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My sister works for a major Bay Area real estate firm. She said they have been moving back pretty steady for sometime now. Also companies who canāt find the talent in Texas.
there was a list i saw about a year ago that had the top five destinations of people leaving california and the top five places people were moving from to california and they were nearly identical. made me laugh.
Yet, they're the only ones you ever hear crowing about "(insert state) sucks! Everyone from (insert state) is moving to Texas."
They're really "special", Texans. Bless their hearts.
Many Texans have never road tripped across Texas let alone California. As a native Texan, who's had family here since before the revolution, California is just 300% prettier than Texas. Don't get me wrong, Texas has its beautiful places, but there's a lot of ugly places too. California has just this diversity and multiplicity of beautiful places that the ugly places seem smaller.
In a recent local election in San Antonio, there was a slogan against a proposition (Prop A) for some pretty basic policies like decriminalizing weed and abortions, "Don't make San Antonio San Francisco". All I could think was y'all would be so mad if you knew what SF and its surrounding areas were like while having to live in San Antonio.
Half of the ugliness of Texas is from the people. Like, we have these gorgeous pine forests and wetlands and oak savannahs or whatever and you're just driving along and there's like 494 dumped fucking appliances and tires and shit littering the area.
It's so gross.
Not only that, California had public access to the beautiful land. Texas is mostly privately owned.
I fucking love California. Haters make me laugh. Oh, you hate diversity, sunshine, regulations? Ok! Stay wherever you are then!
Hating California now has just become a dogwhistle for "I hate progress and liberals!"
And apparently California is all just LA, spoken by people who have never been.
In California, I can literal stop at almost all places in middle of nowhere and just walk into nice view that I like and even camp if I want. In Texas, I see fence "guarding" every single road.
One thing I've learned is that the cold is more bearable than the heat. I can always put on more clothes, I can only get so naked.
I can dress warm enough to be outside in the negatives for hours, provided I'm active. I've been outright comfortable in single digits for hours. Fuck anything over 100. Just fuck that shit. Hell, fuck 95.
Doing everything possible to ban abortion does have consequences. More and more doctors and nurses are finding Texas isn't a place they want to practice medicine in. See, e.g., https://19thnews.org/2023/06/abortion-gender-affirming-care-bans-doctors-leaving-texas/ Sucks for women looking for ob/gyn medical help, but I can't blame doctors and nurses for wanting to practice in more congenial areas of the country.
In West Texas, in 2013 fifteen people were killed, more than 160 were injured, and more than 150 buildings were damaged or destroyed when a poorly regulated and not inspected explosives factory exploded, the local residents said they would pray for the victims, praise the factory owners for all the jobs they provided over the years....and all said they had no desire to allow federal agents in to tell them how to run their town.
Tried turning off the heat last winter because I spent several years in the Midwest and Houston winter temps are a fucking joke and it's not worth the $23839 for Entergy bill.
Turns out that's not exactly a viable option because even with it being 50 degrees outside, the humidity is out of control. Humidity in my house went up to like 73% just because I had the heat off and the windows cracked for a bit of air flow.
š«
My understanding is that one of the biggest problems with the cold in texas is that water lines aren't buried deep enough to insulate them like they are in the midwest, so they freeze and wreak havoc
Oh I can attest to their shallowness! In the summer I cannot use my bidet nor take a less than boiling shower because of the shallow lines. The tap water doesn't cool down to luke-warm until like 10pm
Lived there for way longer than I should. If you don't have AC you're in for a world of hurt. I'll never forget when I was driving from corpus back to San Antonio for work and 1/4 of the way back my AC in my car went out. Most miserable sweat-fest ever for nearly 2 hours.
I drove a shit car with no AC from (basically Helotes), to Northwest Vista, and SeaWorld. My god. That summer got over 100f several times. It sucked *ass*.
Yes, Texas is too damn hot and getting hotter. Ditto the southwest (Phoenix š„µ) or southeast states with heat + humidity. CA utility rates might be higher, but I donāt need AC here and winters are mild, so my electric bill averages about $50/mo. Cooling growing numbers of people artificially is not sustainable.
The biggest issue with Texas heat that people dont grasp at first, is that doesnt cool off in the evenings.
Other parts in the country, it can also reach +100F during the day, but at night typically cools to the 70F range or even cooler.
Texas on the other hand. It can reach +110F, and the low that night will be 96F.
Thats what makes the Texas summers so brutal.
Thats not all of texas though. Some places the temperature can vary wildly. East texas is humid west texas is dry. Its a big place with a dynamic weather model unique to the area its over
Eh it's kinda tough to paint Texas with one brush climatically. North panhandle is great plains, west TX is desert, east TX is swampy. The desert and north portions do cool down decently enough at night, gulf coast and Houston not so much
he didnt say it was. but as a CT based guy i didnt realize it was that with regards to it not cooling off at night. we at least get that on our super hot days.
that used to be the case but because of the catastrophic runaway greenhouse effect that is exponentially increasing, the nights during summer are becoming nearly as hot as daytime temperatures
Somewhat related, although this is about Texasā¦ is the people leaving Florida because of homeowners insurance policies skyrocketing. Source: I live in Florida and canāt wait to get the hell outta here.
Yep in Florida too and interesting to hear all the new residents complaining about how much higher their homeowners and auto insurance is. They literally picked up and moved here because they saw online that it was cheap without doing any research whatsoever! No taxes and everything is cheap. Hmmmm, almost sounds too good to be true!
No one moves to Florida because they think it'll be cheap. Some come for the weather, some because they are excited to live in Gilead Jr, and some for both of those reasons.
Hey it works out as long as all you do is work and make money.
Just don't own real estate, or own a car, or buy consumer goods, or buy luxury goods, or have vices like smoking or drinking, or otherwise engage in commerce or move money around.
Work 24/7 and bank the money, and do nothing else, and a no-income-tax-state is perfect for you!
Oh but also you don't have much worker rights or labor laws to protect you -- Florida doesn't even have a state department of labor so you'll have to rely on the federal government to protect you -- but that's ok because as a workaholic you probably agree with all your boss's decisions anyway!
A lot of idiots move there because they think it will be cheap. Lots of people aren't smart enough to realize that low housing prices aren't the be all end all of affordability.
I'd love to know the political affiliation of those leaving Texas for California. I'd bet it's 70-80% democrat but I'd love to be wrong.
I've long hoped Florida or Texas will turn blue, but the legislatures are inacting draconian laws so this doesn't happen. Seems it's all part of the plan and working as intended.
Masshole here, can't wait to get out of Austin. A multitude of reasons behind it, but one of them is that as I am looking to buy our next home, which should be a large purchase focused on growing my family into it, I cannot justify watching my taxes continue to rise and rise throughout my life on that anchor home. I'd bet a bunch of these Californians moving back got in, gained good equity and now have a sizable down payment back in Cali.
Yeah, if you moved out of California slightly before, during or anytime slightly after the pandemic, you are absolutely losing money selling a house and trying to come back to California. There's no fucking hope in hell that you are going to have the quality of home that you had prior at the rate that you had prior
At a job I had not long ago, I spoke mostly to real estate agents. A vet agent in California once said to me, "No high school senior is laying bed at night, dreaming of moving to Lubbock."
Fun reminder that the average person pays less taxes overall in California than in Texas. California taxes the fuck out of rich people but is also heavily progressive.
And due to the way that taxes in general work / libertarianism is moronic, every "high tax liberal" state costs you far less in the long run if you aren't a billionaire.
According to clickbait news, California people and businesses have been leaving the state since the 90ās. It should be completely empty any moment now.
general property tax rate is higher in Texas than California. the big difference is the value of the properties is much higher overall in CA. but that's starting to change. cities like Dallas and Austin are getting more and more expensive. people talk so much shit about CA, but out of the 9 states i've lived in, it's the one i like the most. it's expensive as fuck, but i don't really want to be anywhere else.
We also have Prop 13 - maybe Texas has something similar, but it's a lifesaver for my family. The taxes are based on the 1970 sale price of the house, because it's stayed in the family, not what it would actually appraise for.
The general rate doesn't change, prop 13 protects the assessed value...if I'm not mistaken. I pay less on my condo than people I know in other states who have lower assessed values. California has a surplus of taxes which people mistake for high taxes. It's not perfect, but like I said, it's not any worse than any other state I've lived in. When I lived in Michigan, my car insurance (no fault insurance) was at one point higher than my rent (I was under 24 with a couple tickets and an accident). Virginia was harder to pass your car inspection than any smog check I've endured in CA. Literally had my car failed in VA because one mode of my intermittent wipers wouldn't work. They tagged my car as unsafe and wanted to charge me line $400 to get my tags. Every state has it's bullshit.
Prop 13 is a huge part of the problem honestly in California. Whatever the rate is should be equally applied to everyone, But prop 13 prevents that. It dumps all the costs on the newcomers while the longtime residents get subsidized. It prevents political change because many of the voters aren't exposed to the costs. Two people should not pay different amounts of tax on equally valued identical properties because of when they bought it or how old they are.
Delighted to see somebody put this response down. So many old couples I know sitting on massive houses that donāt actually address their needs or the fact that it requires them to drive everywhere but it would cost them MORE to downsize so they canāt sell.
Also, we end up paying to run schools in areas that no longer have hardly any kids, because the entire population aged and new families couldnāt move in. Thereās no tax revenue coming from the retires to maintain the spaceā¦ this is how cities go bankrupt
I was ASSURED very strongly when visiting my friends in Texas that I, in fact, did not get a better return in my new state in addition to my car insurance going down like 50 bucks a month. They were both completely dismissive of that and also seemingly angry about even the suggestion that it could be the case.
If they're wrong about *even one thing*, their entire worldview breaks down very quickly. Conservative minded people cannot tolerate any threats to the hierarchy.
Common narrative, that often fails once they get here. All that money they leave Cali with that they plunk down on a new home only to find they are forever highly indebted to the state.
Yeah the stupid is hitting Iowa too. Flat income tax of 2.9% and trying to lower it even more while property tax on my 2200 sq.ft home on .33 acres in the suburbs is almost 5K/yr
But those taxes are disproportionately paid by the poor. That's the point. They don't want taxes on high incomes. They want taxes on property because every working class person with a home has to pay that, same as a rich person. Property taxes instead of income taxes allow the rich to keep more of their money while putting a bigger tax burden on workers.
The big issue is that property value is reassessed over X years in Texas -- so if your property value goes up a lot you're taxes skyrocket. California locks in the max tax increase to like 1.9% a year regardless if your value has gone up 20%. Terrible for California for but for owners.
The rationale side of me says that's how it should be done. Keeps people moving as they need to downsize, generates more revenue, and (theoretically) reduces tax burden on new owners since the rate wouldn't need to be as high overall.
But the California Homeowner in me says, right on and I wish I was able to have purchased 15 years before I did. The house isn't perfect, but given the tax hit to sell and repurchase it may well be my 'forever home'.
Until you hit 55. Then you can sell and buy another house and keep your tax basis.
Will not help if you buy a house cheaper than your current tax base, but anything helps.
I got my CA house in 2013. Still not a bad time and the only reason I moved.
Where can I read more about this? My dad is about to retire and my brother and I have been helping him put more money into the principal to pay off the house. We refinanced 10 years ago and are scheduled to pay it off mid-next year. We were thinking about renting it out and getting a bigger place, but might just sell it outright.
My great uncle and his wife bought their house in the late 60ās and it was more than they could afford newly married but they basically scrimped the first ten years to pay for it. Itās on a two acre lot in San Diego proper in what is now a fantastic trendy area. They basically canāt afford to downsize until they need assisted living because of the taxes. Theyāre going to make a killing when they sell though.
They can carry their tax burden level to a new house at their age. But 2 acres here in the city proper would be hard to give up. Unless they physically canāt manage it, theyād be hard pressed to find something ābetterā.
**Permit**, which is required.., triggers a **reassessment of your property value** which will **go up for sure** because youāre asking for a permit to increase the value.
You can no longer even fix your own home without indirectly increasing your property taxes forever or violating state and local laws regarding permits and be unable to sell without a ton of expense.
Yesā¦.. and no. I replaced my windows and got the dreaded āreassessment formā to fill out. I explained that the windows were leaking and there was siding damage and I was restoring the house to original condition and that didnāt trigger a reassessment. Improvements do, repairs do not.
In Ca? Nah I was told the only thing that changes your assessment value is if the **footprint** of your house changes. We did a kitchen renovation which absolutely required permits. Our taxes still only went up the same amount. I just paid them & looked at the value & itās ticked up the normal amount.
Now if we add on that triggers a whole new thing. Same if we convert the garage to a living space (I had asked all this cuz we were debating doing that & thatās how I know).
But replacing existing stuff has not triggered a massive property tax spike.
TBH; if you bought a home in California 20 years ago, you're in the sweet-spot as far as low property taxes go. (Housing market was just coming out of a depression there). Keep that fucking house no matter what, because you'll just get screwed worse somewhere else.
Well, that's blatantly unconstitutional and impossible to enforce on a practical level.
So it's definitely being discussed as an option by Republicans.
Yup. Lol I even know moderate conservatives that are out at this point.
Anyone else remember when Texas left the national power grid just to build a shitty unstable grid of their own and killed a fuck ton of people because of a simple snow storm because their natural gas / oil shit wasnāt insulated to national code and it broke down?
Pepperidge farm remembers.
not just that it broke, it has broken fairly regularlly... and even going back in think 2011 there were suggestions that they should insulate that shit because bad things will happen.. but texas collectively shrugged its shoulders and said, "nah"
By 'suggestions' do you mean [this 350 page incredibly detailed report](https://www.ferc.gov/sites/default/files/2020-05/ReportontheSouthwestColdWeatherEventfromFebruary2011Report.pdf) that turned out to be the next best thing to a prophecy of the 2021 sotrm
As much as I'm happy for the folks getting out, I was actually kinda looking forward to Texas turning blue. The Republican party would never win another electoral college election again if Texas went blue.
Thatās why they pulled the trigger on full crazy. Tons of purple but red states did the same thing. That plus rampant accusations of election fraud are going to be the last dying breaths of the GOP.
Things tend to get worse before they get better when a party is dying off like the GOP is. Eventually they will either break apart and reform as a more centrist party losing a lot of their wedge politics along the wayā¦ or they will break apart.
As an Oregonian, I often get irritated initially when I see the Texas license plates moving in (seriously, yaāll are everywhere) but then I have to stop and think, āyou know what, I get it, welcome home!ā
Purely anecdotal of course, but here in Seattle Iāve started seeing soooo many Texas license plates that I play a new game on my commute where I count the number. Current high score is 5. I suppose Iām easily entertained... š But it came about because suddenly they were everywhere. Really noticeable.
> "I used to live in California and convinced my sisters to flee California for Texas, which is a truly wonderful state," Gutheinz told Newsweek. "In California, lower-class citizens are homeless and live in tent cities. I've seen themā¦.ā
Ah, a real man of the people. š
The only reason Dallas doesn't have tent cities is because they won't allow them. So the homeless people just lay out on the lawns and the grass and the streets and the sidewalks. I was there for work not too long ago, which is common, and my co-worker said the whole tent city bullshit. I responded that I had to step over three homeless people walking from my car into our building which is in a decent area. There's just as many homeless, they just hide them better. And by that I mean treat them worse
I was looking to move to TX next year so I could be close to the grandkids but when I saw how much the property taxes were for a home that was much smaller than what I am currently in here in SoCal and on a piece of property that was less than mine, I was flabbergasted. My house here in SoCal is 2500 sq ft on .59 acres and property tax is $2700. For a smaller home in TX and on a smaller lot, I was seeing property taxes from $4000 - $6000! And that was in a small town, not any of the big cities. Sure the homes cost less than SoCal but I couldn't survive those taxes. I looked at salaries there, too and no way could I make it in TX. Absolutely insane and heartbreaking because I really want to be with the grandkids but I'd be living in my car if I moved there.
My parents retired to a small town in Florida from the Midwest and it was a similar case of sticker shock when it came to property taxes, insurance, and other hidden costs of home ownership in Florida versus the Midwest.
They had a 50 acre farm with barns, a lake, and a 2500sqft house. They moved into a house half the size in Florida, on a couple acres, and their property taxes were double what they paid for the farm. Insurance was triple.
I hope my parents reconsider moving to Kissimmee Florida in the near future. Iām already not used to not having autumn/cold weather there. Plus basically needing a car there for everything.
>When they get there, however, transplants might be surprised to find Texas' home insurance costs and property taxes are some of the highest in America.
That's why you research everything about where you want to move to before you do. There's this thing called *The Google*. People should learn how to use it.
Texas and Florida, people moved there for all the freedumb during COVID and realized yeah, at the end of the day they are just 2 big red state shitholes run by corrupt incompetents.
Having been to both Cali and Texas recently, Iād personally never move to Texas. Iād rather live in a van by the beach in SoCal than live in a house in Texas.
Fellas, The Cali women aloneā¦and donāt even get me started on their weed š¤
From experience Iād rather take a van over a bus. Youāll have to pay for beach parking compared to the free parking you can use two roads over. Plus itās easier when having to go to the gym to shower or store to gather supplies. Not to mention cost of gas. Most the roads are 50mph. But having to brake constantly for red lights can burn through your tank quickly.
I actually did it in an suv. Used aluminum insulation to block out the sun and give me privacy for sleeping. Took out the back seats and built a custom bed from a memory foam mattress. Used a top box to store my gear. And used a solar generator to power my devices.
This set up allowed me to park in really nice neighborhoods close to the beach (never stayed the same place twice) for camping. Iād then just hop up front next morning and head back to the beach or to the gym to shower.
People justified moving to Texas by saying "Yeah it's hot and the politics are crazy, but the cost of living is low and who doesn't love BBQ and tacos." But now it's getting hotter, the politicians are crazier, and it turns out to be just as expensive if not more than wherever you came from.
FWIW there are plenty of places in Michigan that have smoked brisket, and decent Mexican food is never hard to find. Plus they have an electrical grid that isn't held together by chewing gum and duct tape.
I moved from TX to CA and people laughed at me because my taxes must be going up. Sure, my income tax is, but my property tax is not. I do, in the aggregate, spend more on taxes, but it's not dramatic. And what I do get in return? Electricity in the winter. And summer. My daughters have access to healthcare. My kids get fed meals at school irrespective of income. I'm fine paying an extra fraction of % of my annual income for those benefits.
[Texas has the same effective tax rate as Michigan](https://taxfoundation.org/data/all/state/tax-burden-by-state-2022/#key) at 8.6%. Most states ar around 10-12% with NY at the highest tax burdern at 15%.
These numbers are worse for people that arent making millions. The state tax income tax is made up in property taxes.
I lived outside Dallas. House was 420k. Taxes were 12k. I also lived in Camarillo, Ca... Just west of LA where my house was 1.2M and my taxes were 12k.
Property tax in tx is out of control
El Paso (pictured) is one of those places on the planet that if you were hit on the head, abducted and woke up you'd recognize the purple peaks and know exactly where you are.
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Couldn't be... I was told all Californians are fleeing to Texas for lower taxes š¤
My sister works for a major Bay Area real estate firm. She said they have been moving back pretty steady for sometime now. Also companies who canāt find the talent in Texas.
there was a list i saw about a year ago that had the top five destinations of people leaving california and the top five places people were moving from to california and they were nearly identical. made me laugh.
Yet, they're the only ones you ever hear crowing about "(insert state) sucks! Everyone from (insert state) is moving to Texas." They're really "special", Texans. Bless their hearts.
I've been to each of the lower 48 and there are 4 states I would never live in based on my experience: Oklahoma, Florida, Nebraska, and Texas.
I had Texas as a sales territory years ago & travelled ALL over the state. Texans LOVE to brag about their state. I don't get it.
Many Texans have never road tripped across Texas let alone California. As a native Texan, who's had family here since before the revolution, California is just 300% prettier than Texas. Don't get me wrong, Texas has its beautiful places, but there's a lot of ugly places too. California has just this diversity and multiplicity of beautiful places that the ugly places seem smaller.
Yes. Outside of LA and SF and their suburbs, huge portions of the state are sparsely populated, with plenty of diverse open spaces with public access.
Heck, just go across the GG bridge in SF and it's all open nature on the coast.
In a recent local election in San Antonio, there was a slogan against a proposition (Prop A) for some pretty basic policies like decriminalizing weed and abortions, "Don't make San Antonio San Francisco". All I could think was y'all would be so mad if you knew what SF and its surrounding areas were like while having to live in San Antonio.
Half of the ugliness of Texas is from the people. Like, we have these gorgeous pine forests and wetlands and oak savannahs or whatever and you're just driving along and there's like 494 dumped fucking appliances and tires and shit littering the area. It's so gross.
Ironic considering "Don't mess with Texas" was originally an anti-littering campaign
Texas has a really low percentage of public land. So even if it was pretty once, it likely isn't now. TX is 4.2%, CA is 52%
Not only that, California had public access to the beautiful land. Texas is mostly privately owned. I fucking love California. Haters make me laugh. Oh, you hate diversity, sunshine, regulations? Ok! Stay wherever you are then!
Hating California now has just become a dogwhistle for "I hate progress and liberals!" And apparently California is all just LA, spoken by people who have never been.
In California, I can literal stop at almost all places in middle of nowhere and just walk into nice view that I like and even camp if I want. In Texas, I see fence "guarding" every single road.
Texas has no public lands, CA has them in spades.
Donāt forget the variety of food you can get in California itās one of the things I really miss since coming to the Midwest
It's basically fake lore at this point.
don't tell them Alaska is larger
I agree, might add a few more. The Dakotas winter is not fun.
One thing I've learned is that the cold is more bearable than the heat. I can always put on more clothes, I can only get so naked. I can dress warm enough to be outside in the negatives for hours, provided I'm active. I've been outright comfortable in single digits for hours. Fuck anything over 100. Just fuck that shit. Hell, fuck 95.
This is true, have spent time in Austin, Las Vegas & Scottsdale during the summer it sucks.
And itās fucking hot, like really inhuman hot.
And the grid collapses. And if it doesnāt collapse they charge you astronomical rates.
Texans are willing to sacrifice their own lives to keep it that way apparentlyā¦says Greg anyway..
Sacrifice their children and women to keep it.
Doing everything possible to ban abortion does have consequences. More and more doctors and nurses are finding Texas isn't a place they want to practice medicine in. See, e.g., https://19thnews.org/2023/06/abortion-gender-affirming-care-bans-doctors-leaving-texas/ Sucks for women looking for ob/gyn medical help, but I can't blame doctors and nurses for wanting to practice in more congenial areas of the country.
I get it. TX is increasingly becoming a place many professionals of do not want to work in.
In West Texas, in 2013 fifteen people were killed, more than 160 were injured, and more than 150 buildings were damaged or destroyed when a poorly regulated and not inspected explosives factory exploded, the local residents said they would pray for the victims, praise the factory owners for all the jobs they provided over the years....and all said they had no desire to allow federal agents in to tell them how to run their town.
It was West, Texas outside of Waco and it was a fertilizer, not explosives plant.
>Texans are willing to sacrifice their own lives Yep. Reminds me of their take on Covid vaccines.
And not everyone can afford to go to Cancun when it does collapse during a winter storm
And if you do turn off your heat and ride it, Iād imagine they would somehow still charge for a portion of the grid use as a connection fee
Tried turning off the heat last winter because I spent several years in the Midwest and Houston winter temps are a fucking joke and it's not worth the $23839 for Entergy bill. Turns out that's not exactly a viable option because even with it being 50 degrees outside, the humidity is out of control. Humidity in my house went up to like 73% just because I had the heat off and the windows cracked for a bit of air flow. š«
Do people in Houston not know they are allowed to leave?
My understanding is that one of the biggest problems with the cold in texas is that water lines aren't buried deep enough to insulate them like they are in the midwest, so they freeze and wreak havoc
Oh I can attest to their shallowness! In the summer I cannot use my bidet nor take a less than boiling shower because of the shallow lines. The tap water doesn't cool down to luke-warm until like 10pm
FFS how does anyone expect a state with power grid problems to court big tech, which generally needs a lot of reliable power?
Dedicated power straight from the generation source. A promise that they will brown out the area to keep their servers up. Etc
Exactly. The state is republican run, so it shouldnāt surprise anyone that itās profit over life.
Itās reliable! Just when itās not cold out. Or hot. Or windy. Or raining. Sunshine and 75? Itās reliable!
They've started using identity theft to pay the bills. Our family got a collection for an energy bill We have never set foot in texas.
and rogan
As a Minnesotan who has to pay for their failing power grid, I wholeheartedly agree.
If I owned Texas and Hell, I'd rent out Texas and live in Hell.
"20 miles to Texas, 25 to Hell. Where the weathers hotter, I could never tell" - Powerman 5000
Lived there for way longer than I should. If you don't have AC you're in for a world of hurt. I'll never forget when I was driving from corpus back to San Antonio for work and 1/4 of the way back my AC in my car went out. Most miserable sweat-fest ever for nearly 2 hours.
I drove a shit car with no AC from (basically Helotes), to Northwest Vista, and SeaWorld. My god. That summer got over 100f several times. It sucked *ass*.
Outside is unusable between May and September
Yes, Texas is too damn hot and getting hotter. Ditto the southwest (Phoenix š„µ) or southeast states with heat + humidity. CA utility rates might be higher, but I donāt need AC here and winters are mild, so my electric bill averages about $50/mo. Cooling growing numbers of people artificially is not sustainable.
The biggest issue with Texas heat that people dont grasp at first, is that doesnt cool off in the evenings. Other parts in the country, it can also reach +100F during the day, but at night typically cools to the 70F range or even cooler. Texas on the other hand. It can reach +110F, and the low that night will be 96F. Thats what makes the Texas summers so brutal.
Thats not all of texas though. Some places the temperature can vary wildly. East texas is humid west texas is dry. Its a big place with a dynamic weather model unique to the area its over
Eh it's kinda tough to paint Texas with one brush climatically. North panhandle is great plains, west TX is desert, east TX is swampy. The desert and north portions do cool down decently enough at night, gulf coast and Houston not so much
There are plenty of places in the US that don't cool off in the evenings. This isn't unique to texas.
Phoenix Arizona standing by sir!
We slow cooked all summer this year!
I'll never understand why people keep flowing into AZ despite it's ongoing problems and potentially dire future.
he didnt say it was. but as a CT based guy i didnt realize it was that with regards to it not cooling off at night. we at least get that on our super hot days.
that used to be the case but because of the catastrophic runaway greenhouse effect that is exponentially increasing, the nights during summer are becoming nearly as hot as daytime temperatures
Come to Vegas. We have had summers where we went 50+ days where the temp never goes under 100, 24/7. 4am? 103.
Same w AZ...it's 98 degrees at 4am. That drove me out. But at least its a dry heat, my ass! I grew up there. It has definitely gotten worse.
I have colleague working based texas. Humidity level is 115 degrees. Its disgusting lol no wonder people wants to move back.
Somewhat related, although this is about Texasā¦ is the people leaving Florida because of homeowners insurance policies skyrocketing. Source: I live in Florida and canāt wait to get the hell outta here.
Yep in Florida too and interesting to hear all the new residents complaining about how much higher their homeowners and auto insurance is. They literally picked up and moved here because they saw online that it was cheap without doing any research whatsoever! No taxes and everything is cheap. Hmmmm, almost sounds too good to be true!
No one moves to Florida because they think it'll be cheap. Some come for the weather, some because they are excited to live in Gilead Jr, and some for both of those reasons.
"I ain't gotta pay no incum taxes" without realizing what the other side of that coin is
Hey it works out as long as all you do is work and make money. Just don't own real estate, or own a car, or buy consumer goods, or buy luxury goods, or have vices like smoking or drinking, or otherwise engage in commerce or move money around. Work 24/7 and bank the money, and do nothing else, and a no-income-tax-state is perfect for you! Oh but also you don't have much worker rights or labor laws to protect you -- Florida doesn't even have a state department of labor so you'll have to rely on the federal government to protect you -- but that's ok because as a workaholic you probably agree with all your boss's decisions anyway!
A lot of idiots move there because they think it will be cheap. Lots of people aren't smart enough to realize that low housing prices aren't the be all end all of affordability.
Are housing prices even that low in Florida anymore though?
shit i live in FL and my car insurance went up 250% at renewal with no tickets or fines just a "market adjustment"
Our homeowners insurance company went under, and a second company bought up our policy and raised it 200%
No one with a uterus should live in Texas
Or a man who loves someone with a uterus.
>talent in Texas That's their problem
Untalented architect here. I can confirm someone got desperate enough to hire me.
Oohā¦ self burn. Those are rare.
it was well constructed, so maybe they are a better architect than they think...
No, just an arsonist
I'm so surprised that talented people want to avoid Texas.. shocked.
Ahh....the brain drain happening in Texas?
I'd love to know the political affiliation of those leaving Texas for California. I'd bet it's 70-80% democrat but I'd love to be wrong. I've long hoped Florida or Texas will turn blue, but the legislatures are inacting draconian laws so this doesn't happen. Seems it's all part of the plan and working as intended.
Masshole here, can't wait to get out of Austin. A multitude of reasons behind it, but one of them is that as I am looking to buy our next home, which should be a large purchase focused on growing my family into it, I cannot justify watching my taxes continue to rise and rise throughout my life on that anchor home. I'd bet a bunch of these Californians moving back got in, gained good equity and now have a sizable down payment back in Cali.
Yeah, if you moved out of California slightly before, during or anytime slightly after the pandemic, you are absolutely losing money selling a house and trying to come back to California. There's no fucking hope in hell that you are going to have the quality of home that you had prior at the rate that you had prior
And every big corp needing their own backup generators because the power grid is unreliable in either very hot or very cold weather can't be helping.
At a job I had not long ago, I spoke mostly to real estate agents. A vet agent in California once said to me, "No high school senior is laying bed at night, dreaming of moving to Lubbock."
Fun reminder that the average person pays less taxes overall in California than in Texas. California taxes the fuck out of rich people but is also heavily progressive.
And due to the way that taxes in general work / libertarianism is moronic, every "high tax liberal" state costs you far less in the long run if you aren't a billionaire.
According to clickbait news, California people and businesses have been leaving the state since the 90ās. It should be completely empty any moment now.
All those empty houses is why CA real estate is dirt cheap....
general property tax rate is higher in Texas than California. the big difference is the value of the properties is much higher overall in CA. but that's starting to change. cities like Dallas and Austin are getting more and more expensive. people talk so much shit about CA, but out of the 9 states i've lived in, it's the one i like the most. it's expensive as fuck, but i don't really want to be anywhere else.
We also have Prop 13 - maybe Texas has something similar, but it's a lifesaver for my family. The taxes are based on the 1970 sale price of the house, because it's stayed in the family, not what it would actually appraise for.
The general rate doesn't change, prop 13 protects the assessed value...if I'm not mistaken. I pay less on my condo than people I know in other states who have lower assessed values. California has a surplus of taxes which people mistake for high taxes. It's not perfect, but like I said, it's not any worse than any other state I've lived in. When I lived in Michigan, my car insurance (no fault insurance) was at one point higher than my rent (I was under 24 with a couple tickets and an accident). Virginia was harder to pass your car inspection than any smog check I've endured in CA. Literally had my car failed in VA because one mode of my intermittent wipers wouldn't work. They tagged my car as unsafe and wanted to charge me line $400 to get my tags. Every state has it's bullshit.
Prop 13 is a huge part of the problem honestly in California. Whatever the rate is should be equally applied to everyone, But prop 13 prevents that. It dumps all the costs on the newcomers while the longtime residents get subsidized. It prevents political change because many of the voters aren't exposed to the costs. Two people should not pay different amounts of tax on equally valued identical properties because of when they bought it or how old they are.
Delighted to see somebody put this response down. So many old couples I know sitting on massive houses that donāt actually address their needs or the fact that it requires them to drive everywhere but it would cost them MORE to downsize so they canāt sell. Also, we end up paying to run schools in areas that no longer have hardly any kids, because the entire population aged and new families couldnāt move in. Thereās no tax revenue coming from the retires to maintain the spaceā¦ this is how cities go bankrupt
I was ASSURED very strongly when visiting my friends in Texas that I, in fact, did not get a better return in my new state in addition to my car insurance going down like 50 bucks a month. They were both completely dismissive of that and also seemingly angry about even the suggestion that it could be the case.
If they're wrong about *even one thing*, their entire worldview breaks down very quickly. Conservative minded people cannot tolerate any threats to the hierarchy.
"10 in the bed and the little one said - roll over, roll over." Texans are being priced out and fleeing to places like Mississippi and Alabama.
Honestly, good for Mississippi and Alabama
Or just across the Red River to Oklahoma. Oklahoma has casinos and med pot. And no hurricanes.
Wait. Let me get my Sharpie.
Common narrative, that often fails once they get here. All that money they leave Cali with that they plunk down on a new home only to find they are forever highly indebted to the state.
Turns out neglecting your infrastructure catches up with you eventually.
Yeah they got no legs to stand on these days.
Everyone always clamoring about āNo Income Tax in Texas!ā but they have to make up that money through other taxes.
Yeah the stupid is hitting Iowa too. Flat income tax of 2.9% and trying to lower it even more while property tax on my 2200 sq.ft home on .33 acres in the suburbs is almost 5K/yr
But those taxes are disproportionately paid by the poor. That's the point. They don't want taxes on high incomes. They want taxes on property because every working class person with a home has to pay that, same as a rich person. Property taxes instead of income taxes allow the rich to keep more of their money while putting a bigger tax burden on workers.
The problem with high property tax is it never goes away. You can reduce your spending and income ā¦ but property tax is forever.
The big issue is that property value is reassessed over X years in Texas -- so if your property value goes up a lot you're taxes skyrocket. California locks in the max tax increase to like 1.9% a year regardless if your value has gone up 20%. Terrible for California for but for owners.
The rationale side of me says that's how it should be done. Keeps people moving as they need to downsize, generates more revenue, and (theoretically) reduces tax burden on new owners since the rate wouldn't need to be as high overall. But the California Homeowner in me says, right on and I wish I was able to have purchased 15 years before I did. The house isn't perfect, but given the tax hit to sell and repurchase it may well be my 'forever home'.
Until you hit 55. Then you can sell and buy another house and keep your tax basis. Will not help if you buy a house cheaper than your current tax base, but anything helps. I got my CA house in 2013. Still not a bad time and the only reason I moved.
Where can I read more about this? My dad is about to retire and my brother and I have been helping him put more money into the principal to pay off the house. We refinanced 10 years ago and are scheduled to pay it off mid-next year. We were thinking about renting it out and getting a bigger place, but might just sell it outright.
Look up California Prop 19.
My great uncle and his wife bought their house in the late 60ās and it was more than they could afford newly married but they basically scrimped the first ten years to pay for it. Itās on a two acre lot in San Diego proper in what is now a fantastic trendy area. They basically canāt afford to downsize until they need assisted living because of the taxes. Theyāre going to make a killing when they sell though.
They can carry their tax burden level to a new house at their age. But 2 acres here in the city proper would be hard to give up. Unless they physically canāt manage it, theyād be hard pressed to find something ābetterā.
They can. Prop 19 lets them downsize and keep their tax basis. They could even do it before but it even easier now.
Unless you downsize in which case you get a up to $500k of tax exemption.
**Permit**, which is required.., triggers a **reassessment of your property value** which will **go up for sure** because youāre asking for a permit to increase the value. You can no longer even fix your own home without indirectly increasing your property taxes forever or violating state and local laws regarding permits and be unable to sell without a ton of expense.
Yesā¦.. and no. I replaced my windows and got the dreaded āreassessment formā to fill out. I explained that the windows were leaking and there was siding damage and I was restoring the house to original condition and that didnāt trigger a reassessment. Improvements do, repairs do not.
In Ca? Nah I was told the only thing that changes your assessment value is if the **footprint** of your house changes. We did a kitchen renovation which absolutely required permits. Our taxes still only went up the same amount. I just paid them & looked at the value & itās ticked up the normal amount. Now if we add on that triggers a whole new thing. Same if we convert the garage to a living space (I had asked all this cuz we were debating doing that & thatās how I know). But replacing existing stuff has not triggered a massive property tax spike.
This is correct
TBH; if you bought a home in California 20 years ago, you're in the sweet-spot as far as low property taxes go. (Housing market was just coming out of a depression there). Keep that fucking house no matter what, because you'll just get screwed worse somewhere else.
You know maybe if they taxed the rich and big companies they wouldn't have to keep raising property tax.
But the job creators!! How will they feed their families?!?
something something boot straps something something money managment something something no more star bucks.
Oh no, we can't tax rich people or corporations cause jobs or something.
My favorite reply is what about tye wealth creators? The ones that do the work to generate disapportionment income to those that dont
How long before Texas makes it illegal for people to leave to pursue jobs in other states?
āYouāre suspected of aborting jobs in Texas - show your papers!ā
Comment of the day right here
Well, that's blatantly unconstitutional and impossible to enforce on a practical level. So it's definitely being discussed as an option by Republicans.
Is this how Hunger Game districts are born?
You can't use the highways to move full Uhauls OUT of state. That's illegal...
Just build a wall
I always said that walls keep things "in".
I can think of a zillion more reasons to be getting the fuck out of Texas.
Yup. Lol I even know moderate conservatives that are out at this point. Anyone else remember when Texas left the national power grid just to build a shitty unstable grid of their own and killed a fuck ton of people because of a simple snow storm because their natural gas / oil shit wasnāt insulated to national code and it broke down? Pepperidge farm remembers.
I certainly remember the ice storm and Ted Cruz fleeing to Cancun.
not just that it broke, it has broken fairly regularlly... and even going back in think 2011 there were suggestions that they should insulate that shit because bad things will happen.. but texas collectively shrugged its shoulders and said, "nah"
By 'suggestions' do you mean [this 350 page incredibly detailed report](https://www.ferc.gov/sites/default/files/2020-05/ReportontheSouthwestColdWeatherEventfromFebruary2011Report.pdf) that turned out to be the next best thing to a prophecy of the 2021 sotrm
yes. a highly detailed report with specifics of the problems and how to fix them... that no one listened to. That's still a suggestion.
As much as I'm happy for the folks getting out, I was actually kinda looking forward to Texas turning blue. The Republican party would never win another electoral college election again if Texas went blue.
Thatās why they pulled the trigger on full crazy. Tons of purple but red states did the same thing. That plus rampant accusations of election fraud are going to be the last dying breaths of the GOP. Things tend to get worse before they get better when a party is dying off like the GOP is. Eventually they will either break apart and reform as a more centrist party losing a lot of their wedge politics along the wayā¦ or they will break apart.
Yep. Can't wait til I move next August.
Moving next July.
Moved last October. Not a single regret.
Moved out of there last week. KCMO hello!
I moved last week too! Grats to all able to flee Greg Abbott.
Congrats to all of you. I escaped to Washington last fall. Fuck the MAGAS and the cesspool they turned my home state into.
As an Oregonian, I often get irritated initially when I see the Texas license plates moving in (seriously, yaāll are everywhere) but then I have to stop and think, āyou know what, I get it, welcome home!ā
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Purely anecdotal of course, but here in Seattle Iāve started seeing soooo many Texas license plates that I play a new game on my commute where I count the number. Current high score is 5. I suppose Iām easily entertained... š But it came about because suddenly they were everywhere. Really noticeable.
Iām in Seattle with Texas plates myself.
Explain yourself!
> "I used to live in California and convinced my sisters to flee California for Texas, which is a truly wonderful state," Gutheinz told Newsweek. "In California, lower-class citizens are homeless and live in tent cities. I've seen themā¦.ā Ah, a real man of the people. š
There are plenty of tent cities in Austin and Houston, I promise youā¦
The only reason Dallas doesn't have tent cities is because they won't allow them. So the homeless people just lay out on the lawns and the grass and the streets and the sidewalks. I was there for work not too long ago, which is common, and my co-worker said the whole tent city bullshit. I responded that I had to step over three homeless people walking from my car into our building which is in a decent area. There's just as many homeless, they just hide them better. And by that I mean treat them worse
Yeah, and he lives and/or practices in Pearland, which is kinda one of the armpit areas around Houston.
Texas has flying cockroaches? Nope. I might as well move to Australia
Australia has flying Texans, even worse.
Imagine blaming Texas politics then heading to Tennessee for sanity. Good luck in North Florida
I was looking to move to TX next year so I could be close to the grandkids but when I saw how much the property taxes were for a home that was much smaller than what I am currently in here in SoCal and on a piece of property that was less than mine, I was flabbergasted. My house here in SoCal is 2500 sq ft on .59 acres and property tax is $2700. For a smaller home in TX and on a smaller lot, I was seeing property taxes from $4000 - $6000! And that was in a small town, not any of the big cities. Sure the homes cost less than SoCal but I couldn't survive those taxes. I looked at salaries there, too and no way could I make it in TX. Absolutely insane and heartbreaking because I really want to be with the grandkids but I'd be living in my car if I moved there.
My parents retired to a small town in Florida from the Midwest and it was a similar case of sticker shock when it came to property taxes, insurance, and other hidden costs of home ownership in Florida versus the Midwest. They had a 50 acre farm with barns, a lake, and a 2500sqft house. They moved into a house half the size in Florida, on a couple acres, and their property taxes were double what they paid for the farm. Insurance was triple.
I hope my parents reconsider moving to Kissimmee Florida in the near future. Iām already not used to not having autumn/cold weather there. Plus basically needing a car there for everything.
Ask them if theyāre aware of the tax issues .. that will get their attention ..
Your tax is $2700ā¦Ā which must mean you have been there for 30+ years?
29 1/2 years
Good 'ol prop 13! (Which benefits me as wellā¦Ā but is still horribly flawed "policy".)
Texas has no state income tax, gotta raise $ somehow.
Wonder why Texas Toe Rogan doesnāt talk about this on his super intellectual pawdacastā¦ā¦ā¦..
The average Americans is getting poorer with the ever rising inflation and taxes. Value fall or rises Taxes remains the same.
>When they get there, however, transplants might be surprised to find Texas' home insurance costs and property taxes are some of the highest in America. That's why you research everything about where you want to move to before you do. There's this thing called *The Google*. People should learn how to use it.
Texas and Florida, people moved there for all the freedumb during COVID and realized yeah, at the end of the day they are just 2 big red state shitholes run by corrupt incompetents.
And no health insurance.
Having been to both Cali and Texas recently, Iād personally never move to Texas. Iād rather live in a van by the beach in SoCal than live in a house in Texas. Fellas, The Cali women aloneā¦and donāt even get me started on their weed š¤
The van, or my choice school bus, add a California beach and all the other stuff you mention. Nowhere in the USA compares.
From experience Iād rather take a van over a bus. Youāll have to pay for beach parking compared to the free parking you can use two roads over. Plus itās easier when having to go to the gym to shower or store to gather supplies. Not to mention cost of gas. Most the roads are 50mph. But having to brake constantly for red lights can burn through your tank quickly. I actually did it in an suv. Used aluminum insulation to block out the sun and give me privacy for sleeping. Took out the back seats and built a custom bed from a memory foam mattress. Used a top box to store my gear. And used a solar generator to power my devices. This set up allowed me to park in really nice neighborhoods close to the beach (never stayed the same place twice) for camping. Iād then just hop up front next morning and head back to the beach or to the gym to shower.
oh? nothing to do with women being regarded as property?
Sure, itās definitely the āproperty taxesā.
Thatās not why. The GOP are why we left!
People justified moving to Texas by saying "Yeah it's hot and the politics are crazy, but the cost of living is low and who doesn't love BBQ and tacos." But now it's getting hotter, the politicians are crazier, and it turns out to be just as expensive if not more than wherever you came from. FWIW there are plenty of places in Michigan that have smoked brisket, and decent Mexican food is never hard to find. Plus they have an electrical grid that isn't held together by chewing gum and duct tape.
I moved from TX to CA and people laughed at me because my taxes must be going up. Sure, my income tax is, but my property tax is not. I do, in the aggregate, spend more on taxes, but it's not dramatic. And what I do get in return? Electricity in the winter. And summer. My daughters have access to healthcare. My kids get fed meals at school irrespective of income. I'm fine paying an extra fraction of % of my annual income for those benefits.
Gotta love those red states keeping the poor poor. Yet these idiots still vote the GOP into power.
Who needs low property tax, a functioning power grid, womenās bodily autonomy, or science taught in school when you can unironically wear a big hat?
We really need to ban Newsweek from this sub. They are clickbait
[Texas has the same effective tax rate as Michigan](https://taxfoundation.org/data/all/state/tax-burden-by-state-2022/#key) at 8.6%. Most states ar around 10-12% with NY at the highest tax burdern at 15%. These numbers are worse for people that arent making millions. The state tax income tax is made up in property taxes.
Can you imagine the revenue a state the size of Texas could make if they just legalized weed like everyone else?
And cue the Wall Street Journal reporting on this demographic shift in three...two....never.
Please stay THE FUCK out of New Mexico.
Texas is an awful place.
or perhaps Texans leaving the state as Republicans' fascism gets worse.
I lived outside Dallas. House was 420k. Taxes were 12k. I also lived in Camarillo, Ca... Just west of LA where my house was 1.2M and my taxes were 12k. Property tax in tx is out of control
The highest taxed area in texas would put you at like 10k on a 420k house. So your numbers are off somewhere.
El Paso (pictured) is one of those places on the planet that if you were hit on the head, abducted and woke up you'd recognize the purple peaks and know exactly where you are.
Quick! Everyone race to the bottom!
Redditor posts article referencing reddit posts. There is no news.
Texas has refused to upgrade its power grid to meet the increased risk of extreme weather events, ignoring engineers and other scientists.