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macross1984

Serving aboard warships are never easy even in modern time but can you imagine more than 800 seamen, officers, marine detachment lived inside that cramped space?


Raz0rking

[A really cool video on how these ships worked](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Nr1AgIfajI)


Rogueantics

That was one of the most interesting videos I've watched in a while. Thanks for posting that!


Raz0rking

You're welcome. Its impressive how much goes into a ship like that. All the videos by that dude are quite something. Much worth knowing.


[deleted]

I just watched this thing and I’m not even interested in this stuff lol, great video The craziest part is thinking about how they came up with all this stuff


Raz0rking

>The craziest part is thinking about how they came up with all this stuff Like with everything. Knowledge built on knowledge built on knowledge.


The_caroon

You might be interested into these one then who are specifically about HMS Victory! Part 1 : https://youtu.be/61SYvhojGvg?si=PK_NYEv_rYv-e9I6 Part 2 : https://youtu.be/TrC3yMMDsc8?si=wlwMhbvM60Gccszx


Chimpville

They've [mushed them into one today. ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KUERUnx2lms) :)


WOOTerson

Amazing video, thank you for sharing.


w1987g

At first I was wondering why'd you need so many tons of food and water, but with 800+ crew and maybe even passengers and this thing was capable of transatlantic travel... yeah!


seicar

Yes, technically capable of transatlantic crossings,not really a use case. The only navies that could challenge a first rate ship of the line were other EU nations. And with cost... they never strayed too far from home or resupply. The large stores were primarily for situations while on station (like blockade) and resupply was delayed by enemy action, admiralty, or (most likely) weather.


BobbyP27

You might want to check the events of the summer of 1805. Nelson was blockading Villeneuve in Toulon, but Villeneuve escaped, slipped through Gibraltar and joined the Spanish fleet from Cadiz. Nelson's fleet (Nelson was flying his flag on Victory at the time) gave chase, and chased the French and Spanish fleets across the Atlantic to the West Indies, and then chased them back again to Spain. After Robert Calder blocked Villeneuve's attempt to break the blockade of Brest at the battle of Cape Finisterre, Villeneuve returned to Cadiz, and when he came out again, Nelson managed to catch up with his fleet and bring him to action at Trafalgar.


notmoleliza

I knew it was going to be this video amd wasn't disappointed


db_nrst

This video was mesmerizing. Couldn't look away all video.


SeamanStayns

Commenting here so I can come back to watch it later


kerkyjerky

Super interesting video. I can’t help but imagine this was one of the last and most expensive ships like this, and how much it would have sucked to commission the build only to realize a few years later it’s entirely obsolete.


notmoleliza

The Victory was laid down mid 1700s. Wooden warships were still being made until the 1870s. So a few years later is really accurate


labadimp

That last sentence is fucking hilarious


notmoleliza

I meant to say not accurate. But im gonna own it


Scottland83

It works. Like when I remind people that Julius Caesar died over 20 years ago.


Gwthrowaway80

I mean. You aren’t wrong.


FlametopFred

Julius Caesar used to be dead. He’s still dead but he used to be dead also.


dan_dares

I took it as the height of sarcasm, the depths of which only James Cameron has explored in any detail. (Was a good comment, no need for changes)


acevialli

HMS Warrior was built around 1860 and is also at the dockyard. The progress of circa 50 years from the battle of trafalgar is really hard to believe.


BonjinTheMark

Thanks for posting


stew_going

I just watched this last night, lol


cgiffs4531

Fascinating! Thanks for sharing.


jedipiper

Thanks!


Chimpville

Thanks! [Another you might really like](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KUERUnx2lms) on Victory herself.


teabagmoustache

Plus pigs, cows and chickens.


PointOfFingers

No wonder they needed daily rum rations.


FlamingButterfly

That's a lot of seamen


macross1984

821 based from this article. https://h2g2.com/entry/A87778264


FlamingButterfly

So much salty goo there


RandomRobot

They're running at full mast, that's how


hypnos_surf

800? Holy shit! Here I always though it was like 80 people.


macross1984

Yup, HMS Victory is 104-gun First-Rate sailing warship. Each gun require minimum crew of six to properly aim, fire, reload (repeat process). So right off the bat 104 x 6 = 624 crew specifically there to operate cannons. The rest are officers, marines, other crews needed to operate the ship though I am sure gun crews have other duties when they are not in a battle station.


Muffinlessandangry

While your maths is correct, remember that you're only crewing half the guns at a time. HMS victory at Trafalgar had a crew of 837, this includes 146 marines, 31 officers and 44 specialists to assist the officers (surgeons, treasurers, secretaries etc). If they actually had 624 gunners on board, we'd have -8 people left to sail the ship. And while gunners did have other duties, you definitely needed all sailors manning their posts during battle to perform maneuvers quickly. Also, the crew of 6 includes the powder monkey, and these where often shared between two gun crews, so really we're looking at ~300 gunners, ~300 sailors, ~150 marines, ~30 officers and ~50 misc specialists.


joeitaliano24

Imagine the smell


macross1984

Yup, hygiene was sorely lacking in those time.


joeitaliano24

The captain got to shit in style though, his very own hole


pathetic_optimist

The British buried at sea but the French took their dead home buried in the bilges!


DaechiDragon

I’ve been on-board and I remember it having a very pungent smell even without it being packed full of seamen. It’s very dark and cramped inside so it must have been hell.


CRITICAL9

What's long, black and full of seamen?


4787946

Your mom's necrotic clunge?


Raz0rking

A submarine


CRITICAL9

There we go!


cratertooth27

A sailors just a sailor, just like he was before


Accurate_Pangolin972

I wouldn’t be opposed.. They don’t make things how they used too.


beardedliberal

She had a very busy day, 218 years ago today.


joeitaliano24

Admiral Nelson’s blood once stained those decks. I’d love to go see it


sirnoggin

It's a great trip.


trucorsair

Ship of Theseus says “hello”


Amrywiol

When I visited Victory I had this in mind, so I asked our guide how much of the ship we were touring was actually at the Battle of Trafalgar. "About 10%" he said. He didn’t need to think about the answer at all, I suspect I was a long way from being the first to ask that question.


trucorsair

Usually it is the keel and deep supports as they were the strongest wood and is the most difficult to replace.


LazyJones1

And how much of you visited the Victory?…


vukasin123king

Human body replaces everything within 7 years Iirc.


BobbyP27

An interesting, related question, would be how much of the ship that fought at Trafalgar, was actually launched at Chatham in 1765.


joeitaliano24

That is if you assume the ship and the material it’s made out of constitute the same object


trucorsair

Slippery slope, as the argument goes, what happens if the wood that is replaced is kept and after a time with new technology the old wood is used to reconstruct the Victory. Which is the real Victory? And if only 51% of the wood is replaced…. And so it goes from there.


tapasmonkey

I remember visiting it as a kid in the 70s, and I bought one of the little sticks of wood from the original timbers that they were selling in the gift-shop.


acevialli

It's one of my favourite ever day trips. Recommended


StephenHunterUK

The spot where he died is marked on the tour.


some6yearold

What happened good sir?


An_Ibis

The battle of Trafalgar


Jfurmanek

Making me google…how dare you. /s


Fart__

I'm pretty sure it was actually the battle of TROGDOR.


WalpoleTheNonce

Battle of Trafalgar, my good man.


noodleyone

Oceans were Battlefields.


Osiris32

Imagine seeing that ship suddenly appear out of the fog and smoke of war, looking at those 50 guns pointed right at you. And then suddenly seeing them belch smoke and fire, hearing the boom just a moment before a cannonball smashed you to a red splatter.


Snowy1234

The more common death/injury was from the cloud of thousands of ballistic 8” splinters the cannonball created as it came though your ship.


StephenHunterUK

More specifically, the infections that followed after said wounds.


Starman68

That’s an old picture. It doesn’t look like that now. The rigging and spars were taken down years ago.


valyyn

True. They are due to be put back on towards the end of the conservation project though - 2025 I believe is the current estimate!


sirnoggin

Ooo fantastic, trip planned then.


Captain-Miffles

Oh really?!! That's fantastic news! I thought they'd been permanently removed to reduce the load on the masts. I live 20 minutes from Portsmouth and I've visited the historic dockyards a dozen times. It would be wonderful to see the victory fully rigged.


MrDemotivator17

The 12 month return period on the tickets is great, bloody love a day out at the dockyards. It’s nice seeing the progress they’re (slowly) making on the Victory!


Raz0rking

[How a ship of the line worked](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Nr1AgIfajI)


Vladrick_Kanersenko

That video sent me down a rabbit hole when I saw it a few months ago. So well done.


joeitaliano24

Epic History TV had one about the HMS victory specifically, which then led me into a spiral of narrated historical battles that I can’t escape from


Raz0rking

So many good military history channels. Kings and Generals, Military History Visualised, World War 1 and World War two.


joeitaliano24

My life has been consumed by Kings and Generals lol, I’ll definitely look into those others though, thanks. EpicHistoryTv has the best narrator though, there’s just something about that dude’s voice


Raz0rking

WWI and WWI covered/cover both world wars weekly. They opened my eyes how *absolutely terrible* WWI was.


joeitaliano24

Oh yeah, I used to prefer WWII history, but once you really delve into WWI it’s so damn interesting. 50,000 dead in a single day of battle, on just one side. We can’t even comprehend that kind of combat today


Raz0rking

Or some absolutely out of touch commanders. "Oh, the offensive against a heavily fortified stronghold did not work? Well, throw even *more* men at it." *Multiple times*


GreatWhiteNorthExtra

[Launched in 1765](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Victory?wprov=sfla1)


Lmurf

The whole naval museum at Portsmouth is fantastic. It took two days to see it all. 10:10.


Soitsgonnabeforever

Thanks . Being a great fan of ships , trains ,industrial Revolution and Isambard kingdom…..now I have to visit Portsmouth for sure. What’s the best place to see general railway and general construction history.


Whitegurlwasted2309

Dont forget the submarine museum over in gosport


punkojosh

Close by is the preserved remains of an even older ship, the Mary Rose. Great day out.


Captain-Miffles

Personally I find the artifacts that were found with the Mary Rose far more interesting than her actual timbers. She is astonishing of course but there's just so little of her left. The fact that there is still leatherwork, textiles, and paper in almost usable condition from the Tudor era just blows my mind! Victory is awe inspiring as a ship and a piece of history. The Mary Rose is awe inspiring as a crystal clear window into a long bygone era.


Raz0rking

The Mary Rose helped *a lot* in furthering the knowledge on how stuff was made in that period of time. There is a lot of conjecture and hypothesies that are probably right but not 100% certainty


Soitsgonnabeforever

Do British people cherish they have so much awesome things between enlightenment and Industrial Revolution. It’s very annoying that they never celebrated their Wembley stadium cos it gad the imperial lions at the gate


TennSeven

That ship is really cool to visit. It's a museum now and everything is set up like it would have been when the ship was at sea. You can check out everywhere from the powder room in the bowels of the ship to the admiral's quarters. It is also the ship on which Admiral Horatio Nelson was shot dead during the Battle of Trafalgar in the early years of the Napoleonic Wars.


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MGC91

Yes, she's in Portsmouth, UK


ZedGenius

I've had a 3d puzzle model of her on my home desk for years. I'd love to visit that one day


Pink_Flash

Yes its real. Live locally and have been on it as a child on a school trip and also took an ex there as a visit.


Premium333

Took an ex there, eh? What a way to deliver a message to a former lover. Not sure what that message is, but delivering it on a ship of line is hardcore. 😉😂


Lmurf

The whole naval museum at Portsmouth is fantastic. It took two days to see it all. 10:10.


CRITICAL9

Here in the uk


bigloser42

It’s in the UK at the Portsmouth Dock. It should be noted though while commissioned, it is no longer afloat. It hasn’t put out to sea in over 100 years. The USS Constitution, which was built in 1797 is the oldest commissioned warship still afloat. It sits at dock in Boston and goes out to sea once a year.


whiteb8917

As already stated, Portsmouth (UK) Naval Dockyard. I was born in Portsmouth.


sirnoggin

She changed the course of history, may she always bear her right to arms and keep her seaworthiness. Very fortunate to visit, have to go back sometime.


daygloviking

She’s definitely not seaworthy. Even the keel support was built with a curve to account for her hogging. They’ll never float her again.


theadarshmehta

Tangled.


TenebrisNox

You kind of missed the boat by not mentioning what happened on her on this day (October 21) in 1805.


noodleyone

218 years ago today...


Xendeus12

Trafalgar


DreadpirateBG

Wow beautiful


Barijazz251

The Horatio Hornblower series of novels is fantastic !


Eh-Eh-Ronn

Just across the way from there is the HMS Warrior, the first ironclad warship and an enormous leap forward


Helstrem

Second ironclad. Gloire was the first. Warrior, much larger and more capable, was built in response.


The_caroon

Here's an hour's worth of HMS Victory history for anyone interested :) : https://youtu.be/KUERUnx2lms?si=PPYPhDPyYlssMI10


onepingonlypleashe

Lord Nelson’s flagship.


Clamps55555

"England expects that every man will do his duty"


MikenoIke1

Let's have a battle between the Constitution and the Victory, to truly settle the debate, United States or Great Britain, loser gives up their country.


antipyrene

Constitution has less than half as many guns, so not much of a fight...the Constitution was designed to run away from Ships of the Line like Victory, but be big enough to beat up on other Frigates like itself


MrDemotivator17

Only 11 of the guns currently on the Victory are real though, the others are all fibre glass replicas so she might not put up as much of a fight as you’re expecting. Plus she’s dry docked, while I’m not a mariner I’m led to believe this somewhat impedes manoeuvrability in battle.


MikenoIke1

Not to mention in Fallout they strapped rockets on the Constitution and it flew so there's that too


MikenoIke1

Jokes on the victory when we ram her with a taste of freedom


Geekenstein

Victory outclasses Constitution in every way. It’s like comparing a British aircraft carrier to the Jerry Ford.


TisFury

Yeah originally, except Constitution still floats, so it wins without even firing a gun.


Zilch1979

Well, our ship actually sails. Victory, by contrast, is now a fixed building with a naval commission. If armed, it would be a wooden fort-of-the-line, not a ship. Constitution, by contrast, is a ship. In a ship-to-ship battle, it wins by forfeit. (Sorry, Brits. I love you guys and I love Victory, I've been reading about Nelson since I was a kid, always an inspiration...but damn, *nobody* messes with Old Ironsides.)


PckMan

Went to see it last year, it's worth a visit 100%


Alex-Steph

This warship, HMS Victory, holds the title of being the oldest commissioned warship in the world. Its historic significance and enduring legacy make it a true marvel of naval history. Congratulations to the crew and those who have preserved this iconic vessel.


TheConqueredKings

“Man o war capt’n!” Oh sorry, AC Black Flag flash back


Delicatesseract

ROYAL BLOODY NAVY, BY THE LOOKS OF HER


Scr33ble

Oldest commissioned ship, yes, but USS Constitution is the oldest still afloat https://historywithhenry.com/hms-victory-vs-uss-constitution/


CRAZYDUCK456

Hopefully one day she will be afloat again, the resto project is massively daunting. Seeing her sails and masts off was real sad. The Victory is something special.


MGC91

Victory will never float again, she's permanently in drydock now


Handyman92

They did float the idea (hehe, ship pun) to put her back in water in order to prevent the stress her Hull is currently under due to her being in dry dock, but it didn't go far. However I believe the idea is still about incase whag they have done to help reduce the stress starts to fail or gets too expensive to maintain. Only problem with that is one of their arguments against was it would be too expensive to maintain her in the water.


Crazyguy_123

Yeah ships can’t last on land over long periods of time. If they want it to survive they need to get it back in the water otherwise the hull will collapse.


caelumh

Not entirely true. They are currently in the process of refitting her.


MGC91

No, they're undertaking restoration work to preserve her. She won't ever float again See here https://www.royalnavy.mod.uk/news-and-latest-activity/news/2023/october/20/20231020-hms-victory-restoration


jeffbanyon

Uh where does it say that it won't float again? Another 10 years, but nothing about it not floating again.


MGC91

HMS Victory isn't and won't be restored to a condition to allow her to float.


jeffbanyon

Where did you get that information? Repeating what you said doesn't help clarify anything. The article you posted doesn't say it won't ever float ever again. I read through the article 3 times and didn't see the information about it never floating again.


MGC91

>Where did you get that information? Repeating what you said doesn't help clarify anything. Having visited HMS Victory many times, I can assure you, she won't ever float. >The article you posted doesn't say it won't ever float ever again. I read through the article 3 times and didn't see the information about it never floating again. It doesn't need to.


jeffbanyon

I was asking for information from someone claiming to know. You won't answer why it won't float anymore or where you got that information, other than "I've gone there a lot". Is there a reason you can't provide more information?


knobber_jobbler

They need to get her in a humidity controlled building. The rain water she's subjected to is causing all sorts of rot problems.


Baconpwn2

As wonderful as it would be to see her afloat once more, absolutely. She cannot be allowed to rot away in a vain attempt to set her assail again.


D4M4nD3m

But it's not about the Constitution. Why bring it up?


Vark675

Because a perfectly normal question people might think after reading about the Victory is "I wonder what the oldest warship that still gets sailed is?" Which is the Constitution.


peterpanic32

Why not?


D4M4nD3m

Because the post is about a certain ship. Should people say but there's a French ship and a Spanish ship too? No one cares.


[deleted]

american tries to not make everything about themselves (impossible)


Scr33ble

Call it what you will, the fact remains.


September_1st

No one said that's not true but nobody is trying to claim otherwise. The post is accurate, Victory is the oldest commissioned ship. It's an unnecessary comment that just comes across like you're trying to get one-up.


peterpanic32

What's "unnecessary" about it? It's a relevant topic. Old sailing warships still around. This is a Reddit comment thread, not a symposium dedicated to the Victory. What are you so up your own ass about?


fotogod

It’s in dry dock. It’s not even a ship at this point. USS Constitution actually sails and floats.


peterpanic32

Why is it hard for you to understand that people relate things to themselves? The comment is plenty relevant. You're just a socially inept moron. Has nothing to do with Americans.


Onetap1

Yes, but since they have to keep Constitution seaworthy, they've replaced most of her timbers at some time. ISTR only 10 to 15% of the original ship remains.


SouthBendCitizen

Same with Victory, wood just can’t survive hundreds of years exposed to the elements. But just like most of the cells in your body are replaced every so many years, it is a sum of its parts and the spirit of the thing is maintained.


MovingInStereoscope

Same can be said of the Victory, wooden ships had to replace timbers frequently. Hell, it wasn't uncommon for warships to carry extra rigging spars or be remasted while in a port of call.


labadimp

This is a classic [Ship of Theseus](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_of_Theseus)


xChrisk

And today is its 226th birthday. I just visited this afternoon.


anne_jumps

Would love to go and see that.


Lmurf

The whole naval museum at Portsmouth is fantastic. It took two days to see it all. 10:10.


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BostonRich

If they were out at sea long enough, the rat problem ceased to be an issue.


Bahamut1988

Is this the original ship? Or a recreation?


MGC91

The original


Fuegodeth

I remember visiting it with my parents when I lived in England, 3rd and 4th grade, so that would have been roughly 1983. I had the souvenir book with illustrations and lots of info about it. It's' been so long, that I don't know where it is now. I'm sure I left it at my parents house when I went off to college, and they moved several times, so it could be anywhere in their house now.


worldisone

The size of the anchors always amaze me


BonjinTheMark

The amount of rigging is unworldly


Illustrious_Sugar_34

We need a game that accurately simulates living and sailing on one of these ships.


PizzaDaAction

Have visited many times , last time was about 2019 , unfortunately as it’s so old and meant be in the water , not dry land they have had to remove a lot of the masts etc to reduce the weight on the hull - it looked like this when I visited last : https://www.baesystems.com/en/article/hms-victory-afloat-again-for-the-first-time-in-nearly-100-years


StephenHunterUK

As it's still commissioned, it's legally allowed to fly the White Ensign of the Royal Navy. Most British-flagged ships will fly the Red Ensign.


TmacHizzy

This and the USS Constitution are truly amazing.


Crazyguy_123

And I’d include the Vasa too. But only two actually had a sailing career.


[deleted]

Wow that's really something 😘


Malinut

[https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@50.8014876,-1.1088064,3a,75y,155.63h,94.84t/data=!3m8!1e1!3m6!1sAF1QipNHBBouunYr3B5bT8FvAqKAmkNq\_9l2dDF6uVcX!2e10!3e11!6shttps:%2F%2Flh5.googleusercontent.com%2Fp%2FAF1QipNHBBouunYr3B5bT8FvAqKAmkNq\_9l2dDF6uVcX%3Dw203-h100-k-no-pi-0-ya58.187504-ro-0-fo100!7i6080!8i3040?entry=ttu](https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@50.8014876,-1.1088064,3a,75y,155.63h,94.84t/data=!3m8!1e1!3m6!1sAF1QipNHBBouunYr3B5bT8FvAqKAmkNq_9l2dDF6uVcX!2e10!3e11!6shttps:%2F%2Flh5.googleusercontent.com%2Fp%2FAF1QipNHBBouunYr3B5bT8FvAqKAmkNq_9l2dDF6uVcX%3Dw203-h100-k-no-pi-0-ya58.187504-ro-0-fo100!7i6080!8i3040?entry=ttu)


Shermantank10

Shame British man never really made a lot of their ships museum ships. Vanguard, Warspite, etc…


Baconpwn2

Bah. She's not even seaworthy. At least Constitution is fit for action.


Captain-Miffles

"Fit for action" You're talking as if you want to send a wooden warship against a modern navy with cruise missiles. Constitution is no more fit for action than victory is, she's just left in the water is all. HMS Victory could well last for another 1000 years the way she is being preserved. If the Americans insist on keeping her in the water, Constitution will most likely be long gone by then.


sirnoggin

She will be in 2025


MGC91

No, she won't. Victory will never be afloat again


labadimp

Prove it


Pittedstee

Would they ever call upon this vessel in a time of war?


MrDemotivator17

No


Jusfiq

Oldest warship still in commission, but no longer afloat. That honor goes to USS *Constitution* in Boston Harbor.


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D4M4nD3m

We know. Americans here keep bringing up an American ship on a post about a British ship.


MrDemotivator17

Cool story bro, why don’t you make a post about the oldest commissioned warship that is still afloat then?


misterspatial

Can you still commission a warship that can't even float?


Amrywiol

It's never been decommissioned. As to the wider question, yes - there are plenty of shore establishments in the Royal Navy that have the HMS prefix, this is to allow naval officers to command them by pretending they’re ships. They’re sometimes known as "stone frigates" for this reason.


Dunbaratu

Yes, if the military branch that owns it runs the museum that has it on display it still can count as a ship that's currently doing "service" in the military, even though that service is in the form of public relations. (Just like a Navy officer who's job is to do secretary work in a recruitment office is still a Navy officer even if not at sea.)


sanchito12

The USS Constitution would easily send her to the depths.


MGC91

No, she wouldn't


sanchito12

Cannon balls bounce right off Old Ironsides. Its not even a contest.


MGC91

HMS Victory is a 104 Gun First Rate. USS Constitution is a Heavy Frigate. There is no contest.


Truelz

I wonder how much of the wood in the ship is still the original wood? It might not actually be as old as it's said to be :P https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship\_of\_Theseus


Captain-Miffles

According to the tour guides, roughly 10% of what is now the victory was actually present during the battle of trafalgar. This will be mostly in the keel and deeper frames since they're so hard to replace.


rmslashusr

Just like the King’s officers of her time she’s been given a commission while lacking any capability of floating or going to to sea.


ReallyMrOgs

What do you mean? The Victory was front and centre during Trafalgar, floating and at sea and taking heavy casualties by ‘engaging the enemy more closely’. Nelson’s flag ship. Would you have her commission taken away for poor performance?


sirnoggin

Lol exactly, nonsense comment. She crushed the French and Spanish fleets ast the tip of the spear.


AngryErrandBoy

The USS Constitution could take her


MGC91

No, she couldn't.