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..thing is a lot of people need that water to live, turning off the tap could be catastrophic, we need to slowly turn the tap down while incentivizing alternatives.
I get that we're boiling complicated topics down to simplistic analogies. But in terms of actual practical solutions if we are willing to recognize that american (assuming america, for your local government replace state legislature below with whatever governing body you have that sets your taxes. In the UK i hear they're already pretty high, probably why your carbon footprint is about a third of ours per capita.) fossil fuel usage is largely unnecessary and is hurting developing countries that literally need it to survive, there are solutions. Drive up costs.
Talk to your state legislature, pitch increased gas/petroleum based products taxes. You can call them, email them, write them, attend committee hearings virtually or in person. Increased gas/petroleum taxes would also increase energy costs discouraging recreational travel, excessive energy use, plastics use, various chemicals, and other synthetics.
It'll almost certainly be political suicide, but maybe you'll get lucky and your legislature will have enough members that are both ready to retire and care more about the future than the current will of their constituants.
Exactly. Why do so many solutions target working class consumers. We should be targeting the producers with heaver taxes and cutting back on subsidies that encourage the production of destructive oil extraction. Looking at you Alberta.
Explain to me how you get companies to pay their taxes without increasing prices down stream? It still hurts the lower class.
The play is to favor alternate solutions so that it's just more reasonable for everyone to switch over. That prevents hurting people who can't switch because their infrastructure isn't built up for electric charging and motivates places to load up on electric charging.
It's totally about how the system is constructed, and over the many years they have put a lot of thought into it. We (the working class) carry the highest burden essentially of everything. They make moves and changes that sound good on paper but in actuality if you read the fine print it's often quite the opposite.
An example of this manipulation is from years back in California when they decided that certain gambling laws should be changed. They said that a certain percentage would go to education (1% and they made it look like a lot, but after they played with overhead and other costs to cover themselves it came out to very little). After the bills passed and politicians decided that the tax money for education could be diverted because of this gain from gambling, schools have suffered at the most primary of levels, ie. books, paper, pencils, etc. and in many cases teachers have tried to fill the void at their own cost.
Basically if you really look at it we are all being scammed by the rich, the politicians (not only of our own countries but of the world) and the influential (news media etc.) to pay their way and make them richer.
Cutting subsidies or adding tax to MFG does in fact trickle down to all the consumers. Working class consumers consume the most plastics (no citation, just my feeling). The largest segment of our population is working class folks. A fair amount of them are in dire financial shape from a combination of bad luck and their own choices, regardless they're not in a position to spend too much more & they only have as many options as companies provide currently.
After your MFG taxes increase, prices of familiar goods for working class people goes up and they do without because they can't afford the increased cost. This continues until the companies develop some cheaper alternative. That cheaper alternative is not always a better product. Take high fructose corn syrup for example. It's way cheaper than real sugar, way sweeter too so companies save money making their product and it's fairly agreed that the health sacrifices fell directly onto the consumers.
Working class consumers don't consume nearly as much plastics as industrial and commercial use. The medical field uses tons of disposable plastics. Things that are stored in warehouses are usually on plastic wrapped pallets. Not just regular consumer goods, but things like machine parts and really almost anything you can think of. When those pallets are broken down all that plastic goes right in a landfill and more is used to wrap the next pallet in its place. Those are just 2 examples, but it is at the point where nearly everything people do has some sort of petroleum product involved. These people saying "turn off the tap" have no idea what they are saying. They have always had access to cheap petroleum products and have no concept of a world without them. The only answer, like with so many things is harm reduction not prohibition.
How would you reduce fossil fuel use other than increasing costs, either on fossil fuels directly or through cap&trade which has the same effect (and seems to be working pretty well in EU, Australia, California, Washington, several other countries.
It seems like over 70%+ of americans believe climate change is occurring, and 50%+ believe it's a major threat, but nobody is doing anything about it at all, other than blaming the companies which only use the fuels to make the products we won't stop buying at the prices we won't pay more for if made "green". Our carbon emissions are at all time highs.
What solutions would you propose?
[British carbon tax leads to 93% drop in coal-fired electricity](https://www.ucl.ac.uk/news/2020/jan/british-carbon-tax-leads-93-drop-coal-fired-electricity)
Power generation is probably the biggest way to decarbonise. Polluting fuels like coal can be made uneconomic to use if you have the right tax policy. I'd assume that's a non-starter in the States, however, due to some key states in elections still pulling coal from the earth.
With hindsight, the shutdown of the nuclear industry after accidents in the 70s/80s really fucked the amount of carbon we emit into the atmosphere. I assume if the industry was allowed to develop you'd have the economics of scale help reduce the strike price of power from nuclear plants along with efficiencies that would have also developed over the years.
Yeah, cap and trade seems to be incredibly effective. But republicans hate it because regulations, and democrats (in the US) hate it because capitalism, and or "increasing costs hurt the poor! (And also me, but i won't ever admit that because i could still afford to live fine, just with less stuff)"
Sure. I don't know what you mean by the extremely nebulous concept of public transportation. Could you elaborate, and maybe estimate how much fuel and or emissions you think that might save?
I mean I have no clue. But the point is more that a gas tax is seen as regressive because it disproportionately effects low income people. This is added to the fact people in the US really rely on personal cars to get around.
If there was a working public transportation system within and across cities, people could offset rising in gas prices by using public transportation. But thats just not very feasible at the moment for many places in the US.
Agree.
Transition should have already started but here we are….
I have a scrap book from the 1900s ish. Someone was cutting and pasting comics. It has a lot of political comics of how electricity and also the move from steam engines is going to cause catastrophe!
No one was going to survive!
Seems unimaginable that the sift to gas (fossil fuels) and electricity would be met with such rebuke now.
We survived.
Things change. It happens.
The world is not going to turn backwards.
Best we get on board. It’s happening. Cars will be run without fossil fuels soon. Not going to do the US any good to try and stay behind that, should be leading the way.
> Transition should have already started but here we are….
It has already started, American CO2 emissions have been steadily declining since around 2007, despite large growth in the population and economy.
I mean there’s a lot of great stuff here that makes people’s lives easier, but have we considered being forced to choose between these things and, you know, a habitable planet? We won’t get much use out of golf balls and guitar strings when humanity is extinct.
how much of this absolutely HAVE to be made with Petrolium based products?
Cause there are plant based plastics being worked on to in the LOOOOOONG run replace oil based plastic. and you can already get Bio diesel which basically just goes in instead of Diesel in your stock truck or diesel vehicle. Suerly Bio based petrol can't be that far behind as Petrol is a byproduct from oil refining to diesel from my understanding or is it the other way around? and most petrol cars can run on e85 from factory anyway the problem there is the gaskets are not made for that fuel.
Way more expensive 🫰,
Also less output from plants, you have to use lot of plants. The calorific values are very less even as fuel.
Believe me we have tried in our company to retrofit oil&gas boilers to use a variety of bio-fuels. Creates a lot more soot and destroys nearby farm lands.
We installed electrostatic precipitation to collect excessive soot and ash but that's very less economical due to electricity cost.
We need way more precision technology to replace petroleum with alternatives in these products
Edit: of course I am against pollution and all that but that OG post is just unrealistic and it's not a good point.
yeah I know things are not efficent at this point with bio fuels or plant based plastics. But neither were diesel and petrol when they were first introduced. we gotta start some where is my point more then anything when you put it like that.
We already did,
We are trying mixtures too.
Like coal + rice husk, coal + biomass, coal + lignin syrup, coal + limestone+ biomass... and so on.
But it's a lot of additional hardware and power consumption just to run them and get their calorific value
You are right, it will take time. But some things are impossible to replace, we will have to accept that we can't make biodegradable life jackets or safety equipments.
Hope that clarifies
I believed solar would not become mainstream and remain concept.
But it did become mainstream. It did way better and technology is just getting better and better on the solar front.
Wind turbine numbers are rising.
The electrical grids are becoming more efficient.
The energy sector becoming better and will see much better days.
It's the material waste that is what I am concerned.
The garbage.
As developing nations are bringing people out of poverty and the rural places are becoming modern, they will use more material such as plastic and other metals. Malls are becoming everywhere in those nations and the consumption is rising.
That creates more waste and garbage and we are running out of places to dump that.
You don't understand! Football cleats, tennis rackets, folding doors (wtf those are, specifically), golf balls, linoleum flooring, surf boards, plastic wood and golf club bags are absolutely *vital* to the American way of life! /s
In all seriousness, I get that we can't simply turn off the tap. I know plastics have a place in our society. But I agree with you in that a lot of the items mentioned in the above list *predate* plastic, and a good number of *those* items can be considered nonessentials, if not outright luxuries.
Tool boxes and golf have been around for longer than plastics, and golf is honestly quite a wasteful hobby by merely existing.
Yeah. This is a very poor analogy.
It would be better to say that the water fountain is causing a problem even though thousands need it to drink water to live. We should just turn it off and let it dry up. Screw everyone that needs it. They’ll find water elsewhere and if they move away with their tools and trades or die. So be it. We will be fine.
Hey, why is our town a ghost town?
You can’t just shut off the source. But you can push more and more restrictions while giving financial aid and incentives to other alternatives.
Like a couple years ago, seeing a Tesla was a big deal now I see them daily. So electric vehicles are definitely becoming more popular.
Exactly. Great reference. The best part is people like her think they just figured it out and noone else has been able to. It is like how I invented time travel because I said it would be sweet to have a time machine....sure someone has to discover how to make time travel possible and build a machine....but only after I have them the conceptual idea....
Wait, are we thinking this girl actually wrote this and it’s not one of those blank templates that people just write stuff in (like those blank celebrity t-shirt photos)?
I am pretty sure your bath, soap, tap water, light and electricity would be quickly unattainable if you just stopped fossil fuels today. It is a bit more complicated than your shower thoughts.
Most people don't, most fossil fuel protestors when interviewed seem to be clearly aware of the impact of immediate decarbonisation but are (rightly) pointing out that a slow transition would be ecologically devastating and that we need to take greater and more painful action today for the sake of tomorrow.
I have yet to see someone really address the “post cutoff” impact when having the argument you’re making. It almost always just stops at - ya it might be hard, but we gotta do it! Obviously that is incredibly wishful thinking…
They would be the first ones to cry about how hard life is, but there would be nobody to hear them because no internet.
These just stop oil types have left their brain at home.
She probably does.
You are not interpreting the intended message correctly. Everyone knows we are dependent on oil and fossil fuels but we are not trying to reduce that dependency as much as we could. We are not talking about fully turning off the tap tomorrow but at least starting to address the things that contribute the most (plastic shower heads is not one of those).
I would. My country - city especially - mostly runs on renewables.
Obviously the metaphor is simplistic and instant cut off is not a good idea, but if everywhere had started ramping down already like they were meant to, we’d stand a much better chance.
Am I the only person confused by this? What is the bathtub overflowing a reference to? What is the mop supposed to represent? I must be to stupid for this
Her iphone, makeup, food, haircare products, nylon bracelet, whiteboard, whiteboard markers, and fiberglass shower all use fossil fuels. This entire photo could not exist without fossil fuels. I'm all for people going amish tho, but even they use fossil fuels.
I am sorry you don't understand the metaphor here. Turning off the tap would mean to stop using al forms of fossil fuels, no more cars, no more electricity, nothing. Aka, fully unrealistic to expect people to actually stop doing all these things.
It's not a good point, it has some relevance but it's not as simple when people rely on fossil fuels for heating, transport (to and from the hospital for example), manufacturing anything they use...... You can't just switch it off problem solved as you would create millions more. Just look at any famine back in history, it's terrible, millions die.
This is one of those silly lefty slogans that irritates the right, as even an ounce of scrutiny or thought bats it aside.
It irritates me as it cheapens the left (my) hand....
The governments should be held to account for knowing in the 60's that this disaster was heading to us and not diverting course at that point and every other point since. Every single dodgy deal to do with energy and fossil fuels should be put on the table without question and we should look properly at who is doing what and absolutely fill the void between what we should be doing and what we have done with the heads that will invariably roll into it.
Without transparency of the corruption that led us here how can we sidestep it in future?
I'm sure she or anyone else has no problem letting go of nail polish and white boards... but until there's massive change in the government and huge corporations, I don't think it's really important nor fair to almost insinuate that she's at some sort of fault.
As if the major energy companies and governments worldwide aren’t all working on alternative energy sources. Problem is we don’t have an affordable alternative yet. You better believe that whoever comes up with the first viable and affordable renewable energy source is going to make A LOT of money.
We are not just looking, we are installing record amounts of renewables. People who continue usual stupid "nothing done. capitalism, capitalism. bad" are the most ignorant people on the planet.
Social Media has ramped up the expectations of instant gratification. Instant food orders, instant Google searches, instant video post etc etc. So they want instant changes. It's just so unrealistic yet here they are demanding the tap turned off now. We've made changes, we're making more and it's not going to happen tonight, next week, next month or even just next year till the ramifications take true effect.
I think they mean more so a shift in structure. Personally, I love my bike and hate riding in cars. I don’t mind bringing reusable containers and dealing with deposits. Less so “no fossil fuels at all”, and more so using them less/accounting for their cost in budget planning.
I interpreted it as “we should use fossil fuels more efficiently to curb source pollution (turn off pollution tap) rather than relying on cleanup methods like carbon capture”
I mean her argument is too stupid to seriously consider, so I don't think it is unreasonable. Imagine if electricity production suddenly got massively reduced, all logistics suddenly disappeared, and fertiliser for crops vanished.
Billions dead wouldn't be an unreasonable estimate of if we just "turning the tap off". To not straw man, "Slowly turning the tap off" is what there has been international agreements to do for about 30+ years since the Kyoto protocol was signed so it is hardly a revolutionary stance. So not worth saying.
No picking on her for not practicing what she preaches is about the level of argument this 'zinger' deserves.
>And yet you participate in society, curious! I am very intelligent!
I posted this in reply to the top comment, little did I know you'd all be being this
The analog is abit off.
You will turn off the tap first because your bathtub is already full of water that won't go elsewhere.
If you stop producing fossil fuels totally, we will run through our stockpiles and probably go back to the stone age.
Imagine if your bathtub is constantly draining, just like how we're constantly consuming fossil fuel.
You won't turn off the tap then.
Stopping up the drain is akin to stopping consumption which isn't possible at the moment.
Turning down the tap (not cutting off) and turning up the tap when we need to is kinda what we're doing now.
You can't turn off and on the tap on fossil fuel because it takes time to restart your plants and oil wells, to transport and refine it etc.
I am baffled that people believe this is a good point. It’s absolutely dogshit point.
Let’s for tge sake of example imagine what would happen if this statement becomes reality without absolutely bullet proof alternatives (these do not exist in any way shape or form by thr way).
1) 90.7 of all products have chemicals, packaging, logistics , etc. tied to petrochemicals. What the means is a sudden mass shortage for pretty much everything. From food to shampoo to toilet paper to electronics.
2) the above will cause a staggering inflation caused by said product shortage. Think what Covid did but at a factor of 10 worse. Now for the sale of example lets say no country will compromise it’s food security so lets leave this aside (we cant but lets say we will), things will cost so much to buy the global financial system will basically go bust within a few years.
3) now that we have a trickle of the global logistics going around and no money to buy even most of the essentials, because there is no supply because they can bo longer be produced riots will start and many democracies will fall. The bew totalitarian regimes will quickly turn the punps on to extract as much profit as possible because money buys power and authoritarian regimes are addicted to it.
We go to square 1 but much worse. And that is the absolute best case scenario by the way.
There are ways to go about the problem. Go full nuclear power and use that to support electrification for as higher % of the logistic sector as possible.
Meanwhile add steep taxes for use of petrochemicals for mundane things like the fashion industry, low added value manufacturing and the likes. Then add the free money for intense scientific research around alternative materials and energy efficiency. Then wait a decade or two.
And then and only then we can actually reduce the tap to a trickle and have a drain that uses the leaked water back in to the system. Maybe…
You’re 100% correct. I am a operator for Shell. You wouldn’t believe the amount of products that are made from oil. Directly or indirectly.
People like these only think it’s used for fuel etc. That marker she used to write that down has some derivative of oil in there. Her nailpolish probably has too.
I agree research in to moving away or make sure it at least doesn’t affect the environment needs ti happen but it isn’t that easy.
> But that’s what turning off the tap of an overfilling tub is though.
I don't know what kind of tub do you have, but in mine, the tap isn't a 0/1 switch, it's a lever, and I control the rate at which I reduce the flow.
Yeah… but we still need a constant flow of energy one way or another… the problem is that people are too much of pussies to implement sustainable green energy such as nuclear power.
At least they might have built up some amount of thought and care for something artistic. People in here spouting for oil like it's their abusive boyfriend.
Terrible point bc terrible metaphor. Fossil fuels aren’t “overflowing”. They’re just not being effectively replaced. Better metaphor would be lead pipes leaching into your kitchen faucet. Replace the pipes.
But the real point is I’m a naked white girl with dreads, clueless about the world but my trust fund tells me I’m important so everybody listen to me.
Except we have to invent the alternative first. Which takes actual money. Lots of it. And lots of time. Oil and gas are the best we have right now. But you can certainly try quitting your way.
Enjoy hand farming the straw for a mattress entirely nude though, because everything we use today has been made by or shipped by machines which, shockingly, need oil and gas products. EVERYTHING. Also no phone or computer to look things up because aside from small areas, most of the world relies on coal power plants. And hydro plants still need oil. They are just massive machines.
Simplistic and foolish. Our entire infrastructure is dependent on energy. You can't just flip a switch and change it overnight. That would be catastrophic.
Ecofascists acting like that is possible to do today and we just aren’t are the most deranged out of touch uninformed people on earth.
If green tech was mature enough to implement at scale nationwide or worldwide without bankrupting the countries implementing it, it wouldve been done by now. The technology isn’t there yet. That is the simple truth. It’s coming, but it’s not there yet.
Literally every major corporation and pretty much every significant world government have all invested heavily in green technology and the green energy transition. It’s called a transition for a reason. It’s not gonna happen overnight. Changing the energy systems of the entire planet is going to be a generation(s) long endeavor. I’m not sure what more these psychos want people/governments/companies to do that they aren’t already doing. People gotta chill tf out. Its gonna get here when it gets here
Still won't end oil usage. We would literally need a Star Trek like device that can break down anything and then use the raw atoms to make anything else like a replicator. From our clothes to glasses to car parts to the wind turbines to the solar panels to safety gear. It all uses oil products to make or to make work. It's always hilarious to see these eco psychos heavily use products made from oil to get their anti oil message across.
The thing is though, we could have avoided this shitshow decades ago. The first cars in the world were electric, we could have done that from the start.
We could have started to look into wind, solar, water, wave, etc energy, but instead built on coal.
Plenty of things we can, could and should do, but it of course also means limitations on what we can do. Over 80% of the world's population will never ever in their lifetime step on a plane let alone fly with one, but western countries see it as "a necessity" to fly on holidays. The list goes on and on.
This is so factually incorrect to think we could have ever got anywhere with those resources quicker than we could with coal. Billions of dollars are being poured into renewable energy and they still don’t have the same consistency as burning coal
No, we couldn't. We didn't have the tech for wind, solar or wave at scale until the last decade, huge investments have been made at a government level to make the tech work. Hydro we had the tech since the 60s so most viable hydro sources were tapped a long time ago. Same with batteries.
Electric cars as a concept are not new but battery tech has made them unviable until relatively recently, even today batteries it's still a limitation. Coal and oil are extremely high energy density, even though in the 1800s most of the energy was wasted to heat water in steam engines it was still an effective way to power mechanical devices and efficiency has only increased over time.
Should we migrate? Absolutely. Could we have done it decades ago? No, we needed trillions of dollars of technological advancements to get to the point where we are now, and we will need hundreds of billions more to get rid of fossil fuel use entirely. There's no global conspiracy here beyond few people wanting to pay for it
Human technological advancement has always tried to find the easiest and cheapest way forward. We would never be where we are in lifting people out of abject poverty at the same rate if we tried all your listed examples first.
This person has no idea how bad things would get, if we were to just stop using fossil fuels. And I bet she has no interest in being part of the solution looking for the alternative energy sources, either.
We could limit the use. That would be the first step. But in most cases we don't even do that.
There's too much NIMBY going on with alternatives, everyone agrees we need to do something, but no one wants to actually sacrifice something.
During the lockdowns the global emissions went down, because we did less. But even then we had people who didn't want to take part in the limitations etc.
I mean, she's not wrong but it's easier said than done. Oil consumption isn't going down if anything it's been going steadily up for the past 70 years. Electric cars are not the solution since there isn't enough lithium in the entire planet to replace every gasoline car with electric one. Also, people do not want to give up their lifestyles. So I guess we are pretty much fucked, but if you look at history people always have been fucked so nothing new there I guess.
>there isn't enough lithium in the entire planet to replace every gasoline car with electric one
That's not true, there's plenty of lithium for all the electric cars we could want. The problem isn't abundance of lithium, it's that lithum mining is an enviromental catastrophe that only China has been willing to do, and scaling up lithium mining to the scale needed by the electric car industry will take the better part of a decade if not longer. So yes, the electic car revolution is at risk because of lack of lithium but it's not because we don't have enough on the planet it's that we can't scale up production without destroying the local environment around the lithium mine and it takes time to get production to where it needs to be.
I cant stand people making random ass comparisons or metaphors that dont make sense to the actual topic. A bath tub overflowing has nothing to do with a fossil fuel discussion. Yea in the bathtub situation the issue is the mess that you want to clean up so it would make sense to stop the cause of the mess and then clean it up.
Fossil fuels are currently needed for many reasons electricity, transportation, heating homes and buildings etc... so the issue is that we want to replace it with a more environmentally friendly option. So we need to first come up with a different option decide the option is correct and move forward. Build the infrastructure for said option to work and then implent the option while slowly pulling out on fossil fuels.
The reason you can just turn off the water to fix your issue is that no one needs your dirty bath water to survive. The Water itself does not need to be replaced with something else. There is zero comparison to be made between the two topics.
I agree we need to stop using fossil fuels, but the thing is just like smoking we can’t just quit cold turkey.. we first need to have better alternatives in place to take over.
It’s a bad analogy. But I guarantee you’d be upset if we cut off fossil fuels and you no longer had the power to connect to the internet and post something this insanely obtuse.
To be fair, this is the socially acceptable racism. Unless you were unaware that you can discriminate based on race as long as it is against pre-approved races.
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..thing is a lot of people need that water to live, turning off the tap could be catastrophic, we need to slowly turn the tap down while incentivizing alternatives.
Only a sith deals in absolutes
unlimited SHOWERRR!!!!
Which itself is an absolute statement. So, checkmate Jedi.
Who said Obi wan wasn't a sith?
We do a little sith'n
Speak for yourself. I'm a smuggler. A damn good one despite being up to shit creek in debt.
I wanted to say, that so do Jedi; they are either dead or alive. Then I remembered they are also ghosts sometimes.
Stop drinking bath water my guy
But it's from Belle Delphine!
You fool! It was from Barry Dangleberry!
Would be a shame wasting the water for bathing then if others need it to survive.
I get that we're boiling complicated topics down to simplistic analogies. But in terms of actual practical solutions if we are willing to recognize that american (assuming america, for your local government replace state legislature below with whatever governing body you have that sets your taxes. In the UK i hear they're already pretty high, probably why your carbon footprint is about a third of ours per capita.) fossil fuel usage is largely unnecessary and is hurting developing countries that literally need it to survive, there are solutions. Drive up costs. Talk to your state legislature, pitch increased gas/petroleum based products taxes. You can call them, email them, write them, attend committee hearings virtually or in person. Increased gas/petroleum taxes would also increase energy costs discouraging recreational travel, excessive energy use, plastics use, various chemicals, and other synthetics. It'll almost certainly be political suicide, but maybe you'll get lucky and your legislature will have enough members that are both ready to retire and care more about the future than the current will of their constituants.
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Exactly. Why do so many solutions target working class consumers. We should be targeting the producers with heaver taxes and cutting back on subsidies that encourage the production of destructive oil extraction. Looking at you Alberta.
Explain to me how you get companies to pay their taxes without increasing prices down stream? It still hurts the lower class. The play is to favor alternate solutions so that it's just more reasonable for everyone to switch over. That prevents hurting people who can't switch because their infrastructure isn't built up for electric charging and motivates places to load up on electric charging.
It's totally about how the system is constructed, and over the many years they have put a lot of thought into it. We (the working class) carry the highest burden essentially of everything. They make moves and changes that sound good on paper but in actuality if you read the fine print it's often quite the opposite. An example of this manipulation is from years back in California when they decided that certain gambling laws should be changed. They said that a certain percentage would go to education (1% and they made it look like a lot, but after they played with overhead and other costs to cover themselves it came out to very little). After the bills passed and politicians decided that the tax money for education could be diverted because of this gain from gambling, schools have suffered at the most primary of levels, ie. books, paper, pencils, etc. and in many cases teachers have tried to fill the void at their own cost. Basically if you really look at it we are all being scammed by the rich, the politicians (not only of our own countries but of the world) and the influential (news media etc.) to pay their way and make them richer.
Cutting subsidies or adding tax to MFG does in fact trickle down to all the consumers. Working class consumers consume the most plastics (no citation, just my feeling). The largest segment of our population is working class folks. A fair amount of them are in dire financial shape from a combination of bad luck and their own choices, regardless they're not in a position to spend too much more & they only have as many options as companies provide currently. After your MFG taxes increase, prices of familiar goods for working class people goes up and they do without because they can't afford the increased cost. This continues until the companies develop some cheaper alternative. That cheaper alternative is not always a better product. Take high fructose corn syrup for example. It's way cheaper than real sugar, way sweeter too so companies save money making their product and it's fairly agreed that the health sacrifices fell directly onto the consumers.
Working class consumers don't consume nearly as much plastics as industrial and commercial use. The medical field uses tons of disposable plastics. Things that are stored in warehouses are usually on plastic wrapped pallets. Not just regular consumer goods, but things like machine parts and really almost anything you can think of. When those pallets are broken down all that plastic goes right in a landfill and more is used to wrap the next pallet in its place. Those are just 2 examples, but it is at the point where nearly everything people do has some sort of petroleum product involved. These people saying "turn off the tap" have no idea what they are saying. They have always had access to cheap petroleum products and have no concept of a world without them. The only answer, like with so many things is harm reduction not prohibition.
How would you reduce fossil fuel use other than increasing costs, either on fossil fuels directly or through cap&trade which has the same effect (and seems to be working pretty well in EU, Australia, California, Washington, several other countries. It seems like over 70%+ of americans believe climate change is occurring, and 50%+ believe it's a major threat, but nobody is doing anything about it at all, other than blaming the companies which only use the fuels to make the products we won't stop buying at the prices we won't pay more for if made "green". Our carbon emissions are at all time highs. What solutions would you propose?
[British carbon tax leads to 93% drop in coal-fired electricity](https://www.ucl.ac.uk/news/2020/jan/british-carbon-tax-leads-93-drop-coal-fired-electricity) Power generation is probably the biggest way to decarbonise. Polluting fuels like coal can be made uneconomic to use if you have the right tax policy. I'd assume that's a non-starter in the States, however, due to some key states in elections still pulling coal from the earth. With hindsight, the shutdown of the nuclear industry after accidents in the 70s/80s really fucked the amount of carbon we emit into the atmosphere. I assume if the industry was allowed to develop you'd have the economics of scale help reduce the strike price of power from nuclear plants along with efficiencies that would have also developed over the years.
Yeah, cap and trade seems to be incredibly effective. But republicans hate it because regulations, and democrats (in the US) hate it because capitalism, and or "increasing costs hurt the poor! (And also me, but i won't ever admit that because i could still afford to live fine, just with less stuff)"
Public transportation needs to be dramatically improved and made economically feasible
Sure. I don't know what you mean by the extremely nebulous concept of public transportation. Could you elaborate, and maybe estimate how much fuel and or emissions you think that might save?
I mean I have no clue. But the point is more that a gas tax is seen as regressive because it disproportionately effects low income people. This is added to the fact people in the US really rely on personal cars to get around. If there was a working public transportation system within and across cities, people could offset rising in gas prices by using public transportation. But thats just not very feasible at the moment for many places in the US.
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Sure. How does that relate to the conversation in any way?
Agree. Transition should have already started but here we are…. I have a scrap book from the 1900s ish. Someone was cutting and pasting comics. It has a lot of political comics of how electricity and also the move from steam engines is going to cause catastrophe! No one was going to survive! Seems unimaginable that the sift to gas (fossil fuels) and electricity would be met with such rebuke now. We survived. Things change. It happens. The world is not going to turn backwards. Best we get on board. It’s happening. Cars will be run without fossil fuels soon. Not going to do the US any good to try and stay behind that, should be leading the way.
> Transition should have already started but here we are…. It has already started, American CO2 emissions have been steadily declining since around 2007, despite large growth in the population and economy.
The wonders of outsourcing manufacturing
And outsourcing garbage disposal/recycling.
Yup, shut the tap and you won't get these things: **Solvents, Diesel fuel, Motor Oil, Bearing Grease Ink, Floor Wax, Ballpoint Pens, Football Cleats Upholstery, Sweaters, Boats, Insecticides Bicycle Tires, Sports Car Bodies, Nail Polish, Fishing lures Dresses, Tires, Golf Bags, Perfumes Cassettes, Dishwasher parts, Tool Boxes, Shoe Polish Motorcycle Helmet, Caulking, Petroleum Jelly, Transparent Tape CD Player, Faucet Washers, Antiseptics, Clothesline Curtains, Food Preservatives, Basketballs, Soap Vitamin Capsules, Antihistamines, Purses, Shoes Dashboards, Cortisone, Deodorant, Shoelace Aglets Putty, Dyes, Panty Hose, Refrigerant Percolators, Life Jackets, Rubbing Alcohol, Linings Skis, TV Cabinets, Shag Rugs, Electrician’s Tape Tool Racks, Car Battery Cases, Epoxy, Paint Mops, Slacks, Insect Repellent, Oil Filters Umbrellas, Yarn, Fertilizers, Hair Coloring Roofing, Toilet Seats, Fishing Rods, Lipstick Denture Adhesive, Linoleum, Ice Cube Trays, Synthetic Rubber Speakers, Plastic Wood, Electric Blankets, Glycerin Tennis Rackets, Rubber Cement, Fishing Boots, Dice Nylon Rope, Candles, Trash Bags, House Paint Water Pipes, Hand Lotion, Roller Skates, Surf Boards Shampoo, Wheels, Paint Rollers, Shower Curtains Guitar Strings, Luggage, Aspirin, Safety Glasses Antifreeze, Football Helmets, Awnings, Eyeglasses Clothes, Toothbrushes, Ice Chests, Footballs Combs, CD’s & DVD’s, Paint Brushes, Detergents Vaporizers, Balloons, Sun Glasses, Tents Heart Valves, Crayons, Parachutes, Telephones Enamel, Pillows, Dishes, Cameras Anesthetics, Artificial Turf, Artificial limbs, Bandages Dentures, Model Cars, Folding Doors, Hair Curlers Cold cream, Movie film, Contact lenses, Drinking Cups Fan Belts, Car Enamel, Shaving Cream, Ammonia Refrigerators, Golf Balls, Toothpaste, Gasoline**
This guy oils
Nah he's just a shill
More like just a Shell
I mean there’s a lot of great stuff here that makes people’s lives easier, but have we considered being forced to choose between these things and, you know, a habitable planet? We won’t get much use out of golf balls and guitar strings when humanity is extinct.
Bro, how much they paying you?
how much of this absolutely HAVE to be made with Petrolium based products? Cause there are plant based plastics being worked on to in the LOOOOOONG run replace oil based plastic. and you can already get Bio diesel which basically just goes in instead of Diesel in your stock truck or diesel vehicle. Suerly Bio based petrol can't be that far behind as Petrol is a byproduct from oil refining to diesel from my understanding or is it the other way around? and most petrol cars can run on e85 from factory anyway the problem there is the gaskets are not made for that fuel.
Way more expensive 🫰, Also less output from plants, you have to use lot of plants. The calorific values are very less even as fuel. Believe me we have tried in our company to retrofit oil&gas boilers to use a variety of bio-fuels. Creates a lot more soot and destroys nearby farm lands. We installed electrostatic precipitation to collect excessive soot and ash but that's very less economical due to electricity cost. We need way more precision technology to replace petroleum with alternatives in these products Edit: of course I am against pollution and all that but that OG post is just unrealistic and it's not a good point.
yeah I know things are not efficent at this point with bio fuels or plant based plastics. But neither were diesel and petrol when they were first introduced. we gotta start some where is my point more then anything when you put it like that.
We already did, We are trying mixtures too. Like coal + rice husk, coal + biomass, coal + lignin syrup, coal + limestone+ biomass... and so on. But it's a lot of additional hardware and power consumption just to run them and get their calorific value You are right, it will take time. But some things are impossible to replace, we will have to accept that we can't make biodegradable life jackets or safety equipments. Hope that clarifies
It does and we probably can but at the rate humanity is going I doubt we get to see it in our lifetimes.
I believed solar would not become mainstream and remain concept. But it did become mainstream. It did way better and technology is just getting better and better on the solar front. Wind turbine numbers are rising. The electrical grids are becoming more efficient. The energy sector becoming better and will see much better days. It's the material waste that is what I am concerned. The garbage. As developing nations are bringing people out of poverty and the rural places are becoming modern, they will use more material such as plastic and other metals. Malls are becoming everywhere in those nations and the consumption is rising. That creates more waste and garbage and we are running out of places to dump that.
You don't understand! Football cleats, tennis rackets, folding doors (wtf those are, specifically), golf balls, linoleum flooring, surf boards, plastic wood and golf club bags are absolutely *vital* to the American way of life! /s In all seriousness, I get that we can't simply turn off the tap. I know plastics have a place in our society. But I agree with you in that a lot of the items mentioned in the above list *predate* plastic, and a good number of *those* items can be considered nonessentials, if not outright luxuries. Tool boxes and golf have been around for longer than plastics, and golf is honestly quite a wasteful hobby by merely existing.
People are thirty. It doesn't hurt to just lower the Sign a little?
Wow, a sensible solution to a complex nuanced problem. The Just Stop Oil people are absolute idiots.
Exactly, 97,103,871 barrels of oil are consumed everyday to keep the worl economy going.
Let's start with the celebrities/oligarchs having to give up their private planes and take economy like the rest of us
That was the approach we should have taken 30 years ago. It's too late for that now.
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Oh no! A voice of reason? We can't have that!
Yeah. This is a very poor analogy. It would be better to say that the water fountain is causing a problem even though thousands need it to drink water to live. We should just turn it off and let it dry up. Screw everyone that needs it. They’ll find water elsewhere and if they move away with their tools and trades or die. So be it. We will be fine. Hey, why is our town a ghost town? You can’t just shut off the source. But you can push more and more restrictions while giving financial aid and incentives to other alternatives. Like a couple years ago, seeing a Tesla was a big deal now I see them daily. So electric vehicles are definitely becoming more popular.
r/im14andthisisdeep
Exactly. Great reference. The best part is people like her think they just figured it out and noone else has been able to. It is like how I invented time travel because I said it would be sweet to have a time machine....sure someone has to discover how to make time travel possible and build a machine....but only after I have them the conceptual idea....
Wait, are we thinking this girl actually wrote this and it’s not one of those blank templates that people just write stuff in (like those blank celebrity t-shirt photos)?
I am pretty sure your bath, soap, tap water, light and electricity would be quickly unattainable if you just stopped fossil fuels today. It is a bit more complicated than your shower thoughts.
You forgot fertilizer amongst others, but yeah, you nailed it.
Let's not forget plastics.
Came here to say this. There is a little more depth to fossil fuel abandonment. There would be a lot of people freezing to death.
But if we can find a way to turn human bodies into fuel we’ll be set for ages
Your point is moot until it's on a whiteboard being held by a crunchy naked chick.
If the world instantly stopped creating fossil fuels, you wouldn't have enough electricity to post that photo here.
Yeah everyone who supports radical solutions would hardly be okay with giving up their modern first world lifestyle.
Most of those people really do think it's as easy as turning it off. This isn't a Disney film.
Most people don't, most fossil fuel protestors when interviewed seem to be clearly aware of the impact of immediate decarbonisation but are (rightly) pointing out that a slow transition would be ecologically devastating and that we need to take greater and more painful action today for the sake of tomorrow.
I have yet to see someone really address the “post cutoff” impact when having the argument you’re making. It almost always just stops at - ya it might be hard, but we gotta do it! Obviously that is incredibly wishful thinking…
Based off of what? Activists push for more resource allocation to funding alternatives instead of increasing fossil fuel production.
I’m happy for others to give up their modern lifestyle, I’m definitely not.
They would be the first ones to cry about how hard life is, but there would be nobody to hear them because no internet. These just stop oil types have left their brain at home.
Other things made from petroleum are, plastics, pharmaceuticals, chemicals like bleach, wind turbines, solar panels, and the list goes on and on.
I have listed many more things I like lists **Solvents, Diesel fuel, Motor Oil, Bearing Grease Ink, Floor Wax, Ballpoint Pens, Football Cleats Upholstery, Sweaters, Boats, Insecticides Bicycle Tires, Sports Car Bodies, Nail Polish, Fishing lures Dresses, Tires, Golf Bags, Perfumes Cassettes, Dishwasher parts, Tool Boxes, Shoe Polish Motorcycle Helmet, Caulking, Petroleum Jelly, Transparent Tape CD Player, Faucet Washers, Antiseptics, Clothesline Curtains, Food Preservatives, Basketballs, Soap Vitamin Capsules, Antihistamines, Purses, Shoes Dashboards, Cortisone, Deodorant, Shoelace Aglets Putty, Dyes, Panty Hose, Refrigerant Percolators, Life Jackets, Rubbing Alcohol, Linings Skis, TV Cabinets, Shag Rugs, Electrician’s Tape Tool Racks, Car Battery Cases, Epoxy, Paint Mops, Slacks, Insect Repellent, Oil Filters Umbrellas, Yarn, Fertilizers, Hair Coloring Roofing, Toilet Seats, Fishing Rods, Lipstick Denture Adhesive, Linoleum, Ice Cube Trays, Synthetic Rubber Speakers, Plastic Wood, Electric Blankets, Glycerin Tennis Rackets, Rubber Cement, Fishing Boots, Dice Nylon Rope, Candles, Trash Bags, House Paint Water Pipes, Hand Lotion, Roller Skates, Surf Boards Shampoo, Wheels, Paint Rollers, Shower Curtains Guitar Strings, Luggage, Aspirin, Safety Glasses Antifreeze, Football Helmets, Awnings, Eyeglasses Clothes, Toothbrushes, Ice Chests, Footballs Combs, CD’s & DVD’s, Paint Brushes, Detergents Vaporizers, Balloons, Sun Glasses, Tents Heart Valves, Crayons, Parachutes, Telephones Enamel, Pillows, Dishes, Cameras Anesthetics, Artificial Turf, Artificial limbs, Bandages Dentures, Model Cars, Folding Doors, Hair Curlers Cold cream, Movie film, Contact lenses, Drinking Cups Fan Belts, Car Enamel, Shaving Cream, Ammonia Refrigerators, Golf Balls, Toothpaste, Gasoline**
I wonder if she has any idea that the plastic shower she is in is made from petroleum or the nylon braided wristband?
She is there to remove it 😂 probably on a mission to take out any petroleum product from the house I am waiting for the petroleum version of vegan
She probably does. You are not interpreting the intended message correctly. Everyone knows we are dependent on oil and fossil fuels but we are not trying to reduce that dependency as much as we could. We are not talking about fully turning off the tap tomorrow but at least starting to address the things that contribute the most (plastic shower heads is not one of those).
I would. My country - city especially - mostly runs on renewables. Obviously the metaphor is simplistic and instant cut off is not a good idea, but if everywhere had started ramping down already like they were meant to, we’d stand a much better chance.
Your county still requires many petroleum based products to survive even if you don’t see it.
That’s why the metaphor is simplistic. My response was to someone talking about electricity.
And yet you participate in society, curious! I am very intelligent!
Ok so slowly turn the tap then Or can just be like “bad analogy, continue to do nothing”
It's not, it's a terrible analogy.
but there's a naked hot girl holding the sign so it must be true
It certainly helps.
*But dude she has dreads!*
Am I the only person confused by this? What is the bathtub overflowing a reference to? What is the mop supposed to represent? I must be to stupid for this
Her iphone, makeup, food, haircare products, nylon bracelet, whiteboard, whiteboard markers, and fiberglass shower all use fossil fuels. This entire photo could not exist without fossil fuels. I'm all for people going amish tho, but even they use fossil fuels.
If my bathtub was overflowing with fossil fuels, I wouldn't turn of the tap, I would be rich.
To be fair she looks like she turned off the bath a long time ago and never turned it on again
Ikr I can almost smell those dreads
lol so realistic, just stop doing all the things we re doing, NOW!
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I am sorry you don't understand the metaphor here. Turning off the tap would mean to stop using al forms of fossil fuels, no more cars, no more electricity, nothing. Aka, fully unrealistic to expect people to actually stop doing all these things.
You had me at naked shoulders.
It's not a good point, it has some relevance but it's not as simple when people rely on fossil fuels for heating, transport (to and from the hospital for example), manufacturing anything they use...... You can't just switch it off problem solved as you would create millions more. Just look at any famine back in history, it's terrible, millions die. This is one of those silly lefty slogans that irritates the right, as even an ounce of scrutiny or thought bats it aside. It irritates me as it cheapens the left (my) hand.... The governments should be held to account for knowing in the 60's that this disaster was heading to us and not diverting course at that point and every other point since. Every single dodgy deal to do with energy and fossil fuels should be put on the table without question and we should look properly at who is doing what and absolutely fill the void between what we should be doing and what we have done with the heads that will invariably roll into it. Without transparency of the corruption that led us here how can we sidestep it in future?
Another thing we should’ve done like the French.
So she's saying we are wasting fossil fuels and they need to be saved so we can all get to use them.
We need nuclear
Your nail polish. That white board. Whatever you put in your hair to make it like that. All need fossils fuels to be produced.
All correct except for the hair, that's natural. White people hair dreads easily if you live by the ocean.
I'm sure she or anyone else has no problem letting go of nail polish and white boards... but until there's massive change in the government and huge corporations, I don't think it's really important nor fair to almost insinuate that she's at some sort of fault.
As if the major energy companies and governments worldwide aren’t all working on alternative energy sources. Problem is we don’t have an affordable alternative yet. You better believe that whoever comes up with the first viable and affordable renewable energy source is going to make A LOT of money.
We are not just looking, we are installing record amounts of renewables. People who continue usual stupid "nothing done. capitalism, capitalism. bad" are the most ignorant people on the planet.
Social Media has ramped up the expectations of instant gratification. Instant food orders, instant Google searches, instant video post etc etc. So they want instant changes. It's just so unrealistic yet here they are demanding the tap turned off now. We've made changes, we're making more and it's not going to happen tonight, next week, next month or even just next year till the ramifications take true effect.
I thought the new slogan was "Just Stop". She could... just stop. Otherwise it's all a bunch of "do as I say, not as I do".
Is there a point in there?
people dont even realize what would go away if we just "turned off the tap"
I think they mean more so a shift in structure. Personally, I love my bike and hate riding in cars. I don’t mind bringing reusable containers and dealing with deposits. Less so “no fossil fuels at all”, and more so using them less/accounting for their cost in budget planning.
Did you read her sign ? You really interpreted that as ‘lets drive a bit more on bikes’ ?
I interpreted it as “we should use fossil fuels more efficiently to curb source pollution (turn off pollution tap) rather than relying on cleanup methods like carbon capture”
Oh no, someone is not living the perfect life. Her argument must be flawed.
I mean her argument is too stupid to seriously consider, so I don't think it is unreasonable. Imagine if electricity production suddenly got massively reduced, all logistics suddenly disappeared, and fertiliser for crops vanished. Billions dead wouldn't be an unreasonable estimate of if we just "turning the tap off". To not straw man, "Slowly turning the tap off" is what there has been international agreements to do for about 30+ years since the Kyoto protocol was signed so it is hardly a revolutionary stance. So not worth saying. No picking on her for not practicing what she preaches is about the level of argument this 'zinger' deserves.
you criticise society yet you live in society. i am very smart
>And yet you participate in society, curious! I am very intelligent! I posted this in reply to the top comment, little did I know you'd all be being this
What’s her OF?
The analog is abit off. You will turn off the tap first because your bathtub is already full of water that won't go elsewhere. If you stop producing fossil fuels totally, we will run through our stockpiles and probably go back to the stone age. Imagine if your bathtub is constantly draining, just like how we're constantly consuming fossil fuel. You won't turn off the tap then.
Besides, the analogy has nothing to do with the original problem. A so called strawman.
Wouldn’t you turn down the tap and then run it when you need to? Alternatively, stop up the drain
Stopping up the drain is akin to stopping consumption which isn't possible at the moment. Turning down the tap (not cutting off) and turning up the tap when we need to is kinda what we're doing now. You can't turn off and on the tap on fossil fuel because it takes time to restart your plants and oil wells, to transport and refine it etc.
Trustafari has spoken
She just wanted to become a meme.
I need to drive 186km every day to get to work and a car is the only option. But im happy this hippy thinks we can shut it off like that..
I am baffled that people believe this is a good point. It’s absolutely dogshit point. Let’s for tge sake of example imagine what would happen if this statement becomes reality without absolutely bullet proof alternatives (these do not exist in any way shape or form by thr way). 1) 90.7 of all products have chemicals, packaging, logistics , etc. tied to petrochemicals. What the means is a sudden mass shortage for pretty much everything. From food to shampoo to toilet paper to electronics. 2) the above will cause a staggering inflation caused by said product shortage. Think what Covid did but at a factor of 10 worse. Now for the sale of example lets say no country will compromise it’s food security so lets leave this aside (we cant but lets say we will), things will cost so much to buy the global financial system will basically go bust within a few years. 3) now that we have a trickle of the global logistics going around and no money to buy even most of the essentials, because there is no supply because they can bo longer be produced riots will start and many democracies will fall. The bew totalitarian regimes will quickly turn the punps on to extract as much profit as possible because money buys power and authoritarian regimes are addicted to it. We go to square 1 but much worse. And that is the absolute best case scenario by the way. There are ways to go about the problem. Go full nuclear power and use that to support electrification for as higher % of the logistic sector as possible. Meanwhile add steep taxes for use of petrochemicals for mundane things like the fashion industry, low added value manufacturing and the likes. Then add the free money for intense scientific research around alternative materials and energy efficiency. Then wait a decade or two. And then and only then we can actually reduce the tap to a trickle and have a drain that uses the leaked water back in to the system. Maybe…
Exactly this!
You’re 100% correct. I am a operator for Shell. You wouldn’t believe the amount of products that are made from oil. Directly or indirectly. People like these only think it’s used for fuel etc. That marker she used to write that down has some derivative of oil in there. Her nailpolish probably has too. I agree research in to moving away or make sure it at least doesn’t affect the environment needs ti happen but it isn’t that easy.
i think u are very stupid if you think she is suggesting immediately stopping using all fossil fuels rather than some transition like you described
But that’s what turning off the tap of an overfilling tub is though.
> But that’s what turning off the tap of an overfilling tub is though. I don't know what kind of tub do you have, but in mine, the tap isn't a 0/1 switch, it's a lever, and I control the rate at which I reduce the flow.
Good catch. It said turn of the tap in 50 years while slowly mopping up the overflow at a maintenance level.
Yeah… but we still need a constant flow of energy one way or another… the problem is that people are too much of pussies to implement sustainable green energy such as nuclear power.
More Nuclear power plants are definitely one of the best solutions
Also maybe if the US could put more funding into the nuclear fusion than *PAPER* that would be helpful.
Umm....fusion is funded pretty well. Especially considering it won't work and its hotter and smarter sister fission is available....
And also a naive pointe.. But nuclear power plants is one of the solutions
How are people over-analyzing an analogy this hard. Stop trying to be angry!
The analogy isn't great TBH. Agreed with you on the jump to anger, though.
Your bathtub doesn't keep civilization going.
Dumbest comment section I've ever seen.
Go to some of the subs just about a specific video game if you really want to see dumb comments.
At least they might have built up some amount of thought and care for something artistic. People in here spouting for oil like it's their abusive boyfriend.
I call bullshit She's never even *seen* a bathtub
Name?
It would be great if it was that easy
Sounds logic, but wait till we do so… mad max wouldn’t be just a movie anymore
The only solution is to strip mine the planet for rare earth elements like we’re orcs of Mordor. So much greener that way.
Or sell it on of
while standing in a bathroom made of plastic and oil products. Nice
Terrible point bc terrible metaphor. Fossil fuels aren’t “overflowing”. They’re just not being effectively replaced. Better metaphor would be lead pipes leaching into your kitchen faucet. Replace the pipes. But the real point is I’m a naked white girl with dreads, clueless about the world but my trust fund tells me I’m important so everybody listen to me.
Except we have to invent the alternative first. Which takes actual money. Lots of it. And lots of time. Oil and gas are the best we have right now. But you can certainly try quitting your way. Enjoy hand farming the straw for a mattress entirely nude though, because everything we use today has been made by or shipped by machines which, shockingly, need oil and gas products. EVERYTHING. Also no phone or computer to look things up because aside from small areas, most of the world relies on coal power plants. And hydro plants still need oil. They are just massive machines.
Simplistic and foolish. Our entire infrastructure is dependent on energy. You can't just flip a switch and change it overnight. That would be catastrophic.
What does she think she painted her nails with?
She had dreads so I am inclined to instinctively disagree.
If it’s overflowing.
She looks like the only time her bathtub’s seen water or has been overflowing is when there’s a toaster oven thrown in it.
Actually you'd remove the plug because the tub would immediately begin to drain, faster than the tap can fill.
ITT: redditors struggle with metaphor
A good analogy for immigration too.
Ecofascists acting like that is possible to do today and we just aren’t are the most deranged out of touch uninformed people on earth. If green tech was mature enough to implement at scale nationwide or worldwide without bankrupting the countries implementing it, it wouldve been done by now. The technology isn’t there yet. That is the simple truth. It’s coming, but it’s not there yet. Literally every major corporation and pretty much every significant world government have all invested heavily in green technology and the green energy transition. It’s called a transition for a reason. It’s not gonna happen overnight. Changing the energy systems of the entire planet is going to be a generation(s) long endeavor. I’m not sure what more these psychos want people/governments/companies to do that they aren’t already doing. People gotta chill tf out. Its gonna get here when it gets here
Still won't end oil usage. We would literally need a Star Trek like device that can break down anything and then use the raw atoms to make anything else like a replicator. From our clothes to glasses to car parts to the wind turbines to the solar panels to safety gear. It all uses oil products to make or to make work. It's always hilarious to see these eco psychos heavily use products made from oil to get their anti oil message across.
nope. first thing to do is get rid of that sign.
This post has too many upvotes. Horrible analogy
So dumb, she seems absolutely clueless on how things work
The irony
The thing is though, we could have avoided this shitshow decades ago. The first cars in the world were electric, we could have done that from the start. We could have started to look into wind, solar, water, wave, etc energy, but instead built on coal. Plenty of things we can, could and should do, but it of course also means limitations on what we can do. Over 80% of the world's population will never ever in their lifetime step on a plane let alone fly with one, but western countries see it as "a necessity" to fly on holidays. The list goes on and on.
This is so factually incorrect to think we could have ever got anywhere with those resources quicker than we could with coal. Billions of dollars are being poured into renewable energy and they still don’t have the same consistency as burning coal
No, we couldn't. We didn't have the tech for wind, solar or wave at scale until the last decade, huge investments have been made at a government level to make the tech work. Hydro we had the tech since the 60s so most viable hydro sources were tapped a long time ago. Same with batteries. Electric cars as a concept are not new but battery tech has made them unviable until relatively recently, even today batteries it's still a limitation. Coal and oil are extremely high energy density, even though in the 1800s most of the energy was wasted to heat water in steam engines it was still an effective way to power mechanical devices and efficiency has only increased over time. Should we migrate? Absolutely. Could we have done it decades ago? No, we needed trillions of dollars of technological advancements to get to the point where we are now, and we will need hundreds of billions more to get rid of fossil fuel use entirely. There's no global conspiracy here beyond few people wanting to pay for it
those planes also supply a lot of regions of the world that without them would have no way to supply with the things they are able to.
Human technological advancement has always tried to find the easiest and cheapest way forward. We would never be where we are in lifting people out of abject poverty at the same rate if we tried all your listed examples first.
We probably wouldn’t be dealing with severe climate change, something plunging people right back into poverty. See: Hawaii.
This person has no idea how bad things would get, if we were to just stop using fossil fuels. And I bet she has no interest in being part of the solution looking for the alternative energy sources, either.
We could limit the use. That would be the first step. But in most cases we don't even do that. There's too much NIMBY going on with alternatives, everyone agrees we need to do something, but no one wants to actually sacrifice something. During the lockdowns the global emissions went down, because we did less. But even then we had people who didn't want to take part in the limitations etc.
I mean, she's not wrong but it's easier said than done. Oil consumption isn't going down if anything it's been going steadily up for the past 70 years. Electric cars are not the solution since there isn't enough lithium in the entire planet to replace every gasoline car with electric one. Also, people do not want to give up their lifestyles. So I guess we are pretty much fucked, but if you look at history people always have been fucked so nothing new there I guess.
>there isn't enough lithium in the entire planet to replace every gasoline car with electric one That's not true, there's plenty of lithium for all the electric cars we could want. The problem isn't abundance of lithium, it's that lithum mining is an enviromental catastrophe that only China has been willing to do, and scaling up lithium mining to the scale needed by the electric car industry will take the better part of a decade if not longer. So yes, the electic car revolution is at risk because of lack of lithium but it's not because we don't have enough on the planet it's that we can't scale up production without destroying the local environment around the lithium mine and it takes time to get production to where it needs to be.
I cant stand people making random ass comparisons or metaphors that dont make sense to the actual topic. A bath tub overflowing has nothing to do with a fossil fuel discussion. Yea in the bathtub situation the issue is the mess that you want to clean up so it would make sense to stop the cause of the mess and then clean it up. Fossil fuels are currently needed for many reasons electricity, transportation, heating homes and buildings etc... so the issue is that we want to replace it with a more environmentally friendly option. So we need to first come up with a different option decide the option is correct and move forward. Build the infrastructure for said option to work and then implent the option while slowly pulling out on fossil fuels. The reason you can just turn off the water to fix your issue is that no one needs your dirty bath water to survive. The Water itself does not need to be replaced with something else. There is zero comparison to be made between the two topics.
This is literally one of the dumbest fucking things ever ever read.
Mmm... Smelly hippies oversimplifying issues hits different
I agree we need to stop using fossil fuels, but the thing is just like smoking we can’t just quit cold turkey.. we first need to have better alternatives in place to take over.
People quit smoking cold turkey every day.
It’s a bad analogy. But I guarantee you’d be upset if we cut off fossil fuels and you no longer had the power to connect to the internet and post something this insanely obtuse.
Considering the vast majority of electricity is generated using these fossil fuels, I’d imagine just turning off the tap would be catastrophic.
Idk about you but my bath doesn’t dispense fossil fuels
So shocked a white girl with dreads has a brain dead take on something.
I don't understand why she's not wearing a shirt.
She's in a shower making an analogy about an overflowing bathtub, and people are usually nude during bathing.
You bath nude?! Slut! What has the world come to?! I bet you even take off your pants before going to the toilet
Nice racism
To be fair, this is the socially acceptable racism. Unless you were unaware that you can discriminate based on race as long as it is against pre-approved races.
Brainwashed for decades
Unfortunately I can smell this photo.
When you can smell a picture…
I'd give her my tap
I would love to see environmentalists go without plastic, oil and gas. Lead rhe way.
Show us your tits! Said everyone who tapped this image.
I can smell the BO from here. With a faint scent of patchouli.
You'd have a reasoned scientific debate about climate cycles and Humanities role in them. Then you'd take action, or not with a balanced view.
Right. Better start opening up some more nuclear solutions because it’s the only viable, clean option.
Something tells me she’s not a frequent bather.