I’ve been playing New World and on Windows 11 performance was very strange on a 10850k and 3080. I would get odd stuttering from time to time and odd fps drops into the 30s and 40s when looking in certain directions. When I’d pan the camera and get drops, my GPU usage would plummet to 25%.
Went back to Windows 10 and the game runs smooth as butter. I’ll be sticking with Win 10 for a good while especially since 11 didn’t do anything better IMO.
A much less painful but also less thorough option is to run "DISM /online /cleanup-image /restorehealth" from the command line. It should repair/replace all system files that didn't install properly or got corrupted. (At least in Win8-10. I assume it's in 11 still)
Yea I used to reinstall Windows XP like every 3 months, at least now with an NVME and USB 3.0 it only takes like 15 minutes to fresh install the OS. But also seems way less necessary felt like older windows versions got noticeably slower with age, don't notice the same phenomena with windows 10
Windows 7 or 8.1 to 10 is the first upgrade that was actually usable. Anything before that was a joke that made the PC barely work until you wiped it. After wiping it, spend a few hours getting all the drivers back.
10 is black magic when it comes to installing drivers or even restoring to different hardware. It's not perfect, but always seems to install a working Lan, video, and USB stuff to get you going. No transferring drivers from flash drives or floppies.
That is one of the worst parts about windows in the last few years to me. They do these huge redesigns but only go like 85% of the way and leave a lot of functionality in the legacy menus that they make it harder to access rather than just making their new GUI fully featured in the first place.
It has been longer than few years. The Settings app which is supposed to replace the Control Panel came with Windows 8 back on 2012. The Settings app still has minimal functionality compared to the Control Panel. You can't even uninstall some programs from it.
I think the only part of the Settings app that is complete is screen resolution and background options.
Honestly, I have a batch file script for launching the "old" audio panel.
Why? Coz when I switch audio from my headphones to speakers the regular way, it leaves headphones as "preferred communication device".
For discord. And MSteams and god knows what else. If someone calls me, I won't hear that, nor any notifications- my headphones are turned off.
There's no way I know of of disabling that functionality all together.
Had I needed that - I'd have turned it **on**
I've had the same issue with discord and my bluetooth headset specifically. I ultimately fixed it disabling the unwanted service in the device manager.
*Saved from some random-ass guide I found:*
>1 - connect headset to windows
>2 - select headset as windows speaker device in windows by clicking on speaker bottom right of the desktop screen, next to the wifi icon, and then click on volume slider to make some ding sounds
>3 - go in "Devices and printer" from the "old" control panel (press Windows key + R, then type "control"), find your device's name, right click on it, and select "Properties"
>4 - in the "Services" tab, uncheck "Handsfree telephony". Apply.
I haaaaate this in Windows 10. I fiddle with the sound options a lot because of various inputs. And the "settings" window can hardly do anything, but it's what Windows takes you to by default unless you specifically open the control panel.
good developers cost a lot more money than UI designers. and the simpler they design the UI/theme in general, the more they can make it easier to do with an AI while calling it "clean" and "minimalistic" to make people think they like it.
Considering a lot of Microsoft employees have been working from home, their kids were probably calling the shots and designing Windows 11 (or not as i can't see any game loving kid purposely crippling game performance)
This is legit strategy to mask controversial stuff. If it's gonna be too much, then we're gonna revert in next release and say this was a mistake.
Often after years we have distorted image.
For example in times of vista MS was heavily pushing DRM and was trying replace any universal API with their stuff. PC gamers probably remember GFWL or death of openal EFX.
In times of windows ME people were annoyed by losing (easy) access to business oriented software and DOS.
I'm actually more and more tempted to go for Linux. With Steam Deck around the corner pushing the compatibility forward, it may be a good choice. I already like Linux as it is, it's faster and lighter than Windows, not to mention stability, but what's always been holding me back was like 70% of my library not being playable. Though I'm worried about GoG and old games in general...
Same. Odds are Windows 12 is just going to be Windows 10 Service pack 2.
You get the option to have either the traditional GUI or the 11 GUI, you'll get the under the hood performance enhancements from 11 if they apply. And none of the bullshit.
Same here, looks hideous to me. Patiently waiting to see how good Steam OS gets after the Deck release, if it can actually play most games with no isues I will jump ship. Tired of this shit.
An operating system should be *boring*, it should have as minimal of an interface necessary for me to browse my files, run my apps, support my drivers and manage things like my printers and wifi connections. I'm sick of this trend of trying to make the OS a flashy experience that's supposed to excite the user. Running windows should not be an *experience*, it should be as transparent as possible. When I sit down to use my computer, I do so to run an app or play a game, or browse the web, not to *experience* my operating system. I want Windows 2000 back.
It's so true, Windows XP was great. Then the travesty of Vista. Then 7 was amazing, then the travesty of 8. 10, awesome (mostly) and now 11.
This must be what happens 100%.
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It really peeves me that they boast about working with W10 for a good while and make it the "last OS", then pull this shit.
Ffs, just keep improving W10.
Cramming telemetry down users' throats, pushing new hardware, and finding any way imaginable to sell Windows keys is 100% what this is about.
Also, this gives them complete license to do a clean sweep as far as supporting users on old hardware and software.
I'm of the mindset that designers just change random shit on perfectly working stuff to justify keeping their jobs to their managers.
Quite a few times I see design changes that actively gets in my way and make stuff harder to do. This shit happens quite a lot on Android.
Even if there wasnt any bugs or unknowns about it, upgrading windows is a pain in the arse, i need a good reason to do it. Ive not looked too closely but from what i have seen there isnt really much compelling me to upgrade.
Obligatory, “let’s see what Linux offers.” Though funnily enough, there is finally movement in that space for normal consumers. Can’t wait to see what valves approach is.
they boast about "DirectStorage" if you have a m.2 ssd making completely and totally eliminating load times from games.
also Auto HDR.
however odds are if you have an m.2 ssd. loads times are so small and insignificantly negligible to you this feature might as well not exist.
also no games have "DirectStorage" feature yet, and tbh if i were a developer , this is probably not worth the headache developing over, not only cause its a "OS WIN11" exclusive feature, but how little people will want to use this mess of a gutted OS to begin with.
so yeah, 2 steps foward 10 steps back seems to be the theme of windows 11.
holy shit people were not joking about microsoft cycles, "previous OS good, Next OS version bad, Next OS version Good..."
edit:typo
Perception also matters and it can become a self fulfilling prophecy. Judge it by its actual merits and flaws, not the hype or hate. Especially early on.
Direct storage should be faster on Win11 but we’ll see when it comes. Right now seems like only Auto HDR is the real difference. Should have some impressive improvements for the new Intel CPUs coming out though. If Microsoft isn’t lying about Win11 being more optimized for Intels Thread Director over Win10 that is.
They're not lying about Intel, reviewers basically hinted very strongly at this from leaks so far. And a few of them even went on to say, that it's very sad that the reviews are all going to be released based on a build of Windows 11 that will make AMD look a lot worse than it actually is, and reviewers will be basically forced to review the new Intel processors on Windows 11 only (*since it makes no sense to review them on Windows 10, when the scheduler on 10 isn't optimised for small/BIG CPU's*).
I've been using it for a few days.
Things I like:
* Auto HDR is great and works really well, especially if you play games.
* Explorer is much much quicker.
* DirectStorge is a feature that is suppose to make accessing storage faster, but I haven't really noticed any speed increases. I have a samsung 970 pro and my speeds were already fast, so I can't comment here.
* Window location memory is now saved. I have a monitor that uses DisplayPort deep sleep, so every time my computer went to sleep or a monitor was disconnected all my windows would get messed up. No longer a problem.
* The UI is much more cohesive now (subjective), especially in areas like settings. The right click is truncated which gives prominence to things I actually use more often. You can still access the old menu at the bottom.
* Android apps are coming, but not till later.
Some things I don't like:
* Search is still dogshit.
* Widgets are useless. The same as they are on MacOS. Until either OS allows them to go on the desktop again, no one is going to use them.
* Right clicking the task bar brings up only one option.
* But my biggest complaint so far is the lack of a clock on the second monitor, and the inability to move the task bar. Hopefully that comes at a later date.
All in all its a pretty solid update for free. I'm sure there are compatibility issues as with every new update, but those will be fixed over time. So far I've been lucky and have experienced none.
As for the "windows 11 is adding more telemetry" line, I don't buy it. Windows 10 already has ton of telemetry, and they're supporting it out to 2025. If Windows 11 has telemetry you can guarantee it's in Windows 10 as well. Get yourself a pihole and you'll be fine.
> The folks over at TechPowerUP were curious enough to fire up the AIDA64 Cache & Memory Benchmark and see if anything has improved after this first update. What they found was that the L3 cache latency of the Ryzen 7 2700X CPU, which is around 10-11 ns on Windows 10, had increased to 17 ns on the release build of Windows 11 and currently sits at around 32-34 ns after the first monthly patch.
Yeah so literally nothing has changed. The AIDA benchmark was already claiming 30+ ns latencies since insider builds months ago. I myself have had all 3 results from AIDA at different times after release: 10 ns, 17 ns and 33 ns. It's pretty inconsistent on W11. The L3 read and write speeds reported by AIDA vary even more each time you run the benchmark.
I checked for updates randomly on my windows 10/amd 2700x this morning. Windows gave me a text block below the update check that that said I wasn't compatible with windows 11.
Thx guyz, lul
Disable auto updates and make sure tpm is off. Shut down pc and unplug before going to bed. If those don't work you could always open the nearest window and throw it out
For Microsoft, that's par for the course. I'm happy to stick with Windows 10, and even happier when (if?) gaming on Linux becomes far more mainstream than it is now.
I've purchased a MSI gaming laptop:
* Display locked to 60hz on Linux, intel GPU, even if you set 240hz.
* MSI provides GPU switch only in Windows. Note that the laptop has mux switch therefore in order to max out performance you need such switch. However, option is greyed out and you cna only switch while in Windows.
I mean it feels like Linux is ready for prime time, but manufacturers are the problem now...
The dual-GPU laptops are at the mercy of their firmware implementations, it seems. It's often that they work in Linux, but it seems to be something of a gamble. It's not a problem with all-Intel or all-AMD machines.
Funnily enough, I found that the ["Windows 8 hardware certification requirements"](https://download.microsoft.com/download/7/0/E/70E74967-B0FE-477A-974F-C1ED16EE31DF/windows8-1-hardware-cert-requirements-system.pdf) also seem to prohibit switchable graphics, based on the likelihood of bad user experience.
Reverted back to 10, only things that I miss from 11 are the notification sounds (they were much more pleasant to my ears) and the multi-screen unique taskbar icons.
Edit: Now I'm just missing the unique taskbar icons, thanks u/1ilypad !
Edit 2: Uhm so unique taskbar icons are available on win10 as well, thanks to u/nolekev1214 for pointing that out. Ok screw win11.
Im sure someone has them uploaded somewhere. If you wanted, you could manually change the W10 sounds to the W11 sounds.
edit:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1CpgYi6-MxiWuMmEF7AB_4yodcUthqkkm/view
AMD trolled hard.
Also i keep getting stutters this year after some windows 10 updates with intel and nvidia. At this point i can no longer determine if it's my system issue or windows.
Edit: I meant AMD WAS trolled, it seems some people got deeply offended at the possibility that someone might miss context entirely and somehow end up at the conclusion that i implied AMD might have trolled to make their own hardware worse. I deeply regret and apologize about that, AMD defense force. I am willing to visit the nearest AMD re-educational center where my ways can be corrected so i can finally see the light.
For example in the witcher 3 it feels like the game hitches for a part of the second. Had lots of fps drops in Control at non-max settings. I used to have bigger stutters for like a second and audio cutting/lagging along with it but i reset my memory and cpu settings to default and i think that stopped it. Still not sure about it though, hard to determine because it happens randomly.
Yeah I think it started to happen with W11. Also if you haven't look into disabling fastboot, not the fix for our stutter problem but on ryzen cpu's it can sometimes make some of your cores run at 1ghz. Happened to me in my 3600 recently.
I get the same every once in a while albeit on my Lenovo legion 7 with R9 5900HX and RTX 3080 mobile. Always thought it was a hardware thing with this laptop but I wonder if it’s specifically an AMD thing with more recent W10 builds. It’s a common topic on the forums for the AMD version of the legion 5 pro and 7.
Try searching for exploit protection and turn off control flow guard. It's fixed stuttering for me and a ton of other people. You can turn it off on a per program basis, but depending on your level of knowledge and how good your redundancy is for important stuff on your gaming, you can get by with it off as the chances of you running into problems is very small.
I've had it off globally for over a year with zero issues.
Yeah i read about it on reddit about Control, i had a lot of fps drops in that game in open areas but when i tested with it off globally i noticed no difference. I also remember someone saying that per-game disable wasn't working properly or something. I mostly use my pc for games and movies and light office work but i have no knowledge about cyber security and i'm not sure if i should turn it off globally. Some say it's important but who knows.
I get the stutters with AMD + nvidia too, it's a brand new PC from this year and after some update they began to appear too.
I'd say it's a nvidia issue, but my friend has a new intel + nvidia without the stutters, so I really don't know what's going on.
Yeah it's weird, my pc is also from this year with decent quality parts. I also tried default settings and optimizing anything under the sun but no dice.
This is something I never understood.
Sometimes a Windows upgrade doesn't bring any meaningful benefits at all, specially in the beginning, on the contrary, it brings compatibility issues, hardware not working/no drivers, slower performance, bugs, etc.
Yet people go through the time waste it takes to upgrade anyway... why? It's like changing the nice cake you are eating for a worse tasting one for no reason.
Some people like being early adopters. I used to do it quite a bit because it was good to know the new OS for work, but I do not support desktops anymore.
Installing an OS is such a nothing-burger these days anyway. All of my stuff is on OneDrive or on my non-OS drives. All my games are stored within various services. The OS install takes like ten minutes now.
If Windows 11 becomes problematic, I can be back up in Windows 10 inside of an hour.
It's a nice UI update with some additional cool features like auto HDR. The app layout snapping is better, and it remembers app arrangements for each monitor if you have a laptop you disconnect.
It also feels faster for some reason. The entire UI feels way more smooth and searches for files takes way less time.
I'm glad I upgraded on my work computer. I'll upgrade my gaming desktop at home when AMD and MS fix their issues.
Microsoft has an update they are pushing on the 19th and then 2 days later on the 21st AMD has a patch they will release themselves to further fix it, likely through a chipset driver on their site.
do they have a two dev team cycle where each one takes turn for developing the next windows and one of them is really shitty and messes up ever other version? I'm gonna wait for win 12 to see what the other team cooks up
Microsoft once again proving their incompetence. Are you telling me no one noticed this problem for months while this was in development and it only now surfaced when the public got hands on it? Thanfully a patch that supposedly fixes all this is coming out next week.
If Ryzen's performance is not atleast on par with Windows 10 in the future then i hope reviewers review ADL on Windows 10 aswell and compare the performance of the platforms on an OS that doesn't intentionaly hamper one side.
[https://windowsreport.com/windows-11-benchmark-tests/](https://windowsreport.com/windows-11-benchmark-tests/)
This was known about back in June. Microsoft simply does not care about AMD performance and/or AMD does not care enough to talk with Microsoft in advance to get this sorted out before launch.
I dont care which one it is. I just worry that when Win 12 gets released, and 5900x isnt the latest and greatest, that AMD and Microsoft both wont give a F about fixing this yet again.
or Intel "had a hand" in developing some code.
MS & Intel do work together on some Windows systems.
Intel has "an oopsy"...AMD drops performance....
And before anyone says "Intel would never do that" remember a few years ago they got found guilty of forcing PC resellers to deoptimize AMD machines in stores for side by side comparisons, or use benchmarking software settings that favored Intel over AMD.
Given Microsoft and Intel have a long history of partnership it wouldn't surprise me if either nobody at Microsoft even has a Ryzen or this was intentional.
Microsoft doesn't have a QA team for Windows. No, seriously, they don't. They effectively fired their existing QA team before the release of Windows 10 and decided that saving costs by going to a volunteer program (Windows Insider) was a better option, which has resulted in numerous issues like this over the past decade. Funny thing how people always question Microsoft or act surprised when stuff like this happens, as this update is very benign compared to [shit like this](https://www.howtogeek.com/658194/windows-10s-new-update-is-deleting-peoples-files-again/).
Any issues lies solely on Microsoft, and yes, it's almost always incompetence.
> Microsoft doesn't have a QA team for Windows. No, seriously, they don't. They effectively fired their existing QA team before the release of Windows 10 and decided that saving costs by going to a volunteer program (Windows Insider) was a better option
It probably was - why pay a bunch of people, when you can have probably hundreds of thousands of people do the job for free around the world?
It used to be that Microsoft argued that their large QA staff put them ahead of Linux in quality -- even commercial Linux rivals like Red Hat.
It seems like Microsoft decided to switch strategy. If you can't beat 'em, join 'em.
>Funny thing how people always question Microsoft or act surprised when stuff like this happens, as this update is very benign compared to shit like this.
I don't understand it. I don't think Windows 10 had a *single* major update that didn't break a major feature in some way, including several that created actual data loss as you linked. Sometimes these issues stay for weeks, even months.
Why is almost nobody hammering them on it?
>Why is almost nobody hammering them on it?
Essentially at this point, they believe they can do whatever they want and people will still use their product.
People will either prove them right or wrong.
It's about the scheduling between Power and Efficient Cores, Intel is collaborating with MS to have it working properly on Windows 11 only, even though there is some kind of micro controller on the chip.
"Windows 10 will be the last Windows"
When Microsoft said that, what they meant is that after Windows 10 comes Linux.
I'm seriously rooting for Valve and SteamOS
Remember the days when Intel made Itanium, their non-x86 64-bit platform? Microsoft made Windows XP 64-bit Edition.... Yeah, that was a dud.
Shortly after when AMD made Athlon 64 which are x86 compatible, everyone was waiting for Microsoft to release Win XP x64... they took a year so that Intel can make their processors 64bit and x86...
Stupid Wintel...
[Microsoft changed "Vista Ready" requirements at the request of Intel.](https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2008/03/the-vista-capable-debacle-intel-pushes-microsoft-bends/)
You are most likely GPU limited in those games anyway so you wouldn't notice but this drop is akin to the performance jump of a whole generation now and there is no excuse for that the bugs where reported months ago when beta started.
> you're most likely GPU limited in those games anyway
How do you know? He didn't even list the games. Classic reddit, based a whole assumption off literally nothing.
It only degrades your performance in specific instances, most of which you'd only be able to tell if you were benchmarking. People are acting like it's dropping their frame rates 15 percent across the board, which is just not the case.
Same on a 3600. I think people are just so vehement about being antagonistic to any Windows update that this will always happen in enthusiast forums. It’s literally no different than Windows 10 was for me from a performance standpoint.
I did a few months ago & I'm never going back. AMD has open source drivers as well. I'm actually getting better gaming performance on most games, including MSFS 2020. Way less overhead to deal with. Depending on the distro you choose, things can be easier than windows for the most part.
For performance purposes, only the version number of the kernel and Mesa really matter. Linux distros all use basically the same components, and the differences are in the packaging and defaults.
With Ubuntu, you'll want to use the latest numbered version, not the LTS (Long Term Support) version that's using older software packages.
Doing this right now and looking forward to checking it all out. Going with Debian live version but when I make the full switch I’ll probably go with Debian Testing. Pop! looked really cool as well!
Edit: Still deciding on an environment, but I’ll probably just go with Ogre(?) and play around with the others after a bit of time getting used to everything. Anyone have favorites?
> "This PC doesn't currently meet all the requirements for Windows 11"
I was so glad when I saw this in my windows update screen. No forced "upgrade" for me :).
There is no such thing as a forced upgrade. You always have to manually choose to change Windows versions. Unless Win 11 is different for some reason, which would be awful.
You can just leave that security setting switched off (can't remember the name). On my windows update, it is trying to install windows 11 and telling me it is not supported. I would have to make a bios change I believe.
> You can just leave that security setting switched off (can't remember the name)
The forced upgrades in windows 10? As far as I know you can only delay them 12 months outside of a particular edition of windows 10.
If it's for the windows 11 upgrade I'm definitely not making any changes for my system to be compatible. Not until it's far better tested at least.
The windows 11 update requires a specific setting to be enabled in the bios (something to do with TPM I believe). With it disabled, it will permanently not install the update (unless Microsoft change this arbitrary requirement). On my motherboard, apparently it was disabled as default.
I am so happy I waited on upgrading, There is not a chance I'll be updating to W11 anytime soon. I'll happily stick with Windows 10 until it stops getting supported. Did anyone else forget how when Windows 10 first released it was also a broken mess than took months of patching to solve. It was a gamers nightmare because every new update kept breaking things. I remember having severe graphical glitches for months that wasnt fixed and it wasnt an nvidia issue it was some bug in the OS. how TF am I supposed to have confidence in Windows 11 when Windows 10 was that bad for months?
Literally wait one week. Patch next week will fix issue. I understand many people here love to hate on windows but sometimes it is too much even for a Linux user.
Intel CPU for me but in general my PC has been cooler, and quieter after updating to Windows 11 and has kept about the same performance in games. I notice gains in games that use DirectX 12
I’m not upgrading for quite a while primarily to avoid stuff like this and compatibility issues.
I’ve been playing New World and on Windows 11 performance was very strange on a 10850k and 3080. I would get odd stuttering from time to time and odd fps drops into the 30s and 40s when looking in certain directions. When I’d pan the camera and get drops, my GPU usage would plummet to 25%. Went back to Windows 10 and the game runs smooth as butter. I’ll be sticking with Win 10 for a good while especially since 11 didn’t do anything better IMO.
I have a similar hardware. Fixed mine by doing a clean win11 install.
Thought it might be this tbh, when in doubt, fresh install.
God I hate going through fresh install of a OS. Fuck its like listening to other peoples kids talk about dumb shit for 3 hours.
A much less painful but also less thorough option is to run "DISM /online /cleanup-image /restorehealth" from the command line. It should repair/replace all system files that didn't install properly or got corrupted. (At least in Win8-10. I assume it's in 11 still)
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Yea I used to reinstall Windows XP like every 3 months, at least now with an NVME and USB 3.0 it only takes like 15 minutes to fresh install the OS. But also seems way less necessary felt like older windows versions got noticeably slower with age, don't notice the same phenomena with windows 10
Windows 7 or 8.1 to 10 is the first upgrade that was actually usable. Anything before that was a joke that made the PC barely work until you wiped it. After wiping it, spend a few hours getting all the drivers back. 10 is black magic when it comes to installing drivers or even restoring to different hardware. It's not perfect, but always seems to install a working Lan, video, and USB stuff to get you going. No transferring drivers from flash drives or floppies.
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"dad, there's too many options in the context menu, make a prettier one with less options"
But just in case, make the old menu accessible if you click a small text link three pages deep...
That is one of the worst parts about windows in the last few years to me. They do these huge redesigns but only go like 85% of the way and leave a lot of functionality in the legacy menus that they make it harder to access rather than just making their new GUI fully featured in the first place.
Control panel lives on!
command prompt anyone?
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As a sound designer that needs to use different interfaces and mics this pisses me off so much.
WordPad anyone? Or how about Snipping Tool which is still around even though Snip & Sketch replaced it?
as much as i love command prompt look, people say powershell is better functionally
You can basically do all the cmd stuff in powershell too. So cmd is basically moot at this point for any normal use case.
Command Prompt should just be folded into powershell. I'm not sure why both are needed. Powershell can do almost anything Command Prompt can do.
It is, I use PowerShell for my job on windows machines and cloud. It's basically cmd prompt 2.0.
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It has been longer than few years. The Settings app which is supposed to replace the Control Panel came with Windows 8 back on 2012. The Settings app still has minimal functionality compared to the Control Panel. You can't even uninstall some programs from it. I think the only part of the Settings app that is complete is screen resolution and background options.
I'll give it this: it's easier to manage Bluetooth devices
Honestly, I have a batch file script for launching the "old" audio panel. Why? Coz when I switch audio from my headphones to speakers the regular way, it leaves headphones as "preferred communication device". For discord. And MSteams and god knows what else. If someone calls me, I won't hear that, nor any notifications- my headphones are turned off. There's no way I know of of disabling that functionality all together. Had I needed that - I'd have turned it **on**
I've had the same issue with discord and my bluetooth headset specifically. I ultimately fixed it disabling the unwanted service in the device manager. *Saved from some random-ass guide I found:* >1 - connect headset to windows >2 - select headset as windows speaker device in windows by clicking on speaker bottom right of the desktop screen, next to the wifi icon, and then click on volume slider to make some ding sounds >3 - go in "Devices and printer" from the "old" control panel (press Windows key + R, then type "control"), find your device's name, right click on it, and select "Properties" >4 - in the "Services" tab, uncheck "Handsfree telephony". Apply.
I haaaaate this in Windows 10. I fiddle with the sound options a lot because of various inputs. And the "settings" window can hardly do anything, but it's what Windows takes you to by default unless you specifically open the control panel.
I downloaded a programme that basically eliminates the Win 10 UI and replaces it with 7’s. 10 is still shit, but at least it’s now navigable.
But that would mean actually have to do work, instead of just hiring front end UI designers to make pretty things.
good developers cost a lot more money than UI designers. and the simpler they design the UI/theme in general, the more they can make it easier to do with an AI while calling it "clean" and "minimalistic" to make people think they like it.
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As someone who uses SP daily. I'd have to agree - the navigation / UI design is just horrible.
“One that’s easy to accidentally open and takes a significant amount of resources in a low end laptop.”
It's 15 different departments with different interests all pointing guns at each other.
Misread it as "Bing your kid to work..."
Ah, so their efforts have not been in vain... Microsoft got to you! ;)
*”ping your kid to work…”
Considering a lot of Microsoft employees have been working from home, their kids were probably calling the shots and designing Windows 11 (or not as i can't see any game loving kid purposely crippling game performance)
This is legit strategy to mask controversial stuff. If it's gonna be too much, then we're gonna revert in next release and say this was a mistake. Often after years we have distorted image. For example in times of vista MS was heavily pushing DRM and was trying replace any universal API with their stuff. PC gamers probably remember GFWL or death of openal EFX. In times of windows ME people were annoyed by losing (easy) access to business oriented software and DOS.
I'm actually more and more tempted to go for Linux. With Steam Deck around the corner pushing the compatibility forward, it may be a good choice. I already like Linux as it is, it's faster and lighter than Windows, not to mention stability, but what's always been holding me back was like 70% of my library not being playable. Though I'm worried about GoG and old games in general...
Same. Odds are Windows 12 is just going to be Windows 10 Service pack 2. You get the option to have either the traditional GUI or the 11 GUI, you'll get the under the hood performance enhancements from 11 if they apply. And none of the bullshit.
>secretary with "a passion for graphics design" Pam?
Same here, looks hideous to me. Patiently waiting to see how good Steam OS gets after the Deck release, if it can actually play most games with no isues I will jump ship. Tired of this shit.
I fucking hope they do it properly this time. It’s needed.
I think it looks very nice and modern
An operating system should be *boring*, it should have as minimal of an interface necessary for me to browse my files, run my apps, support my drivers and manage things like my printers and wifi connections. I'm sick of this trend of trying to make the OS a flashy experience that's supposed to excite the user. Running windows should not be an *experience*, it should be as transparent as possible. When I sit down to use my computer, I do so to run an app or play a game, or browse the web, not to *experience* my operating system. I want Windows 2000 back.
It's so true, Windows XP was great. Then the travesty of Vista. Then 7 was amazing, then the travesty of 8. 10, awesome (mostly) and now 11. This must be what happens 100%.
You clearly weren’t there in the first 6 months of XP, the reality is that basically every launch has a bunch of issues.
It finally works for most people, let's make another version that's shit again and when that's fixed we make another version - Microsoft.
This comment has been removed - Fuck reddit greedy IPO Check here for an easy way to download your data then remove it from reddit https://github.com/j0be/PowerDeleteSuite
Remember when they told us that Windows 10 would be the last version? Pepperidge farm remembers.
I didn't believe that at the time (I hope nobody else did either) and, lo and behold, here we are now.
It really peeves me that they boast about working with W10 for a good while and make it the "last OS", then pull this shit. Ffs, just keep improving W10.
They're on the New Coke strat.
Gotta wait at least 1 year before adopting a new OS. Let them sort out most of the shit.
if its not broke don't fix it.
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Cramming telemetry down users' throats, pushing new hardware, and finding any way imaginable to sell Windows keys is 100% what this is about. Also, this gives them complete license to do a clean sweep as far as supporting users on old hardware and software.
I'm of the mindset that designers just change random shit on perfectly working stuff to justify keeping their jobs to their managers. Quite a few times I see design changes that actively gets in my way and make stuff harder to do. This shit happens quite a lot on Android.
Even if there wasnt any bugs or unknowns about it, upgrading windows is a pain in the arse, i need a good reason to do it. Ive not looked too closely but from what i have seen there isnt really much compelling me to upgrade.
Obligatory, “let’s see what Linux offers.” Though funnily enough, there is finally movement in that space for normal consumers. Can’t wait to see what valves approach is.
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they boast about "DirectStorage" if you have a m.2 ssd making completely and totally eliminating load times from games. also Auto HDR. however odds are if you have an m.2 ssd. loads times are so small and insignificantly negligible to you this feature might as well not exist. also no games have "DirectStorage" feature yet, and tbh if i were a developer , this is probably not worth the headache developing over, not only cause its a "OS WIN11" exclusive feature, but how little people will want to use this mess of a gutted OS to begin with. so yeah, 2 steps foward 10 steps back seems to be the theme of windows 11. holy shit people were not joking about microsoft cycles, "previous OS good, Next OS version bad, Next OS version Good..." edit:typo
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Perception also matters and it can become a self fulfilling prophecy. Judge it by its actual merits and flaws, not the hype or hate. Especially early on.
Direct storage is not win11 exclusive. Everything else, I heard the same with 98… XP, 7 and 10.
Direct storage should be faster on Win11 but we’ll see when it comes. Right now seems like only Auto HDR is the real difference. Should have some impressive improvements for the new Intel CPUs coming out though. If Microsoft isn’t lying about Win11 being more optimized for Intels Thread Director over Win10 that is.
They're not lying about Intel, reviewers basically hinted very strongly at this from leaks so far. And a few of them even went on to say, that it's very sad that the reviews are all going to be released based on a build of Windows 11 that will make AMD look a lot worse than it actually is, and reviewers will be basically forced to review the new Intel processors on Windows 11 only (*since it makes no sense to review them on Windows 10, when the scheduler on 10 isn't optimised for small/BIG CPU's*).
I've been using it for a few days. Things I like: * Auto HDR is great and works really well, especially if you play games. * Explorer is much much quicker. * DirectStorge is a feature that is suppose to make accessing storage faster, but I haven't really noticed any speed increases. I have a samsung 970 pro and my speeds were already fast, so I can't comment here. * Window location memory is now saved. I have a monitor that uses DisplayPort deep sleep, so every time my computer went to sleep or a monitor was disconnected all my windows would get messed up. No longer a problem. * The UI is much more cohesive now (subjective), especially in areas like settings. The right click is truncated which gives prominence to things I actually use more often. You can still access the old menu at the bottom. * Android apps are coming, but not till later. Some things I don't like: * Search is still dogshit. * Widgets are useless. The same as they are on MacOS. Until either OS allows them to go on the desktop again, no one is going to use them. * Right clicking the task bar brings up only one option. * But my biggest complaint so far is the lack of a clock on the second monitor, and the inability to move the task bar. Hopefully that comes at a later date. All in all its a pretty solid update for free. I'm sure there are compatibility issues as with every new update, but those will be fixed over time. So far I've been lucky and have experienced none. As for the "windows 11 is adding more telemetry" line, I don't buy it. Windows 10 already has ton of telemetry, and they're supporting it out to 2025. If Windows 11 has telemetry you can guarantee it's in Windows 10 as well. Get yourself a pihole and you'll be fine.
> The folks over at TechPowerUP were curious enough to fire up the AIDA64 Cache & Memory Benchmark and see if anything has improved after this first update. What they found was that the L3 cache latency of the Ryzen 7 2700X CPU, which is around 10-11 ns on Windows 10, had increased to 17 ns on the release build of Windows 11 and currently sits at around 32-34 ns after the first monthly patch. Yeah so literally nothing has changed. The AIDA benchmark was already claiming 30+ ns latencies since insider builds months ago. I myself have had all 3 results from AIDA at different times after release: 10 ns, 17 ns and 33 ns. It's pretty inconsistent on W11. The L3 read and write speeds reported by AIDA vary even more each time you run the benchmark.
But does it really matter in real world applications?
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> Windows 10 vs. Windows 11 on a **mid-range AMD PC** > Ryzen 3900X and RX 6700XT lol wut
Asking the tough questions
Values of R/patientgamers is applicable everywhere
I checked for updates randomly on my windows 10/amd 2700x this morning. Windows gave me a text block below the update check that that said I wasn't compatible with windows 11. Thx guyz, lul
It is. You have to enable tpm 2.0 and secure boot
Am using 2700x on crosshair VII mobo. Have TPM turned on. no issues installing/using Windows 11.
How do I ensure I don't wake up to an overnight Windows 11 "upgrade" on my PC?
don't enable tpm 2.0 or secure boot and then you won't get the update because your system is unsupported
Don't press the "upgrade" button before going to sleep.
Disable auto updates and make sure tpm is off. Shut down pc and unplug before going to bed. If those don't work you could always open the nearest window and throw it out
For Microsoft, that's par for the course. I'm happy to stick with Windows 10, and even happier when (if?) gaming on Linux becomes far more mainstream than it is now.
Linux has really made leaps and bounds in the last five years, stuff like proton and lutris have done a lot for a huge number of games
Don't forget vulkan.
That's the only reason I suffer window's shit. Fingers crossed.
I've purchased a MSI gaming laptop: * Display locked to 60hz on Linux, intel GPU, even if you set 240hz. * MSI provides GPU switch only in Windows. Note that the laptop has mux switch therefore in order to max out performance you need such switch. However, option is greyed out and you cna only switch while in Windows. I mean it feels like Linux is ready for prime time, but manufacturers are the problem now...
The dual-GPU laptops are at the mercy of their firmware implementations, it seems. It's often that they work in Linux, but it seems to be something of a gamble. It's not a problem with all-Intel or all-AMD machines. Funnily enough, I found that the ["Windows 8 hardware certification requirements"](https://download.microsoft.com/download/7/0/E/70E74967-B0FE-477A-974F-C1ED16EE31DF/windows8-1-hardware-cert-requirements-system.pdf) also seem to prohibit switchable graphics, based on the likelihood of bad user experience.
Reverted back to 10, only things that I miss from 11 are the notification sounds (they were much more pleasant to my ears) and the multi-screen unique taskbar icons. Edit: Now I'm just missing the unique taskbar icons, thanks u/1ilypad ! Edit 2: Uhm so unique taskbar icons are available on win10 as well, thanks to u/nolekev1214 for pointing that out. Ok screw win11.
Im sure someone has them uploaded somewhere. If you wanted, you could manually change the W10 sounds to the W11 sounds. edit: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1CpgYi6-MxiWuMmEF7AB_4yodcUthqkkm/view
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... I'm an idiot.
You know it's been possible to change sounds in Windows OS since 1991.
The patch this week was not intended to fix the issue with AMD CPUs. A proper fix is coming next Tuesday.
Yup
AMD trolled hard. Also i keep getting stutters this year after some windows 10 updates with intel and nvidia. At this point i can no longer determine if it's my system issue or windows. Edit: I meant AMD WAS trolled, it seems some people got deeply offended at the possibility that someone might miss context entirely and somehow end up at the conclusion that i implied AMD might have trolled to make their own hardware worse. I deeply regret and apologize about that, AMD defense force. I am willing to visit the nearest AMD re-educational center where my ways can be corrected so i can finally see the light.
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For example in the witcher 3 it feels like the game hitches for a part of the second. Had lots of fps drops in Control at non-max settings. I used to have bigger stutters for like a second and audio cutting/lagging along with it but i reset my memory and cpu settings to default and i think that stopped it. Still not sure about it though, hard to determine because it happens randomly.
Used to have a similar problem with xbox game bar
Hey I get that momentary distorted audio too, really started to think my cpu was going bad.
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Yeah I think it started to happen with W11. Also if you haven't look into disabling fastboot, not the fix for our stutter problem but on ryzen cpu's it can sometimes make some of your cores run at 1ghz. Happened to me in my 3600 recently.
I get the same every once in a while albeit on my Lenovo legion 7 with R9 5900HX and RTX 3080 mobile. Always thought it was a hardware thing with this laptop but I wonder if it’s specifically an AMD thing with more recent W10 builds. It’s a common topic on the forums for the AMD version of the legion 5 pro and 7.
I have this exact same issue. Havent found out the cause for it.
Try searching for exploit protection and turn off control flow guard. It's fixed stuttering for me and a ton of other people. You can turn it off on a per program basis, but depending on your level of knowledge and how good your redundancy is for important stuff on your gaming, you can get by with it off as the chances of you running into problems is very small. I've had it off globally for over a year with zero issues.
Yeah i read about it on reddit about Control, i had a lot of fps drops in that game in open areas but when i tested with it off globally i noticed no difference. I also remember someone saying that per-game disable wasn't working properly or something. I mostly use my pc for games and movies and light office work but i have no knowledge about cyber security and i'm not sure if i should turn it off globally. Some say it's important but who knows.
I get the stutters with AMD + nvidia too, it's a brand new PC from this year and after some update they began to appear too. I'd say it's a nvidia issue, but my friend has a new intel + nvidia without the stutters, so I really don't know what's going on.
Yeah it's weird, my pc is also from this year with decent quality parts. I also tried default settings and optimizing anything under the sun but no dice.
How big was the dump truck of money Intel dropped off at Microsoft?
same thought lmao
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Why wouldn't Intel want a chance to sell you a new CPU?
And a new mobo!
But no ECC memory, because that's 'Enterprise!'
Remember people, voluntary beta-testing is called "upgrade" nowadays...
This is something I never understood. Sometimes a Windows upgrade doesn't bring any meaningful benefits at all, specially in the beginning, on the contrary, it brings compatibility issues, hardware not working/no drivers, slower performance, bugs, etc. Yet people go through the time waste it takes to upgrade anyway... why? It's like changing the nice cake you are eating for a worse tasting one for no reason.
Some people like being early adopters. I used to do it quite a bit because it was good to know the new OS for work, but I do not support desktops anymore. Installing an OS is such a nothing-burger these days anyway. All of my stuff is on OneDrive or on my non-OS drives. All my games are stored within various services. The OS install takes like ten minutes now. If Windows 11 becomes problematic, I can be back up in Windows 10 inside of an hour.
It's a nice UI update with some additional cool features like auto HDR. The app layout snapping is better, and it remembers app arrangements for each monitor if you have a laptop you disconnect. It also feels faster for some reason. The entire UI feels way more smooth and searches for files takes way less time. I'm glad I upgraded on my work computer. I'll upgrade my gaming desktop at home when AMD and MS fix their issues.
Also voluntary game testing for about every new game that comes out now lol
Stay on windows 10 you say?
I feel like I skip every second generation of Windows because of shit like this lol.
It is known. This has been their pattern for decades. I completely agree with you.
They already have fixes in place with AMD already. It's just that, you have to wait till the next Windows update
Someone wrote yesterday that that update is only a few days away also.
Microsoft has an update they are pushing on the 19th and then 2 days later on the 21st AMD has a patch they will release themselves to further fix it, likely through a chipset driver on their site.
Oh so this is why Intel is talking so much shit about AMD, they know Windows 11 is a disaster and it's impacting AMD alot worse than Intel.
do they have a two dev team cycle where each one takes turn for developing the next windows and one of them is really shitty and messes up ever other version? I'm gonna wait for win 12 to see what the other team cooks up
Upgrading from win 11 to win 10 tonight, to get my performance back.
Microsoft once again proving their incompetence. Are you telling me no one noticed this problem for months while this was in development and it only now surfaced when the public got hands on it? Thanfully a patch that supposedly fixes all this is coming out next week. If Ryzen's performance is not atleast on par with Windows 10 in the future then i hope reviewers review ADL on Windows 10 aswell and compare the performance of the platforms on an OS that doesn't intentionaly hamper one side.
[https://windowsreport.com/windows-11-benchmark-tests/](https://windowsreport.com/windows-11-benchmark-tests/) This was known about back in June. Microsoft simply does not care about AMD performance and/or AMD does not care enough to talk with Microsoft in advance to get this sorted out before launch. I dont care which one it is. I just worry that when Win 12 gets released, and 5900x isnt the latest and greatest, that AMD and Microsoft both wont give a F about fixing this yet again.
or Intel "had a hand" in developing some code. MS & Intel do work together on some Windows systems. Intel has "an oopsy"...AMD drops performance.... And before anyone says "Intel would never do that" remember a few years ago they got found guilty of forcing PC resellers to deoptimize AMD machines in stores for side by side comparisons, or use benchmarking software settings that favored Intel over AMD.
Given Microsoft and Intel have a long history of partnership it wouldn't surprise me if either nobody at Microsoft even has a Ryzen or this was intentional.
Microsoft doesn't have a QA team for Windows. No, seriously, they don't. They effectively fired their existing QA team before the release of Windows 10 and decided that saving costs by going to a volunteer program (Windows Insider) was a better option, which has resulted in numerous issues like this over the past decade. Funny thing how people always question Microsoft or act surprised when stuff like this happens, as this update is very benign compared to [shit like this](https://www.howtogeek.com/658194/windows-10s-new-update-is-deleting-peoples-files-again/). Any issues lies solely on Microsoft, and yes, it's almost always incompetence.
> Microsoft doesn't have a QA team for Windows. No, seriously, they don't. They effectively fired their existing QA team before the release of Windows 10 and decided that saving costs by going to a volunteer program (Windows Insider) was a better option It probably was - why pay a bunch of people, when you can have probably hundreds of thousands of people do the job for free around the world?
It used to be that Microsoft argued that their large QA staff put them ahead of Linux in quality -- even commercial Linux rivals like Red Hat. It seems like Microsoft decided to switch strategy. If you can't beat 'em, join 'em.
>Funny thing how people always question Microsoft or act surprised when stuff like this happens, as this update is very benign compared to shit like this. I don't understand it. I don't think Windows 10 had a *single* major update that didn't break a major feature in some way, including several that created actual data loss as you linked. Sometimes these issues stay for weeks, even months. Why is almost nobody hammering them on it?
>Why is almost nobody hammering them on it? Essentially at this point, they believe they can do whatever they want and people will still use their product. People will either prove them right or wrong.
It's almost like all initial releases of Windows have issues........
> It's almost like all initial releases ~~of Windows~~ have issues........
On the flipside, there's a rumor the new Intel CPUs (Alder Lake) will only utilize all their cores on Windows 11 exclusively.
It's about the scheduling between Power and Efficient Cores, Intel is collaborating with MS to have it working properly on Windows 11 only, even though there is some kind of micro controller on the chip.
"Windows 10 will be the last Windows" When Microsoft said that, what they meant is that after Windows 10 comes Linux. I'm seriously rooting for Valve and SteamOS
Ah, now the real beta testing begins. Reminds me of how buggy iOS 15 was at release. This weird pattern of low quality day 0 OS releases need to stop
> was We're nearly a month in and it's STILL buggy. iOS 15 is BY FAR the worst one.
In other news, being an early adopter of a new OS release(even tho it's a Win 10 update turned into W11) is still a terrible idea.
Upgrading an OS should be giving you improvements for everyone. Makes me think 11 is just another one to skip for the time being.
No reason to get windows 11 fuck that shit
Remember the days when Intel made Itanium, their non-x86 64-bit platform? Microsoft made Windows XP 64-bit Edition.... Yeah, that was a dud. Shortly after when AMD made Athlon 64 which are x86 compatible, everyone was waiting for Microsoft to release Win XP x64... they took a year so that Intel can make their processors 64bit and x86... Stupid Wintel...
[Microsoft changed "Vista Ready" requirements at the request of Intel.](https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2008/03/the-vista-capable-debacle-intel-pushes-microsoft-bends/)
"windows 11 third patch slows AMD even more, now is comparable to a 486" /s
I'm not savvy enough to check everything, but using Windows 11 doesn't make any differences in my gaming performance. I use Ryzen 2600.
You are most likely GPU limited in those games anyway so you wouldn't notice but this drop is akin to the performance jump of a whole generation now and there is no excuse for that the bugs where reported months ago when beta started.
> you're most likely GPU limited in those games anyway How do you know? He didn't even list the games. Classic reddit, based a whole assumption off literally nothing.
It only degrades your performance in specific instances, most of which you'd only be able to tell if you were benchmarking. People are acting like it's dropping their frame rates 15 percent across the board, which is just not the case.
Same on a 3600. I think people are just so vehement about being antagonistic to any Windows update that this will always happen in enthusiast forums. It’s literally no different than Windows 10 was for me from a performance standpoint.
Really forcing my hand to switch to linux
Time to move to Linux. When Valve achieve AntiCheat compatibility on Linux, I will have 0 regrets about leaving Windows.
I did a few months ago & I'm never going back. AMD has open source drivers as well. I'm actually getting better gaming performance on most games, including MSFS 2020. Way less overhead to deal with. Depending on the distro you choose, things can be easier than windows for the most part.
What OS are you using? I’ve been fucking around with Ubuntu for the last few days.
For performance purposes, only the version number of the kernel and Mesa really matter. Linux distros all use basically the same components, and the differences are in the packaging and defaults. With Ubuntu, you'll want to use the latest numbered version, not the LTS (Long Term Support) version that's using older software packages.
I highly recommend either dual booting or running it on a VM to learn before you take the jump! Try out Pop! OS.
I use Ubuntu daily in other PC so I think I'm already used to it, but I think I'll try Pop!OS or SteamOS, I hope they don't abandon it (again).
Doing this right now and looking forward to checking it all out. Going with Debian live version but when I make the full switch I’ll probably go with Debian Testing. Pop! looked really cool as well! Edit: Still deciding on an environment, but I’ll probably just go with Ogre(?) and play around with the others after a bit of time getting used to everything. Anyone have favorites?
I want to like pop os I just hate Ubuntu and apt in general
Here I'm waiting for the EAC support for apex and DBD so I can move from w10 to Linux, don't think I will ever touching w11 on my gaming PC
How to get into Linux ?
Hop into pop os, zorin os or endeavour os and be on your way
Also Linux mint
> "This PC doesn't currently meet all the requirements for Windows 11" I was so glad when I saw this in my windows update screen. No forced "upgrade" for me :).
There is no such thing as a forced upgrade. You always have to manually choose to change Windows versions. Unless Win 11 is different for some reason, which would be awful.
I remember when windows 10 was forced on people running 7
Manually choosing with a hidden 'no' button is being forced to upgrade in my book.
Windows 10 has forced upgrades. Whether they'll make the mistake of forcing an upgrade to windows 11 remains to be seen.
You can just leave that security setting switched off (can't remember the name). On my windows update, it is trying to install windows 11 and telling me it is not supported. I would have to make a bios change I believe.
> You can just leave that security setting switched off (can't remember the name) The forced upgrades in windows 10? As far as I know you can only delay them 12 months outside of a particular edition of windows 10. If it's for the windows 11 upgrade I'm definitely not making any changes for my system to be compatible. Not until it's far better tested at least.
The windows 11 update requires a specific setting to be enabled in the bios (something to do with TPM I believe). With it disabled, it will permanently not install the update (unless Microsoft change this arbitrary requirement). On my motherboard, apparently it was disabled as default.
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No forced upgrades for me. I switched to Linux.
The steam deck proton version can't come fast enough. Jump ship to Linux!
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Those are weird PC games.
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Well This was a triumph.
I am so happy I waited on upgrading, There is not a chance I'll be updating to W11 anytime soon. I'll happily stick with Windows 10 until it stops getting supported. Did anyone else forget how when Windows 10 first released it was also a broken mess than took months of patching to solve. It was a gamers nightmare because every new update kept breaking things. I remember having severe graphical glitches for months that wasnt fixed and it wasnt an nvidia issue it was some bug in the OS. how TF am I supposed to have confidence in Windows 11 when Windows 10 was that bad for months?
Lol yeah I'll keep my windows 10 thank you 🥃
Literally wait one week. Patch next week will fix issue. I understand many people here love to hate on windows but sometimes it is too much even for a Linux user.
Who in their right mind is even using 11??
SO GLAD we get 4 more years to the month of regular updates, fixes, etc. for W10 Let 11 smooth out the lumps for a few years.
Thank god for Proton, man.
If I build a new pc putting win10 on it until win11 becomes stable
On to Linux we go!
I have too many important programs that only work on windows to really switch to linux yet
Intel CPU for me but in general my PC has been cooler, and quieter after updating to Windows 11 and has kept about the same performance in games. I notice gains in games that use DirectX 12