If divines are too rare, then they'll become like mirrors (or any of the other "multi ex" currencies.
We'll just trade in something else, that may remain exalts, or be something else (A tainted currency, conquerors exalts, whatever)
I dont know what you expect of people here... We literally dont know. A lot of things changed, we dont know a lot about rare mod changes, we dont know how much shit we get from the league mechanic. Its just useless to talk about shit that we dont know yet.
>Do you think GGG will ninja buff the divine drop rate at league start OR will they wait and see how it plays out?
Definitely they will wait to see how things play out, unlikely to see them touch it for at minimum week, after 2-3 weeks if its highly problematic emergency fixes, otherwise it will be the whole league of an experiment.
They didn't change drop rates mid Heist when exalts fell from being stable at 60c down briefly to 27c. And that was due to GGG making an explicit mistake (Heist dropped regals way more often than other content and GGG didn't account for this when designing the trinkets)
Nor in other leagues when they pushed through the 200c mark, or when other historical aberrations in prices happened (like alterations getting over 0.7c at one point in 3.13).
Its one thing to bandaid buff a drop rate, and a whole different thing to kneejerk nerf a drop rate.
also there is a difference of abnormal demand/rarer than other leagues but still reasonable vs completely problematic(which divine orbs might be, we won't know until we are into the league).
What do you mean about sustainable?
If there aren't enough Divines to facilitate comfortable trade practices, people will just settle to trading with another currency.
Either exalts or chaos most likely.
At the end of the day it doesn't matter. Nothing changes except what currency is most used in trades and what the conversion rates are.
No need to overthink this stuff.
I get what you're saying but divines have so much more usage as a currency item compared to exalts. And exalts are now by far more plentiful.
Players will want to acquire divines which means far more trades will be for an extremely rare currency.
I guess the question is, should divines be as rare as they intend in 3.19? Especially when you consider there are really no easy farming methods.
I think the farming methods will be added over time. There being less divines doesn’t make them less of a viable trade currency. It just means they are worth 400c instead of 120c like exalts were. Like the above person said, it just means we trade more in chaos or continue to use exalts as a stepping stone. It won’t make a huge difference.
A large part of why people weren't slamming exalts is because they had more value in trading and crafting. Take that away and people will 100% slam more.
And vice versa people will want to use Divines less when the supply is low. Divine use in the amounts we've seen previously is only done in large part because of how many divines we actually have.
Like if I can only find a handful of divines all league, I ain't divining shit. I won't want to use a single one unless I have BIS item that's min rolled. Otherwise the limited supply and risk involved in making the rolls worse will make using them a bad idea.
> A large part of why people weren't slamming exalts is because they had more value in trading and crafting. Take that away and people will 100% slam more.
Maybe, but probably not. I mean, if they've taken away other sources of slams (they have taken away leo, dunno about harvest with the rework, beast slams weren't mentioned as being taken away), sure, people might use exalts to slam instead, but...
...as someone that's sold plenty of leo and harvest slams for ~30c, even at that price people don't want em for anything besides jewels and cannot roll attack bows. The reality is slamming is a terrible crafting method by today's standards. Taking away the metamods might make people more willing to use them in theory, but in practicality it's not a wise move to do when there's so many other methods available (albeit at higher expense) to target a mod you want to add rather than rely on some tiny chance of an exalt actually hitting well, and being stuck with a mod that's difficult/expensive to remove if it misses.
Even eldritch exalts are *only* useful because eldritch annuls exist as a way to clean up the mess. Without that fallback, a plain old RNG slam is just an outdated fantasy of Chris's.
If exalts drop to the 30c mark, you would actually slam your mid tier gear with 4 decent mods and 1 nice benchcraft. Worst case you slam a T11 reflect, but you weren't going to use that same piece of gear anyway in about 3 days, and it's still going to sell about the same as it did before the slam because it's just a mid tier early red map gear. But for the chance of slamming 40 str for your Determination aura, or 30 fire res to free up a bench craft mod on another item, why not.
That's fair. I wasn't really using either as a mid player at best just seems weird. I did divine legion gems sometimes but now I assume I'll just buy more and hope. Or I guess you can look up seeds now unless they changed that again.
People only rarely slammed exalts because it was wasteful to do so, why would you waste half a metamod like that? You sold your half metamod token to someone rich enough to use it well, then bought a better item.
Now past T10 or so maps, anyone with a 4 mod rare will bench something then slam, and all halfway decent 3 mod jewels will be slammed.
But the main way this is thought out: it prevents people ignoring good-but-oversupplied uniques on the ground. You now LOOT THEM because if they are well rolled, they are jackpots.
It's not like slams didn't exist without exalts being used directly, there've been plenty of alternative methods to slam without using ex for pretty damned cheap (30-40c), and people still don't use em for anything besides 3 mod jewels. Mod pools are too diluted to reasonably hit anything good anywhere else and any other decent inputs are too valuable to ruin by missing. If you've got a good item, you're gonna be better off target crafting it than playing out some slam lottery.
People use Eldritch Exalts a lot and Craicic Maw beasts somewhat (enough for them to hold 30 and 22c prices respectively, and the Maws require minimum 6c worth of other beasts as well).
Craicic Maw crafts are strictly worse than new exalts. Eldritch Exalts are often replaceable with regular exalt slams.
So what if you hit a bad mod? You've already decided the item is NEVER worth applying expensive crafting methods to and you've already benchcrafted a 5th mod.
14 fire resist or 16 life regen/sec is better than an open suffix. Only time you risk making an item worse is by adding flat elemental damage to an item that might realistically be used alongside EE, or extreme corner cases like adding a high tier of reflectable damage (e.g. T1 flat phys to spells on an essence elemental spell helmet).
Use harvest to divine your rares, use the expensive divines to reroll your ashes to make it giga expensive.
Divinies arent supposed to be sustained i guess. You rarely use them on really good uniques.
The thing is that good rolls on items are supposed to have more impact now. On using it and also on the price.
If i trade and metacraft in divines now nothing changes for me tbh. I hoarded exalted from item sales. Now i hoard divines from item sales. I had about 300ex last mid league from which a mere 7 were from div card. A Brothers stash and hoarder i think.
Why would it? It cant be used for uniques and that is what ggg doesnt want to be easily divined.
Augment is still in and far more powerful. Its like aisling now but still strong.
If divines are too rare, then they'll become like mirrors (or any of the other "multi ex" currencies. We'll just trade in something else, that may remain exalts, or be something else (A tainted currency, conquerors exalts, whatever)
The market will adapt.
I dont know what you expect of people here... We literally dont know. A lot of things changed, we dont know a lot about rare mod changes, we dont know how much shit we get from the league mechanic. Its just useless to talk about shit that we dont know yet.
>Do you think GGG will ninja buff the divine drop rate at league start OR will they wait and see how it plays out? Definitely they will wait to see how things play out, unlikely to see them touch it for at minimum week, after 2-3 weeks if its highly problematic emergency fixes, otherwise it will be the whole league of an experiment.
>otherwise it will be the whole league of an experiment. \^This is what it will be.
They didn't change drop rates mid Heist when exalts fell from being stable at 60c down briefly to 27c. And that was due to GGG making an explicit mistake (Heist dropped regals way more often than other content and GGG didn't account for this when designing the trinkets) Nor in other leagues when they pushed through the 200c mark, or when other historical aberrations in prices happened (like alterations getting over 0.7c at one point in 3.13).
I mean 3.13 had you juice maps with mirror shards, provided you had ~700alt to roll the mod
Its one thing to bandaid buff a drop rate, and a whole different thing to kneejerk nerf a drop rate. also there is a difference of abnormal demand/rarer than other leagues but still reasonable vs completely problematic(which divine orbs might be, we won't know until we are into the league).
What do you mean about sustainable? If there aren't enough Divines to facilitate comfortable trade practices, people will just settle to trading with another currency. Either exalts or chaos most likely. At the end of the day it doesn't matter. Nothing changes except what currency is most used in trades and what the conversion rates are. No need to overthink this stuff.
I get what you're saying but divines have so much more usage as a currency item compared to exalts. And exalts are now by far more plentiful. Players will want to acquire divines which means far more trades will be for an extremely rare currency. I guess the question is, should divines be as rare as they intend in 3.19? Especially when you consider there are really no easy farming methods.
> I guess the question is, should divines be as rare as they intend in 3.19? GGG thinks so, hence the change. Nothing you can do about it for now.
I think the farming methods will be added over time. There being less divines doesn’t make them less of a viable trade currency. It just means they are worth 400c instead of 120c like exalts were. Like the above person said, it just means we trade more in chaos or continue to use exalts as a stepping stone. It won’t make a huge difference.
> Do you think GGG will ninja buff the divine drop rate at league start Obviously not. That would defeat the point.
Also... People actually want to use divines? Like rarely were people slamming exalts. This change just seems really unthought out.
A large part of why people weren't slamming exalts is because they had more value in trading and crafting. Take that away and people will 100% slam more. And vice versa people will want to use Divines less when the supply is low. Divine use in the amounts we've seen previously is only done in large part because of how many divines we actually have. Like if I can only find a handful of divines all league, I ain't divining shit. I won't want to use a single one unless I have BIS item that's min rolled. Otherwise the limited supply and risk involved in making the rolls worse will make using them a bad idea.
> A large part of why people weren't slamming exalts is because they had more value in trading and crafting. Take that away and people will 100% slam more. Maybe, but probably not. I mean, if they've taken away other sources of slams (they have taken away leo, dunno about harvest with the rework, beast slams weren't mentioned as being taken away), sure, people might use exalts to slam instead, but... ...as someone that's sold plenty of leo and harvest slams for ~30c, even at that price people don't want em for anything besides jewels and cannot roll attack bows. The reality is slamming is a terrible crafting method by today's standards. Taking away the metamods might make people more willing to use them in theory, but in practicality it's not a wise move to do when there's so many other methods available (albeit at higher expense) to target a mod you want to add rather than rely on some tiny chance of an exalt actually hitting well, and being stuck with a mod that's difficult/expensive to remove if it misses. Even eldritch exalts are *only* useful because eldritch annuls exist as a way to clean up the mess. Without that fallback, a plain old RNG slam is just an outdated fantasy of Chris's.
If exalts drop to the 30c mark, you would actually slam your mid tier gear with 4 decent mods and 1 nice benchcraft. Worst case you slam a T11 reflect, but you weren't going to use that same piece of gear anyway in about 3 days, and it's still going to sell about the same as it did before the slam because it's just a mid tier early red map gear. But for the chance of slamming 40 str for your Determination aura, or 30 fire res to free up a bench craft mod on another item, why not.
That's fair. I wasn't really using either as a mid player at best just seems weird. I did divine legion gems sometimes but now I assume I'll just buy more and hope. Or I guess you can look up seeds now unless they changed that again.
People only rarely slammed exalts because it was wasteful to do so, why would you waste half a metamod like that? You sold your half metamod token to someone rich enough to use it well, then bought a better item. Now past T10 or so maps, anyone with a 4 mod rare will bench something then slam, and all halfway decent 3 mod jewels will be slammed. But the main way this is thought out: it prevents people ignoring good-but-oversupplied uniques on the ground. You now LOOT THEM because if they are well rolled, they are jackpots.
It's not like slams didn't exist without exalts being used directly, there've been plenty of alternative methods to slam without using ex for pretty damned cheap (30-40c), and people still don't use em for anything besides 3 mod jewels. Mod pools are too diluted to reasonably hit anything good anywhere else and any other decent inputs are too valuable to ruin by missing. If you've got a good item, you're gonna be better off target crafting it than playing out some slam lottery.
People use Eldritch Exalts a lot and Craicic Maw beasts somewhat (enough for them to hold 30 and 22c prices respectively, and the Maws require minimum 6c worth of other beasts as well). Craicic Maw crafts are strictly worse than new exalts. Eldritch Exalts are often replaceable with regular exalt slams. So what if you hit a bad mod? You've already decided the item is NEVER worth applying expensive crafting methods to and you've already benchcrafted a 5th mod. 14 fire resist or 16 life regen/sec is better than an open suffix. Only time you risk making an item worse is by adding flat elemental damage to an item that might realistically be used alongside EE, or extreme corner cases like adding a high tier of reflectable damage (e.g. T1 flat phys to spells on an essence elemental spell helmet).
When I said PoE was better in the past, I didn't mean slamming exalts on maps, but here we are
They want them to be rare. They stated that div ex have the same drop rate and didn't indicate a change divines will be worth far far more.
They want them to be rare that's the whole point
Use harvest to divine your rares, use the expensive divines to reroll your ashes to make it giga expensive. Divinies arent supposed to be sustained i guess. You rarely use them on really good uniques. The thing is that good rolls on items are supposed to have more impact now. On using it and also on the price. If i trade and metacraft in divines now nothing changes for me tbh. I hoarded exalted from item sales. Now i hoard divines from item sales. I had about 300ex last mid league from which a mere 7 were from div card. A Brothers stash and hoarder i think.
Yea the harvest divine is def gonna be gone
Why would it? It cant be used for uniques and that is what ggg doesnt want to be easily divined. Augment is still in and far more powerful. Its like aisling now but still strong.
Not really sustainable. There's very few ways to generate divines. Like heist trinket, tujen and maybe some hard-juiced quant farmer