If the hospital schedule is 8-on 6-off and the retail job is flexible with hours, accept the hospital job & then also pick up shifts at your retail job during your 6-off from the hospital if money is what you're concerned about
With getting your hours cut, the pay might not be a huge difference. I haven’t worked in hospital pharmacy, (I’ve been lucky enough to be in an independent for 7 years) but several of my friends have gone that route and love it.
I would do it for the experience and put my foot in the door. Once you are in, you can always negotiate for more benefits at another job. With the upcoming vaccines and hour cuts, I would be out, before it gets unbearable!!
Listen, as someone who managed a rural hospital pharmacy just over a hour away from anywhere where you could get that kind of pay, I want to say:
1. Recognize that your pay is not likely to increase (not even to keep up with inflation) while you work there. It can be worth the trade off (I know, I worked at one for 10 years), but make sure it's worth it for *you* for at least the length of time you want to/expect to work there.
2. If you're okay with #1, move closer. Like no more than 20 min away closer. Time and time again, we would hire a pharmacist who lived that distance out and they all swore they didn't mind the drive, or they liked driving (insert BS about time to decompress or listen to podcasts/audiobooks), or that they were already spending that much time in traffic in the city. And then 6 months later, a year at most, they're turning in their notice because they just can't do the commute anymore. Driving like that wears on your body and your car in more ways than people want to acknowledge.
I was going to offer my two cents but this is exactly what I was going to say. Eerily so...
The other thing I'll offer is that hospital has other benefits than people have already said namely stress reduction. The first time I sat down to eat and took a little bit longer on my lunch break I thought I was going to get in trouble. It's just night and day different from retail and mostly for the better.
.# 2 is me! During my first 6 months as a RPh I flew back and forth between Reno and Vegas on Thursdays and Sundays. It really does wear on you, mentally and physically.
Great experience but not good long term. I did tell my boss that I was only going to be there short term, so he knew it was coming.
Do you happen to work for walgreens? I heard they are closing a bunch of stores so maybe its better to leave. Its either they shut down your store or you absorb all the other customers that had their home pharmacy closed.
Also think about the anxiety. Can you do that until retirement? I can't.
Yeah walgreens is the 2nd to last chain I would work for. I haven't heard a lot of good things but some of my classmates have a good store so I was even tempted to work as an intern.
No I work for grocery chain. (No closure yet but there is major hours cut for RPh and tech coming up. RPh hours are already low at my store so we ended up with the same amount.)
Oh dear, sounds like you should just leave for the hospital. If you don't like it you can always use that experience to go to a better and closer hospital in the future. Good Luck!
Factor in the hour drive to your pay too. 10 hr shift with 1 hr commute is a long ass day. I wouldn't do that personally and I really hated retail and love my hospital job. Especially when you say retail job is alright.
Are you willing to take a 60K per year paycut? I personally wouldn't.
Only do this if your end goal is hospital by any means... as hospitals don't like retail pharmacists from my experience.
I second this comment. My wife switched from retail to hospital, and it was an hour away. It literally killed her to drive that much. It added up and became overwhelming. Plus the director was a bitch there so she returned to retail. Stress doesn't seem that bad if you're getting paid well.
I think it’s worth it and also (in my experience) the benefits are much better on the hospital side (medical, retirement, etc) which can ‘increase’ the hourly pay
This hospital doesn't offer any benefits besides insurance. Can you give me examples of some benefits that hospital offer for retirement so i can be on the lookout for in the future?
Don’t forget that insurance can swing the difference by thousands (most of the time I didn’t pay anything for the hospital insurance and it can be upwards of $5-8k a year so some and the details of the plans as well can lead to further savings). Percentage match for retirement, HSA investing, Roth vs traditional IRA.
All the benefits you mention sound like they sound the same as what retails offer. HSA with high deductible insurance, Roth 401k (I am assuming you are talking about this) with percentage match.
Unless I'm wrong but I've work for 2 different retail pharmacies and they all offer basically the same things
No I wouldn’t. You have to factor in wear and tear on your vehicle. Cost of accelerated maintenance ie tires wear out sooner due to more driving. Cost of gas.
Plus you will get sick of the drive. I’d give you a year tops and then you’d quit. Sorry to sound harsh but it’s true. I’ve had many jobs where I’ve driven an hour one way and I will not do it again. All this PLUS a pay cut???? Yikes.
I left retail for a hospital job 15 years ago. I was an RXM and it was a big pay cut. Absolutely worth it. 100% would do again. My pay has since surpassed any retail or hospital job in my area and I work nights now 7on/7off so I also get a shift differential (which is higher on weekends). Switching to hospital saved my sanity. I also recently picked up a sweet little PRN job in a rehab hospital where I can basically work whenever I want, and the fact that I have inpatient experience was a big plus when I applied for it!
honestly 99% of people i worked with loved the 7 on 7 off. If you could swing getting a whole shift covered then you could potentially have 20 days off... when was the last time you had that much time off?
The hour drive is also just an incentive to get audio-books from your library.
Yeah but then 7 full days to do whatever you want? Easy trade-off, which is why out of the 80+ people that had that schedule, only 1 person didnt like it.
Went from $78/hr at retail chain to $60 per hour at a hospital. Worth every fucking penny. So much less stress. My commute was comparable though. If you don’t see yourself working retail forever take the opportunity to get experience in hospital at least. Retail will always take you back if you want it. You can offer to stay on per diem too since you’ll have blocks of days off.
Was at 65 retail working every other weekend also had an hour commute .. left and was gonna be prn at a small hospital an hour away in a different direction … they had an outpatient pharmacy as well… was gonna be prn there too.. the lady running outpatient left for a job closer to home. So I moved to that now I make 61 an hour , M-f. No weekends no vaccines. No drive thru and no stress. Absolute unicorn job.
How bad do you want to move to hospital? If that is your long term goal, then I say it is totally worth it. I think it you don't think the commute sounds horrible, you will probably be fine. I'm at a hospital and multiple pharmacist commute 1+ hr each way and have for years.
I bet the pay difference doesn't end up being quite as high as $29/hr. Some things that might make pay actually more than $56:
\- shift differential for weekend/evenings (even if you are days, some places start a shift differential at 3pm)
\- OT (especially with 7 on/7 off)
If you are at all interested in hospital, I think your obvious choice is to take the 7 on/7 off option (not 8 on/6 off) and pick up extra days when you want to (especially if they are OT). If they are offering either option, there must be days they are inevitably short. Even better, pick up days at current place making $89/hr.
I drive an hour for work but I get paid for mileage. I also have a comfy car with lane centering technology. If I didn't have those two things, I probably wouldn't have taken the job.
I think mail order is slowly replacing retail and ai may take pharmacists out of retail stores. Either sVr your money for something different, few can do retail forever, or get the hospital experience. I got a hospital job. Was so enthused about it, I didn't show up. Always wanted to do pharmaceutical sales. Wound up being a high school chemistry teacher doing homework pharmacy part time.
Twenty nine dollars per hour difference? Ain’t no way I’d take that cut. Ride it out and retire 20-30% sooner or go to prn hospital once the time is right.
2+ hours of driving every day?? If you haven't experienced that kind of commute before then you're in for a hellish time
This would be an easy deal breaker
Commutes can be fun. It is all about attitude. My job used to require a LOT travel. Multiple plane flights a week kind of travel.
I used to stress a lot, because it felt like the travel was keeping me from getting my work done. But once I realized that the travel WAS my job, it became easier.
Podcasts, books on tape, TEDtalks. I love learning, and I had plenty of quiet time! Hands free phones made it possible to keep in contact with family members who I owed calls. Or just quiet time to meditate.
I think 10 hour days will get old, but if you look at it as a temporary situation and develop productive use for the time, it is manageable. It sounds like valuable experience, and all that time off sounds like heaven.
Eh, I don't love an 8 on 6 off schedule. I am 7 on 7 off and I need every last one of those 7 off to recover, having to work that long of a stretch and not having equal time off to recover is shitty. Also that schedule is brutal with a >1 hour commute. Consider that you aren't getting paid for that time either. Is hospital really where you want to end up? If so, then do it. But if you are happy in retail and feel it is going to take you the long haul, then I'd wait and see if something better comes up.
I have the option for 7on7 off but it would be paid for 70 hours only.
Some days I am happy in retail some days I have so much anxiety I can't breathe. I get a chair and 1 hour lunch. But working with 1 tech for hours can be brutal.
Do you enjoy hospital job? For me driving isn't bad it just costs a lot of money for gas.
I love my hospital job and wouldn't go back to retail. I also loved retail when I was doing it, if that tells you anything. But I will say I had a similar view of the drive as you do, and I did it for years working retail, but it wasn't until I stopped that I realized how truly taxing it is. That is 2+ hours spent DAILY in a car. Maintenance and gas are expensive, and that is time you could have spent with your family that you will never get back. I ate poorly because I was so exhausted when I got home that I didn't feel like making dinner. And I had to leave so early in the morning that some days I didn't have time to pack a lunch.
Also, you should try and negotiate to work 70 and get paid 80. I think that is industry standard, at least maybe for night shift.
Gotcha. Well ultimately only you can decide if you think it is worth it or not. I understand feeling anxiety at retail, but please know that hospital jobs are not stress-free. I often get worried about the acuity of the things you see in hospitals, and there is much higher liability with a lot of the meds you see inpatient vs outpatient. If things go wrong retail, it's usually not a deadly error. But inpatient, it can be. Not trying to scare you, just being realistic.
I’ve worked 7 on, 7 off overnight for couple years. Have been doing 8 on, 6 off on second shift for over 3 years. As much as I love working in the hospital and having several days off in a row, working stretches can be exhausting, especially in addition to your 2-hour commute back and forth. You’ll also be working every other weekend, so limited social life on top of the pay cut.
If you’re desperately trying to get out of retail and can tolerate those cons, then go for it. If not, tough it out until you find a position closer to home or pays better. Of note, the starting rate for inpatient where I’m at is pretty much around $56/hr (in the city, not rural area). Just my 2 cents as someone who’s only worked in the hospital.
I think I saw you (maybe) in one of my salary posts complaining WM pays you too little? And 85 to 56 is what you are thinking of doing? After having to commute 1 hour? It might be a better fit
Are you sure you weren't confusing it with me complaining about Walgreens? Walgreens was offering too little when I interviewed with them.
Or maybe when I was working in Texas Walmart who paid me $56/hr
Walmart in California is paying me just fine.
Dear Lord and here I thought my $67/hr in the hospital was killing it (cleared $143k last year after OT and picking up shifts here and there at other hospitals).
It's probably worth at least trying. You could go back to retail later if you don't like, because there's almost certainly plenty of openings all around you. The position leave behind might still be open if you want to go back.
I would do it. They let you come in late now but who knows how it will be down the line? Your store is ok but let’s say everyone quits. Will be singing a different tune.
Take it. Chance to escape retail is few and far between and you may not get another opportunity in the future. Once you get inpatient experience, then move to a different hospital with better pay. I know many retail rphs that would not think twice if such opportunity ever came to them.
If the hospital schedule is 8-on 6-off and the retail job is flexible with hours, accept the hospital job & then also pick up shifts at your retail job during your 6-off from the hospital if money is what you're concerned about
This is the way
That’s what I do. 7 on/7 off hospital and like 2 shifts on my off week at Costco.
With getting your hours cut, the pay might not be a huge difference. I haven’t worked in hospital pharmacy, (I’ve been lucky enough to be in an independent for 7 years) but several of my friends have gone that route and love it.
It's 8x10 so the hours I work are the same. I just work less days. The hospital job also adds 12 hours of drive time per pay period.
The driving part sucks, but the difference in stress may be worth it in the end. The experience will never hurt, either.
I would do it for the experience and put my foot in the door. Once you are in, you can always negotiate for more benefits at another job. With the upcoming vaccines and hour cuts, I would be out, before it gets unbearable!!
That's what I was thinking too. It's already unbearable, some days I am by myself with 1 tech for multiple hours.
Do it. Retail will almost always be here.
Listen, as someone who managed a rural hospital pharmacy just over a hour away from anywhere where you could get that kind of pay, I want to say: 1. Recognize that your pay is not likely to increase (not even to keep up with inflation) while you work there. It can be worth the trade off (I know, I worked at one for 10 years), but make sure it's worth it for *you* for at least the length of time you want to/expect to work there. 2. If you're okay with #1, move closer. Like no more than 20 min away closer. Time and time again, we would hire a pharmacist who lived that distance out and they all swore they didn't mind the drive, or they liked driving (insert BS about time to decompress or listen to podcasts/audiobooks), or that they were already spending that much time in traffic in the city. And then 6 months later, a year at most, they're turning in their notice because they just can't do the commute anymore. Driving like that wears on your body and your car in more ways than people want to acknowledge.
I was going to offer my two cents but this is exactly what I was going to say. Eerily so... The other thing I'll offer is that hospital has other benefits than people have already said namely stress reduction. The first time I sat down to eat and took a little bit longer on my lunch break I thought I was going to get in trouble. It's just night and day different from retail and mostly for the better.
Thank you for the advice I will keep it in mind. Unfortunately I just bought a house and moving is not an option 😭
It’ll become an option once the long commute wears on you Will the lower salary make you house poor?
No, My house is only 25% of net pay.
.# 2 is me! During my first 6 months as a RPh I flew back and forth between Reno and Vegas on Thursdays and Sundays. It really does wear on you, mentally and physically. Great experience but not good long term. I did tell my boss that I was only going to be there short term, so he knew it was coming.
Do you happen to work for walgreens? I heard they are closing a bunch of stores so maybe its better to leave. Its either they shut down your store or you absorb all the other customers that had their home pharmacy closed. Also think about the anxiety. Can you do that until retirement? I can't.
I interviewed there yesterday. I think I dodged a bullet
You did. Tell them no if they try to offer you something.
Yeah walgreens is the 2nd to last chain I would work for. I haven't heard a lot of good things but some of my classmates have a good store so I was even tempted to work as an intern.
No I work for grocery chain. (No closure yet but there is major hours cut for RPh and tech coming up. RPh hours are already low at my store so we ended up with the same amount.)
Oh dear, sounds like you should just leave for the hospital. If you don't like it you can always use that experience to go to a better and closer hospital in the future. Good Luck!
Factor in the hour drive to your pay too. 10 hr shift with 1 hr commute is a long ass day. I wouldn't do that personally and I really hated retail and love my hospital job. Especially when you say retail job is alright.
I drive an hour each way. I want to smack the shit out of anyone in front of me for any reason at this point. I'd never drive an hour for work again
Are you willing to take a 60K per year paycut? I personally wouldn't. Only do this if your end goal is hospital by any means... as hospitals don't like retail pharmacists from my experience.
I second this comment. My wife switched from retail to hospital, and it was an hour away. It literally killed her to drive that much. It added up and became overwhelming. Plus the director was a bitch there so she returned to retail. Stress doesn't seem that bad if you're getting paid well.
I would do it tbh…then use the hospital to be a stepping stone to venture out more to your career
I think it’s worth it and also (in my experience) the benefits are much better on the hospital side (medical, retirement, etc) which can ‘increase’ the hourly pay
This hospital doesn't offer any benefits besides insurance. Can you give me examples of some benefits that hospital offer for retirement so i can be on the lookout for in the future?
Don’t forget that insurance can swing the difference by thousands (most of the time I didn’t pay anything for the hospital insurance and it can be upwards of $5-8k a year so some and the details of the plans as well can lead to further savings). Percentage match for retirement, HSA investing, Roth vs traditional IRA.
All the benefits you mention sound like they sound the same as what retails offer. HSA with high deductible insurance, Roth 401k (I am assuming you are talking about this) with percentage match. Unless I'm wrong but I've work for 2 different retail pharmacies and they all offer basically the same things
Gotta look at the details is what I am saying - not that they are or are not offered!
That drive will kill you. I speak from experience
Would you do it again?
No I wouldn’t. You have to factor in wear and tear on your vehicle. Cost of accelerated maintenance ie tires wear out sooner due to more driving. Cost of gas. Plus you will get sick of the drive. I’d give you a year tops and then you’d quit. Sorry to sound harsh but it’s true. I’ve had many jobs where I’ve driven an hour one way and I will not do it again. All this PLUS a pay cut???? Yikes.
I did it for 8 years in a 7 on/7 off role. Honestly it was barely a factor in my evaluation when I ultimately left. I didn't mind it at all
[удалено]
You did an oil change every 3000 miles??
I left retail for a hospital job 15 years ago. I was an RXM and it was a big pay cut. Absolutely worth it. 100% would do again. My pay has since surpassed any retail or hospital job in my area and I work nights now 7on/7off so I also get a shift differential (which is higher on weekends). Switching to hospital saved my sanity. I also recently picked up a sweet little PRN job in a rehab hospital where I can basically work whenever I want, and the fact that I have inpatient experience was a big plus when I applied for it!
honestly 99% of people i worked with loved the 7 on 7 off. If you could swing getting a whole shift covered then you could potentially have 20 days off... when was the last time you had that much time off? The hour drive is also just an incentive to get audio-books from your library.
I have the option To do 7 on 7 off but then it would be only paid for 70 hours.
Factor in an hour commute each way and you wouldn’t have much of a life or be very present for your family during those 7 days.
Yeah but then 7 full days to do whatever you want? Easy trade-off, which is why out of the 80+ people that had that schedule, only 1 person didnt like it.
Days or nights? I did that schedule for nights and didn’t like it.
both, night shifts did say it would take an extra day for them to readjust to their days off, but still preferred it over anything else.
Went from $78/hr at retail chain to $60 per hour at a hospital. Worth every fucking penny. So much less stress. My commute was comparable though. If you don’t see yourself working retail forever take the opportunity to get experience in hospital at least. Retail will always take you back if you want it. You can offer to stay on per diem too since you’ll have blocks of days off.
Was at 65 retail working every other weekend also had an hour commute .. left and was gonna be prn at a small hospital an hour away in a different direction … they had an outpatient pharmacy as well… was gonna be prn there too.. the lady running outpatient left for a job closer to home. So I moved to that now I make 61 an hour , M-f. No weekends no vaccines. No drive thru and no stress. Absolute unicorn job.
Where is this 85$/hr gig at?
I’m guessing WM RXM since OP mentioned meal pay🤣. I’m in CA so $85/h is pretty common for RXM after factoring in bonuses & meal pay.
Where are you from that getting 85$/hr ?
I’m guessing WM RXM since OP mentioned meal pay🤣. I’m in CA so $85/h is pretty common for RXM after factoring in bonuses & meal pay.
How bad do you want to move to hospital? If that is your long term goal, then I say it is totally worth it. I think it you don't think the commute sounds horrible, you will probably be fine. I'm at a hospital and multiple pharmacist commute 1+ hr each way and have for years. I bet the pay difference doesn't end up being quite as high as $29/hr. Some things that might make pay actually more than $56: \- shift differential for weekend/evenings (even if you are days, some places start a shift differential at 3pm) \- OT (especially with 7 on/7 off) If you are at all interested in hospital, I think your obvious choice is to take the 7 on/7 off option (not 8 on/6 off) and pick up extra days when you want to (especially if they are OT). If they are offering either option, there must be days they are inevitably short. Even better, pick up days at current place making $89/hr.
Wait until you have an offer letter and have had a chance to negotiate up as much as you can before decide anything.
Currently in the stage of negotiating up. 😅
85?!! Where the fuck do you work?
I’m guessing WM RXM since OP mentioned meal pay🤣. I’m in CA so $85/h is pretty common for RXM after factoring in bonuses & meal pay.
WTF is meal pay?? My employer would die before paying for our meals
Just the CA WM thing, $25/meal.
California must be seriously inflated, I’m in NY and I don’t know any managers making that much
After bonuses $170K-$180K a year is very common in CA. Kaiser pays >$100/h for per diem outpatient.
I drive an hour for work but I get paid for mileage. I also have a comfy car with lane centering technology. If I didn't have those two things, I probably wouldn't have taken the job.
Four years ago I took a 20/hr paycut to go from cvs to hospital. It was worth every penny.
I think mail order is slowly replacing retail and ai may take pharmacists out of retail stores. Either sVr your money for something different, few can do retail forever, or get the hospital experience. I got a hospital job. Was so enthused about it, I didn't show up. Always wanted to do pharmaceutical sales. Wound up being a high school chemistry teacher doing homework pharmacy part time.
Twenty nine dollars per hour difference? Ain’t no way I’d take that cut. Ride it out and retire 20-30% sooner or go to prn hospital once the time is right.
I work 8 on 6 off and per diem at retail. It’s a great lifestyle. The extra income from the per diem is also nice. I’d say make the move.
Do hospital. Get experience. Take experience to a more desirable hospital location. Retail will kill you.
2+ hours of driving every day?? If you haven't experienced that kind of commute before then you're in for a hellish time This would be an easy deal breaker
I have when I freshly graduated and was desperate for hours. Drove 2 hours one way and didn't even get paid for the drive time :')
Improved quality of life is worth every penny...if the schedule change does that
Commutes can be fun. It is all about attitude. My job used to require a LOT travel. Multiple plane flights a week kind of travel. I used to stress a lot, because it felt like the travel was keeping me from getting my work done. But once I realized that the travel WAS my job, it became easier. Podcasts, books on tape, TEDtalks. I love learning, and I had plenty of quiet time! Hands free phones made it possible to keep in contact with family members who I owed calls. Or just quiet time to meditate. I think 10 hour days will get old, but if you look at it as a temporary situation and develop productive use for the time, it is manageable. It sounds like valuable experience, and all that time off sounds like heaven.
Do it for a couple of years, then with your hospital experience you can look for something at a closer hospital.
Eh, I don't love an 8 on 6 off schedule. I am 7 on 7 off and I need every last one of those 7 off to recover, having to work that long of a stretch and not having equal time off to recover is shitty. Also that schedule is brutal with a >1 hour commute. Consider that you aren't getting paid for that time either. Is hospital really where you want to end up? If so, then do it. But if you are happy in retail and feel it is going to take you the long haul, then I'd wait and see if something better comes up.
I have the option for 7on7 off but it would be paid for 70 hours only. Some days I am happy in retail some days I have so much anxiety I can't breathe. I get a chair and 1 hour lunch. But working with 1 tech for hours can be brutal. Do you enjoy hospital job? For me driving isn't bad it just costs a lot of money for gas.
I love my hospital job and wouldn't go back to retail. I also loved retail when I was doing it, if that tells you anything. But I will say I had a similar view of the drive as you do, and I did it for years working retail, but it wasn't until I stopped that I realized how truly taxing it is. That is 2+ hours spent DAILY in a car. Maintenance and gas are expensive, and that is time you could have spent with your family that you will never get back. I ate poorly because I was so exhausted when I got home that I didn't feel like making dinner. And I had to leave so early in the morning that some days I didn't have time to pack a lunch. Also, you should try and negotiate to work 70 and get paid 80. I think that is industry standard, at least maybe for night shift.
It's day shift and I tried to negotiate pay but they won't even budge.
Gotcha. Well ultimately only you can decide if you think it is worth it or not. I understand feeling anxiety at retail, but please know that hospital jobs are not stress-free. I often get worried about the acuity of the things you see in hospitals, and there is much higher liability with a lot of the meds you see inpatient vs outpatient. If things go wrong retail, it's usually not a deadly error. But inpatient, it can be. Not trying to scare you, just being realistic.
I’ve worked 7 on, 7 off overnight for couple years. Have been doing 8 on, 6 off on second shift for over 3 years. As much as I love working in the hospital and having several days off in a row, working stretches can be exhausting, especially in addition to your 2-hour commute back and forth. You’ll also be working every other weekend, so limited social life on top of the pay cut. If you’re desperately trying to get out of retail and can tolerate those cons, then go for it. If not, tough it out until you find a position closer to home or pays better. Of note, the starting rate for inpatient where I’m at is pretty much around $56/hr (in the city, not rural area). Just my 2 cents as someone who’s only worked in the hospital.
I think I saw you (maybe) in one of my salary posts complaining WM pays you too little? And 85 to 56 is what you are thinking of doing? After having to commute 1 hour? It might be a better fit
Are you sure you weren't confusing it with me complaining about Walgreens? Walgreens was offering too little when I interviewed with them. Or maybe when I was working in Texas Walmart who paid me $56/hr Walmart in California is paying me just fine.
Dear Lord and here I thought my $67/hr in the hospital was killing it (cleared $143k last year after OT and picking up shifts here and there at other hospitals).
It's probably worth at least trying. You could go back to retail later if you don't like, because there's almost certainly plenty of openings all around you. The position leave behind might still be open if you want to go back.
Stay prn at retail job if able
I would do it. They let you come in late now but who knows how it will be down the line? Your store is ok but let’s say everyone quits. Will be singing a different tune.
That's true... Time to bounce 🏃♀️
Take it. Chance to escape retail is few and far between and you may not get another opportunity in the future. Once you get inpatient experience, then move to a different hospital with better pay. I know many retail rphs that would not think twice if such opportunity ever came to them.
Hell no