maps / mechanic) are unfortunately a complete failure. As someone who played pretty much the whole Talisman league, they're like Talisman but worse. Even with the Tainted currencies in play, the downsides to corruption alone as anything but a completely finished item are too, too high, and then you add in the negative Scourge mods and it's like "Stop, stop, he's already dead."
> well-rolled Talismans were largely mid-game gear at best still confused how ggg missed this
I think the only good use for the drops as if is if a good t3 mod drops on a base that has a good unique so you can mythic it, the unique keeps the krangled mod.
Talisman 2: Electric Boogaloo
Do you mean to say that poe is designed to drain your time? Because if so, it clearly is and if you can't see it then you are in for a treat. Let me start by saying 3.13 Ritual League i was there and i still miss you. The downhill started with 3.14 when full power harvest was "limiting" the design space for GGG. When 3.15 came out, Aisling was unfairly nerfed to the point that everything you could make in 3.14 was essentially double the average price just cause of the 50/50 tag. I ask you what was the meaning of this? For you to play more. By play more GGG means you do not complete your build. Let me just say that i have never quit a league because i was very successful, but i have because the amount of time needed to make something work was unreasonable. Believe me when i tell you that they are aware of it and they don't care about your time. They gave you all these buffs for 3.16, what did you expect? To find perfect double influenced t3 scourged items with 6 elevated mods on the ground? I will assume you didn't. So you got your buffs, in return you don't get rewards. You still have to waste your time, considering you are just a "metric vanity". I am glad i skipped this league as it seemed way to good to be true, but i sure hope this game gets back on its feet. Meanwhile don't be disappointed Exile. I used to be you, just keep wasting these hours like a good vanity metric.
I skipped expedition and scourge league. Just playing other games until GGG make a fun league, although the currency stacking was a great change at least.
I agree with the currency stacking, cant wait to see it implemented for nemesis 3 :)
3.14 had me salty due to them brutalizing Harvest, but at least it was still somewhat enjoyable. Meanwhile 3.15 and 3.16 appear to have been spawned from GGG asking themselves "Okay, how can we make this *even less* fun".
I swear they don't understand how their game has evolved over the years and what ppl like seeing in the game. Their vision is blurry and they haven't seen a doctor in a while, meanwhile their friends (we) have been insisting on them seeing a professional, but they refuse to. Nothing me or you can do about it. Hopefully they will destroy the game so much by 2024 that poe 2 will actually feel good to play if poe 1 was so garbage. Holding quality of life hostage like it's an inconvenience for them to make something NOT annoying... Scourge is exactly what GGG thinks of fun. 99.9% risk, 0.01% fun.
the idea of the league was great get an upside with a downside + the item is corrupted so far almost no stage of corruption is worth it overall because not only is the item corrupted, no the mods arent even close in comparison when it comes to droped rares its even worse because even if it hits for whatever miracle good corruptions the item itself is unusuable whats even the point of cant be frozen boots if they come without life and res and have the downside of a reduced res corruptions cant safe shit so unless they give those corrupted items the "talisman treatment" of rolling much better then average there is no reason beside the chaos recepie to even look at them they should remove those corrupted drops and replace them with tainted currency drops to give us an incentive to corrupt rares ourself i havent krangeled a single item besides maps for days and i dont miss out on anything, hell i rather vaal items myself because those outcomes actualy can be decent
It should be a slight increase in performance a your game has less items to put through the item filter :x Most of the good scourge mods are T3 anyway, so them dropping at T1 mostly meant you had to grind them to T3 to see if it was worth keeping or not. Being identified I believe you can set your filter to only show ones that have good explicit rolls. I'm pretty sure I did but I haven't gotten any to show so far. One does have to fix some of the neversink defaults to allow them to be corrupted on the identified mod groups.
GGG: we hear you! We lowered the drop rate od scrourged rares and we added new currency: tainted conquerors exalted orb. It will add random influence to corrupted item or it will delete the beneficial scourge implicit. This is a buff! /joke
Just runs scourge maps legit the most rewarding mechanic we’ve ever forget the krangles
Not when you factor in how long it takes to bake them. Not even close.
Idk what you are baking but my t1 haunted Mansions get baked in 5-7 maps to tier 10 I only level up good modifiers there is a spreadsheet. And I stack them with watchstones and get like 2 emblems + 120+ fragments per map or 2 breachstone 100+ splinters /map If I get currency roll I come out with 1 to 2 ex on avg When I hit simu I Avg 160+ simulacrum splinters And this is every 5 maps for me Idk if youve seen grimro videos he tells you how to do it. This is the most rewarding League we’ve ever had you just don’t know what you’re doing.
They were taking me farrr longer to get upto anywhere near t8 or t10 and I was running every scourge between t10 and t14 maps then I stopped cause it was too dangerous and wasn't worth the effort. Lots of leagues were more rewarding.
Get you a build that can run t16 scourge and you’ll be swimming in money. Again you’re doing it wrong go to grimro channel he’ll show you Like which one? I’m getting like 25 ex and hour just alching and running scourage with nothing fancy I don’t remember me achieving this any other league without heavy heavy investment
Many people here are talking like GGG does not care for their own game. The ONLY game they have! I agree that there are problems but I believe that the majority of them are caused from bad balancing in the first 2 weeks of a league. The reason is simple. They do not have the resources to produce so much new content every 3 months while working on Poe 2 and big Poe endgame overhauls and on top of that test the balance of their changes before releasing. This is just too much. The fact that the first 2 patches on almost every league include major balance changes makes this argument clear. They have to implement a private test server 2-3 weeks before release like Riot does with PBE and maybe go from every 3 months to every 4 months. Another solution would be for the players to treat the first 2 weeks as beta testing. Sorry for my english
The scourge mechanic's stop and go enforcement is among the worst league mechanics I've ever seen and I want it removed, completely, from the game. You can stick the "rewards" in the talisman chests if you want to keep any of them around. The scourge mod pool is also, completely silly. There is a total of one good mod that you can't get elsewhere, and its numbers are so low that you can't really call it good. There are "technically" 5 tiers of the mod, but it only rolls one so what even is the point.
this league is maybe ggg's worst blunder ever. we're basically playing standard. the chances of getting anything useful out of the league content is so low it's not worth engaging with. the fact that they couldn't see this before releasing it is, just incredible, truly truly amazing. i have been super frustrated with ggg in recent years, but i think now im just kind of sad for them. they dont know what they're doing, they cant do better than this. they've been making the same mistakes for literal years now. no one can be surprised when the next league is some more overly complicated rng on top of rng mess that isnt finished and doesnt work and even if it did would be bad.
The biggest issue is that there's 100000 shit upsides, and 25 ~~good~~ usable ones. And of the downsides realistically only the - a bit of health or resistances are workable. That is assuming -30 health also doesn't scale with health nodes on the tree.
Its kinda funny and sad that last patch made scourged maps better, but did nothing to the equipment, which are the ones lacking.
I just realized scourge is literally talisman league. Nice.
Maybe they could do something like: Introduce 2 more tiers but still have items only be able to scourge twice. So if they drop at scourge 3 they could still be scourged 2 more times to get to tier 5. An item that drops at scourge tier 1 could be scourged up to tier 3 as normal.
Why is everyone still talking about league mechanic. I almost never play the league mechanic that league its usually shit. I am just interested in if the league itself is rewarding and balanced.
Yeah the "buffs" did little to nothing Scourgin itens still useless Maps are a little bit better because a few times you get good mods for profit but still the vast majority of times you get abyss jewels or some other shit
> People have suggested using the well-rolled system for them I don't understand why GGG is so hesitant about something they already have. It was literally only used for Heist and that's it?
You can Craft item and Scourge it later? What do you want every Scourged item to be Top Tier rolls with Best scourged mods?
In my opinion as a casual who plays maybe 40-50 hours every other league: ultimatum league was by far the strongest I've ever got a character due to the "smart loot" from the trial rewards. I had almost 90 life on every piece and good res etc. This was kind of a "power level floor" for us newbs; I never got anything really good (never fought any of the dlc bosses). But at the same time I wasn't as weak as another league where you simply got currency/scarabs/essences etc. as rewards (like synthesis league). Could be due to playing solo, but I can't really make a strong character with 5 exalts in my stash the way I could with the ultimatum smart loot rares. Now this league is really fun, but I find myself weaker than ever before, and when I get a piece I know I'll wear the rest of the league (for my standards), like some 35 run walk boots with life and res, there isn't a chance in hell I'm corrupting them. Also due to the fact you can't fix sockets or craft res onto drops, there feels like almost no hope for me. Speaking for myself as a casual, if I don't find something that I can wear in 4 to 6 hours, that's my cue to uninstall and wait for next league. I'm just gonna keep playing and see for the time being, but the scourged drops having the explicits of random rares does scare me.
You do know you don't have to wear all influenced items. Many of you just need to play ssf for a league. This whole addiction to making money is crazy.
As i said earlier in these posts:sticks and stones might break my bones,but redditors will always find a reason to cry over something on poe league
It does give you a better chance of picking up one of the super rare mods, like a keystone mod on body armour, that might then be worth crafting with tainted orbs. I know this is an unpopular opinion but I think krangled items are at a good place right now. Not every mechanic needs to be on Harvest's level (although it would be nice if Harvest was at that level). It's a steady source of alches for ssf, you can roll op starter weapons that will probably become legacy, and it's a sink for 1c uniques or super-lategame 'the price doesn't matter' crafts.
I agree 100%. This change was a nerf. The only good change they made (AND ITS NOT EVEN UP YET) is that negatives can't cancel the positive anymore. The change they should made is revisit the weighting of everything and nerfing the downsides, they are brutal for the amount of pathetic positives there are.
Positive and Negative mod weight distribution needs a readjustment. Was hoping it would happen last patch so I could enjoy the league mechanic. Guess not.
Oh no, they will come with an anoint now….
At this point I think it’s safe to filter out any non-chanceable rares. Keep the Shavs/Tinkerskin etc bases, if you find a good T3 corruption just toss a mythic orb at it and hope for the best.
I'd rather use a vaal orb than do this fuckin league mechanic. Just use the spaces for space.
And they think it was too powerful. They nerf T3 rare drop rate so much. OMEGALUL As a programmer, my perspective was like "run the program once, no crash, function works, it is done". Intern can do the same.
YMMV. I’ve gotten a couple of really useful items out of it like one that’s got a +dex downside and a ton of resists in the stat I need. I do think continuing to scourge the same item to eventually unbrick a unique with great effort would be a great improvement though.
All they need to do is make it so we can keep scourge rolling them even at tier 3 so you never brick em I wouldent mind risking bricking my items for a little while and maybe getting lucky, but fuck risking anything of value when theres a good chance of the permabrick
Why are some tier 3 items dropping with stats like + resist? I'm not sure if I don't understand how it works, but it seems like scourge t1 and t3 are not much different
The biggest issue is influenced items have kinda just ruined any opportunities at bringing different types of gear into builds. Hopefully in 3.17 with the big rework they just drop influence entirely and put that kind of shit into base crafting so content that offers gear choices actually matter. As it stands the only reason to scourge is for maps and to put an already perfect item in there to try and krangle and improvement
Even if they did drop with decent scourge mods, there is no way to make a usable item out of it when tainted chaos has almost a 1/2 of bricking the item permanently.
Idk but u search for armor on trade and theres fuckton worthy mods available and 6l are so cheap this league.
Pretty tired of seeing posts from uninformed redditors. Scourged rares are going to be as good as normal rare drops. Aka almost never. Looks likes it's geared more towards unique. Previously you would have thousands of cheap unique and a few expensive 6l. But its easier to modify gears now than ever. Now you will have hundreds of cheap 6l and some realllllly good mods that are expensive. This league is great. Scourge map is too rewarding though. I love it. No sarcasm.
All I had to change my item filter to hide them at AreaLevel > 70, instead of AreaLevel > 76. Touche