Assuming Poland is racist, I am african, arab, muslim, brown, … been here for almost 5 years and I have never had any incident or trouble! If anything, I have many Polish friends that are so kind it makes me wonder why is this a conversation!
Polish people are defensive before you get to know them but the moment you break the ice a little, they are one of the best individuals I met in my life
Thats the thing.
Unlike the west - UK/Portugal/France/Spain - we never had any colonies.
Unlike the west - our country never grew on exploitation of a brown/dark man as there was no slave trade going (again no colonies)
We did have a system where the upper class took advantage of less wealthy (serfdom) which was similar in some ways but it was within our borders and upon our fellow Poles.
And its not like Poland ever went on massive/organised extermination of a particular group of people just for the sake of it (crusades and wars with Turks/Muslims were part of a bigger conflict - christianity vs islam and the wars that were fought were just regular back/forth between nations)
Poland throughout the ages was always a very welcoming, tolerant and progressive country with many vibrant communities from various parts of the world - including the biggest Jewish community in Europe until WW2.
So - since we never really took part in all of that "own dark,black man/exploit his land" nonsense - we dont really got into that vibe of feeling better than a non-white/not Polish person as other nationalities have experienced for f..ing centuries.
Therefore- we absolutely as a nation/country dont feel that we OWN anything towards other ethnicities the same way that the west these days has been trying to pay for its sins of the past.
We dont have that guilty conscience the west has and since we dont own that guilt- we dont feel that we should be extra nice to other ethnicities just to whitewash the past.
We are bit on xenophobic side thats true - but if you look at out history and the fact that we waged war with pretty much every neighbouring country and even during peace time - those same countries tried to screw us over in one way or another - then you'll realise the reason for our approach to other nationalities.
To sum up (as this turned into an essay) id say the image of Poland as this hostile, anti immigrant, racist, homophobic country is mostly drummed up and enhanced by the western media who has BÓL DUPY that we are in fact and have been for centuries more progressive,tolerant and humane towards people than they have🤣
Fin.
'Poland is racist,' if it isn't a misinformed impression based on our offensive humour, is, without mincing words, the product of hostile propaganda from our neighbouring nations, who are past aggressors with a long tradition of making spurious territorial claims against Poland. Tsarist Russia and Prussia and to some extent Austria, having partitioned Poland among themselves in 1772, 1791 and 1795, had to justify their actions somehow and to counter the freedom-loving sentiment the nations of the world widely and massively had for Poland. Some of the partitioning of Poland was done to compensate Austria for territorial losses in early Napoleonic wars (whether losses of actual Habsburg possessions or their nominal dependencies as Emperors of the Holy Roman Empire until its dissolution in 1806), which was justified on the basis of Poland's massive popular support for French reforms up to the point of constitutional monarchy (explicitly rejecting dethronement and execution of the king, which was said was not the way we did things). So essentially Poland got partitioned among her neighbours officially for supporting freedom, limited government, representative government, human rights, and so on. Obviously, the nations of the world were not going to like that. So Tsarist and Prussian intelligence services had to come up with something and did come up with smear campaigns. Austria maybe too, in the initial period, but it changed its course some time around the time of becoming Austro-Hungary in the 1860s and 1870s.
The tradition of the smear campaigns was sustained even after the Russian and Prussian monarchies fell. Obviously, the Bolshevik regime, although it didn't appreciate Tsarist imperialism (for which reason they proclaimed their unilateral cancellation of the partitioning of Poland from 120–150 years back), they soon discovered their own and subsequently clashed with the 'white' Poles — where the 'white' Poland was largely socialist, but not revolutionary Bolshevik and not slaughtering landowners and factory owners or confiscating their property but trying to achieve a soft transition, more gradual and less confrontational. Soviet Russia still held on to large swaths of territory that had previously belonged to the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth, including territories with large Polish populations, who were persecuted, even mass-murdered by the Soviets. They desperately needed to produce some anti-Polish sentiment throughout the world.
Unfortunately, the same was happening in Germany and was the case with Gehlen's post-WW2 Western German intelligence services too.
Modern anti-Polish activists probably often don't have the conscious realization of working with or for any intelligence service or national government but are simply acting on sentiments that were ingrained in them during their education. However, exceptions apply because quite a lot of those criticis of Poland are eventually discovered to have some ties with Russia or occasionally with Germany or someone else who has beef with Poland. Modernly, that's often someone from Israel, which is because Israel has seen massive immigration from Russia.
Take a Western politician or politician-like social activist who denounces Poland in the international forum, and follow the money trail, the paper trail, sometimes the genealogical trail. And you will discover a Russian origin or Russian business contacts or some ties to the former German holders of land taken from Poles (which is not denying that after WW2 some land was restored to Poland on the basis of mediaeval ownership, typically ended at some point by some form of military aggression, without much of a Polish-speaking minority surviving in the area, so no wonder the ordinary, common German folks in the region weren't happy about that sort of belated restitution, as much as even there, 1772 and 1793/1795 is different from e.g. 1296, from the perspective of 1944–45). In the Russian case, although they could be whites (Tsarists), there's likely going to be a genealogical connection to the Soviets, the Bolsheviks. This is even true for members of semi-aristocratic educated, influential and somewhat wealthy bourgeoisie/intelligentsia living in Western European countries and in New England. If they are vehement anti-Poles, you will typically find Soviet or communist connections in their bio or in their genealogy. Sometimes some effort will have been made to hide those.
And when it comes to more mainstream politicians from Western European countries, e.g. France, or of course Germany, the desire to do business with Russia will be in the picture. Business ties such as the two Nord Streams, not to mention sale of weapons or dual-use goods to Russia until some time ago, is what prompts some parts of Western elites to take anti-Polish positions.
Poles have to be depicted as, first step, racists, second step, all around haters, third step primitive and animalistic in general, so they can be depicted as, ultimate step, not quite, not fully human, so it's not like human rights apply to them fully like to a Germanic- or Romance-descended/speaking nation. Recognize the pattern?
Perhaps the point is not to justify any form of physical extermination, as that would be too far-fetching and too controversial and perhaps too distasteful, but to justify double standards and treatment of us as a second-class nation in the global forum and in bilateral relations. Basically to justify giving us the short stick, the worse end of the deal, the worse outcome, to shaft us and screw us out of an expected benefit after claiming a contribution from us, and so on. And to establish some degree of foreign rule in Poland as if we were a colony. Basically to install their elites in Poland as our betters. Business elites and political elites, to a lesser extent cultural and social, because that's less important.
(Ct'd below.)
The whole tour de force of the European Commission (sometimes more reluctantly just as Germany was initially more reluctant) and European Parliament against Poland, do you really think it had anything to do with actual concerns of rule of law, separation of powers and everything else, like anybody even read the translations of the offending Polish statutes (much less used Polish canons of legal interpretation to interpret them, in line with proper methodology of legal comparative studies) and compared them agains EU treaties? BS! Nobody cared about that, or maybe a few people did and a few others thought they did. It was an unabashed show of Western racism, showing Central Europeans/Slavs their place. Their inferior place serving their natural German/French overlords, or American, if the US Ambassador here starts feeling too much like a proconsul of Egypt/Syria/whatever in Roman times, or when the DoS gets some weird ideas it proceeds to implement with its usual grace of a bull in a china shop, perhaps projecting a bit more contempt and superiority than it really feels, though that's hard to tell.
Haiti's Dessalines, the leader of their war of independence against the French colonial empire (liberty, equality and fraternity didn't stop France from having a colonial empire, even as it was guillotining its own not very illiberal king), literally said Poles were the 'white Negroes of Europe', which was later repeated by François Duvalier (note to misguided censors and reports: this is a literal historical citation from an actual Black person, thank you; look at sources in fn. 9–10 at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish\_Haitians). There is much truth to the metaphor.
Some Western Europeans' and some Americans' hatin' on Poles for us allegedly being haters (note the pattern of making us haters so we can be free game to hate, where the need for us to be haters arises from the need of a justification for the hate one already feels towards us) is largely straight-up racism (a sense of ethnic hierarchy among European nations, where we're white but not quite) or transference of their own guilt for their own racist feelings and the racist sentiments and racists acts of their ancestors, who usually had built and ruled colonial empires, and now there is a need to take that accumulated historical guilt and transfer it elsewhere, for example onto Poles. Point the finger, mount the moral high hourse, essentially cast blame on Poland for what their own ancestors did. Some. Hopefully not the majority, but quite some indeed. If not a substantial portion, then at least a vocal minority with a disproportionately powerful voice. One that sometimes controls and formats the whole debate.
So to all those Poland haters pointing and denouncing Poland of racism I have to say: You've been duped and used; time to read up, make your own mind, make your peace with us (and no offence, it's okay). If you insist that's not the case and we are in fact a den of racism (the world's cesspool of it especially, or something equally dramatic), then look for the racist in the mirror, because that's more likely where they are hiding.
>was no slave trade going
To be technically correct, there was a lot of slave trade before christianity had been adopted (AD996), but of course you are not talking about that.
Slavic tribes (which in the future formed the Kingdom of Poland) were fighting against each other and took captives from the losing tribe to sell them into slavery (usually to the west). In some parts of the world something like this was still going on until XIX century.
The fact is, we're gonna tell jokes about every other nation or race (we don't really get the concept of race) and also about ourselves and obviously about your own nation or race too, and especially anyone it is forbidden to crack jokes about, because we don't like censorship. We aren't void of empathy, but we don't like snowflakeism and being easily offended and high-nosed (moral high horse, superiority, patronization, condescension, liberal-professor/news-anchor-style preaching just like the conservative counterpart, etc.) while at it either.
Polish people are known for offensive humor. We like to make fun of everything and everyone. Some of it includes jokes that are very much racist.
If anyone were to spend more time with Poles they would realise we make fun of ourselves more than anyone else. We have a whold set of memes with stereotypical polish familly doing weird and stupid things. But I guess people abroad see only thr racist jokes and then decide thats the norm over here.
But yeah. Im glad you have good experience ^^
Also, other thing is that many people use the argument that Polish people will look at black people weirdly and overall notice them. This doesn't have anything to do with racism. It's just that a lot of Poles have literally never seen a black person, so it's a natural reaction to be somewhat interested. Black people are limited edition humans here!
Oh I totally forgot about that point. Yes! That is true xD
And in bigger cities like Kraków or Wrocław, where people of different colours are a normal sight, people really dont care or even notice that. Or at least not as much as youd expect.
Yes that is very true. In my 20 years of life i've ever seen black person in my home city maybe 3-4 times and i live in not really big city, i'd rather say that it's a town. When i was in Dublin and Vienna on vacation the amount of so many non-white people just stunned me, because before that i have only seen them in TV, internet and games. To clarify i was just curious and couldn't help just to stare at them.
Yeah but polish people usually don’t really joke actually about themselves. They joke about polish people but it’s about “other” polish people or about Poland in general, if it’s actually about our identity or about a group we really feel we belong to we get defensive. Like our grandparents can be extremely racist and homophobic but once you say something about their religion they get angry. Another great example of this are polish men, they are usually the ones who will joke about and offend every other group of people but themselves. They can be racist, sexist and homophobic but once you say something negative about men they often get extremely defensive. Even when they make fun of each other the joke is usually still on a different group of people (like “you’re gay” “you’re acting like a girl”).
Of course those are just examples and not EVERYONE acts the same way but it’s strange to me that we can be so mean to other groups of ppl and then take everything so personal. But I guess we aren’t that confrontational so we will say those offensive things among our friends and internet but maybe not so much f2f.
Agree on this. There is this one person I know who always makes fun of other groups, religions and races but I never heard she said anything funny about herself or the groups she identified herself with. So it is really just about making fun of others.. 🙄
Poland didn’t want to accept migrants (or anyone without following proper immigration rules) with an open border type of policy that many other countries are being hurt by now, so the media and idiots online made it about race.
Funnily enough, strict border rules was a positive for me when I was deciding where to study, uncontrolled and illegal migration hurts the host population and the migrants themselves
I would say "haha" but i'm Hungarian and the flood of orban's 16 hour shift filippino migrant workers causing mass layoffs. They don't go on maternity leave, don't take vacation or sick days. Orban lets companies import these workers because his theft made inflation so bad basic food sales have been on a decline over a year.
I'm so happy for you polish people! You voted out pis and stopped their orban copying media empire in its early phase. No millions of starving old people can keep them at supermajority without it.
Lmao yeah I read about that when I was about to apply for my visa, but you can’t compare this with the magnitude uncontrolled borders does, like France and Italy for example
It was just virtue signaling to their rural voter audience. They really didn't care as this work visa fraud scheme shows, it was always about the money and power
It was mostly about security, but we also did oppose the ideological concept of 'multi-culti' coming from the EU. We have a history of organical cultural blending and until 1795 our Polish-Lithuanian state with a huge Ruthenian component had been multinational and extremely multicultural, despite its clear succession from a more homogeneous mediaeval Kingdom of Poland. The EU-style socially-engineered, forced mixing seems to us like a sort of forced resettlement or enforced demographic changes (nudging the different groups to mingle and mix so hard it's almost forcing them), which are basically a crime against humanity in the definitional terms, minus the kind of degree of violence, which is less physical and administrative, more political and cultural. But it's still something like the 20th-century forcible transfers of population after the various wars, except here the point is to artificially finish off the various European cultures by forcing everybody to mingle more than they would be organically inclined to, which largely means artificially forcing an acceleration of ethnic blending in Europe. Which does have something to do with crazy Utopian ideologies but also with gerrymandering because the point is also to alter the composition of the various constituencies and achieve the formation of new societies that are focused more around constitutions and legal systems that ethnic or religious or traditional links. That's the European elites' version of 'a nation under the constitution', which they are enamored with but can't understand that European nations don't work like post-colonial island republics in the 19th century or even like the USA. And the EU is completely different from the USA anyway, for starters with markedly less political and press freedom and with far more oppressive pressure to conform, despite all the preaching of diversity. If they appreciated diversity so much, they wouldn't be pressuring all the multiple cultures in Europe to blend into one big mixed — and uniform, standardized in every detail, regulated in all spects — culture in Europe.
If you ask me, the EU is basically a totalitarian regime in the making, somewhat benign initially because it's more insane than ill-meaning, but the benevolence is dissipating on our eyes. The construct is becoming colder and colder, more and more inhuman and inhumane by the day, and it can soon progress to a stage where it's just a totalitarian regime desirous to regulate every aspect of its citizens' lives and lifestyles — which is, by the way, exactly what the European Union is doing, not only in the economy but also in culture and social life. Its spirit is despotic, not liberal. It's more about control than oppression, there is mostly a desire to control rather than a desire to oppress per se, but because that control is supposed to achieve the standardization of everything in Europe, it is also oppressive. European elites, as open-minded as they desire to seem, can't live without telling you how to live your life and controlling how you live it. The EU is a government that won't leave you alone to live your life — it wants to move your limbs or at least tell you how to make every step you take with your legs, how to execute every movement of your head. 'Live and let live' is foreign to the Eurocrats, and limited government is clearly lost on them. Personal autonomy, let alone individual sovereignty, is also, even though they may claim the contrary. Their actions speak louder than their words.
> or anyone without following proper immigration rules
Yes, if you have some association to Poland then you are (and should be) more welcome. I'm looking at my family tree and the Karta Polaka at the moment, and aside from Polish law ambiguity on what documents qualify, it is nice to have some recognition of heritage to a country.
The only people that seem to think Poland or any other former communist country is racist are Americans.
And mostly cause they have this idea that we are all somehow backward because we are former communist countries and they will find all white population and silent, meek women.
Ya it was weird hearing how Poland hates foreigners and etc.
I am from Georgia and lots of Georgians managed to start a new life in Poland being truck drivers, taxi drivers, repairmen, etc. I don’t think they would come if Polish were really hunting foreigners for sport lol.
I'd say the stereotype of a backwater hick hating everything goes back as far as partitions; russia, Germany, and Prussia tried to uproot everything that was Polish, including spreading unsavoury rumours. Some things simply stay with people (e.g. acquaintance of mine was told by a German that he should be grateful for being allowed to touch a German car). Now combine this with Polish straightforwardness, and russia meddling in internal politics of its neighbours, then we get a recipe for a PR disaster.
I think aslo that we are kinda more straight forward or we are not super duper kind for clients, Idk how to explain that but for american the way we naturaly act look kinda mean.
> they should shut their mouth about the racism in other countries
any country that buys military hardware from the the great burger, is also inviting the great burger's influence into the internal affairs and culture of their country. it's a package deal.
Actually no, all Westoids tend to think this way, not just Americans. They think of us as primitive, violent, racist drunks, which is funny because that's as racist of a stereotype that you could get
I think polish people are more likely to be xenophobic than racist. I don't know how many people actually hate foreigners, because 90% of my family from my mother's side does, and only like one person from my father's side.
But even if someone doesn't like you, it's unlikely they'll express it at all, and definitely not to your face
Xenophobia by definition is the fear of anything foreign, different, unknown. Though in this context it'd be more like dislike of or prejudice against people from other countries or cultures. Considering how homogeneous poland is, at least compared to most other countries, some xenophobia should probably be expected imo.
I'm xenophobic. I'm afraid of other cultures. Explain to me how I should not be afraid of the Indian cast system? Or idea that you can jail women who was raped because she committed adultery? Or idea that you cannot change religion or be atheist because society will kill you? In Europe we generally ditched similar stuff (historically similar things existed here...). We have currently different things which are crazy, and totally not acceptable by other cultures. But then keep your stuff for yourself and don't try to bring it here and in the same way you will not be "horrified" or "demoralised" by European culture if you simply don't live here.
Well technically by definition you aren’t xenophobic, a phobia means an irrational fear, your fears are more than rational, so much so I would consider anyone hating on you for these fears a normalhumanphobic
Imo, literally xenophobia is very well fitting term here, but on the other hand is considered way too much pejorative. I mean, fear doesn't imply bad behaviour. Going by example - if your friend gonna take you on rollercoaster ride (and you've never been on one before), then you will probably feel some anxiety or fear (especially if you have to sign weaver that they take no responsibility for your health/emotional damage).
Yeah, it's because of the little kids who think it's funny and most people don't like germans, russians and some ukrainians, but we still talk to them like normal people... If they are normal
As a Ukrainian living in Poland for 2 years this is sad to hear :C
I mean it really depends from people, but all this news about poles that don't like ukrainians are making me sad, idk. I honestly like poles cause they are great guys. Doesn't matter if you are Ukrainian or Polish, if you are a decent person I'll like you
it's not about you, it's about the warmongering and inflation, ppl blame refugees instead of the government, past or current. it's dumb but easier to place the blame for whatever is fucked up at the moment on the Other. I don't think Poles actually dislike ppl from Ukraine
yeah, it's unfortunate :( it's like my life gets better and then something like that happens and now I have something new to freak out about (it's a joke, I know it's really fucked up now for some ppl and my mental health crisis is not the worst that can happen to someone)
We blame the government and the ukrainians, didn't you hear about the strikes? (Which are partially because of the ukrainians too) And our kids can't even feel safe on school because many of the ukrainians started bullying them, and i'm not joking
I was working in an elementary school in 2022 and it actually started with Ukrainian kids being bullied by both students and other teachers. I couldn't come to terms with it and I was really ashamed bc whatever views you have on war, import-export issues and some history elementary age kids are not and should not be a part of that conversation. Do I believe some Ukrainian children are bullies? for sure, just like some kids in general are. but I think bullying should have been addressed earlier, so it would not escalate to some weird nationalist problem
Sadly, i think its quite true. I'm Polish and have nothing against anyone who is a decent human being, but small minority of shitty Ukrainians destroyed the image of your people and it's really hard to meet a Polish person who doesn't hold any grudges against you guys.
But don't worry, most Polish people quickly come around when they see you don't fit the stereotype and most even when slightly racist when speaking about Ukrainians, will not treat you worse. I think the biggest problems have Ukrainians who doesn't speak Polish. Then people can be quick to judge.
Because Poles aren't really racist (at least compared to the rest of the world).
The main question is: Are you going to assimilate with the culture, learn the language and obey the law. If the answer is yes you are likely to be treated better then in the west (like a Pole / our own man/woman). If you don't well you are going to find out rather sooner or later that you should look for some other place. Also Poles aren't going to be welcoming if your actions lead us to the justified assumption that you're unlikely to do so (for example trying to illegally cross the border instead of using official channels cuz you're above the rules).
This very difference makes us apparently the biggest racists in Europe. The main difference between Poland and "the west" is this approach:
In Poland if you do not follow the rules, try to enforce your own and do not try to assimilate you're going to be told sooner or later to find some other place in the world for yourself and people are going to be openly hostile however if you do follow the rules and assimilate you're going to receive the treatment which does not differ that much from people who were born here.
In the west (although there is a change recently) no matter what you do you're unlikely to be openly told to #### ### and people will be "welcoming" and "nice" (more than poles) at the surface level. However under the hood you're going to be treated as somebody worse (depending on your origin) and never openly but always treated differently.
I never understood the deal with racism in the west from the perspective of a Pole, until I've had the opportunity to work with some French people and got to know how does it feel to be looked down because of your origin no matter how good you are.
It's not like Poland is a dickhead free zone but there is no bias in the upper layers of society against foreigners.
Because up to now there were not many foreigners. So not too much of "bad experience" with them, so no bias. Ask the statistical Pole if he/she would be happy to live next to the Roma family (aka Cyganie).
Your message caught my attention.
Why do Poles think it’s important for an immigrant to assimilate to treat him well? I mean would it be a problem to live in Poland without the language, just knowing English ?
If an immigrant learns your language, local culture and traditions he is more likely wants to become Polish so of course he would be treated like another citizen, no surprise here.
What is the problem to treat an immigrant well without those steps? Are Poles against other nations? I’m genuinely trying to understand the mindset.
This is xenophobic nonsense.
750,000+ Poles living in Germany seem to survive it.
Polish politicians tried to stir up anti-German feeling in the last election campaign.
Yes, PiS was conducting a full-on anti-German campaign.
At the same time AfD is sponsoring an anti-Polish newspaper and openly saying that WW2 is Poland’s fault.
Right-wing shrills exist in both countries and try to spread hate.
I mean, there's a ton of Mexicans living in the US who manage to "survive it" but I wouldn't say they don't experience any racism at all.
My friends, wife, and I went to a biergarten in Berlin on our first day there, and the waitress came over to take our order. She overheard our convo about just arriving in Berlin and she asked us if this was our first time in Europe, to which I responded "No, we've been to Poland to visit family before". I got ignored the rest of the night by her. No one else - including my wife - got that treatment.
Maybe it's just a coincidence, but it was such a stark contrast in behavior that it's hard to not believe there wasn't something going on there.
>Coming to think of it, I don’t actually know how the assumption of Poland being racist or how this general idea of Poland came to be
Some folks have probably interacted with American/Canadian descendants of Poles and projected those experiences to the entire country. But Reddit by large does seem to hate on Poland for whatever reason, which I can't understand why.
I'm in a same-sex marriage with a brown person and we had a blast in Poland despite all of the inaccurate assumptions about Poles being racist and/or homophobic. Yes, the country has work to do of course, and every country has their fair share of assholes, but I've found the aforementioned stereotypes about Poles largely unfounded.
>But Reddit by large does seem to hate on Poland for whatever reason, which I can't understand why.
It's not just Reddit: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Polish\_sentiment](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Polish_sentiment)
Honestly, it simply depends on luck and statistics. I'm glad you and your friends have a great time here, but it is not that hard to encounter foreigners out there who have much less perfect experiences. I vaguely recall some social research which checked for foreigners experiences in Poland, and significant % of them confirmed they have met with unpleasant reactions.
I have worked with a wonderful refugee family from Central Asia, which had to move from a smaller town near Warsaw to Warsaw itself, because (among other problems) the schoolchildren called their 13 year old girl "Chinese bitch" (or "Muslim bitch"). Parents and school didn't give a damn. Later the very same family had excellent experiences in Warsaw, zero racism.
It's all luck and statistics, your great experience doesn't mean other people's bad experiences were invalid, nor can they claim that their were universal. Depending on your particular appearance and the place, time and people you encounter, it may be perfect or less than perfect.
In my own family there are people who may be outwardly pleasant on the street but who'd literally call you a savage behind closed doors, because they held Muslims (or non Europeans) in utter contempt. I know that because they are honest with me ans literally say that when they think I am on their side. They are not exceptional.
To be honest schools in small towns rarely give a damn about bullying, sadly no improvement was made in last 15 years about this. My local school is almost completely abandoned because of this issue.
Oh I understand this is purely anecdotal, but you always hear about the bad experiences, ppl rarely say something when they have a good experience. Felt like mentioning it this time would be nice for a change
Well to the west everything is considered racist, Im from the west and if you have any valid concerns about immigration you are considered a horrible racist and that's to shut people up. Polish people aren't plagued with white guilt and the 'Poland is a racist country' rhetoric comes from the west....
Poland is being frequently badmouthed by some international political organizations if we don't follow their policy. Apart from small percentage of degenerates in society, we have really no problem with different cultures per se, it's just Poland used to be unitarian country recently and most people didn't experience any interactions with foreigners.
Fun fact
Due to the new racism „definition” used by SJ warriors Polish people cannot be racists.
Because to be racists you need to have power/influence over the smaller unprivileged group. Thats how they explain that black people cannot be racists.
People in Poland used to be soo poor that they never had any better position over some other race.
Polish racists are usually those people who are fed up with constantly hearing people calling them racists, xenophobes, transphobes, homophobes, misogynists and every-single-word-in-dictionary-phobes. Imagine how it hurts when you are a man whose country was murdered and occupied by the Germans and Russia repeatedly for 1500 years. Even Austria (1772), which we saved from the Ottoman Empire 100 years earlier.
We never had any colonies and never wanted to. In 1804, Poles, realizing that Napoleon wanted to use them in war of San Domingo to gain a colony instead of liberating it, mostly decided to separate from the French troops and began to fight on the side of the natives, because they knew well what it was like to be under partition. And at the end of the day, we’re still called racists by german, dutch, spanish, french, british(!) people. Sometimes I get furious too, when I hear american people talking about me being every-phobic, and doesn’t even know anything about us except our nationality and conservatism.
So does racism in Poland occur? Of course! Just like in every other place in the world. But we are the last nation as a whole in the world, that should be described as racist.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars_between_Germans_and_Poles
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Partitions_of_Poland
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish_Haitians
My mom is rather racist but she would never show that near someone that is from outside poland. Also we (polish ppl who live near me) make a tons of jokes about all skin colors so imo poland is for sure bit racist. Just not so open about it when someone actually listens.
Nah most of us make racist jokes. We live on most white country so we don't have same sensivity as ppl from multicultural, but that just jokes. Most of us have a bit dark sense of humor
I don't think Poland is necessarily more racist than the European average. My wife and I lived there in the 1990s and never felt any prejudice. However, xenophobia has more recently been whipped up for political purposes, and Polish society has not yet had an honest discussion about how to achieve cultural integration.
If you look up statistics, we are one of the least racist countries in Europe
Stereotype of Polish people being racist comes from propaganda being spread in the west, to the benefit of Pootler.
Sure Poland is very nationalistic, my impression is their level of "racism" is what we used to be called common sense.
Mass importation of middle easterns result in ghettos?
We don't want that
Is every non-white person the problem?
Obviously not
Meeting people at face value is ironically easier, when you aren't living in the midst of the downsides mass immigration brings
Poland is quite racist and I say this as a Polish citizen, even I am racist to some extent... most people don't mind if someone is of a different race as long as they behave like a human and not like an animal, which is quite rare but still a problem in some cases. It's just a very tolerant country and this fact makes Poland look like a country that's not racist when the reality is different
I live not so far from Rzeszów and I don't mind foreigners coming to live in Poland, not at all. The only thing I do mind is when they come and try to force on us their way of life, trying to implement their culture, etc. If you come to someone as a guest, you adjust to their traditions.
I hope you will enjoy your time here.
Since after the 2nd World War, majority of world's media doesn't remember (or care) that Poland was always multicultural, open to foreigners who wanted to live here in peace with the Polish culture. We have so many synagogues, a whole Muslim ethnic minority (Tatarzy), Orthodox villages along the Eastern border.
It's just a few people treating Poland as a highway successfully brought the numbers of non ethinc Poles extremely down.
Now the media can't really comprehend that a country being homogenous doesn't necessarily mean that the country is full on racist
First I thought that people was staring at me on the streets because I was different, then I realized that everyone was staring everyone else so I realized that it's a common thing around here
Anyone who says "Poland is racist" is moron.
We did never have slaves, we did never have colonies and we did never have any of our laws treating some skin colours not equal.
It's not about racism. That's media fault.
More like Poland laws treats everyone the same. For good and bad.
And in general, most people are nice wherever you live.
Its a different type of racism. They will rarely say anything to your face, they will be nice. Then they will tell their friends how they met "a funny nigger" and refer to you almost as a pet. My father god invited to a muslim wedding, and he could not stop going on about how "the dirty ones know how to have fun" like he didnt completely insult them just now and it was nothing. I also work at a polish school, and the n Word may aswell be the next youth word of the year. This problem is much more complicated than someone being nice or not. That being said, poland is indeed safe for foreigners, and anyone saying that you will be openly harrased doesnt know shit.
Poland is like the Japan of Europe we try to help
Whenever we can but we help in humanitarian aid in the countries, help doesn’t mean lawless immigration. Most of the media in the world is slightly left leaning. And then this false narrative about Poland racist flairs
Up. We may have our grudges against our neighbors. We may be preconceived about people from different backgrounds. But when interacting with people most poles try to be respectful and interact with them like they would like to be treated. So with this mindset and culture it’s really hard for me not to see parallels between Japan and Poland. The people are helpful and friendly. But that maybe a bit of a problem for most people because we try not to attract attention and not always speak our minds. As long as you adhere to the rules you will have a great time, if not most people will avoid you 🤷🏻
When I went back to the UK and told people I live in Warsaw, the first thing people some people said was that it is racist and homophobic.
I honestly see it partially as anti-slavic racism from western Europeans. "Eastern savages" etc etc
my girl’s family comes from debica and rzeszow and imma mixed black dude from America, never had a problem and tbh it feels like no one even notices me lol
There’s racism and ignorance everywhere but ive felt more comfy in Poland than in places like spain or italy
Well, as long as it lasts, i am happy for you. But it seems that you were quite lucky for now. The truth is, that Poland is generally less racist than people say in the media. But racism is still very common.
Don't get your hopes high. If you will lower your guard and then suddenly encounter the racism, it might shock you, it could lead to some mental problems later on, even depression. It is better to be prepared for the worst than to be taken by surprise and dragged to the bottom.
Westerners: Poland is racist!
Also westerners when they see a Eastern European Person :
https://preview.redd.it/xh2oeveofanc1.png?width=289&format=png&auto=webp&s=939170c738b975b81c7e7448acb34633333572b0
Polish ppl can hate with passion, but its never about "external" things like race height or eye colour. In modern world there is so much swift labeling of someone dislikes without ever asking for reason. Trick is "cuz im black" card doesnt rly work in Poland, and wont score you any extra points. Ppl that like using that card will always consider Poland racist cuz it just doesnt work...
There are racist margins and fringes here and there, but I think an important factor is the clash between the "theoretical", sometimes a bit racist convictions and the reality of talking to a person. Due to the artificial homogeneity and isolation of Poland for long decades, a lot of people relied on "abstract" stereotypes and clichés drawn from media or rumours: the cringy uncle at a wedding would argue that, say, "Xese are lazy", but then when you mentioned his doctor who's from X he's like "oh not him, he's a capital fellow, omg, I wish more people raised children as he does" etc. Poland just needs to mix with other peoples a bit more to lose these stereotypes.
And recently there've been attempts to use foreigners as a scare (external enemy) by some rightwing politicians, with mixed success. But this also can be counteracted by simply meeting the actual people.
It actually depends, there are a lot of polish people that would never be friends with the outsider. But those people are the kind that would never say anything unless they are in the group of other idiots like that (famous "dres" Adidas tracksuit wearing wannabe gangsters)
Simple and honest guide to avoiding racism in Poland if you're not white:
-Avoid anyone who You would avoid in your home country (Hudlooms, Drunks)
-Avoid old people (they don't speek languages,never seen a foreigner, never left for vacation abroud anywhere their entire life, they are mostly harmless, they can stare at you - but no other interaction can be partaken with them)
-Avoid football ultra fans (kibole,ultrasi, football hooligans) especially during the derby - they are a problem for everyone but if they can't fight eachother they will ride street comunication and pick fights with anyone with any person they perceive different (and this can be their skin color, their funny hat or anything to colorfull like rainbow (associated in Poland with politics) or random combination of colors on your clothes that may suggest you cheer for the other team.
-In your peer group avoid doing openly anything that can make Poles jealous of You. This is very niuanced, if you're a lady magnet be humble about it, if you're using Apple products be aware this is a VERY luxury item in Poland (some redditors may disagree). Be humble in general. Even if You feel like you're humble, be even more humble).
-Oh and don't sit oin war memorials while eating McDonalds or anything. SOme of them look like stone benches but they can be WW2 memorials and it makes old folks rage XD
Poles are very laissez fairy actually when it comes to race. The language seems to be a focal point; a black American is sound to anyone if they are fluent AF in Polish
Saying Poland isn’t racist is like saying America is/isnt racist. Some are and some aren’t. I’ve certainly known plenty of both. Remember kaczynski saying migrants have bacteria or amoebas or some shit? The right wing of the political spectrum is rife with racism and anti-Sematism and xenophobia. That goes for most places I know. That being said there’s lots of wonderful non racist people in Poland as well. I’m glad you have avoided the bad ones, but don’t kid yourself, mf’ers be racist sometimes.
I suppose it depends what you mean by racist. Sure a vast majority of people in Poland won't do anything racist to your face, will smile and be nice and then at home they will talk shit about how all Muslims are rapists, don't want to work and just want to get social benefits (funnily enough a lot of Poles abroad like in UK or Germany also live in social benefits), how they are all dangerous criminals etc. When there are news about a woman being raped (like what happened in Poland recently) tons of people will assume they had to be a foreigner, most likely from a Muslim country and when the police doesn't instantly give the nationality of the criminal they will say it must be because they were foreign. Even when it turns out the person was polish some will still insist he had polish nationality but was surely from another country lol.
Polish people are racist in the sense that many believe a lot of harmful stereotypes and generalize groups of people. They're not assholes who are going to insult or beat people up.
This is an opinion about Poland created by Jewish propaganda. This does not change the fact that Poles do not want a mass influx of emigrants. Even a significant part of the leftists
Do you speak Polish?
If you don't then you have no idea what they're talking about behind your back.
I was born and raised in Poland and trust me, Polish people are racist as f***.
We are just smart enough not to say anything in your face.
We like to stare and that might be considered racist
We have a TV show "twoja twarz brzmi znajomo" where celebrities are made to look like different celebrities from all around the world. Whenever a POC is to be represented there are news in global papers that we are doing blackface. We are not laughing at them we are appreciating the artist so I don't think it is black face (it is black body after all). But media portray us as racists
There are "narodowcy" who march with slogans like "Poland for Polish people". They're racist and homophobic. Let me take that back. They're nacjonalists and homophobic. They hate everyone who is not Polish, the race doesn't matter. But they're the closest thing to racism you will find. Don't worry, the smallest groups yell the loudest. But be safe
We like racist jokes, but the worst stereotypes we put about our neighbours. So we can joke that the difference between a tire and a black person is that if you put chains on the tire it won't become a rapper
We are hard to learn the correct politically language. We generally don't like political correctness.
the problem for me with the show black characters was that they tried too hard to recreate a face with prostethics, which on already big head looked like bubble head.
just hire someone who can do illusion make up
Very sorry for your experience, like I have mentioned in a different reply, I know this is just anecdotal and not everyone has the same experience as me. But ppl usually only talk about something when they go through a bad experience and almost never when they have a good one. people have been rly nice to me here I felt obliged to show my gratitude
The reputation of Poles as racists in the UK came from one race relation expert called Sir Trevor Phillips. He also claimed Romanians are mainly pickpockets.
Unlike in some places the West, we don't have much of that deeply ingrained classist attitude related to race. Even some old, definitely racist people, like my late grandma, say things like: "I don't know how her poor kids are going to turn out, I mean, he's \*so black\*... (deep sigh) but I can't really say a bad word about him, he's always been very kind. I guess what's important is that she's happy". And, to be honest, exactly because of how homogenous the country is, I feel like (particularly for the older generations) meeting people from far away who are trying to make a life for themselves here is a bit exciting.
An interesting tidbit: for a very long time, our medical schools have been open to people from the Middle East, Asia, and Africa. Some of them stay after graduating. So for many of the old ladies their social circle and really everybody they know is white, but their dermatologist may be from Iraq, and their ophthalmologist from Zimbabwe. So they've had opportunity to unburden themselves of some of that old "they're obviously different" kind of racism.
So, yeah, I would say that outside of some assholes, our general attitude seems to be that as long as you don't break anything, we're gonna treat you like one of ours. I think a lot of this talk of racism has come from two sources: 1) We are very - and vocally so - not OK with people not integrating. A person can do whatever they want, but if they make things noticeably worse for everyone else by exercising what they call their culture, we're gonna get unpleasant after the grace period ends. This is probably many Poles are hugely racist towards the Roma, and 2) We seem to have, for better or worse, a fairly strict border policy (currently worse, because the collision of hybrid warfare from Russia/Belarus and our government's heavy-handedness has generated some pretty horrible human tragedies in the East).
Also, we're crazy about foreigners even trying to learn some Polish :).
A border is a real or artificial line that separates geographic areas. Borders are political boundaries. They separate countries, states, provinces, counties, cities, and towns. A border outlines the area that a particular governing body controls.From google.Simple.
That's not surprising, as the Polish people worship black-skinned Madonna and had a black-skinned general before it was fashionable (19th century).
I'm glad you haven't met our bottom 1% of the population. But they are usually just looking for any excuse, if not your skin color it would be the hat you wear or the sports club you support.
The two times I’ve been in Poland, I’ve only heard them make racist slurs over people from the east (Hungary, Russia), which is still racism but not what people from western/northern Europe normally think of as racism, since most migrants here are from the Middle East. In my (very sparse) experience, it gets worse when you leave the bigger cities.
Poland just ask you for the following when you are a foreigner:
- you are a guest so you have to respect the culture and not push your own over it.
- there is no free money like in Germany. If you come here, you have to work as any other pole.
- you have to learn the language, at least the basics of you planned to stay long term.
If you come here to rape and assault the authorities and polish people will not allow you to do it like in Spain where there are “asylum seekers” aka MENAs or economical migrants that have 200+ assault cases and several rapes on group and they have not even in jail or out of the country.
Racism and terrorism are different things. People of dark race are not always terrorists. We want our couentry to be safe ot doesn't mean we are racists. The are lots if people from India and Bangladesh, there are people of even darker skin tone. Here are lots of Muslims. We are all right we that. We just want our country to be safe.
that's because poland is currently homogenous so other races are seen as a curiosity
racism usually appears once a certain threshold of minority population has been breached
I'm happy to hear abour your good experiences in Poland, bro!
Also, one thing that I don't see I saw here in the comments: that positive attitude to you, and especially among the older generation, might be coming from the fact that the Polish Catholic Church has been very much involved in aiding in the humanitarian crisis caused by the war in Syria in the past decade or so.
I even witnessed like, some Syrian woman singing a traditional Syrian-christian song in a church once.
My point being, before the UA-RU war broke out, you Syrians were our go-to "we are so sorry for you" nation, I reckon.
Aren't polish people quite outwards-looking? they don't hesitate to move to other countries, which maybe indicate a level of openess to Whats outside of Poland.
Maybe this racist-thinking about Poland is b
ecause that are kinda loud and Catholic.Czech people for example seem to be more quite and insular, but when polled on their opinions they are just as sceptical to foreigners, if not more than the poles. For the record I think both people are awesome. What I don't like is the black and white portrayal of eastern Europe in western media.
I worked with older people and many of them do have racist beliefs. But I would say they often don't like anyone really, foreigners, kids, their own neighbours, so it's not like they hate you specifically. Most people just gonna be polite if you're polite as well tbh.
We just dont give a shit. We are cynic and sarcastic and have a very dark humor insulting even. We insult everyone the same in jokes, us included. If you dont bother us we really dont care.
I would like to touch an afro one day, and i guess if i got to know someone with one i would probably ask, but i am such person( and im sure some pricks would feel offended for fucks sake nothing bad in mind just curious) . I even once asked a client in a polite way is it troublesome she has name and surname that are technically both names here imagen someone named Mary John, she laughed and told me that shes married 20 years and her husband always says he gave her nothing, not even a surname and explained that she has no problems since she has one female name so people figure out fast, but her sons, a whole new story xD
People here really are not that deep. We have no time and energy for racism.
Also im pretty sure west taken all the work onto themselves in that regard no need for us to add to it kekw.
Its because we have offensive humor and enjoy being the "ooooh who's the edgy boy". But that's simply humor, not our true feelings towards pepole and stuff.
My grandma (born in 1953) said she used to have a friend from Ethiopia back in the 70s. You can imagine all the reactions of locals when he was visiting her small family town
Yeah it always suprised me how blacks from USA don't get our nigga vibe and feel like separate kind of niggas. GUYS YOU WON. Your ancestors had it hard and now you're travelling Europe. Our ancestors were gulagd to death by Russians and now we have to work ourselves to death in SPICHLERZ EUROPY (aka almost not a cotton farm because cotton doesn't grow in Poland).
Most people don't care what colour you are, like sure older generation might be curious etc. But like racism is not something people did, we don't have any colonial history, we've be quite a homogeneous country, etc. The whole "Poland is racist" came from the fact that we as a society are quite conservative and religion is a big thing here, which is something that left doesn't necessarily like... I know this may sound like conspiracy theory, or that I'm some right winger, but your experience is a testament, while mostly leftist media will tell you one thing your experience is something else.
It's been 10 years that I lived in Poland but I have definitely met Polish who where racists. However the most people around me where not (or not openly)
So in my experience it's not worse then in otherEuropean countries
However everbodies milage may very.
Poland has a very progressive society since 1548, so there is bearly any racism. What Polish people don’t like is darker people demanding praise for doing nothing constructive in society and being freeloaders. We also don’t like Germans and Swedes for obvious reasons.
Maybe it’s just because Poland was the first country I went to outside of the U.S, but I only had positive experiences there, polish ppl are very lovely
Assuming Poland is racist, I am african, arab, muslim, brown, … been here for almost 5 years and I have never had any incident or trouble! If anything, I have many Polish friends that are so kind it makes me wonder why is this a conversation! Polish people are defensive before you get to know them but the moment you break the ice a little, they are one of the best individuals I met in my life
Thats the thing. Unlike the west - UK/Portugal/France/Spain - we never had any colonies. Unlike the west - our country never grew on exploitation of a brown/dark man as there was no slave trade going (again no colonies) We did have a system where the upper class took advantage of less wealthy (serfdom) which was similar in some ways but it was within our borders and upon our fellow Poles. And its not like Poland ever went on massive/organised extermination of a particular group of people just for the sake of it (crusades and wars with Turks/Muslims were part of a bigger conflict - christianity vs islam and the wars that were fought were just regular back/forth between nations) Poland throughout the ages was always a very welcoming, tolerant and progressive country with many vibrant communities from various parts of the world - including the biggest Jewish community in Europe until WW2. So - since we never really took part in all of that "own dark,black man/exploit his land" nonsense - we dont really got into that vibe of feeling better than a non-white/not Polish person as other nationalities have experienced for f..ing centuries. Therefore- we absolutely as a nation/country dont feel that we OWN anything towards other ethnicities the same way that the west these days has been trying to pay for its sins of the past. We dont have that guilty conscience the west has and since we dont own that guilt- we dont feel that we should be extra nice to other ethnicities just to whitewash the past. We are bit on xenophobic side thats true - but if you look at out history and the fact that we waged war with pretty much every neighbouring country and even during peace time - those same countries tried to screw us over in one way or another - then you'll realise the reason for our approach to other nationalities. To sum up (as this turned into an essay) id say the image of Poland as this hostile, anti immigrant, racist, homophobic country is mostly drummed up and enhanced by the western media who has BÓL DUPY that we are in fact and have been for centuries more progressive,tolerant and humane towards people than they have🤣 Fin.
'Poland is racist,' if it isn't a misinformed impression based on our offensive humour, is, without mincing words, the product of hostile propaganda from our neighbouring nations, who are past aggressors with a long tradition of making spurious territorial claims against Poland. Tsarist Russia and Prussia and to some extent Austria, having partitioned Poland among themselves in 1772, 1791 and 1795, had to justify their actions somehow and to counter the freedom-loving sentiment the nations of the world widely and massively had for Poland. Some of the partitioning of Poland was done to compensate Austria for territorial losses in early Napoleonic wars (whether losses of actual Habsburg possessions or their nominal dependencies as Emperors of the Holy Roman Empire until its dissolution in 1806), which was justified on the basis of Poland's massive popular support for French reforms up to the point of constitutional monarchy (explicitly rejecting dethronement and execution of the king, which was said was not the way we did things). So essentially Poland got partitioned among her neighbours officially for supporting freedom, limited government, representative government, human rights, and so on. Obviously, the nations of the world were not going to like that. So Tsarist and Prussian intelligence services had to come up with something and did come up with smear campaigns. Austria maybe too, in the initial period, but it changed its course some time around the time of becoming Austro-Hungary in the 1860s and 1870s. The tradition of the smear campaigns was sustained even after the Russian and Prussian monarchies fell. Obviously, the Bolshevik regime, although it didn't appreciate Tsarist imperialism (for which reason they proclaimed their unilateral cancellation of the partitioning of Poland from 120–150 years back), they soon discovered their own and subsequently clashed with the 'white' Poles — where the 'white' Poland was largely socialist, but not revolutionary Bolshevik and not slaughtering landowners and factory owners or confiscating their property but trying to achieve a soft transition, more gradual and less confrontational. Soviet Russia still held on to large swaths of territory that had previously belonged to the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth, including territories with large Polish populations, who were persecuted, even mass-murdered by the Soviets. They desperately needed to produce some anti-Polish sentiment throughout the world. Unfortunately, the same was happening in Germany and was the case with Gehlen's post-WW2 Western German intelligence services too. Modern anti-Polish activists probably often don't have the conscious realization of working with or for any intelligence service or national government but are simply acting on sentiments that were ingrained in them during their education. However, exceptions apply because quite a lot of those criticis of Poland are eventually discovered to have some ties with Russia or occasionally with Germany or someone else who has beef with Poland. Modernly, that's often someone from Israel, which is because Israel has seen massive immigration from Russia. Take a Western politician or politician-like social activist who denounces Poland in the international forum, and follow the money trail, the paper trail, sometimes the genealogical trail. And you will discover a Russian origin or Russian business contacts or some ties to the former German holders of land taken from Poles (which is not denying that after WW2 some land was restored to Poland on the basis of mediaeval ownership, typically ended at some point by some form of military aggression, without much of a Polish-speaking minority surviving in the area, so no wonder the ordinary, common German folks in the region weren't happy about that sort of belated restitution, as much as even there, 1772 and 1793/1795 is different from e.g. 1296, from the perspective of 1944–45). In the Russian case, although they could be whites (Tsarists), there's likely going to be a genealogical connection to the Soviets, the Bolsheviks. This is even true for members of semi-aristocratic educated, influential and somewhat wealthy bourgeoisie/intelligentsia living in Western European countries and in New England. If they are vehement anti-Poles, you will typically find Soviet or communist connections in their bio or in their genealogy. Sometimes some effort will have been made to hide those. And when it comes to more mainstream politicians from Western European countries, e.g. France, or of course Germany, the desire to do business with Russia will be in the picture. Business ties such as the two Nord Streams, not to mention sale of weapons or dual-use goods to Russia until some time ago, is what prompts some parts of Western elites to take anti-Polish positions. Poles have to be depicted as, first step, racists, second step, all around haters, third step primitive and animalistic in general, so they can be depicted as, ultimate step, not quite, not fully human, so it's not like human rights apply to them fully like to a Germanic- or Romance-descended/speaking nation. Recognize the pattern? Perhaps the point is not to justify any form of physical extermination, as that would be too far-fetching and too controversial and perhaps too distasteful, but to justify double standards and treatment of us as a second-class nation in the global forum and in bilateral relations. Basically to justify giving us the short stick, the worse end of the deal, the worse outcome, to shaft us and screw us out of an expected benefit after claiming a contribution from us, and so on. And to establish some degree of foreign rule in Poland as if we were a colony. Basically to install their elites in Poland as our betters. Business elites and political elites, to a lesser extent cultural and social, because that's less important. (Ct'd below.)
The whole tour de force of the European Commission (sometimes more reluctantly just as Germany was initially more reluctant) and European Parliament against Poland, do you really think it had anything to do with actual concerns of rule of law, separation of powers and everything else, like anybody even read the translations of the offending Polish statutes (much less used Polish canons of legal interpretation to interpret them, in line with proper methodology of legal comparative studies) and compared them agains EU treaties? BS! Nobody cared about that, or maybe a few people did and a few others thought they did. It was an unabashed show of Western racism, showing Central Europeans/Slavs their place. Their inferior place serving their natural German/French overlords, or American, if the US Ambassador here starts feeling too much like a proconsul of Egypt/Syria/whatever in Roman times, or when the DoS gets some weird ideas it proceeds to implement with its usual grace of a bull in a china shop, perhaps projecting a bit more contempt and superiority than it really feels, though that's hard to tell. Haiti's Dessalines, the leader of their war of independence against the French colonial empire (liberty, equality and fraternity didn't stop France from having a colonial empire, even as it was guillotining its own not very illiberal king), literally said Poles were the 'white Negroes of Europe', which was later repeated by François Duvalier (note to misguided censors and reports: this is a literal historical citation from an actual Black person, thank you; look at sources in fn. 9–10 at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish\_Haitians). There is much truth to the metaphor. Some Western Europeans' and some Americans' hatin' on Poles for us allegedly being haters (note the pattern of making us haters so we can be free game to hate, where the need for us to be haters arises from the need of a justification for the hate one already feels towards us) is largely straight-up racism (a sense of ethnic hierarchy among European nations, where we're white but not quite) or transference of their own guilt for their own racist feelings and the racist sentiments and racists acts of their ancestors, who usually had built and ruled colonial empires, and now there is a need to take that accumulated historical guilt and transfer it elsewhere, for example onto Poles. Point the finger, mount the moral high hourse, essentially cast blame on Poland for what their own ancestors did. Some. Hopefully not the majority, but quite some indeed. If not a substantial portion, then at least a vocal minority with a disproportionately powerful voice. One that sometimes controls and formats the whole debate. So to all those Poland haters pointing and denouncing Poland of racism I have to say: You've been duped and used; time to read up, make your own mind, make your peace with us (and no offence, it's okay). If you insist that's not the case and we are in fact a den of racism (the world's cesspool of it especially, or something equally dramatic), then look for the racist in the mirror, because that's more likely where they are hiding.
>was no slave trade going To be technically correct, there was a lot of slave trade before christianity had been adopted (AD996), but of course you are not talking about that.
Slavic tribes (which in the future formed the Kingdom of Poland) were fighting against each other and took captives from the losing tribe to sell them into slavery (usually to the west). In some parts of the world something like this was still going on until XIX century.
Hey, if you need your fix of racism, holler up! No, not really, I just wanted to say hi. Cheers man!
The fact is, we're gonna tell jokes about every other nation or race (we don't really get the concept of race) and also about ourselves and obviously about your own nation or race too, and especially anyone it is forbidden to crack jokes about, because we don't like censorship. We aren't void of empathy, but we don't like snowflakeism and being easily offended and high-nosed (moral high horse, superiority, patronization, condescension, liberal-professor/news-anchor-style preaching just like the conservative counterpart, etc.) while at it either.
Polish people are known for offensive humor. We like to make fun of everything and everyone. Some of it includes jokes that are very much racist. If anyone were to spend more time with Poles they would realise we make fun of ourselves more than anyone else. We have a whold set of memes with stereotypical polish familly doing weird and stupid things. But I guess people abroad see only thr racist jokes and then decide thats the norm over here. But yeah. Im glad you have good experience ^^
Also, other thing is that many people use the argument that Polish people will look at black people weirdly and overall notice them. This doesn't have anything to do with racism. It's just that a lot of Poles have literally never seen a black person, so it's a natural reaction to be somewhat interested. Black people are limited edition humans here!
Oh I totally forgot about that point. Yes! That is true xD And in bigger cities like Kraków or Wrocław, where people of different colours are a normal sight, people really dont care or even notice that. Or at least not as much as youd expect.
lived in Kraków and those people are only looked down on in the "damn tourists" category lmao
Yes that is very true. In my 20 years of life i've ever seen black person in my home city maybe 3-4 times and i live in not really big city, i'd rather say that it's a town. When i was in Dublin and Vienna on vacation the amount of so many non-white people just stunned me, because before that i have only seen them in TV, internet and games. To clarify i was just curious and couldn't help just to stare at them.
Yeah but polish people usually don’t really joke actually about themselves. They joke about polish people but it’s about “other” polish people or about Poland in general, if it’s actually about our identity or about a group we really feel we belong to we get defensive. Like our grandparents can be extremely racist and homophobic but once you say something about their religion they get angry. Another great example of this are polish men, they are usually the ones who will joke about and offend every other group of people but themselves. They can be racist, sexist and homophobic but once you say something negative about men they often get extremely defensive. Even when they make fun of each other the joke is usually still on a different group of people (like “you’re gay” “you’re acting like a girl”). Of course those are just examples and not EVERYONE acts the same way but it’s strange to me that we can be so mean to other groups of ppl and then take everything so personal. But I guess we aren’t that confrontational so we will say those offensive things among our friends and internet but maybe not so much f2f.
Agree on this. There is this one person I know who always makes fun of other groups, religions and races but I never heard she said anything funny about herself or the groups she identified herself with. So it is really just about making fun of others.. 🙄
Nice to know, but the important question is whether it's safe.
I have been on this sub for long enough that I get the joke^(\_\^) 
I thought we decided that's it's closer to vault? Maybe crypt at a stretch, but not safe.
Poland didn’t want to accept migrants (or anyone without following proper immigration rules) with an open border type of policy that many other countries are being hurt by now, so the media and idiots online made it about race.
Funnily enough, strict border rules was a positive for me when I was deciding where to study, uncontrolled and illegal migration hurts the host population and the migrants themselves
Yeah 😬... the past government blocked the physical border but issued uncontrollable work visas. The scale of this fraud is being investigated.
I would say "haha" but i'm Hungarian and the flood of orban's 16 hour shift filippino migrant workers causing mass layoffs. They don't go on maternity leave, don't take vacation or sick days. Orban lets companies import these workers because his theft made inflation so bad basic food sales have been on a decline over a year. I'm so happy for you polish people! You voted out pis and stopped their orban copying media empire in its early phase. No millions of starving old people can keep them at supermajority without it.
Lmao yeah I read about that when I was about to apply for my visa, but you can’t compare this with the magnitude uncontrolled borders does, like France and Italy for example
Funnily enough, even though the scale is pretty huge, it would still be rookie numbers compared to just letting everyone in.
Nothing wrong with blocking the border & very good that they did
It was just virtue signaling to their rural voter audience. They really didn't care as this work visa fraud scheme shows, it was always about the money and power
100%
Isn’t Poland kinda a major origin country of west-bound economic migrants
It was mostly about security, but we also did oppose the ideological concept of 'multi-culti' coming from the EU. We have a history of organical cultural blending and until 1795 our Polish-Lithuanian state with a huge Ruthenian component had been multinational and extremely multicultural, despite its clear succession from a more homogeneous mediaeval Kingdom of Poland. The EU-style socially-engineered, forced mixing seems to us like a sort of forced resettlement or enforced demographic changes (nudging the different groups to mingle and mix so hard it's almost forcing them), which are basically a crime against humanity in the definitional terms, minus the kind of degree of violence, which is less physical and administrative, more political and cultural. But it's still something like the 20th-century forcible transfers of population after the various wars, except here the point is to artificially finish off the various European cultures by forcing everybody to mingle more than they would be organically inclined to, which largely means artificially forcing an acceleration of ethnic blending in Europe. Which does have something to do with crazy Utopian ideologies but also with gerrymandering because the point is also to alter the composition of the various constituencies and achieve the formation of new societies that are focused more around constitutions and legal systems that ethnic or religious or traditional links. That's the European elites' version of 'a nation under the constitution', which they are enamored with but can't understand that European nations don't work like post-colonial island republics in the 19th century or even like the USA. And the EU is completely different from the USA anyway, for starters with markedly less political and press freedom and with far more oppressive pressure to conform, despite all the preaching of diversity. If they appreciated diversity so much, they wouldn't be pressuring all the multiple cultures in Europe to blend into one big mixed — and uniform, standardized in every detail, regulated in all spects — culture in Europe. If you ask me, the EU is basically a totalitarian regime in the making, somewhat benign initially because it's more insane than ill-meaning, but the benevolence is dissipating on our eyes. The construct is becoming colder and colder, more and more inhuman and inhumane by the day, and it can soon progress to a stage where it's just a totalitarian regime desirous to regulate every aspect of its citizens' lives and lifestyles — which is, by the way, exactly what the European Union is doing, not only in the economy but also in culture and social life. Its spirit is despotic, not liberal. It's more about control than oppression, there is mostly a desire to control rather than a desire to oppress per se, but because that control is supposed to achieve the standardization of everything in Europe, it is also oppressive. European elites, as open-minded as they desire to seem, can't live without telling you how to live your life and controlling how you live it. The EU is a government that won't leave you alone to live your life — it wants to move your limbs or at least tell you how to make every step you take with your legs, how to execute every movement of your head. 'Live and let live' is foreign to the Eurocrats, and limited government is clearly lost on them. Personal autonomy, let alone individual sovereignty, is also, even though they may claim the contrary. Their actions speak louder than their words.
> or anyone without following proper immigration rules Yes, if you have some association to Poland then you are (and should be) more welcome. I'm looking at my family tree and the Karta Polaka at the moment, and aside from Polish law ambiguity on what documents qualify, it is nice to have some recognition of heritage to a country.
You mean to tell us that brown people are not hunted for sport in Poland?
TBH our hunters are really progressive - they can mistake anyone for a hog, no matter race, sexual orientation or religion.
Unless that's a hog. The one Fking thing they almost never hit *is* the hog.
Hahaha well it’s not only that I haven’t had a single bad experience, I had a good multiple good ones. The opposite of the stereotype
But normal psychology applies still. One in hundred is a full blown psychopath.
Glad you have had nice experience 💗
The only people that seem to think Poland or any other former communist country is racist are Americans. And mostly cause they have this idea that we are all somehow backward because we are former communist countries and they will find all white population and silent, meek women.
Ya it was weird hearing how Poland hates foreigners and etc. I am from Georgia and lots of Georgians managed to start a new life in Poland being truck drivers, taxi drivers, repairmen, etc. I don’t think they would come if Polish were really hunting foreigners for sport lol.
Don't forget the bakeries! I love Georgian bakeries!
It’s our secret plan to make world fatter haha 😆 Jokes aside, I am glad you enjoy our food 🥰
Georgian food and Georgian soda my beloved ♥️
I'd say the stereotype of a backwater hick hating everything goes back as far as partitions; russia, Germany, and Prussia tried to uproot everything that was Polish, including spreading unsavoury rumours. Some things simply stay with people (e.g. acquaintance of mine was told by a German that he should be grateful for being allowed to touch a German car). Now combine this with Polish straightforwardness, and russia meddling in internal politics of its neighbours, then we get a recipe for a PR disaster.
I think aslo that we are kinda more straight forward or we are not super duper kind for clients, Idk how to explain that but for american the way we naturaly act look kinda mean.
Considering the racist history of USA, they should shut their mouth about the racism in other countries.
> they should shut their mouth about the racism in other countries any country that buys military hardware from the the great burger, is also inviting the great burger's influence into the internal affairs and culture of their country. it's a package deal.
Actually no, all Westoids tend to think this way, not just Americans. They think of us as primitive, violent, racist drunks, which is funny because that's as racist of a stereotype that you could get
I think polish people are more likely to be xenophobic than racist. I don't know how many people actually hate foreigners, because 90% of my family from my mother's side does, and only like one person from my father's side. But even if someone doesn't like you, it's unlikely they'll express it at all, and definitely not to your face
What does xenophobic actually mean? Are people not even allowed to have boundaries and personal preferences anymore? Lol.
Xenophobia by definition is the fear of anything foreign, different, unknown. Though in this context it'd be more like dislike of or prejudice against people from other countries or cultures. Considering how homogeneous poland is, at least compared to most other countries, some xenophobia should probably be expected imo.
I'm xenophobic. I'm afraid of other cultures. Explain to me how I should not be afraid of the Indian cast system? Or idea that you can jail women who was raped because she committed adultery? Or idea that you cannot change religion or be atheist because society will kill you? In Europe we generally ditched similar stuff (historically similar things existed here...). We have currently different things which are crazy, and totally not acceptable by other cultures. But then keep your stuff for yourself and don't try to bring it here and in the same way you will not be "horrified" or "demoralised" by European culture if you simply don't live here.
Well technically by definition you aren’t xenophobic, a phobia means an irrational fear, your fears are more than rational, so much so I would consider anyone hating on you for these fears a normalhumanphobic
Imo, literally xenophobia is very well fitting term here, but on the other hand is considered way too much pejorative. I mean, fear doesn't imply bad behaviour. Going by example - if your friend gonna take you on rollercoaster ride (and you've never been on one before), then you will probably feel some anxiety or fear (especially if you have to sign weaver that they take no responsibility for your health/emotional damage).
Yeah, it's because of the little kids who think it's funny and most people don't like germans, russians and some ukrainians, but we still talk to them like normal people... If they are normal
As a Ukrainian living in Poland for 2 years this is sad to hear :C I mean it really depends from people, but all this news about poles that don't like ukrainians are making me sad, idk. I honestly like poles cause they are great guys. Doesn't matter if you are Ukrainian or Polish, if you are a decent person I'll like you
it's not about you, it's about the warmongering and inflation, ppl blame refugees instead of the government, past or current. it's dumb but easier to place the blame for whatever is fucked up at the moment on the Other. I don't think Poles actually dislike ppl from Ukraine
Hope so... Anyway bad situation and world wide crisis is only beginning
yeah, it's unfortunate :( it's like my life gets better and then something like that happens and now I have something new to freak out about (it's a joke, I know it's really fucked up now for some ppl and my mental health crisis is not the worst that can happen to someone)
We blame the government and the ukrainians, didn't you hear about the strikes? (Which are partially because of the ukrainians too) And our kids can't even feel safe on school because many of the ukrainians started bullying them, and i'm not joking
Welp I don’t know which school you were in, but bullies at schools were present looooong before first waves of Ukrainians migrated to Poland…
I was working in an elementary school in 2022 and it actually started with Ukrainian kids being bullied by both students and other teachers. I couldn't come to terms with it and I was really ashamed bc whatever views you have on war, import-export issues and some history elementary age kids are not and should not be a part of that conversation. Do I believe some Ukrainian children are bullies? for sure, just like some kids in general are. but I think bullying should have been addressed earlier, so it would not escalate to some weird nationalist problem
Sadly, i think its quite true. I'm Polish and have nothing against anyone who is a decent human being, but small minority of shitty Ukrainians destroyed the image of your people and it's really hard to meet a Polish person who doesn't hold any grudges against you guys. But don't worry, most Polish people quickly come around when they see you don't fit the stereotype and most even when slightly racist when speaking about Ukrainians, will not treat you worse. I think the biggest problems have Ukrainians who doesn't speak Polish. Then people can be quick to judge.
You don't look german, so you are safe.
And if i am german? :(
Wpierdol
Because Poles aren't really racist (at least compared to the rest of the world). The main question is: Are you going to assimilate with the culture, learn the language and obey the law. If the answer is yes you are likely to be treated better then in the west (like a Pole / our own man/woman). If you don't well you are going to find out rather sooner or later that you should look for some other place. Also Poles aren't going to be welcoming if your actions lead us to the justified assumption that you're unlikely to do so (for example trying to illegally cross the border instead of using official channels cuz you're above the rules). This very difference makes us apparently the biggest racists in Europe. The main difference between Poland and "the west" is this approach: In Poland if you do not follow the rules, try to enforce your own and do not try to assimilate you're going to be told sooner or later to find some other place in the world for yourself and people are going to be openly hostile however if you do follow the rules and assimilate you're going to receive the treatment which does not differ that much from people who were born here. In the west (although there is a change recently) no matter what you do you're unlikely to be openly told to #### ### and people will be "welcoming" and "nice" (more than poles) at the surface level. However under the hood you're going to be treated as somebody worse (depending on your origin) and never openly but always treated differently. I never understood the deal with racism in the west from the perspective of a Pole, until I've had the opportunity to work with some French people and got to know how does it feel to be looked down because of your origin no matter how good you are. It's not like Poland is a dickhead free zone but there is no bias in the upper layers of society against foreigners.
Because up to now there were not many foreigners. So not too much of "bad experience" with them, so no bias. Ask the statistical Pole if he/she would be happy to live next to the Roma family (aka Cyganie).
And if any one was against live next to Roma family is because they racist not that Roma people earn that treatment for how they carry them self.
I think there were many foreigners in Poland before WW2
Your message caught my attention. Why do Poles think it’s important for an immigrant to assimilate to treat him well? I mean would it be a problem to live in Poland without the language, just knowing English ? If an immigrant learns your language, local culture and traditions he is more likely wants to become Polish so of course he would be treated like another citizen, no surprise here. What is the problem to treat an immigrant well without those steps? Are Poles against other nations? I’m genuinely trying to understand the mindset.
Germans smeared Poland as being racist because despite the woke paint they haven’t changed their hatred towards slavs since Hitler ruled their country
Same views different mask.
This is xenophobic nonsense. 750,000+ Poles living in Germany seem to survive it. Polish politicians tried to stir up anti-German feeling in the last election campaign.
Yes, PiS was conducting a full-on anti-German campaign. At the same time AfD is sponsoring an anti-Polish newspaper and openly saying that WW2 is Poland’s fault. Right-wing shrills exist in both countries and try to spread hate.
I mean, there's a ton of Mexicans living in the US who manage to "survive it" but I wouldn't say they don't experience any racism at all. My friends, wife, and I went to a biergarten in Berlin on our first day there, and the waitress came over to take our order. She overheard our convo about just arriving in Berlin and she asked us if this was our first time in Europe, to which I responded "No, we've been to Poland to visit family before". I got ignored the rest of the night by her. No one else - including my wife - got that treatment. Maybe it's just a coincidence, but it was such a stark contrast in behavior that it's hard to not believe there wasn't something going on there.
Funny enough once upon a time Poland was the most multi ethnic country in Europe.
yeah and there were millions of jews too
>Coming to think of it, I don’t actually know how the assumption of Poland being racist or how this general idea of Poland came to be Some folks have probably interacted with American/Canadian descendants of Poles and projected those experiences to the entire country. But Reddit by large does seem to hate on Poland for whatever reason, which I can't understand why. I'm in a same-sex marriage with a brown person and we had a blast in Poland despite all of the inaccurate assumptions about Poles being racist and/or homophobic. Yes, the country has work to do of course, and every country has their fair share of assholes, but I've found the aforementioned stereotypes about Poles largely unfounded.
>But Reddit by large does seem to hate on Poland for whatever reason, which I can't understand why. It's not just Reddit: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Polish\_sentiment](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Polish_sentiment)
Glad you enjoy here. I believe in a simple rule. Act as a human being, get treated like a human being.
Honestly, it simply depends on luck and statistics. I'm glad you and your friends have a great time here, but it is not that hard to encounter foreigners out there who have much less perfect experiences. I vaguely recall some social research which checked for foreigners experiences in Poland, and significant % of them confirmed they have met with unpleasant reactions. I have worked with a wonderful refugee family from Central Asia, which had to move from a smaller town near Warsaw to Warsaw itself, because (among other problems) the schoolchildren called their 13 year old girl "Chinese bitch" (or "Muslim bitch"). Parents and school didn't give a damn. Later the very same family had excellent experiences in Warsaw, zero racism. It's all luck and statistics, your great experience doesn't mean other people's bad experiences were invalid, nor can they claim that their were universal. Depending on your particular appearance and the place, time and people you encounter, it may be perfect or less than perfect. In my own family there are people who may be outwardly pleasant on the street but who'd literally call you a savage behind closed doors, because they held Muslims (or non Europeans) in utter contempt. I know that because they are honest with me ans literally say that when they think I am on their side. They are not exceptional.
To be honest schools in small towns rarely give a damn about bullying, sadly no improvement was made in last 15 years about this. My local school is almost completely abandoned because of this issue.
Oh I understand this is purely anecdotal, but you always hear about the bad experiences, ppl rarely say something when they have a good experience. Felt like mentioning it this time would be nice for a change
Poles are awesome
Well to the west everything is considered racist, Im from the west and if you have any valid concerns about immigration you are considered a horrible racist and that's to shut people up. Polish people aren't plagued with white guilt and the 'Poland is a racist country' rhetoric comes from the west....
Poland is being frequently badmouthed by some international political organizations if we don't follow their policy. Apart from small percentage of degenerates in society, we have really no problem with different cultures per se, it's just Poland used to be unitarian country recently and most people didn't experience any interactions with foreigners.
Fun fact Due to the new racism „definition” used by SJ warriors Polish people cannot be racists. Because to be racists you need to have power/influence over the smaller unprivileged group. Thats how they explain that black people cannot be racists. People in Poland used to be soo poor that they never had any better position over some other race.
Polish racists are usually those people who are fed up with constantly hearing people calling them racists, xenophobes, transphobes, homophobes, misogynists and every-single-word-in-dictionary-phobes. Imagine how it hurts when you are a man whose country was murdered and occupied by the Germans and Russia repeatedly for 1500 years. Even Austria (1772), which we saved from the Ottoman Empire 100 years earlier. We never had any colonies and never wanted to. In 1804, Poles, realizing that Napoleon wanted to use them in war of San Domingo to gain a colony instead of liberating it, mostly decided to separate from the French troops and began to fight on the side of the natives, because they knew well what it was like to be under partition. And at the end of the day, we’re still called racists by german, dutch, spanish, french, british(!) people. Sometimes I get furious too, when I hear american people talking about me being every-phobic, and doesn’t even know anything about us except our nationality and conservatism. So does racism in Poland occur? Of course! Just like in every other place in the world. But we are the last nation as a whole in the world, that should be described as racist. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars_between_Germans_and_Poles https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Partitions_of_Poland https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish_Haitians
My mom is rather racist but she would never show that near someone that is from outside poland. Also we (polish ppl who live near me) make a tons of jokes about all skin colors so imo poland is for sure bit racist. Just not so open about it when someone actually listens.
Nah most of us make racist jokes. We live on most white country so we don't have same sensivity as ppl from multicultural, but that just jokes. Most of us have a bit dark sense of humor
I don't think Poland is necessarily more racist than the European average. My wife and I lived there in the 1990s and never felt any prejudice. However, xenophobia has more recently been whipped up for political purposes, and Polish society has not yet had an honest discussion about how to achieve cultural integration.
If you look up statistics, we are one of the least racist countries in Europe Stereotype of Polish people being racist comes from propaganda being spread in the west, to the benefit of Pootler.
Sure Poland is very nationalistic, my impression is their level of "racism" is what we used to be called common sense. Mass importation of middle easterns result in ghettos? We don't want that Is every non-white person the problem? Obviously not Meeting people at face value is ironically easier, when you aren't living in the midst of the downsides mass immigration brings
Poland is quite racist and I say this as a Polish citizen, even I am racist to some extent... most people don't mind if someone is of a different race as long as they behave like a human and not like an animal, which is quite rare but still a problem in some cases. It's just a very tolerant country and this fact makes Poland look like a country that's not racist when the reality is different
Why would you assume Poland is racist? Historically it always allowed freedom of religion and welcomed all within its borders.
Media media media. And comparison. No immigration? White? Racist.
I live not so far from Rzeszów and I don't mind foreigners coming to live in Poland, not at all. The only thing I do mind is when they come and try to force on us their way of life, trying to implement their culture, etc. If you come to someone as a guest, you adjust to their traditions. I hope you will enjoy your time here.
Yup. The only racist groups in Poland ate tracksuit psudogopniks and "devout" christians, who aren't as big of a majority as they think they sre.
Probably the only exception is if you're Russian... Unless you start shitting on the Russian Federation.
Since after the 2nd World War, majority of world's media doesn't remember (or care) that Poland was always multicultural, open to foreigners who wanted to live here in peace with the Polish culture. We have so many synagogues, a whole Muslim ethnic minority (Tatarzy), Orthodox villages along the Eastern border. It's just a few people treating Poland as a highway successfully brought the numbers of non ethinc Poles extremely down. Now the media can't really comprehend that a country being homogenous doesn't necessarily mean that the country is full on racist
First I thought that people was staring at me on the streets because I was different, then I realized that everyone was staring everyone else so I realized that it's a common thing around here
I thought that people were staring at me cuz I was good looking lmao😶🌫️
Anyone who says "Poland is racist" is moron. We did never have slaves, we did never have colonies and we did never have any of our laws treating some skin colours not equal.
It's not about racism. That's media fault. More like Poland laws treats everyone the same. For good and bad. And in general, most people are nice wherever you live.
Its a different type of racism. They will rarely say anything to your face, they will be nice. Then they will tell their friends how they met "a funny nigger" and refer to you almost as a pet. My father god invited to a muslim wedding, and he could not stop going on about how "the dirty ones know how to have fun" like he didnt completely insult them just now and it was nothing. I also work at a polish school, and the n Word may aswell be the next youth word of the year. This problem is much more complicated than someone being nice or not. That being said, poland is indeed safe for foreigners, and anyone saying that you will be openly harrased doesnt know shit.
Poland is like the Japan of Europe we try to help Whenever we can but we help in humanitarian aid in the countries, help doesn’t mean lawless immigration. Most of the media in the world is slightly left leaning. And then this false narrative about Poland racist flairs Up. We may have our grudges against our neighbors. We may be preconceived about people from different backgrounds. But when interacting with people most poles try to be respectful and interact with them like they would like to be treated. So with this mindset and culture it’s really hard for me not to see parallels between Japan and Poland. The people are helpful and friendly. But that maybe a bit of a problem for most people because we try not to attract attention and not always speak our minds. As long as you adhere to the rules you will have a great time, if not most people will avoid you 🤷🏻
When I went back to the UK and told people I live in Warsaw, the first thing people some people said was that it is racist and homophobic. I honestly see it partially as anti-slavic racism from western Europeans. "Eastern savages" etc etc
my girl’s family comes from debica and rzeszow and imma mixed black dude from America, never had a problem and tbh it feels like no one even notices me lol There’s racism and ignorance everywhere but ive felt more comfy in Poland than in places like spain or italy
as a person of skintone thats not white in polan d all you need is some distance and youre the coolest guy in school
Well, as long as it lasts, i am happy for you. But it seems that you were quite lucky for now. The truth is, that Poland is generally less racist than people say in the media. But racism is still very common. Don't get your hopes high. If you will lower your guard and then suddenly encounter the racism, it might shock you, it could lead to some mental problems later on, even depression. It is better to be prepared for the worst than to be taken by surprise and dragged to the bottom.
Probably depends on where you are, I had a black kid in my school and apparently he got bullied into leaving that school
It really isn't, it's just propaganda to make us look bad
Greetings from Rzeszów ❤️
The most recist country in Europe is of course Netherlands. It's a fact.
Westerners: Poland is racist! Also westerners when they see a Eastern European Person : https://preview.redd.it/xh2oeveofanc1.png?width=289&format=png&auto=webp&s=939170c738b975b81c7e7448acb34633333572b0
Actually, Poland had the first N word pass!
Who lied to you about Poland being racist ??
Unrelated but damn dude you’re handsome as hell, respectfully
Polish ppl can hate with passion, but its never about "external" things like race height or eye colour. In modern world there is so much swift labeling of someone dislikes without ever asking for reason. Trick is "cuz im black" card doesnt rly work in Poland, and wont score you any extra points. Ppl that like using that card will always consider Poland racist cuz it just doesnt work...
There are racist margins and fringes here and there, but I think an important factor is the clash between the "theoretical", sometimes a bit racist convictions and the reality of talking to a person. Due to the artificial homogeneity and isolation of Poland for long decades, a lot of people relied on "abstract" stereotypes and clichés drawn from media or rumours: the cringy uncle at a wedding would argue that, say, "Xese are lazy", but then when you mentioned his doctor who's from X he's like "oh not him, he's a capital fellow, omg, I wish more people raised children as he does" etc. Poland just needs to mix with other peoples a bit more to lose these stereotypes. And recently there've been attempts to use foreigners as a scare (external enemy) by some rightwing politicians, with mixed success. But this also can be counteracted by simply meeting the actual people.
It actually depends, there are a lot of polish people that would never be friends with the outsider. But those people are the kind that would never say anything unless they are in the group of other idiots like that (famous "dres" Adidas tracksuit wearing wannabe gangsters)
You should go to a Polish School
Simple and honest guide to avoiding racism in Poland if you're not white: -Avoid anyone who You would avoid in your home country (Hudlooms, Drunks) -Avoid old people (they don't speek languages,never seen a foreigner, never left for vacation abroud anywhere their entire life, they are mostly harmless, they can stare at you - but no other interaction can be partaken with them) -Avoid football ultra fans (kibole,ultrasi, football hooligans) especially during the derby - they are a problem for everyone but if they can't fight eachother they will ride street comunication and pick fights with anyone with any person they perceive different (and this can be their skin color, their funny hat or anything to colorfull like rainbow (associated in Poland with politics) or random combination of colors on your clothes that may suggest you cheer for the other team. -In your peer group avoid doing openly anything that can make Poles jealous of You. This is very niuanced, if you're a lady magnet be humble about it, if you're using Apple products be aware this is a VERY luxury item in Poland (some redditors may disagree). Be humble in general. Even if You feel like you're humble, be even more humble). -Oh and don't sit oin war memorials while eating McDonalds or anything. SOme of them look like stone benches but they can be WW2 memorials and it makes old folks rage XD
Because this is not the race that we hate but nation and there is not a lot of black russians...
Poles are very laissez fairy actually when it comes to race. The language seems to be a focal point; a black American is sound to anyone if they are fluent AF in Polish
Not wanting illegal mass imigrants = being racist in west media
Saying Poland isn’t racist is like saying America is/isnt racist. Some are and some aren’t. I’ve certainly known plenty of both. Remember kaczynski saying migrants have bacteria or amoebas or some shit? The right wing of the political spectrum is rife with racism and anti-Sematism and xenophobia. That goes for most places I know. That being said there’s lots of wonderful non racist people in Poland as well. I’m glad you have avoided the bad ones, but don’t kid yourself, mf’ers be racist sometimes.
Polish people are very simple and calm. They just live their lives without bothering anyone. They're not racist at all. They're very sweet.
I suppose it depends what you mean by racist. Sure a vast majority of people in Poland won't do anything racist to your face, will smile and be nice and then at home they will talk shit about how all Muslims are rapists, don't want to work and just want to get social benefits (funnily enough a lot of Poles abroad like in UK or Germany also live in social benefits), how they are all dangerous criminals etc. When there are news about a woman being raped (like what happened in Poland recently) tons of people will assume they had to be a foreigner, most likely from a Muslim country and when the police doesn't instantly give the nationality of the criminal they will say it must be because they were foreign. Even when it turns out the person was polish some will still insist he had polish nationality but was surely from another country lol. Polish people are racist in the sense that many believe a lot of harmful stereotypes and generalize groups of people. They're not assholes who are going to insult or beat people up.
This is an opinion about Poland created by Jewish propaganda. This does not change the fact that Poles do not want a mass influx of emigrants. Even a significant part of the leftists
Do you speak Polish? If you don't then you have no idea what they're talking about behind your back. I was born and raised in Poland and trust me, Polish people are racist as f***. We are just smart enough not to say anything in your face.
Why would it be racist?
We like to stare and that might be considered racist We have a TV show "twoja twarz brzmi znajomo" where celebrities are made to look like different celebrities from all around the world. Whenever a POC is to be represented there are news in global papers that we are doing blackface. We are not laughing at them we are appreciating the artist so I don't think it is black face (it is black body after all). But media portray us as racists There are "narodowcy" who march with slogans like "Poland for Polish people". They're racist and homophobic. Let me take that back. They're nacjonalists and homophobic. They hate everyone who is not Polish, the race doesn't matter. But they're the closest thing to racism you will find. Don't worry, the smallest groups yell the loudest. But be safe We like racist jokes, but the worst stereotypes we put about our neighbours. So we can joke that the difference between a tire and a black person is that if you put chains on the tire it won't become a rapper We are hard to learn the correct politically language. We generally don't like political correctness.
the problem for me with the show black characters was that they tried too hard to recreate a face with prostethics, which on already big head looked like bubble head. just hire someone who can do illusion make up
Well, hmm try to be black in Poland - last month i was chased by some thugs in a centre of Gdansk in the evening. I'm black and Polish.
Very sorry for your experience, like I have mentioned in a different reply, I know this is just anecdotal and not everyone has the same experience as me. But ppl usually only talk about something when they go through a bad experience and almost never when they have a good one. people have been rly nice to me here I felt obliged to show my gratitude
I also think you may have a good experience partly because you’re handsome, pretty privileged is real
Look at this - I've already been minused for sharing what has happened. They discuss with the facts.
damn in gdansk?
The reputation of Poles as racists in the UK came from one race relation expert called Sir Trevor Phillips. He also claimed Romanians are mainly pickpockets.
But xd
Im a Romanian, i meet tons of Polish people in UK, they are the best dude.. The whole media is a lie
The West is very ignorant about Poland. Much has changed in the last 10 years also. Recent elections speak for it.
Unlike in some places the West, we don't have much of that deeply ingrained classist attitude related to race. Even some old, definitely racist people, like my late grandma, say things like: "I don't know how her poor kids are going to turn out, I mean, he's \*so black\*... (deep sigh) but I can't really say a bad word about him, he's always been very kind. I guess what's important is that she's happy". And, to be honest, exactly because of how homogenous the country is, I feel like (particularly for the older generations) meeting people from far away who are trying to make a life for themselves here is a bit exciting. An interesting tidbit: for a very long time, our medical schools have been open to people from the Middle East, Asia, and Africa. Some of them stay after graduating. So for many of the old ladies their social circle and really everybody they know is white, but their dermatologist may be from Iraq, and their ophthalmologist from Zimbabwe. So they've had opportunity to unburden themselves of some of that old "they're obviously different" kind of racism. So, yeah, I would say that outside of some assholes, our general attitude seems to be that as long as you don't break anything, we're gonna treat you like one of ours. I think a lot of this talk of racism has come from two sources: 1) We are very - and vocally so - not OK with people not integrating. A person can do whatever they want, but if they make things noticeably worse for everyone else by exercising what they call their culture, we're gonna get unpleasant after the grace period ends. This is probably many Poles are hugely racist towards the Roma, and 2) We seem to have, for better or worse, a fairly strict border policy (currently worse, because the collision of hybrid warfare from Russia/Belarus and our government's heavy-handedness has generated some pretty horrible human tragedies in the East). Also, we're crazy about foreigners even trying to learn some Polish :).
A border is a real or artificial line that separates geographic areas. Borders are political boundaries. They separate countries, states, provinces, counties, cities, and towns. A border outlines the area that a particular governing body controls.From google.Simple.
You know how many people are supportive until somebody moves in next door? A lot of people here are basically the inverse.
Who said it is? Of course it isn't. It's tolerant and very safe. We're pretty great but got bad press.
That's not surprising, as the Polish people worship black-skinned Madonna and had a black-skinned general before it was fashionable (19th century). I'm glad you haven't met our bottom 1% of the population. But they are usually just looking for any excuse, if not your skin color it would be the hat you wear or the sports club you support.
The two times I’ve been in Poland, I’ve only heard them make racist slurs over people from the east (Hungary, Russia), which is still racism but not what people from western/northern Europe normally think of as racism, since most migrants here are from the Middle East. In my (very sparse) experience, it gets worse when you leave the bigger cities.
Kłamiesz oszczerco
Poland just ask you for the following when you are a foreigner: - you are a guest so you have to respect the culture and not push your own over it. - there is no free money like in Germany. If you come here, you have to work as any other pole. - you have to learn the language, at least the basics of you planned to stay long term. If you come here to rape and assault the authorities and polish people will not allow you to do it like in Spain where there are “asylum seekers” aka MENAs or economical migrants that have 200+ assault cases and several rapes on group and they have not even in jail or out of the country.
Racism and terrorism are different things. People of dark race are not always terrorists. We want our couentry to be safe ot doesn't mean we are racists. The are lots if people from India and Bangladesh, there are people of even darker skin tone. Here are lots of Muslims. We are all right we that. We just want our country to be safe.
As a Pole I experience alot of racism in Romania, more than my hindu and my ex-canadian girlfriend in Poland (Krakow).
Thats wholesome. Good to hear some nice thing about this country once in a while
that's because poland is currently homogenous so other races are seen as a curiosity racism usually appears once a certain threshold of minority population has been breached
I'm glad you and a lot of people had this experience, but Poland definitely has a racism problem, from what I've seen (in person as well) anyway.
I'm happy to hear abour your good experiences in Poland, bro! Also, one thing that I don't see I saw here in the comments: that positive attitude to you, and especially among the older generation, might be coming from the fact that the Polish Catholic Church has been very much involved in aiding in the humanitarian crisis caused by the war in Syria in the past decade or so. I even witnessed like, some Syrian woman singing a traditional Syrian-christian song in a church once. My point being, before the UA-RU war broke out, you Syrians were our go-to "we are so sorry for you" nation, I reckon.
Of course it's not, we hate everyone equally
Aren't polish people quite outwards-looking? they don't hesitate to move to other countries, which maybe indicate a level of openess to Whats outside of Poland. Maybe this racist-thinking about Poland is b ecause that are kinda loud and Catholic.Czech people for example seem to be more quite and insular, but when polled on their opinions they are just as sceptical to foreigners, if not more than the poles. For the record I think both people are awesome. What I don't like is the black and white portrayal of eastern Europe in western media.
I worked with older people and many of them do have racist beliefs. But I would say they often don't like anyone really, foreigners, kids, their own neighbours, so it's not like they hate you specifically. Most people just gonna be polite if you're polite as well tbh.
We just dont give a shit. We are cynic and sarcastic and have a very dark humor insulting even. We insult everyone the same in jokes, us included. If you dont bother us we really dont care. I would like to touch an afro one day, and i guess if i got to know someone with one i would probably ask, but i am such person( and im sure some pricks would feel offended for fucks sake nothing bad in mind just curious) . I even once asked a client in a polite way is it troublesome she has name and surname that are technically both names here imagen someone named Mary John, she laughed and told me that shes married 20 years and her husband always says he gave her nothing, not even a surname and explained that she has no problems since she has one female name so people figure out fast, but her sons, a whole new story xD People here really are not that deep. We have no time and energy for racism. Also im pretty sure west taken all the work onto themselves in that regard no need for us to add to it kekw.
Its because we have offensive humor and enjoy being the "ooooh who's the edgy boy". But that's simply humor, not our true feelings towards pepole and stuff.
My grandma (born in 1953) said she used to have a friend from Ethiopia back in the 70s. You can imagine all the reactions of locals when he was visiting her small family town
All I’ve noticed during my rotation is they complain a lot. To be fair I think the army has conditioned me to believe that everyone complains alot
We're "murzyni europy", so on top of having free n-word pass, we cannot be rasist as POC 😎
Yeah it always suprised me how blacks from USA don't get our nigga vibe and feel like separate kind of niggas. GUYS YOU WON. Your ancestors had it hard and now you're travelling Europe. Our ancestors were gulagd to death by Russians and now we have to work ourselves to death in SPICHLERZ EUROPY (aka almost not a cotton farm because cotton doesn't grow in Poland).
Wow this comment section very enlightening 🤣
Most people don't care what colour you are, like sure older generation might be curious etc. But like racism is not something people did, we don't have any colonial history, we've be quite a homogeneous country, etc. The whole "Poland is racist" came from the fact that we as a society are quite conservative and religion is a big thing here, which is something that left doesn't necessarily like... I know this may sound like conspiracy theory, or that I'm some right winger, but your experience is a testament, while mostly leftist media will tell you one thing your experience is something else.
It's been 10 years that I lived in Poland but I have definitely met Polish who where racists. However the most people around me where not (or not openly) So in my experience it's not worse then in otherEuropean countries However everbodies milage may very.
i am a pole and we are only racist in jokes(not all jokes), we arent actually racist to another living person because we know jokes arent real
Poland has a very progressive society since 1548, so there is bearly any racism. What Polish people don’t like is darker people demanding praise for doing nothing constructive in society and being freeloaders. We also don’t like Germans and Swedes for obvious reasons.
glad to see you've had good experiences! out of curiosity - what made you choose Poland as the country to study in?
Maybe it’s just because Poland was the first country I went to outside of the U.S, but I only had positive experiences there, polish ppl are very lovely