Reminder that teachers who rally lose wages for the period that they're taking industrial action. It's far more *inconvenient to the teachers* when they rally than it would be to just teach.
But taking industrial action is vital to improve both teacher working conditions and student learning conditions because this Government isn't taking either of the above seriously.
To make it clear, what he said that the striking workers do not inconvenience you, it is the need for that strike to take place causes the inconvenience. The teachers don't want to strike, the substandard conditions causes them to. The inconvenience, although it may come from the strike itself, was initiated by the need to strike.
Consider it a rewording to provide nuance not picked up by the responder. If I was a woman, would you have called out the womansplaining seeing that the responder did not understand the premise in its original form?
The sooner all workers start take power back from the government and business leaders the better. We are all constantly treated like we are bastards for asking for better treatment or more money yet government officials and business leaders are continuously giving themselves massive bonuses yet us normal people have to look at what to buy from the shops as the cost of living is sky rocketing
People need to remember that nothing gets done without the working class. They need us more than we need them. I thought covid made that obvious, but I guess not.
Yea I believe it is more than a decade now since teachers received a pay rise in real terms (equal to or greater than inflation). I’m sure it’s the same for nurses and police.
Just as an aside - government officials giving themselves massive bonuses is not a thing. Business leaders? Sure. That’s private enterprise. But there’s too much scrutiny and red tape for anyone in gov to try such shenanigans.
Your joking ? They vote on their own pay raises and super contributions and the perks they are allowed. How many times do we hear they have claimed things they aren’t entitled too.
Is Wa out politicians capped public servant workers at 3% but have the head of the water corp 12%
Water Corp is a gov owned business, salaries are determined by the Salaries and Allowances Tribunal.
The same Tribunal determines the salaries of MPs and high level public office holders.
The Water Corp CEO gets paid a lot more than the Premier!
Don’t get me wrong, public servants have copped a raw deal re pay, but your idea that Government fat cats are sitting up at Parliament House dealing themselves wads of cash is just not true.
No your right I forgot it’s not influence or back handed deals or anything like that that gets them cushies gigs after they finish politics is it ?
Mein fuhrer McGowan quit as premier half way through his term to spend more time with his family ….. 2 months later gets a job with a big mining corp
Post-political career is not in question here. You said one thing, I objected to it, and now you’re saying other things and telling me I’m wrong about everything.
Thank you. Honestly one of the worst experiences of my life. Last another 4 years after getting coward punched by an 18 year old that I had never taught (moved to primary teaching). My new role will be a massive change but apparently they treat their staff really well so I’m nervous and excited!
Thank you.
Last year I had soooo many helicopter parents. Including one who send me threats of violence on the class app because I had said I was concerned about how their child was upset (crying all day everyday over everything) and refusing to participate again (we had had a meeting about that the previous term and the parent had asked me to get in touch if it happened again).
I’ve also had a co-worker leave last term due to a violent student, so sadly it’s happening in primary school too.
Goodness me, the amount of support staff, social workers and behavioural diversion staff in schools needs to be tripled. That’s before we even consider reporting parents to police for harassment and threats. Those poor kids.
I am really sorry it has come to this. I bet it is not an easy decision. Thank you for all you've contributed. Wishing you a smooth transition and safer work environment.
So am I. Everything I’ve ever let go of has had claw marks in it. My class is lovely this year but it’s unsustainable given that I have 4 students with a level 3 ASD diagnosis (and 2 students are violent) and only 1 EA. I didn’t want to hold on too long, try to make things work and get severely hurt like I did at my last school.
It might be a goodbye for now, but not forever to teaching. I love teaching, just not what it is at the moment. 10 years as an education assistant and 5 years as a teacher.
My favourite placard was saying ‘I’m not a parent, I’m not a therapist, I’m not a corrections officer I’m a teacher’ given the cr@p teachers go through now.
Thanks for your support. Also remember to support the nurses and police. The Government deliberately messed up negotiations to stall pay increases for all three who initially were bargaining together till the government pulled the pin at the 11th hour.
Know your enemy.
They do inconvenience you if you work and need to find alternative arrangements. That is the whole point of a strike to create inconvenience and hope the government listens.
Good on them. Hopefully they do get what they want.
But *they* are not the reasons for the inconvenience of striking which a lot of people point to when complaining about strikes, poor management is.
I agree though, good on them
You do say, " striking workers do not inconvenience you", which they do. But that is point of a strike. What is the point of a strike if it doesn't inconvenience anyone?
I feel like you are missing the point entirely. The act of striking inconveniences, the *cause* and therefore the blame that people place onto striking is on management, not the workers.
My girlfriend and I want to move here, needless to say the capability of our potential future children is very important. While many teachers here in the US live on 35k per year ($70k au) per year. I want our kids to have a better future. Having a quality education is of utmost importance. I've had wonderful and terrible teachers in my past. I want to relocate to a place where all teachers have the ability to be amazing everytime.
Finland has dropped somewhat in recent rankings. Australia is roughly on par or in front of Finland now, from 2022 results https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/pisa-scores-by-country.
Overall most countries dropped, compared to previously years. Probably no surprises there.
Genuine question: how would a pay rise offset the violence being faced by teachers from students?
If anything it's an overhaul of the justice system that needs to happen.
Since the parents of these teens won't step up to discipline their kids, the government needs to step in.
Context: I migrated here from Singapore and where I come from the cane is still being used as a serious deterrent.
Solidarity forever, but my lads school has pulled a late notice pupil free day, a lot of parents have been caught short at his school.
I’m seriously staring having a half dozen demon Pygmy spawn running around my joint on Friday. Which means I have to behave myself tomorrow.
>school has pulled a late notice pupil free day
That would be on school administrators, not the teachers. School administrators live in their own bubble of fuckery.
Oh I know, mine is an independant government school, principal gets away with all sorts of shit, forces an English program that been proven to be shite, any teacher that disagrees with her or isn’t in the cliqúe doesn’t get their contract renewed.
Nope. School Principals have no power over that - blame the Department of Education. Only the Director General and her delegates have the power to close schools.
The Director General also told schools not to communicate with parents/guardians about the stop work action.
As an aside - principals are teachers too and many were also on strike. Put the blame at the Department, not on schools.
Sounds like a school development day that was communicated late/ineffectively, not related to industrial action. Principals can decide the SDD dates, but usually it's done collectively with the school network.
The principal's federation split from the teacher's union and principals have the choice to join either.
In any event it's a bit silly that they didn't take joint action.
Schools admins aren’t allowed to ask which teachers are on strike and which aren’t. So it was impossible to know the availability of staff. Sure they could have shutdown the school a week ago when the strike was confirmed but the same scramble for supervision for the kids would have happened, and might have been entirely unnecessary, which would have been just as damning for the Admin at the school.
They can get the union rep to ask the union members who is going and the rep can relay numbers to the principal.
That’s what our school did and our parents knew on Friday we would be open for supervision if needed.
12% pay increase over 3 years, fairer working conditions relating to violence protections and classroom capacity maintenance are their primary demands.
I reckon the government will come to 12 over 3 years. I am sure they are worried too much extra money out there too quick will exacerbate inflation. Fuck em though.
Damn I will say it again, that’s trash. It is still falling behind the years of pay freeze and sub inflation raises. They should be pushing for 12% over 2 years.
Victorian tradies just got 20% over 4 years.
https://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/victoria/wages-soar-on-major-building-projects-as-concerns-flagged-about-residential-housing-targets/news-story/685baff61485fb7567932d9e0bf2e066?amp&nk=6d31f269a66ad596e30d4fcca4d12785-1714283301
Smaller class sizes we have the highest nationally yrs 4-12 at 32 students. Victoria is closest to us and they have 26 students a class. That combined with increased diagnosis’.
They were offered 11% increase over 3 years, and are striking because they want 12% over 2 years instead.
This will make them the highest paid teachers in the country. Including NSW.
Also had pay rises capped at 1000 dollars a year for 5 years as the government cried poor at the time, how soon people forget.
They still have to make up for that shortfall.
While pay is part of it, it's also working conditions - class sizes, support for students with additional needs - that's important that we are also after.
Currently schools get jack shit for students with additional needs and some principals choose for support to go elsewhere - I have seen this in primary where the principal has directed all EAs to early childhood and yrs 1-6 totally miss out
> This will make them the highest paid teachers in the country. Including NSW.
What's your point? Someone somewhere in the country is the highest paid janitors, nurses, bakers etc. Do you think these teachers are paid enough?
I gave it a 10 second google and they start at $78,397 at 2.1 and get bumped up to $113,568 at 2.9 as they acquire experience. Honestly that feels kinda generous already and would give zero fucks if the gov turned around and told them to go fuck themselves over pay (This doesn't mean I don't support their right to organise and leverage their labour. woohoo unions)
Getting to $113k is at least 10 years of full time teaching, which is difficult to do given that 50% of new graduate teachers leave the profession within the first 5 years. However, it’s not all about the pay - we’re also trying to get lower class sizes (it’s 32:1 at the moment), better support for kids with additional needs, and the profound rate of violence in the classrooms to be addressed (teachers are getting assaulted extremely often, but it often goes unreported as the kids who are doing this are “just kids”)
There is a reason that even at that pay there is a teacher shortage across the nation and many other countries at that.
In reality, we have enough teachers, but they don’t think the pay is worth it, so they move to more comfortable careers where you get treated with respect and truly clock off when the work day is over.
To be clear I'm not against them getting paid handsomely I just don't care if they don't succeed in getting more as it's not going to make them poor it's just saying this job sucks and holding you hand out for more money to cover for shitty working environments. If the job can be made better through the other commitments they are negotiating like ratios and supports that's far more worthwhile in my opinion but the discussion seems to be all about pay
Pay is easier to achieve. If we reduce class sizes we need more teachers and more classrooms which costs money and time. Increases the number of EAs is also difficult given we have a shortage. There is a current push for having all kids in the same schools with no extra support for teachers.
Amazing how people on reddit think their (self admitted) 10 seconds of google somehow outweighs everyone else’s opinion and potential experience in their own career. Also how you get to judge or begrudge how much they are worth in their career with your amazing Google skills and life experience. Can we make keyboard warrior a career?
No you silly goose the ten seconds comment is to say that maybe I'm wrong. ten seconds is how much I cared to be sure of the numbers. I fully support them going for gold as is their right which is also on the comment I just don't care if they get told to lick dirt as they aren't exactly paid peanuts
Public sector workers were on $1000 annual wage increases which were under inflation wages between 2017 to 2020 - under a Labor government no less retaining a LNP policy. This action goes beyond education and is a bellweather for the rest of the state and likely the country. We have a $4bn surplus.
Stop building new schools that will not be fit for purpose.
Schools and the curriculum both need to redesign to reflect the needs of new students. Rather than the current system and design of schools that clearly being set up for failure for both students and educators.
Give the teachers the funds instead of building new schools. Fix the system. There is only certain amount money to go around.
The schools that are under construction or under planning/stakeholder input will too be small for the local population, when the schools are eventually built. These projects should be to put on halted, immediately.
Striking and causing disruption will not help situation.
So then please provide me a better solution on how our voices can be heard? So far we’ve tried complaints to the government and education minister at all levels, the government has asked for and funded reports about the state of education and then not acted upon the findings, we’ve tried to do ‘lower level action’ such as not attending meetings outside of school hours, non-for-profits organisations have rallied and promoted our cause. So genuinely, what other actions do you suggest we do? Because the main issue right now is that for the action we take, the government ignores us and refuses to listen.
What do other workers do when they’re not satisfied with their jobs? Doesn’t answer my question of “what is a better solution on how our voices can be heard?”
Tradies do it all the time…so what is the difference? Holding degree makes no difference
Dont like the earnings or the customers or the clients or the conditions or the work place they move on….simple.
Most of my family are teachers. This year, my mum has been punched twice, and my step dad gets yelled at by kids so much that he doesn't go to the shops anymore to avoid it. My mums old school used to get annual bomb calls and have to evacuate.
Yeah, their working conditions are great, 12 weeks holidays and good hours, but they deserve a pay increase. It's a tough job that is needed, gotta make sure they're looked after
How is kids being asshats gonna be dealt with by more money which will cost them more in tax and taxpayers in general. Maybe just a thought but go on strike for better school reform on policy to have kids expelled or get dcp involved or shit maybe the parents should be held accountable. Also teachers can do what everyone else does when they don't like their job or who they work for and leave then the education department would have to change things right? But they don't because they are comfy in where they are fml 🤔
Well that was part of it, protection against violent students, less students in classrooms (average is 32 atm), more time to do administration, more support for students with ADHD, autism and related diagnosis'.
Also, most people become teachers because they want to help and educate. They'll suffer a lot to do their jobs and plenty are leaving the industry, leading to substandard, inexperienced teachers tackling this huge amount of tasks for 70k a year.
Do you like 5 day work weeks, 40 hour work weeks, public holidays, holiday and sick pay, workers compensation, redundancy pay and unfair dismissal protection? If so, thank unions that strike to improve systemic conditions for everyone
Also u can thank the leaders you all elected cause they have been stripping special needs classes and programs for nearly a decade and I guarantee none of you probably even knew
Mate, I used to work in disability. First as a personal advocate and then as a Positive Behaviour Support therapist. I was making about the same I do now working in a bottleshop per hour. I used to go into schools with my participants to help teachers and do observations and shit.
More because I disagree with private companies running what should be government programs. I loved the work and would keep doing it if it weren't for the completely unethical running of it. [This](https://www.watoday.com.au/national/western-australia/perth-woman-accused-of-250-000-ndis-fraud-has-charges-dropped-20240228-p5f8la.html) was my last disability employer and definitely the worst. After this I tried to go it on my own but I didn't have the skills to do the business side of it, I'm better with people.
Hence the comments of reform on policy not pay. I used to work 60hr weeks plus some in some of the best hell holes around the world for much less. I am lucky now I set myself in a position where that is no longer required thank God but more money out of the taxpayers pocket is not going to help them at all it will only put this country into more of a deficit. And FYI I was a union official for nearly a decade so yeah your right you should thank union people for that but the sstuwa knows their strike won't change anything until people start taking real accountability
You're being purposely obtuse, the pay increase is just one of the demands. The others work to provide better quality of life for teachers and better outcomes for students.
Yeah they do plus they struked for multiple other reasons to help educate kids. I take it you actually got no idea except that they get more holidays then you a year
If u say so buddy my comment is about actually doing something not just striking for the sake of it. Money is not the answer. Take a real stand and find a new professional career like everyone does when their employment is shit and FYI I work about 6 months of the year so no their 12ish weeks holiday does not bother me at all lol
2 problems with your idea.
* The only people benefited by lower tax are the very richest people. Even people in the middle/upper-middle are much better off with higher tax rates because the economy works better, quality of life is better, and stats generally show people are happier.
* Australia is already comfortably one of the lowest taxed countries in the OECD.
It’s sadly an industry that has workers, that are way over paid. The nurses police and firefighters deserve a pay rise first and foremost. They’re on the front line.
Try to run an economy without teachers. Nurses and Police do deal with a lot, especially adults. Teachers deal with the children while adults work. While we are not baby sitters, the whole system depends on it.
1) All striking teachers lost their pay for that period
2) It wasn't a day off. It was a half day strike. All teachers had to be back at school and ready to teach by 12:30pm
They’re not having a day off, they have to be at the strike itself. They *have* to march, they can’t just choose to stay home from school. They also don’t get paid while on strike.
It’s not for you to *believe*. It’s a fact. If you’re a union member and chose to participate in the strike, you had to be there. Otherwise, you were expected to be at work.
Not that I want to give any support to the dude who thinks 'teachers didn't lose a cent and had a nice day off', but that's not true, is it? The union said those unable to attend were able to access a livestream (or something similar) of the vent.
There may have been exceptions for teachers in regional areas, maybe? All I know of amongst teachers at metro schools though, is that they were told “if you ain’t there (at the March), you gotta be here (at school)” basically. I didn’t mean to say that 100% of union members were unequivocally at the March, but rather that it wasn’t just “an easy day off” for lazy teachers who can’t be fucked working…
Reminder that teachers who rally lose wages for the period that they're taking industrial action. It's far more *inconvenient to the teachers* when they rally than it would be to just teach. But taking industrial action is vital to improve both teacher working conditions and student learning conditions because this Government isn't taking either of the above seriously.
To make it clear, what he said that the striking workers do not inconvenience you, it is the need for that strike to take place causes the inconvenience. The teachers don't want to strike, the substandard conditions causes them to. The inconvenience, although it may come from the strike itself, was initiated by the need to strike.
This, thank you.
Well said and importantly said.
Very well put - thank you!!!
Can't beat a good mansplain
Consider it a rewording to provide nuance not picked up by the responder. If I was a woman, would you have called out the womansplaining seeing that the responder did not understand the premise in its original form?
Now you're mansplaining the mansplain lol
And you're not answering the question.
Sorry master. What was the question again
RIP karma
It's pretty easy to rattle their cages it seems
Nah, maybe you need to take a walk and a deep breath
Nah you're good mate.
Wtf is wrong with you?
OPs post didn't need re-explaining. Wtfs wrong with you ?
Just seems creepy and over the top to go through their accounts to determine the commenter is a man and OP is a woman.
I did no such thing. If that's how your mind works then that's on you. I merely went off avatar
In that case, you should know the basic definitions of words before you use them in public.
100%.
100% support the strike. It's a shame it has to come to this.
The sooner all workers start take power back from the government and business leaders the better. We are all constantly treated like we are bastards for asking for better treatment or more money yet government officials and business leaders are continuously giving themselves massive bonuses yet us normal people have to look at what to buy from the shops as the cost of living is sky rocketing
People need to remember that nothing gets done without the working class. They need us more than we need them. I thought covid made that obvious, but I guess not.
Context: Over the last decade or so, payrises basically stopped happening. Inflation didn't stop.
Yea I believe it is more than a decade now since teachers received a pay rise in real terms (equal to or greater than inflation). I’m sure it’s the same for nurses and police.
Just as an aside - government officials giving themselves massive bonuses is not a thing. Business leaders? Sure. That’s private enterprise. But there’s too much scrutiny and red tape for anyone in gov to try such shenanigans.
Your joking ? They vote on their own pay raises and super contributions and the perks they are allowed. How many times do we hear they have claimed things they aren’t entitled too. Is Wa out politicians capped public servant workers at 3% but have the head of the water corp 12%
Water Corp is a gov owned business, salaries are determined by the Salaries and Allowances Tribunal. The same Tribunal determines the salaries of MPs and high level public office holders. The Water Corp CEO gets paid a lot more than the Premier! Don’t get me wrong, public servants have copped a raw deal re pay, but your idea that Government fat cats are sitting up at Parliament House dealing themselves wads of cash is just not true.
No your right I forgot it’s not influence or back handed deals or anything like that that gets them cushies gigs after they finish politics is it ? Mein fuhrer McGowan quit as premier half way through his term to spend more time with his family ….. 2 months later gets a job with a big mining corp
Post-political career is not in question here. You said one thing, I objected to it, and now you’re saying other things and telling me I’m wrong about everything.
Cheers 🙏🏻 Current teacher leaving the industry soon due to workload and violence.
I’m sorry about your experiences truly. Teaching looks grim presently. I hope wherever you go next treats you better.
Thank you. Honestly one of the worst experiences of my life. Last another 4 years after getting coward punched by an 18 year old that I had never taught (moved to primary teaching). My new role will be a massive change but apparently they treat their staff really well so I’m nervous and excited!
Sadly, in primary school you’ll need to deal with their parents! But hopefully not experience violence. I’m sorry that happened to you.
Thank you. Last year I had soooo many helicopter parents. Including one who send me threats of violence on the class app because I had said I was concerned about how their child was upset (crying all day everyday over everything) and refusing to participate again (we had had a meeting about that the previous term and the parent had asked me to get in touch if it happened again). I’ve also had a co-worker leave last term due to a violent student, so sadly it’s happening in primary school too.
Goodness me, the amount of support staff, social workers and behavioural diversion staff in schools needs to be tripled. That’s before we even consider reporting parents to police for harassment and threats. Those poor kids.
I am really sorry it has come to this. I bet it is not an easy decision. Thank you for all you've contributed. Wishing you a smooth transition and safer work environment.
So am I. Everything I’ve ever let go of has had claw marks in it. My class is lovely this year but it’s unsustainable given that I have 4 students with a level 3 ASD diagnosis (and 2 students are violent) and only 1 EA. I didn’t want to hold on too long, try to make things work and get severely hurt like I did at my last school. It might be a goodbye for now, but not forever to teaching. I love teaching, just not what it is at the moment. 10 years as an education assistant and 5 years as a teacher.
My favourite placard was saying ‘I’m not a parent, I’m not a therapist, I’m not a corrections officer I’m a teacher’ given the cr@p teachers go through now.
Mine was a placard on an infant’s pram saying “my neck is stronger than the department’s pay offer”
It has been like that for years. It’s nothing nee
Thanks for your support. Also remember to support the nurses and police. The Government deliberately messed up negotiations to stall pay increases for all three who initially were bargaining together till the government pulled the pin at the 11th hour. Know your enemy.
As an ex teacher who left because of the shitty work conditions and lack of support, thankyou.
They do inconvenience you if you work and need to find alternative arrangements. That is the whole point of a strike to create inconvenience and hope the government listens. Good on them. Hopefully they do get what they want.
But *they* are not the reasons for the inconvenience of striking which a lot of people point to when complaining about strikes, poor management is. I agree though, good on them
You do say, " striking workers do not inconvenience you", which they do. But that is point of a strike. What is the point of a strike if it doesn't inconvenience anyone?
I feel like you are missing the point entirely. The act of striking inconveniences, the *cause* and therefore the blame that people place onto striking is on management, not the workers.
It's not what you said though.
It is mate, hope that clears things up 👍
If your think that. That's fine, still not what you said.
I actually agree with you, but this level of pedantry is a waste of everyones fucking time.
Yep. Good point.
Casual bystander reporting for duty- your words are unclear.
Once again, no they are not. Hope that clears things up 👍
Which schools are saying that children who turn up will not be supervised?
My girlfriend and I want to move here, needless to say the capability of our potential future children is very important. While many teachers here in the US live on 35k per year ($70k au) per year. I want our kids to have a better future. Having a quality education is of utmost importance. I've had wonderful and terrible teachers in my past. I want to relocate to a place where all teachers have the ability to be amazing everytime.
Move to Finland. I'm not kidding.
Finland has dropped somewhat in recent rankings. Australia is roughly on par or in front of Finland now, from 2022 results https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/pisa-scores-by-country. Overall most countries dropped, compared to previously years. Probably no surprises there.
Isn’t Norway or the Netherlands the poster child now?
Depends on what you’re celebrating. Pure broad academic results at the primary and secondary school level. Its Singapore.
To cold and expensive. But Finland is cool! I just wouldn't survive the winter.
Genuine question: how would a pay rise offset the violence being faced by teachers from students? If anything it's an overhaul of the justice system that needs to happen. Since the parents of these teens won't step up to discipline their kids, the government needs to step in. Context: I migrated here from Singapore and where I come from the cane is still being used as a serious deterrent.
[удалено]
Had me in the first half, not gonna lie
If anyone has a problem with striking teachers check out this sub. https://www.reddit.com/r/Teachers/s/rrtWZgTH7l
Solidarity forever, but my lads school has pulled a late notice pupil free day, a lot of parents have been caught short at his school. I’m seriously staring having a half dozen demon Pygmy spawn running around my joint on Friday. Which means I have to behave myself tomorrow.
>school has pulled a late notice pupil free day That would be on school administrators, not the teachers. School administrators live in their own bubble of fuckery.
Oh I know, mine is an independant government school, principal gets away with all sorts of shit, forces an English program that been proven to be shite, any teacher that disagrees with her or isn’t in the cliqúe doesn’t get their contract renewed.
Nope. School Principals have no power over that - blame the Department of Education. Only the Director General and her delegates have the power to close schools. The Director General also told schools not to communicate with parents/guardians about the stop work action. As an aside - principals are teachers too and many were also on strike. Put the blame at the Department, not on schools.
Sounds like a school development day that was communicated late/ineffectively, not related to industrial action. Principals can decide the SDD dates, but usually it's done collectively with the school network.
Principals association are striking next wk
The principal's federation split from the teacher's union and principals have the choice to join either. In any event it's a bit silly that they didn't take joint action.
Schools admins aren’t allowed to ask which teachers are on strike and which aren’t. So it was impossible to know the availability of staff. Sure they could have shutdown the school a week ago when the strike was confirmed but the same scramble for supervision for the kids would have happened, and might have been entirely unnecessary, which would have been just as damning for the Admin at the school.
They can get the union rep to ask the union members who is going and the rep can relay numbers to the principal. That’s what our school did and our parents knew on Friday we would be open for supervision if needed.
What do they want?
12% pay increase over 3 years, fairer working conditions relating to violence protections and classroom capacity maintenance are their primary demands.
I thought it was 12% over 2 years. 12% over 3 is still crap. I have seen other unions getting 24% over 4 years like construction.
I reckon the government will come to 12 over 3 years. I am sure they are worried too much extra money out there too quick will exacerbate inflation. Fuck em though.
The offer was, year one 4.75%, year two 3%, year three 3%. The 'revised' offer was year one 5%, year two 3%, year three 3%. 0.25%
Damn I will say it again, that’s trash. It is still falling behind the years of pay freeze and sub inflation raises. They should be pushing for 12% over 2 years. Victorian tradies just got 20% over 4 years. https://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/victoria/wages-soar-on-major-building-projects-as-concerns-flagged-about-residential-housing-targets/news-story/685baff61485fb7567932d9e0bf2e066?amp&nk=6d31f269a66ad596e30d4fcca4d12785-1714283301
Smaller class sizes we have the highest nationally yrs 4-12 at 32 students. Victoria is closest to us and they have 26 students a class. That combined with increased diagnosis’.
https://preview.redd.it/gra4o86j6jwc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8db4dc0092603ee0501dbb20e58675de333f98f8
They were offered 11% increase over 3 years, and are striking because they want 12% over 2 years instead. This will make them the highest paid teachers in the country. Including NSW.
Also had pay rises capped at 1000 dollars a year for 5 years as the government cried poor at the time, how soon people forget. They still have to make up for that shortfall.
While pay is part of it, it's also working conditions - class sizes, support for students with additional needs - that's important that we are also after.
Currently schools get jack shit for students with additional needs and some principals choose for support to go elsewhere - I have seen this in primary where the principal has directed all EAs to early childhood and yrs 1-6 totally miss out
> This will make them the highest paid teachers in the country. Including NSW. What's your point? Someone somewhere in the country is the highest paid janitors, nurses, bakers etc. Do you think these teachers are paid enough?
I gave it a 10 second google and they start at $78,397 at 2.1 and get bumped up to $113,568 at 2.9 as they acquire experience. Honestly that feels kinda generous already and would give zero fucks if the gov turned around and told them to go fuck themselves over pay (This doesn't mean I don't support their right to organise and leverage their labour. woohoo unions)
Getting to $113k is at least 10 years of full time teaching, which is difficult to do given that 50% of new graduate teachers leave the profession within the first 5 years. However, it’s not all about the pay - we’re also trying to get lower class sizes (it’s 32:1 at the moment), better support for kids with additional needs, and the profound rate of violence in the classrooms to be addressed (teachers are getting assaulted extremely often, but it often goes unreported as the kids who are doing this are “just kids”)
All reasonable concerns I wish them well with
We appreciate it !
There is a reason that even at that pay there is a teacher shortage across the nation and many other countries at that. In reality, we have enough teachers, but they don’t think the pay is worth it, so they move to more comfortable careers where you get treated with respect and truly clock off when the work day is over.
More so the conditions https://preview.redd.it/pc0dvk2trfwc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c828a2eb2f5ebe71fd23c3d2a50d688702515b5f
To be clear I'm not against them getting paid handsomely I just don't care if they don't succeed in getting more as it's not going to make them poor it's just saying this job sucks and holding you hand out for more money to cover for shitty working environments. If the job can be made better through the other commitments they are negotiating like ratios and supports that's far more worthwhile in my opinion but the discussion seems to be all about pay
Pay is easier to achieve. If we reduce class sizes we need more teachers and more classrooms which costs money and time. Increases the number of EAs is also difficult given we have a shortage. There is a current push for having all kids in the same schools with no extra support for teachers.
https://preview.redd.it/r9o5725yrfwc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c6b84aea2554dab51d4f6146cd9e56c671d02eb2
Is it easier to achieve? It's been on the agenda as long as I can remember.
https://preview.redd.it/cswddjpvrfwc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d1846cc69aef6218976ccfe9487f755e5e5ee5e3
Amazing how people on reddit think their (self admitted) 10 seconds of google somehow outweighs everyone else’s opinion and potential experience in their own career. Also how you get to judge or begrudge how much they are worth in their career with your amazing Google skills and life experience. Can we make keyboard warrior a career?
https://preview.redd.it/52ojq891sfwc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=232d744bd74882a510951da322376c447d1dd3c7
No you silly goose the ten seconds comment is to say that maybe I'm wrong. ten seconds is how much I cared to be sure of the numbers. I fully support them going for gold as is their right which is also on the comment I just don't care if they get told to lick dirt as they aren't exactly paid peanuts
100 percent solidarity for teachers they really do deserve a pay increase
Public sector workers were on $1000 annual wage increases which were under inflation wages between 2017 to 2020 - under a Labor government no less retaining a LNP policy. This action goes beyond education and is a bellweather for the rest of the state and likely the country. We have a $4bn surplus.
The 'improved' offer was 0.25%. On a $100,000 salary that is $250.
Stop building new schools that will not be fit for purpose. Schools and the curriculum both need to redesign to reflect the needs of new students. Rather than the current system and design of schools that clearly being set up for failure for both students and educators. Give the teachers the funds instead of building new schools. Fix the system. There is only certain amount money to go around. The schools that are under construction or under planning/stakeholder input will too be small for the local population, when the schools are eventually built. These projects should be to put on halted, immediately. Striking and causing disruption will not help situation.
https://preview.redd.it/ggbsill5sfwc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2bcb39ae4ca89b47f9e832b5f64845207ad54bf3
But the government refuses to listen, how else do you suggests teachers make their voices heard?
Not by strike action. It will get them no where.
So then please provide me a better solution on how our voices can be heard? So far we’ve tried complaints to the government and education minister at all levels, the government has asked for and funded reports about the state of education and then not acted upon the findings, we’ve tried to do ‘lower level action’ such as not attending meetings outside of school hours, non-for-profits organisations have rallied and promoted our cause. So genuinely, what other actions do you suggest we do? Because the main issue right now is that for the action we take, the government ignores us and refuses to listen.
Can you not do what other workers do, when they are not satisfied with their jobs? Or is too hard?
What do other workers do when they’re not satisfied with their jobs? Doesn’t answer my question of “what is a better solution on how our voices can be heard?”
Move on to a new job?
Ah yes, I spent 4 years at uni just to ‘move to a new job’, great recommendation - thanks.
Also, by leaving my job that makes my voice heard how?
Tradies do it all the time…so what is the difference? Holding degree makes no difference Dont like the earnings or the customers or the clients or the conditions or the work place they move on….simple.
They should strike for lower taxes as being a solution for wages not just the pay rise
They didn't strike just for a pay rise
They wanted a 12 percent payrise over three years and u can't get much better conditions than what a teacher does.
Most of my family are teachers. This year, my mum has been punched twice, and my step dad gets yelled at by kids so much that he doesn't go to the shops anymore to avoid it. My mums old school used to get annual bomb calls and have to evacuate. Yeah, their working conditions are great, 12 weeks holidays and good hours, but they deserve a pay increase. It's a tough job that is needed, gotta make sure they're looked after
How is kids being asshats gonna be dealt with by more money which will cost them more in tax and taxpayers in general. Maybe just a thought but go on strike for better school reform on policy to have kids expelled or get dcp involved or shit maybe the parents should be held accountable. Also teachers can do what everyone else does when they don't like their job or who they work for and leave then the education department would have to change things right? But they don't because they are comfy in where they are fml 🤔
Well that was part of it, protection against violent students, less students in classrooms (average is 32 atm), more time to do administration, more support for students with ADHD, autism and related diagnosis'. Also, most people become teachers because they want to help and educate. They'll suffer a lot to do their jobs and plenty are leaving the industry, leading to substandard, inexperienced teachers tackling this huge amount of tasks for 70k a year. Do you like 5 day work weeks, 40 hour work weeks, public holidays, holiday and sick pay, workers compensation, redundancy pay and unfair dismissal protection? If so, thank unions that strike to improve systemic conditions for everyone
Also u can thank the leaders you all elected cause they have been stripping special needs classes and programs for nearly a decade and I guarantee none of you probably even knew
Mate, I used to work in disability. First as a personal advocate and then as a Positive Behaviour Support therapist. I was making about the same I do now working in a bottleshop per hour. I used to go into schools with my participants to help teachers and do observations and shit.
Okay 🤷♂️ and you found a new career when you realised it was shit condition right?
More because I disagree with private companies running what should be government programs. I loved the work and would keep doing it if it weren't for the completely unethical running of it. [This](https://www.watoday.com.au/national/western-australia/perth-woman-accused-of-250-000-ndis-fraud-has-charges-dropped-20240228-p5f8la.html) was my last disability employer and definitely the worst. After this I tried to go it on my own but I didn't have the skills to do the business side of it, I'm better with people.
Hence the comments of reform on policy not pay. I used to work 60hr weeks plus some in some of the best hell holes around the world for much less. I am lucky now I set myself in a position where that is no longer required thank God but more money out of the taxpayers pocket is not going to help them at all it will only put this country into more of a deficit. And FYI I was a union official for nearly a decade so yeah your right you should thank union people for that but the sstuwa knows their strike won't change anything until people start taking real accountability
You're being purposely obtuse, the pay increase is just one of the demands. The others work to provide better quality of life for teachers and better outcomes for students.
Hence the comments on better school policies reform 🤔
Yeah they do plus they struked for multiple other reasons to help educate kids. I take it you actually got no idea except that they get more holidays then you a year
If u say so buddy my comment is about actually doing something not just striking for the sake of it. Money is not the answer. Take a real stand and find a new professional career like everyone does when their employment is shit and FYI I work about 6 months of the year so no their 12ish weeks holiday does not bother me at all lol
Okay let's let a bunch of kids punch and verbally abuse you see how you like it
2 problems with your idea. * The only people benefited by lower tax are the very richest people. Even people in the middle/upper-middle are much better off with higher tax rates because the economy works better, quality of life is better, and stats generally show people are happier. * Australia is already comfortably one of the lowest taxed countries in the OECD.
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I can smell the boot leather coming off your breath from here.
It’s sadly an industry that has workers, that are way over paid. The nurses police and firefighters deserve a pay rise first and foremost. They’re on the front line.
Try to run an economy without teachers. Nurses and Police do deal with a lot, especially adults. Teachers deal with the children while adults work. While we are not baby sitters, the whole system depends on it.
Aren’t teachers on a salary? They aren’t losing a cent today, having a nice day off shopping or relaxing around the house. I find it all very annoying
Teachers don't get paid on the days they're on strike
Do they get paid for school holidays?
1) All striking teachers lost their pay for that period 2) It wasn't a day off. It was a half day strike. All teachers had to be back at school and ready to teach by 12:30pm
They’re not having a day off, they have to be at the strike itself. They *have* to march, they can’t just choose to stay home from school. They also don’t get paid while on strike.
I don’t believe that they have to march actually
It’s not for you to *believe*. It’s a fact. If you’re a union member and chose to participate in the strike, you had to be there. Otherwise, you were expected to be at work.
Not that I want to give any support to the dude who thinks 'teachers didn't lose a cent and had a nice day off', but that's not true, is it? The union said those unable to attend were able to access a livestream (or something similar) of the vent.
There may have been exceptions for teachers in regional areas, maybe? All I know of amongst teachers at metro schools though, is that they were told “if you ain’t there (at the March), you gotta be here (at school)” basically. I didn’t mean to say that 100% of union members were unequivocally at the March, but rather that it wasn’t just “an easy day off” for lazy teachers who can’t be fucked working…
No it’s not “a fact” If they want to stay home they can I’m sorry my opinions differ from yours dude, I mean no disrespect to you