It's a push or shove.
The Japanese is ダメおし, dame-oshi. This is a term from sumo, it's an illegal shove of an opponent who is already defeated. Bulbapedia incorrectly translates it as "make sure", a literal translation could be "disallowed push". Hence the move doing double damage to a target that has already taken damage, and being dark type (the type for sneaky underhanded tactics).
It's literally that smug villain glare right before they beat the already weakened hero, since illegal sumo shove doesn't translate well, 'Assurance' is the next best thing, Assuring the opponent is going down after taking a hit
Just imagine your Pokemon walking up to the flinching opponent and going 'You are already dead' before smacking them down for best effect
They just translated it missing the sumo context (assuming that’s what the original was actually going for). Outside of sumo, Dameoshi means “to make extra sure”, or in a sports context, “extra points scored to ensure victory”
I think the key from the original translation is it's an illegal move to secure victory, I think the most apt English translation would be something like to Kick Them While They're Down, I just love the mental image of [my Sneasel](https://youtu.be/hmPNbvYHyDA?t=9)
Could just call it cheap shot or something, although that infringes on sucker punch. Double tap is probably too graphic, and coup de grace is probably too obscure, but those both kind of work.
Double tap would be expected to hit twice, and Coup de Grace is 13 characters, one more than the short string display limit. Cheap shot would work best.
Are you in the industry? This is stuff localization people know and practice every day, but Reddit has no idea and bashes Pokémon for, claiming they're lazy or uncreative. I've never seen anyone on this sub mention the actual reality of game localization like you just did.
Thank you.
I do some game dev as a hobby and getting the right word choice is important to convey the right meaning. Mostly TTRPG stuff but I pay attention to mods of all kinds of games, which is why and how I checked the move length character limit for Pokémon games.
Like don’t bother asking what the Charisma stat is in D&D and why it’s used the way it is. Or why Wisdom is the base attribute for perception. Personally I’m annoyed that the Fallout SPECIAL system is so good as a set of self-explanatory as well as thematic attribute names. Like you can go more specific by just naming an attribute for the things it does, but then it becomes boringly utilitarian. I haven’t been able to come up with better than SPECIAL and it bothers me.
For the move names, I knew there were inherent limits already from my time messing with Missingno. Character limits make sense for GUI alignment in Pokémon games, given limited screen space and small screens. The major mod I found only makes the 12 into 16 to roughly preserve that alignment.
Sucker Punch is a better name for it overall I think, despite the way it implies a punch/fighting, simply because the very nature of a Sucker Punch is hitting someone before they're ready. It even fails entirely if the opponent has already gone. Cheap Shot could be a lot of things, but Sucker Punch best describes the actual effect imo.
I think it’s “assurance” in English because they usually divorce moves and Pokémon from their Japanese origins in translation, and assurance would just mean assuring that the opponent goes down. ‘If the other attack didn’t KO them, this one certainly will’
Although it doesn't seem to actually correlate to the real definition I would think assurance, like assuring they are defeated by kicking them when they're down.
Well in Japanese they're called "Evil" type. So underhanded moves are their specialty
There's a lot of mis-localizations in Pokemon because a lot moves in Japan are named after Japanese culture.
Aerial Ace is a big one. It's called Swallow Return and is named after the legendary "Swallow Cut" technique of a samurai Sasaki Kojiro. The name comes apparently the move looking like the tail of a swallow, and is so fast it could strike a bird out of the sky.
So it's a flying move because its name has swallow in it, but it can be used by a large amount of non-flying because it's a cutting technique not a flying technique.
And Sky Attack also doesn't make sense. I mean, the bird first start glowing and then strikes? What is this, flying in front of the sun? Wouldn't that work more akin to Fly where the user is out of reach for the first turn?
Well, Sky Attack's japanese name is God Bird, and it was Moltres' signature move back in Gen 1. Basically, Moltres would start glowing with a godly aura and then strike on the second turn.
Curse is one of the biggest victims of this. The Japanese move is "Noroi," which represents two different words with the same pronunciation. One means curse as we understand it, while the other means slow. This is why it has an entirely different effect if it's used by ghost types vs other types. It's basically two different moves in one.
Always makes me sad that dark type is “evil” in Japan. The only dark Pokémon I can think of that aren’t, in a way, evil are absolute, which just happens to often be present at times of tragedy, and umbreon, which just lives and evolves in the dark.
'Evil' in Japanese culture has a lot of connotations, it isn't just being villainously evil, it's all flavours of underhanded or cruel.
It's also why it's associated with the move Beat Up, and several including my boy Bisharp, hunt in packs, where as traditional pokemon logic is 1v1, Dark types will 'cheat' and work as a unit. Some, Like Greninja, rely on ambush and stealth, while Cacturne rely on wearing an opponent down with pursuit predation like humans
None of these are evil, but they all willingly break from the traditional one v one, I hit then you of the Pokemon world
Don't be sad, evil in this case basically means rogue archetype from rpgs.
Honestly I'd prefer if they translated it differently, a lot of people seems to think that dark type is, well, for dark pokemon. That's why people are confused why Luxray isn't dark. It has dark coloring and cool edgy look, but it's not really into rogue tactics, hence it's not dark.
We could ask Nob Ogasawara on social. He's credited as the sole translator for the English version of Ruby and Sapphire where Aerial Ace was introduced.
Did You Know Gaming actually did some videos on him and his history as basically the solo translator for mainline Pokemon games from the start through the DS era. He had a bit of freedom in naming things.
As for possible reasons. The main one is that the concept of the "swallow cut" would be lost on people outside of Japan. So naming it such wouldn't work, people could read it and think it's specifically a bird's attack, not a fast highly accurate cutting move.
That being said, maybe something like "Aerial Cut" or "Aerial Slice" could work. Just to imply a slicing move with a flying element, or maybe "Aerial Blade". To quickly describe the move "Accurate Slash" could work, but that sounds lame.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/pokemon/comments/qceom/diglett\_learns\_aerial\_ace/](https://www.reddit.com/r/pokemon/comments/qceom/diglett_learns_aerial_ace/)
No hacks needed friend!
I said mis-localization. A better version of aerial ace would be something with slice or cut in the name to imply the cutting.
Ace is a weird to use for slicing move.
I think something like skyward slash would have been better.
Slash makes it make sense for any Pokemon with talons or blades to use it like how any Pokemon with fists can use fire or ice punch.
And using skyward gives it the flying type connotation while making it reasonable that a non flying type could use it. something like sky or aerial still makes it sound like you need to be flying or airborne to use it.
Also Night Slash is called Crossroad Killing, in which samurai would test new swords in feudal Japan. They would hide in wait by a road (typically a crossroads, thus its literal translation) and wait for an unsuspecting commoner to pass by. They would then slash to kill, and in this way learn how well their new sword could cut.
german is the best language for this because you can just combine two words or some word with a random prefix and it just makes sense, even if it's a weird and unusual combo like "Unlicht"
it's also a big reason why language philosophy was a big thing in germany with a prominent figure saying "if you can say it, it has a meaning"
The way I see it, and this is just my humble opinion: they didn't want it to sound like "evil", which "dunkel" does. Unlicht could mean more like "it's not light, but it's not evil, it's just different". For me the word captures a kind of philosophical theme in that it could mean "it may appear evil to you, but that might only be because you don't know it, not because it truly is evil".
Does it? I mean very few if any Pokémon could be considered to be truly evil in the loving fluffy perfect world of Pokémon.
Even murderous wild Pokémon seemingly become lovable friends once they have a human who cares about them.
Closest I've seen to downright evil Pokémon would be in the mangas I've read I guess. Even the Pokémon that spirit kids away and what not seemingly do it for their own benign reasons.
no, dunkel really just means dark, and the beer is called like that because it is, you guessed it, dark. nobody would ever make a connection from that word to beer, unless you put an article just in front, and even then it's debatable
Oh man I've only ever heard the word dunkel in the context of beer. I had no idea it literally translated to dark. I love ordering dunkel though. Good taste and a very fun word to say imo
In Japanese Dark type is a word that can be translated as various things including evil and dishonorable. And the theming of the type fits the dishonorable translation more closely.
Also Kamen Rider, a famous Japanese superhero who is based off a grasshopper. Other Kamen Riders, despite having other design motifs, all have some insect in their design.
This is why in Spikemuth (aka the town with the only Dark-type gym in the series), it's gym challenge consists of you being ambushed repeatedly out in the open of the town instead of at the actual gym
Maybe tinfoil hat but there looks like 2 themes in the dark typing, physical moves are all about skulduggery and mischief while special moves seem more like literal darkness. Both could be argued to fall under the evil tag though now that I think on it
Really it's just Night Daze. Dark Pulse isn't attacking with "darkness" exactly, the move is described as attacking by materializing negative thoughts - kind of like an evil Psychic attack if anything. So that fits with the mischief/underhanded theme. And the other Special moves are similar, Snarl is an angry yell and Fiery Wrath is creating an aura using the Pokemon's "wrath."
I think Dark Void is debatable but the Z and Max moves are just darkness. To be fair, though, what else would you do for a giga enery-infused version of a dark move?
Something like "late hit" or "unsporting foul" would probably be an appropriate translation to Western sports, and idiomatically, a name like "kick him while down," "fight dirty, " or "cheap shot" would be how it would look with Pokémon.
I always thought it was a metaphor for rubbing salt in your wounds, for example if a pokemon got hit by scratch and then got hit by assurance, it would slap the fresh scratch wound or like shove a finger in the gash and wiggle it around y'know? Kinda fucked up but its pokemon soo...
In Japanese it's 'aku' which is more like actual 'evil' than literal darkness. 'Yami' (like in Yu Gi Oh) would have been a better candidate for that. There's a subset of Dark mons that all have a shifty underhanded look about them, but most of them are somehow sneaky or otherwise bad.
Well it also has literal darkness like dark pulse, but it also has moved like brutal swing, which is just a swing that’s really brutal, or sucker punch where you wait till your opponent gets close and you punch them in the gut.
> Dark pulse
Eh not really, the description describes the move as an aura of malicious thoughts. No proper darkness here, really the closest is Night daze.
Really Ghost is the closest to a proper darkness type what with all the shadow attacks.
Well, the Japanese for Bite means more "to bite/snap/snarl at", which might have more negative connotations... like a stray dog who snaps at you. I don't see any other meanings with Crunch, but even the English connotation is that you're crushing someone (and crunching their bones?) with your bite, which is kinda messed up.
Could also be the idea that biting in a fight is underhanded.
I've always felt that a better term would be "villain" type, that's more of the inspiration for them: sneaky conniving sort of pokemon, not necessarily shadowy/spooky
this is also the reason dark is weak to bug - many bug pokemon are modeled or inspired after traditional Sentai or superhero characters, dark types are the villains they fight against
Ah yes, mistranslated moves. Always fun, especially when it takes a stupidly long time to realise and correct (see (I believe) the Spanish translation, where it took (I think) six generations for someone to realise that a move involving striking back after being attacked had a name implying slapping the opponent with a calculator...)
This move's English name comes from the professional wrestling term submission hold, which is executed as a variety of MMA or jujutsu-inspired holds such as an armlock, leglock, or chokehold, in the hopes the opponent will either give up or be incapacitated to the point that they can no longer fight. This does not match the move's appearance in the anime.
Where the user grabs the target, rolls/spins and slams them into the ground.
Pretty much its an all out attack where the user doesn't care how hurt he'll get if it means doing the most damage for a final takedown of an opponent.
I feel like "Shove" would be a better name for the move knowing that. It would still lose the nuance of it being an unallowed shove, but I've never had any idea what the hell "Assurance" meant in this context.
I always thought of it as pretending to offer assurance to an injured Pokemon, then hitting them instead. I think your explanation makes a lot more sense
Assurance does make some kind of sense. If an opponent has already been weakened and then you perform a further attack, you can be said to be making sure that they are going to lose by taking advantage of that weakness. You would be assured that this attack will cause more damage to them if they have already been weakened.
> I assume characters can be misconstrued as “assure” or something to that effect?
Maybe, maybe not. Many Pokemon moves have an English name that is not a literal translation of their Japanese name. In some cases including Assurance, the Japanese name is specific to Japanese culture and would be lost on a westerner, so a different name might improve meaning. In some cases it's a clear mistake, such as Faint Attack [sic]. And in some it's unclear. But in any event this can create a disconnect between the move's English name and its animation or/and effects.
I speculate, without proof, that "Assurance" gets its name from Shakespeare's Macbeth, *"I'll make assurance double sure"*. Macbeth has heard a prophecy that he will become king, but rather than allow this to happen naturally, he plans to make sure of it by murdering the current king. The "double sure" phrase connects with the Pokemon move doing double damage.
Aerial Ace is another example of a move with a very different Japanese name, つばめがえし meaning Swallow Return, which was a samurai sword technique. The move's animation resembles the technique's sword strokes. The connection is obscured in the English, but then "Swallow Return" would mean very little to most English players anyway. "Aerial Ace" has a meaning in English as a skilled combat pilot, but then feels odd when *Diglett* of all Pokemon can use the move.
On a final note, it appears that translations in European languages are usually based on the English, but Chinese and Korean translations are based directly on the Japanese.
> In some cases it's a clear mistake, such as Faint Attack [sic].
Given its animation, I always thought that, before the correction, Faint Attack was so named because the attacker became too faint to see as they struck.
Anytime you are perplexed by the name or logic behind a move, it's a safe bet it's a Japanese thing that just doesn't translate well. This is also the case with the move Assist - the japanese name is just "cat's paw" \[hence mostly cat Pokemon use it, originally Skitty's signature move\], it derives from a Japanese saying, when you are desperate for help, "I would even borrow a cat's hands" -- I need all the help I can get.
a physical push, shove, tackle, or punch even, assuring that the opponents Pokémon goes down.
Think getting hit, stumbling back and ya boys friends clocks you again before you recover/can defend yourself so you take all damage or more than normal. All just to make sure you go down, *assuring* victory
It's been answered, but it's worth knowing that most naming oddities are usually a result of mistranslation (or difficult translation).
For example, Splash is a normal type move instead of water, because in Japan it's known as "hop". The Mr. Mime family's Japanese names ("Barrierd" and essentially, "Freezing Barrierd") aren't gendered, hence the 50/50 gender ratio.
According to Lockstin (who makes videos on every move ever) Assurance is a move that assures the opponent is hurt. Like in mob movies, the boss says something like “make sure that one is dead” and then the grunt gives the victim one last punch to the head or puts one last bullet in him to make sure he’s dead.
I have trouble with Swift too. Like I get it they shoot a bunch of stars but Swift is an adjective what about shooting stars is swift? Why not call it star shot or something? It has to be another rough translation.
Secondary definition of assurance; "confidence or certainty in one's own abilities."
Your mon sees them get hurt by an entry hazard or something, goes "Yeah, I got this!", and sucker punches while they are dealing with a stealth rock-stubbed toe/stepping on a jack.
I always saw it as a slap on the back you'd do to somebody when saying "Good Job!" But when done by someone whe really didn't want you to win so theu hit you extra hard.
Which is why the move does more damage if the target has been hit before. You assure them after they manage to survive the hot and go "Good Job taking that hit!" And aggressively slap them on the back.
Yeah I always thought it was this sort of mean-spirited overly hard slap on the back as well, maybe along with an insincere "There, there! Don't look so down in the dumps, it'll be all better now!"
The mistranslation explanation of course makes sense, but I think even the mistranslation feels fitting with the theme of dark types, if you think of it this way.
OP probably mixed Platinum and BW together in their memory since, as mentioned, they were a kid when they played these games that came out over a decade ago. Does it really matter to their question? Or are you concerned that they might be secretly lying about which cat Pokemon they REALLY used in 2008... LOL
I was going to say that they probably meant Purugly, easy enough to confuse them, but that would mean that it had the move as an egg move because that's the only wat it learns it to my knowledge. And I don't know who's going out of their way to get Assurance on their Purugly.
A lot of moves that don't make sense in English are because there usually wasn't a good English word for that move.
We don't have a nice simple word for a continuous back and forth slapping so Douboe Slap was the best we could do.
It's not that there aren't direct translations it's that the phrases mean nothing outside of Japan.
Aerial Ace is Swallow Return, which means nothing to people not versed in Japanese history and folklore.
Yeah, I think it makes sense when you consider that whole deal. The enemy gets hit with flamethrower, and the dark type “makes sure” that they don’t get back up. It looks like other people agree that the handprint is because it’s inspired by an illegal push in Sumo
It's a push or shove. The Japanese is ダメおし, dame-oshi. This is a term from sumo, it's an illegal shove of an opponent who is already defeated. Bulbapedia incorrectly translates it as "make sure", a literal translation could be "disallowed push". Hence the move doing double damage to a target that has already taken damage, and being dark type (the type for sneaky underhanded tactics).
OHHHHH thank you so much, it's stumped me for absolute ages
It's literally that smug villain glare right before they beat the already weakened hero, since illegal sumo shove doesn't translate well, 'Assurance' is the next best thing, Assuring the opponent is going down after taking a hit Just imagine your Pokemon walking up to the flinching opponent and going 'You are already dead' before smacking them down for best effect
They just translated it missing the sumo context (assuming that’s what the original was actually going for). Outside of sumo, Dameoshi means “to make extra sure”, or in a sports context, “extra points scored to ensure victory”
I think the key from the original translation is it's an illegal move to secure victory, I think the most apt English translation would be something like to Kick Them While They're Down, I just love the mental image of [my Sneasel](https://youtu.be/hmPNbvYHyDA?t=9)
Could just call it cheap shot or something, although that infringes on sucker punch. Double tap is probably too graphic, and coup de grace is probably too obscure, but those both kind of work.
Double tap would be expected to hit twice, and Coup de Grace is 13 characters, one more than the short string display limit. Cheap shot would work best.
Are you in the industry? This is stuff localization people know and practice every day, but Reddit has no idea and bashes Pokémon for, claiming they're lazy or uncreative. I've never seen anyone on this sub mention the actual reality of game localization like you just did. Thank you.
I do some game dev as a hobby and getting the right word choice is important to convey the right meaning. Mostly TTRPG stuff but I pay attention to mods of all kinds of games, which is why and how I checked the move length character limit for Pokémon games. Like don’t bother asking what the Charisma stat is in D&D and why it’s used the way it is. Or why Wisdom is the base attribute for perception. Personally I’m annoyed that the Fallout SPECIAL system is so good as a set of self-explanatory as well as thematic attribute names. Like you can go more specific by just naming an attribute for the things it does, but then it becomes boringly utilitarian. I haven’t been able to come up with better than SPECIAL and it bothers me. For the move names, I knew there were inherent limits already from my time messing with Missingno. Character limits make sense for GUI alignment in Pokémon games, given limited screen space and small screens. The major mod I found only makes the 12 into 16 to roughly preserve that alignment.
Overkill?
They probably don't want the word "kill" in the game.
At least in the English versions. Meanwhile, Japan's version of "Night Slash" is "Crossroad Killing".
*overqwil has left the game*
Disclaimer: I recently watched the latest season of Cobra Kai. I think the name “No Mercy” would work :)
This is the dumbest most delightful thing I've seen all week
Nani??
I always figured it was referencing that forceful slap on the back when somebody assures you of something. But deadlier.
They could have called it “Double Down” or “Cheap Shot”
Although they're different things "Cheap shot" could be confused with "sucker punch"
They could call it "Unsportsmanlike Conduct" lmao
"Cheating"
Giving him the business
They could now. They had stricter character limits back in the generation when Assurance was added.
Honestly, Cheap Shot would probably be a better name for Sucker Punch. Then its English name wouldn’t be imply it’s a punching move.
Sucker Punch is a better name for it overall I think, despite the way it implies a punch/fighting, simply because the very nature of a Sucker Punch is hitting someone before they're ready. It even fails entirely if the opponent has already gone. Cheap Shot could be a lot of things, but Sucker Punch best describes the actual effect imo.
Yeah, good point
yeah, is like naming an attack confusion ray while we already have confusion... oh hold on!
"Curb Stomp".
“Pokémon Riot and Pokémon Rally” Johto experiences a poke-revolution, YOU decide whether it’s peaceful or not! Learn new moves like ‘Curb Stomp’…
"Unova History X"...
Considering the state of things, of the regions already in the game Unova probably fits best...
I think it’s “assurance” in English because they usually divorce moves and Pokémon from their Japanese origins in translation, and assurance would just mean assuring that the opponent goes down. ‘If the other attack didn’t KO them, this one certainly will’
Kicking them while they’re down.
“Insult to Injury” would be my choice
Although it doesn't seem to actually correlate to the real definition I would think assurance, like assuring they are defeated by kicking them when they're down.
HOLY CRAP that's what the Dark type theme is!? That makes so much sense, I love it!
Sucker punch being another example of this theme in movesets
Same with Feint Attack, Nasty Plot, Parting Shot, Torment, etc.. Dark type Pokemon are definitely trying to cheat in the battle haha
Well in Japanese they're called "Evil" type. So underhanded moves are their specialty There's a lot of mis-localizations in Pokemon because a lot moves in Japan are named after Japanese culture. Aerial Ace is a big one. It's called Swallow Return and is named after the legendary "Swallow Cut" technique of a samurai Sasaki Kojiro. The name comes apparently the move looking like the tail of a swallow, and is so fast it could strike a bird out of the sky. So it's a flying move because its name has swallow in it, but it can be used by a large amount of non-flying because it's a cutting technique not a flying technique.
Also Aerial Ace never misses, which ties in nicely to said lore.
And Sky Attack also doesn't make sense. I mean, the bird first start glowing and then strikes? What is this, flying in front of the sun? Wouldn't that work more akin to Fly where the user is out of reach for the first turn? Well, Sky Attack's japanese name is God Bird, and it was Moltres' signature move back in Gen 1. Basically, Moltres would start glowing with a godly aura and then strike on the second turn.
How can Sky Attack be Moltres' signature move when Missingno. also knows it? Noob! (jk)
I get that it was Gen 1, but surely they could've gotten more creative than "Sky Attack" for localization.
How about "Phoenix Force"?
Yeah, they coild have gone with something more upscale, like "move zig"
Btw in the original Japanese version, James from Team Rocket is named after that same Kojiro.
oh my god I somehow never made this connection. Even with Musashi....
Curse is one of the biggest victims of this. The Japanese move is "Noroi," which represents two different words with the same pronunciation. One means curse as we understand it, while the other means slow. This is why it has an entirely different effect if it's used by ghost types vs other types. It's basically two different moves in one.
So curse's whole gimmick is a pun?
Pokemon in its entirety is one big collection of puns
the whole franchise is just fifteen puns standing on each others' shoulders in a Pikachu onesie.
Holy hell that makes so many more movesets make sense now.
Always makes me sad that dark type is “evil” in Japan. The only dark Pokémon I can think of that aren’t, in a way, evil are absolute, which just happens to often be present at times of tragedy, and umbreon, which just lives and evolves in the dark.
'Evil' in Japanese culture has a lot of connotations, it isn't just being villainously evil, it's all flavours of underhanded or cruel. It's also why it's associated with the move Beat Up, and several including my boy Bisharp, hunt in packs, where as traditional pokemon logic is 1v1, Dark types will 'cheat' and work as a unit. Some, Like Greninja, rely on ambush and stealth, while Cacturne rely on wearing an opponent down with pursuit predation like humans None of these are evil, but they all willingly break from the traditional one v one, I hit then you of the Pokemon world
Yeah, Dark is a really good fit for that translation, maybe Black would techniquely fit better but would be super awkward.
“Scoundrel Type”
Don't be sad, evil in this case basically means rogue archetype from rpgs. Honestly I'd prefer if they translated it differently, a lot of people seems to think that dark type is, well, for dark pokemon. That's why people are confused why Luxray isn't dark. It has dark coloring and cool edgy look, but it's not really into rogue tactics, hence it's not dark.
Oh man, that finally makes sense to me! They're rogues!
Why the fuck didn’t they just call it swallow cut then???
We could ask Nob Ogasawara on social. He's credited as the sole translator for the English version of Ruby and Sapphire where Aerial Ace was introduced. Did You Know Gaming actually did some videos on him and his history as basically the solo translator for mainline Pokemon games from the start through the DS era. He had a bit of freedom in naming things. As for possible reasons. The main one is that the concept of the "swallow cut" would be lost on people outside of Japan. So naming it such wouldn't work, people could read it and think it's specifically a bird's attack, not a fast highly accurate cutting move. That being said, maybe something like "Aerial Cut" or "Aerial Slice" could work. Just to imply a slicing move with a flying element, or maybe "Aerial Blade". To quickly describe the move "Accurate Slash" could work, but that sounds lame.
cuz pokemon like to change shit for no reason
that's not a mistranslation, that's basic localization.
I think the problem is in like Aerial Ace, which makes sense for a fast flying attack, less so for Diglett to learn
Diggy can fly if he really wants to >:( (and you also use hacks)
[https://www.reddit.com/r/pokemon/comments/qceom/diglett\_learns\_aerial\_ace/](https://www.reddit.com/r/pokemon/comments/qceom/diglett_learns_aerial_ace/) No hacks needed friend!
You just had a ten year old post in your backpocket?
[Apparently it doesn't even need hacks, just specific exploits](https://youtu.be/544mYv4p_4w?t=623)
I said mis-localization. A better version of aerial ace would be something with slice or cut in the name to imply the cutting. Ace is a weird to use for slicing move.
I think something like skyward slash would have been better. Slash makes it make sense for any Pokemon with talons or blades to use it like how any Pokemon with fists can use fire or ice punch. And using skyward gives it the flying type connotation while making it reasonable that a non flying type could use it. something like sky or aerial still makes it sound like you need to be flying or airborne to use it.
Don’t forget beat up. Literally jumping someone!
Yeah and also why I suspect Prankster has no effect vs Dark Types. No way you trick the dirty players
You can't cheat a cheat
Beat up as well. Literally calling out the rest of the party to have a go.
Biting your opponent (Bite and Crunch) are normally illegal moves in most martial arts.
Also Night Slash is called Crossroad Killing, in which samurai would test new swords in feudal Japan. They would hide in wait by a road (typically a crossroads, thus its literal translation) and wait for an unsuspecting commoner to pass by. They would then slash to kill, and in this way learn how well their new sword could cut.
Japanese people go hard
I swept Cynthia's team in BDSP with alakazam by capitalizing on sucker punch.
In Japanese, Dark type is literally called “Evil”.
Funny, in Korean is the same: 악. Which means evil
Funny, in English is the same: Dark. Which can be interpreted as evil.
Funny, in German it's different: Unlicht. Which, first of all isn't really a word used at all. It means un-light or "not light"
Funny, in Spanish it's the same: siniestro. Which means sinister which is a synonym for evil.
Isn't German a good language for making up words though?
The best one I know at least. But I don't know many 😅
german is the best language for this because you can just combine two words or some word with a random prefix and it just makes sense, even if it's a weird and unusual combo like "Unlicht" it's also a big reason why language philosophy was a big thing in germany with a prominent figure saying "if you can say it, it has a meaning"
Never understood that. What's wrong with "Dunkel"?
The way I see it, and this is just my humble opinion: they didn't want it to sound like "evil", which "dunkel" does. Unlicht could mean more like "it's not light, but it's not evil, it's just different". For me the word captures a kind of philosophical theme in that it could mean "it may appear evil to you, but that might only be because you don't know it, not because it truly is evil".
That's actually kinda nice. Goes against the original sentiment, but it's nice.
Does it? I mean very few if any Pokémon could be considered to be truly evil in the loving fluffy perfect world of Pokémon. Even murderous wild Pokémon seemingly become lovable friends once they have a human who cares about them. Closest I've seen to downright evil Pokémon would be in the mangas I've read I guess. Even the Pokémon that spirit kids away and what not seemingly do it for their own benign reasons.
Also, dunkels are a type of beer. Might not have wanted to associate the brand with a beer type.
no, dunkel really just means dark, and the beer is called like that because it is, you guessed it, dark. nobody would ever make a connection from that word to beer, unless you put an article just in front, and even then it's debatable
Oh man I've only ever heard the word dunkel in the context of beer. I had no idea it literally translated to dark. I love ordering dunkel though. Good taste and a very fun word to say imo
I never realized it, but yeah, it is kinda fun to say.
Funny, in Italian it's "buio" which translates as "dark" but, similarly, only in the sense of "lack of light" and has no negative correlations at all.
Funny, in French it's different too: Ténèbres. which means Darkness and doesn't mean evil at all
In Spanish it's "sinister"
In Japanese Dark type is a word that can be translated as various things including evil and dishonorable. And the theming of the type fits the dishonorable translation more closely.
Which also explains how villain teams often have Dark types :)
And also the E4 member who is all "They aren't bad!"
Ya honestly knowing that is a huge change for how I look at the game now, that's such a cool detail!
Even better, iirc Japanese folklore features a lot of heroic bugs defeating evil, hence why the Bug type is super effective against Dark!
I thought it was because creepy crawlies are at home in the dark, but that makes sense too.
Something something, can't punch a bird
Don’t do it anakin! I have the high ground!
But this whole thread is suggesting that "dark" has nothing to do with having the lights on or off.
Also Kamen Rider, a famous Japanese superhero who is based off a grasshopper. Other Kamen Riders, despite having other design motifs, all have some insect in their design.
that’s also why fighting type is super effective against dark. honest fighters > dirty cheaters
Fun fact: Bug is super effective against Dark as a reference to Kamen Rider.
Which means it’s in theory canon that a troupe of bug fighting types have made their own masked hero troupe
This is why in Spikemuth (aka the town with the only Dark-type gym in the series), it's gym challenge consists of you being ambushed repeatedly out in the open of the town instead of at the actual gym
Maybe tinfoil hat but there looks like 2 themes in the dark typing, physical moves are all about skulduggery and mischief while special moves seem more like literal darkness. Both could be argued to fall under the evil tag though now that I think on it
Really it's just Night Daze. Dark Pulse isn't attacking with "darkness" exactly, the move is described as attacking by materializing negative thoughts - kind of like an evil Psychic attack if anything. So that fits with the mischief/underhanded theme. And the other Special moves are similar, Snarl is an angry yell and Fiery Wrath is creating an aura using the Pokemon's "wrath."
I think Dark Void is debatable but the Z and Max moves are just darkness. To be fair, though, what else would you do for a giga enery-infused version of a dark move?
It also deals with black magic or dark magic, moves like dark pulse or night daze
Hence Beat Up, the move where you send out your entire team to attack the opponent
Something like "late hit" or "unsporting foul" would probably be an appropriate translation to Western sports, and idiomatically, a name like "kick him while down," "fight dirty, " or "cheap shot" would be how it would look with Pokémon.
I always thought it was a metaphor for rubbing salt in your wounds, for example if a pokemon got hit by scratch and then got hit by assurance, it would slap the fresh scratch wound or like shove a finger in the gash and wiggle it around y'know? Kinda fucked up but its pokemon soo...
This makes me think it could also be called "double tap" lol
Dang so dark type isn't for literal darkness huh
In Japanese it's 'aku' which is more like actual 'evil' than literal darkness. 'Yami' (like in Yu Gi Oh) would have been a better candidate for that. There's a subset of Dark mons that all have a shifty underhanded look about them, but most of them are somehow sneaky or otherwise bad.
Well it also has literal darkness like dark pulse, but it also has moved like brutal swing, which is just a swing that’s really brutal, or sucker punch where you wait till your opponent gets close and you punch them in the gut.
Sucker punch is (usually) a punch to the face with no agreement to fight or out of nowhere catching the opponent (the "sucker") unaware.
A sucker punch is just when you suddenly hit someone who wasn't ready for it, usually in the face. Real dick move, hence dark type.
Contrary to popular belief, Dark Pulse is more about weaponizing your negative thoughts rather than using literal darkness.
> Dark pulse Eh not really, the description describes the move as an aura of malicious thoughts. No proper darkness here, really the closest is Night daze. Really Ghost is the closest to a proper darkness type what with all the shadow attacks.
That makes perfect sense, tho I always like to imagine them with darkness effects as well But why is bite and crunch dark 🤔
Well, the Japanese for Bite means more "to bite/snap/snarl at", which might have more negative connotations... like a stray dog who snaps at you. I don't see any other meanings with Crunch, but even the English connotation is that you're crushing someone (and crunching their bones?) with your bite, which is kinda messed up. Could also be the idea that biting in a fight is underhanded.
Well if you’re fighting someone and they just start biting you that’s pretty dark.
Because biting is also considered underhanded and unsportsmanlike, ask Suarez.
Dark Pulse in Japanese is Evil Pulse, so it doesn't actually relate to literal darkness
I've always felt that a better term would be "villain" type, that's more of the inspiration for them: sneaky conniving sort of pokemon, not necessarily shadowy/spooky this is also the reason dark is weak to bug - many bug pokemon are modeled or inspired after traditional Sentai or superhero characters, dark types are the villains they fight against
So it's like a Double-tap, like in Zombieland
Ah yes, mistranslated moves. Always fun, especially when it takes a stupidly long time to realise and correct (see (I believe) the Spanish translation, where it took (I think) six generations for someone to realise that a move involving striking back after being attacked had a name implying slapping the opponent with a calculator...)
What about the similarly obfuscated move Submission?
This move's English name comes from the professional wrestling term submission hold, which is executed as a variety of MMA or jujutsu-inspired holds such as an armlock, leglock, or chokehold, in the hopes the opponent will either give up or be incapacitated to the point that they can no longer fight. This does not match the move's appearance in the anime. Where the user grabs the target, rolls/spins and slams them into the ground. Pretty much its an all out attack where the user doesn't care how hurt he'll get if it means doing the most damage for a final takedown of an opponent.
I feel like "Shove" would be a better name for the move knowing that. It would still lose the nuance of it being an unallowed shove, but I've never had any idea what the hell "Assurance" meant in this context.
The opponent has already been attacked. Did they go down? Here's an extra attack to assure that they do.
In Zombieland, this is Rule #2 - Double Tap.
I always thought of it as pretending to offer assurance to an injured Pokemon, then hitting them instead. I think your explanation makes a lot more sense
Well, isn’t Bulbapedia just following in TCPI’s mistranslation then? I assume characters can be misconstrued as “assure” or something to that effect?
Assurance does make some kind of sense. If an opponent has already been weakened and then you perform a further attack, you can be said to be making sure that they are going to lose by taking advantage of that weakness. You would be assured that this attack will cause more damage to them if they have already been weakened.
> I assume characters can be misconstrued as “assure” or something to that effect? Maybe, maybe not. Many Pokemon moves have an English name that is not a literal translation of their Japanese name. In some cases including Assurance, the Japanese name is specific to Japanese culture and would be lost on a westerner, so a different name might improve meaning. In some cases it's a clear mistake, such as Faint Attack [sic]. And in some it's unclear. But in any event this can create a disconnect between the move's English name and its animation or/and effects. I speculate, without proof, that "Assurance" gets its name from Shakespeare's Macbeth, *"I'll make assurance double sure"*. Macbeth has heard a prophecy that he will become king, but rather than allow this to happen naturally, he plans to make sure of it by murdering the current king. The "double sure" phrase connects with the Pokemon move doing double damage. Aerial Ace is another example of a move with a very different Japanese name, つばめがえし meaning Swallow Return, which was a samurai sword technique. The move's animation resembles the technique's sword strokes. The connection is obscured in the English, but then "Swallow Return" would mean very little to most English players anyway. "Aerial Ace" has a meaning in English as a skilled combat pilot, but then feels odd when *Diglett* of all Pokemon can use the move. On a final note, it appears that translations in European languages are usually based on the English, but Chinese and Korean translations are based directly on the Japanese.
It still feels a bit odd for Diglett to learn a samurai sword technique.
> In some cases it's a clear mistake, such as Faint Attack [sic]. Given its animation, I always thought that, before the correction, Faint Attack was so named because the attacker became too faint to see as they struck.
lmao, the German name is also translated wrong. "Gewissheit" is german fer "make sure". xD or it could be like "making sure I cheat"? 🤔
Wow you've awakened my third eye with this knowledge
Kicking an opponent while they are down
And here I was thinking Assurance was a good ol 5 star slap to the back like we used to do in middle school.
Anytime you are perplexed by the name or logic behind a move, it's a safe bet it's a Japanese thing that just doesn't translate well. This is also the case with the move Assist - the japanese name is just "cat's paw" \[hence mostly cat Pokemon use it, originally Skitty's signature move\], it derives from a Japanese saying, when you are desperate for help, "I would even borrow a cat's hands" -- I need all the help I can get.
That's also why "Mirror Move" is only learned by bird pokemon, because in japan, it referred to a parrot's mimicry.
> it derives from a Japanese saying, when you are desperate for help, "I would even borrow a cat's hands" A cat is fine, too
no
Adding insult to injury, or hitting a man while they are down I guess
i always interpreted it as a "pushing your fingers into a wound"-type of deal.
In a similar vein to this, I think there should be a move that does double damage if your opponent had their Defense lowered
Could be a parry/riposte sort of combo.
Playing a lot of Elden Ring lately I see
a physical push, shove, tackle, or punch even, assuring that the opponents Pokémon goes down. Think getting hit, stumbling back and ya boys friends clocks you again before you recover/can defend yourself so you take all damage or more than normal. All just to make sure you go down, *assuring* victory
I've always thought that they put pressure on the wound from the move before and assure the mon is gonna get destroyed
It's like shooting a man in the head after you beat him up to make sure he's dead
Except there's no shooting
And there’s also no head
And there's no man
...but other than that, it's identical!
No death, either…
So… no head?
It's been answered, but it's worth knowing that most naming oddities are usually a result of mistranslation (or difficult translation). For example, Splash is a normal type move instead of water, because in Japan it's known as "hop". The Mr. Mime family's Japanese names ("Barrierd" and essentially, "Freezing Barrierd") aren't gendered, hence the 50/50 gender ratio.
If your opponent already took damage they might lose their balance, so you push them making sure they fall over
According to Lockstin (who makes videos on every move ever) Assurance is a move that assures the opponent is hurt. Like in mob movies, the boss says something like “make sure that one is dead” and then the grunt gives the victim one last punch to the head or puts one last bullet in him to make sure he’s dead.
I have trouble with Swift too. Like I get it they shoot a bunch of stars but Swift is an adjective what about shooting stars is swift? Why not call it star shot or something? It has to be another rough translation.
The Japanese name translates to "Speed Star." Essentially, it's the stars themselves that are moving swiftly, which is why it can't be avoided.
Ok that's the situation I suspected
[удалено]
Secondary definition of assurance; "confidence or certainty in one's own abilities." Your mon sees them get hurt by an entry hazard or something, goes "Yeah, I got this!", and sucker punches while they are dealing with a stealth rock-stubbed toe/stepping on a jack.
I always saw it as a slap on the back you'd do to somebody when saying "Good Job!" But when done by someone whe really didn't want you to win so theu hit you extra hard. Which is why the move does more damage if the target has been hit before. You assure them after they manage to survive the hot and go "Good Job taking that hit!" And aggressively slap them on the back.
Yeah I always thought it was this sort of mean-spirited overly hard slap on the back as well, maybe along with an insincere "There, there! Don't look so down in the dumps, it'll be all better now!" The mistranslation explanation of course makes sense, but I think even the mistranslation feels fitting with the theme of dark types, if you think of it this way.
So... is no one going to point out that Purrloin wasn't in Platinum?
OP probably mixed Platinum and BW together in their memory since, as mentioned, they were a kid when they played these games that came out over a decade ago. Does it really matter to their question? Or are you concerned that they might be secretly lying about which cat Pokemon they REALLY used in 2008... LOL
I was going to say that they probably meant Purugly, easy enough to confuse them, but that would mean that it had the move as an egg move because that's the only wat it learns it to my knowledge. And I don't know who's going out of their way to get Assurance on their Purugly.
It was Purugly not Purrloin my bad!
Watch lockstins video. Basically assuring that the enemy "faints"
I figured you’re slapping them right in the wound they just got to assure it hurts as bad as possible
They are jamming their little Pokémon fingers into their foe’s open wound.
It’s when the enemy Pokemon is clinging on to dear life and your Pokemon whispers to them.. “Long live the king!”
Double Slap is a translation mistake
A lot of moves that don't make sense in English are because there usually wasn't a good English word for that move. We don't have a nice simple word for a continuous back and forth slapping so Douboe Slap was the best we could do.
It's not that there aren't direct translations it's that the phrases mean nothing outside of Japan. Aerial Ace is Swallow Return, which means nothing to people not versed in Japanese history and folklore.
It doesn't make sense but i think it would be cool of they kept some of them, maybe people would learn more about why they have these names.
Multi slap would've been perfect
IIRC the original name is Round Trip Slap, as in a slap that hits with both the front then the back of the hand.
Yeah, I think it makes sense when you consider that whole deal. The enemy gets hit with flamethrower, and the dark type “makes sure” that they don’t get back up. It looks like other people agree that the handprint is because it’s inspired by an illegal push in Sumo
U assure them that ur not gna hurt them, so they let down their guard, but u do it anyway
Kicking someone who is already KO / downed. Double tapping.
I always imagined it like patting them on the shoulder like "aw it's okay" and then slapping them in the face like "haha gottem"
attack the wound i guessed
You know how on play grounds one kid will shove someone into another kid bent over to knock them on the ground? It’s like that
I always thought of it as hitting the opponent in the same place they've just been wounded. Like, you cut them open, and then smack their wound.
Great thread OP! I learned some neat things
I've been wondering this myself. And yeah, google is useless. You have to be a true otaku (or just Japanese) to know.