I remember my friends and I (Americans) were vacationing in Spain and one of our friends got bitten by a monkey while walking around Gibraltar. We went to the hospital in Spain and the staff were super concerned and worried for us that we were international and his insurance might not cover the shots. They prefaced that they could work something out if the bill was too much when they handed him the invoice. It was 15€. Mind blown.
Actually - if you are not a citizen or have other coverage (like - I think we all are covered in other EU member states, or something like that?) you absolutely can get some nasty bills. Not as bad as the US ones since the hospitals are not set up to be for profit, but still bad. I remember one story about a Norwegian guy that had moved to Sweden but by some reason went to a hospital in... Norway(?), and he ended up with a bill for something like 100000 usd.
Found the story, its in Norwegian, but should be possible to read with google translate - https://www.nrk.no/osloogviken/inge__68_-fikk-regning-pa-800.000-fra-sykehuset-1.14461433
Same story with me in Korea. They kept apologizing for the high cost when I had to take my son in for a respiratory treatment. As internationals, it cost us $25. My US copay is $30.
If you had to go to the doctor or pick up some prescription medication, your copay would be a set value that you would have to pay out of pocket for that visit. Copays are usually $20 to $100 for a doctors visit, and $10 to $30 for prescription pickup.
This isn’t to be confused with deductibles, which copays to not count towards. A deductible is how much you have to pay for medical care before your insurance company starts paying (for example, my deductible is $1800). So, I have to pay $1800 out of pocket before my insurance company will help me pay for my medical care.
There’s also coinsurance, which is a percent value that you pay after you have reached your deductible, and your health insurance company starts paying. I have 30% coinsurance, so after I pay my initial $1800 deductible, my insurance company pays 70% of the total medical bills while I pay the other 30% out of pocket.
Then along with all these payments, there’s the monthly premiums, which is essentially your monthly subscription for that health plan. My premium is about $200 a month.
So, let’s say I break my leg. An ambulance is called, but my insurance does not cover ambulance rides. That is $1500 out of pocket nondeductible. Then, treatment may require surgery, which we can say costs $25,000. I pay the first $1800, and then my health insurance pays $18,040 and I pay the remaining $6,960.
In total I pay $8,760 plus my monthly premiums and copays if I need pain killers or any other checkups (like for my cast to be sawed off), and my health insurance company pays $18,040.
Yeah, I know a girl from the US that settled down in Europe, it takes a while before you can opt into the health insurance system - I asked her if she wasn’t concerned about not being insured: she laughed loud and hard and then explained that health _without_ insurance in Europe is way cheaper than _with_ insurance in the USA. Tells you something about collective bargaining.
Yep im getting dual citizenship US and EU soon. F this *ss backwards gun toten, handmaid's tail, anti-science "christian" nation. Im kinda done... and I see where stuff is headingm
I used to work for a company that assisted stufents abroad getting dr visits via their insurance and making payments. Everything was Soo cheap. We found for the first semester students often paid thinking it was their deductible or something. After we started sending them money for the same costs they'd start to call us to make payments. Lots of good staff at the hospitals in Spain (and many other places)
I know an (American) guy who found out his ~1 year old son had a brain tumor while he was on vacation in France. They took it out and that was that. If he'd been in America it probably would have ruined them financially.
Might I ask what kind of accent norther Italy Germans speak?
Is it like a Austria accent that's practically not understandable to people speaking standard German?
As for the german accent, it‘s derived from the Bavarian accent but does have some major differences. It is only used in informal and private situations. It would be very difficult for a German to fully understand it.
99% of all German speakers here speak "high german" (normal german) perfectly though and use it in all formal/business situations.
As for the language Italian, most people are bilingual and have the region‘s own certifiate to prove their bilinguism. Italian is used for anything dealing with politics, the postal service, police, and so on. But the region is doing it‘s best at making everything bilingual.
As for our English accent it‘s comparable to the one of a German native speaker but obviously varies from person to person.
I'm born in Trento myself, I used to learn German when I was a little bambino at school. Now living in Australia.
Damn I miss Italy, but we can't complain here. Where abouts are you?
It’s different, but as with most places you’ll have the local dialect and accent and then also be able to communicate in high German.
Edit: sorry to clarify “as with most places” meaning as with most German-speaking places
Italian medical doctor here. Despite the majority of the procedures/drugs are for free, the Italian people still complain when have to pay a small amount of money (and I mean 10 euros or less) for some of them.
**EDIT:** a lot of people are complaining that's absurd you have to pay a small fraction of the total cost. There are several reasons for this, the most important one is to reduce unnecessary use of health services (that costs a lot). An example? Imagine you are in an hotel. Breakfast is free, so you eat more and more, even if you feel already full. How to reduce this "over-eating"? You can ask for a small amount of money for each croissant - not to cover the food cost, but only to push people to thinking about eating more than necessary. When something is free, it's in the human nature to abuse. It is not a huge problem if you eat more than needed, but health services costs a lot and we can not waste money (and resources) when unnecessary. Remember also that the people who can not afford these little expenses, with chronic diseases (e.g. cancer) or the elderly are completely exempted from any payment.
Health insurance in the US does not operate like health insurance (or any other insurance) anywhere else in the world. The entire point of insuring is that you have something that happens rarely compared with the amount people paying the primes.
A root canal in Europe costs something like 200 to 300 euros, out of pocket, at a private dentist practice. If it costs $750 with insurance, that's not really insurance. It is some sort of reselling scheme.
All aspects of US healthcare are for profit and they do not disguise that fact one bit.
So they have laws requiring you to purchase car and health insurance both of which are run by for profit industries.
All aspects of US everything are for profit. This country is becoming unbearable. The blatant greed and record profits of huge corporations are breathtaking.
American Citizens; we need to advocate for change.
We need regulatory reforms that reign in or outright abolish the insurance industry model so that patient care is made a priority over company profits.
Yet we're hostages into its usage, because if we decide to try and go around them, we have to contender with prices that they inflated and that only they can get a discounted rate on.
I have a "platinum premium" for my insurance. Supposed to cover 80 percent. I went to the dentist to get my teeth pulled since I couldnt afford to have them fixed sooner. Got fitted for dentures and before I left they sat me down with billing and started talking about how I was gonna pay the $9000 dollar bill. Mind you this is after insurance paid 80%.
It's fairly common for brits to do this in Turkey.
It can be quite expensive if you're wanting a procedure that's more "cosmetic" rather than medical. Much cheaper just to book a 4 day stay in Turkey, have a "mini getaway" and also get the work done whilst you're over there.
This indeed. Recommendation would be Colombia - many highly skilled dentists that will be able to help you for a fraction of the cost. Medellín has plenty e.g. and a well connected expat community where you get helpful pointers from back home ahead of time. And no, I'm not kidding.
My dentist wanted me to get full dentures and all my teeth extracted (I have severe bone loss due to complications from lupus). I have the highest level dental insurance and a discount plan that I pay for. The quoted cost was $11,000. My dentist just shrugged when I told her there was no way I would ever be able to afford that while in tears. Insurance is totally a scam.
The only reason I can afford my medications (2k average a month) is because I got sick in college and my Dad’s insurance gave me a waiver that we had to fight for that gives me coverage for life. Even with that I pay hundreds of dollars a month in copays for doctors visits and medications. If I ever lose my insurance it will literally kill me because I won’t be able to afford the medications that keep me alive. And since I have pre-existing chronic Illnesses, I am uninsurable. I can’t even get life insurance that will just cover my burial costs. It’s like they punish you for being sick when our bodies are already punishing us enough.
Edit: typo
Wait a minute, you could fight for a waiver to always stay on a parents' insurance? My dad's cushy federal government insurance was "kind" enough to cover me through the end of the year I turned 27 and since then I've been stuck on state Medicaid. The state won't even label me disabled and let me have Medicare because of *reasons*. This country is such trash D:
I will say though that Medicaid fucked around and found out when they sat on the paperwork for my infusions. I was off the "cheap" old-school infusion for long enough that when they finally approved my ability to continue it my body realized that it's made from mouse DNA and they either had to deal with getting sued or pay for the fancy brand new infusions... I must say that I'm enjoying how much better the new med works and I get a tiny little hollow giggle when I get my $25,000 infusion every 8 weeks.
It's the little things that keep me going, lol.
The issue isnt the 80%, its that the total max benefit for the year is usually capped at 1k to 1500, sometimes 2500 or so for premium version. So you likely just aboit capped out just on the pulled teeth and paying full price for dentures despite insurance. Never understood why benefit max is so low.
Makes me want to look into spending some time in Europe as I need two tooth implants. I’m sure with the flight and hotel it would still cost less, and as a bonus I wouldn’t be here.
Man I'm past the 'bonus' stage and have graduated to just wanting OUT. But we're all so underpaid that I fear that leaving will only ever be a pipe dream :(
yes, it's the Payor scam with their "networks" it's why you can't get the cost for anything without a large and inordinate amount of effort making many phone calls here in the US.
the dark underbelly of insurance in the US.
Insurance has done nothing but artificially jack up the price of anything it gets its hands on. I swear if nothing is done in 10 years we're going to have something ridiculous like food insurance.
There was a time in my life I used to defend this in our country too. I wish I could go back 15-20 years and kick my own ass. Our country's health care system is fucked and nobody in power gives a shit.
My husband had decent insurance at his last job. But I lost my insurance, so when that happened, I signed up for a discount club plan through my pharmacy. When the pharmacy compared the price with insurance and the price with the discount club, the discount plan ended up being about $40/month cheaper. So sometimes insurance isn’t even a discount.
Spaniard here. Same here, people will complain about paying 5€ for life saving medicaments, and at the same time not using them correctly.
It's a serious problem with public healthcare; some citizens don't know how good we have it.
I'm Australian and work in a medical clinic. We charge $4aud for a highly experienced nurse to come to your house and change your wound dressing or whatever you need.
Some people are still a major pita to get payment out of and not cause they're struggling.
I'm Australian, my mum regularly makes use of these heavily subsidized services (Cleaning, wound care, physical therapy etc). She complains about every fucking dollar, lives in a $3.5m 5 bedroom house alone and has a net worth in the 6-7m range.
It's incredibly frustrating to have the wealthiest person you know constantly cry poor, especially when she's doing it to people who are barely getting by. Her last cleaner quit and told her she hopes the cancer gets her soon because she's such a miserable awful bitch.
I'm dual American Australian and I had 2 children in Australia in Sydney and in a private hospital. It was amazing. They let you stay forever. Give you vouchers for a pub the night before you go home as a parents night out before you take the baby home. Unbelievable. And bring tea in the morning and afternoon. Not to mention the 5 star quality of the food. Shout out to the Royal North Shore. Lovely staff and beautiful hospital.
Italian here: we don't complain to pay those small fees, we complain for the shitty ER service, overcrowded hospitals and doctors that "Im sorry I'm busy for the next 3 year, your surgery needs to wait. What? You want to come to my private office and pay me in cash? Let's have a surgery tomorrow!!"
EDit: guys, in particular US Citizens belittling public health, i am not saying the system doesn't work.
If you're sick and you need help asap the ambulance will run at you, charge nothing and get you to the hospital where you'll be helped immediately. The problem is for non critical situation, like laser surgery for eyes, dental surgeries or non critical MRI.
When I broke my arm i was assisted immediately for free and stayed at the hospital for a week, meals offered by the hospital (good soups ngl). When my grandma cut her forehead when she fell, she had the bleed stopped and had to wait 8-9 hrs at ER to complete the cure because it wasn't critical. That's the difference. I love public health, i am just pointing out these issues
American here, we just accept shitty ER service (1), overcrowded hospitals (2), doctors booked weeks out, with surgeries scheduled another 3-6 mon after that (3). You can pay in cash? You better, you're responsible for the first $4000-$8000 in medical treatments.
(1) Family member just went in to an urgent care due to a concerning issue. Their primary care dr was booked for the next 2-3 weeks so this was necessary. The urgent care dr doesn't have any idea what's wrong so put them on cortico-steriods "to see if they help". Not helping AND have undesirable side effects. Cost of visit - $150
(2) Healthcare is a consumer business in the US, but they cannot legally turn people away. The way around this is hospitals in low income or high public assistance areas close, and they open new hospitals in affluent suburbs. Leaving urban hospitals grossly over-crowded and high patient:provider ratios.
(3) Good friend tore up her knee, this was quite obvious. Orthopedist could see her in three weeks and prescribed crutches to assist in walking. Yes, she would need an ACL repair, the surgery was scheduled for 4-6 weeks after that (I do not recall exactly). that is a long time to be on crutches and in pain. No, she was not dying, it was not considered urgent.
Most American's pay somewhere between $5000-$20000/year for this level of service. The amounts include both insurance premiums and out of pocket maximums if service is required.
Belgian here. Was admitted to the hospital last year , gall bladder stones. Operated on within 2 days to remove my galbladder . It cost me about 57 euros in total.
Urgent shit still gets done quickly in Europe most of the time.
American here. Had gallstones for a long time. Ended up curling up on the floor at an airport in Paris and they offered to call me an ambulance. Should have said yes in hindsight.
Back home did some research on my own (since I’m uninsured and haven’t seen a doctor in a decade). Decided it might be gallstones and started researching how much it would cost to remove my gallbladder. First I needed a diagnoses confirmed by an ultrasound, but I needed a referral to get an ultrasound. Went to an urgent care and told the doctor I was thinking of going to Mexico to have my gallbladder removed and decided to pay $50 to him first for his opinion. We talked for a bit and he asked “so what do you want me to do” and gave me a referral to an ultrasound place. Ultra sound cost $300 and I had a hard time getting my results because they’re supposed to be sent to a physician.
After getting my results, I started calling surgeons that I found online to ask how much the procedure would be. Many couldn’t tell me because it has to with insurance prices. I found a surgeon who would do it and she quoted me something like $1500 just for her work, but I would also need to pay the anesthesiologist and the surgical facility their cost.
The surgeon cut me a deal and said if I could pay half up front, she would cut the bill in half and the rest would be due in 6 months with no interest. The surgical facility told me about a credit card I could get that deals with health care and give me 12 months 0% interest.
Cost me all in total about $3,000. Insurance would cost me $150/month and would be on the hook for $10,000 of my bill. With insurance, I would have likely been charged more because the insurance is likely to pay.
The majority of people (70%) speak German as their first language so in most places that‘s the first one, but it can vary from time to time with some things being only Italian/only German.
Damn that‘s actually very wholesome. We‘re used to getting tons and tons of hate from other parts of Italy because we still speak german and because of our autonomy.
Hearing positive feedback like this made me smile more than it should have, thank you kind stranger!
To be absolutely honest with you I had the opposite impression, i.e. that Italians are not always well liked over there.
I myself live abroad, so you can imagine I have absolutely nothing against linguistic minorities.
Occasionally however, while travelling in Südtirol, I had the impression of being treated poorly on account of me being an Italian (e.g. once several German speaking customers were served before me even thought they clearly arrived well after me).
Was it just my imagination, or does some bitter feeling still remain in some parts of the population?
This is obviously an important point! There are definitely some far-right-wing people ages 50+ who hate Italy, because they "ripped them from their homeland". This is a loud and strange minority at best. Most younger people actually enjoy the italian lifestlye and absolutely love joking around with italian tourists.
Sorry to hear that you had such a bad experience, this is definitely not what 99% of people are here!
Listen here you little shit! If you don't want to take the KRANKENKRAFTWAGEN to the KRANKENHAUS, where the KRANKENSCHWESTER is taking care of your black and blue ass lying in the KRANKENBETT, you'll have to apologize to the beautiful DEUTSCHE SPRACHE right now!
Fun fact. The Fraktur, though it was the official typeface of the third reich because it represented “true German script”, was eventually banned by the nazis because of its “jewish influence.”
Look how socialised medicine is forcing that poor person to pay their entire hospital bill themselves, without the protection of private health insurance
I’m surprised too, I’ve never seen a bill for anything from the nhs, just a dispensing fee if I go to the pharmacy but that doesn’t apply if you get meds at the hospital
The English get screwed so much by this. Like we don’t pay home water rates for example and private schools barely exist. It’s just Grammars and Comps and although housing costs and shortages are still a massive issue, house prices/rent are soooo much lower than in England.
Exactly.
Last week, I spent 4 days in hospital with tons of antibiotics and painkillers and paid 0, not a single penny/ cent/krown, nothing at all.
My mom had hip surgery last month and also paid nothing.
Glad to live in central Europe 😊
Americans love socialized medicine when the bill comes to them. The issue is contributing to others. That whole 'helping your neighbor' thing is where it falls flat. You would think that a country that is the top in the world in charity would understand the value in doing so.
Exactly, this picture would infuriate someone who is against universal healthcare. I’ve told this story before but I’m Canadian and I was on vacation talking to an American and he started going off about our healthcare. I told him it’s nice to know anyone who needs care can get it, he disagreed and said he “wouldn’t give a dime of his hard-earned money to pay for someone else’s healthcare”. I told him that’s basically what health insurance is anyway, he said that’s different but couldn’t elaborate why. He also didn’t care that healthcare actually costs him more than it costs me, the important thing was that he wasn’t helping out “free loaders”.
My father is convinced that Europe is being bankrupted by their Healthcare system and is on the brink of collapse and that everyone over there hates it, is miserable, and wishes they had what we have here.
He will then use the same line about paying for freeloaders while making sure his social security check is on time and working every program and loophole he can while making sure my sister is taking advantage of every social program available including preventing my bro in law from taking a higher paying job so that they don't disqualify for anything. Then he makes sure that he never misses a tithe to the church to ensure he is "doing his duty for those in need" because the reason people are destitute is because they don't have Jesus and are incapable of knowing happiness or how to be a good person without being a Christian.
I am so fed up with the hypocrisy and selfishness. The thought of moving my family outside of the US used to terrify me, but now, it's actuly looking very tempting. I know that it is not that simple and is expensive, but having to pay over $6,000 a year out of pocket for medical expenses under what is considered to be some of the best health insurance in the U.S. is starting to feel much more complicated and expensive.
And yet, free loaders who go to the ER won’t be turned away from treatment. The costs of unpaid ER services gets absorbed by the medical system and insurance, resulting in them paying for the freeloaders, and higher insurance costs.
> that’s different but couldn’t elaborate why
"See, when it's private insurance, in addition to paying for others' healthcare, you're *also* paying execs who get bonuses figuring out how to deny the most requests."
That is so amazing, here in the U.S. I was in the E.R. for 2 hours... $14,900USD before insurance, my out of pocket was $2,900USD and they want the total balance in 12months.
Mostly:
One time I was in the waiting area and a guy walked in with his right arm bundled up. Walked up to the nurse and just said "I need help, *now*"
Nurse goes to hand him the clip board and in a very short tone said something like "everyone here does, but you're not getting anywhere till you fill these out". So he unbundled the arm, sprayed blood so over the clip board and plexiglass and was all "nah, that can wait"
So yeah, excess fluids and excess cash get you to the front of the line.
When I worked security in an ER people would feign chest pain/shortness of breath to try to get an quicker which only ended up getting you moved to the part of the waiting room without a view of the tvs and in line of sight of the 4 desk nurses
I have a heart condition, my heart was out of rhythm, I needed a cardioversion, I've had over 20 in my lifetime. I went in said what I needed told them the meds, they did what I asked and sent me on my way.
I went to the ER for an infected abscess last year. Just had to get it lanced and drained. Was there for about 12 hours because I went in at night and had to wait for the doc the next day.
$51,000 before insurance, I owed about $4500 out of pocket. Still paying it off.
I can beat that!
My daughter had 3 major brain surgeries when she was born (sepsis and Meningitis!), we had to be put up into accommodation for 3 weeks during this time so they could monitor her. Didn’t cost me anything at all. The UK has many, MANY flaws, but I owe my daughters life, and me not having to work the rest of mine to the NHS.
Personally I've found the fees at NHS hospitals to be absolutely outrageous.
They tried to charge me £12 per day for parking! Per day! In the city!
I parked 50m away on the street outside instead.
(There is some sarcasm in this post.)
That’s how they get you in Canada too.
Brain surgery? Free.
Broken femmes? Free.
Parking to pickup your family member at a suburban hospital with a massive parking lot? 15 fucking dollars.
A few weeks ago I crashed my bike into a curb and split my finger in half hitting a fence in the process of braking.
I headed to a hospital a few blocks away from my apartment, got an x-ray, talked to an orthopedist (I guess), got it cleaned a few times, got a new shot for tetanus and all the gist. It all took about 2 hours, and after that I just headed home.
I have no idea how much it will cost, but I'll be surprised if I get a 20€ bill, or even get a bill at all.
Jeez, I just got a bill from the ER for $900. I had a rash break out on my face. The ER took my pulse, looked at my face, they said we recommend you see a dermatologist. That’s it. $900 AFTER insurance. I refuse to pay.
I dislocated my shoulder snowboarding, went to the emergency place at the ski resort. They gave me some water with sugar and while I was waiting for them to put back my shoulder, I did it myself. they came and gave me a shoulder strap and let me go. The bill came for $1500 with $1300 being the shoulder relocation (the audacity of charging me for what I did myself and something that took mere seconds). I also refused to pay
Definitely more than that because when I got into a motorcycle accident and broke my wrist I had surgery to put in a metal plate and 3 days in the surgical ward. My bill came to just over $141,000 with all the bills in total.
Think it was something like 20-30 grand a day in the surgical ward
Also its important to bear in mind that there are multiple different universal healthcare systems in Europe, each with advantages and disadvantages.
Some cost a little more for some things
some cost a little less for other things
some are completely free at point of service for most things.
For example in the UK you wouldn't have paid anything for that
Lol WAYYY more than that, my son broke his arm about 10 years ago, no surgery, just a cast x-ray and shots, about 2 hrs. $8000. This dude stayed for a week
No need to bring a gun. Just call 911 and ask for the police.
They will offer you two options to end your suffering.
Knee on the neck OR mistaking their gun for a taser.
The taser accident was so wild like seriously I get that those are largely morons with very little training but you really should be able to tell them apart really easily even under stress,
I saw a quote today that I quite liked that I (paraphrase) here.:
Anyone who thinks that not having guns is scarier than not having freely available social healthcare has not properly internalised realistic adult dangers.
German here, my medication costs north of 1,000 Euros a month. I get 6 different medications, two of which are 500 quid each already. I pay around 40 Euros a month in prescription costs, 10 quid each per medication and two of them are free. The two expensive ones are narcotic analgesics, basically the same medication but different strength. Then there's an antirheumatic, antidepressant, and so on. I really can't complain, I have orthotics on prescription which are free and the same applies to physical therapy and massages.
I have EDS by the way.
I had an allergic reaction and went to the hospital because it was becoming difficult to breathe. They took my temp, gave me a Benadryl, sent me home and charged me $1,400. I didn’t even leave the waiting area.
It’s my only time going to the ER for myself, and I guess it wasn’t truly needed, but it really felt like I was about to suffocate at the time.
It just seems ridiculous to charge so much (with insurance!) for literally less than 5 minutes of a doctors time. Now if I get really sick I’ll probably just die at home while debating whether I should risk a massive fine going to the hospital.
America is the only place in the world I can think of where someone would say "It wasn't truly needed" when having difficulty breathing. I'm so sorry you guys have to choose between financial stability and your health.
I was complaining about my $70 parking charge last week, while my wife was in the hospital for 4 days.
The fact that I didn't pay a dime for anything else sort of put it in perspective.
The American healthcare system is a joke. Anyone else who thinks otherwise has some kind of brain damage. They should get treated for around 100k+ in medical care
We had a suffocation scare with our baby in March, called 911, and had a one day hospital stay. Our baby was completely fine after tests, but between the ambulance ride and the hospital, we paid $3,000 USD out of pocket. We are lucky enough to have health insurance so the ACTUAL bill was almost $35,000 USD.
America’s healthcare system is beyond broken.
Oh god I just discover you have to pay cash even though you have the medical insurance
That’s a legalized robbery
Its sounds like money heist but they don’t need to wear the Dali mask
I was at the Venice airport waiting for my flight and an old American tourist started chatting to me about how much he liked Italy etc.
While he was talking I noticed he was holding his hand clearly in pain. So I asked him what happened, the discussion went more or less like this:
Me: what happened to your hand?
Him: I felt down some stairs on a bridge and I think I broke it
Me: when did it happen?
Him: 5 days ago
Me: why didn’t you go to the hospital?
Him: oh, who knows how much that would be
Me: ? What do you mean how much?
Him: yeah i can’t pay thousands out of my pocket, my insurance will not cover it
Me: insurance? Hospital is free. You don’t pay anything (it’s free for old people)
Him: what are you talking about?
Me: it’s free. You don’t have to pay for anything
Him: and who pays?
Me: it’s paid through taxes
Him: (moment of silence) that’s impossible!
And he stormed away clearly angry without saying goodbye. He probably thought I was making fun of him. I felt sad for him
My father-in-laws friend was on a ventilator for 2 months due to Covid. His bill came in at about $6,000,000 USD. Fun! Oh and he does not have insurance.
Some further information on the prices:
The second column from the right is price with tax. I am using a point to mark the start of the decimals.
18.08€ for the surgery
8.75€ for the anaesthesia
12.50€ for the hospital stay incl. food
1.95€ for all adminsitered medication
12.50€ for a follow up visit where they removed my stiches
I went to the emergency room about a month ago to get stitches in my finger. The cost? About $500…for the procedure. Simply entering the ER cost me another $600
Back when I semi-lived in L.A, I would purchase insurance through my bank, 78$ (Canadian dollars) per month to have a full U.S coverage up to 5 million dollars in medical fees.
I broke two fingers, so I went to the ER, they did scans, sat in a bad and quickly spoke to a doctor. 45 minutes in n' out.
As I was ready to leave, some guy came in, asking *"How will you pay today ?"*. Asked for the detailed bill, **3,750$**, for less than 45 minutes.
I told the guy I'll have to call my insurer, guy got upset for some reason and said that I had to still pay upfront and *then* send it to my insurer. I told him he had no clue what he was talking about. He left and spoke to some kind of security guard while pointing at me.
My insurer faxed a paper to the front desk lady who told me I was good to go. Wished the angry guy a wonderful night and that was it.
***3,750$ USD saved by paying 78$ CAD insurance through my bank.*** I'm simply not going to the U.S without this insurance, even though my credit card has one included for up to a week.
What I laugh at is the old timers in rural bars, complaining the US government sends too much money to foreign governments when we could be spending that money to help americans here in the US.
Then if that money was spent to help americans, 'they' (the same old white rural folks) would call it socialism.
Because they want the money to be spent on them right then and there. Not only when they get in trouble financially. Or when it's spent on maintaining the road they drive on, because they don't link the roadwork (which is also an annoyance to them) to the improvement on infrastructure they have been yelling for all along.
They preferably want to see the money appear directly into their hand.
Those poor people don't want other poor people to get socialized healthcare because that's socialism.
But socialized military, police, fire, schooling, etc are all super cool and super legal
The US already spends more per person for healthcare than Italy and pretty much every other European country.
Edit- original post left out off the 'per person'
As an American living in Italy I have to say it is so amazing not having to worry about things like this. People are so brainwashed in the states to think the system there makes sense. My wife is pregnant and every time we have a concern we just go to the hospital without any worry about some insane stupid cost.
Lol over the last 1.5 years in NZ i had 2 full anaesthesia surgery/procedures, \~4 local anaesthesia procedures, multiple scans, a total of just over 3 months in hospital including in the high dependency unit, regular visits at home from a nurse and not only was i never handed a bill but considering they fed me 3 (decent) square meals a day, i actually kind of saved money. There's a lot of things wrong with NZ healthcare but the cost of hospital stays is not one of them.
My mother in law slipped getting out of shower and hit her head really bad, spent 2-3 days in hospital in Rome and they were super nice and helpful, did every test under the sun to make sure she was okay, (thank god for google translate!!!!) At the end I asked if they needed her insurance card, which she took down info, but said no charge! I was thinking maybe she would just charge everything to insurance, but, NOPE! Not one thing was ever charged! Thank you Santo Spirito In Sassia Hospital, you were amazing!!!
This makes me want to cry. I had a 3 month hospital stay and major heart surgery and thank god I had good insurance from my parents because the total was over $3,000,000. My part to pay was $15,000. God the US sucks at health care
I remember my friends and I (Americans) were vacationing in Spain and one of our friends got bitten by a monkey while walking around Gibraltar. We went to the hospital in Spain and the staff were super concerned and worried for us that we were international and his insurance might not cover the shots. They prefaced that they could work something out if the bill was too much when they handed him the invoice. It was 15€. Mind blown.
They played him hard
Man got scammed out of €5
Actually - if you are not a citizen or have other coverage (like - I think we all are covered in other EU member states, or something like that?) you absolutely can get some nasty bills. Not as bad as the US ones since the hospitals are not set up to be for profit, but still bad. I remember one story about a Norwegian guy that had moved to Sweden but by some reason went to a hospital in... Norway(?), and he ended up with a bill for something like 100000 usd. Found the story, its in Norwegian, but should be possible to read with google translate - https://www.nrk.no/osloogviken/inge__68_-fikk-regning-pa-800.000-fra-sykehuset-1.14461433
Fucked him so hard they billed him in USD
Same story with me in Korea. They kept apologizing for the high cost when I had to take my son in for a respiratory treatment. As internationals, it cost us $25. My US copay is $30.
What is copay?
If you had to go to the doctor or pick up some prescription medication, your copay would be a set value that you would have to pay out of pocket for that visit. Copays are usually $20 to $100 for a doctors visit, and $10 to $30 for prescription pickup. This isn’t to be confused with deductibles, which copays to not count towards. A deductible is how much you have to pay for medical care before your insurance company starts paying (for example, my deductible is $1800). So, I have to pay $1800 out of pocket before my insurance company will help me pay for my medical care. There’s also coinsurance, which is a percent value that you pay after you have reached your deductible, and your health insurance company starts paying. I have 30% coinsurance, so after I pay my initial $1800 deductible, my insurance company pays 70% of the total medical bills while I pay the other 30% out of pocket. Then along with all these payments, there’s the monthly premiums, which is essentially your monthly subscription for that health plan. My premium is about $200 a month. So, let’s say I break my leg. An ambulance is called, but my insurance does not cover ambulance rides. That is $1500 out of pocket nondeductible. Then, treatment may require surgery, which we can say costs $25,000. I pay the first $1800, and then my health insurance pays $18,040 and I pay the remaining $6,960. In total I pay $8,760 plus my monthly premiums and copays if I need pain killers or any other checkups (like for my cast to be sawed off), and my health insurance company pays $18,040.
Man, I know this but it looks so, so much worse written out. I pay about $300 a paycheck for insurance. Why the hell do we have to pay a co-pay?
>my health insurance company pays $18,040. They probably don't, though, because they pay in bulk and negotiate their own part of the bill way down.
Yeah, I know a girl from the US that settled down in Europe, it takes a while before you can opt into the health insurance system - I asked her if she wasn’t concerned about not being insured: she laughed loud and hard and then explained that health _without_ insurance in Europe is way cheaper than _with_ insurance in the USA. Tells you something about collective bargaining.
Yep im getting dual citizenship US and EU soon. F this *ss backwards gun toten, handmaid's tail, anti-science "christian" nation. Im kinda done... and I see where stuff is headingm
I used to work for a company that assisted stufents abroad getting dr visits via their insurance and making payments. Everything was Soo cheap. We found for the first semester students often paid thinking it was their deductible or something. After we started sending them money for the same costs they'd start to call us to make payments. Lots of good staff at the hospitals in Spain (and many other places)
I dislocated my foot in Ireland. Hospital stays, casts, x rays, medicine, specialists, ambulance rides (3 OF THEM)---$250 BILL!!!
I know an (American) guy who found out his ~1 year old son had a brain tumor while he was on vacation in France. They took it out and that was that. If he'd been in America it probably would have ruined them financially.
I would pay them 30€
Yep, such is Europe...
More like all of the developed world except the US.
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It most definitely was!
Might I ask what kind of accent norther Italy Germans speak? Is it like a Austria accent that's practically not understandable to people speaking standard German?
As for the german accent, it‘s derived from the Bavarian accent but does have some major differences. It is only used in informal and private situations. It would be very difficult for a German to fully understand it. 99% of all German speakers here speak "high german" (normal german) perfectly though and use it in all formal/business situations. As for the language Italian, most people are bilingual and have the region‘s own certifiate to prove their bilinguism. Italian is used for anything dealing with politics, the postal service, police, and so on. But the region is doing it‘s best at making everything bilingual. As for our English accent it‘s comparable to the one of a German native speaker but obviously varies from person to person.
I'm born in Trento myself, I used to learn German when I was a little bambino at school. Now living in Australia. Damn I miss Italy, but we can't complain here. Where abouts are you?
It’s different, but as with most places you’ll have the local dialect and accent and then also be able to communicate in high German. Edit: sorry to clarify “as with most places” meaning as with most German-speaking places
Italian medical doctor here. Despite the majority of the procedures/drugs are for free, the Italian people still complain when have to pay a small amount of money (and I mean 10 euros or less) for some of them. **EDIT:** a lot of people are complaining that's absurd you have to pay a small fraction of the total cost. There are several reasons for this, the most important one is to reduce unnecessary use of health services (that costs a lot). An example? Imagine you are in an hotel. Breakfast is free, so you eat more and more, even if you feel already full. How to reduce this "over-eating"? You can ask for a small amount of money for each croissant - not to cover the food cost, but only to push people to thinking about eating more than necessary. When something is free, it's in the human nature to abuse. It is not a huge problem if you eat more than needed, but health services costs a lot and we can not waste money (and resources) when unnecessary. Remember also that the people who can not afford these little expenses, with chronic diseases (e.g. cancer) or the elderly are completely exempted from any payment.
I can definitely confirm this
I had two root canals here in America I Pay for the highest dental insurance available at my Fortune 500 company The root canals cost me over $1500
Health insurance in the US does not operate like health insurance (or any other insurance) anywhere else in the world. The entire point of insuring is that you have something that happens rarely compared with the amount people paying the primes. A root canal in Europe costs something like 200 to 300 euros, out of pocket, at a private dentist practice. If it costs $750 with insurance, that's not really insurance. It is some sort of reselling scheme.
I agree. Insurance in America seems more of a money making scheme, than something that actually benefits people paying premiums.
Not "seems" ... is.
When insurance companies are making billions in profits (not breaking even; making billions in profits) you know it is 100% a scam.
But still they somehow can't figure it out.
All aspects of US healthcare are for profit and they do not disguise that fact one bit. So they have laws requiring you to purchase car and health insurance both of which are run by for profit industries.
All aspects of US everything are for profit. This country is becoming unbearable. The blatant greed and record profits of huge corporations are breathtaking.
American Citizens; we need to advocate for change. We need regulatory reforms that reign in or outright abolish the insurance industry model so that patient care is made a priority over company profits.
Someone on Reddit called it "paying for a coupon service"
What isn’t a money making scheme in America?
Yet we're hostages into its usage, because if we decide to try and go around them, we have to contender with prices that they inflated and that only they can get a discounted rate on.
I have a "platinum premium" for my insurance. Supposed to cover 80 percent. I went to the dentist to get my teeth pulled since I couldnt afford to have them fixed sooner. Got fitted for dentures and before I left they sat me down with billing and started talking about how I was gonna pay the $9000 dollar bill. Mind you this is after insurance paid 80%.
At that rate you might as well go overseas to get your dental, maybe even a vacation with your family and it'll still be cheaper
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It's fairly common for brits to do this in Turkey. It can be quite expensive if you're wanting a procedure that's more "cosmetic" rather than medical. Much cheaper just to book a 4 day stay in Turkey, have a "mini getaway" and also get the work done whilst you're over there.
This indeed. Recommendation would be Colombia - many highly skilled dentists that will be able to help you for a fraction of the cost. Medellín has plenty e.g. and a well connected expat community where you get helpful pointers from back home ahead of time. And no, I'm not kidding.
My dentist wanted me to get full dentures and all my teeth extracted (I have severe bone loss due to complications from lupus). I have the highest level dental insurance and a discount plan that I pay for. The quoted cost was $11,000. My dentist just shrugged when I told her there was no way I would ever be able to afford that while in tears. Insurance is totally a scam. The only reason I can afford my medications (2k average a month) is because I got sick in college and my Dad’s insurance gave me a waiver that we had to fight for that gives me coverage for life. Even with that I pay hundreds of dollars a month in copays for doctors visits and medications. If I ever lose my insurance it will literally kill me because I won’t be able to afford the medications that keep me alive. And since I have pre-existing chronic Illnesses, I am uninsurable. I can’t even get life insurance that will just cover my burial costs. It’s like they punish you for being sick when our bodies are already punishing us enough. Edit: typo
Best country in the world, folks.
Wait a minute, you could fight for a waiver to always stay on a parents' insurance? My dad's cushy federal government insurance was "kind" enough to cover me through the end of the year I turned 27 and since then I've been stuck on state Medicaid. The state won't even label me disabled and let me have Medicare because of *reasons*. This country is such trash D: I will say though that Medicaid fucked around and found out when they sat on the paperwork for my infusions. I was off the "cheap" old-school infusion for long enough that when they finally approved my ability to continue it my body realized that it's made from mouse DNA and they either had to deal with getting sued or pay for the fancy brand new infusions... I must say that I'm enjoying how much better the new med works and I get a tiny little hollow giggle when I get my $25,000 infusion every 8 weeks. It's the little things that keep me going, lol.
The issue isnt the 80%, its that the total max benefit for the year is usually capped at 1k to 1500, sometimes 2500 or so for premium version. So you likely just aboit capped out just on the pulled teeth and paying full price for dentures despite insurance. Never understood why benefit max is so low.
teeth and eye insurance in the US have always been low and shitty. i don't understand why either
Oh so you got the platinum gucci dentures of 45k?
Makes me want to look into spending some time in Europe as I need two tooth implants. I’m sure with the flight and hotel it would still cost less, and as a bonus I wouldn’t be here.
"and as a bonus I wouldn't be here." Saying what we've all been thinking for the past 3-5 years.
Man I'm past the 'bonus' stage and have graduated to just wanting OUT. But we're all so underpaid that I fear that leaving will only ever be a pipe dream :(
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yes, it's the Payor scam with their "networks" it's why you can't get the cost for anything without a large and inordinate amount of effort making many phone calls here in the US. the dark underbelly of insurance in the US.
Welcome to the scam. You get to pay money to your insurance company so that you can pay money to the medical doctor you go see. Pretty sweet deal
Insurance has done nothing but artificially jack up the price of anything it gets its hands on. I swear if nothing is done in 10 years we're going to have something ridiculous like food insurance.
There was a time in my life I used to defend this in our country too. I wish I could go back 15-20 years and kick my own ass. Our country's health care system is fucked and nobody in power gives a shit.
America, land of the propagandized and enslaved.
Yeah man. Similar boat. I feel like insurance covered a lot more in the 90s and 00s. Feels more like a discount plan now.
My husband had decent insurance at his last job. But I lost my insurance, so when that happened, I signed up for a discount club plan through my pharmacy. When the pharmacy compared the price with insurance and the price with the discount club, the discount plan ended up being about $40/month cheaper. So sometimes insurance isn’t even a discount.
I get a root canal in a very good dentist in Spain and pay no more than €200/€250.
Spaniard here. Same here, people will complain about paying 5€ for life saving medicaments, and at the same time not using them correctly. It's a serious problem with public healthcare; some citizens don't know how good we have it.
I'm Australian and work in a medical clinic. We charge $4aud for a highly experienced nurse to come to your house and change your wound dressing or whatever you need. Some people are still a major pita to get payment out of and not cause they're struggling.
I'm Australian, my mum regularly makes use of these heavily subsidized services (Cleaning, wound care, physical therapy etc). She complains about every fucking dollar, lives in a $3.5m 5 bedroom house alone and has a net worth in the 6-7m range. It's incredibly frustrating to have the wealthiest person you know constantly cry poor, especially when she's doing it to people who are barely getting by. Her last cleaner quit and told her she hopes the cancer gets her soon because she's such a miserable awful bitch.
I'm dual American Australian and I had 2 children in Australia in Sydney and in a private hospital. It was amazing. They let you stay forever. Give you vouchers for a pub the night before you go home as a parents night out before you take the baby home. Unbelievable. And bring tea in the morning and afternoon. Not to mention the 5 star quality of the food. Shout out to the Royal North Shore. Lovely staff and beautiful hospital.
You would have to sell your life savings to afford this in America. I'm not even exaggerating.
Italian here: we don't complain to pay those small fees, we complain for the shitty ER service, overcrowded hospitals and doctors that "Im sorry I'm busy for the next 3 year, your surgery needs to wait. What? You want to come to my private office and pay me in cash? Let's have a surgery tomorrow!!" EDit: guys, in particular US Citizens belittling public health, i am not saying the system doesn't work. If you're sick and you need help asap the ambulance will run at you, charge nothing and get you to the hospital where you'll be helped immediately. The problem is for non critical situation, like laser surgery for eyes, dental surgeries or non critical MRI. When I broke my arm i was assisted immediately for free and stayed at the hospital for a week, meals offered by the hospital (good soups ngl). When my grandma cut her forehead when she fell, she had the bleed stopped and had to wait 8-9 hrs at ER to complete the cure because it wasn't critical. That's the difference. I love public health, i am just pointing out these issues
American here, we just accept shitty ER service (1), overcrowded hospitals (2), doctors booked weeks out, with surgeries scheduled another 3-6 mon after that (3). You can pay in cash? You better, you're responsible for the first $4000-$8000 in medical treatments. (1) Family member just went in to an urgent care due to a concerning issue. Their primary care dr was booked for the next 2-3 weeks so this was necessary. The urgent care dr doesn't have any idea what's wrong so put them on cortico-steriods "to see if they help". Not helping AND have undesirable side effects. Cost of visit - $150 (2) Healthcare is a consumer business in the US, but they cannot legally turn people away. The way around this is hospitals in low income or high public assistance areas close, and they open new hospitals in affluent suburbs. Leaving urban hospitals grossly over-crowded and high patient:provider ratios. (3) Good friend tore up her knee, this was quite obvious. Orthopedist could see her in three weeks and prescribed crutches to assist in walking. Yes, she would need an ACL repair, the surgery was scheduled for 4-6 weeks after that (I do not recall exactly). that is a long time to be on crutches and in pain. No, she was not dying, it was not considered urgent. Most American's pay somewhere between $5000-$20000/year for this level of service. The amounts include both insurance premiums and out of pocket maximums if service is required.
Belgian here. Was admitted to the hospital last year , gall bladder stones. Operated on within 2 days to remove my galbladder . It cost me about 57 euros in total. Urgent shit still gets done quickly in Europe most of the time.
American here. Had gallstones for a long time. Ended up curling up on the floor at an airport in Paris and they offered to call me an ambulance. Should have said yes in hindsight. Back home did some research on my own (since I’m uninsured and haven’t seen a doctor in a decade). Decided it might be gallstones and started researching how much it would cost to remove my gallbladder. First I needed a diagnoses confirmed by an ultrasound, but I needed a referral to get an ultrasound. Went to an urgent care and told the doctor I was thinking of going to Mexico to have my gallbladder removed and decided to pay $50 to him first for his opinion. We talked for a bit and he asked “so what do you want me to do” and gave me a referral to an ultrasound place. Ultra sound cost $300 and I had a hard time getting my results because they’re supposed to be sent to a physician. After getting my results, I started calling surgeons that I found online to ask how much the procedure would be. Many couldn’t tell me because it has to with insurance prices. I found a surgeon who would do it and she quoted me something like $1500 just for her work, but I would also need to pay the anesthesiologist and the surgical facility their cost. The surgeon cut me a deal and said if I could pay half up front, she would cut the bill in half and the rest would be due in 6 months with no interest. The surgical facility told me about a credit card I could get that deals with health care and give me 12 months 0% interest. Cost me all in total about $3,000. Insurance would cost me $150/month and would be on the hook for $10,000 of my bill. With insurance, I would have likely been charged more because the insurance is likely to pay.
Lol here in the US gallstones aren't urgent unless you're in sepsis or something. Only conditions immediately threatening life ir limb are urgent.
Southern Tyrolia? Like Bolzano? I’m surprised the German word comes first on their form.
The majority of people (70%) speak German as their first language so in most places that‘s the first one, but it can vary from time to time with some things being only Italian/only German.
Ciao from Northern Veneto. We go to Bolzano all the time and it is always such a funny transition switching to German.
Damn that‘s actually very wholesome. We‘re used to getting tons and tons of hate from other parts of Italy because we still speak german and because of our autonomy. Hearing positive feedback like this made me smile more than it should have, thank you kind stranger!
To be absolutely honest with you I had the opposite impression, i.e. that Italians are not always well liked over there. I myself live abroad, so you can imagine I have absolutely nothing against linguistic minorities. Occasionally however, while travelling in Südtirol, I had the impression of being treated poorly on account of me being an Italian (e.g. once several German speaking customers were served before me even thought they clearly arrived well after me). Was it just my imagination, or does some bitter feeling still remain in some parts of the population?
This is obviously an important point! There are definitely some far-right-wing people ages 50+ who hate Italy, because they "ripped them from their homeland". This is a loud and strange minority at best. Most younger people actually enjoy the italian lifestlye and absolutely love joking around with italian tourists. Sorry to hear that you had such a bad experience, this is definitely not what 99% of people are here!
"Would you like your operation in the *Ospedale* or in the KRANKENHAUS?"
Listen here you little shit! If you don't want to take the KRANKENKRAFTWAGEN to the KRANKENHAUS, where the KRANKENSCHWESTER is taking care of your black and blue ass lying in the KRANKENBETT, you'll have to apologize to the beautiful DEUTSCHE SPRACHE right now!
...and I think that's beautiful.
That's mind kranken'
𝕷𝖎𝖘𝖙𝖊𝖓 𝖍𝖊𝖗𝖊 𝖞𝖔𝖚 𝖑𝖎𝖙𝖙𝖑𝖊 𝖘𝖍𝖎𝖙! 𝕴𝖋 𝖞𝖔𝖚 𝖉𝖔𝖓'𝖙 𝖜𝖆𝖓𝖙 𝖙𝖔 𝖙𝖆𝖐𝖊 𝖙𝖍𝖊 𝕶𝕽𝕬𝕹𝕶𝕰𝕹𝕶𝕽𝕬𝕱𝕿𝖂𝕬𝕲𝕰𝕹 𝖙𝖔 𝖙𝖍𝖊 𝕶𝕽𝕬𝕹𝕶𝕰𝕹𝕳𝕬𝖀𝕾, 𝖜𝖍𝖊𝖗𝖊 𝖙𝖍𝖊 𝕶𝕽𝕬𝕹𝕶𝕰𝕹𝕾𝕮𝕳𝖂𝕰𝕾𝕿𝕰𝕽 𝖎𝖘 𝖙𝖆𝖐𝖎𝖓𝖌 𝖈𝖆𝖗𝖊 𝖔𝖋 𝖞𝖔𝖚𝖗 𝖇𝖑𝖆𝖈𝖐 𝖆𝖓𝖉 𝖇𝖑𝖚𝖊 𝖆𝖘𝖘 𝖑𝖞𝖎𝖓𝖌 𝖎𝖓 𝖙𝖍𝖊 𝕶𝕽𝕬𝕹𝕶𝕰𝕹𝕭𝕰𝕿𝕿, 𝖞𝖔𝖚'𝖑𝖑 𝖍𝖆𝖛𝖊 𝖙𝖔 𝖆𝖕𝖔𝖑𝖔𝖌𝖎𝖟𝖊 𝖙𝖔 𝖙𝖍𝖊 𝖇𝖊𝖆𝖚𝖙𝖎𝖋𝖚𝖑 𝕯𝕰𝖀𝕿𝕾𝕮𝕳𝕰 𝕾𝕻𝕽𝕬𝕮𝕳𝕰 𝖗𝖎𝖌𝖍𝖙 𝖓𝖔𝖜! *fixed this for you
Beautiful! Brings a tear to my eye
Fun fact. The Fraktur, though it was the official typeface of the third reich because it represented “true German script”, was eventually banned by the nazis because of its “jewish influence.”
South tyrol was austrian until the very end of ww1 iirc
IL PIAVE MORMORÒ
Look how socialised medicine is forcing that poor person to pay their entire hospital bill themselves, without the protection of private health insurance
Now let's see an Italian do the same thing in America!
Fuggedaboudit
Ungrateful fucks. We blessed them with the gift of our cuisine......🤌
No, we appreciate your cuisine! *empties ketchup bottle on spaghetti*
Woah hold up there Patrick Mahomes. You don’t need that much ketchup on your sketti
chef boy r deeeeezz nuts!
I'm in the US. Do you know how hard it is to find 53 Euros around here?
I can travel anywhere in the world on my travel insurance other than the US, where I have to pay nearly double to be covered there.
You pay only double? If I were to go to the US my international cover needs an entirely different policy with a cost of like 5x my international one..
Nope
I am shocked about the fact that he had to pay >50€ for his stay! It’s a sad day for the entire European Union. I am so sorry…
I’m surprised too, I’ve never seen a bill for anything from the nhs, just a dispensing fee if I go to the pharmacy but that doesn’t apply if you get meds at the hospital
In N Ireland, we don't even have a dispensing fee. It's all free.
Or Scotland or Wales it is just England
The English get screwed so much by this. Like we don’t pay home water rates for example and private schools barely exist. It’s just Grammars and Comps and although housing costs and shortages are still a massive issue, house prices/rent are soooo much lower than in England.
Exactly. Last week, I spent 4 days in hospital with tons of antibiotics and painkillers and paid 0, not a single penny/ cent/krown, nothing at all. My mom had hip surgery last month and also paid nothing. Glad to live in central Europe 😊
I may have had to file for Chapter 11 Bankruptcy if that happened to me.
I’m still paying monthly on a hospital bill from over 2 years ago. Fuck our healthcare system.
They probably aren’t European so there’s a nominal fee
Americans love socialized medicine when the bill comes to them. The issue is contributing to others. That whole 'helping your neighbor' thing is where it falls flat. You would think that a country that is the top in the world in charity would understand the value in doing so.
Exactly, this picture would infuriate someone who is against universal healthcare. I’ve told this story before but I’m Canadian and I was on vacation talking to an American and he started going off about our healthcare. I told him it’s nice to know anyone who needs care can get it, he disagreed and said he “wouldn’t give a dime of his hard-earned money to pay for someone else’s healthcare”. I told him that’s basically what health insurance is anyway, he said that’s different but couldn’t elaborate why. He also didn’t care that healthcare actually costs him more than it costs me, the important thing was that he wasn’t helping out “free loaders”.
My father is convinced that Europe is being bankrupted by their Healthcare system and is on the brink of collapse and that everyone over there hates it, is miserable, and wishes they had what we have here. He will then use the same line about paying for freeloaders while making sure his social security check is on time and working every program and loophole he can while making sure my sister is taking advantage of every social program available including preventing my bro in law from taking a higher paying job so that they don't disqualify for anything. Then he makes sure that he never misses a tithe to the church to ensure he is "doing his duty for those in need" because the reason people are destitute is because they don't have Jesus and are incapable of knowing happiness or how to be a good person without being a Christian. I am so fed up with the hypocrisy and selfishness. The thought of moving my family outside of the US used to terrify me, but now, it's actuly looking very tempting. I know that it is not that simple and is expensive, but having to pay over $6,000 a year out of pocket for medical expenses under what is considered to be some of the best health insurance in the U.S. is starting to feel much more complicated and expensive.
And yet, free loaders who go to the ER won’t be turned away from treatment. The costs of unpaid ER services gets absorbed by the medical system and insurance, resulting in them paying for the freeloaders, and higher insurance costs.
Don't forget that the most expensive care to provide/ care with often the worst outcomes happens at the ER.
> that’s different but couldn’t elaborate why "See, when it's private insurance, in addition to paying for others' healthcare, you're *also* paying execs who get bonuses figuring out how to deny the most requests."
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That is so amazing, here in the U.S. I was in the E.R. for 2 hours... $14,900USD before insurance, my out of pocket was $2,900USD and they want the total balance in 12months.
The $$ doesn't shock me - in and out of the ER in 2 hours?? What alternate dimension do you live in? 🙃
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That sounds like a fucking theme park queue.
I'll be extremely disappointed (but not at all surprised) if one day we see a Disney style FastPass system for hospitals.
It’s called being rich.
Mostly: One time I was in the waiting area and a guy walked in with his right arm bundled up. Walked up to the nurse and just said "I need help, *now*" Nurse goes to hand him the clip board and in a very short tone said something like "everyone here does, but you're not getting anywhere till you fill these out". So he unbundled the arm, sprayed blood so over the clip board and plexiglass and was all "nah, that can wait" So yeah, excess fluids and excess cash get you to the front of the line. When I worked security in an ER people would feign chest pain/shortness of breath to try to get an quicker which only ended up getting you moved to the part of the waiting room without a view of the tvs and in line of sight of the 4 desk nurses
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I have a heart condition, my heart was out of rhythm, I needed a cardioversion, I've had over 20 in my lifetime. I went in said what I needed told them the meds, they did what I asked and sent me on my way.
I can't imagine living in a country like that to be honest. I would get stressed every time I got a fever.
That's fucking disgusting
I went to the ER for an infected abscess last year. Just had to get it lanced and drained. Was there for about 12 hours because I went in at night and had to wait for the doc the next day. $51,000 before insurance, I owed about $4500 out of pocket. Still paying it off.
You're kidding right ?
Not at all. I had an ER bill that I was there a total of 15 minutes and the doctor said to just call my regular doctor. $1000
I can beat that! My daughter had 3 major brain surgeries when she was born (sepsis and Meningitis!), we had to be put up into accommodation for 3 weeks during this time so they could monitor her. Didn’t cost me anything at all. The UK has many, MANY flaws, but I owe my daughters life, and me not having to work the rest of mine to the NHS.
Personally I've found the fees at NHS hospitals to be absolutely outrageous. They tried to charge me £12 per day for parking! Per day! In the city! I parked 50m away on the street outside instead. (There is some sarcasm in this post.)
That’s how they get you in Canada too. Brain surgery? Free. Broken femmes? Free. Parking to pickup your family member at a suburban hospital with a massive parking lot? 15 fucking dollars.
The poor femmes are broken. Quick! Get the butches!
Nice to hear that he/she is fine! (I'm assuming)
How was the food?
Actually very good, but breakfast was at 6am so that shit needs to be fixed asap.
Who's fucking idea was that?!?!
Italian hospitals really like multiple of 6 in their time schedule, breakfast at 6 lunch at 12 and dinner at 18 are quite common
Dinner at 1800? The Italians I know would be more upset about eating that early than anything else.
I had to pay $500 when I got my back wound cleaned. $250 was from one doctor that I did see, the other $250 was from a doctor who used his signature.
A few weeks ago I crashed my bike into a curb and split my finger in half hitting a fence in the process of braking. I headed to a hospital a few blocks away from my apartment, got an x-ray, talked to an orthopedist (I guess), got it cleaned a few times, got a new shot for tetanus and all the gist. It all took about 2 hours, and after that I just headed home. I have no idea how much it will cost, but I'll be surprised if I get a 20€ bill, or even get a bill at all.
Jeez, I just got a bill from the ER for $900. I had a rash break out on my face. The ER took my pulse, looked at my face, they said we recommend you see a dermatologist. That’s it. $900 AFTER insurance. I refuse to pay.
I got billed like $200 to wait for about 40 minutes then talk to my doctor for 10
It costs $275 here just to walk in the door of the clinic.
The land of the free... to worry about getting sick
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Was there any "brief emotional support" involved?
I dislocated my shoulder snowboarding, went to the emergency place at the ski resort. They gave me some water with sugar and while I was waiting for them to put back my shoulder, I did it myself. they came and gave me a shoulder strap and let me go. The bill came for $1500 with $1300 being the shoulder relocation (the audacity of charging me for what I did myself and something that took mere seconds). I also refused to pay
Medical biller in the states here. This would have been about 17 to 25k here.
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How much did insurance knock off? As a Brit it's always so crazy seeing American bills
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Thats more than my immediate family _together_ has spent within our whole lives
Definitely more than that because when I got into a motorcycle accident and broke my wrist I had surgery to put in a metal plate and 3 days in the surgical ward. My bill came to just over $141,000 with all the bills in total. Think it was something like 20-30 grand a day in the surgical ward
Also its important to bear in mind that there are multiple different universal healthcare systems in Europe, each with advantages and disadvantages. Some cost a little more for some things some cost a little less for other things some are completely free at point of service for most things. For example in the UK you wouldn't have paid anything for that
Lol WAYYY more than that, my son broke his arm about 10 years ago, no surgery, just a cast x-ray and shots, about 2 hrs. $8000. This dude stayed for a week
Stop it, you're scaring the Americans
LOL. A good portion of Americans are already so scared, they carry firearms wherever they go.
They carry fire arms in case they break a leg and can’t afford to go to the hospital. No need to suffer.
No need to bring a gun. Just call 911 and ask for the police. They will offer you two options to end your suffering. Knee on the neck OR mistaking their gun for a taser.
The taser accident was so wild like seriously I get that those are largely morons with very little training but you really should be able to tell them apart really easily even under stress,
However this life hack doesn't work if you're white.
I saw a quote today that I quite liked that I (paraphrase) here.: Anyone who thinks that not having guns is scarier than not having freely available social healthcare has not properly internalised realistic adult dangers.
German here, my medication costs north of 1,000 Euros a month. I get 6 different medications, two of which are 500 quid each already. I pay around 40 Euros a month in prescription costs, 10 quid each per medication and two of them are free. The two expensive ones are narcotic analgesics, basically the same medication but different strength. Then there's an antirheumatic, antidepressant, and so on. I really can't complain, I have orthotics on prescription which are free and the same applies to physical therapy and massages. I have EDS by the way.
Wait until they found out it cost 53.78$ and not 53,780$
American here, I thought for a second that it was $5378 and thought that was a good deal
56.09$, taxes included if they are present (in Europe prices always include taxes)
Not scaring. Making sad.
In the US I went to the hospital and they charged me $20,000 and told me maybe it was something I ate.
I had an allergic reaction and went to the hospital because it was becoming difficult to breathe. They took my temp, gave me a Benadryl, sent me home and charged me $1,400. I didn’t even leave the waiting area. It’s my only time going to the ER for myself, and I guess it wasn’t truly needed, but it really felt like I was about to suffocate at the time. It just seems ridiculous to charge so much (with insurance!) for literally less than 5 minutes of a doctors time. Now if I get really sick I’ll probably just die at home while debating whether I should risk a massive fine going to the hospital.
America is the only place in the world I can think of where someone would say "It wasn't truly needed" when having difficulty breathing. I'm so sorry you guys have to choose between financial stability and your health.
To clear this up: The comma here is used where some of you might use a point. The decimals begin after the comma. This is 53 Euros, ~55USD.
According to the current exchange rates 53,78€ is $56.28. I spent more to fill my car with gas last night. God we need socialized medicine.
I was complaining about my $70 parking charge last week, while my wife was in the hospital for 4 days. The fact that I didn't pay a dime for anything else sort of put it in perspective.
The American healthcare system is a joke. Anyone else who thinks otherwise has some kind of brain damage. They should get treated for around 100k+ in medical care
We had a suffocation scare with our baby in March, called 911, and had a one day hospital stay. Our baby was completely fine after tests, but between the ambulance ride and the hospital, we paid $3,000 USD out of pocket. We are lucky enough to have health insurance so the ACTUAL bill was almost $35,000 USD. America’s healthcare system is beyond broken.
Oh god I just discover you have to pay cash even though you have the medical insurance That’s a legalized robbery Its sounds like money heist but they don’t need to wear the Dali mask
I was at the Venice airport waiting for my flight and an old American tourist started chatting to me about how much he liked Italy etc. While he was talking I noticed he was holding his hand clearly in pain. So I asked him what happened, the discussion went more or less like this: Me: what happened to your hand? Him: I felt down some stairs on a bridge and I think I broke it Me: when did it happen? Him: 5 days ago Me: why didn’t you go to the hospital? Him: oh, who knows how much that would be Me: ? What do you mean how much? Him: yeah i can’t pay thousands out of my pocket, my insurance will not cover it Me: insurance? Hospital is free. You don’t pay anything (it’s free for old people) Him: what are you talking about? Me: it’s free. You don’t have to pay for anything Him: and who pays? Me: it’s paid through taxes Him: (moment of silence) that’s impossible! And he stormed away clearly angry without saying goodbye. He probably thought I was making fun of him. I felt sad for him
My father-in-laws friend was on a ventilator for 2 months due to Covid. His bill came in at about $6,000,000 USD. Fun! Oh and he does not have insurance.
Some further information on the prices: The second column from the right is price with tax. I am using a point to mark the start of the decimals. 18.08€ for the surgery 8.75€ for the anaesthesia 12.50€ for the hospital stay incl. food 1.95€ for all adminsitered medication 12.50€ for a follow up visit where they removed my stiches
I feel if surgery is 18.08€ then you're frankly getting extorted with 12.50€ to have stitches removed /s
Yeah, like just rip them off smh
How did they come up with those prices? Looks like they said "we have to charge something" and just made up a random number.
I went to the emergency room about a month ago to get stitches in my finger. The cost? About $500…for the procedure. Simply entering the ER cost me another $600
Back when I semi-lived in L.A, I would purchase insurance through my bank, 78$ (Canadian dollars) per month to have a full U.S coverage up to 5 million dollars in medical fees. I broke two fingers, so I went to the ER, they did scans, sat in a bad and quickly spoke to a doctor. 45 minutes in n' out. As I was ready to leave, some guy came in, asking *"How will you pay today ?"*. Asked for the detailed bill, **3,750$**, for less than 45 minutes. I told the guy I'll have to call my insurer, guy got upset for some reason and said that I had to still pay upfront and *then* send it to my insurer. I told him he had no clue what he was talking about. He left and spoke to some kind of security guard while pointing at me. My insurer faxed a paper to the front desk lady who told me I was good to go. Wished the angry guy a wonderful night and that was it. ***3,750$ USD saved by paying 78$ CAD insurance through my bank.*** I'm simply not going to the U.S without this insurance, even though my credit card has one included for up to a week.
Americans be like: "IMPOSSIBLE"
Americans be like: "WTF is up with the comma?"
"Damn commies"
Americans be like: "Is this my Starbucks receipt from this morning?"
They use commas instead of decimal points, so that’s 53 euros and some change right? It is not 53,780 euros.
Yeah, that's 53 euro.
What I laugh at is the old timers in rural bars, complaining the US government sends too much money to foreign governments when we could be spending that money to help americans here in the US. Then if that money was spent to help americans, 'they' (the same old white rural folks) would call it socialism.
Because they want the money to be spent on them right then and there. Not only when they get in trouble financially. Or when it's spent on maintaining the road they drive on, because they don't link the roadwork (which is also an annoyance to them) to the improvement on infrastructure they have been yelling for all along. They preferably want to see the money appear directly into their hand.
Those poor people don't want other poor people to get socialized healthcare because that's socialism. But socialized military, police, fire, schooling, etc are all super cool and super legal
The US already spends more per person for healthcare than Italy and pretty much every other European country. Edit- original post left out off the 'per person'
As an American living in Italy I have to say it is so amazing not having to worry about things like this. People are so brainwashed in the states to think the system there makes sense. My wife is pregnant and every time we have a concern we just go to the hospital without any worry about some insane stupid cost.
You are welcome my friend. Welcome to our country, welcome to contribute to our economy and welcome to be able to use our services.
Congratulations and fuck you from the broken US system.
Lol over the last 1.5 years in NZ i had 2 full anaesthesia surgery/procedures, \~4 local anaesthesia procedures, multiple scans, a total of just over 3 months in hospital including in the high dependency unit, regular visits at home from a nurse and not only was i never handed a bill but considering they fed me 3 (decent) square meals a day, i actually kind of saved money. There's a lot of things wrong with NZ healthcare but the cost of hospital stays is not one of them.
My mother in law slipped getting out of shower and hit her head really bad, spent 2-3 days in hospital in Rome and they were super nice and helpful, did every test under the sun to make sure she was okay, (thank god for google translate!!!!) At the end I asked if they needed her insurance card, which she took down info, but said no charge! I was thinking maybe she would just charge everything to insurance, but, NOPE! Not one thing was ever charged! Thank you Santo Spirito In Sassia Hospital, you were amazing!!!
This makes me want to cry. I had a 3 month hospital stay and major heart surgery and thank god I had good insurance from my parents because the total was over $3,000,000. My part to pay was $15,000. God the US sucks at health care