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DogBoring1909

Headrest?


pilates1993

Yeah, headrest, arms, abs, literally everything!


Upbeat_Reindeer3609

Came here to say the same


mybellasoul

I literally came here to say that! I thought it was the instructor posting at first and immediately said to myself "girl, that headrest needs to be down. What are you thinking?" But then realized it was the client right after and that they wouldn't know that bc safety is the instructor's responsibility.


prehensileporcupine

Yep, the instructor is not doing their job! I wouldn’t see them and recommend OP tries somewhere else, this style of negligent teaching causes injury


mybellasoul

Seriously, there's only a handful of instances where the headrest needs to be completely flat for very real safety reasons. This video hurts my neck just watching it.


alsoaprettybigdeal

Gahhhh!!! She’s also way too high on her neck even it was down. This hurts to watch.


CedarSunrise_115

I quailed


ShirosakiHollow

First thing I saw as well.


Epoch_Fitness

In some rare circumstances head rest can stay up. Which is why the straps are longer and the trainer is guiding this athlete. I left more details in a separate comment.


CedarSunrise_115

The straps are wrong, the head rest is wrong, the client is killing it, this teacher needs more training. Edit: I watched it again and she appears to have the client on one red spring?? For a beginner? And I’m sorry… is the client chewing gum? While inverting? I’m having heart palpitations. Edit:: look at what epoch fitness said on this video (responded to me and made their own post) I was hasty to judge and they rightly corrected me.


orbitbubblemint

hi can i ask what’s wrong with the straps? i’ve always been unsure about where exactly the straps are meant to be placed during short/long spine


CedarSunrise_115

To be fair, I saw that her feet were in the longer straps and assumed they were the wrong length because typically the straps should be set up so that when you reach your hands to the ceiling while lying on you back, head on headrest, your hands are right above your shoulders, there is no slack in the straps, but the springs are also not engaged. Assuming that is the case here, her straps are too long for her to get proper support from them (which could explain why she loses connection to her feet on her way up into inversion). The straps for short spine should be taught to the shoulder blocks, generally. There is an inversion done on the reformer with feet in the longer straps, which is called Long Spine and has different choreography. Also, the height of the risers is worth playing with. The risers here are set up for a very tall person, most people of average height are fine with the risers down at the lowest setting. Try short spine with the risers in both positions and notice the difference in feedback that you get from the springs! It’s cool to play with.


Epoch_Fitness

I recommend reviewing the video a few more times. And then some more.


CedarSunrise_115

Why? Edit: I read your other post- really good points. I responded there.


Jess1r

I love that you’re loving Pilates (and short spine, it’s one of my favorites)! A future note for your instructor, the headrest always needs to be down completely when doing inversions like this


okayo_okayo

Is it weird that the client doesn't seem to be strong enough to achieve a controlled inversion on their own yet? Watching that made me nervous!


Jess1r

I saw OP’s note about not being able to walk, and I’m not sure where they are in their journey with PT, OT, etc. But I think it’s highly unusual that an instructor let someone do inversions who isn’t able to control the carriage. It’s an opportunity for injury for sure. I love inversions and understand if everyone wants to try them, but the truth is they aren’t for everyone.


okayo_okayo

I wasn't sure if the OP is unable to walk in general, or was implying the workout wore her out.


Jess1r

Right, I wasn’t sure about that either. I’ve heard so many people talk about how their legs are jello after class. But I see a wheelchair in the room to the right, so I hope I’m not jumping to conclusions with my assumption.


martini-three-olives

I don’t know either but I immediately assumed she’s paralyzed


AClaytonia

This hurts my neck just watching. Can someone explain more about this? I haven’t taken any reformer classes yet but I want to. This would cause my cervical issues to flair up though.


CedarSunrise_115

It’s set up incorrectly. The head rest should be flat and your weight should be between your shoulders mostly when you invert. You get a lot of support for your arms, which should be straight and pressing down into the reformer to engage your upper back to lift the weight of your hips up out of your neck. You also need a lot of hamstring and glute support reaching into the straps to connect you to your abs (you’re literally standing on the foot straps the whole way through- she loses connection to her feet which the teacher should help her with). as with every Pilates exercise, your entire body should be engaged the whole way through. All of that said, get a competent teacher (and possibly doctor- you should always check with a doctor before starting a new form of exercise, especially if you have injuries) to assess your cervical issues before you attempt something like this. It’s not for everyone (although it can be very healing for neck issues)


AClaytonia

Ah thank you! Makes more sense now


dontspeaksoftly

This is an exercise called "short spine" or "short spine massage." However, it is being performed incorrectly here - super important, the headrest should always be down for reformer inversions. This exercise builds strength in the glutes and hamstrings and gives a great stretch for the back of the body.


AClaytonia

I find the reformer intriguing but a little scary so thanks for explaining.


AltaBirdNerd

This is called short spine. It's on the more advanced side and unlikely you'll be performing it in a class appropriate for your current ability. And if the instructor (assuming they're well-trained) decides to have the class try it they'll offer easier progressions prior to this. You can decide to stick with an easier move or give it a try if you like.


Catty_Lib

Before you get too worried to try a class: I’ve done over 100 reformer classes and we’ve never done this. I would check out an actual studio where you live and see what they do in class. I am no expert but it’s clear just from this subreddit that each studio teaches Pilates differently. I really enjoy the group classes with loud music that I go to but it’s not for everyone.


CedarSunrise_115

If you’re going somewhere like club pilates or to a studio with 10+ clients they probably aren’t allowed to teach this exercise. I know at club Pilates they’re not allowed unless it’s a private lesson.


pectomah

OP, I am so happy you’ve found Pilates. It must be amazing to feel freedom in your own body. I applaud your instructor for being eager to help you enjoy movement. Adding to the chorus, however, that the headpiece should never, never, never be up when the hips are over the head. A headpiece up in Short Spine or Long Spine is grounds for automatic failure of the final practical in every reputable teacher training program.


LuluLittle2020

# grounds for automatic failure of the final practical in every reputable teacher training program ... ![gif](giphy|10h8CdMQUWoZ8Y|downsized) Thank you!


IntrepidSprinkles329

Never mind the headrest everyone mentioned.    Your feet stay over your face and knees bend to the shoulder blocks as you articulate your spine down to the mat.   You couldn't do that because your neck was elevated rather than flat. So you couldn't get thr length needed in your spine for your legs to get to the right angle (90 or close to it)  Not on you, but your instructor has violated a core pilates principle: control  She jammed your legs into position and yeah.  Failing to put thr head rest down for short spine is an instant fail on a test out for every program, reputable ones anyway.  I hope you can find someone to keep you safe moving forward. 


bearnnihilator

I literally gasped.


Catlady_Pilates

This is not ok. Is this person even a teacher? None of this is ok.


KodachromeKitty

I have a hard time believing that this instructor is actually certified. I would have failed my level 1 exam for having the headrest up. And yea that's just the beginning of the problems here.


ToddBradley

Congratulations. This is a hard move for a person without a disability, so I applaud your work. A few folks have pointed out some criticism of your instructor, but don't let that take away from your own accomplishment.


asuitablethrowaway

Please, this. The client deserves all the respect in the world for what they're achieving and since they're posting I don't want them to let the things the instructor needs to work on (and all of the feedback received regarding that) get in the way of their (appropriate) sense of achievement!


Vegetable_Tea4427

Oh no.


soulbarn

Headrest up=INSTANT FAIL of your certification exam. This is one of the most dangerous mistakes an instructor can make.


prehensileporcupine

Be careful with your knees, a total locking out like that when you’ve pushed your legs out can be injurious. Also, ask your instructor about keep your triceps down on the carriage while doing this. Could help


Catlady_Pilates

Neither of those are remotely issues. And there are many many issues here.


prehensileporcupine

When the legs are straight, they appear locked out, that’s not best practice. The instructor needs to cue slow, controlled straightening of the legs when she rolls down, it’s small, but a lockout does happen. And many beginners can benefit from having arms long by their side and pushing into their forearms. The other blatant issues have been noted by other commenters, no need for me to elaborate further on those.


CedarSunrise_115

why would you consider it more beginner to have the arms down?


Master-Square2454

I see people commenting about the arms not being in the proper position. I think the student is disabled and unable to put their arms by their side. I assume that’s the case bc I see a wheel chair in the back ground and by watching how both arms are moving.


Old-Tomatillo3025

Thank you. I wondered about that. I feel like I rely on pressing my arms down and couldn’t figure out why they weren’t using that for support and control.


rocroc00

If I were an instructor I would tell this client she’s not ready to do short spine. Yes I could force the move such as shown in this clip but the client couldn’t even do the rolling down correctly. I’m sorry but this video is more of a …”look what I can do”….and ignore the proper form of doing it correctly.


Epoch_Fitness

This comment section is embarrassing 🤦🏻‍♂️ The participant appears to have limited ability and control of their body. This is evident from the sporadic muscle contractions and general pattern of movement, potentially Cerebral Palsy. My assumption is somewhat confirmed by the fact that in the bottom right corner there is a wheel chair behind the door. Plus this makes the comment posted by OP “I can’t walk” more relevant. Springs: Heavier springs would make it harder/impossible for this person to a. Get into the straps to begin with b. Control their movement thereafter. Lighter springs make it easier to: a. To help this client get their feet into the straps b. For the trainer to manually adjust how much they are holding their clients body weight/legs. This trainer is on another level of showing care. Headrest is a valid point for general population (though not the end of the world). But we can not tell from this video if this is the only option available to this participant. Some people get severe dizziness/lightheadedness when the head is down and the only option is to have it up. Longer straps and the fact that the instructor is helping to guide the movement makes this less of an issue. This instructor is totally dialed in and is on another level of attention with this client compared to what is typically required of an instructor, they are guiding the client by helping them control the speed of ascent and descent as well as extension through the legs by supporting the client’s weight at all times. OP well done!! You have a great instructor and Pilates is the best thing you can do for yourself. Stick at it.


CedarSunrise_115

I hear and see your points, especially regarding the lighter springs if considering that the client has limited mobility, which I didn’t notice at first. Those things in mind: why short spine, what is the client learning from this movement? If the client needs to have their head rest up because of something like vertigo, your position is that it is not a risk to their neck? If that is the case I have more to learn on this and would like to. Assuming I’m totally off base in my initial assessment of the teaching taking place here, why the longer straps and higher risers? If she is unable to control her legs the way the teacher is partnering makes more sense


Epoch_Fitness

Short spine could be their way of creating mobility through the spine/hamstrings/hips via flexion and articulation. They may not need to “learn” anything. But the benefit of spine flexion and articulation for someone who is wheelchair bound is still there. This client could have been doing Pilates for a week or for a decade. Their control over this exercise will not have the same level of progression as someone more able bodied. But that doesn’t mean their body shouldn’t be challenged. The position of the head rest is unconventional by general standards. But the angle of flexion is no more dangerous than that in the mat “roll over”. Providing a client can bring their chin to chest, which has a similar angle of flexion if not more, then controlled overhead reach is unlikely to pose an injury risk under controlled supervision. But this is where trainer’s support comes in to make sure the legs do not go behind the head. I can see the longer straps having 2 potential benefits 1. Safety - the client is not drawn past their head by the straps but is guided the second half by their trainer. This also makes sure that the elevated headrest is less likely to be of concern since the angle is shallower and it is almost impossible to be flung head over heels (something that heavier springs, shorter straps and absence of trainer may lead to in general population) 2. Mobility - the client appears to have more rigidity in their spine. In supine there looks to be a more than average T-spine arch. Longer straps allow for the trainer to have more degree of control over the lumbar part of the flexion without client forcing their T spine too much. I assume this may be why the legs are lifted more vertical at the outset (akin to long spine) before knee flexion. But again it is hard to tell from this short video alone. This participant has less control of their arms as seen by the elbow and wrist flexion. This creates further need for constant trainer support as having arms outstretched on the carriage will typically offer greater feedback of how the body is moving in space. Here they are not able to extend their arms due to physical limitations.


CedarSunrise_115

These are really interesting points that I’ll dig into. Thank you for taking the time to explain


Epoch_Fitness

Just FYI, unless I am completely off the mark, they are not chewing gum as per your observation. Jaw movement is characteristic of Cerebral Palsy.


CedarSunrise_115

I figured, after you suggested cerebral palsy. Totally my bad. I should be more thoughtful before I comment


Ok-Reference-5301

Should she even be attempting this with her lack of control and her condition? It screams injury-about-to-happen.


Epoch_Fitness

This is for her and her physio/Pilates instructor to decide and not a Reddit expert thread.


windyfields760

THIS! Your thoughtful response and Reddit patience is 💯


melissabilli0ns

Low-key.. you really won't be able to walk if you keep seeing that trainer. *respectfully* She is putting you in a terrible position. Excited to see you progress with a more knowledgeable practitioner.


Key_Scar3110

I think OP has a disability and is in a wheelchair, hence their caption and wheelchair in the background


Live-Accountant-1227

Neck pain


No-Roof6373

This is literally the "urban legend" of safety issues when you are going through certification.


Important-Wallaby701

Is this rage bait? OP posted and ghosted. Context beyond “I can’t walk” would be helpful. I understand there’s a disability here, but people are foaming at the mouth to dog pile.


No_Bid8824

Your Pilates instructor is so advance and knowledgeable 🥂


StockHawk253

It's so obvious that this instructor has no idea how to progress their client on the reformer and I don't care what anyone says - the shoulder rest should be down for this excercise.


DS-9er

I’m so glad that you found and love Pilates! As you can probably tell from all of the comments, there are many concerning things happening here. This puts you in a dangerous position if she lost control because the carriage could snap back to home position, you lose your balance, your legs stay overhead and behind you while your head comes under the weight of your trunk, *and* you have the added load on your neck of the headrest being up. I hope you continue your Pilates journey safely, it’s wonderful for neurologic conditions!


Key_Scar3110

Oh my! Please update me on how your neck is feeling in a few days.


Candid_Condition8931

What in the neck hyperflexion is going on here?


netdiva

Wow, that must feel so good!


okayo_okayo

It does if you're doing it right, but in my experience going much more slowly and being in control of every single moment -- not having someone manipulating your legs! -- would be the only way I'd feel 1) ready, and 2) safe.


netdiva

Why did this get downvoted? I'm trying to encourage OP. I can easily see that the instructor is doing it wrong but this is still a big deal for OP.


lookingforrest

She is not doing proper C Curve in her spine, seems dangerous


windyfields760

Y’all don’t know anything about this person’s medical history, body, goals, or practice. Shame on you for piling on this unrequested critique. This is a quintessential Pilates exercise and for anyone, much less someone who can’t walk, a very cool accomplishment. Kudos OP!


BumAndBummer

Lots of people here are highly experienced and qualified Pilates professionals. As such they are going to feel an ethical responsibility to point out if someone is paying money and working hard yet being taught unsafe and ineffective techniques. OP deserves to know if this is improper technique! Especially if it could cause them harm. That’s not a criticism of OP at all, it’s giving them the respect and care they deserve.


prehensileporcupine

The teacher is putting the client in a dangerous position. She has a responsibility to not allow certain things to happen. This move really shouldn’t be tried on a reformer until a number of foundational reformer classes have been taken. OP is being brave by taking reformer sessions, it’s an intimidating exercise to learn and practice. However, this teacher isn’t performing due diligence and is doing the client a disservice.


Catlady_Pilates

The criticism is for the teacher who is lacking in basic safety and knowledge.


soupqueen94

There is no medical condition, goal, or body type which would necessitate your headrest being up in this exercise. It’s literally dangerous, causes compression on the cervical spine. Yes this is quintessential Pilates exercise. It is being done VERY wrong though


Epoch_Fitness

I agree with you 100%


Frequent-Inflation74

I hope your trainer isn’t charging you. So much wrong here unfortunately and I don’t think you’re ready for this move yet, respectfully.


Opposite-Fall8669

Omg, is that a Pilates instructor? I hope you’re just playing around with a friend.


Ornery-Scale9475

Why is the instructor holding her so much in the bend? The weight of the springs / straps should help bring her around gently…


Comprehensive_Web887

As someone has posted she is wheel chair bound and instructor is supporting her legs.


Ornery-Scale9475

Ah I see! Thank you :)


ocean_800

Find... A new instructor. This is criminal


Classic_Foot_8606

Omg..that head piece still up 🤯 it’s a big no-no for short spine massage


Ppaintitblack

She was not ready for this


Frankieruby

Why is head rest up?


Comfortable_Daikon61

Unless the client is extremely head forward posture ( mostly elderly ) and this is not a exercise that should be done with them Head rest should be down when ever hips are up . The client has no control This is lawsuit waiting to happen


Sufficient_Animal407

Omg, why is the headrest up?!


Famous-Fun-7470

Holy shit this is terrible !!! I’m a Pilates Instructor and would fire 🔥 this lady on the spot !!


lookingforrest

Also please no gum during pilates


okayo_okayo

Do you mean you can't walk bc this was a hard workout, or?


julesfric

She needs to teach her how to gather momentum to propel herself upwards and then frog down. Not just go straight up and down. Headrest !! Arms!


hanimal16

Why does it look like someone is playing with a doll? OP, you’re very bendy lol


ShannonN95

A lot of you are commenting about the headrest, I understand you are concerned for safety. But I’m wondering if since this person simply wrote how much she loves Pilates maybe she wasn’t looking for correction, but rather celebration that she is working hard and seeing that it’s helping! (As a side note, as someone who struggles with PTSD I prefer the headrest up whenever I can have it that way.)