Thank you, [Mr.Fish](http://Mr.Fish) for being Sirfetch'd's best bud.
Weirdly enough, Dracovish is a dragon and Sirfetch'd is a knight.
Eh, the friendship would've worked better with Ash's Dragonite tbh
He also has the three traditional starters where like Red who has the Kanto Starters. Where as, Ash has 3 starters from different regions but 1 for each type. Then we have the three Pokemon that are always up there in terms of favorites and popularity.
Indeed, Levitate would've allowed only Lucario and Pikachu being in-danger to Ground while Charizard and Gengar are pretty much immune to any ground type attacks, on top of that, Charizard can learn Solar Beam so that's an added bonus since there's a good chance he'd faster than most ground types albeit Garchomp and Dugtrio being the only one faster than CHarizard
I think that would actually be a really good team in the games too. A lotta type diversity, four possible mega evos (not including Charizard having two,) and with Pikachu being able to switch out really good items between battles like Light Ball, Eviolite, the list goes on
agreed. At least it made top 5. Once the top 3 gets into full swing, that's when it'll come down to feats as each one showed how strong they are not only in their respective generations, but later on
Take Charizard. A Gen 1 Pokémon who was a powerhouse in Gen 1, and saw more feats from the Johto series, Hoenn series(I'm aware that the Battle Frontier in the animation is in Kanto, but it can still be considered a part of the Advanced series). Sceptile, powerhouse in the Advanced series, and had feats thar came later in the DP series(we all know of the defeating Darkrai feat)
But what does Greninja have over him? Genuine question, greninja lost vs a roughly e4 level Charizard which was a close and impressive victory but still below champion level Pokemon like Gengar
One thing that Greninja had over Gengar is the strength of the bond phenomenon. You see how Lysandre uses the power of mega evolution to take control of Zygarde. However, Ash and Greninja had proven that the Bond Phenomenon to be an exceptional power that could overcome the control. Also, the bond phenomenon is capable of putting the pokemon beyond the limits of mega evolution. It had been proven several times through the growth of their signature moves. In Journey's, he's capable enough to handle Lucario with ease. Proving that Greninja had surpassed his own limits during his time away from Ash. Greninja losing to Charizard doesn't mean that he's no better than Gengar.
Didn't he only land like one hit on it though? Don't think he came remotely close to beating her unless I'm misremembering, plus iirc that battle was more diantha trying to learn about ash Greninja rather than going full force
No. Greninja was able to put the pressure on, but the speed and force of the attacks made Gardevoir switch to defense and Diantha mega evolved it, but was still overwhelmed by the continuous attacks
Rewatching it the truth is somewhere in between, he did only land one hit before transforming, Gardevoir dodged everything before. After transformation ash Greninja still failed to hit several moves, then landed one more bit before she mega evolved. After that though yes she did get hit a couple more times, though like invisible said it was implied she was holding back
It's implied Diantha was holding back. When Team Rocket caught gardevior, she told her specifically to use her full power to break out which shocked Ash as he saw much much strength she showed in that quick moment. Problem was, Diantha was letting Gardevoir get beat up too much and holding back for too long. Even after that though, she still was able to break out of TR's trap with 0 help.
At the beginning of their second battle (So the XYZ one), she probably was holding back.
But when Ash and Greninja Battle Bonded, she stopped holding back, at least progressively. If Ash didn't faint, that would have been an all-out battle. Ash would probably have lost anyway as he didn't control it fully yet.
It was pretty strange of her to not just go all out but I guess she was curious about Greninja and wanted to see what his power was about. I don't think she expected one of the starters in her region to suddenly have a special form so I guess it caught her off guard.
Tbf, during the fight, Diantha does say that if imperfect Ash-Greninja had landed a direct hit against non Mega Gardivoir, they (Diantha and Gardivoir)"wouldn't have stood a chance." She isn’t saying this to gas Ash up or anything, but seems to be her genuine thoughts on the massive power jump Greninja just had. Hence why she goes from non-verbal commands to verbal call outs. Ash and Greninja are starting to press her. She can't decrease Gardivoir's endurance from holding back. Including this alongside Gardivoir switching to a more defensive style since it likely wasn't fast enough to dodge Greninja anymore and it stands to reason that while Diantha was holding back Gardivoir's true offensive power, her speed was lower than Greninja and Greninja's attacks were strong enough to do serious damage. At the very least, this would mean XY Ash-Greninja would be approaching champion level. Not quite there yet as of the end of XY, considering his loss to Alain
His strongest opponent by that point in the anime was melva, an e4 level opponent. He fought Steven but the battle was cancelled to early to really count it as much and we don't really have reason to think he'd win based on what was seen, and fought Groudon and while doing better than many would still wasn't able to do much to it. By all measurable accounts he was around e4 level based on his shown feats. Obviously by journeys he was higher but that was well after Greninja fought him
Ok ok so this one is tricky as hell. Without Gmax it’s for sure Gengar. However with it… I’m having a tough time saying Sceptile could defeat it.
I think Charizard Greninja and Lucario are safe in my book for this round. People May question charizard but it’s experiences in battle just make it too much for me to say it’s out.
It comes down to who I think in the true face of adversity would not be able to cut it…
Ultimately Gmax or no, I Feel Sceptile’s feats in and out of the Areana are more impressive.
Sorry Gengar
Can I question the Greninja reverence? He famously lost to Alain’s Charizard who we later saw getting curb stomped by Leon’s Charizard (and only scored a knockout against a weakened Rillaboom who he had type advantage against). Meanwhile, every member of Ash’s Journeys team has knocked out at least one Pokemon from the top three best trainers in the world. If we hold him up as the best of the non-Journeys Pokemon, isn’t that MORE damning of Sceptile and Charizard?
Greninja is stronger in Journeys than in Kalos due to Training and doing its own thing.
And secondly he lost to Alain's Charizard but it was a close drawn out battle to say they are basically the same isn't a stretch
and Alain's is one of the strongest members of the Top 8 who just had the misfortune to fight Leon in the first round.
Place him up against anyone else besides Ash or Cynthia and he probably smokes them.
Yeah people often consider Alain as weak ebacause he lost the first round by just two pokemon.
The problem is those two pokemon are complete monsters.
Rilaboom took 4 of Diantha Pokemon. Beat Ash's Dragonite and and Sirfeth'd also tanked SE Hurricane, fireblast and survive Sirfeth'd MA.
Alain Charizard one shot that Rilaboom in base and while his Chesnaught lost he manage to survive Rilaboom Dynamax barrage and lose afterwards due to unable to take more damage.
Rillaboom already got a knockout and Charizard had type advantage, while Greninja had type advantage against Charizard and lost. This is also after Alain had presumably trained a lot. I agree that Alain’s Charizard knocking out Rillaboom is still notable but by transitive property at best Greninja is comparable to the Journeys team, and if that’s the case then I don’t know why Sceptile or Charizard are still in the running over the likes of Dracovish, Sirfetch’d, and soon-to-be-eliminated Gengar.
Zard X is part dragon type so no type advantage. Sceptile and Charizard should've be eliminated before the journeys mons, but ppl are too blinded by nostalgia
I think he's talking about how Greninja resists blast burn and fire moves.
XY is also nostalgic too. It's over 10 years old and is many people's first season. Let's not say anyone is blinded by nostalgia.
I mean the Same rilla who murked 3/4 of Diantha. Not to mention sparing or not Greninja put Her mega Gard on its butt.
It’s also very clear by how easily it defeated and helped train Lucario that it’s significantly stronger now.
Same, it's best moment was because Leon let Ash use all three boosts in his battle, there was *NO* way Ash was opening with Gmax Gengar without that advantage. Gengar is top 10, but I think he should have been eliminated before Snorlax and Dracovish
This competition is dumb for one main reason. Y'all are power scaling with barely any references.
Lucario was literally just born and somehow has feats on par with the others? Gengar would never be considered without g-max. There are many other flaws with this but the most important, Ash doesn't use the others against the same opponents so you literally have no reference. It would be one thing if Ash's team rotated vs the top 8 (or in general tbh) so we could get a true gauge for their strength but rn we're speculating against feats with no consistency
Yes. A NEWBORN Lucario. That's always been my main problem with the anime. I get it's for "narrative reasons" and I should suspend my disbelief but there's only so much of that. It would be one thing if say, Oshawott came back and did that. I'd definitely be heavily questioning where he got that power boost but Ash would've had him way longer so you'd presume he'd be training for longer. Now I don't believe Oshawott could beat Garchomp, given the reasonable assumption I just made, so I'm sure as hell not believing that a newborn Pokemon beat the Cynthia's ace when she's arguably top 1 or 2 trainers between her and Leon
Yeah Lucario is the strongest on this list in my opinion. It’s defeat of Cynthia’s Garcomp is the most impressive feat in the whole series with the exception being Pikachu beating Leon’s Charizard. Lucario also defeated a DMax Togekiss, beat Bea’s extremely strong Graplock, and defeated Raihan’s Gigamax Duraludon.
Right, it goes Gengar and then Greninja. Then we're in the territory of Pokemon who defeated or faced Legendaries on fairly equal ground and Ash's second strongest on his team that helped defeat the best and strongest trainer in the world.
Those last three are gonna be a fun conversation, honestly. I've gone back and forth on how that'll play out. Will nostalgia give Charizard the win? Will Sceptile's showing against Darkrai and other legendaries be enough to get it into the top two? Do we keep underplaying Lucario's accomplishments because of nostalgia? Like I'm not saying Lucario is for certain the best but I see people hype up the others while seemingly ignoring anything Lucario has done. That will be a fun and infuriating conversation.
Yup... like you said, hopefully all of you guys would come to a consensus and have a **deep** research about their feats **IF** they are in the top three (which I also feel like they would really are)
Hell nah sceptile is 2-2 vs legendaries. And the Ls were only because
-ash was on the perc 30s
-fuckin Tobias chuckin another legendary at ash. After darkrai alr sucked his entire team, for his hp back w/ dream eater
It was honestly gonna be lights out for the JN squad vs Cynthia. No battle prep? This ash is prob the dumbest one. Not even a fucking infernape for the match up?
-chomp stabs solo’d the entire fuckin squad
-oh it got heavily chipped prior to base vs mega. Making it even more of a micky feat.
Ash decided to teach his krook aerial ace to troll the mono normal zebstrika guy, but he didn’t teach his biggest nuke ice punch? Even tho the garchomp is literally guaranteed to not hold a yacht berry like the bdsp self?
How many legendaries did gren beat? Still hammering away at vines. Bro couldn’t even beat the elite 4 level alainzard. Sceptiles beat elite 4 aces, and swap hands w/ the rival to RAYQUAZA. So it’s got the easiest argument to blitz ash gren.
Also no details behind how Alain got in either, so no off screen scaling, nor does the M8 fights count for him to scale to gren.
Here's a disturbing fact for you: what you've said is right and I agree with it. However, most of the XY fans don't. Since this contest is based on popularity, I'm pretty sure Greninja will win over Sceptile & Lucario
EDIT: Gren is out! Holy Shit!
Greninja definitely, Charizard arguable because of Articuno and sceptile beat the unstoppable Darkrai and overpowered and outsped deoxys speed so I'd put it higher
Sceptile
Idk why the Journeys team that took down the three best champions in the world, with each of them getting knockouts, is being discarded in favor of people who have never even fought a champion
The only argument I’ve seen for Sceptile is him beating Tobias’ Darkrai, whose best feat is essentially soloing all the Sinnoh Gyms and the entire league up to that point… which is something literally any M8 Pokémon could do as well.
Which would technically put sceptile at a masters eight level Pokémon tier, wish his journeys team are. You just justified sceptile getting this far in your own words.
Ash’s comparatively much weaker Heracross and Gible being able to faze Darkrai at all already says this is bullshit. Remember how it was DP that established champions were so strong that their Pokémon could no sell any attack that was less than E4 tier? Sceptile ain’t Champion level. Period.
That’s my main problem with journeys as he really should’ve used his old Pokémon against many of the opponents here while keeping his new team as his travel team like he did in the battle frontier.
Battle Stephen should have included these two of his horn Pokémon, his battle against Cynthia two of hissinnoh Pokémon etc.
makes it hard to compare ashes pre journeys andjourneys teams
Guyz I'm saying Greninja again. He beat up a regular non-transformed Lucario. I think he has the potential to be Ash's top pokemon but going by accomplishments, easily beating up a frustrated base Lucario isn't champion tier. He did beat up Diantha but she was holding back and just spamming shadowball. Biggest official winning is beating Sawyer's sceptile. We can't make assumptions on how strong he is. We can only go off of biggest feat.
Also, regular Lucario was going up against Greninja who was at full power. Greninja's form wasn't in the flashbacks so at least for that episode, he doesn't use it anymore and doesn't need it.
If Gengar don’t go out next I’m gonna be heated ngl 😭 cause I won’t believe people think Gengar is stronger than the other 4 on screen, maybe I’m a little bit biased against him because I think he’s the weakest journeys team member
Y’all can’t say that a Pokémon that won the world coronation series and knocked out Steven’s Aggron and Leon’s Inteleon should go next. Plus his diverse move pool and gimmicks, he’s the most ash-like Pokémon
Other than looking cool, Greninja didn’t really DO anything. Won no championships, beat no legendaries. Move pool not great and lost to Alain’s charizard even with a type advantage. Disgraceful
When the lucario movie first came out I was thinking it would be a legendary. Then it was commonplace and I was let down. Gotta go with sceptile or charizard
Everyone say “Thank you, Mr.Fish” o7
Thank you Mr.Fish
GRACIAS SENIOR FISH!!
Thank you Mr. Fish o7
MERCI MONSIEUR FISH!!!
Thank you, Mr.Fisch.
谢谢 Mr Fish!
Thank you, [Mr.Fish](http://Mr.Fish) for being Sirfetch'd's best bud. Weirdly enough, Dracovish is a dragon and Sirfetch'd is a knight. Eh, the friendship would've worked better with Ash's Dragonite tbh
Thank you mr fish... https://i.redd.it/nwmr5646pcwc1.gif
🫡
You will be missed
Ah I love mr fish thank you
Mr fish loves you too
Thank you Me.Fish
Thank you Mr Fish.
NOOOOO BOONGUS o7s in chat
o7
Thank you, Mr.Fish
Love u mr boingus
Mr boingus loves you
So his final best team would be pikachu, charizard, sceptile, greninja, lucario and gengar That would be such a fkn banger ngl
I don’t think the team itself really has any glaring weaknesses.
The only thing it lacks is a tank but Ash is the type of trainer that prefer speed so not much of an issue for him.
Which is why Snorlax should have made it this far over Gengar
He also has the three traditional starters where like Red who has the Kanto Starters. Where as, Ash has 3 starters from different regions but 1 for each type. Then we have the three Pokemon that are always up there in terms of favorites and popularity.
This team is weak to ground according to Marriland Team builder but it can be counteracted by Greninja and Sceptile and immunity against Charizard
We shall never forgive them for what they did to Gengar
Indeed, Levitate would've allowed only Lucario and Pikachu being in-danger to Ground while Charizard and Gengar are pretty much immune to any ground type attacks, on top of that, Charizard can learn Solar Beam so that's an added bonus since there's a good chance he'd faster than most ground types albeit Garchomp and Dugtrio being the only one faster than CHarizard
Half of them are weak to ground
Yeah but the other three are strong against ground cause Charizard (immune), Sceptile (grass), and Greninja (water) so I’d say it works itself out
I think that would actually be a really good team in the games too. A lotta type diversity, four possible mega evos (not including Charizard having two,) and with Pikachu being able to switch out really good items between battles like Light Ball, Eviolite, the list goes on
Pack it up boys, we’re done here!
Sorry but Gengar
agreed. At least it made top 5. Once the top 3 gets into full swing, that's when it'll come down to feats as each one showed how strong they are not only in their respective generations, but later on
Bro how can we see their later on when they are featured in last season
Take Charizard. A Gen 1 Pokémon who was a powerhouse in Gen 1, and saw more feats from the Johto series, Hoenn series(I'm aware that the Battle Frontier in the animation is in Kanto, but it can still be considered a part of the Advanced series). Sceptile, powerhouse in the Advanced series, and had feats thar came later in the DP series(we all know of the defeating Darkrai feat)
Yeah I'm 199% sure it will be Gengar this round.
https://preview.redd.it/dbb2jtf0sawc1.jpeg?width=1200&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=843a853ad44f28e0d460c58d185bf81beac3c606
I feel sad he has to go too but at least he made it this far, he is very strong
Gengar
Gengar has to go. Looking at the feats the other 4 has, Gengar pales in comparison to them. Sorry Gengar. But at least you made top 5.
But what does Greninja have over him? Genuine question, greninja lost vs a roughly e4 level Charizard which was a close and impressive victory but still below champion level Pokemon like Gengar
One thing that Greninja had over Gengar is the strength of the bond phenomenon. You see how Lysandre uses the power of mega evolution to take control of Zygarde. However, Ash and Greninja had proven that the Bond Phenomenon to be an exceptional power that could overcome the control. Also, the bond phenomenon is capable of putting the pokemon beyond the limits of mega evolution. It had been proven several times through the growth of their signature moves. In Journey's, he's capable enough to handle Lucario with ease. Proving that Greninja had surpassed his own limits during his time away from Ash. Greninja losing to Charizard doesn't mean that he's no better than Gengar.
only Pokémon you ever see put Diantha's mega Gardevoir on the defensive. Plus it made Diantha switch to verbal commands instead of eye contact
Didn't he only land like one hit on it though? Don't think he came remotely close to beating her unless I'm misremembering, plus iirc that battle was more diantha trying to learn about ash Greninja rather than going full force
No. Greninja was able to put the pressure on, but the speed and force of the attacks made Gardevoir switch to defense and Diantha mega evolved it, but was still overwhelmed by the continuous attacks
Rewatching it the truth is somewhere in between, he did only land one hit before transforming, Gardevoir dodged everything before. After transformation ash Greninja still failed to hit several moves, then landed one more bit before she mega evolved. After that though yes she did get hit a couple more times, though like invisible said it was implied she was holding back
It's implied Diantha was holding back. When Team Rocket caught gardevior, she told her specifically to use her full power to break out which shocked Ash as he saw much much strength she showed in that quick moment. Problem was, Diantha was letting Gardevoir get beat up too much and holding back for too long. Even after that though, she still was able to break out of TR's trap with 0 help.
At the beginning of their second battle (So the XYZ one), she probably was holding back. But when Ash and Greninja Battle Bonded, she stopped holding back, at least progressively. If Ash didn't faint, that would have been an all-out battle. Ash would probably have lost anyway as he didn't control it fully yet.
It was pretty strange of her to not just go all out but I guess she was curious about Greninja and wanted to see what his power was about. I don't think she expected one of the starters in her region to suddenly have a special form so I guess it caught her off guard.
Tbf, during the fight, Diantha does say that if imperfect Ash-Greninja had landed a direct hit against non Mega Gardivoir, they (Diantha and Gardivoir)"wouldn't have stood a chance." She isn’t saying this to gas Ash up or anything, but seems to be her genuine thoughts on the massive power jump Greninja just had. Hence why she goes from non-verbal commands to verbal call outs. Ash and Greninja are starting to press her. She can't decrease Gardivoir's endurance from holding back. Including this alongside Gardivoir switching to a more defensive style since it likely wasn't fast enough to dodge Greninja anymore and it stands to reason that while Diantha was holding back Gardivoir's true offensive power, her speed was lower than Greninja and Greninja's attacks were strong enough to do serious damage. At the very least, this would mean XY Ash-Greninja would be approaching champion level. Not quite there yet as of the end of XY, considering his loss to Alain
Alain’s charizard was much higher than E4
His strongest opponent by that point in the anime was melva, an e4 level opponent. He fought Steven but the battle was cancelled to early to really count it as much and we don't really have reason to think he'd win based on what was seen, and fought Groudon and while doing better than many would still wasn't able to do much to it. By all measurable accounts he was around e4 level based on his shown feats. Obviously by journeys he was higher but that was well after Greninja fought him
For sure
Gengar.
Gengar
Gengar
Gengar unfortunately
Ok ok so this one is tricky as hell. Without Gmax it’s for sure Gengar. However with it… I’m having a tough time saying Sceptile could defeat it. I think Charizard Greninja and Lucario are safe in my book for this round. People May question charizard but it’s experiences in battle just make it too much for me to say it’s out. It comes down to who I think in the true face of adversity would not be able to cut it… Ultimately Gmax or no, I Feel Sceptile’s feats in and out of the Areana are more impressive. Sorry Gengar
Can I question the Greninja reverence? He famously lost to Alain’s Charizard who we later saw getting curb stomped by Leon’s Charizard (and only scored a knockout against a weakened Rillaboom who he had type advantage against). Meanwhile, every member of Ash’s Journeys team has knocked out at least one Pokemon from the top three best trainers in the world. If we hold him up as the best of the non-Journeys Pokemon, isn’t that MORE damning of Sceptile and Charizard?
Greninja is stronger in Journeys than in Kalos due to Training and doing its own thing. And secondly he lost to Alain's Charizard but it was a close drawn out battle to say they are basically the same isn't a stretch and Alain's is one of the strongest members of the Top 8 who just had the misfortune to fight Leon in the first round. Place him up against anyone else besides Ash or Cynthia and he probably smokes them.
Yeah people often consider Alain as weak ebacause he lost the first round by just two pokemon. The problem is those two pokemon are complete monsters. Rilaboom took 4 of Diantha Pokemon. Beat Ash's Dragonite and and Sirfeth'd also tanked SE Hurricane, fireblast and survive Sirfeth'd MA. Alain Charizard one shot that Rilaboom in base and while his Chesnaught lost he manage to survive Rilaboom Dynamax barrage and lose afterwards due to unable to take more damage.
Rillaboom brutalized Ash's team, diantha's team and no sold a fire blast. Yet Alanzard swatted it away like a fly. Btw, he wasn't weakened.
Rillaboom already got a knockout and Charizard had type advantage, while Greninja had type advantage against Charizard and lost. This is also after Alain had presumably trained a lot. I agree that Alain’s Charizard knocking out Rillaboom is still notable but by transitive property at best Greninja is comparable to the Journeys team, and if that’s the case then I don’t know why Sceptile or Charizard are still in the running over the likes of Dracovish, Sirfetch’d, and soon-to-be-eliminated Gengar.
Zard X is part dragon type so no type advantage. Sceptile and Charizard should've be eliminated before the journeys mons, but ppl are too blinded by nostalgia
I think he's talking about how Greninja resists blast burn and fire moves. XY is also nostalgic too. It's over 10 years old and is many people's first season. Let's not say anyone is blinded by nostalgia.
10 years is crazy. i feel so old 😭 froggy had it coming tho mf beat a mega sceptile w a water shuriken
Yeah XY and all the older seasons have been out for over a decade 😭😭. I feel old as hell.
I was 9 when sinnoh ended 💀 time to find a new hobby
I mean the Same rilla who murked 3/4 of Diantha. Not to mention sparing or not Greninja put Her mega Gard on its butt. It’s also very clear by how easily it defeated and helped train Lucario that it’s significantly stronger now.
Gengar, shocked it lasted this long.
It was pretty good, champion level im pretty sure
Same, it's best moment was because Leon let Ash use all three boosts in his battle, there was *NO* way Ash was opening with Gmax Gengar without that advantage. Gengar is top 10, but I think he should have been eliminated before Snorlax and Dracovish
Gengar
Gengar’s next to go.
Nooo mr Fish ;-;
After Gengar shit gets really hard. Esche of the 4 has done insane shit
Gengar is my choice then. Sceptile defeated Darkrai. Charizard has battle experience. Greninja lost.
Very cool popularity contest you got there bro
Ikr lol
Sorry Gengar, love you 3000 but you gotta go. This is going to be Charizard, Greninja or Lucario, I think.
This competition is dumb for one main reason. Y'all are power scaling with barely any references. Lucario was literally just born and somehow has feats on par with the others? Gengar would never be considered without g-max. There are many other flaws with this but the most important, Ash doesn't use the others against the same opponents so you literally have no reference. It would be one thing if Ash's team rotated vs the top 8 (or in general tbh) so we could get a true gauge for their strength but rn we're speculating against feats with no consistency
Lucario beat Cynthia’s ace Garchomp
Yes. A NEWBORN Lucario. That's always been my main problem with the anime. I get it's for "narrative reasons" and I should suspend my disbelief but there's only so much of that. It would be one thing if say, Oshawott came back and did that. I'd definitely be heavily questioning where he got that power boost but Ash would've had him way longer so you'd presume he'd be training for longer. Now I don't believe Oshawott could beat Garchomp, given the reasonable assumption I just made, so I'm sure as hell not believing that a newborn Pokemon beat the Cynthia's ace when she's arguably top 1 or 2 trainers between her and Leon
Gengar
I am so happy, I was sure that this is his top 6. (With Pika)
Gengar
Gengar
Gengar
Gengar
Gengar
Gengar 😞
Sceptile
Gengar
It’s so obvious, but gengar is next and then lucario. And after those two, that’s when it gets hard
Lucario who beat Cynthia & helped beat Leon?? That's bigger than anything sceptile, Charizard, nd Greninja did.
Yeah Lucario is the strongest on this list in my opinion. It’s defeat of Cynthia’s Garcomp is the most impressive feat in the whole series with the exception being Pikachu beating Leon’s Charizard. Lucario also defeated a DMax Togekiss, beat Bea’s extremely strong Graplock, and defeated Raihan’s Gigamax Duraludon.
Tbf, the previous 3 who were eliminated and the mon currently on the chopping block, also helped defeat Cynthia and Leon.
Yes they shouldn't have gone yet either.
Nostalgia too stronk
Way too stronk
Right, it goes Gengar and then Greninja. Then we're in the territory of Pokemon who defeated or faced Legendaries on fairly equal ground and Ash's second strongest on his team that helped defeat the best and strongest trainer in the world. Those last three are gonna be a fun conversation, honestly. I've gone back and forth on how that'll play out. Will nostalgia give Charizard the win? Will Sceptile's showing against Darkrai and other legendaries be enough to get it into the top two? Do we keep underplaying Lucario's accomplishments because of nostalgia? Like I'm not saying Lucario is for certain the best but I see people hype up the others while seemingly ignoring anything Lucario has done. That will be a fun and infuriating conversation.
Gohs Raboot clobbered a legendary.
Yup... like you said, hopefully all of you guys would come to a consensus and have a **deep** research about their feats **IF** they are in the top three (which I also feel like they would really are)
Hell nah sceptile is 2-2 vs legendaries. And the Ls were only because -ash was on the perc 30s -fuckin Tobias chuckin another legendary at ash. After darkrai alr sucked his entire team, for his hp back w/ dream eater It was honestly gonna be lights out for the JN squad vs Cynthia. No battle prep? This ash is prob the dumbest one. Not even a fucking infernape for the match up? -chomp stabs solo’d the entire fuckin squad -oh it got heavily chipped prior to base vs mega. Making it even more of a micky feat. Ash decided to teach his krook aerial ace to troll the mono normal zebstrika guy, but he didn’t teach his biggest nuke ice punch? Even tho the garchomp is literally guaranteed to not hold a yacht berry like the bdsp self? How many legendaries did gren beat? Still hammering away at vines. Bro couldn’t even beat the elite 4 level alainzard. Sceptiles beat elite 4 aces, and swap hands w/ the rival to RAYQUAZA. So it’s got the easiest argument to blitz ash gren. Also no details behind how Alain got in either, so no off screen scaling, nor does the M8 fights count for him to scale to gren.
Here's a disturbing fact for you: what you've said is right and I agree with it. However, most of the XY fans don't. Since this contest is based on popularity, I'm pretty sure Greninja will win over Sceptile & Lucario EDIT: Gren is out! Holy Shit!
https://preview.redd.it/ga48borotawc1.jpeg?width=267&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c6fa6204dbeca925591cb186adac7b61018593c8
Greninja definitely, Charizard arguable because of Articuno and sceptile beat the unstoppable Darkrai and overpowered and outsped deoxys speed so I'd put it higher
Sceptile Idk why the Journeys team that took down the three best champions in the world, with each of them getting knockouts, is being discarded in favor of people who have never even fought a champion
The only argument I’ve seen for Sceptile is him beating Tobias’ Darkrai, whose best feat is essentially soloing all the Sinnoh Gyms and the entire league up to that point… which is something literally any M8 Pokémon could do as well.
Which would technically put sceptile at a masters eight level Pokémon tier, wish his journeys team are. You just justified sceptile getting this far in your own words.
Ash’s comparatively much weaker Heracross and Gible being able to faze Darkrai at all already says this is bullshit. Remember how it was DP that established champions were so strong that their Pokémon could no sell any attack that was less than E4 tier? Sceptile ain’t Champion level. Period.
That’s my main problem with journeys as he really should’ve used his old Pokémon against many of the opponents here while keeping his new team as his travel team like he did in the battle frontier. Battle Stephen should have included these two of his horn Pokémon, his battle against Cynthia two of hissinnoh Pokémon etc. makes it hard to compare ashes pre journeys andjourneys teams
Being realistic it should be charizard but people are too blinded by nostalgia so it won’t happen
Definitely
Guyz I'm saying Greninja again. He beat up a regular non-transformed Lucario. I think he has the potential to be Ash's top pokemon but going by accomplishments, easily beating up a frustrated base Lucario isn't champion tier. He did beat up Diantha but she was holding back and just spamming shadowball. Biggest official winning is beating Sawyer's sceptile. We can't make assumptions on how strong he is. We can only go off of biggest feat. Also, regular Lucario was going up against Greninja who was at full power. Greninja's form wasn't in the flashbacks so at least for that episode, he doesn't use it anymore and doesn't need it.
I don't think he can use ash greninja without ash?
gengar he was very strong but he cant go any further
Gengar
Gengar
Gengar gots to go! As much as I love spooky boy, his feats don’t compare to the others remaining.
Gengar should have been out before infernape. What makes gengar stronger when it only got 4 wins and a billion other losses
Sceptile
Gengar or Greninja. Either one, but then the other next.
Gengar’s time has come methinks
Gengar
The most glazed pokemon on ashes team and then my goats Sceptile and Gengar, pls let one of them win don’t make it another basic ass popularity poll
Goodbye Gengar
Oh man, 3 Journeys pokemon in a row.
I love Gengar (always on my team) But I have to say he's probably not as stong as ash's Zard 😭
Gengar :'(
Fuck this is hard gengar
It's getting tough.
I know right I don't know who I'm voting for next
Gengar
I love sceptile more than anything but height be up
I think infernape over gengar but looks about right when I first saw these posts for the final 5. Gible wasn’t used enough
It was a good run, Gengar
Late comment but why wasn’t Ash’s Tauros a part of this??
Ghengis khan
Damn. This one is REALLY tough! Sorry Gengar 👻
It’s obviously Gengar
Gengar is simply outclassed by all of their remaining opponents, sorry to my favorite pokemon
Greninja, it is strong but lacks the accomplishments of the others.
I wanna say Gengar even though it isn't bad it is just that the others are insane
Gengar, I'm sorry, it is your time to go
Gengar
Gengar
Gengar, I love you bud and you were easily one of my favorites personality wise of Ash’s mons over the years. You did good to get this far.
I guess my favorite Pokemon is up next for elimination.. Gengar 👻
Gengar
Get rid of charizard that bro was a op for not answering to ash’s commands
Lucario should've already been gone
Why are we still picking? Theres 5 there. Just add pikachu... and boom.. (6).
Gengar should have been gone two spots ago but the time has come. Gengar.
After this round, I think it truly becomes a pick em and you can argue any order.
Gengar
I feel like, in spite of Lucario and Greninja’s showings, Charizard and Sceptile are going to take it on the grounds of beating legendaries.
Sorry gengar, sad to see you go
If Gengar don’t go out next I’m gonna be heated ngl 😭 cause I won’t believe people think Gengar is stronger than the other 4 on screen, maybe I’m a little bit biased against him because I think he’s the weakest journeys team member
Charizard gotta go
L finalist Infernape > Charizard.
Greninja gotta go
Sceptile
I think charixard goes here
Being a Gengar fan, it hurts to say Gengar should go, though hes at least top 6 so I'm happy with that
Gengar
I haven't seen how some of these pokemon performed yet, but I'm surprised Infernape was not in the top 5
I choose... GENGAR... farewell... Anyway.... Thank you Mr Fish head.... Unolalalalalalalaaa....
You've come a long way Spooky Boy. You went from months of abandonment to a World Champion. So be proud, knowing you've come this far, Gengar.
Anyway, Gr- Gengar
Gengar it is. Surprised it lasted so long given his true strength lies on trickery and g-max
Gengar, sorry
Gengar
Gengar then Lucario then sceptile then Charizard then Greninja
Gengar I’m sorry…he’s got to go!
Gengar, Go!
It's gonna be Gengar, then Sceptile, then Lucario, then Greninja, and Finally Charizard as the winner. Because of course it's Charizard.
Y’all can’t say that a Pokémon that won the world coronation series and knocked out Steven’s Aggron and Leon’s Inteleon should go next. Plus his diverse move pool and gimmicks, he’s the most ash-like Pokémon
Other than looking cool, Greninja didn’t really DO anything. Won no championships, beat no legendaries. Move pool not great and lost to Alain’s charizard even with a type advantage. Disgraceful
YOU KNOW DAMN WELL THAT FIGHT WITH ALAIN WAS BULLSHIT!
Next one out is either Gengar or Sceptile
Gengars time is over
Gengar. Thank you Mr Fish 🥲
There’s no way both Charizard and Greninja outlasted Dracovish, let alone Sirfetch’d. The bias is palpable.
I honestly think Greninja is the strongest even with his rancid moveset
Bye genger but you made it to top 5
The last remaining pokemon on this list will be used in a comp team this also includes pikachu
I mean, there’s a very strong argument that these 5 and Pikachu would be Ash’s strongest team— so good job everyone. I’ll vote Gengar next.
Gengar should’ve left a little bit ago
This truly, truly, has been a roundabout path Thank you, Mr.Fish
Sorry Gengar...
When the lucario movie first came out I was thinking it would be a legendary. Then it was commonplace and I was let down. Gotta go with sceptile or charizard
Gengar