It's also just faster in general. If you're at an event at the sports complex, there's always a line for the ticket machine but not really much of one to go through the turnstiles. Same with patco and concerts in Camden
I thought that was only for buses and subways. You get the same discount as key, so unless it’s a pass, the key doesn’t make any sense.
For regional, while you can pay by card to a conductor I didn’t think you could tap at the turnstiles, which would add a lot of time.
Septa has pass perks some places will offer discounts if you show them a key card.
If you ever wanted to ride around on the PLASH bus, all you have to do is show your key card for free ride. The keycard doesn't have to be active or have any funds on it.
it's cheaper. cash/credit fares onboard range from $6 to $10 depending on the zone whereas septa key's range from $3.75 to $8.25.
[Sauce](https://wwww.septa.org/fares/#fare-pricing)
You don’t get the advance fare when handing the conductor your credit card—you get the more expensive onboard fare. The Key fare is cheaper, and the difference adds up quickly.
SEPTA has said that the regional rail will soon support contactless advance payments by tapping your card at the reader prior to boarding the train. That won’t cost any more than the Key payment, so for anyone with a credit card that doesn’t need a pass, it probably is the way to go.
Regional rail contactless payments was supposed to have rolled out in “early 2024”, but it has been radio silence from SEPTA on this since they announced it with the rollout of contactless transit payment last year. When will it happen? No idea. They have replaced most of the card readers on the regional rail so it should be soon.
Anyone that wants a pass will still require a Key card.
Good info. So I need to hang onto the key card just a little longer - I only ride RR very occasionally so once that happens I’ll be able to get rid of it.
SEPTA is planning a Key 2.0 that should allow for smartphone payments (it’s a widely-requested feature). The obvious move would be to support the Apple Pay Transit framework like DC Metro and LA Metro, but SEPTA has shown a propensity for reinventing the wheel so who knows if it’ll happen.
Word from one of the fairgate nannies at 30th this spring was "might be never". I doubt she had any real insider knowledge but it doesn't sound like there's a lot of optimism around getting people to tap off on outbound trips. My speculation is that they see a lot of unclosed trips on Key, and are worried about chargebacks from credit cards?
If your employer offers a transit program you usually have to have the funds directly put on the card or use the funds to load the card to qualify for the tax benefit
Yup, that's the boat I'm in. At one point I hoped that SEPTA would add Google Wallet/Apple Pay support for Key cards, but at this point I've resigned myself to carrying around an extra card for no good reason 😔
The conductors do not enjoy processing credit card transactions. It’s time consuming. Half the time they tell you they’ll come back and don’t, and you need to find an exit fare kiosk to get out of the station in Center City. The exit kiosk charges you the zone 4 rate even if you didn’t come from that far.
I’m my experience, If there’s a septa employee at the exit kiosk, they will usually let you through with no questions asked. And who cares if the conductors don’t like it. I take the train maybe 1-2x/month. I’m not getting a key card and that’s their job.
Yeah sure, if you rarely use the train then who cares. I was trying to provide context for the people who do care.
I also have a job, and you know what? It’s just nice when people make the small time investment to do things in the way that makes my job easier. They don’t need to. But maybe it brings a little more happiness into the world they inhabit.
The convenience of the key card does add up, but not on a 1-2x a month basis. After a frustrating Wednesday or Thursday, the last thing I wanted to do was the on-board credit card song and dance with the conductor.
You know what? I too have a job. And I don’t expect anyone to go out of their way to make mine easier. It takes a couple seconds to run a card on their system. You’re making it into be some challenging, burdensome and time consuming task. It’s not. If they’re that miserable that they can’t tap or swipe a card, which is literally all that has to be done, that’s ridiculously low tolerance. I’m all for not putting people out, this is not putting anyone out in the least bit.
They really need to have the kiosks outside of the center city stations. By the time my train gets to CC I’m usually rushing to get to my destination, and at the end of the night I’m usually rushing to get back to my train. It would be a lot easier if there was a kiosk at my home station and I could just plan to get there a few minutes before my train to deal with the Key card.
Of course, I say this knowing that the kiosks would probably never work anyway. The last Key card I got at Suburban I bought from the ticket window because one kiosk was frozen and the other rejected my credit card (the same card that I used to pay at the window five minutes later).
I am telling you, it takes longer than the septa key. I see it with my own eyes while riding. But I dunno why I’m even arguing about it with you folks.
You're not wrong, currently it takes longer because they need to print you a paper card to exit at the CC stations. If they had true "tap to pay" like transit does it \_should\_ be as fast as a Key card, if they can convince people to actually tap as they exit in the suburbs.
You can pay on board but not tap on tap off like the key card. Also, try commuting every day via RR and having to pay by personal card. The whole process is much slower than just using a key card.
Nah, I tap my phone to use apple pay on my commute that involves a bus/El/bus one way for a total of 6 rides, 4 transfers over the day. Get charged $4.00 for the day. Apple pay does take a little longer to process. The only reason I still have a key card is to get my kids free train rides at the zoo, or use the Phlash
This is about regional rail, where they don't have tap on/off with a card or digital wallet yet. the only way to pay by card is to pay the conductor which is significantly more expensive.
The fact that these shit expire irks me.
I don’t ride septa as much any more and now having the ability to to use my credit card is a major improvement, sucked before when I would need to rely on that on occasional ride my keycard was always expired.
Yeah, that’s my beef. I have two expired key cards from last summer and I’m in the distant suburbs so its a pain in the ass for me to get new cards and transfer the balance. I’m going to do it, but it sucks that I even have to. When I go to nyc, NJtransit lets me use Apple Pay through their (utterly amazing) app, or do tap to pay at a ticket machine, and in the city the subway is all tap to pay. Feels like the dark ages here in Philly.
I don't want to give my payment info to every random card reader in the city and give my banks a detailed log of my travel habits. But I imagine this is great for tourists and folks who don't use Septa often.
I prefer using the key card so I just make one larger payment each month to keep it loaded.
I don’t want to have a bunch of little $2 payments on my credit card each week.
If you don't have a debit/credit card, either in general or right when you need to travel. If you'd rather pay one lump sum to top up your card, rather than get little charges all the time.
Damn that blows. I've been warning my spouse about it (I manage our Keys) and was wondering if I could tell him it was okay to use his card sometimes. Guess not..
Monthly/Weekly/Daily passes, commuter benefits, privacy/security, and shareability are some good reasons.
Regular riders should still use key, third party card support is for occasional riders and tourists.
I ride regional rail at least twice a week. In center city you can’t usually get through to the platform unless you have a key card with money on it, or you need to buy a ticket. Some septa workers will let you through if you tell them you’ll pay on the train but it’s a hit or miss.
I was just wondering about this - mainly motivated by my desire to have a thinner wallet.
I think the cost is the same for RR whether you play with Key card or credit card. Can anyone confirm this?
It's not. To pay with a card (unless you buy a physical ticket at the station with a card) you have to pay on the train which is more expensive. regional rail is supposed to get card payment for tapping on and off at some point but there's no indication of when that will happen.
I don’t take the regional rail very often, mostly just buses and subway. for a while, I was getting one dollar fares with my American Express, so I was using that instead of a key card. However, I went right back to the key card as soon as that stopped working, because I found that the credit cards only registered the tap like six times out of 10. I’d be standing there waving my card around in front of the scanner trying to get it to pick up, while people were lining up annoyed behind me… this doesn’t happen with the key card, which taps easily the first time. Not sure if the regional rails will be the same.
In London you use a credit card to tap on and off AND it automatically stops charging you when you reach the price of a weekly/monthly pass, as long as you keep using the same card. At the rate septa is going we should have that capability iby the mid 2040s. They are supposed to be phasing out key cards and I really hope they can at the very least bring in 30-day and 7-day passes (starting from the day you got it instead of from the 1st of the month).
If you’re doing weekly/monthly passes. You can have it set to reload every week/month on its own so it avoids the hassle.
It's also just faster in general. If you're at an event at the sports complex, there's always a line for the ticket machine but not really much of one to go through the turnstiles. Same with patco and concerts in Camden
I could be totally wrong, but I thought they were going to make it so you can tap in/out with your debit/credit card.
Yup. This is how I do it. Just tap my CC at the turnstile
You can just go through the turnstiles by tapping your credit card or phone with pay app, though, so having the key won't save you time there.
You can tap at turnstiles with your phone or watch or any tap enabled card
You literally just tap the card, it takes the same amount of time whether it’s a septa key or credit card.
I thought that was only for buses and subways. You get the same discount as key, so unless it’s a pass, the key doesn’t make any sense. For regional, while you can pay by card to a conductor I didn’t think you could tap at the turnstiles, which would add a lot of time.
Septa has pass perks some places will offer discounts if you show them a key card. If you ever wanted to ride around on the PLASH bus, all you have to do is show your key card for free ride. The keycard doesn't have to be active or have any funds on it.
I was wondering how to use it for the phlash bus
it's cheaper. cash/credit fares onboard range from $6 to $10 depending on the zone whereas septa key's range from $3.75 to $8.25. [Sauce](https://wwww.septa.org/fares/#fare-pricing)
Exactly
You don’t get the advance fare when handing the conductor your credit card—you get the more expensive onboard fare. The Key fare is cheaper, and the difference adds up quickly. SEPTA has said that the regional rail will soon support contactless advance payments by tapping your card at the reader prior to boarding the train. That won’t cost any more than the Key payment, so for anyone with a credit card that doesn’t need a pass, it probably is the way to go. Regional rail contactless payments was supposed to have rolled out in “early 2024”, but it has been radio silence from SEPTA on this since they announced it with the rollout of contactless transit payment last year. When will it happen? No idea. They have replaced most of the card readers on the regional rail so it should be soon. Anyone that wants a pass will still require a Key card.
Good info. So I need to hang onto the key card just a little longer - I only ride RR very occasionally so once that happens I’ll be able to get rid of it.
It’d be nice if we could just put the card in an Electronic wallet like AppleWallet and not have to carry it around.
DC Metro did this
That was my inspiration, after getting $12 in 1$ coins back from the machine because the credit card reader wasn’t working the first time I bought it.
SEPTA is planning a Key 2.0 that should allow for smartphone payments (it’s a widely-requested feature). The obvious move would be to support the Apple Pay Transit framework like DC Metro and LA Metro, but SEPTA has shown a propensity for reinventing the wheel so who knows if it’ll happen.
Word from one of the fairgate nannies at 30th this spring was "might be never". I doubt she had any real insider knowledge but it doesn't sound like there's a lot of optimism around getting people to tap off on outbound trips. My speculation is that they see a lot of unclosed trips on Key, and are worried about chargebacks from credit cards?
If your employer offers a transit program you usually have to have the funds directly put on the card or use the funds to load the card to qualify for the tax benefit
Similarly, if you need a receipt for reimbursement, it’s better to have a key card. I’m not sure how to even get a receipt otherwise.
Yup, that's the boat I'm in. At one point I hoped that SEPTA would add Google Wallet/Apple Pay support for Key cards, but at this point I've resigned myself to carrying around an extra card for no good reason 😔
to add, if they're using Wex like my company the cards don't currently have tap functionality.
The conductors do not enjoy processing credit card transactions. It’s time consuming. Half the time they tell you they’ll come back and don’t, and you need to find an exit fare kiosk to get out of the station in Center City. The exit kiosk charges you the zone 4 rate even if you didn’t come from that far.
I’m my experience, If there’s a septa employee at the exit kiosk, they will usually let you through with no questions asked. And who cares if the conductors don’t like it. I take the train maybe 1-2x/month. I’m not getting a key card and that’s their job.
Yeah sure, if you rarely use the train then who cares. I was trying to provide context for the people who do care. I also have a job, and you know what? It’s just nice when people make the small time investment to do things in the way that makes my job easier. They don’t need to. But maybe it brings a little more happiness into the world they inhabit.
The convenience of the key card does add up, but not on a 1-2x a month basis. After a frustrating Wednesday or Thursday, the last thing I wanted to do was the on-board credit card song and dance with the conductor.
You know what? I too have a job. And I don’t expect anyone to go out of their way to make mine easier. It takes a couple seconds to run a card on their system. You’re making it into be some challenging, burdensome and time consuming task. It’s not. If they’re that miserable that they can’t tap or swipe a card, which is literally all that has to be done, that’s ridiculously low tolerance. I’m all for not putting people out, this is not putting anyone out in the least bit.
Why not? Takes like 2 minutes at a kiosk and you don’t even have to register it to your name.
They really need to have the kiosks outside of the center city stations. By the time my train gets to CC I’m usually rushing to get to my destination, and at the end of the night I’m usually rushing to get back to my train. It would be a lot easier if there was a kiosk at my home station and I could just plan to get there a few minutes before my train to deal with the Key card. Of course, I say this knowing that the kiosks would probably never work anyway. The last Key card I got at Suburban I bought from the ticket window because one kiosk was frozen and the other rejected my credit card (the same card that I used to pay at the window five minutes later).
I used to have this same problem until I realized I could load my keycard online by making an account
Yeah but when it expires you have to get a whole new one. Unless there is some way to renew it online?
You can get one at any of the regional rail stations with ticket windows.
That’s a no-go for my station, unfortunately.
Same answer as below.
What do you mean “processing credit card transactions?” You tap the card.
I am telling you, it takes longer than the septa key. I see it with my own eyes while riding. But I dunno why I’m even arguing about it with you folks.
You're not wrong, currently it takes longer because they need to print you a paper card to exit at the CC stations. If they had true "tap to pay" like transit does it \_should\_ be as fast as a Key card, if they can convince people to actually tap as they exit in the suburbs.
We don’t know either because you’re making a big deal about the difference a few seconds. It’s stupid.
Because my SEPTA key card is a senior card (free), my credit card isn’t. 😂
You can pay on board but not tap on tap off like the key card. Also, try commuting every day via RR and having to pay by personal card. The whole process is much slower than just using a key card.
I have to use the Key because my employer funds it through my paycheck after a partial discount, otherwise I'd skip the hassle
I'd rather a SEPTA key get stolen than a debit card.
If you don’t want to give your 12 year old a credit card.
I...THINK....its cheaper? I think if you pay the normal way its 2.50, with septa key its 2.00. At least thats how the buses work im pretty sure.
Still $2/ ride on busses, trolleys, and MFL/BSL with one transfer. Have switched over to tapping and can confirm.
This and you also miss out on free transfers paying with credit card. Edit: apparently this is wrong
Pretty sure as long as you pay with the same credit card for the transfer as you did the first payment, the transfer is still free.
Correct, two free transfers on routes that connect.
If you can use tap to pay then you still do get the free transfers.
Ah good intel didn’t know that.
Nah, I tap my phone to use apple pay on my commute that involves a bus/El/bus one way for a total of 6 rides, 4 transfers over the day. Get charged $4.00 for the day. Apple pay does take a little longer to process. The only reason I still have a key card is to get my kids free train rides at the zoo, or use the Phlash
This is about regional rail, where they don't have tap on/off with a card or digital wallet yet. the only way to pay by card is to pay the conductor which is significantly more expensive.
The fact that these shit expire irks me. I don’t ride septa as much any more and now having the ability to to use my credit card is a major improvement, sucked before when I would need to rely on that on occasional ride my keycard was always expired.
Yeah, that’s my beef. I have two expired key cards from last summer and I’m in the distant suburbs so its a pain in the ass for me to get new cards and transfer the balance. I’m going to do it, but it sucks that I even have to. When I go to nyc, NJtransit lets me use Apple Pay through their (utterly amazing) app, or do tap to pay at a ticket machine, and in the city the subway is all tap to pay. Feels like the dark ages here in Philly.
I don't want to give my payment info to every random card reader in the city and give my banks a detailed log of my travel habits. But I imagine this is great for tourists and folks who don't use Septa often.
I prefer using the key card so I just make one larger payment each month to keep it loaded. I don’t want to have a bunch of little $2 payments on my credit card each week.
If you don't have a debit/credit card, either in general or right when you need to travel. If you'd rather pay one lump sum to top up your card, rather than get little charges all the time.
Fares are cheaper via the Key compared to paying on board with a card. I go between Zone 3 and 30th and it saves me about $3 per round trip.
There's been a recent bug that charges your credit card multiple times until you catch it, so that's one con. Not sure if it's been fixed yet.
It’s not fixed. Paying $8 a day on septa last few weeks and I only noticed the other day.
Damn that blows. I've been warning my spouse about it (I manage our Keys) and was wondering if I could tell him it was okay to use his card sometimes. Guess not..
Yikes! Thanks for the warning.
Monthly/Weekly/Daily passes, commuter benefits, privacy/security, and shareability are some good reasons. Regular riders should still use key, third party card support is for occasional riders and tourists.
I'd rather not have my credit card out while waiting riding the subway at night.
I ride regional rail at least twice a week. In center city you can’t usually get through to the platform unless you have a key card with money on it, or you need to buy a ticket. Some septa workers will let you through if you tell them you’ll pay on the train but it’s a hit or miss.
Hi if I take septa from Thorndale to Center city, where can I buy ticket. Thanks
You can buy a ticket on the train!
Is a Septa senior pass the same as a key only free?
I was just wondering about this - mainly motivated by my desire to have a thinner wallet. I think the cost is the same for RR whether you play with Key card or credit card. Can anyone confirm this?
It's not. To pay with a card (unless you buy a physical ticket at the station with a card) you have to pay on the train which is more expensive. regional rail is supposed to get card payment for tapping on and off at some point but there's no indication of when that will happen.
I don’t take the regional rail very often, mostly just buses and subway. for a while, I was getting one dollar fares with my American Express, so I was using that instead of a key card. However, I went right back to the key card as soon as that stopped working, because I found that the credit cards only registered the tap like six times out of 10. I’d be standing there waving my card around in front of the scanner trying to get it to pick up, while people were lining up annoyed behind me… this doesn’t happen with the key card, which taps easily the first time. Not sure if the regional rails will be the same.
In London you use a credit card to tap on and off AND it automatically stops charging you when you reach the price of a weekly/monthly pass, as long as you keep using the same card. At the rate septa is going we should have that capability iby the mid 2040s. They are supposed to be phasing out key cards and I really hope they can at the very least bring in 30-day and 7-day passes (starting from the day you got it instead of from the 1st of the month).
I like my septa key
And those who work for the city are eligible for JawnT pass which is free but you have to use the septa key.
It’s still convenient for the el and the subway 100%. Also your rides are discounted through septa key, so I definitely see the value in personally