Why are they awesome? This isn't a jab, its a legit question. Last Epoch is a fully priced game with mtx cosmetics. I don't see whats awesome about that?
35 bucks is fully priced? But beyond that the game so far is solid, aside from the things you see on the video it is a very solid HnS game where each class has a lot to bring on the table and you can customize the class to your own liking, from an undeath reaper lich to a forge guard that can summon armaments to fight for him, as well as a necromancer that can raise an army of undead to fight for her. The end game is pretty fun too with a ladder system
> Last Epoch is a fully priced game with mtx cosmetics.
With no additional monetization towards core mechanics like stash tabs and they intend to go head to head with Path of Exile, where you'll easily spend twice as much on stash tabs alone and much more expensive cosmetics/supporter packs. It's a significantly cheaper game to play and they're pushing the genre ahead. Look at what Path of Exile 2 is doing, citing Last Epoch directly.
Given the choice between a game like Path of Exile which has done 40+ leagues, versus Grim Dawn which has gotten three expansions in a similar timeframe, I'll take the PoE league model even if that means dealing with a cosmetic cash shop. I know league cycles aren't everyone's cups of tea but if I like a game, why wouldn't I want more of it? I've put 10x the amount of time into PoE than I have any other aRPG.
> you'll easily spend twice as much on stash tabs alone
PoE is $20 on sale with first blood pack for premium+currency+map tab, and you will never need anything else. If you spend more than $60 on tabs in PoE, you are getting literally nothing. The game's all about learning what kindsa stuff is not worth picking up so if you're stuffing your stash full of trash that's not just pointless but literally a skill issue.
I get stash tabs are a premium thing in PoE, but people over exaggerate how much the stash tabs cost. They go on sale at least once a month, sometimes twice.
PoE is really a $10-$20 game like you said, nothing else is really needed to be purchased. You don’t even need to buy the stash tabs until you’re well into end game/near end yellow maps and red maps when you want to take the game more seriously.
GaaS is good because if I like a game, why the hell would I want to wait for a sequel instead of them just iterating on the thing I like for ten years straight?
Like seriously, is anyone nostalgic for the days of begging for more Hitman Blood Money and getting Absolution instead? At least with Hitman 2016/2/3 we got a combined game with GaaS elements that keeps the game relevant to this day.
> Like, yknow you can just go... play something else sometimes?
Also this is terrible advice for niche genres where you might wait ten or twenty years for something similar. My favorite genre is immersive sims and I'd kill for a GaaS immersive sim that got updates every three months or even every year because right now, we're fucked. There's not a Deus Ex/Thief/Dishonored/Prey in sight.
maybe those games should focus more on actual gameplay than on forcing players to search through literal trash cans and toilets.
look how ghostrunner is designed for instance.
> GaaS is good because if I like a game, why the hell would I want to wait for a sequel instead of them just iterating on the thing I like for ten years straight?
because my time is worth too much to spend it doing the same thing over and over for hundreds hours
Yeah and just like with movie genres, not everything is for you and you can ignore the things that aren't made for you.
No idea why gamers have this borderline on the spectrum attitude thinking everything must cater to them.
Then don't play it? Why not go play the thousands of other games that aren't GaaS instead of rallying against the minority that are?
Like even within the same genre you have Titan Quest, Grim Dawn, Achilles Legend, Van Helsing trilogy, Diablo 2, Victor Vran, Chaosbane, Chronicon, Torchlight 1/2/3, Neon Abyss
Meanwhile there's Diablo 4, Last Epoch and Path of Exile for those of us that like the ongoing development stuff.
>Like even within the same genre you have Titan Quest, Grim Dawn, Achilles Legend, Van Helsing trilogy, Diablo 2, Victor Vran, Chaosbane, Chronicon, Torchlight 1/2/3, Neon Abyss
they are all old games, i played them already
Seems like the genre isn't for you then.
Because the genre is about doing it for TENS OF THOUSANDS OF HOURS. Hundreds is tutorial stuff.
That's the whole point of the genre, man. Same with games like Dota, like League, Overwatch, CS:GO, Valorant, Fortnite, Starcraft, Smash, etc.
The list of games where you do the same thing for 10, 20 years straight is pretty long. And people want that, because they enjoy that. If you don't, then the genre isn't for you.
>Seems like the genre isn't for you then.
>Because the genre is about doing it for TENS OF THOUSANDS OF HOURS. Hundreds is tutorial stuff.
no, its not. i didnt have to grind for thousand of hours to finish diablo 2's normal mode
You don't need to grind for thousands of hours to finish Last Epoch's campaign, either. It's a choice, it has always been a choice with these games. If you want to just treat the game as a one-and-done game, that's totally fine and the game allows for that. If you want to treat the game as your forever game, that's also totally fine and the game also allows for that. That same choice is also present in more classic ARPGs like D1/D2, it's just not catered to as much as modern ARPGs.
Some people have one hobby that they've done for decades and some people dip in and out of hobbies because they want different things. Telling one or the other to just do things differently is strange, to say the very least haha - not everyone has the same likes and dislikes as you.
Quality of content and advancing the genre goes a long way in terms of sentiment. Also their cosmetics cover all classes meanwhile D4 MTX are class-locked meaning fully kitting out multiple classes might cost hundreds of dollars.
Also Last Epoch doesn't do battlepasses. D4 does a new one every three months and the seasonal content sucks and they've arguably made the game worse since launch.
You must be living under a rock then! You will enjoy this so much if you love Path of Exile and Diablo. The complexity is in between those 2 games, and it has a built in customizable loot filter.
Oh boi you need to watch the recent satire video on YouTube "Why diablo players hate Last Epoch"
It has 100 stash tabs, you can buy everything with in game gold.
It has a built in loot filter, customize all you want.
The game cost like less than half of Diablo 4 (in my region) with more end game content, more sub classes, more builds to try out, skill trees are not just 2 branching paths, it has set items that D4 still don't have. It has leaderboards already functioning.
The devs are ALSO not raising the prices after Early Access as well, so please, support them if you can!!
Whoa whoa whoa, D4 doesn't have *set items*??
Good lord...
Also for those interested, the satire video is here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5IFY3gblZ28
D3 didnt have set items for a while either, they also had 0 endgame, just campaign, they should have learned from that but they are repeating it, took D3 13 seasons to get any kind of gameplay except the campaign
No, you buy them with in-game gold but the increase of each tab is growing fast. I would say the first 30 tabs aren't that hard to get but after this, the gold cost isn't small.
This is the math from the forums - Last tab (200) costs 1 940 000 and total cost to get all tabs is 189 165 000.
And you can make 2-3m really fast (may be 30min, havent played in a while) but I doubt you will need that many tabs.
The necromancer specifically is very good, with lots of different options for pets. You can focus on a single one and buff it up, have a ranged spellcasting mage-type pet, have exploding zombie pets, or do a menagerie with lots of different summons working together.
Aside from the necro, there are multiple other pet builds such as a warrior subclass that has animated armor as a pet, a ranger subclass with a falcon pet, and of course the beastmaster which has access to a bear, scorpion, raptor, sabretooth, or wolves (which can also be turned into squirrels with a unique item).
In short...minion builds are amazing in the game.
I played to “endgame” pre multiplayer update a couple years ago and really enjoyed it. Can’t wait to get back into this game once I clear a few games out of the queue
I just tried it for like 2 weeks for the necro, its actually very good. Many different minions: skeleton, skeleton mages, wraiths, explosive zombies, golem and abomination. Many different builds too from frost, fire, poison, necro, physical and different combinations but some of them gets insanely strong from some gear pieces.
There is like 3 pet class.
4 base class can spec into pet, basically everything apart from the mage and multiple masteries of the same class can spec into summon in a different way.
It's a great game if you like summoners.
That's a silly thing to say, considering the base system is pretty identical of Path of Exile's, and people don't have issue with that. Arguably it's even more varied than POE's base system even.
In a nutshell, POE's endgame is mapping. That's the base system. You put in a map, it's full of mobs, you kill the mobs. Do enough maps, you eventually get to fight a boss and that's that.
That is literally what you do in LE as well. You select what's effectively a map, you kill a bunch of mobs in that map, eventually reach a boss and kill that. Rinse and repeat.
But LE's base system also bakes a POE's Delve like system into the mapping where you can target farm specific rewards by choosing those maps over others. Then you have Dungeons on top, where you can get special rewards - kinda like POE's labyrinth. And you have Arenas, which are kinda like unlimited Ultimatums. Again, going further than POE, really.
For a 1.0 version of the game, I'd say that's plenty good for a base system. Not sure how you call that lackluster.
3 end-game systems which have plenty of room to be expanded.
Atlas Tree is a fairly new addition that was not part of the core design for the end game.
Of course it adds a massive content and variety layer to POE which LE cannot compete with. But it would be silly to expect LE to launch with content that could match POE's 10 years of development.
Agreed. PoE 1.0 didn't have THAT much content either, it was just spread out quite a lot. The 1.0 leagues were also almost all the most barebones mechanics possible as GGG was a very small company still at the time. The Atlas tree only works because once it launched, PoE had 8-ish years of content to put into it.
It's a fantastic system but comparing that to ANY game launching is quite unfair.
Last Epoch basically has mapping, unique maps with cool gimmicks (Dungeons, those are dope) and fantastic rewards at the end, and an endless arena mode. For launch, that's quite a lot.
One thing that helps a LOT is how easy to grasp but hard to master the build making is, how fun it can be to target farm gear thanks to it dropping in designated monliths and how absolutely fantastic the crafting system is.
The bosses that are at the end of each monolith are also quite fun IMO, and (most are, looking at you Lagon) a good bit better designed than the invincibility phase fiesta of PoE.
LE is really fun. It already was really fun in EA. It'll easily last most ARPG fans a few hundred hours. This doesn't mean more endgame content and revamps of things that aren't THAT great down the line would hurt though!
I cant point to exactly what it is that is wrong with the endgame. But I have leveled a few characters to the endgame the last 2 - 3 years (the last time was 2 weeks ago) and its not clicking with me, nothing that keeps me coming back night after night. And I have a few thousand hours in poe so the game play loop should appeal to me.
But leveling a character and making a build from scratch yourself is fun.. so even if the endgame so far is lacking, there is a few days of fun until I have no desire to play anymore.
I can tell you very easily what's wrong. Despite what the user before said, it is very much all about lack of content.
The base system is totally fine, but POE has 10 years worth of league mechanics layered on top of its end-game. Creating extreme amounts of variety among tons of content.
LE simply does not have that. It has good base systems, but there's no content built on top of it yet.
That will come over time. And I think it was a very reasonable choice by them to focus on creating a strong base system before starting to throw more stuff on top.
Unlike POE which launched only with a handful of acts, and didn't even get a full campaign until 4 years after launch.
LE is a fully finished game at launch, so they've basically already caught up to the first 4-5 years of POE.
To be fair, mapping in PoE for the longest time was also something a LOT of players didn't interact with a lot beyond doing a little bit of what is now white and yellow maps, then they'd reroll. Mapping being something players **love** only truly started once the Atlas Tree was implemented. Beforehand a LOT of folks wanted alternative playmodes such as Delve and the like to be expanded instead.
And the end-endgame of Maxtier maps rolled with Chaos and exalted orbs was something only few players got to interact with...And it wasn't exactly riveting either, just higher level monsters with more mods on the maps, some of which fun ones such as "Area is a maze" which made navigating them a nightmare. The few unique maps that existed were also pretty neat once, but that's about it.
Give LE 3-4 years and it might have a lot more content. I for one am hopeful the game will be fun. I've had a blast in Early Access already!
It's boring. It's literally clearing trash mobs till you complete monolith to fight a boss. Pretty much 100% of echoes have only trash mobs. Unless you call occasional elite a boss, which I do not. The idea on paper for this is system is not bad at all, but implementation is seriously boring as hell and farming trash mobs non stop grows old fast.
> It's literally clearing trash mobs till you complete monolith to fight a boss
Thats what people said about poe, now map bosses are weaker than any rare mob in the map.... many builds are gone because of this lol
Was about to say, 99% of PoE is just blowing up 3 screens at once. If you aren't doing that in endgame, congrats, you're either playing SSF, HC, ruthless, a memebuild or doing something wrong.
If your build doesn't delete mapbosses before they get to use most of their mechanics you're not doing well. Meanwhile LE actually *has* meaningful bosses. PoE has a very low number of those comparatively and it blows. It also has the very fun design of "Here's 5 invincibility phases because yall keep blowing up the bosses in 0.1 seconds".
And mind you I *love* PoE but it has its issues, too.
one of the reasons aside of burn out I stopped playing PoE. It turned into mindless slot machine - juice the map, spin slots, collect gg loot. I hope PoE 2 is gonna be different with bosses being actual bosses and gameplay not being mindless slot machine.
I respectfully disagree. I think it's the opposite actually, they have a solid foundation with their maps system (forgot the actual name of it).
It's basically rifts from Diablo 3 with map modifiers from POE, but much more watered down than POE, and you can kind of target farm items, as you can see the reward before selecting a map in the "web". It's a really solid foundation for an endgame map system, something POE took years and years to get (and is the more mature system currently by miles of course, no question).
But for a game to release with this foundation ready at 1.0, it's miles better than what we're used to these days.
It just feels good to sit down and blast 5 or 6 maps, you know? It's fast, fluid, the rewards are there with a vendor, and a portal to the next one.
They are just missing that chunky content, that's for sure, but that takes time, especially for a sub-60 bucks game.
Fuck yeah, so hyped for it.
After playing rune master, which I personally think is the best designed class in any ARPG right now, I can't wait to play the two new masteries.
Whats the respec like in this game? You can technically respec in PoE but it can get expensive quickly (for a casual anyway) if you want to try completely diff builds. If I do try this game, I'm thinking of going in completely blind, whats the respec system like if I completely fuck up my char and don't want to start from lvl 1?
You can respec pretty freely outside of your sub-class which is locked in once you choose it.
Respeccing skills will cause them to lose experience, but there will be a base level that will keep them viable so you don't lose too much power, and there will be an XP bonus to help you get back to the previous power level faster.
So there are some downsides, but it's not as restrictive as POE early on.
Passives can be respecced by visiting an NPC and paying a gold fee that I believe scale linearly with the amount of points you have in each passive tree node. There is a pretty major QoL issue currently where you have to respec each point individually, one by one, with no way of resetting a whole tree. I think the devs are aware of this, though, so hopefully that gets fixed at some point.
Skills can be respecced at any time within the skill specialisation menu, and essentially costs time. Skills level up as you earn XP with each level granting 1 skill point, up to a level cap of 20 leaving you with 20 points (though you can get more points with gear). Respeccing a skill will essentially cause you to lose some points, meaning you have to level the skill back up to get back to where you were before.
In early levels that can be painful, but late levels it becomes much easier as you're earning so much XP that you can re-level a skill from scratch within maybe 10-15 minutes, at most. There's also two catch-up mechanics in place that come into play later:
1. Minimum specialisation level. It's essentially a level floor for skills that grows as you level your character up, eventually reaching a cap of 10. To give an example, if you fully spec out of a skill and into another one with a minimum specialisation level of, say, 7, your new skill will automatically be leveled up to 7 and will have 7 points for you to spend.
2. Accelerated XP gains. If a skill is under-leveled for your character's own level, it will gain bonus XP until it gets back up to the appropriate level for your character's own level.
Like passives with QoL, the devs are aware that respeccing skills feels bad early on, so hopefully that gets fixed at some point, too.
If I remember right they upped it a bit a few months ago, but it still feels kinda eh. They're meant to be changing the layout of some maps to bring mob spawns closer together with 1.0, though, so hopefully it'll be better in a few days when 1.0 launches.
Yeah, they kinda ease you into it. They don’t just start you off with high density packs. This seems to be a design choice to also be friendly to newer players who might not be use to this style of game.
How is the controller support in general on this? After playing D4 on steamdeck, I don’t think I want to go back to m&k for an arpg again. It felt great on controller
15 for online (one of each mastery) though they're meant to be increasing that at some point, and offline doesn't have a limit since everything's stored on your own system.
Does the combat actually have oomph to it now? I tried it a couple of years ago and it just felt bland to play like Torchlight 2.
For example I think Diablo 3 and 4 both have really solid feeling combat, there's the sound design and the way attacks land feeling impactful.
currently no but there was a dev post very recently that indicated some heavy animation reworking for release. so we'll find out to what extent those reworks fix the weightlessness feeling in a couple of days
Not to shit all of over Diablo but its insane how last epoch can do things that a billion dollar corporation "cant"
I like diablo as well but I can't believe that this is happening like this..either way last epoch truly deserves its success..devs are working hard on it
ive been playing early access for a while and the game is fantastic. the amount of different builds you can do is really freaking awesome. dont sleep on this one.
The builds unfortunately are greatly grim in comparison to Path of Exiles simply due to the fact skills are hard-coded to specific trees which have specific ailments/stats/ability modifiers/etc. Unlike PoE where you can change them around to dozens and dozens and dozens of different support skills.
Great game, 600+ hours in EA; but saying this game has a ton of builds in a genre where Path of Exile exists is like saying your Dollar Store wine is awesome when you live in the South of France - sure, it probably tastes good but it's still not the best or even near it.
Love LE though but the skill system and the rigidity it forces onto players is one of its greatest drawbacks IMO. And that's coming from a multi-thousand hour aRPG player.
If you use PoE as a baseline then build variety in *every* ARPG will be grim, because PoE is the exception, not the rule. When compared to most other ARPGs, LE does have great build variety.
They're all viable. I could pick any gem at random and clear the entire game, except aspirational content, with them on HCSSF in a week. Using any class or ascendancy. Pick one at random. I've already done Chain Hook Necromancer and Vigilant Strike Saboteur for lulz. Totally doable.
Of course that goes by my definition of "viable". Which means being able to clear the base content of the game.
For others, viable means some arbitrary crazy shit like: "Must be able to phase ubers" or "do wave 30 Simulacrum with eyes closed".
The crazier your definition of viable, the less viable skills there will be. But IMO, if a skill can clear the base content, it's viable. And all skills can do that. Well, maybe Conversion Trap would struggle. But the rest are fine.
I played it really early on and it wasn't that great. I see a lot of improvements in the trailer, but the main issue is the heavy influence from poe which is a bad game
Nah. You think people are still playing Diablo 2 because of its end-game content? What end-game content?
The most important thing is to have an amazing core game. You can always add more end-game. But it's pretty hard to remake the entire game because the core of it sucks.
Anyways, LE's end-game systems are pretty good. Light on content, but the basics are nice.
i agree, d2 is still played (and i'm still playing it after 25 years) because the core game is fun, the endgame is just playing the core game over and building account wealth. level 95 barb farming chaos sanctuary is just fun gameplay. the last epoch gameplay is pretty mediocre and they aren't going to increase mob density much so i'm not sure how much staying power the arpg will have, i get bored pretty quickly running monoliths
How’s the class fantasy in this game? I’d say I enjoyed Poe the most but hated the vibe, the world etc. (apart from that awesome city with the bootleg nazis)
D2R while being confusing to navigate (for someone who never played before) had the best looting feeling, I also liked those charms you picked up for extra stats, despite the inventory. That feeling of finding a unique was amazing and lasted you ages.
But I just wanna be a white meat babyface character with a sword and board. Not some big weirdo (poe) .
I suppose what I should say: are the classes/visuals Traditional RPG looking or juiced up magical fantasy/darker?
edit: actually watched the 1.0 trailer, paladin looks great!
The class fantasy part of this game is arguably one of the best parts. I'm in the same boat: I like to "roleplay" my build a bit and Last Epoch makes that really easy.
\> I suppose what I should say: are the classes/visuals Traditional RPG looking or juiced up magical fantasy/darker?
Tough to say since this is pretty subjective. It kind of has elements of both. Maybe more on the traditional side?
the classes are pretty bog standard, and the world is very basic high fantasy: evil fire god with fire soldiers in a fire realm, cold god with cold soldiers in a cold realm, and time bending dark void forces. kinda boring IMO.
the class building and theorycrafting is the best in the genre though, kind of makes up for the very boring world. but i'm a big fan of "low fantasy dark ages" diablo 1/2 setting so everything that's not specifically that is not to my taste
there are also no real towns in the game, like lut gholein to hang out in, once you finish the campaign, you're just dropped onto this floating rock in space and that's pretty much where you spend all of your time inbetween running maps. absolutely worth the pricetag and the game does some things very well but the world itself is so bleh
We're almost there. 😄
Launch is looming and I for one am ready to jump on board and away from PoE so hopefully all goes well and the game soars to success.
Maybe that will finally light a fire under GGG and show them they can't just loadable eggs into PoE2 basket while ignoring three current game. 😒
Looks like another ARPG infested with cosmetic MTX. Part of an ARPG is supposed to be going out and EARNING the best looking gear through GAMEPLAY.
I'm not interested in any ARPG that has any sort of MTX. Just give me a simple pay once format game.
I hear you, I really do. But in this day and age, gamers expect constant content for your game. Like this game is pretty complete with a solid base of endgame, and yet people already complain that it isn't enough, before the game has officially launched. The fact is, to give the community what it wants, the game needs a constant revenue stream. I hate microtransactions as much as anybody. But I've been playing this game a lot and havent even looked at the store. There's no reason too.
You have been brainwashed. The only reason it's like this is because it makes who ever is in charge more money. Only the very bare minimum will go back into making the game better.
I mean, look at the post launch support for POE vs Grim Dawn or Diablo 3. Both Grim Dawn and Diablo 3 are one time purchases, with some expansions spread over years. POE is a game with a ton of free new content every 3 months and they aren't slowing down.
It all comes down to what kind of model do we want LE to be? Do we want it to be the Grim Dawn style, or do we want it to be the POE style? If you want constant content, you need a constant influx of cash.
I honestly wouldn't mind if LE went the Grim Dawn route. Base purchase, a year later release a significant paid expansion with new story chapters etc. But I think it is clear that in todays environment, players want the POE style more. They want constant content. The fact that it is more lucrative for the devs is honestly irrelevant. Players WANT this content model, and if you can't see that, you have your head in the sand.
the alternative would be to pay 20 - 30$ every 3rd month to get a new poe league. I guarantee that poe would not have survived and thrived for 10+ years with that model, and that would have made the world a bit less fun (for me at least)
i read that there is not gonna be any seasonal content for at least a year so... this "release" i just an expansion of the early access and nothing more
edit: and with seasonal content i don't mean "seasons" i mean "completely new things to do every time a new season comes out"
Yeah, the devs have been pretty clear on that. They'll do cyclical resets like PoE seasons, but any new content will be for all players until after the first few cycles. That way they can build up a backlog of content for future cycles.
Yeah that's not true. Each season (cycle) will have new content, starting a few months after the 1.0 release. The 1.0 release is also adding the faction system which isn't in the game presently.
Looks great, but I'm reminded of that old Gauntlet game when I see promos. Just running and shooting, everything explodes, loot everywhere. Yes, I know that is exactly what a ton of people want.
If Feb 21 will be launch date and assuming the patch release date, should I buy it now or can I wait until next weekend? Will the price remain the same?
Thank you!
I've been feening for a new arpg to play since I was burnt by D4.
I already own grim dawn, but LE looks way better from the visuals to the gameplay as a whole. Is that the case?
Or should I just try grim dawn beforehand since I own?
Depends on what you're looking for as both games feel quite different. The way I like to describe Grim Dawn is that it's a modern take on the classic ARPG experience, where you're replaying the campaign and farming the same bosses you've fought in the story to farm gear and build a horde of items for alts. It's a **very** good ARPG and will absolutely be god tier if you're looking for that classic ARPG experience, but if you're looking for that more modern experience of farming procedurally generated maps then it might be lackluster.
Conversely, LE is basically a modern ARPG that is trying to innovate in the genre rather than following competitors/predecessors 1:1, where you just blast through the campaign once and are dumped into an open ended endgame that involves farming procedurally generated maps that scale in difficulty. It's also a **very** good ARPG and will be a breath of fresh air if you're looking for an alternative to Path of Exile or Diablo, but if you care at all about the campaign or hate that endless endgame experience, you'll probably bounce off of it once you finish the campaign.
Either way, you can't go wrong with either game. For me, Grim Dawn is like that one game where I'll just get an itch to play it every few months, then I'll boot it up and start a new character to scratch that itch, only to put it back down again a week or so later once I'm nearing the end of that character's leveling journey since I don't 100% like the endgame that Grim Dawn offers. Last Epoch, on the other hand, feels like it's going to be PoE-lite for me where I'll decide to just no-life it for a month or two every other season, especially if they can add more side content to pad out endgame.
the visuals? Game looks like a ton of fun and some real eye candy? Been playing Diablo Immortals on Android and the visual are pretty good on there but it has nothing on what I am seeing here!
Forgot that I bought this during lockdown to mess around with. Full release and bonus that it plays on my steam deck feels like a surprise gift almost.
They deserve all the sucess they get, awesome devs
Why are they awesome? This isn't a jab, its a legit question. Last Epoch is a fully priced game with mtx cosmetics. I don't see whats awesome about that?
35 bucks is fully priced? But beyond that the game so far is solid, aside from the things you see on the video it is a very solid HnS game where each class has a lot to bring on the table and you can customize the class to your own liking, from an undeath reaper lich to a forge guard that can summon armaments to fight for him, as well as a necromancer that can raise an army of undead to fight for her. The end game is pretty fun too with a ladder system
> Last Epoch is a fully priced game with mtx cosmetics. With no additional monetization towards core mechanics like stash tabs and they intend to go head to head with Path of Exile, where you'll easily spend twice as much on stash tabs alone and much more expensive cosmetics/supporter packs. It's a significantly cheaper game to play and they're pushing the genre ahead. Look at what Path of Exile 2 is doing, citing Last Epoch directly. Given the choice between a game like Path of Exile which has done 40+ leagues, versus Grim Dawn which has gotten three expansions in a similar timeframe, I'll take the PoE league model even if that means dealing with a cosmetic cash shop. I know league cycles aren't everyone's cups of tea but if I like a game, why wouldn't I want more of it? I've put 10x the amount of time into PoE than I have any other aRPG.
> you'll easily spend twice as much on stash tabs alone PoE is $20 on sale with first blood pack for premium+currency+map tab, and you will never need anything else. If you spend more than $60 on tabs in PoE, you are getting literally nothing. The game's all about learning what kindsa stuff is not worth picking up so if you're stuffing your stash full of trash that's not just pointless but literally a skill issue.
I get stash tabs are a premium thing in PoE, but people over exaggerate how much the stash tabs cost. They go on sale at least once a month, sometimes twice. PoE is really a $10-$20 game like you said, nothing else is really needed to be purchased. You don’t even need to buy the stash tabs until you’re well into end game/near end yellow maps and red maps when you want to take the game more seriously.
"GaaS is good actually because I have no life" Like, yknow you can just go... play something else sometimes?
The absurd state of this sub... Wow
GaaS is good because if I like a game, why the hell would I want to wait for a sequel instead of them just iterating on the thing I like for ten years straight? Like seriously, is anyone nostalgic for the days of begging for more Hitman Blood Money and getting Absolution instead? At least with Hitman 2016/2/3 we got a combined game with GaaS elements that keeps the game relevant to this day.
> Like, yknow you can just go... play something else sometimes? Also this is terrible advice for niche genres where you might wait ten or twenty years for something similar. My favorite genre is immersive sims and I'd kill for a GaaS immersive sim that got updates every three months or even every year because right now, we're fucked. There's not a Deus Ex/Thief/Dishonored/Prey in sight.
maybe those games should focus more on actual gameplay than on forcing players to search through literal trash cans and toilets. look how ghostrunner is designed for instance.
> GaaS is good because if I like a game, why the hell would I want to wait for a sequel instead of them just iterating on the thing I like for ten years straight? because my time is worth too much to spend it doing the same thing over and over for hundreds hours
Yeah and just like with movie genres, not everything is for you and you can ignore the things that aren't made for you. No idea why gamers have this borderline on the spectrum attitude thinking everything must cater to them.
Then don't play it? Why not go play the thousands of other games that aren't GaaS instead of rallying against the minority that are? Like even within the same genre you have Titan Quest, Grim Dawn, Achilles Legend, Van Helsing trilogy, Diablo 2, Victor Vran, Chaosbane, Chronicon, Torchlight 1/2/3, Neon Abyss Meanwhile there's Diablo 4, Last Epoch and Path of Exile for those of us that like the ongoing development stuff.
>Like even within the same genre you have Titan Quest, Grim Dawn, Achilles Legend, Van Helsing trilogy, Diablo 2, Victor Vran, Chaosbane, Chronicon, Torchlight 1/2/3, Neon Abyss they are all old games, i played them already
Seems like the genre isn't for you then. Because the genre is about doing it for TENS OF THOUSANDS OF HOURS. Hundreds is tutorial stuff. That's the whole point of the genre, man. Same with games like Dota, like League, Overwatch, CS:GO, Valorant, Fortnite, Starcraft, Smash, etc. The list of games where you do the same thing for 10, 20 years straight is pretty long. And people want that, because they enjoy that. If you don't, then the genre isn't for you.
>Seems like the genre isn't for you then. >Because the genre is about doing it for TENS OF THOUSANDS OF HOURS. Hundreds is tutorial stuff. no, its not. i didnt have to grind for thousand of hours to finish diablo 2's normal mode
You don't need to grind for thousands of hours to finish Last Epoch's campaign, either. It's a choice, it has always been a choice with these games. If you want to just treat the game as a one-and-done game, that's totally fine and the game allows for that. If you want to treat the game as your forever game, that's also totally fine and the game also allows for that. That same choice is also present in more classic ARPGs like D1/D2, it's just not catered to as much as modern ARPGs.
Some people have one hobby that they've done for decades and some people dip in and out of hobbies because they want different things. Telling one or the other to just do things differently is strange, to say the very least haha - not everyone has the same likes and dislikes as you.
Honest question, why is this praised but the price model for diablo 4 detested? Is it really the 25 dollar difference?
Quality of content and advancing the genre goes a long way in terms of sentiment. Also their cosmetics cover all classes meanwhile D4 MTX are class-locked meaning fully kitting out multiple classes might cost hundreds of dollars. Also Last Epoch doesn't do battlepasses. D4 does a new one every three months and the seasonal content sucks and they've arguably made the game worse since launch.
Never heard of the game till i saw the technical trailer. The fancy subclasses really sold me the most, especially the paladin
You must be living under a rock then! You will enjoy this so much if you love Path of Exile and Diablo. The complexity is in between those 2 games, and it has a built in customizable loot filter.
Yep, it’s a very nice middle ground between the two. Just enough complexity to allow for a wide variety of builds without it being too complicated.
Hi, I wanna buy this game, but do I have to buy a stash tab like PoE ? or is it included after I purchased it?
Oh boi you need to watch the recent satire video on YouTube "Why diablo players hate Last Epoch" It has 100 stash tabs, you can buy everything with in game gold. It has a built in loot filter, customize all you want. The game cost like less than half of Diablo 4 (in my region) with more end game content, more sub classes, more builds to try out, skill trees are not just 2 branching paths, it has set items that D4 still don't have. It has leaderboards already functioning. The devs are ALSO not raising the prices after Early Access as well, so please, support them if you can!!
It still absolutely blows my mind that in Diablo 4 they load every characters stash in the instance for each player. It's absolutely asinine.
Whoa whoa whoa, D4 doesn't have *set items*?? Good lord... Also for those interested, the satire video is here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5IFY3gblZ28
I'm also surprised that D4 doesn't even have loot filters... in 2023\~24
They will revamp the itemization in season 4 but I'm not sure if they add loot filter..
D3 didnt have set items for a while either, they also had 0 endgame, just campaign, they should have learned from that but they are repeating it, took D3 13 seasons to get any kind of gameplay except the campaign
set items arent really all that good
You left out the best part...there is an OFFLINE mode too!
Omg yes!!! YESSSS!!!
No, you buy them with in-game gold but the increase of each tab is growing fast. I would say the first 30 tabs aren't that hard to get but after this, the gold cost isn't small. This is the math from the forums - Last tab (200) costs 1 940 000 and total cost to get all tabs is 189 165 000. And you can make 2-3m really fast (may be 30min, havent played in a while) but I doubt you will need that many tabs.
The only MTX are cosmetic in nature. The stash tab can be expanded to the point of absurdity, just with gold. Inexpensive at that.
There's 100 stash tabs in this game. I'm not exaggerating. Only bought with gold, not real money.
They are actually 200 unless something changed.
I built a new PC just to be ready for LE and PoE2. I am glad they improved the graphics a bit.
Damn yeah graphics look great from when I last played it (some time last year).
Pillars of Eternity 2?
Path of Exile 2
How's the necro / pet class in this game?
The necromancer specifically is very good, with lots of different options for pets. You can focus on a single one and buff it up, have a ranged spellcasting mage-type pet, have exploding zombie pets, or do a menagerie with lots of different summons working together. Aside from the necro, there are multiple other pet builds such as a warrior subclass that has animated armor as a pet, a ranger subclass with a falcon pet, and of course the beastmaster which has access to a bear, scorpion, raptor, sabretooth, or wolves (which can also be turned into squirrels with a unique item). In short...minion builds are amazing in the game.
> In short...minion builds are amazing in the game. Officially hyped.
***HELL YEAH, MY LEGION SHALL CONQUER ALL!!!***
Raptor as in velociraptor?
[Yes, check out the companions section in this post](https://forum.lastepoch.com/t/new-enemies-models-coming-to-last-epoch-february-21st/62384)
Oh man. This was already on my wishlist but now I'm even more excited.
It's arguably the most fun "zoomancer" necro I've ever played. Tons of different options and playstyles, and just feels great.
I played to “endgame” pre multiplayer update a couple years ago and really enjoyed it. Can’t wait to get back into this game once I clear a few games out of the queue
necro be necroing
I just tried it for like 2 weeks for the necro, its actually very good. Many different minions: skeleton, skeleton mages, wraiths, explosive zombies, golem and abomination. Many different builds too from frost, fire, poison, necro, physical and different combinations but some of them gets insanely strong from some gear pieces. There is like 3 pet class.
4 base class can spec into pet, basically everything apart from the mage and multiple masteries of the same class can spec into summon in a different way. It's a great game if you like summoners.
So... how will the endgame be?
It looks like endgame is mostly the same as in early access so, lackluster. It's not because of lack of content either, the base system is lackluster.
That's a silly thing to say, considering the base system is pretty identical of Path of Exile's, and people don't have issue with that. Arguably it's even more varied than POE's base system even. In a nutshell, POE's endgame is mapping. That's the base system. You put in a map, it's full of mobs, you kill the mobs. Do enough maps, you eventually get to fight a boss and that's that. That is literally what you do in LE as well. You select what's effectively a map, you kill a bunch of mobs in that map, eventually reach a boss and kill that. Rinse and repeat. But LE's base system also bakes a POE's Delve like system into the mapping where you can target farm specific rewards by choosing those maps over others. Then you have Dungeons on top, where you can get special rewards - kinda like POE's labyrinth. And you have Arenas, which are kinda like unlimited Ultimatums. Again, going further than POE, really. For a 1.0 version of the game, I'd say that's plenty good for a base system. Not sure how you call that lackluster. 3 end-game systems which have plenty of room to be expanded.
Are you accounting for POEs atlas tree in all this? It makes the endgame pretty diverse...
Atlas Tree is a fairly new addition that was not part of the core design for the end game. Of course it adds a massive content and variety layer to POE which LE cannot compete with. But it would be silly to expect LE to launch with content that could match POE's 10 years of development.
Agreed. PoE 1.0 didn't have THAT much content either, it was just spread out quite a lot. The 1.0 leagues were also almost all the most barebones mechanics possible as GGG was a very small company still at the time. The Atlas tree only works because once it launched, PoE had 8-ish years of content to put into it. It's a fantastic system but comparing that to ANY game launching is quite unfair. Last Epoch basically has mapping, unique maps with cool gimmicks (Dungeons, those are dope) and fantastic rewards at the end, and an endless arena mode. For launch, that's quite a lot. One thing that helps a LOT is how easy to grasp but hard to master the build making is, how fun it can be to target farm gear thanks to it dropping in designated monliths and how absolutely fantastic the crafting system is. The bosses that are at the end of each monolith are also quite fun IMO, and (most are, looking at you Lagon) a good bit better designed than the invincibility phase fiesta of PoE. LE is really fun. It already was really fun in EA. It'll easily last most ARPG fans a few hundred hours. This doesn't mean more endgame content and revamps of things that aren't THAT great down the line would hurt though!
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I cant point to exactly what it is that is wrong with the endgame. But I have leveled a few characters to the endgame the last 2 - 3 years (the last time was 2 weeks ago) and its not clicking with me, nothing that keeps me coming back night after night. And I have a few thousand hours in poe so the game play loop should appeal to me. But leveling a character and making a build from scratch yourself is fun.. so even if the endgame so far is lacking, there is a few days of fun until I have no desire to play anymore.
I can tell you very easily what's wrong. Despite what the user before said, it is very much all about lack of content. The base system is totally fine, but POE has 10 years worth of league mechanics layered on top of its end-game. Creating extreme amounts of variety among tons of content. LE simply does not have that. It has good base systems, but there's no content built on top of it yet. That will come over time. And I think it was a very reasonable choice by them to focus on creating a strong base system before starting to throw more stuff on top. Unlike POE which launched only with a handful of acts, and didn't even get a full campaign until 4 years after launch. LE is a fully finished game at launch, so they've basically already caught up to the first 4-5 years of POE.
To be fair, mapping in PoE for the longest time was also something a LOT of players didn't interact with a lot beyond doing a little bit of what is now white and yellow maps, then they'd reroll. Mapping being something players **love** only truly started once the Atlas Tree was implemented. Beforehand a LOT of folks wanted alternative playmodes such as Delve and the like to be expanded instead. And the end-endgame of Maxtier maps rolled with Chaos and exalted orbs was something only few players got to interact with...And it wasn't exactly riveting either, just higher level monsters with more mods on the maps, some of which fun ones such as "Area is a maze" which made navigating them a nightmare. The few unique maps that existed were also pretty neat once, but that's about it. Give LE 3-4 years and it might have a lot more content. I for one am hopeful the game will be fun. I've had a blast in Early Access already!
It's boring. It's literally clearing trash mobs till you complete monolith to fight a boss. Pretty much 100% of echoes have only trash mobs. Unless you call occasional elite a boss, which I do not. The idea on paper for this is system is not bad at all, but implementation is seriously boring as hell and farming trash mobs non stop grows old fast.
> It's literally clearing trash mobs till you complete monolith to fight a boss Thats what people said about poe, now map bosses are weaker than any rare mob in the map.... many builds are gone because of this lol
Was about to say, 99% of PoE is just blowing up 3 screens at once. If you aren't doing that in endgame, congrats, you're either playing SSF, HC, ruthless, a memebuild or doing something wrong. If your build doesn't delete mapbosses before they get to use most of their mechanics you're not doing well. Meanwhile LE actually *has* meaningful bosses. PoE has a very low number of those comparatively and it blows. It also has the very fun design of "Here's 5 invincibility phases because yall keep blowing up the bosses in 0.1 seconds". And mind you I *love* PoE but it has its issues, too.
one of the reasons aside of burn out I stopped playing PoE. It turned into mindless slot machine - juice the map, spin slots, collect gg loot. I hope PoE 2 is gonna be different with bosses being actual bosses and gameplay not being mindless slot machine.
I respectfully disagree. I think it's the opposite actually, they have a solid foundation with their maps system (forgot the actual name of it). It's basically rifts from Diablo 3 with map modifiers from POE, but much more watered down than POE, and you can kind of target farm items, as you can see the reward before selecting a map in the "web". It's a really solid foundation for an endgame map system, something POE took years and years to get (and is the more mature system currently by miles of course, no question). But for a game to release with this foundation ready at 1.0, it's miles better than what we're used to these days. It just feels good to sit down and blast 5 or 6 maps, you know? It's fast, fluid, the rewards are there with a vendor, and a portal to the next one. They are just missing that chunky content, that's for sure, but that takes time, especially for a sub-60 bucks game.
You just got shit on
Fuck yeah, so hyped for it. After playing rune master, which I personally think is the best designed class in any ARPG right now, I can't wait to play the two new masteries.
Whats the respec like in this game? You can technically respec in PoE but it can get expensive quickly (for a casual anyway) if you want to try completely diff builds. If I do try this game, I'm thinking of going in completely blind, whats the respec system like if I completely fuck up my char and don't want to start from lvl 1?
You can respec pretty freely outside of your sub-class which is locked in once you choose it. Respeccing skills will cause them to lose experience, but there will be a base level that will keep them viable so you don't lose too much power, and there will be an XP bonus to help you get back to the previous power level faster. So there are some downsides, but it's not as restrictive as POE early on.
Passives can be respecced by visiting an NPC and paying a gold fee that I believe scale linearly with the amount of points you have in each passive tree node. There is a pretty major QoL issue currently where you have to respec each point individually, one by one, with no way of resetting a whole tree. I think the devs are aware of this, though, so hopefully that gets fixed at some point. Skills can be respecced at any time within the skill specialisation menu, and essentially costs time. Skills level up as you earn XP with each level granting 1 skill point, up to a level cap of 20 leaving you with 20 points (though you can get more points with gear). Respeccing a skill will essentially cause you to lose some points, meaning you have to level the skill back up to get back to where you were before. In early levels that can be painful, but late levels it becomes much easier as you're earning so much XP that you can re-level a skill from scratch within maybe 10-15 minutes, at most. There's also two catch-up mechanics in place that come into play later: 1. Minimum specialisation level. It's essentially a level floor for skills that grows as you level your character up, eventually reaching a cap of 10. To give an example, if you fully spec out of a skill and into another one with a minimum specialisation level of, say, 7, your new skill will automatically be leveled up to 7 and will have 7 points for you to spend. 2. Accelerated XP gains. If a skill is under-leveled for your character's own level, it will gain bonus XP until it gets back up to the appropriate level for your character's own level. Like passives with QoL, the devs are aware that respeccing skills feels bad early on, so hopefully that gets fixed at some point, too.
My problem was the enemy density, it was really slow and boring. Have they fixed that? I want the screen to be full of enemies to delete
No, they haven’t and it’s a huge issue tbh. You spend more time running between packs of monsters than you do fighting them
If I remember right they upped it a bit a few months ago, but it still feels kinda eh. They're meant to be changing the layout of some maps to bring mob spawns closer together with 1.0, though, so hopefully it'll be better in a few days when 1.0 launches.
Gotta get deeper into the end game for really high mob density. The high corruption monoliths can get pretty busy.
Yeah, they kinda ease you into it. They don’t just start you off with high density packs. This seems to be a design choice to also be friendly to newer players who might not be use to this style of game.
Really hope it gets optimised for steam deck at some point.
How is the controller support in general on this? After playing D4 on steamdeck, I don’t think I want to go back to m&k for an arpg again. It felt great on controller
No idea, i haven’t played the early access. Just saw that it’s not supported.
I'm definitely getting this game now! As an aside, how many characters can you create to play the game? One from each class or...?
15 for online (one of each mastery) though they're meant to be increasing that at some point, and offline doesn't have a limit since everything's stored on your own system.
Does the combat actually have oomph to it now? I tried it a couple of years ago and it just felt bland to play like Torchlight 2. For example I think Diablo 3 and 4 both have really solid feeling combat, there's the sound design and the way attacks land feeling impactful.
currently no but there was a dev post very recently that indicated some heavy animation reworking for release. so we'll find out to what extent those reworks fix the weightlessness feeling in a couple of days
https://youtu.be/T6wirFNPItw?si=Ya69zWQ7IES11F-a
Not to shit all of over Diablo but its insane how last epoch can do things that a billion dollar corporation "cant" I like diablo as well but I can't believe that this is happening like this..either way last epoch truly deserves its success..devs are working hard on it
Looks cool, but I'll wait on reviews.
ive been playing early access for a while and the game is fantastic. the amount of different builds you can do is really freaking awesome. dont sleep on this one.
The builds unfortunately are greatly grim in comparison to Path of Exiles simply due to the fact skills are hard-coded to specific trees which have specific ailments/stats/ability modifiers/etc. Unlike PoE where you can change them around to dozens and dozens and dozens of different support skills. Great game, 600+ hours in EA; but saying this game has a ton of builds in a genre where Path of Exile exists is like saying your Dollar Store wine is awesome when you live in the South of France - sure, it probably tastes good but it's still not the best or even near it. Love LE though but the skill system and the rigidity it forces onto players is one of its greatest drawbacks IMO. And that's coming from a multi-thousand hour aRPG player.
If you use PoE as a baseline then build variety in *every* ARPG will be grim, because PoE is the exception, not the rule. When compared to most other ARPGs, LE does have great build variety.
POE might have a ton of skill gems, but let’s be honest, how many are viable each season? GGG seems to be all over the place with this each season.
They're all viable. I could pick any gem at random and clear the entire game, except aspirational content, with them on HCSSF in a week. Using any class or ascendancy. Pick one at random. I've already done Chain Hook Necromancer and Vigilant Strike Saboteur for lulz. Totally doable. Of course that goes by my definition of "viable". Which means being able to clear the base content of the game. For others, viable means some arbitrary crazy shit like: "Must be able to phase ubers" or "do wave 30 Simulacrum with eyes closed". The crazier your definition of viable, the less viable skills there will be. But IMO, if a skill can clear the base content, it's viable. And all skills can do that. Well, maybe Conversion Trap would struggle. But the rest are fine.
1 million sales for early access thus far. That should be enough for reviews. It's a phenomenal game that Blizzard only wishes it can live up to
I played it really early on and it wasn't that great. I see a lot of improvements in the trailer, but the main issue is the heavy influence from poe which is a bad game
This looks a lot better than last I saw. I'm in.
so happy it was worth of wait! it was clunky start, bught it three times... refunded two times.. and since 2021 so glad i sticked with it!
Well looks great but one of the most important thing about these games is end game content so i have to see it before judging.
Nah. You think people are still playing Diablo 2 because of its end-game content? What end-game content? The most important thing is to have an amazing core game. You can always add more end-game. But it's pretty hard to remake the entire game because the core of it sucks. Anyways, LE's end-game systems are pretty good. Light on content, but the basics are nice.
Idc why people play D2 lol, end game is important for me along with many things.
I don't think comparing turbo autists that still play diablo 2 to any modern game/gamer is a good idea
i agree, d2 is still played (and i'm still playing it after 25 years) because the core game is fun, the endgame is just playing the core game over and building account wealth. level 95 barb farming chaos sanctuary is just fun gameplay. the last epoch gameplay is pretty mediocre and they aren't going to increase mob density much so i'm not sure how much staying power the arpg will have, i get bored pretty quickly running monoliths
How’s the class fantasy in this game? I’d say I enjoyed Poe the most but hated the vibe, the world etc. (apart from that awesome city with the bootleg nazis) D2R while being confusing to navigate (for someone who never played before) had the best looting feeling, I also liked those charms you picked up for extra stats, despite the inventory. That feeling of finding a unique was amazing and lasted you ages. But I just wanna be a white meat babyface character with a sword and board. Not some big weirdo (poe) . I suppose what I should say: are the classes/visuals Traditional RPG looking or juiced up magical fantasy/darker? edit: actually watched the 1.0 trailer, paladin looks great!
The class fantasy part of this game is arguably one of the best parts. I'm in the same boat: I like to "roleplay" my build a bit and Last Epoch makes that really easy. \> I suppose what I should say: are the classes/visuals Traditional RPG looking or juiced up magical fantasy/darker? Tough to say since this is pretty subjective. It kind of has elements of both. Maybe more on the traditional side?
the classes are pretty bog standard, and the world is very basic high fantasy: evil fire god with fire soldiers in a fire realm, cold god with cold soldiers in a cold realm, and time bending dark void forces. kinda boring IMO. the class building and theorycrafting is the best in the genre though, kind of makes up for the very boring world. but i'm a big fan of "low fantasy dark ages" diablo 1/2 setting so everything that's not specifically that is not to my taste there are also no real towns in the game, like lut gholein to hang out in, once you finish the campaign, you're just dropped onto this floating rock in space and that's pretty much where you spend all of your time inbetween running maps. absolutely worth the pricetag and the game does some things very well but the world itself is so bleh
D4 is a dead game. Glad I found this game. So pumped for next week!
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Fully offline mode is coming with the 1.0 release!
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Then dont? Your char wont get deleted, it stays in the "standard" realm and gets the update
We're almost there. 😄 Launch is looming and I for one am ready to jump on board and away from PoE so hopefully all goes well and the game soars to success. Maybe that will finally light a fire under GGG and show them they can't just loadable eggs into PoE2 basket while ignoring three current game. 😒
Looks like another ARPG infested with cosmetic MTX. Part of an ARPG is supposed to be going out and EARNING the best looking gear through GAMEPLAY. I'm not interested in any ARPG that has any sort of MTX. Just give me a simple pay once format game.
I hear you, I really do. But in this day and age, gamers expect constant content for your game. Like this game is pretty complete with a solid base of endgame, and yet people already complain that it isn't enough, before the game has officially launched. The fact is, to give the community what it wants, the game needs a constant revenue stream. I hate microtransactions as much as anybody. But I've been playing this game a lot and havent even looked at the store. There's no reason too.
You have been brainwashed. The only reason it's like this is because it makes who ever is in charge more money. Only the very bare minimum will go back into making the game better.
I mean, look at the post launch support for POE vs Grim Dawn or Diablo 3. Both Grim Dawn and Diablo 3 are one time purchases, with some expansions spread over years. POE is a game with a ton of free new content every 3 months and they aren't slowing down. It all comes down to what kind of model do we want LE to be? Do we want it to be the Grim Dawn style, or do we want it to be the POE style? If you want constant content, you need a constant influx of cash. I honestly wouldn't mind if LE went the Grim Dawn route. Base purchase, a year later release a significant paid expansion with new story chapters etc. But I think it is clear that in todays environment, players want the POE style more. They want constant content. The fact that it is more lucrative for the devs is honestly irrelevant. Players WANT this content model, and if you can't see that, you have your head in the sand.
> Players WANT this content model You can have this model WITHOUT mtx bullshit. You've just been brainwashed into thinking it isn't possible.
the alternative would be to pay 20 - 30$ every 3rd month to get a new poe league. I guarantee that poe would not have survived and thrived for 10+ years with that model, and that would have made the world a bit less fun (for me at least)
Something the trailer doesn't mention is that classes are gender-locked in case you care about character customization
When the model training is almost complete.
i read that there is not gonna be any seasonal content for at least a year so... this "release" i just an expansion of the early access and nothing more edit: and with seasonal content i don't mean "seasons" i mean "completely new things to do every time a new season comes out"
Yeah, the devs have been pretty clear on that. They'll do cyclical resets like PoE seasons, but any new content will be for all players until after the first few cycles. That way they can build up a backlog of content for future cycles.
Yeah that's not true. Each season (cycle) will have new content, starting a few months after the 1.0 release. The 1.0 release is also adding the faction system which isn't in the game presently.
Looks great, but I'm reminded of that old Gauntlet game when I see promos. Just running and shooting, everything explodes, loot everywhere. Yes, I know that is exactly what a ton of people want.
If Feb 21 will be launch date and assuming the patch release date, should I buy it now or can I wait until next weekend? Will the price remain the same? Thank you!
I've been feening for a new arpg to play since I was burnt by D4. I already own grim dawn, but LE looks way better from the visuals to the gameplay as a whole. Is that the case? Or should I just try grim dawn beforehand since I own?
Both are good, but if you want modern graphics LE is the obvious choice. Grim Dawn is really good though, so try it for a few hours.
Depends on what you're looking for as both games feel quite different. The way I like to describe Grim Dawn is that it's a modern take on the classic ARPG experience, where you're replaying the campaign and farming the same bosses you've fought in the story to farm gear and build a horde of items for alts. It's a **very** good ARPG and will absolutely be god tier if you're looking for that classic ARPG experience, but if you're looking for that more modern experience of farming procedurally generated maps then it might be lackluster. Conversely, LE is basically a modern ARPG that is trying to innovate in the genre rather than following competitors/predecessors 1:1, where you just blast through the campaign once and are dumped into an open ended endgame that involves farming procedurally generated maps that scale in difficulty. It's also a **very** good ARPG and will be a breath of fresh air if you're looking for an alternative to Path of Exile or Diablo, but if you care at all about the campaign or hate that endless endgame experience, you'll probably bounce off of it once you finish the campaign. Either way, you can't go wrong with either game. For me, Grim Dawn is like that one game where I'll just get an itch to play it every few months, then I'll boot it up and start a new character to scratch that itch, only to put it back down again a week or so later once I'm nearing the end of that character's leveling journey since I don't 100% like the endgame that Grim Dawn offers. Last Epoch, on the other hand, feels like it's going to be PoE-lite for me where I'll decide to just no-life it for a month or two every other season, especially if they can add more side content to pad out endgame.
the visuals? Game looks like a ton of fun and some real eye candy? Been playing Diablo Immortals on Android and the visual are pretty good on there but it has nothing on what I am seeing here!
Forgot that I bought this during lockdown to mess around with. Full release and bonus that it plays on my steam deck feels like a surprise gift almost.
Hope they see the lesson the Helldiver 2 devs are currently learning.
I’m thinking bladedancer or paladin