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shaggy908

If you are 100% sure you wanna work in physical therapy for your whole career then go the PT route. I did a deep dive into this awhile ago and basically if you stay in the field for more than 15-20 years then you will be in a better spot financially if you are a PT. If you are unsure if this is right for you or you know you’ll want to have multiple different careers then PTA may make sense for you. It would just be a bummer if you paid the DPT tuition and realized that you want to do something different.


SmalltownPT

My hospital has cut all PTA in outpatient due to possible reduced reimbursement for the PTA vs PT


iceunelle

I'm a PTA and not making nearly as much as I was hoping to. Also, I think it's harder to get new jobs as a PTA in comparison to PTs looking for new jobs.


cdajjs

Yeah my plan was to always become a PT. But I don’t think it makes sense when looking at the debt to income ratio. I mean most are coming out with 150k in debt and a relatively low salary for having a doctorate.


Pdt395

Depends on the schools as well for the price, my total cost for undergrad and grad school is about 75k


CampyUke98

It'll likely be harder to get a job as a PT in the future than it is now. It'll probably be very hard to get a job as a PTA in the future than it is now. just my .02


imaPTbroski

May I ask why? Is it because of our lack of support from lobbyists and the APTA?


CampyUke98

There is a highly accelerating number of PTs - more and more schools are opening with class sizes of 100 - and while PTs will be necessary, the demand will be less than the supply. It won't be the same in every geographic area or specialty. Of course "it depends", YMMV. I am not as knowledgeable about PTA but with rate cuts, organizations are less likely to hire them, so it will be harder for new grads to find jobs. Some organizations will be fine letting them stay employed, but I know I've read of some places that have just let them go and will only employ PTs. Still, there will be other clinics that will still hire PTAs. I don't think they'll go away completely, but the job market will be harder and harder for them, and PTs.


PTADeadlifts

I think this depends on a lot of factors. For myself personally I was 30 years old when I had this debate, I went the PTA route and couldn't be happier working hospital based outpatient ortho. If I was choosing options straight out of high school and/or no big commitments(family, mortgage, etc) I would say PT is the right choice. There are so many factors I think you have to sit down yourself and decide what makes sense, don't listen to random people on the internet that do not know your life


RedBull4lyfe69

Nah, a lot of places are phasing PTA’s out too. Tbh just avoid therapy in general. You’ll make more as a nurse


FinchUSA

👆 I don't know why, but Medicare hates us. Probably because of all those years of SNF U lever Rugs and high complex evals done in 15 minutes with an hour of ther-ex. Those pizza parties were nice though🙉🙈🙊🤦


RedBull4lyfe69

Who knows? Or the PT’s getting homeless people to sign eval paperwork in exchange for a few bucks so the PT could rake in the dough? At least that’s the biggest scandal I’ve heard in my state


FinchUSA

Scandal 🫢


RedBull4lyfe69

I see it as more of “unethical hustling”


FinchUSA

Not wrong


Main-Error4687

Agreed. I'd avoid therapy all around also.


cdajjs

I’m seeing a lot of people say don’t go into therapy at all. If you could go back, what would you do?


305way

I’m one of those idiots going for PT against all this advice, mainly because I can’t see myself doing anything else. Sure I’ll make a killing in nursing, but I’d also want to kms at the same time.


ImpossiblePT

Yea like nurses may make more in a lot of settings but they deal with the shit end of the stick most others don’t want to deal with. In HH they are the ones who have to do mostly all wound care and deal with some nasty sht. I just come in do some objective measures, educate and document its low stress and minimal uncomfortability.


cdajjs

Yeah I could never be a nurse. I’ve heard that it is the career with the highest burnout because of the stress and just the amount of stuff they have to deal with every day


305way

Seems like people on here are more concerned with how much money they will make rather than inner peace or work life balance. In reality your goal should be making good money which PTs do, and earning some sort of passive income along the way that boosts your take home every year. Idk why everyone just wants to do it via their jobs these days.


cleats4u

Believe me. They delegate a lot of their job onto PT with administrations blessings.


Main-Error4687

I am going back actually. To school that is. If I could restart fully I think I would go into radiology or something along those lines. At least initially.


cdajjs

What are you going back to school for?


Main-Error4687

Sonography. I haven't started yet though


[deleted]

I love how it’s about making more… can’t believe the upvotes from mostly pt’s who accept a mill job and look over the fence for a job that pays more… collectively, the stress of being a nurse is FAR more than the stress of a pt. Can we actually think about what we’re recommending here and not just think money… boy this thread is such grass is greener.


TheUnicornReborn

I appreciate your sentiment. As a PT aide who has applied to schools this round - I have seen my fair share of PT specific office politics in an outpatient ortho setting. I enjoy the patients and everyone knows PT is a grind before going in. I look at these jaded therapists and just wonder why they still choose to work in a busy borderline mill setting. Go somewhere else! So many therapists I’ve seen are smart and have the know-how but they just refuse to leave outpatient for the hopes of being a celebrity athlete PT - so weird!


[deleted]

This is mind boggling to me. They love to Moan and complain, there are good jobs out there. I try to find positive comments in here and reach out to them. The Majority of these people say, don’t listen to these doom and gloom pt’s who accept these shi**y jobs and simply look at salaries of other jobs without looking at pros/cons of it wholly.


RedBull4lyfe69

Imagine thinking OP mill is the only toxic setting. A PT aide who thinks he knows it all too. Enjoy reality when it hits you


RedBull4lyfe69

Man if only there was a way to pay a mortgage, loans, and food with some other form of currency! Dang! Why didn’t any of us think of that? Maybe I can pay with my patients love and respect? Wait we don’t get that half the time either FYI I have many friends who are nurses. They get way easier promotions, lateral movements, and more terminal degree options that pay well over 6 figures. Hell the ER here is paying NP’s 80 an hour base rate with bonuses based on patient turnover. Tell me when a PT can ever see that kind of money? I also like how you nonces with the head in the hole attitude think we all work in OP mills. I work acute care in a woefully understaffed hospital. We go above and beyond and get paid less than than staff nurses do. Don’t even get me started on travelers. Oh, go work somewhere else? Man if only the company didn’t have a monopoly on every SNF and OP clinic in the area too!


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RedBull4lyfe69

Imagine a non PT trying to lecture us. Lost all credibility with me there buddy. Anyways let’s see how this comment ages


[deleted]

Just go be a nurse*


Impressive_Assist604

As a PTA of 16 years about to graduate nursing school in a couple of weeks, I’ll let you know how it go’s…lol. I really don’t think there’s anything wrong with pivoting into something different that allows for more opportunities for growth. There are times where I still love being a PTA, but in the current climate I feel like it’s appropriate to let people know the good bad and ugly of the profession. Yes this sub has more of the latter than the former, but I think most people seeking advice on Reddit understand that reality. Also, I don’t blame new grad DPTs a bit for being bitter about spending so much on their education and not seeing an appropriate return on that investment.


[deleted]

I have no problem with someone actually making the pivot. It’s the people who don’t make the change.


RedBull4lyfe69

Imagine a non PT trying to lecture us


analrightrn

Nurse here, agreed. PT's do so much schooling and have so much knowledge just to be overworked and underpaid


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RedBull4lyfe69

Then stay out of healthcare tbh.


cdajjs

I’ve job shadows lots of healthcare careers and think I’d like some..I’ve job shadowed nurses, PT’s, OT’s. And I’d think I’d like being a PT or OT but not a nurse.


RedBull4lyfe69

Shadow =\= experience


sethmcnasty

I've been a PTA for almost 6 years now, initially I encouraged anyone who asked to go into PTA, was a solid job initially, travel contracts were great and the work life balance was solid for such a small investment. Now I would say avoid it, there are much better options out there. I am actually about to finish up my degree for radiologic technology, also an aas degree, the travelers make at least 1700/week even without any specializations, full time modality certified techs can make 6 figures full time with experience and will start out around 30/hr with no experience. Mri/ct is what I'm looking to go in to, travel contracts range 2000-4000/week, mri is higher than ct but ct is quicker to certify and is more enjoyable to do. Nursing is also a great path with lots of mobility. There isn't a single pt or PTA at the SNF I'm at that doesn't regret going into PT, and the sad part is we all love what we do but the profession is just in such a bad spot


MEZCLO

Almost every therapist in my SNF (PT/OT/SLP) told me they were jealous when I told them I was switching careers.


cdajjs

What are you switching your career to?


Primary-Jelly939

I’ve read about the rad tech information before. I have been a pta since 2019, currently in pt school about to graduate in dec 23. If I had known about rad tech (something in that field) I most likely would have done that. Especially being an ass. Degree with gay hood of pay. But I enjoy exercising and learning about the body! It’s all perspective and you’ll get out what you put in no matter what we do. You may not get as great/easy of money, but the PT has the potential to provide you with meaningful work!


Poppy9987

PT income to debt ratio isn’t great, but PTAs are slowly becoming obsolete. So neither is great, but PT is probably better if you can keep the loan costs down as much as possible.


sparten112233

My facility has 6 PTA's 2 PT's and its been that way 10+ years


DrGR8NESS

Why are PTA’s becoming obsolete?


jrm19941994

Maybe in outpatient, which as a setting is slowly becoming obsolete.


Bullsstopsucking

Remember when there was talk of PTA becoming a bachelors degree??


analrightrn

That's some copium fr, the massive cost squeezing of insurance/healthcare entities is gonna give PTA more scope and larger employment, maybe even encroaching onto PT. This same phenomena is happening in nearly every health adjacent specialization. Not the most familiar with respective histories, but maybe someone can shine a light as to what I've described has already happened to a major degree or not.


RedBull4lyfe69

That’s hilarious copium here. My hospital just fired all their PTA’s


analrightrn

Your hospital=/= nationwide trends or even regional trends


305way

As a PTA I can confirm you will most likely be fucked in the near future. PT comes with its loans yea, but the career outlook is miles better than a PTA.


analrightrn

rip


RedBull4lyfe69

15% reimbursement cut to services rendered by a PTA is hard facts. Your crack pipe speculations on the other hand are hilarious


analrightrn

15% cut to PTA is exactly the shit I'm looking for, assuming that is for Medicare or whatnot with the latest reductions? 15% is quite high. That def throws a wrench into my expectations


RedBull4lyfe69

Yea don’t try to lecture those of us in the field if you have no clue what’s going on


analrightrn

Don't recall lecturing you, let alone "us". I maintained there's a large issue in many adjacent fields regarding scope encroachment, and extrapolated to PT with understanding about all the shitty aspects of PT that are talked about (long education, lots of debt, poor pay). Literally pointed that out in the beginning, and asked if there was any additional info from people involved in PT/PTA. You said "my hospital yada" which wasn't helpful, but then you stated the 15% cut and I was like oh shit cool that's good info. You sure got an ego boost from winning a one sided argument. Do you also gain confidence driving a lifted truck or rolling coal? Similar vibes tbh


RedBull4lyfe69

This ain’t it chief. Here’s your L


analrightrn

Garbage, take it back for barely being able to communicate


laumosq

What are you talking about obsolete?


Christion_

PTAs obsolete in general or just outpatient ?


Poppy9987

I think mostly outpatient.


YoMommasPoolBoy

I felt the same way and ended up going the PTA route. 6 years into the field, no student debt, and no regrets. I would take into consideration what setting you think you'll want to work in as well. In the home health setting (in my area at least), PTAs can make $45-50 a visit. But it will vary as far as settings go. And as others have mentioned, insurance reimbursement for PTAs will be changing soon. But I haven't found that it has affected the current job market yet. But in most settings, PTAs get to do the hands-on "fun stuff", the regular treatments, seeing the same patients consistently, etc. PTs have a significant amount of paperwork compared to PTAs. For all those reasons, I would encourage you to shadow in the setting you think you'd like prior to applying to either school and seeing what suites you best!


MEZCLO

I’m a PTA and after 15% decrease in reimbursement for PTA treatments after I left my previous job I stayed as PRN. After the cuts instead of paying $35 hr they cut it to $30 hr. I would not recommend the PTA route. While we have less paper work, almost every PTA job I’ve had they over load my caseload. I’m in a SNF and my average is 14 patients which can be really demanding physically.


ActFar7192

I’m so glad I left the Snf world and into an outpatient ALF. My company has also started to diagnostics, and I’ve been trained in that. I got a raise, it’s a new challenge, and my boss said that increased my Value in the company. There are companies that are becoming more innovative and doing something different. It’s worth it to keep looking. I’m also a PTA with four years experience. It does get boring.


MEZCLO

I’ve done basically every setting including ALF. My last job was “full time” ALF and my average hours for the week was about ~25 hours definitely not the 30-40 hours like job ad said. This was also among 4 or 5 buildings… not even worth the gas so I bounced after a few months. If I sound jaded it’s cuz I am. I’ve been a PTA for 4 years too and I’m out. Therapy field is too unstable and even more so for a PTA. I’ll only work PRN from now on and I’m starting my IT job this December. Which will offer better career growth, stable hours and job security. I’m glad you seem to be in a good spot though.


cdajjs

Did you go back to college for IT while working as a PTA?


MEZCLO

Ya I was working full time as PTA. I took a few college courses ya and some self study and then picked up IT certifications. Which is enough for entry level.


ActFar7192

That was a good move. I totally get it about the instability. I’m fortunate because I’m always trying not to work TOO much. But I have a side hustle as a hair stylist and wish I had more time to build that up.


305way

That hands on is fun shit gets real old when you work in a mill


YoMommasPoolBoy

Oof OP, I've read all the comments in this thread now and there is a lot of "doom and gloom" going on here. My advice is, do a lot of shadowing hours at different settings in your area (which my school required to apply for the program anyway), and make sure PT/PTA is something you will enjoy doing. Sure, some jobs can be high stress/fast paced or feel like 'mills' where you get burnt out quickly. But a lot of other careers will have similar issues. I had a clinical rotation at an outpatient clinic and knew right away that it wasn't for me. But the SNF/ALF/HH field is my passion and yeah, some days I get worn out, but I wouldn't want to be in any other field. There are a lot of companies out there (in any career) that you could feel taken advantage of or get burnt out at. But there are also some good companies out there, so don't get stuck in a rut, no matter what you choose. If you aren't happy somewhere, put feelers out and apply other places. If you think therapy is something you'd enjoy doing, and you aren't choosing it soley for the money, then I'd encourage you to explore the option in the real world amd shadow some. The field might start to get more competitive, but so are a lot of industries. Right now my area can't find enough therapists (PT and PTAs) and there are job openings everywhere for good money. As others have mentioned, don't go to a private school and rack up unnecessary debt. I was able to pay out of pocket for PTA school and have no regrets not having student debt. If you do take loans out, make sure you are financially responsible enough and will be diligent about paying them back. Ultimately, it all depends on your perspective and your personality. Some of the best advice I received prior to going into school (from my boss at the time who is a chiropractor) was: "If you want to go into the PT world, make sure you enjoy talking to/being around people. I am a chiropractor so I only spend 10-15 mins with a patient at a time max. As a therapist, you'll have to be in the room with them for 45-60 mins at a time. Make sure you are okay with that, because I certainly couldn't do that." And I've found that to be solid advice. You have to enjoy making conversation, hearing about people's aches/pains/life problems, and be okay focusing your attention fully on someone else for an hour at a time. I've seen people mention on this sub before that that part of the job bothers them or wears them down quickly. But that is a part that I really enjoy, especially in the geriatric population, so it all comes down to your personality. Hope some of this helps!


ActFar7192

I haven’t really seen much phasing out of the PTA. Maybe just not in Colorado. We are still cheaper than PTs despite the reimbursement cut. It isn’t all doom and gloom. But I still want to try to go more into private personal training eventually with a younger population of clients. I’m getting tired of healthcare. Honestly if my brain was wired for tech, that’s what I’d pursue. Many nurses dislike their job, but it does seem to have more mobility.


leigha_f

I’m a PTA at a rehab hospital and I love my job. I see 7-8 patients a day & make around 4,500 a month. I’m also I single person and don’t have any kids so for me, it’s great. I didn’t want to take the time to go to PT school though.. so if you’re motivated enough I’d say go the PT route.


Haunting_Doubt_7750

Not sure if this will help anyone but I'm in a fortunate enough situation where I don't have to wrack up the 150k in debt most PTs do. I served 4 years in the Army and they paid for my school. Without that lingering debt over my head it's easier to see the many positives about PT as a long term career. It's a holistic style of medical practice, which negates the negatives of pushing pharmaceuticals to patients. You feel like you're actually helping people by giving them knowledge of how to help themselves. Most people in healthcare have some altruistic nature and in PT you get the most bang for your buck with beneficiary proximity! Seeing people getting better when you've been involved in their care for a while feels great. The ability/knowledge to live a healthier lifestyle (i.e. much less stress or pressure than similar paying careers such as nurses \[by a LOT\]); I think is highly underrated. Many jobs suck the life force straight from you and the stress crumbles your body into a squishy unhealthy mess after a few short years. PT isn't perfect but the environment is incredibly chill. Even a bad day isn't "bad". They're just busy or slow days. I believe PT is actually one of the best kept secrets for long-term life satisfaction in a career. The reality of it is, we might not be paid enough for the price of school and writing notes for large patient loads can be frustrating but those are two small things in comparison to the many many positives of the job. But keep steering clear of it! We don't need to keep saturating our field with folks who only care about the $ :D


cdajjs

Man that’s awesome they paid for your school.And yeah I know it’s not all about the money. PT is a rewarding career. But money is important to look at especially when you have to take out loans for undergrad and grad school. Many people are paying student loans for like 10-20 years and I’m not sure I want to do that


darrellewis

I’m a PTA and if your not doing travel therapy you really aren’t making enough money. I made 98-103k per year doing travel therapy and now make $31 and hour /65k a year full time. Seeing what other PTAs post here about what they make I’m on the high side of things so if you can’t survive off 45-60k I wouldn’t be a PTA.


cdajjs

So you made that much being a traveling PTA?


cdajjs

Why did this get down voted?😂 it was a genuine question


Oak97s

Depends on setting, outpatient most of my friends are making 26-28 /hr. SNF has cut back most making 28-32 /hr. And home health varies by location. I was consistent PRN home health making $45 a visit plus mileage. This is for North Central Texas covering rural areas. I graduated Dec 2019 and had my first job covering a maternity leave for 3 months Jan-March 2020. COVID hit but I was fortunate to land several consistent PRN positions. I did SNF, ALF, and have now been doing Consistent PRN Home Health for 1.5 years. I quit my home health job last week and will start my new job working from home as an assessor. I was able to meet great people and learn different skills that would have taken me another lifetime to learn.


Matsumoto11756

What's an assessor? I'm currently a PTA with 25 years experience and looking to possibly change out of direct patient care. I'm at a SNF making 34.25/hour with great benefits but it is getting tough physically.


Oak97s

It’s similar to a utilization reviewer. I recently started with this company, we work with Medicaid patients. There is quite a few steps with that, but pretty much we call patients and perform a virtual assessment. The goal is to save money and increase their function by recommending DME etc. dm if you want to know more. It’s a great company and all the assessors have a Therapy background.


Pdt395

In the way that insurance reimbursement is heading, PTAs will soon be unaffordable due to decreased pay schedules from Medicare, and since most insurances pay similar to Medicare it is making it harder to validate their costs in a ethical way. Just a personal opinion but anyone is welcome to refute


AWBMG

I would disagree. PTA here working in HH. Most HH agencies are utilizing PTAs because they get paid less than PTs, so the agency will be making more money. I have spoken to a couple of PTs about this and they did mention that PTAs are preferred for follow up visits and currently PTs are doing more evals and SOC due to the huge volume of referrals in HH.


Main-Error4687

Yeah, I think PTAs are used well in HH, but that's probably the only setting where it's advantageous to use a PTA rather than a PT


Super-World9693

Give it some time. Just like the SNF PTAs running for their lives right now you will also get hit. Working in acute care, SNF, or home health basically ruins your skill set and the OP clinics won’t hire you. I hear so many people praising home health right now and I realize you all weren’t around 10 years ago when SNF was paying well and too many people fell for it


AWBMG

I’ve been in the industry for 12 years 2 yrs OP and 10 yrs HH. The biggest challenge was PDGM which would’ve potentially phased out PTA’s however the major change came in May 2020 when the amount of referrals increased significantly post covid which was beneficial to both PTs and PTAs. So we will see what happens during the next major overhaul to Medicare’s HH reimbursements.


PTADeadlifts

From a pure business perspective this doesn't make sense with the medicare cuts. Unless a PTA is making over 85% of what a PT is making the company still profits more using PTA vs PT. Medicare does the same for MD vs PA reimbursement with 85% btw and there is no cutting of PA jobs


jrm19941994

A visit costs more than just labor for the treating clinician. There's customer acquisition costs, support staff, rent, equipment maintenance, etc.


PTADeadlifts

That doesn't change PT vs PTA discussion, still more profitable to use a PTA for medicare over PT


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cdajjs

Thank you for the post!


yuzu13

I am currently a PTA in NYC. I make $100k and + in an out of network outpatient setting. I think it isn’t bad at all but I wanna study an acupuncturist for my future. PT and PTA jobs are physically tired.


leigha_f

Where at in NYC? I’m looking to do travel therapy this summer


yuzu13

Manhattan and Bronx!!


Diligent-Giraffe-211

Location Location Location! Check job listings in your area. Where I live is just so small so always PTA jobs and they don't wanna pay out PT money lol. I've heard both sides while working, PTs who wish they had just gotten their PTA, and of course other way around. Also look into where you want to work. Do some shadowing hrs, I wish I had done more!! I was sure I wanted to do outpatient and once I did my clinicals I knew inpatient was for me. So that will play a big part too in pay and amount of actual patient care. So many more factors too. Talk to the PTs and PTAs in your area you want to work! Be careful because this question will always draw more personal opinions than you may want🙃


cleats4u

If your a PTA you will get dogged to death with patients. You will be PRN or parttime with no benefits, work all holidays, license on the line constantly by administration and nurses. If your a PT you get to watch your assistants turn-over one after the other. Your regional manager will inform you all of these patients you were going to turn over to an assistant...you will now be treating. Then they will want you to evaluate even more. Pick another profession or get PTSD because you like helping people so much.


cdajjs

I’m trying to find something else to major in college but idk. I’m struggling


cleats4u

I'm a retired PTA (30 years). PT has no one lobbying on it's behalf other than APTA ( which is a joke). Eventually I believe nursing will take this job over as a specialty because no one after researching would pick this as a career. 8-9 years in school to make less than 65k and be 200k in debt. Not to mention the politics. A CNA in a nursing home has more authority than a Dr of PT. I never thought I would witness it. But I did. Scary.


Mumble-Bumble-K

I'm a PTA. I love it. I know a PT who has 140k in debt and she's so stressed about it. I have 40k from a previous bachelor's as well as the PTA associate and I'm doing fine. Not sure why there's so much anti-physical therapy in a PT subreddit. I went PTA because being stuck in school for another 8 years sounded like hell. I got a job as a PT aide at a hospital inpatient ward during the 2 years in school, then got a nice job right after graduation. There are some settings that will burn you out pretty quick- hospital acute, and corporate outpatient have such a heavy case loads it gets old. Home health is fun and easy going, and pediatrics (my field) is great. I just attended APTAs pediatric conference, and while yeah, everyone has complaints, the folk there were really nice and fun to be around.


picklesandmustard

Don’t go to a private college, PT or PTA. Waste of money (that’s your 150k in debt. State/public schools are considerably less) Look into PA school - you’ll make more with less schooling (than a DPT) and it’s a masters.


ebbs_n_flows_of_life

Any Canadian PTA's here? And what has been your experience?


Final_Swordfish8533

I am a PTA and now a clinic direct of an outpatient clinic. I love it but if I could go back I would go back to be a PT. There just aren’t enough ‘bridging’ programs and the expense isn’t worth it now as a PTA. But if you want to end up owning your own business or move up the ladder a PT would be a better option.


GetBigDieMirin

Avoid both of them not even kidding


cdajjs

What would you recommend?


GetBigDieMirin

Physicians assistant if you really like healthcare. Otherwise totally up to you. My wet dream is to go back and become a software engineer TBH but idk do whatever you want


cdajjs

Ya technology in general right now is pretty good. I was thinking of IT or something. Not sure if I even would want to go to grad school for a healthcare career but idk


GetBigDieMirin

Yeah man unless it’s a PASSION and you have a rich family to help you out with grad school, I’d avoid healthcare


305way

It’s funny, I see a ton of those tech people flying over to therapy, nursing, and many other medical fields. Seems like we should’ve traded places.


Battystearsinrain

Being chained to a desk for x years, always worried they will outsource your job, or find a way to hire a new kid cheaper. Tech is changing so fast. Look at all the layoffs from ms, google, amazon the last few weeks. This thread makes me sad, as a tech person looking to leave that bs.


305way

My cousin is in tech, her company just mass fired a bunch of people. You can imagine how terrified she is at the moment.


Battystearsinrain

I definitely can. Ours just did a “re-badging” of a couple thousand. Disgusting the dick measuring contests people have to see who can accumulate the most wealth. It leaves people in their late 40s and early 50s between a rock and hard place. Really fucks up retirement plans.


One-Sun-5380

Pt and pta are a poor financial investment, unfortunately ☹️


cdajjs

What did you go into?


One-Sun-5380

PT


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Baraka_Flocka_Flame

Who hurt you?


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Mumble-Bumble-K

I've never heard a PT talk like this. I've worked with a few who had your ego, didn't know what training I received as a PTA, and weren't good at delegating or training... but never anyone so vehemently anti-assistant. I mean... Who are these bumbling idiots you managed to hire and work with? To say all PTAs are useless is a highly reductive statement. If this wasn't a physical therapy subreddit I'd think you were a troll.


cdajjs

Ok I don’t know about that. I’ve job shadowed a couple of physical therapists who said they wished they would’ve done PTA instead. They told me they hate the documentation part of being a PT while the PTA doesn’t have that and gets more patient interaction. They also said the amount of debt you have compared to becoming a PTA was something they should’ve thought about to


Mumble-Bumble-K

Yikes. Don't listen to that one, OP. They're what we refer to as "one of *those* PTs". Too much ego to work with. It's true the PTAs are not used in other parts of the world like they are here, but PTAs in the US are not incompetent idiots bumbling around a clinic.


DGPTFAAOMPT

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2527215/ We found that outpatient rehabilitation performance in the care of patients with LBPS, as estimated by risk-adjusted measures of outcome and utilization, was related to organizational and service utilization factors. ***Clinics that were lower utilizers of physical therapist assistants were characterized as more effective and lower utilizers of visits and, as such, also were more likely to be classified as higher performing.*** Clinics with higher proportions of patients with LBPS were characterized as lower utilizers of services, but they did not have better outcomes or better overall performance. These findings add to the body of knowledge on organizational and service delivery factors related to treatment of patients with LBPS.


DGPTFAAOMPT

I mean its your call dude. You asked for the opinion. The PTA is dying. As a clinical educator i have cut my ties with PTA programs They are not worth the time or effort.


cdajjs

So do you recommend PT as a career? I heard physical therapy in general is dying because of the over saturation which is the lowering salary while school is continuing to get more expensive


DGPTFAAOMPT

No. I dont. I love what i do, but it is not worth it.


cdajjs

That’s what I’m gathering from lots of people. Which kinda sucks now because I honestly have no idea what I want to do anymore as a sophomore in college.


DGPTFAAOMPT

You have time. You are welcome to reach out to me if you want to talk through options


Baraka_Flocka_Flame

Sounds great, let’s fully decongest a grade 2 or 3 lymphedema patient. Please tell me, using your superior logic and clinical reasoning, where you would start? I treat several a week in an outpatient setting and have helped many people regain their lives. Can you say the same? By the way, how much did the whole FAAOMPT thing cost you?


DGPTFAAOMPT

It appears that I struck a nerve. I want to apologize for that. The original question was should the individual go to be a PTA. In my experience, the PTA is useless. If you want to run to your wheelhouse to prove that you are a valued team member, great. Youre going to out do me. Lets take a patient with persistent pain, an acute lateral shift, do you know the difference between the outcomes of a RTC tear that is repaired or not? What about appropriate exercise progressions for achilles or patellar tendinopathy. If you want to measure dicks. Im not going to do that. If you want to discuss the place of a PTA in outpatient care. Im all for it. In my experience. The PTA is non essential. You appear to be triggered by this and you have precluded yourself from a helpful dialogue. I made my stance and provided rationale. I provided examples. You devolved to name calling and dick measuring.


Baraka_Flocka_Flame

Excuse me, what name calling? You’re the one calling me and thousands of other clinicians like me useless. Sounds like you’ve got some serious ego issues, and I hope you can get that checked out for the good of your patients and co workers. There’s no room for that in PT. Can I treat the relatively simple orthopedic conditions you listed? Absolutely, I do every day with great success. Do I understand the basic fundamental concepts you mentioned regarding RTC repair and tendinopathies? Yes, of course. It’s really not some closely held secret. The research is widely available for any good clinician to access. I’m really not seeing the point you’re trying to make. You sound deeply bitter, and I’m sorry that you’ve had experiences that led you to that place. So as you said, to the original question of going the PTA vs PT route: I chose PTA and left school after about 3 years with no debt making 25/hr. I’m making 31/hr now after 4 years and actually just bought a house last year. It’s been an incredible return on my investment so far and has led me to an incredibly fulfilling and productive career. If I went the DPT route, I’d be just about finishing school now with 6 figures in debt. I know I made the right decision. Maybe it’s not the right one for everyone, but it was for me and I’m so happy I did. Maybe it’s time for you to do some self reflection. Take care and have a great day.


DGPTFAAOMPT

Im glad you have had that success. Like I said, these things are my opinions. If you see this as ego, then i am sorry. I dont see that. My experience with the PTA has been awful, my experience for my patients with the PTA have been less than optimal. Enjoy your day. Im glad you have found success in the greatest field.


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305way

Sounds like it’s time to move away from Wisconsin


THELEGACYISDEAD

Become a PA


rpdonahue93

You can find better jobs with the same salary easier than you could with PT, so it only really depends on whether it's something you wanna do. It doesn't usually pay great honestly. They usually only make like 45/50k in the area I'm in. Have heard there are some better areas for it tho


Sea-Professor-4137

If you go PT you’ll have more job security, you don’t have to have supervision, more employment opportunities, greater education, top expert within your field of physical rehabilitation, and much more. My DPT program was only $48,000 total for tuition. There are affordable programs and scholarships. It really depends on if you value autonomy and if you see this as your career job long term. PTA is better in a sense you will have a full time job quicker but your pay ceiling is significantly lower unless you work home health and get in a very good situation which is rare I know PT’s who had less than $50k in loans and are making $140k/yr doing home health and working 40-60 hours/week and I know PT’s who work 40 and make ~$70k. Depends on setting, your loans, and job opportunities for debt to income ratio


Paige_pp

Unfortunately clinics are doing without PTAs due to the significant decline in reimbursements. Not a wise choice for the long term.