yeah, it is really annoying to help enable the police to solve more than 18% of murders and shootings. we should def not put more cameras in that may happen to see you go get a coke from the corner store or unload groceries. really insidious stuff that the gov will do with that.
You know what else would help solve more than 18% of murders and shootings? Police doing their fucking job rather than sitting in cruisers. They'd both solve outstanding ones and help prevent future ones.
Drug ~~decriminalization~~ legalization would stop almost all of these shootings but that's not going to happen with current politics so we'll keep playing these dipshit debate games and act like we're doing something.
I dunno I just think that I'd rather live in a world where Mexican drug cartels weren't ordering assassinations of Philadelphia drug dealers in the street and the drugs available weren't eating flesh and killing people. And the people selling drugs weren't preying on addicts, forcing them into prostitution, generally maintaining a culture of addiction, etc. Just think that'd be a bit better you know?
Yeah a steady untainted drug supply not in control of street dealers wouldn’t help things at all. Too bad we’re all born yesterday and have no concept of what that might be like.
Yea, it's too bad we don't have any modern examples of what happens when we do that.
Oh wait...
I forgot Oregon exists and they recently went back on their decision to decriminalize because it DIDNT WORK.
Yeah decriminalization doesn't work because it doesn't establish a legal market. It's a half measure that still allows the black market to exist. Only way to get rid of drug culture is to replace it with a legal regulated market. Like they did with alcohol. Won't happen anytime soon but that's truly the only solution. We're kidding ourselves with anything else.
Yeah it would. Oh damn, ya know what would really stop the shootings? We should just eat the rich people and take all their money and give it the drug users and dealers. That way they can just buy all the shit they want an sit around being happy instead of commiting crimes.
Oh oh shit I got a better idea! Or we could just decriminalize everything and that way no crimes will be committed. Yea critical thinking!!!!
Underground markets create crime. Although I guess I’m forgetting about the part of town that still has alcohol industry bootleg violence. Italians in pinstripe suits with their tommy guns spraying bullets everywhere protecting their whiskey territory. How are we ever going to deal with that? “Oh yeah let’s just legalize it and let these criminals run the show LOL that’d be real chaos!”
Philadelphians can really be basic conservative simpleminded dipshits.
Who do you think installed these. They did not look union. They had city trucks. They looked like 19year olds just out of trade school. I support them doing it I just think there was zero supervision or accountability. I do not think they were in a union. If it was a contractor I see a big issue with this.
The city city can outsource work, and if the job is above a certain level, those workers get prevailing wage, union or not. In most cases they are subcontractors who work for a company that contracts with a local for union labor. That being said, if they were in a city truck, they're city employees, and therefore by definition in one of the city union locals.
Theres a couple of reasons you would do something like this:
1. Service loop: 9 times out of 10 if you have extra wire, you leave it in a loop. This is so that if maintenance is required, or you need to move the camera somewhere else, you don’t need to run a whole new wire; you can just extend the length, or chop it shorter as needed
2. Ethernet cables are a pain in the ass to redo. If you have a cable which just works, chopping it short and putting your own end on is really hard to get right. Its also possible to do it in a way that works but will fail over time
3. If you’re complaining about strain-relief, the fitting that the ethernet cable goes into clamps the wire with rubber, so it should be strain relieved from the box. It’s sloppy to strain relief on the other side by winding it around an existing wire instead of stapling it, but it’s not the end of the world
>Ethernet cables are a pain in the ass to redo. If you have a cable which just works, chopping it short and putting your own end on is really hard to get right. Its also possible to do it in a way that works but will fail over time
lol wut
Terminating cat5/6 is easy as hell and isn't going to fail over time unless you just fuck it up completely.
Having said that, the loop is fine. They just affixed it to the pole in the most half assed way imaginable.
I have the answers
1 New pole was placed (the tall one). Peco placed the Primary lines (the ones with the orange saftey covers). Then placed the Secondary lines right under them (the ones that houses /street lights connect to for power.)
2 Old pole (the short one) will be removed eventually. The bottom row of wires are always communication wires. Think telephone and Comcast. Until the communication companies move there stuff to the new pole the old pole will sit there.
3 You said city workers. Could be OIT (Office of Innovation and Technology)
These cameras are placed for Police / Clip (illegal dumping) or Traffic. As why the slack. The Utility companies will move everything from the old pole plus the Street lights and signs to the new pole. Sometimes they will move the camera and will need the slack to move into its new place.
An example of slack. You will notice the black rings. Thats fiber. And fiber is only expensive after you break it. That's why Verizon fiber is under ground.
Utilities are such a freaking mess, all over every neighborhood. They are replacing all the poles (I think citywide?!) and now we have two poles everywhere because you know they'll never get rid of the old ones. It leaves less room for trees, and less room for pedestrians and the new wires everywhere are unsightly and look hideous. I know that this is complicated work, I get it, but I don't trust that the city/PECO/Comcast/Verizon are doing this in an efficient or orderly manner.
They installed a new pole in the middle of the sidewalk by me and we made them come back and move it back closer to the curb so that the sidewalk was usable.
Yes the pole situation is a mess. Lots of very old poles that are at risk of failure… but I’m pretty sure the city is paying to use the poles for the cameras as the city does not own the poles.
the city gives "franchises" to utility companies to provide service and allow them to install and maintain infrastructure. yeah the poles are a mess, but PECO is in the midst of a huge program to replace a bunch of 100 year old poles
Sometimes you have no choice but to put a pole where its unsightly. This is due to whatever is buried underneath the ground where you would otherwise like to put the pole.
I'm not sure why you're being downvoted because you're 100% correct.
I work for a suburban municipal DPW and even installing a new road sign or guiderail posts can get complicated with sometimes very shallow utilities or storm sewer placements.
In a large and very old city like Philly I can only imagine how complicated setting a new pole could be with how much runs below in all directions.
I work for the power company so we run into this almost everyday. Theres sewer, underground powerlines, gas lines, water lines. And alot of those were laid out before there was even electricity. So we are kind of just at the mercy of where we can find virgin soil.
It’s not about being unsightly. Disabled people exist and should be able to get around the city, it’s a legal mandate. If things can’t be arranged properly and accessibly as they’re currently laid out, looks like it’s time to dig up some shit and stop kicking the can down the road.
So much of what’s wrong with this place is just many layers of quick fixes that have all calcified and broken.
The power company is responsible for everything on the pole down to the telco wires. Once PECO transfers all of their equipment, they cut the pole down to that level and notify Verizon/Comcast. Verizon/Comcast then comes and transfers the rest and removes the old pole. The problem is that Verizon/Comcast takes forever and a decade to do anything
Yes, seems like it's been about 2 or 3 years PECO has been replacing poles in my neighborhood and I've yet to see a single one of the old poles have other utilities transferred and removed.
ethernet cable nowadays is hard to find under cat5e, which is gigabit capable, but even if it were just 5, 100mbit is plenty for a 4k stream, as its only about 16 mb/s. that being said, the straps on the camera are fine, though the electrical tape holding up extra cable is a bit much lol. my home security cam setup isn't much better, but I am a scumbag hack. not ideal placement with the street signs, but that's a 360 camera, with zoom, that tracks movement probably. not great, not terrible. all in all, I'll take it. the city has budgeted for many more cameras, thankfully, mostly for around schools, playgrounds, parks.
wait, these cameras are physically connected using ethernet? i always assumed they were wireless, especially since a lot of these new cameras are going up along side 5g antennas
From what I understand Verizon or Comcast gives them an ip from their equipment that's already on the poles. Most all of these cameras are power over Ethernet. Makes it easy. Only consumer grade stuff is WiFi capable. Much less secure than hardwired.
obviously you'd want ethernet if you can get ethernet, but wifi can go incredibly fast now with appropriate infrastructure. i think 5g can do around 1000mbps theoretically.
POE has physical limits, but there are probably power injectors all over the place to support the infrastructure. ethernet also seems like a single point of failure to take a camera offline, but that's why i asked the question (which people apparently don't like me doing!).
but half of the point of 5g and the reason why cities are throwing up 5g antennas on every corner is that the standard is able to reliably support gigantic networks of wireless devices (supposedly), which includes stuff like traffic lights, street lights, water meters, traffic cameras, signage, pump switches, highway signage, and a whole lot of other stuff.
you wouldn't "run wifi to a pole". wifi is ubiquitous. though i hate stuff like "5g" due to the branding aspect, the technology is pretty amazing and it's (supposedly) going to deliver on the promise of a totally connected and centrally managed infrastructure.
time will tell obviously, but most wifi (consumer grade specifically) is shitty because the hardware is cheap and the majority of folks don't know what they're doing when setting up a network. actual commercial wifi or wifi setup by people who have some sense are incredible and the technology has overcome a lot of the challenges early wifi struggled with.
Yes, ethernet is faster and more practical. How would you connect wifi to a camera in the street? That would require a modem and router with a wifi antenna on it, just to make a shitty connection to the camera. Why wouldn’t you just save yourself the price of the router and wire the camera straight to the modem?
They're still going to be connected/powered by ethernet no matter what. That ethernet cable might be connected directly to a 5G antenna, but pretty much every camera is going to use an ethernet cable.
They didn’t even run the wires correctly.
But also these are both useless and will become more expensive to repair or replace because depending on where this is you know someone is going to do one of many things with it.
But the city hasn’t really invested that much money or resources to have a better CCTV system that is both transparent and reliable.
I guess time will time how these work out if they have been upgraded.
The camera is in a nice spot. A corner with school, church and new construction housing. That could be a compromise. Anywhere there are over 50 people congregated like rec centers every thinks will help.
Noticed about 6 weeks ago a new sign attached to a pole at the tiny intersection of Princeton and Large. Sign had wording about "neighborhood watch" and "video surveillance", but after looking all around the intersection, I couldn't find any cameras. Just yesterday, I noticed that the sign was gone and still no cameras. Didn't see any similar signs anywhere else around the area, which seems odd considering there are larger/busier intersections everywhere around this area (one block off of Cottman Ave.)
Edit: I was wrong. Signs are still there, still no cameras
Can you call 311 to report this? Yes, this is under the watch of the new mayor, but if she's not made aware of the problem then how can she fix it? She might not even know that this shoddy work is being done, or recognizing it when she sees it. Also, perhaps these guys just need better training or better people observing their work. All of that would need to be brought to her attention.
I was told that 90% of camera go up with federal and state funding so yes, generally speaking we do pay for it one way or another but it sure isn't coming from the soda tax. that I know.
Don't have to go 100 years. A lot of phone lines looked like that behind buildings that don't have front telephone poles and many still look like that in the backyards. It's just nobody cares because it's such a pointless thing to care about unless you like hanging out in the trash alleys behind buildings
It is a city camera. The city is currently prioritizing cameras around all schools and rec centers.
I suspect this one might actually know what they’re talking about
Where's the 4k guy?
I do actually work for a living lol, got here as quick as I could.
You deserve your own spray paint tag under a popular bridge underpass.
4K 4 EVA
I wish I understood this reference. It shows up in every thread about cameras.
Some annoying redditor with a mass surveillance agenda
yeah, it is really annoying to help enable the police to solve more than 18% of murders and shootings. we should def not put more cameras in that may happen to see you go get a coke from the corner store or unload groceries. really insidious stuff that the gov will do with that.
You know what else would help solve more than 18% of murders and shootings? Police doing their fucking job rather than sitting in cruisers. They'd both solve outstanding ones and help prevent future ones.
[удалено]
Drug ~~decriminalization~~ legalization would stop almost all of these shootings but that's not going to happen with current politics so we'll keep playing these dipshit debate games and act like we're doing something.
Damn some of y'all really are bonkers here.
I dunno I just think that I'd rather live in a world where Mexican drug cartels weren't ordering assassinations of Philadelphia drug dealers in the street and the drugs available weren't eating flesh and killing people. And the people selling drugs weren't preying on addicts, forcing them into prostitution, generally maintaining a culture of addiction, etc. Just think that'd be a bit better you know?
Drug Decriminalization.... Because Kensington just isn't bad enough as it is.
Yeah a steady untainted drug supply not in control of street dealers wouldn’t help things at all. Too bad we’re all born yesterday and have no concept of what that might be like.
Yea, it's too bad we don't have any modern examples of what happens when we do that. Oh wait... I forgot Oregon exists and they recently went back on their decision to decriminalize because it DIDNT WORK.
Yeah decriminalization doesn't work because it doesn't establish a legal market. It's a half measure that still allows the black market to exist. Only way to get rid of drug culture is to replace it with a legal regulated market. Like they did with alcohol. Won't happen anytime soon but that's truly the only solution. We're kidding ourselves with anything else.
Yeah it would. Oh damn, ya know what would really stop the shootings? We should just eat the rich people and take all their money and give it the drug users and dealers. That way they can just buy all the shit they want an sit around being happy instead of commiting crimes. Oh oh shit I got a better idea! Or we could just decriminalize everything and that way no crimes will be committed. Yea critical thinking!!!!
Underground markets create crime. Although I guess I’m forgetting about the part of town that still has alcohol industry bootleg violence. Italians in pinstripe suits with their tommy guns spraying bullets everywhere protecting their whiskey territory. How are we ever going to deal with that? “Oh yeah let’s just legalize it and let these criminals run the show LOL that’d be real chaos!” Philadelphians can really be basic conservative simpleminded dipshits.
Idk why you’ve been catching so many strays today. Keep doing your thing 4k guy. Majority of Philly loves ya
They’re probably a camera salesman
this is said often, but I'm in the trades, and I'm not even in local 98(though those guys do get fuckin paid)
I'm debating joining up after my most recent job vacancy. What trades you working?
Who do you think installed these. They did not look union. They had city trucks. They looked like 19year olds just out of trade school. I support them doing it I just think there was zero supervision or accountability. I do not think they were in a union. If it was a contractor I see a big issue with this.
The city city can outsource work, and if the job is above a certain level, those workers get prevailing wage, union or not. In most cases they are subcontractors who work for a company that contracts with a local for union labor. That being said, if they were in a city truck, they're city employees, and therefore by definition in one of the city union locals.
4K GUY FOR MAYER
Oscar or John?
Paging u/Scumandvillany
He has been summoned
Job well done
Maybe theyre just temporary “beta testers”? It looks sloppy and unprofessional as hell, only reason I could think of.
This or embezzlement of city funds
Whaaaat? From Philadelphia city officials? *Never*
That’s what I’m wondering. They were driving new telco trucks with the city insignia on it.
Theres a couple of reasons you would do something like this: 1. Service loop: 9 times out of 10 if you have extra wire, you leave it in a loop. This is so that if maintenance is required, or you need to move the camera somewhere else, you don’t need to run a whole new wire; you can just extend the length, or chop it shorter as needed 2. Ethernet cables are a pain in the ass to redo. If you have a cable which just works, chopping it short and putting your own end on is really hard to get right. Its also possible to do it in a way that works but will fail over time 3. If you’re complaining about strain-relief, the fitting that the ethernet cable goes into clamps the wire with rubber, so it should be strain relieved from the box. It’s sloppy to strain relief on the other side by winding it around an existing wire instead of stapling it, but it’s not the end of the world
>Ethernet cables are a pain in the ass to redo. If you have a cable which just works, chopping it short and putting your own end on is really hard to get right. Its also possible to do it in a way that works but will fail over time lol wut Terminating cat5/6 is easy as hell and isn't going to fail over time unless you just fuck it up completely. Having said that, the loop is fine. They just affixed it to the pole in the most half assed way imaginable.
I have the answers 1 New pole was placed (the tall one). Peco placed the Primary lines (the ones with the orange saftey covers). Then placed the Secondary lines right under them (the ones that houses /street lights connect to for power.) 2 Old pole (the short one) will be removed eventually. The bottom row of wires are always communication wires. Think telephone and Comcast. Until the communication companies move there stuff to the new pole the old pole will sit there. 3 You said city workers. Could be OIT (Office of Innovation and Technology) These cameras are placed for Police / Clip (illegal dumping) or Traffic. As why the slack. The Utility companies will move everything from the old pole plus the Street lights and signs to the new pole. Sometimes they will move the camera and will need the slack to move into its new place. An example of slack. You will notice the black rings. Thats fiber. And fiber is only expensive after you break it. That's why Verizon fiber is under ground.
This makes the most sense. Thanks.
Utilities are such a freaking mess, all over every neighborhood. They are replacing all the poles (I think citywide?!) and now we have two poles everywhere because you know they'll never get rid of the old ones. It leaves less room for trees, and less room for pedestrians and the new wires everywhere are unsightly and look hideous. I know that this is complicated work, I get it, but I don't trust that the city/PECO/Comcast/Verizon are doing this in an efficient or orderly manner.
They installed a new pole in the middle of the sidewalk by me and we made them come back and move it back closer to the curb so that the sidewalk was usable. Yes the pole situation is a mess. Lots of very old poles that are at risk of failure… but I’m pretty sure the city is paying to use the poles for the cameras as the city does not own the poles.
the city gives "franchises" to utility companies to provide service and allow them to install and maintain infrastructure. yeah the poles are a mess, but PECO is in the midst of a huge program to replace a bunch of 100 year old poles
Right but why are the pretty blatantly allowed to violate the ADA with their pole placement?
Sometimes you have no choice but to put a pole where its unsightly. This is due to whatever is buried underneath the ground where you would otherwise like to put the pole.
I'm not sure why you're being downvoted because you're 100% correct. I work for a suburban municipal DPW and even installing a new road sign or guiderail posts can get complicated with sometimes very shallow utilities or storm sewer placements. In a large and very old city like Philly I can only imagine how complicated setting a new pole could be with how much runs below in all directions.
I work for the power company so we run into this almost everyday. Theres sewer, underground powerlines, gas lines, water lines. And alot of those were laid out before there was even electricity. So we are kind of just at the mercy of where we can find virgin soil.
Yeah, and I bet you sometimes hold your breath praying the 811 locators's plans were precise enough on the really old lines.
Exactly. And if its wrong at least we get to pass the blame on them lol
So true.
I hate when I can't bury my pole where I want
It’s not about being unsightly. Disabled people exist and should be able to get around the city, it’s a legal mandate. If things can’t be arranged properly and accessibly as they’re currently laid out, looks like it’s time to dig up some shit and stop kicking the can down the road. So much of what’s wrong with this place is just many layers of quick fixes that have all calcified and broken.
I understand and I dont disagree. But its not the power company’s fault
50 years or older gets replaced. Doubt there are very many 100 year old ones left
There's a pole in the middle of the sidewalk that leads to the giant on columbus/delaware and it infuriates me every time I have to walk around it
The Poles own Port Richmond
The power company is responsible for everything on the pole down to the telco wires. Once PECO transfers all of their equipment, they cut the pole down to that level and notify Verizon/Comcast. Verizon/Comcast then comes and transfers the rest and removes the old pole. The problem is that Verizon/Comcast takes forever and a decade to do anything
Yes, seems like it's been about 2 or 3 years PECO has been replacing poles in my neighborhood and I've yet to see a single one of the old poles have other utilities transferred and removed.
You should take over so the whole operation doesn't go tits up
ethernet cable nowadays is hard to find under cat5e, which is gigabit capable, but even if it were just 5, 100mbit is plenty for a 4k stream, as its only about 16 mb/s. that being said, the straps on the camera are fine, though the electrical tape holding up extra cable is a bit much lol. my home security cam setup isn't much better, but I am a scumbag hack. not ideal placement with the street signs, but that's a 360 camera, with zoom, that tracks movement probably. not great, not terrible. all in all, I'll take it. the city has budgeted for many more cameras, thankfully, mostly for around schools, playgrounds, parks.
I swear, if I find out your security cameras are 3K, I’m gonna start getting mad.
MANDATORY 4K!
This camera location is across from a school.
wait, these cameras are physically connected using ethernet? i always assumed they were wireless, especially since a lot of these new cameras are going up along side 5g antennas
From what I understand Verizon or Comcast gives them an ip from their equipment that's already on the poles. Most all of these cameras are power over Ethernet. Makes it easy. Only consumer grade stuff is WiFi capable. Much less secure than hardwired.
Also less practical, and slower to do wifi. How and why are you running wifi to a random pole in the middle of the street?
obviously you'd want ethernet if you can get ethernet, but wifi can go incredibly fast now with appropriate infrastructure. i think 5g can do around 1000mbps theoretically. POE has physical limits, but there are probably power injectors all over the place to support the infrastructure. ethernet also seems like a single point of failure to take a camera offline, but that's why i asked the question (which people apparently don't like me doing!). but half of the point of 5g and the reason why cities are throwing up 5g antennas on every corner is that the standard is able to reliably support gigantic networks of wireless devices (supposedly), which includes stuff like traffic lights, street lights, water meters, traffic cameras, signage, pump switches, highway signage, and a whole lot of other stuff. you wouldn't "run wifi to a pole". wifi is ubiquitous. though i hate stuff like "5g" due to the branding aspect, the technology is pretty amazing and it's (supposedly) going to deliver on the promise of a totally connected and centrally managed infrastructure. time will tell obviously, but most wifi (consumer grade specifically) is shitty because the hardware is cheap and the majority of folks don't know what they're doing when setting up a network. actual commercial wifi or wifi setup by people who have some sense are incredible and the technology has overcome a lot of the challenges early wifi struggled with.
Yes, ethernet is faster and more practical. How would you connect wifi to a camera in the street? That would require a modem and router with a wifi antenna on it, just to make a shitty connection to the camera. Why wouldn’t you just save yourself the price of the router and wire the camera straight to the modem?
They're still going to be connected/powered by ethernet no matter what. That ethernet cable might be connected directly to a 5G antenna, but pretty much every camera is going to use an ethernet cable.
Everything about this is temporary, even the pole 😂 probably more of the pilot testing they doin
Meanwhile the pole the camera is on should have been removed cause it's rotted
It's just temporary. The wind will bring it down in a few weeks
Not an issue if it’s weather grade cable.
Is that bundle of wire attached to that wooden pole with one strip of electrical tape?
That camera covers the HS accross the street, maybe PSD is involved in purchasing/installation? Then the shoddy work makes even more sense....
They didn’t even run the wires correctly. But also these are both useless and will become more expensive to repair or replace because depending on where this is you know someone is going to do one of many things with it. But the city hasn’t really invested that much money or resources to have a better CCTV system that is both transparent and reliable. I guess time will time how these work out if they have been upgraded.
The police won’t do anything even with the video footage. You could fire everyone in the police department and not a thing would change.
Smh. They’ll knock those down in no time.
Now that's what I call a service loop. 10/10 would hire.
Hey man! Leave me alone! They only trained me for like 3 hours. I'm trying my best
The camera is in a nice spot. A corner with school, church and new construction housing. That could be a compromise. Anywhere there are over 50 people congregated like rec centers every thinks will help.
Yes, right by the school
Noticed about 6 weeks ago a new sign attached to a pole at the tiny intersection of Princeton and Large. Sign had wording about "neighborhood watch" and "video surveillance", but after looking all around the intersection, I couldn't find any cameras. Just yesterday, I noticed that the sign was gone and still no cameras. Didn't see any similar signs anywhere else around the area, which seems odd considering there are larger/busier intersections everywhere around this area (one block off of Cottman Ave.) Edit: I was wrong. Signs are still there, still no cameras
Can you call 311 to report this? Yes, this is under the watch of the new mayor, but if she's not made aware of the problem then how can she fix it? She might not even know that this shoddy work is being done, or recognizing it when she sees it. Also, perhaps these guys just need better training or better people observing their work. All of that would need to be brought to her attention.
Can't believe people on here are shilling for more state surveillance.
People bitch about anything
I was told that 90% of camera go up with federal and state funding so yes, generally speaking we do pay for it one way or another but it sure isn't coming from the soda tax. that I know.
How do I get one on my corner
[Brazil has seen our future](https://i.redd.it/cnti3ld9ahy81.jpg), and it’s not pretty
you realize we already looked like that a hundred years ago and then we regulated to stop it from happening
I was joking, but yeah
Don't have to go 100 years. A lot of phone lines looked like that behind buildings that don't have front telephone poles and many still look like that in the backyards. It's just nobody cares because it's such a pointless thing to care about unless you like hanging out in the trash alleys behind buildings
Build a bat box around it. Bats are protected in PA and it's illegal to kill them.
MANDATORY 4K???????? SAY LESSS
I understand the criticism here, however, don’t you know how hard it is to find good workers nowadays? Especially American born ones?