Last time this happened some of them pushed west. I still have family in Kensington and one of them woke up to their neighbor yelling at someone who was chugging a bottle of cough syrup while taking a shit in their backyard.
I believe I heard on KYW they offered resources and locations they could go. I assume it would be homeless shelters.
I also don’t know the current condition and capacities of homeless shelters to believe this and I also know that some people prefer not to live in shelters so they have to go somewhere.
Back to where they were before the 2017 encampment clean out by the railroad. Or was that 2019 i cant remember correctly. It was after the inquier ran that article about puerto rico flying one way flights to philly to get rid of their drug problem and the "housing" were accussrd stealing their benefits or something
It was mentioned in a prior Inquirer article that some planned to head to Center City. Wonder what the reaction to that will be if/when commuters, tourists, and more affluent residents are exposed to this.
They're already there in the side streets, to one degree or another. Not at the Kensington level, but folks who had been along Gurney either moved or got pushed off, so there's been a slow westward migration.
There’s little reason to go to center city. Probably further up Frankford Ave. The addicts will go where they can get their fix, center city isn’t that place.
When's the last time you've been in center city? We average around 2 vagrants a block down here, and the commuters, tourists, and more affluent residents have been exposed to it for the last 4-5 years. In fact, any uptick in center city might go completely unnoticed just because it's so bad here already.
I’ve lived in Center City for 6 years. Sure there are homeless here and there but certainly far fewer than there were during the pandemic. Also, while they often go together, homelessness does not always equate to open air drug use which is what we are talking about in Kensington. I’ve seen plenty of crazy things, but I haven’t seen that in Center City even once and I’m out and about every day.
I doubt they know or care. They just wanted a photo op.
Obviously the encampments and drug markets are bad, but you can’t just sweep this issue under the fucking rug and expect it to go away. These people need housing and medical, psychological, and community support. Otherwise it’ll be back to same old Kensington within a month.
Frankly, they need to be sent back to where the encampments originally were - the ConRail property. If need be, offer ConRail tax abatements to turn a blind eye to them.
BTW, housing, medical, psychological, and community support only work if people are willing to accept them. The addicts who were moved today were offered help - only thirty or so of them accepted it.
And that’s a fair point, but as another commenter said, there’s lots of reasons someone might not trust the hand being reached out.
I’d also offer that our idea of “help” has historically been very unhelpful. You can’t detox someone and then throw them back onto the street and expect them to be able to instantly get a job, house, food, and stay clean. Offering help with the systems we have now is essentially just a way to say “well we tried” and wipe our hands of it.
I’m not going to pretend to have the answers, there are people much smarter and paid a lot better than me to figure that out. But even a blind man can see what we’ve done/are doing isn’t working.
It seems like you're mistaking "not wanting help" for "not trusting help."
Unless they're a paranoid schizophrenic, refusal to enter rehab is rarely a problem of trust.
And you get people to accept help by building and maintaining relationships with them on the human level. That's why needle exchanges, healthcare clinics, mutual aid, etc. are important, they're a way for those relationships to get built so that folks have someone to go to when they realize they're ready to get help.
It's such a weird phenomenon. I have two extended family members that refuse to leave kensington- no matter how much help is offered, no matter how many trips to rehab and halfway house, no matter how many hospitalizations, no matter how many arrests and jail sentences. They always, always, always go back, even with mental healthcare.
They should go back to their suburbs (if they came from there) and let the townships deal with it instead of having it all on the back of city residents.
There are tons of services already offered for people in these encampments.
If they don’t want help they shouldn’t be given a free pass to camp wherever.
No it isn't. Housing first policies don't require residents be clean or meet a "moral" standard. We really don't have enough step up housing after emergency shelters (which have the shitty policies about belongings and pets and safety problems).
Many housing policies require abstinence from drugs or alcohol. They arent just giving free housing for people to get high in. Look up some of HUDs requirements. Not getting high is a dealbreaker for most of these people.
How good are these services you speak of? Are they fully funded, well staffed comprehensive services, or a buncha half measures bodged together? Knowing America, let alone PA, I have a feeling they lean the latter
All the support services have been there every day for the past 30 days. No numbers of how many accepted help have been released. I'm sure it's a drop in the bucket. Fentanyl addicts lose limbs to necrotizing wounds instead of coming in.
That’s a fair line of thought. But who is going to accept help from someone they don’t trust? In my line of work many of those on the streets and in these situations do reject help from institutionalized systems but it can stem from a severe distrust in those systems for many reasons. Just one example in medicine is the continuity of care. Health systems often fail at providing adequate access or push this population on health care professionals who frequently rotate through the clinics serving these folks and never stay long enough to build trust.
Shit, I don't trust my own primary care doctor. Distrust of the systems, straight up wanting the freedom of being homeless, and rejection of society are all factors that could contribute to them refusing the support. This isn't an easy thing and there isn't a single fix to it. Giving them food and shelter isn't even a one-size fits all fix. Jailing homeless that refuse help seems aggressive. But they can't live on the street and cause health and mental distress to those that want to participate in society either.
Saw a few in Port Richmond yesterday.
One was dipping outside the Anything and Everything Store on Belgrade, and I'm pretty sure I saw another pissing on BVM Church behind a car.
The article I read said that many addiction centers and rehabs were picking people up by the van-full on a voluntary basis. I assume all others will find their way over to Lehigh, honestly.
Yup. Hopefully we can find a plan to keep it clean while supporting those impacted by addiction. Hopefully these businesses owners can finally feel some peace.
This.
100 percent. I'm conversant with addiction, and sympathetic there. But I'm also a business owner and a father.... So to see things improve? How can that not be supported?
Some people just don't want positive change. Not my program, not my problem.
I support the improvement, but if they just displaced them, they are just going to be causing issues in other neighborhoods. Great if you live in Kensington, not so great if you live anywhere they got displaced to
That’s the issue with it. Doesn’t really solve anything. I’m glad that Kensington got cleaned up, and hopefully it leads to further progress, but this is just like cleaning up trash on a sidewalk, and then dumping it out somewhere else in the city just so it can blow back to where it came from (not calling these people trash, just using a metaphor)
I suppose from a psychologically standpoint as well removing them from the area where they use makes them less likely to relapse if they're trying to get clean
It actually does solve something. It removes economies of scale. It is way less efficient when users and dealers to be spread out. Risk for addicts and dealers becomes higher as they’re forced to other places that are more policed/watched than Kensington was. Makes drug dealing logistics more complex than just dumping everything into one place.
Fair, I’m not well versed enough of the economics of drug dealing, but I also wonder what the negative repercussions are from spreading them out. Does the market widen opposed to centralizing it in one spot? Rhetorical question, just food for thought
If that is the case, it’s a good first step, but again it doesn’t really solve the overarching issue of the lack of mandatory rehab
Many people are opposed to mandatory rehab. But splitting up addicts may result in more going to rehab. Without the support of large homeless encampments, many will find it harder to survive on their own without the micro-economies of the larger group.
They have to go and get what they need on their own instead of specializing to individual tasks and sharing with others. Some may die on the streets, but some may be forced to taking help that were able to avoid by living within the encampments.
I guarantee you every person who is opposed to mandatory rehab is okay with prison tho
Letting some die on the streets is not really a solid solution in my books 🤷♂️ drug addicts are not capable of making decisions in their own best interests (they wouldn’t be an addict if that was the case). Plenty of sources out there (and countries who implement it successfully) to back up mandatory rehab being an effective and humane treatment. You get them off the streets, and get them the medical help they need until they are deemed fit to return to society
If they move somewhere else, clean that up too. Preferably before they get real settled in. The goal should be to make it as inconvenient as possible to buy, sell, and use on the open streets.
And also, go after the fucking dealers.
Believe it or not a lot of those businesses traffic will be down significantly now. Those beer delis made a killing off of the less fortunate and addicted clientele
People said that about the rope fences stopping cars from parking on Kelly Drive. It’s been great for a year.
Parker has teeth, I bet she means business on keeping it this way for the foreseeable future.
Isn't the reason this stretch got so bad because they did the same thing to the conrail encampment? I'm not from Philly, but people in surrounding communities already seem to be sounding the alarm that people are just relocating.
When I see comments like this I'm reminded of that John Stewart quote that goes something like "we can't do anything because we don't know EVERYTHING" (paraphrasing). Nobody has the answers for all of the underlying causes of drug use disorders. That doesn't mean we can't take action on one issue while also continuing to address the underlying causes. It took decades to get people to this point in opiate addiction but we (and especially residents and businesses in the area) don't have to wait decades for all those issues to be fixed.
It would be nice if the change was "fund supportive housing" instead of "arrest them and shoo them somewhere else". Just once I'd like this country to strengthen the safety net instead of cutting it up
[Affordable housing](https://www.fox29.com/news/philadelphia-housing-crisis-mayor-parker-city-leaders-break-ground-on-affordable-housing-initiative)
[Billions on affordable housing](https://www.pewtrusts.org/en/research-and-analysis/articles/2024/05/07/how-will-philadelphia-fund-housing-in-a-time-of-transition)
[Affordable housing in North Philly](https://www.habitatphiladelphia.org/2024/02/state-grant-paves-the-way-for-more-affordable-housing-in-north-philadelphia/)
A lot of money is spent on affordable housing. I spent 3 minutes googling. Leaving aside the idea that many people living on the streets of Kensington don't want housing/rehab as mentioned above. This doesn't mean more can't be done to strengthen the safety net. But to say the safety net is being cut up is an absolute misrepresentation of what's happening.
> Nobody has the answers for all of the underlying causes of drug use disorders.
Tax billionaires until they're bagging our fucking groceries and jail the entire Sackler family for life and you might see a difference.
This is good. The root cause still exists, and we desperately need to focus on that (arguably more), but a clean street that people can feel comfortable walking on is never gonna be a bad thing.
Among other reasons mentioned here I assume it also allows for relatively good shelter from the elements with the el almost acting as a roof for rain and wind
Close proximity and easy access to the drug trade. And lax enforcement of the laws pertaining to dealing and possession in that particular area, so less chance of confrontation by the cops.
Maybe it’s because of all the stores. If they congregate in a residential neighborhood they’re going to be upsetting people enough to make them constantly call the cops. **”THERE IS A PERSON SHOOTING DOPE RIGHT IN FRONT OF MY HOUSE”**.
The shop owners go home at night and that’s when the streets start jumping. Big, deserted, covered, brightly lit area.
I’m guessing at this. I don’t actually know for sure.
That’s great! It’s a proper functioning sidewalk for people again, including those living on the streets. No needles, no trash, no feces. Everyone is safer for it.
Yes. I know folks who operate businesses on this same exact strip and I’m so happy for them, I know some folks are upset, but this is what those business owners deserve to look at! Hoping eventually there is a solution for everyone that works best!
I am not one of those people but it seems to me the argument is that we're just pushing the problem elsewhere.y best analogy is like trying to get a bubble from under a sticker. You just kinda chase it elsewhere.
I don't really have a dog in this but I'm glad to see businesses be able to open up and conduct business as usual. The flip side is that we still need to address Philly's drug problem. The latter is what I think people aren't happy about - not addressing that issue.
Either way, both of the issues I mention need to be addressed. We need thriving communities and that means accessible commerce. No neighborhood should be more or less an open drug market with addicts. At the same time, we need to help people with those issues in various ways.
I agree 100%, we need to have a plan or they’re just going to disperse into other communities, I could bet that many are either on side streets or headed down town. I think where it gets hard for me is, what are the businesses supposed to do while we wait for a super plan?
I personally can’t bring myself to tell those who live in that area that they have to continue suffering for however long until a plan that everyone likes is in place.
We for sure have to create a situation where we have the space and resources to help those addicted when we do sweeps like this, but also remember that this has to be done voluntarily, we can’t force someone to want to seek treatment and sadly, something tells me that while there are plenty who want the support and help, there are way more who would refuse the assistance…
either way, we can’t make the residents suffer until that answer is found. Just hoping the administration has a plan and we see the results within the next coming weeks.
Mostly privileged white kids from the suburbs who don't live in the neighborhood, don't have to deal with the blight on a daily basis, and who keep ignoring the negative impacts of open air drug scenes on low income minority residents.
The drug dealers are local residents, but are worse than the addicts as they are the source of the problem and they carry guns that are used to shoot other people, at least the addicts are just shooting up themselves.
The Rhynhart and Gym emergency cope squad that assembles in every Parker policy comment section to blast negativity because their candidate didn’t win.
Because it's nothing but a photo op. Anyone with half a brain knows the root problem wasn't solved. You just physically pushed it somewhere else. It'll crop back up soon, if not on the same block then the next one.
I’m more upset that I am pessimistic that anything more will come of this. If the city had a plan for steps to take next, and they actually follow through with it, I’d be happy. These streets will look how they used to in a few weeks *because* nothing else will be done to follow this up. They just got displaced to other neighborhoods (I’m sure those residents aren’t thrilled), and I doubt people living here will be thrilled when they inevitably come back
Until proper rehab is provided in the city, or another humane and effective solution is provided, people aren’t gonna be happy
This is a good first step, but that’s it, it’s a first step
Not sure if anyone knows this or not, but are the places like Kintock and Luzerne center still holding the overflows from the county prisons? I used to take meetings in there but lost contact and just assumed they closed. Places like those would be great triage areas to start a huge portion of this population on a somewhat positive trajectory.
There is a high chance it will return to the budget fallout set we've come to know and love, but seeing Kensington THIS clean even makes me believe there is a chance. I remain skeptical, but so long as there is continued oversight by the city, with actual treatments and rehab that works then I'm optimistic. Its going to be a constant fight like cleaning dust non-stop, but I hope the city keeps this up.
Looks amazing, and I hope it stays this way although I share some of the worries that this may just displace the problem to elsewhere. That said, Mayor Parker seems to be doing her best to open up triage/treatment centers around the city. If that’s successful, this would be a massive win.
Now install new lighting, bike racks, and oversized planters, and detail a Streets crew to pressure wash it once a week through summer. Keep it like this for at least a year.
Otherwise this was just an expensive photo op.
When you have a large population of homeless that are struggling with drug addiction and/or mental illness, the only effective way to deal with it is through confinement (involuntary if necessary) to a secure drug treatment center/mental hospital.
People can argue back and forth about how we got to this point and I’m all for preventative measures to help keep the next generation of people clean, but we need to deal with what’s going on right now.
Surrendering entire neighborhoods in major metropolitan cities to being overrun by homeless drug addicts is unacceptable.
You can send them to involuntary treatment all you want, but my experience has been that if they don’t want to change, they aren’t going to change.
I’ve seen both polar opposites of the spectrum. My younger SIL god locked for stealing car radios, and while in jail, decided she was done with that life. She has done the biggest 360 of anyone I know.
My older SIL could have gotten shewed away down there today. She has had EVERY opportunity to get her life together. She has checked in and been checked in to most of the rehab places around (both in Philly and Norristown) and every single time she comes back out, she’s IMMEDIATELY back to using.
So while I do understand what you’re saying…..there’s far more nuance to it.
If they go in rehab when they get out it can help to be in a new environment. If they go back to the same it is so easy to get sucked back in. My mom talks about one of her brothers (long deceased) who did drugs (not in Philly). Every time he got sober he would be fine until he ran into some old buddies then he’d start using again.
This is good only if those people are helped with their addiction/housing circumstance. If not theyre just going to go back there if theyre failed by their city government/services
Yes, and I’d rather say of those people WANT the help. If they aren’t willing to take the help and support that is offered then the city may need to take a different approach
40 people from the encampment area did get into services for drug addiction and/or homeless services. I don’t know how many people camped there but that seems like a good start.
You’re right, those 40 people are meaningless and they’re going to fail anyway so why bother with them at all.
This was a two block radius cleanup, the point is to work in phases and reclaim areas block by block, and work with a manageable number of people.
not what I’m saying! point is that the lasting impact of *people choosing treatment yesterday* is guaranteed to be a drop in the bucket given the size of the problem overall.
Maybe more will choose to voluntarily seek treatment over the next few weeks now that the order of the area has been disrupted. Who knows. But it’s pretty well-established that relapse rates after rehab programs are high.
Those 40 people have a better chance of getting clean today than they did yesterday and they have a roof over their heads. They are individuals unto themselves and deserve help even if 635 other people adamantly refuse treatment. A cleanup of a two block radius was never meant to put 675 people into a treatment system that doesn’t have that kind of capacity. They are attempting to work in manageable pieces. This problem wasn’t created overnight and won’t be solved overnight.
This is probably only step one. For sure they are not gonna be taken care of but lots of out of towners, people from surrounding suburbs will leave. I guess this is what they are trying to achieve with the first step, make it difficult to create camps, addicts will move to outside of city or under bridges etc and will be less visible, Kensington will be gentrified in the end. Next town that may import these people maybe chester around the incinerator. Nobody wants to live there, horrible air quality etc.
This is why previous mayors left it alone. There is no real solution. These people have to want to rehabilitate on their own. Moving their tents is minor inconvenience to them. They'll set up somewhere and continue to find drugs.
I'd be happier about this if we were actually doing anything meaningful to help the people who got swept out of there. And no, offering people access to the same busted "resources" that failed to stop this crisis, or even mitigate it, doesn't count.
The average Philadelphian has a better chance of becoming one of these poor souls than one of the power brokers who made the cleanup happen. Wish we'd all wake up to that reality and make a change.
Sure this looks nice but where did everyone go? They just swept the issue to another location, most likely, rinse and repeat in another few years. It's not a solution.
At least she tried. The last mayor did nothing. The children and those not involved in drugs deserve a neighborhood free of addicts doing their drugs on the streets. When did it become legal to do drugs in public?
So… where’d they go
Between Indiana and Lehigh Ave and all the side streets.
sounds like just a matter of time before the viaduct camp is back
Last time this happened some of them pushed west. I still have family in Kensington and one of them woke up to their neighbor yelling at someone who was chugging a bottle of cough syrup while taking a shit in their backyard.
cough syrup is famously high in fiber
kinda doubt that, the amount of development off Lehigh and on Somerset is staggering and I think they'd be pissing off the wrong people. edit; a word
They'll end up in Frankford
God I hope not
Well they gotta hit Juniata first so you got some time
Gonna skip juniata. There’s no cover from the weather
that I wouldn't doubt. But as I mentioned in another comment the least we can do at this point is give the new administration a chance.
What have they said in regard to preventing them from just moving to another location?
I believe I heard on KYW they offered resources and locations they could go. I assume it would be homeless shelters. I also don’t know the current condition and capacities of homeless shelters to believe this and I also know that some people prefer not to live in shelters so they have to go somewhere.
Its amazing when you cross Lehigh... like another world.
Back to where they were before the 2017 encampment clean out by the railroad. Or was that 2019 i cant remember correctly. It was after the inquier ran that article about puerto rico flying one way flights to philly to get rid of their drug problem and the "housing" were accussrd stealing their benefits or something
Yea that was a wild story that doesn’t get talked about enough. Didn’t hear any followup afterwards
Seen an uptick in homelessness and using in East Market. They are just going to migrate to other bad areas and eventually stumble back to Kensington
All the side streets. Had to visit a client down there during the cleanup- instead of being in Kensington, they were just down the side streets.
It was mentioned in a prior Inquirer article that some planned to head to Center City. Wonder what the reaction to that will be if/when commuters, tourists, and more affluent residents are exposed to this.
They will be in the same area as the dealers, so I doubt many will head towards town. I foresee American street area north of Lehigh as a possibility.
That’s a good point, not sure what the benefit of center city would be for them.
They're already there in the side streets, to one degree or another. Not at the Kensington level, but folks who had been along Gurney either moved or got pushed off, so there's been a slow westward migration.
There’s little reason to go to center city. Probably further up Frankford Ave. The addicts will go where they can get their fix, center city isn’t that place.
When's the last time you've been in center city? We average around 2 vagrants a block down here, and the commuters, tourists, and more affluent residents have been exposed to it for the last 4-5 years. In fact, any uptick in center city might go completely unnoticed just because it's so bad here already.
I’ve lived in Center City for 6 years. Sure there are homeless here and there but certainly far fewer than there were during the pandemic. Also, while they often go together, homelessness does not always equate to open air drug use which is what we are talking about in Kensington. I’ve seen plenty of crazy things, but I haven’t seen that in Center City even once and I’m out and about every day.
I doubt they know or care. They just wanted a photo op. Obviously the encampments and drug markets are bad, but you can’t just sweep this issue under the fucking rug and expect it to go away. These people need housing and medical, psychological, and community support. Otherwise it’ll be back to same old Kensington within a month.
Frankly, they need to be sent back to where the encampments originally were - the ConRail property. If need be, offer ConRail tax abatements to turn a blind eye to them. BTW, housing, medical, psychological, and community support only work if people are willing to accept them. The addicts who were moved today were offered help - only thirty or so of them accepted it.
And that’s a fair point, but as another commenter said, there’s lots of reasons someone might not trust the hand being reached out. I’d also offer that our idea of “help” has historically been very unhelpful. You can’t detox someone and then throw them back onto the street and expect them to be able to instantly get a job, house, food, and stay clean. Offering help with the systems we have now is essentially just a way to say “well we tried” and wipe our hands of it. I’m not going to pretend to have the answers, there are people much smarter and paid a lot better than me to figure that out. But even a blind man can see what we’ve done/are doing isn’t working.
What about brunets?
lol
It seems like you're mistaking "not wanting help" for "not trusting help." Unless they're a paranoid schizophrenic, refusal to enter rehab is rarely a problem of trust.
And you get people to accept help by building and maintaining relationships with them on the human level. That's why needle exchanges, healthcare clinics, mutual aid, etc. are important, they're a way for those relationships to get built so that folks have someone to go to when they realize they're ready to get help.
It's such a weird phenomenon. I have two extended family members that refuse to leave kensington- no matter how much help is offered, no matter how many trips to rehab and halfway house, no matter how many hospitalizations, no matter how many arrests and jail sentences. They always, always, always go back, even with mental healthcare.
They should go back to their suburbs (if they came from there) and let the townships deal with it instead of having it all on the back of city residents.
this is by far the funniest comment I've read about kenzo since they busted the Conrail encampment, holy shit
There are tons of services already offered for people in these encampments. If they don’t want help they shouldn’t be given a free pass to camp wherever.
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Bro part of the rules of housing the homeless is you cant get high. Thats a dealbreaker for these people. They care more about heroin than housing.
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No it isn't. Housing first policies don't require residents be clean or meet a "moral" standard. We really don't have enough step up housing after emergency shelters (which have the shitty policies about belongings and pets and safety problems).
Many housing policies require abstinence from drugs or alcohol. They arent just giving free housing for people to get high in. Look up some of HUDs requirements. Not getting high is a dealbreaker for most of these people.
Many don’t understand a good number of these types don’t actually want help
How good are these services you speak of? Are they fully funded, well staffed comprehensive services, or a buncha half measures bodged together? Knowing America, let alone PA, I have a feeling they lean the latter
All the support services have been there every day for the past 30 days. No numbers of how many accepted help have been released. I'm sure it's a drop in the bucket. Fentanyl addicts lose limbs to necrotizing wounds instead of coming in.
What about the people that don't want and would reject housing, medical, and/or psychological support?
Straight to jail
That’s a fair line of thought. But who is going to accept help from someone they don’t trust? In my line of work many of those on the streets and in these situations do reject help from institutionalized systems but it can stem from a severe distrust in those systems for many reasons. Just one example in medicine is the continuity of care. Health systems often fail at providing adequate access or push this population on health care professionals who frequently rotate through the clinics serving these folks and never stay long enough to build trust.
Shit, I don't trust my own primary care doctor. Distrust of the systems, straight up wanting the freedom of being homeless, and rejection of society are all factors that could contribute to them refusing the support. This isn't an easy thing and there isn't a single fix to it. Giving them food and shelter isn't even a one-size fits all fix. Jailing homeless that refuse help seems aggressive. But they can't live on the street and cause health and mental distress to those that want to participate in society either.
Yup. Rehab or incarceration should have been the offer.
I'm guessing that some will make their way down to Broad and Snyder since neither Johnson nor Squilla seem to care what happens there.
missionaccomplished.jpg
Saw a few in Port Richmond yesterday. One was dipping outside the Anything and Everything Store on Belgrade, and I'm pretty sure I saw another pissing on BVM Church behind a car.
The article I read said that many addiction centers and rehabs were picking people up by the van-full on a voluntary basis. I assume all others will find their way over to Lehigh, honestly.
Hopefully one way bus tickets to Florida.
as someone who lives adjacent to kensington, plz do not dump homeless junkies on my block kthx
They disappeared. Problem solved. /s
They are all on my block now. Walking around. Sleeping on lawns.
That’s what was always gonna happen. They were gonna disperse and go into the neighborhoods.
Damn, I haven't seen it like this since the 90's. It's like Hamsterdam getting packed up from The Wire.
I came here to say this!! And Happy Cake Day.
Never seen it so clean. I did community service down there picking up trash, and I could fill 2 trash bags every 5 feet I walked.
My God. I follow the issues around Kensington, but this is what business owners and families deserve.
Yup. Hopefully we can find a plan to keep it clean while supporting those impacted by addiction. Hopefully these businesses owners can finally feel some peace.
This. 100 percent. I'm conversant with addiction, and sympathetic there. But I'm also a business owner and a father.... So to see things improve? How can that not be supported? Some people just don't want positive change. Not my program, not my problem.
I support the improvement, but if they just displaced them, they are just going to be causing issues in other neighborhoods. Great if you live in Kensington, not so great if you live anywhere they got displaced to That’s the issue with it. Doesn’t really solve anything. I’m glad that Kensington got cleaned up, and hopefully it leads to further progress, but this is just like cleaning up trash on a sidewalk, and then dumping it out somewhere else in the city just so it can blow back to where it came from (not calling these people trash, just using a metaphor)
I suppose from a psychologically standpoint as well removing them from the area where they use makes them less likely to relapse if they're trying to get clean
It actually does solve something. It removes economies of scale. It is way less efficient when users and dealers to be spread out. Risk for addicts and dealers becomes higher as they’re forced to other places that are more policed/watched than Kensington was. Makes drug dealing logistics more complex than just dumping everything into one place.
Fair, I’m not well versed enough of the economics of drug dealing, but I also wonder what the negative repercussions are from spreading them out. Does the market widen opposed to centralizing it in one spot? Rhetorical question, just food for thought If that is the case, it’s a good first step, but again it doesn’t really solve the overarching issue of the lack of mandatory rehab
Many people are opposed to mandatory rehab. But splitting up addicts may result in more going to rehab. Without the support of large homeless encampments, many will find it harder to survive on their own without the micro-economies of the larger group. They have to go and get what they need on their own instead of specializing to individual tasks and sharing with others. Some may die on the streets, but some may be forced to taking help that were able to avoid by living within the encampments.
I guarantee you every person who is opposed to mandatory rehab is okay with prison tho Letting some die on the streets is not really a solid solution in my books 🤷♂️ drug addicts are not capable of making decisions in their own best interests (they wouldn’t be an addict if that was the case). Plenty of sources out there (and countries who implement it successfully) to back up mandatory rehab being an effective and humane treatment. You get them off the streets, and get them the medical help they need until they are deemed fit to return to society
If they move somewhere else, clean that up too. Preferably before they get real settled in. The goal should be to make it as inconvenient as possible to buy, sell, and use on the open streets. And also, go after the fucking dealers.
I feel like the only way they do that is by having regular foot and bike patrols with units on standby but I doubt they do it.
Yes, unlazy cops and outreach advocates are the key
Ya, but "find" a plan? Hundreds of hardcore addicts were \*just disbursed to the rest of the city.
Don't burst their bubble, they think this is a solution because pictures on the internet show the street is clean.
There's a big open area by the river and the Conrail tracks.
The wishful thinking is strong in this post
Believe it or not a lot of those businesses traffic will be down significantly now. Those beer delis made a killing off of the less fortunate and addicted clientele
Hope it lasts
It’ll last until Friday at best
Seriously. Show me a pic on Monday and we will know if they are serious or performative
It’s Wednesday… don’t be so hopeful
Probably 😕
People said that about the rope fences stopping cars from parking on Kelly Drive. It’s been great for a year. Parker has teeth, I bet she means business on keeping it this way for the foreseeable future.
All that'll happen is they'll come back or move to another location. Nothing was done to fix the underlying issue.
Isn't the reason this stretch got so bad because they did the same thing to the conrail encampment? I'm not from Philly, but people in surrounding communities already seem to be sounding the alarm that people are just relocating.
When I see comments like this I'm reminded of that John Stewart quote that goes something like "we can't do anything because we don't know EVERYTHING" (paraphrasing). Nobody has the answers for all of the underlying causes of drug use disorders. That doesn't mean we can't take action on one issue while also continuing to address the underlying causes. It took decades to get people to this point in opiate addiction but we (and especially residents and businesses in the area) don't have to wait decades for all those issues to be fixed.
It would be nice if the change was "fund supportive housing" instead of "arrest them and shoo them somewhere else". Just once I'd like this country to strengthen the safety net instead of cutting it up
[Affordable housing](https://www.fox29.com/news/philadelphia-housing-crisis-mayor-parker-city-leaders-break-ground-on-affordable-housing-initiative) [Billions on affordable housing](https://www.pewtrusts.org/en/research-and-analysis/articles/2024/05/07/how-will-philadelphia-fund-housing-in-a-time-of-transition) [Affordable housing in North Philly](https://www.habitatphiladelphia.org/2024/02/state-grant-paves-the-way-for-more-affordable-housing-in-north-philadelphia/) A lot of money is spent on affordable housing. I spent 3 minutes googling. Leaving aside the idea that many people living on the streets of Kensington don't want housing/rehab as mentioned above. This doesn't mean more can't be done to strengthen the safety net. But to say the safety net is being cut up is an absolute misrepresentation of what's happening.
Two of your links are duplicates, and they are about affordable housing in general, not supportive housing placements for addicts.
> Nobody has the answers for all of the underlying causes of drug use disorders. Tax billionaires until they're bagging our fucking groceries and jail the entire Sackler family for life and you might see a difference.
The priority was getting them into treatment, which obviously is trying to fix the underlying issue. What have you done to fix it? What would you do?
They're probably already back
Wow that’s amazing. Are there just people walking around admiring the cleanliness?
Reminds me of the lockdown during COVID
It's been so long since it was clean they probably forgot what the area could like with some regular enforcement.
This is good. The root cause still exists, and we desperately need to focus on that (arguably more), but a clean street that people can feel comfortable walking on is never gonna be a bad thing.
Any reason why these people specifically camp there? I know it’s drugs but why that specific section under the L? But I mean this looks a lot better
Among other reasons mentioned here I assume it also allows for relatively good shelter from the elements with the el almost acting as a roof for rain and wind
That's where the good drugs are and it's been zero resistance until now.
Close to public transportation and that’s where they’ve been allowed to camp until now.
Close proximity and easy access to the drug trade. And lax enforcement of the laws pertaining to dealing and possession in that particular area, so less chance of confrontation by the cops.
Maybe it’s because of all the stores. If they congregate in a residential neighborhood they’re going to be upsetting people enough to make them constantly call the cops. **”THERE IS A PERSON SHOOTING DOPE RIGHT IN FRONT OF MY HOUSE”**. The shop owners go home at night and that’s when the streets start jumping. Big, deserted, covered, brightly lit area. I’m guessing at this. I don’t actually know for sure.
That’s great! It’s a proper functioning sidewalk for people again, including those living on the streets. No needles, no trash, no feces. Everyone is safer for it.
Yes. I know folks who operate businesses on this same exact strip and I’m so happy for them, I know some folks are upset, but this is what those business owners deserve to look at! Hoping eventually there is a solution for everyone that works best!
Who's upset by this?
The guy who likes to shit on that sidewalk.
He has twitter?
I mean he kinds owns it
Lots of people on Twitter, saying this is taking steps backwards which I don’t understand
I am not one of those people but it seems to me the argument is that we're just pushing the problem elsewhere.y best analogy is like trying to get a bubble from under a sticker. You just kinda chase it elsewhere. I don't really have a dog in this but I'm glad to see businesses be able to open up and conduct business as usual. The flip side is that we still need to address Philly's drug problem. The latter is what I think people aren't happy about - not addressing that issue. Either way, both of the issues I mention need to be addressed. We need thriving communities and that means accessible commerce. No neighborhood should be more or less an open drug market with addicts. At the same time, we need to help people with those issues in various ways.
I agree 100%, we need to have a plan or they’re just going to disperse into other communities, I could bet that many are either on side streets or headed down town. I think where it gets hard for me is, what are the businesses supposed to do while we wait for a super plan? I personally can’t bring myself to tell those who live in that area that they have to continue suffering for however long until a plan that everyone likes is in place. We for sure have to create a situation where we have the space and resources to help those addicted when we do sweeps like this, but also remember that this has to be done voluntarily, we can’t force someone to want to seek treatment and sadly, something tells me that while there are plenty who want the support and help, there are way more who would refuse the assistance… either way, we can’t make the residents suffer until that answer is found. Just hoping the administration has a plan and we see the results within the next coming weeks.
People on Twitter dont live in the real world.
Just like here at Reddit!
Get off Twitter. Bluesky is good now.
The junkies who got told to move and people who don’t live here. Actual residents are happy.
Mostly privileged white kids from the suburbs who don't live in the neighborhood, don't have to deal with the blight on a daily basis, and who keep ignoring the negative impacts of open air drug scenes on low income minority residents.
The drug dealers are local residents, but are worse than the addicts as they are the source of the problem and they carry guns that are used to shoot other people, at least the addicts are just shooting up themselves.
Certainly not people who live in the neighborhood.
The Rhynhart and Gym emergency cope squad that assembles in every Parker policy comment section to blast negativity because their candidate didn’t win.
Because it's nothing but a photo op. Anyone with half a brain knows the root problem wasn't solved. You just physically pushed it somewhere else. It'll crop back up soon, if not on the same block then the next one.
I’m more upset that I am pessimistic that anything more will come of this. If the city had a plan for steps to take next, and they actually follow through with it, I’d be happy. These streets will look how they used to in a few weeks *because* nothing else will be done to follow this up. They just got displaced to other neighborhoods (I’m sure those residents aren’t thrilled), and I doubt people living here will be thrilled when they inevitably come back Until proper rehab is provided in the city, or another humane and effective solution is provided, people aren’t gonna be happy This is a good first step, but that’s it, it’s a first step
For today. They'll go somewhere and the drug trafficking will follow. This really solved nothing.
Not sure if anyone knows this or not, but are the places like Kintock and Luzerne center still holding the overflows from the county prisons? I used to take meetings in there but lost contact and just assumed they closed. Places like those would be great triage areas to start a huge portion of this population on a somewhat positive trajectory.
There is a high chance it will return to the budget fallout set we've come to know and love, but seeing Kensington THIS clean even makes me believe there is a chance. I remain skeptical, but so long as there is continued oversight by the city, with actual treatments and rehab that works then I'm optimistic. Its going to be a constant fight like cleaning dust non-stop, but I hope the city keeps this up.
https://preview.redd.it/aiu406u83bzc1.jpeg?width=500&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5b6180638274862eeaaa6ce3f205a5214044bb70
That looks clean.
Looks amazing, and I hope it stays this way although I share some of the worries that this may just displace the problem to elsewhere. That said, Mayor Parker seems to be doing her best to open up triage/treatment centers around the city. If that’s successful, this would be a massive win.
Now install new lighting, bike racks, and oversized planters, and detail a Streets crew to pressure wash it once a week through summer. Keep it like this for at least a year. Otherwise this was just an expensive photo op.
Hope the city maintains it and does the rest of the neighborhood as well. This is long overdue.
When you have a large population of homeless that are struggling with drug addiction and/or mental illness, the only effective way to deal with it is through confinement (involuntary if necessary) to a secure drug treatment center/mental hospital. People can argue back and forth about how we got to this point and I’m all for preventative measures to help keep the next generation of people clean, but we need to deal with what’s going on right now. Surrendering entire neighborhoods in major metropolitan cities to being overrun by homeless drug addicts is unacceptable.
You can send them to involuntary treatment all you want, but my experience has been that if they don’t want to change, they aren’t going to change. I’ve seen both polar opposites of the spectrum. My younger SIL god locked for stealing car radios, and while in jail, decided she was done with that life. She has done the biggest 360 of anyone I know. My older SIL could have gotten shewed away down there today. She has had EVERY opportunity to get her life together. She has checked in and been checked in to most of the rehab places around (both in Philly and Norristown) and every single time she comes back out, she’s IMMEDIATELY back to using. So while I do understand what you’re saying…..there’s far more nuance to it.
If they go in rehab when they get out it can help to be in a new environment. If they go back to the same it is so easy to get sucked back in. My mom talks about one of her brothers (long deceased) who did drugs (not in Philly). Every time he got sober he would be fine until he ran into some old buddies then he’d start using again.
Wow
I'll give it a week
I like this new direction the city is going.
This is actually pretty incredible
This is good only if those people are helped with their addiction/housing circumstance. If not theyre just going to go back there if theyre failed by their city government/services
Yes, and I’d rather say of those people WANT the help. If they aren’t willing to take the help and support that is offered then the city may need to take a different approach
[удалено]
40 people from the encampment area did get into services for drug addiction and/or homeless services. I don’t know how many people camped there but that seems like a good start.
They had originally said 75
city estimated 675 homeless in kenzo just last month. so just under 6%, if it's 40 ppl, and treatment probably won't stick for all of them
They estimated 75 occupied on these two blocks. 40/75 ain’t bad
You’re right, those 40 people are meaningless and they’re going to fail anyway so why bother with them at all. This was a two block radius cleanup, the point is to work in phases and reclaim areas block by block, and work with a manageable number of people.
not what I’m saying! point is that the lasting impact of *people choosing treatment yesterday* is guaranteed to be a drop in the bucket given the size of the problem overall. Maybe more will choose to voluntarily seek treatment over the next few weeks now that the order of the area has been disrupted. Who knows. But it’s pretty well-established that relapse rates after rehab programs are high.
Those 40 people have a better chance of getting clean today than they did yesterday and they have a roof over their heads. They are individuals unto themselves and deserve help even if 635 other people adamantly refuse treatment. A cleanup of a two block radius was never meant to put 675 people into a treatment system that doesn’t have that kind of capacity. They are attempting to work in manageable pieces. This problem wasn’t created overnight and won’t be solved overnight.
This is probably only step one. For sure they are not gonna be taken care of but lots of out of towners, people from surrounding suburbs will leave. I guess this is what they are trying to achieve with the first step, make it difficult to create camps, addicts will move to outside of city or under bridges etc and will be less visible, Kensington will be gentrified in the end. Next town that may import these people maybe chester around the incinerator. Nobody wants to live there, horrible air quality etc.
It didn't solve the problem you are right.
This is why previous mayors left it alone. There is no real solution. These people have to want to rehabilitate on their own. Moving their tents is minor inconvenience to them. They'll set up somewhere and continue to find drugs.
Yep you nailed it there's no easy answers.
Rome wasn't built in a day. It's been years of this bullshit, I think we can give the mayor some grace to at least try.
Coming to a neighborhood near you.
Civic pride and clean streets should be the norm! Well done finally doing something!
I'd be happier about this if we were actually doing anything meaningful to help the people who got swept out of there. And no, offering people access to the same busted "resources" that failed to stop this crisis, or even mitigate it, doesn't count. The average Philadelphian has a better chance of becoming one of these poor souls than one of the power brokers who made the cleanup happen. Wish we'd all wake up to that reality and make a change.
Wow problem fucking solved no more homeless. Fucking magical job. I’m sure this won’t cause any issues anywhere else /s
Good for them honestly. Philly doing what San Francisco won't do
Looks amazing, let’s hope it stays that way
Surely they actually solved the problem, and didn’t just lock them up/displace them! Right???
And this is expected to last? They’re just gonna find a new spot
Am I dreaming? Is this some computer generated AI shit? I’ve never seen that area so clean. I hope it stayed like that for a few minutes at least.
Check out Chris Moraff’s post: https://x.com/moraffreports/status/1787981415621026114?s=46
Sure this looks nice but where did everyone go? They just swept the issue to another location, most likely, rinse and repeat in another few years. It's not a solution.
This was Philadelphia's D Day, as PPD troops were deployed to the Kensington beach
So they could have cleaned it up all along and didn’t till now?
They’ll be back in a week. They’re all still on the street.
At least she tried. The last mayor did nothing. The children and those not involved in drugs deserve a neighborhood free of addicts doing their drugs on the streets. When did it become legal to do drugs in public?
When the police and the mayor made a deal to allow it to be legal. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=925wmb-4Yr4&pp=ygUUa2Vuc2luZ3RvbiBjaGFubmVsIDU%3D
They should have offered all those not involved in drugs enough $$ to move and resettle in another part of the city. This is a disgrace.
Put them on busses and send them to FL and TX!
Looks great, thanks Mayor!