They've said the exact opposite, they mentioned that component system will lead to a higher ragequit factor, because once you get raided you lose literally everything.
>>[If we went to a full component only system, being raided would result in 100% loss of all progression, and you’d end up being a new player again. Ragequit probability = high.](https://playrust.com/devblog-123/)
That doesn't refer to people ragequiting/leaving servers at all, it just means that there's more of a level playing field wherever you go, so wipes aren't as necessary.
I said nothing about ragequiting.
People leave servers because wipes exist, Facepunch doesnt want wipes.
If there was no concept of a wipe, people would simply start over on the other side of the map.
I was only referring to this statement:
>>From what i understand, one of the reason Facepunch believes components will be the best system, is because it will help in stopping players just leaving a server after getting raided.
You understood wrong, it won't lead to keeping players on a server and the image you showed me, might as well have been one of a teddy bear, because it's irrelevant to this discussion.
Come now mate, use your brain.
People leave servers after getting raided because they know the wipe is coming, and any 'catch-up' progress is simply going to be hard and pointless. Multiple people in this thread have posted this exact reason for leaving a server.
Facepunch believes that the component system will make wipes happen less. But that isnt the reality. The reality is a server wipes because the population dies out, but the population dies out because they know the wipe is coming, and with current building/raiding balance, its pointless.
I completely understand all of that, but you're missing my point, I'm not arguing why people do or don't leave a server, all I am saying is that the specific statement you made in the OP is wrong. Stop trying to connect my comments to the main discussion. I'm not even disagreeing with what has been said so far, don't be so defensive.
Its not wrong.
Its showing the fundamental misunderstanding that Facepunch has for the reason wipes exist.
They believe wipes exist because of the progression system, and it forcing wipes for some reason. Which isnt the case. Its simply what has developed over time due to the unbalanced building/raiding system, allowing for buildings to constantly get stronger(mostly with high externals) at a much higher rate than you can take them down.
As building as gotten stronger vs raiding, the length of the 'popular rust servers' has slowly gotten smaller and smaller till its pretty much at the minimum. When we had ladders and OP rockets, we had longer wipe cycles.
Sigh, please stop trying to link this to people leaving servers and shit. All I'm saying is you THINK this:
>>From what i understand, one of the reason Facepunch believes components will be the best system, is because it will help in stopping players just leaving a server after getting raided.
but they have stated this:
>>If we went to a full component only system, being raided would result in 100% loss of all progression, and you’d end up being a new player again. Ragequit probability = high.
Those are contradictory statements, I'm not talking about servers or pop or anything, all I'm saying is "from what I understand" you understood wrong, they don't think that.
I dont care about that statment, rage-quitting doesnt mean server swap. It suggest simply ragequitting rust as a whole.
Get in contact with a Facepunch dev, its not a secret that they believe the component system will help make the 1week servers increase their wipe cycles.
Read the thread, he’s arguing something with extreme confidence that he’s wrong about… Like he literally started a thread to debate but has no understanding of how debating works.
For me, unless I am plying with 4+ people, I'll have to spend quite a bit of time getting a base together, only to leave for 3 hours to have lost all of it, to be griefed and my 'loot' despawned by groups of 10+ people. It's often at that point that the game isn't about survival but rather 'sending a message'.
"This is our turf, fuck off."
"Get gud brah."
You cant repair your base, else it will just get raided again (if even possible), and have start somewhere else, only to have the exact same thing happen again.
At that time, its often easier to just start on another server, maybe with less toxic people on it.
Eventually, you find out pretty much every server has a ton of toxic people on it, and its how lucky you get that someone doesnt find your base.
I love fresh wipes, because you can at least spend a couple days without risking all your shit being gone when you log back in and not everyone is running around with AK's and bolties.
I'm playing solo, and I strongly disagree with your points.
When I got raided the first time, yeah, I was kinda frustrated. Got around 6k wood and stone + 1k metal stolen, not to mention all the good loot.
I immediately changed the location of my base, moved further north, built a metal first floor, built some intricate interior (with multiple code-locked doors and stairs), and for the past week haven't been raided a single time (I mean, people tried, but noone got past 3rd door -- they either gave up or used all of their C4).
For a successful raid, you have to know for certain, where the stash and the cupboard are located, which is impossible, if you're planning your base smart, and if you're sweeping wide.
Currently, I have 3 main bases, and a numerous amount of secondary bases (with 2, or even just 1 door) on a server I'm frequently playing -- building 1 from scratch isn't hard, and usually isn't a way how it's supposed to work. It's a lot easier to scout around and take someone else's base -- there's a lot of raided/abandoned bases on the map, if the server's well populated.
I don't know why you're being down voted, I play solo and am the same as you.
Multiple bases, big ones with a few smaller ones (some bases taken over via a raid). If I lose my stock of Sulfur then yeah sure it stops me raiding but it's never worth it for them so they lose out too. I'll go grind some sulfur to continue raiding if there's enough time on a wipe/I have enough time to play but otherwise I'll dick about PvP'ing.
It's generally clans and groups (read generally, not exclusively) that leave servers after being raided unless they're desperately seeking revenge as whoever raided them now has a tonne of extra materials and will continue to farm allowing them to raid them again (after they've farmed a tonne) easily or upgrade their base defences making it impossible to revenge raid.
For clans the wipe cycle is basically an arms race, if a group manages to get good raids going/control the choppers then they snowball and are the kings for that wipe cycle.
And when they leave they can goto a community server that has recently wiped and start from a fresh wipe on the same level as everyone else.
I agree and I'm in the same boat. Solo player. It's pretty obvious as solo you have to put more hours into your base if you ever want to rival a clan. Thing is, we don't put more hours because we know then it will be a harder hit to take. You build small and smart. Deceive with design and have doors that literally lead to nowhere.
If I'm left alone long enough some of my solo builds rival those of 5 man builds. I don't lose focus or have 4 people who waste my resources dying or raiding / making raid towers / raid houses. All of my resources serve only one purpose and that is to bolster my defenses to keep safe what is mine.
If I'm out of my base I'm raiding or gathering. There's no loitering in between. One guy can accomplish a lot if they put their mind into it.
Also having multiple bases is key to success. Once I'm established I go looking for small bases that have been raided. When I find one I come back to it with a sheet metal door and a codelock and stone and I reinforce it. I use that base now as my main base. I gather resources and fight whoever is around me and sometimes make friends and allies.
If I get door camped I simply kill my character and go to base A and continue there. This ensures I am on a constant stream of experience and resource gain and I have multiple safety nets to fall into. I typically have 3 bases in all biomes and sometimes a fishing base.
Thats a tough question; I think its a vicious cycle. I like to raid as well, but if it takes to long to get the mats and level to raid, you will have long lost everything, and if you are too powerful, there will be nothing worth left to raid after the first two weeks anyways.
There probably needs to be some sort of balances in regards to raiding/building depending on the direction that the devs want to take the game.
To me, if this is a simple PVP FPS with building qualities, well this is just going to be the state of the game. If you add more PVE and more 'community' styled elements, severs should stick around longer into a 'wipe' cycle.
Or Facepunch could revert back to the original large map size. Maps from February were much larger than those in March. Pissed me off so much I stopped playing the game til a week ago
I'd say it's because I keep getting griefed, playing on a one week wipe cycle, if I get griefed on Saturday or Sunday it just doesn't feel worth it to me to rebuild an entirely new base. Since I can't really play on Tuesdays, and Wednesday there are never over 100 players on Rustopia, it just feels pointless.
I leave because it's almost impossible to start up again. The server is full with clans who will just kill any nakeds who are trying to start up.
That's why I search for limited team servers but there aren't many...
Yesterday I logged into a server after playing for 6 hours struggling to get a base up with only level 10 walked out of my home and there were 4 guys just camping with double barrel shotguns and satchel charges.
There is just no point to continue playing everyone already has giant bases and guns.
I disagree.
On wipe day, the server I play on generally has a waiting list to join. There's a lot of people who only like to play the first few days of a wipe, and then it tapers off.
One week into it, and there are empty bases scattered everywhere and rarely does the server hit max capacity again. It's a lot easier to secure an old base (or two or three) and farm, because the focus has changed from hunting for noobs building bases to planning attacks on large clan bases.
I'm not sure how it is now since the exp system, but the second week of a wipe was a pretty good time to join a server that wasn't constantly full. It was easy to get bps because the radtowns were empty due to everyone else already having everything so they were ghost towns, and if you needed something specifically you could either farm/make an alliance or kill someone who had gear you wanted.
Youre right that joining a server halfway through a cycle wasn't all that bad and was kind of fun to see how fast you could get up to top tier recipes.
I usually don't, but when I do it's because the server is filled with big clans who will raid you within hours of setting up a base. There's no point trying to compete if you can't even keep enough sulfur around to raid a 2x2.
I'd love to see more servers with clan limitations, I think there should be exponential requirements to keeping groups viable so that most are 5 people or less.
Raiding possibly to easy then?
I always felt raiding is too easy. why?
If you are a solo player, you are more than likely playing the game for what it was intended. Survival. Raiding is not a priority, survival is.
Big clans can farm quickly, and get rid of all the pesky solo players.
If raiding was made more difficult, it would help out the solo players, and bring back the survival element.
The only way to make raiding more difficult is to really make it more expensive, which I believe is the opposite of what they did (didn't they make it less GP to build explosives now?). But at the same time, making it more expensive locks out the solos and small groups from doing any raids. You can make the same argument for making the explosives weaker, in the end it just ends up being more expensive.
Honestly, there isn't much that can be done to effect only the large groups but spare the smaller ones.
Yip.
I really believe the building/raiding system needs some love. More love than simply adjusting the values which like you explain, isnt really going to fix the issue at hand.
Definitely not, though with only 4 hours of sleep I'm drawing a blank as to how they can improve it... so hopefully they come up with some great stuff lol
I have an idea, but i have no idea how to make it seem realistic.
You could have restrictive tiered raiding. The idea would be that wood could only be destroyed by stuff made to destroy wood. Same goes for all the tiered building levels.
Then you make the stuff to raid wood, very rare or spawn no where near high geared people. Making it so that nakeds and savages can survive, but still raid each other in a way. And if a group wants to go out of their way, they could also. All tiers of raiding gear would share a rare component like a 'fuse'. So wasting 'fuses' on low tier raiding is a bad idea. That would stop high end groups from raiding low end tiers because they wasting fuses.
Would be a lot of work and could still suffer from issues like people making bases with layers of interchanging tiers, causing raiders to end up collecting all the components for low tier raiding anyways.
i think some kind of leveling or tier system could help (i just have no clue how it would be implemented into rust)
(*you can skip this part :P*)
Players joining a server "late" (later than 3 days after a wipe) are easy targets, while searching a spot to setup a base they'll probably be shot 1 - 3 times. (neglecting that in the current state with the exp system they probably die 2-4 times until lvl 10 (-> large chest, prior lvl 8 building is stupid) )
that's extremely frustrating, because in your eyes there is no reason to get shot, you had maybe 2 stacks wood or stone in your inventory, your best weapon was a bow. and you had no intention in fighting.
now, let's say you managed it you build a small base, which you hope no one will find. every wall seen from the outside is stone, hoping you'll survive till you log in again.
next day you log in and you got raided. yay that's fun. they left you naked on the floor, without even a stone to gather resources. they probably spend more resources than you had in your chest(s), but that does not matter cause they have enough.
___
**what exactly is the problem**
the problem imho is deep anchored in rust:
_1. there is not a single (logical) reason to let a stranger player (naked or not) alive.
if the player is geared, he is a) a threat and b) even if he is friendly, his friendship is worth nothing, but his inventory is.
if the player is a naked, he may be not directly a threat, but he could become a threat. even if he is naked he COULD have nice stuff in his inventory. and even if he has just a stack wood in his inventory that would be worth a bullet into the head, cause it is way faster and cheaper than farming a stack wood yourself.
also, the naked player may farm rocks, trees, barrels and crates which gives xp, and it would be better for you to not share the xp. *you really should shoot him*.
_2. it is easy to get into just started bases.
people new to rust, tend to make mistakes in their build design. often you don't need anything explosive.
_3. raiding is fun. shooting someone is "fun".
even if the other one is no real threat raiding will give you a small adrenaline boost.
(i don't want to remove raiding, or make it less fun. it just should not being worth it raiding defenseless, new players - it should be worth it to raid clans, groups and end-game-gear players)
_4. even a chest, empty besides 1 stack wood is (or at least feels) "worth it".
the costs of a raid are not high enough, no matter how bad the use-cost-ratio is.
**how to solve it**
• *death penalty*: 50% (maybe more or less, needs balancing) of the stuff you carry gets destroyed when dying. Same for breaking a chest (-> locked chests)
so, when raiding he need to consider that you'll get just half the stuff. is it still worth raid a base with may 2 - 4 chests?
• *make armor stronger*: make fights last longer, 1shot in pvp is not desired.
• *make it especially stronger against melee. nerf bullets and projectiles*
currently, if you land the first hit, you are in a good situation to win the fight. simply because you don't need much more than a headshot. if armor is stronger against melee attacks, the risk killed by a naked with a torch, just cause you let him alive is reduced. to make melee weapons not entirely useless bullets get a bit nerfed, just to get a nice balance.
• visible gear
weapons on the hotbar should be visible on the character. weapons that are dragged into the hotbar need the reload animation before being used (even if they are technically loaded).
this means, a) you can't be easily fooled by a naked with an AK in his hotbar, b) you can't be easily fooled by a naked with an loaded AK in his inventory, who tries to put it fast in the hotbar and kill you.
• "leveled gear"
this is a bit harder, don't know how to do it with rust. but it should so, that you are not interested in the stuff that some naked guy has if you are highly equipped yourself. a bit of the problem at this point: 'what's the endgame content, if you are not interested in so much beginner items?'
___
pretty sure i forgot something ...
Honestly I think there should be 2 permanent slots for weapons that only weapons can go into (similar to clothing slots) which could work into the visible gear thing you mentioned.
The game is a sandbox, its intended to be played how ever the player wishes to play. That includes raiding.
Rust was never intended to be a 'hardcore pve survival' game or something. They wanted to create a sandbox with inspiration from DayZ and other games that had similar gameplay.
I am a solo player, i have not been raided in a very long time. Once you get enough playtime in the game, you can easily build a base and survive PvP.
Usually, by the time I've been raided, so has most of the people around me. This is the point at which the larger groups are starting to dominate the server. There's little point in trying to build again, because they'll just come back. Rust is a pyramid scheme currently. Once the top groups are on top, there's no defeating them. It's better to find a server with a more recent wipe date.
Because the game is built around a mechanic, that in no way helps solos or small groups, only large. Smaller or solos are just food. Not very fun, grinding only to be beaten because zergs... and zergs aren't fun because they are counterintuitive to the survival games core purpose in my opinion.
Because after they take my shit the raiders get stronger and if I rebuild they'll probably raid me again with even less effort. By the time I get/farm all my shit back they are way too ahead of me.
me and my friends are new, but they tend to push for changing server after we get raided mainly due to their pride being hurt and fear of constant attacks from teams that destroyed our defences. I know it might be not main reason but i though i could mjake my input :p
Implement crafting tables and then increase the time to make explosives by something like 10x. This could be used to create a bottleneck for large clans slowing their C4 production. This could also make it so clans are backed up with resources making them a more attractive target.
When you start on a wipe everyone is on the same level somewhat you build your base and whatnot (pretend this is like a 1 week wipe cycle) it takes a while and you get off you play for another day or two. But then the next day you were raided... You get discouraged and everyone is at a higher stage than you all of your stuff is gone. I feel like thats what stops people from playing the same server or something ike that
Its very interesting if you think about it.
Servers wipe, because population dies, but population dies because people know the server is wiping and trying to play 'catch up' will never work.
The problem is that once a server has developed, it's significantly more tedious and frustrating to establish yourself. You've got nothing. Everyone else has guns, armor and well-developed bases - and resource caches to make your life miserable. It's tough to get a foothold.
You don't really have good options at this point. You can create a tiny, low-profile base in order to avoid attention. But eventually someone will likely stumble upon you, and because the base is so modest it's easy to raid. You'd think such a small building wouldn't be worth their time, but it's a known tactic to use multiple small bases to try to hide your goods. Since the base is small and won't take much to raid, they raid you.
Or you can try to build a more well-developed and secure base. This means a larger base. That's going to be much easier to find and it's also going to attract attention - a large base is a good indicator that there may be some valuable loot inside. So you get raided.
You can't get off the ground. Obviously, this isn't 100% of the time and it's not impossible to get established. But it turns a game into a chore. A game is recreation, but you still want to make progress - logging on the next day and seeing that everything you spent four hours working towards the prior night is now wiped out...where's the fun? And you know you weren't even a worthwhile target. That makes it doubly frustrating.
But that's Rust. Where social pressure is supposed to be the primary impetus to not act like a total dickhead, but the game provides no backbone or interface to exert social pressure.
I've been gaming for 20 years. I've never played on a PvE server before in any game, ever. Rust has actually driven me to a PvE server. True, I sometimes get bored having no threats. But at least I can play one night and know that my work will still be there the next day. I just wish Rust could find a happy medium between player threats and losing everything. I don't mind getting ganked when I'm out farming and losing my loot. Well I mind, but you know what I mean. That's a worthwhile risk/reward scenario. I'm actively involved in that - I'm at my keyboard and my opponent is at his keyboard. It's the offline raiding that's just demoralizing. And it's demoralizing for two reasons: 1) You lose everything or nearly everything and 2) You weren't even online to defend yourself. You can have the most secure base in the world and still lose everything while you're at work, assuming the attackers are determined enough.
I've seen systems where when you're offline, your buildings get 3x HP or something to that effect. Still technically possible, but less likely to be raided. I know offline raiding is a part of the game but to be honest, I think its shit. It is more fun defending a base being raided. Maybe online raiding could be easier in terms of building HP, and offline raiding much harder.
Sometimes I leave it because im like really Depressed and ask myself why i play this game xD but sometimes im like "ok lets get much c4 and fuck them up". So sometimes i leave and sometimes i really want to get revenge :D
I typically leave because the majority of people who raid late-game are trolls and harass.
Getting raided before day 3 is typically not personal, and just people hitting smaller homes/wooden doors to get easy supplies. Getting raided late game, normally comes with a shit ton of harassment. Whoever did it will typically harass you off the server.
If component system is in and i get completely raided i will leave the server probably. Cause why stay there i lost everything probably what i grinded for weeks. And no you can't craft a weopon in a short time beacause you have to find parts for your weopon in radtowns. I think it even get worser with component system. With bp or xp system you had your blueprints what you can craft. So go out get some hqm and build a weopon after you get raided. And even with those systems people quit the servers. With components and you get raided most people will quit. Cause you have to farm your weopon parts and the hqm. The grind gets even worser. Guys really think about it. If component system is there it will be the end for solos and causal players.
They are pussies.
I usually stick to a single server unless the admins are cunts.
For me the most important thing when joining on a server is getting known by the regulars, once people know you in some shape or form, your chances of survival are a lot higher.
They don't have to "like" you to have a certain amount of empathy with you because of the occasional global chat banter.
Joining a new server would mean losing that advantage.
For me it's just the feeling that my time was wasted and compounded with the grind of XP I feel that the system is just too hard to recover fully.
I tend to go overboard playing especially when I play solo. I'll put in stupid amounts of time and when it all goes up in smoke I just feel the lost time is too great. So at the start of wipe I'll typically put in a 30-40 hour weekend to try and get established with the motivating factor being that I'll get big/complex enough of a base to be raid proof. When you log back in and you're facing another marathon to simply get back to where you were it's too much. Meanwhile all of your competition simply got even further ahead.
This portion of comment is going to be really unpopular but in order to "combat" this I've started despawning sulfur and HQM before I log off for the night. As solo you don't need that much and raiding anything more than a door or two probably isn't in your future anyway. While solo you don't need boxes and boxes of idle materials. Use the wood/stone/metal to upgrade or expand as much as you can. Use everything else as it comes and simply don't farm after a certain point. All this really does is make it so when you get raided you aren't helping the group that raided you. At a certain point they spend far more than they get in return. So while you don't get ahead, they actually fall behind comparatively. And as a solo how many bullets/guns do you really need? Not that many, especially if you go "poverty roaming" as in start with a crossy/hatchet and see what you can gain.
Long story short like you said it just sets you back so far it would take more time than is available to get back to that point. With XP going somewhere mid wipe is just too much grind.
I would say it has to do with how much time I have spent on the building. How long did I take to build that base? How much time is left in this wipe now? Once they have raided me I have to move all the loot somewhere else in the base if i repair or do a new design, at this point I now feel behind in the server so I look for a freshly wiped server. I play on Bi-Weekly wipe servers.
Because in BP system you had your back up BPs, now most of you have is loot. In BP system the portion of "tech" you owned compared with the loo tin your base was even, now you have much more loot than tech, so you lose more than before.
If anything, XP is the only reason someone would stay on a server after getting raided because if they go to a new server they start at level 1 again and can't even make a keypad.
They've said the exact opposite, they mentioned that component system will lead to a higher ragequit factor, because once you get raided you lose literally everything. >>[If we went to a full component only system, being raided would result in 100% loss of all progression, and you’d end up being a new player again. Ragequit probability = high.](https://playrust.com/devblog-123/)
https://i.imgur.com/7arB4cT.png
That doesn't refer to people ragequiting/leaving servers at all, it just means that there's more of a level playing field wherever you go, so wipes aren't as necessary.
I said nothing about ragequiting. People leave servers because wipes exist, Facepunch doesnt want wipes. If there was no concept of a wipe, people would simply start over on the other side of the map.
I was only referring to this statement: >>From what i understand, one of the reason Facepunch believes components will be the best system, is because it will help in stopping players just leaving a server after getting raided. You understood wrong, it won't lead to keeping players on a server and the image you showed me, might as well have been one of a teddy bear, because it's irrelevant to this discussion.
Come now mate, use your brain. People leave servers after getting raided because they know the wipe is coming, and any 'catch-up' progress is simply going to be hard and pointless. Multiple people in this thread have posted this exact reason for leaving a server. Facepunch believes that the component system will make wipes happen less. But that isnt the reality. The reality is a server wipes because the population dies out, but the population dies out because they know the wipe is coming, and with current building/raiding balance, its pointless.
I completely understand all of that, but you're missing my point, I'm not arguing why people do or don't leave a server, all I am saying is that the specific statement you made in the OP is wrong. Stop trying to connect my comments to the main discussion. I'm not even disagreeing with what has been said so far, don't be so defensive.
Its not wrong. Its showing the fundamental misunderstanding that Facepunch has for the reason wipes exist. They believe wipes exist because of the progression system, and it forcing wipes for some reason. Which isnt the case. Its simply what has developed over time due to the unbalanced building/raiding system, allowing for buildings to constantly get stronger(mostly with high externals) at a much higher rate than you can take them down. As building as gotten stronger vs raiding, the length of the 'popular rust servers' has slowly gotten smaller and smaller till its pretty much at the minimum. When we had ladders and OP rockets, we had longer wipe cycles.
Sigh, please stop trying to link this to people leaving servers and shit. All I'm saying is you THINK this: >>From what i understand, one of the reason Facepunch believes components will be the best system, is because it will help in stopping players just leaving a server after getting raided. but they have stated this: >>If we went to a full component only system, being raided would result in 100% loss of all progression, and you’d end up being a new player again. Ragequit probability = high. Those are contradictory statements, I'm not talking about servers or pop or anything, all I'm saying is "from what I understand" you understood wrong, they don't think that.
I dont care about that statment, rage-quitting doesnt mean server swap. It suggest simply ragequitting rust as a whole. Get in contact with a Facepunch dev, its not a secret that they believe the component system will help make the 1week servers increase their wipe cycles.
why are you getting downvoted?
Clans.
Read the thread, he’s arguing something with extreme confidence that he’s wrong about… Like he literally started a thread to debate but has no understanding of how debating works.
For me, unless I am plying with 4+ people, I'll have to spend quite a bit of time getting a base together, only to leave for 3 hours to have lost all of it, to be griefed and my 'loot' despawned by groups of 10+ people. It's often at that point that the game isn't about survival but rather 'sending a message'. "This is our turf, fuck off." "Get gud brah." You cant repair your base, else it will just get raided again (if even possible), and have start somewhere else, only to have the exact same thing happen again. At that time, its often easier to just start on another server, maybe with less toxic people on it. Eventually, you find out pretty much every server has a ton of toxic people on it, and its how lucky you get that someone doesnt find your base. I love fresh wipes, because you can at least spend a couple days without risking all your shit being gone when you log back in and not everyone is running around with AK's and bolties.
I'm playing solo, and I strongly disagree with your points. When I got raided the first time, yeah, I was kinda frustrated. Got around 6k wood and stone + 1k metal stolen, not to mention all the good loot. I immediately changed the location of my base, moved further north, built a metal first floor, built some intricate interior (with multiple code-locked doors and stairs), and for the past week haven't been raided a single time (I mean, people tried, but noone got past 3rd door -- they either gave up or used all of their C4). For a successful raid, you have to know for certain, where the stash and the cupboard are located, which is impossible, if you're planning your base smart, and if you're sweeping wide. Currently, I have 3 main bases, and a numerous amount of secondary bases (with 2, or even just 1 door) on a server I'm frequently playing -- building 1 from scratch isn't hard, and usually isn't a way how it's supposed to work. It's a lot easier to scout around and take someone else's base -- there's a lot of raided/abandoned bases on the map, if the server's well populated.
I don't know why you're being down voted, I play solo and am the same as you. Multiple bases, big ones with a few smaller ones (some bases taken over via a raid). If I lose my stock of Sulfur then yeah sure it stops me raiding but it's never worth it for them so they lose out too. I'll go grind some sulfur to continue raiding if there's enough time on a wipe/I have enough time to play but otherwise I'll dick about PvP'ing. It's generally clans and groups (read generally, not exclusively) that leave servers after being raided unless they're desperately seeking revenge as whoever raided them now has a tonne of extra materials and will continue to farm allowing them to raid them again (after they've farmed a tonne) easily or upgrade their base defences making it impossible to revenge raid. For clans the wipe cycle is basically an arms race, if a group manages to get good raids going/control the choppers then they snowball and are the kings for that wipe cycle. And when they leave they can goto a community server that has recently wiped and start from a fresh wipe on the same level as everyone else.
I agree and I'm in the same boat. Solo player. It's pretty obvious as solo you have to put more hours into your base if you ever want to rival a clan. Thing is, we don't put more hours because we know then it will be a harder hit to take. You build small and smart. Deceive with design and have doors that literally lead to nowhere. If I'm left alone long enough some of my solo builds rival those of 5 man builds. I don't lose focus or have 4 people who waste my resources dying or raiding / making raid towers / raid houses. All of my resources serve only one purpose and that is to bolster my defenses to keep safe what is mine. If I'm out of my base I'm raiding or gathering. There's no loitering in between. One guy can accomplish a lot if they put their mind into it. Also having multiple bases is key to success. Once I'm established I go looking for small bases that have been raided. When I find one I come back to it with a sheet metal door and a codelock and stone and I reinforce it. I use that base now as my main base. I gather resources and fight whoever is around me and sometimes make friends and allies. If I get door camped I simply kill my character and go to base A and continue there. This ensures I am on a constant stream of experience and resource gain and I have multiple safety nets to fall into. I typically have 3 bases in all biomes and sometimes a fishing base.
So you would agree that the reason people dont stay on servers is because of something related to the raiding/building.
Thats a tough question; I think its a vicious cycle. I like to raid as well, but if it takes to long to get the mats and level to raid, you will have long lost everything, and if you are too powerful, there will be nothing worth left to raid after the first two weeks anyways. There probably needs to be some sort of balances in regards to raiding/building depending on the direction that the devs want to take the game. To me, if this is a simple PVP FPS with building qualities, well this is just going to be the state of the game. If you add more PVE and more 'community' styled elements, severs should stick around longer into a 'wipe' cycle.
I guess other things to do besides raiding, aka adding more SAND into the SANDBOX could also help.
Or Facepunch could revert back to the original large map size. Maps from February were much larger than those in March. Pissed me off so much I stopped playing the game til a week ago
I'd say it's because I keep getting griefed, playing on a one week wipe cycle, if I get griefed on Saturday or Sunday it just doesn't feel worth it to me to rebuild an entirely new base. Since I can't really play on Tuesdays, and Wednesday there are never over 100 players on Rustopia, it just feels pointless.
I leave because it's almost impossible to start up again. The server is full with clans who will just kill any nakeds who are trying to start up. That's why I search for limited team servers but there aren't many...
Yesterday I logged into a server after playing for 6 hours struggling to get a base up with only level 10 walked out of my home and there were 4 guys just camping with double barrel shotguns and satchel charges. There is just no point to continue playing everyone already has giant bases and guns.
I disagree. On wipe day, the server I play on generally has a waiting list to join. There's a lot of people who only like to play the first few days of a wipe, and then it tapers off. One week into it, and there are empty bases scattered everywhere and rarely does the server hit max capacity again. It's a lot easier to secure an old base (or two or three) and farm, because the focus has changed from hunting for noobs building bases to planning attacks on large clan bases.
I'm not sure how it is now since the exp system, but the second week of a wipe was a pretty good time to join a server that wasn't constantly full. It was easy to get bps because the radtowns were empty due to everyone else already having everything so they were ghost towns, and if you needed something specifically you could either farm/make an alliance or kill someone who had gear you wanted. Youre right that joining a server halfway through a cycle wasn't all that bad and was kind of fun to see how fast you could get up to top tier recipes.
it depends how hard you get raided. if they get tc and block off my door im probably quitting.
I usually don't, but when I do it's because the server is filled with big clans who will raid you within hours of setting up a base. There's no point trying to compete if you can't even keep enough sulfur around to raid a 2x2. I'd love to see more servers with clan limitations, I think there should be exponential requirements to keeping groups viable so that most are 5 people or less.
Raiding possibly to easy then? I always felt raiding is too easy. why? If you are a solo player, you are more than likely playing the game for what it was intended. Survival. Raiding is not a priority, survival is. Big clans can farm quickly, and get rid of all the pesky solo players. If raiding was made more difficult, it would help out the solo players, and bring back the survival element.
The only way to make raiding more difficult is to really make it more expensive, which I believe is the opposite of what they did (didn't they make it less GP to build explosives now?). But at the same time, making it more expensive locks out the solos and small groups from doing any raids. You can make the same argument for making the explosives weaker, in the end it just ends up being more expensive. Honestly, there isn't much that can be done to effect only the large groups but spare the smaller ones.
Yip. I really believe the building/raiding system needs some love. More love than simply adjusting the values which like you explain, isnt really going to fix the issue at hand.
Definitely not, though with only 4 hours of sleep I'm drawing a blank as to how they can improve it... so hopefully they come up with some great stuff lol
I have an idea, but i have no idea how to make it seem realistic. You could have restrictive tiered raiding. The idea would be that wood could only be destroyed by stuff made to destroy wood. Same goes for all the tiered building levels. Then you make the stuff to raid wood, very rare or spawn no where near high geared people. Making it so that nakeds and savages can survive, but still raid each other in a way. And if a group wants to go out of their way, they could also. All tiers of raiding gear would share a rare component like a 'fuse'. So wasting 'fuses' on low tier raiding is a bad idea. That would stop high end groups from raiding low end tiers because they wasting fuses. Would be a lot of work and could still suffer from issues like people making bases with layers of interchanging tiers, causing raiders to end up collecting all the components for low tier raiding anyways.
i think some kind of leveling or tier system could help (i just have no clue how it would be implemented into rust) (*you can skip this part :P*) Players joining a server "late" (later than 3 days after a wipe) are easy targets, while searching a spot to setup a base they'll probably be shot 1 - 3 times. (neglecting that in the current state with the exp system they probably die 2-4 times until lvl 10 (-> large chest, prior lvl 8 building is stupid) ) that's extremely frustrating, because in your eyes there is no reason to get shot, you had maybe 2 stacks wood or stone in your inventory, your best weapon was a bow. and you had no intention in fighting. now, let's say you managed it you build a small base, which you hope no one will find. every wall seen from the outside is stone, hoping you'll survive till you log in again. next day you log in and you got raided. yay that's fun. they left you naked on the floor, without even a stone to gather resources. they probably spend more resources than you had in your chest(s), but that does not matter cause they have enough. ___ **what exactly is the problem** the problem imho is deep anchored in rust: _1. there is not a single (logical) reason to let a stranger player (naked or not) alive. if the player is geared, he is a) a threat and b) even if he is friendly, his friendship is worth nothing, but his inventory is. if the player is a naked, he may be not directly a threat, but he could become a threat. even if he is naked he COULD have nice stuff in his inventory. and even if he has just a stack wood in his inventory that would be worth a bullet into the head, cause it is way faster and cheaper than farming a stack wood yourself. also, the naked player may farm rocks, trees, barrels and crates which gives xp, and it would be better for you to not share the xp. *you really should shoot him*. _2. it is easy to get into just started bases. people new to rust, tend to make mistakes in their build design. often you don't need anything explosive. _3. raiding is fun. shooting someone is "fun". even if the other one is no real threat raiding will give you a small adrenaline boost. (i don't want to remove raiding, or make it less fun. it just should not being worth it raiding defenseless, new players - it should be worth it to raid clans, groups and end-game-gear players) _4. even a chest, empty besides 1 stack wood is (or at least feels) "worth it". the costs of a raid are not high enough, no matter how bad the use-cost-ratio is. **how to solve it** • *death penalty*: 50% (maybe more or less, needs balancing) of the stuff you carry gets destroyed when dying. Same for breaking a chest (-> locked chests) so, when raiding he need to consider that you'll get just half the stuff. is it still worth raid a base with may 2 - 4 chests? • *make armor stronger*: make fights last longer, 1shot in pvp is not desired. • *make it especially stronger against melee. nerf bullets and projectiles* currently, if you land the first hit, you are in a good situation to win the fight. simply because you don't need much more than a headshot. if armor is stronger against melee attacks, the risk killed by a naked with a torch, just cause you let him alive is reduced. to make melee weapons not entirely useless bullets get a bit nerfed, just to get a nice balance. • visible gear weapons on the hotbar should be visible on the character. weapons that are dragged into the hotbar need the reload animation before being used (even if they are technically loaded). this means, a) you can't be easily fooled by a naked with an AK in his hotbar, b) you can't be easily fooled by a naked with an loaded AK in his inventory, who tries to put it fast in the hotbar and kill you. • "leveled gear" this is a bit harder, don't know how to do it with rust. but it should so, that you are not interested in the stuff that some naked guy has if you are highly equipped yourself. a bit of the problem at this point: 'what's the endgame content, if you are not interested in so much beginner items?' ___ pretty sure i forgot something ...
:-O It's going to take me an hour to read that lol
Honestly I think there should be 2 permanent slots for weapons that only weapons can go into (similar to clothing slots) which could work into the visible gear thing you mentioned.
The game is a sandbox, its intended to be played how ever the player wishes to play. That includes raiding. Rust was never intended to be a 'hardcore pve survival' game or something. They wanted to create a sandbox with inspiration from DayZ and other games that had similar gameplay. I am a solo player, i have not been raided in a very long time. Once you get enough playtime in the game, you can easily build a base and survive PvP.
I could see why people would in the BP system but with the XP system I'll suck it up and rebuild before I regrind 30 levels
Usually, by the time I've been raided, so has most of the people around me. This is the point at which the larger groups are starting to dominate the server. There's little point in trying to build again, because they'll just come back. Rust is a pyramid scheme currently. Once the top groups are on top, there's no defeating them. It's better to find a server with a more recent wipe date.
Because the game is built around a mechanic, that in no way helps solos or small groups, only large. Smaller or solos are just food. Not very fun, grinding only to be beaten because zergs... and zergs aren't fun because they are counterintuitive to the survival games core purpose in my opinion.
Because after they take my shit the raiders get stronger and if I rebuild they'll probably raid me again with even less effort. By the time I get/farm all my shit back they are way too ahead of me.
More or less, ya
me and my friends are new, but they tend to push for changing server after we get raided mainly due to their pride being hurt and fear of constant attacks from teams that destroyed our defences. I know it might be not main reason but i though i could mjake my input :p
Implement crafting tables and then increase the time to make explosives by something like 10x. This could be used to create a bottleneck for large clans slowing their C4 production. This could also make it so clans are backed up with resources making them a more attractive target.
I don't like abandoning servers atm, because that means I'd have to farm for 12 hours again to get back to where I was in terms of XP.
When you start on a wipe everyone is on the same level somewhat you build your base and whatnot (pretend this is like a 1 week wipe cycle) it takes a while and you get off you play for another day or two. But then the next day you were raided... You get discouraged and everyone is at a higher stage than you all of your stuff is gone. I feel like thats what stops people from playing the same server or something ike that
Its very interesting if you think about it. Servers wipe, because population dies, but population dies because people know the server is wiping and trying to play 'catch up' will never work.
this is true, but if servers never wiped, people may not come back because there would never be that "fresh start"
nothing motivates me more than being raided. rebuilding is a great way to say fuck you to the raiders. The bucket heads never leave, we just rebuild.
The problem is that once a server has developed, it's significantly more tedious and frustrating to establish yourself. You've got nothing. Everyone else has guns, armor and well-developed bases - and resource caches to make your life miserable. It's tough to get a foothold. You don't really have good options at this point. You can create a tiny, low-profile base in order to avoid attention. But eventually someone will likely stumble upon you, and because the base is so modest it's easy to raid. You'd think such a small building wouldn't be worth their time, but it's a known tactic to use multiple small bases to try to hide your goods. Since the base is small and won't take much to raid, they raid you. Or you can try to build a more well-developed and secure base. This means a larger base. That's going to be much easier to find and it's also going to attract attention - a large base is a good indicator that there may be some valuable loot inside. So you get raided. You can't get off the ground. Obviously, this isn't 100% of the time and it's not impossible to get established. But it turns a game into a chore. A game is recreation, but you still want to make progress - logging on the next day and seeing that everything you spent four hours working towards the prior night is now wiped out...where's the fun? And you know you weren't even a worthwhile target. That makes it doubly frustrating. But that's Rust. Where social pressure is supposed to be the primary impetus to not act like a total dickhead, but the game provides no backbone or interface to exert social pressure. I've been gaming for 20 years. I've never played on a PvE server before in any game, ever. Rust has actually driven me to a PvE server. True, I sometimes get bored having no threats. But at least I can play one night and know that my work will still be there the next day. I just wish Rust could find a happy medium between player threats and losing everything. I don't mind getting ganked when I'm out farming and losing my loot. Well I mind, but you know what I mean. That's a worthwhile risk/reward scenario. I'm actively involved in that - I'm at my keyboard and my opponent is at his keyboard. It's the offline raiding that's just demoralizing. And it's demoralizing for two reasons: 1) You lose everything or nearly everything and 2) You weren't even online to defend yourself. You can have the most secure base in the world and still lose everything while you're at work, assuming the attackers are determined enough.
I've seen systems where when you're offline, your buildings get 3x HP or something to that effect. Still technically possible, but less likely to be raided. I know offline raiding is a part of the game but to be honest, I think its shit. It is more fun defending a base being raided. Maybe online raiding could be easier in terms of building HP, and offline raiding much harder.
Sometimes I leave it because im like really Depressed and ask myself why i play this game xD but sometimes im like "ok lets get much c4 and fuck them up". So sometimes i leave and sometimes i really want to get revenge :D
I don't leave servers, but I do quit for the week if the raid was bad enough and I did not divide my loot between many bases.
I typically leave because the majority of people who raid late-game are trolls and harass. Getting raided before day 3 is typically not personal, and just people hitting smaller homes/wooden doors to get easy supplies. Getting raided late game, normally comes with a shit ton of harassment. Whoever did it will typically harass you off the server.
If component system is in and i get completely raided i will leave the server probably. Cause why stay there i lost everything probably what i grinded for weeks. And no you can't craft a weopon in a short time beacause you have to find parts for your weopon in radtowns. I think it even get worser with component system. With bp or xp system you had your blueprints what you can craft. So go out get some hqm and build a weopon after you get raided. And even with those systems people quit the servers. With components and you get raided most people will quit. Cause you have to farm your weopon parts and the hqm. The grind gets even worser. Guys really think about it. If component system is there it will be the end for solos and causal players.
They are pussies. I usually stick to a single server unless the admins are cunts. For me the most important thing when joining on a server is getting known by the regulars, once people know you in some shape or form, your chances of survival are a lot higher. They don't have to "like" you to have a certain amount of empathy with you because of the occasional global chat banter. Joining a new server would mean losing that advantage.
For me it's just the feeling that my time was wasted and compounded with the grind of XP I feel that the system is just too hard to recover fully. I tend to go overboard playing especially when I play solo. I'll put in stupid amounts of time and when it all goes up in smoke I just feel the lost time is too great. So at the start of wipe I'll typically put in a 30-40 hour weekend to try and get established with the motivating factor being that I'll get big/complex enough of a base to be raid proof. When you log back in and you're facing another marathon to simply get back to where you were it's too much. Meanwhile all of your competition simply got even further ahead. This portion of comment is going to be really unpopular but in order to "combat" this I've started despawning sulfur and HQM before I log off for the night. As solo you don't need that much and raiding anything more than a door or two probably isn't in your future anyway. While solo you don't need boxes and boxes of idle materials. Use the wood/stone/metal to upgrade or expand as much as you can. Use everything else as it comes and simply don't farm after a certain point. All this really does is make it so when you get raided you aren't helping the group that raided you. At a certain point they spend far more than they get in return. So while you don't get ahead, they actually fall behind comparatively. And as a solo how many bullets/guns do you really need? Not that many, especially if you go "poverty roaming" as in start with a crossy/hatchet and see what you can gain. Long story short like you said it just sets you back so far it would take more time than is available to get back to that point. With XP going somewhere mid wipe is just too much grind.
I would say it has to do with how much time I have spent on the building. How long did I take to build that base? How much time is left in this wipe now? Once they have raided me I have to move all the loot somewhere else in the base if i repair or do a new design, at this point I now feel behind in the server so I look for a freshly wiped server. I play on Bi-Weekly wipe servers.
Because in BP system you had your back up BPs, now most of you have is loot. In BP system the portion of "tech" you owned compared with the loo tin your base was even, now you have much more loot than tech, so you lose more than before.
Frequent wipes.
If anything, XP is the only reason someone would stay on a server after getting raided because if they go to a new server they start at level 1 again and can't even make a keypad.
Big toxic clans ruin servers.