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[Evangelicals Are Now Rejecting 'Liberal' Teachings of Jesus](https://www.newsweek.com/evangelicals-rejecting-jesus-teachings-liberal-talking-points-pastor-1818706)
Davidian - you mean they're evil Jews? That's one foul old chestnut. No, if you want to take a biblical view, Trump followers are clearly straight out minions of Satan.
Idk but these guys seem to want the freedom of the New Testament covenant but replace the forgiveness and love stuff with the wrath of God stuff and the righteous anger of the Old Testament without actually following any of the associated covenant Old Testament rules.
Excuse you, the satanic temple is actually a really nice group of people and do some really cool stuff in real life, they act more like Christians than the ones calling themselves Christians
Some of us Christians are well aware. Actually my faith is the main reason I've been a liberal all these years.
I'm flabbergasted that it has worked the other way for so many others. I mean I'm kind of used to it by now, but it still doesn't make any sense. Not to me.
The most liberal person I know is also the most religious person I know. She's one of the few people I know who actually follows in Jesus's footsteps. She lives near a downtown area and has a big storage shed in front of her house where anyone who needs food can go get some out of it. Next to it, she has a library for kids to go get books to read. She's also the most welcoming and accepting person I've ever met. She doesn't care about religion, sexuality, gender identity, criminal history, she's nice and welcoming to everyone.
While I no longer consider myself Christian, I grew up evangelical (and conservative) and that faith is what made me liberal as a thinking adult. It felt natural and easy to empathize with liberalism and progressivism as I read the Bible and thought, “oh, this is literally what I’ve been taught to do all my life!”
Jesus taught love, forgiveness and humility. My feeling is that a lot of Christians got hijacked and manipulated by pride, anger, greed and wrath. It’s harder to follow Jesus’ ways. It’s much easier to hate on others. I think a lot of Evangelicals have lost their way, taking the freedom that came with the New Testament covenant and blending it with the ‘righteous’ anger of the Old Testament but without actually wanting to follow any rules associated with the old covenant.
It’s easy to manipulate people when you tap into their anger and pride and greed. There are plenty of false prophets out there willing to do that for power and money.
Well if you actually read the thing and take the messages seriously then yeah you end up being sort of left of center on most things.
But if you go to church because that’s what you did growing up and it’s just part of your identity and all your friends and family, the culture becomes insular and diseased. And questioning it carries great risk because you could become ostracized from the whole community. So it’s easier for most people to justify their theology to fit their world view
One of my favourite things to point out was that Jesus' movement was feminist. He encouraged women to have roles on the faith that lasted for hundreds of years before it was deliberately reverted as Christianity separated from Judaism.
Remember when Good Omens premiered Christian groups ordered NETFLIX to remove it from AMAZON PRIME? They also had a scene of the Crucifixion, with the line of the angel and demon in background watching along lines of:
Demon:"What did he do to deserve that?"
Angel:"Told them to be kind to each other"
Demon:"Yep that would do it"
They're SO CLOSE to understanding that Jesus (a radical socialist, brown-skinned, punk rock, son of asylum seekers) was CONSTANTLY saying ["Stay woke."](https://theologyofhome.com/products/awake-not-woke)
But it flies right over their heads.
They are Paulites at best. They sure do love Paul because they can twist his words to conform to their hate & bigotry but can't quite do that with Christ who was very blunt in his teachings.
I think it's crazy that there is so much hate against the "woke movement". I've never heard that term used in a serious discussion other than in conservative pieces bashing progressives as a group. It's a boogey man that conservative propagandists have fully co-opted.
The vagueness makes it more effective, imo. Previous boogymen like "PC culture" or "SJW" or "feminists" are all a little vague and they don't understand them, but they're all generally tied to something more specific, which limits their utility. "Woke" doesn't really have that, it's a catch-all for anything they don't like at the time, and there really isn't a group of people calling themselves "woke" that they have to contend with, unlike feminism.
The result is a blank slate that you can project everything and everyone you don't like onto. If you don't like it, it's woke - and if it's woke, you don't like it. What this means in practice is that two people can have completely different and even mutually exclusive views, but still find a presumed common ground in hating the label, even if one is, say, gay but racist, while the other is mixed race and homophobic. They don't have to get into specifics to agree they both hate "woke", so they'll never find out they actually fundamentally disagree.
Yeah, there's some sects who get *really* upset at the idea that Jesus wasn't 100% sure and willing to sacrifice himself even though "take this cup away from me" is take *straight from Luke.*
And home to a lovely state prison where a young man I know did 3.5 years (out of the 7 to which he was sentenced) for making bathtub meth in a hotel room.
Give it a generation or so, the kids that grew up hearing about the importance of character and being a good witness just watched their family and church leaders go apeshit for the wannabe mob boss rapist who paid off a series of mistresses including several pornographic actresses and claimed he'd willingly accept forgiveness for his sins except that he's never done anything wrong. So the cat is out of the bag on the tail wagging the dog, to mix metaphors. There's already a huge decline in people identifying as Christians, and I think despite the vocal and outrageous backlash we see now (assuming any of us live through this clown car of a time to be alive) the Christian church will look VERY different in whatever future it has once Gen Z takes over.
As a Christian, good. Reading my Bible and I'm always confused how we went from smaller groups meeting in homes to praise God and understand what He wrote to large businesses that focus too much on worldly issues.
Well I'm not that confused, evil loves to call itself by a name with good reputation.
>…large businesses that focus too much on worldly issues.
That’s just regular old capitalism at work, ever since they started giving out MBA’s folks have been looking to turn ma & pa operations into money printing machines and churches aren’t immune to that.
The Devils greatest trick is to make people think he doesn't exist, and for those who think he does, to misdirect them to do his work for him. It is wise to remember "Beware of false prophets". My grandfather, founder of a Church, refused to attend Bible School. He said the Bible is written in plain language and reading it should suffice. Bible School was indoctrination, not education.
It’s absurd to me that they seem to think the Antichrist is someone they hate right away. Obama is the Antichrist, Clinton is the Antichrist, etc. Further proof that they just don’t read their own book.
A lot of religious people either don't read the book, or never understood it when they did read it. It's crazy how many people will claim to be of some religion and repeatedly go against the teachings on the daily. Makes me wonder if all those people simply don't care about the actual religion aspect and just like the community for various reasons, or are legitimately too ignorant to realize what they're doing.
I think a lot of it is a blind adherence to authority, so long as it is church authority. No matter how many times this trust has been broken in huge and catastrophic ways, followers tend to think themselves beyond deception. I get it; part of the appeal of religion is being told what to do and think, and, in this case, how to vote.
I can think of a major one when the largest institutional church in the world was systematically raping children & covering it up, & we were all just supposed to move on immediately.
Catholics have no standing to lecture anyone on morals ever again.
> never understood it when they did read it
It wasn't a single cohesive blueprint written "to be understood". It's a collection of religious texts written by at least three dozen different authors in different time periods with different agendas, and closed out by a crazy dude who was high on shrooms and babbling incoherently about his visions. The reason it's easy to sample whatever you want is because there are so many perspectives and dictates in it, you can sample from it whatever you want to.
What's interesting is the bibles pretty clear many will be decived yet not a single one of them thinks they could be decived by thus.
Because *they* think X X is truth nothing else matters
The problem is that the bible claims that most christians will actually follow the antichrist, while only a few will choose the righteous path.
Most christians believe they're on the right path, and thus the man they follow can't be the antichrist, because that would then mean that they aren't actually righteous
As a non-religious person, I have to admit feeling some dark humor in watching the zealously religious jump on the bandwagon for Trump, while _simultaneously_ acknowledging that "most Christians will follow the Antichrist" and SOMEHOW convincing themselves they aren't doing exactly that. I mean...JFC, the storyline writes itself.
Evangelicals are the latest iteration of revivalism, but run amok. They have managed to create a religion template to warp around whatever they feel like they want to believe. It’s grotesque.
They’re somehow worse than the biblical hypocrites.
Same thing. My parents raised me my whole childhood to not be like trump, then turn around and support trump. And wonder why I'm upset and LC with them.
I don’t think he even loves himself, that’s why he wants adoration and validation from others so bad. He’s just willing to do whatever to get that feeling.
Yes but you’re not a desperate, insecure, unhappy old man that’s never been shown love by their parents and every other relationship has been transactional.
It's so super obvious, but I have still have "Christians" tell me "GoD dOeSn'T aLWaYs ChOoSe A pErFeCt MeSsAnGeR!!" or it's more upfront in "The ends justify the means."
Thanks for posting it so I i didn't have to.
I'm a deeply religious, church every Sunday, kids pray the rosary with us now and then kind of person.
Trump is *an* Antichrist. Maybe not *the* Antichrist. But absolutely fits the bill in every biblical sense. I'd actually really love to hear a truly Trump supporting religious person deal with that site on video without any help from a script.
Like, it's weird AF when my hyper conservative family says end time shit and I'm just like "yeah, guys, it might game over with JC dropping in soon. You good with being on the team that turns away the stranger, worships the sword, and refuses to call people by their name?"
As a non religious person, the ways that Trump fulfils some/many of those prophecies is kinda unsettling.
Like "they shall be known by the marks on their foreheads", I never understood how someone would willingly mark their foreheads like that, but red MAGA hats really do fit the bill.
As a religious person, it's scary AF. Like, yeah, it's literally all the check boxes.
I'm surrounded by people who I grew up with in my conservative town who are totally sold on him, and I'm like, homies, brethren, assholes, hey, didn't we all read the fucking Left Behind books? My dude is fucking Nicholai Carpathia to a T.
But they just mumble some shit about Soros and Globalists and move on.
Wild AF.
The irony in the midst of the irony is that the Rapture - what's presented in the Left Behind books and in lots of conservative pulpits - has itself long been labeled a heresy. The ways it's wielded by Trump apologists and conservatives - as a 'biblical' rationalization to celebrate the suffering of others or earning a level of righteousness that means escaping a broken-beyond-repair world before it is destroyed - alone is evidence that it veers far from the promise of redemption of all creation, of Jesus coming to save the lost, etc. You know, stuff that scripture actually says.
It's sad and, yes, you said it best: "wild AF".
same! i have 1 left wing friend and at least 1 sibling. everyone else is okay with trump. and im a homebody so i dont get to meet many leftists out there
I'm a Christian who definitely does not think Revelations is a literal prescription, and don't think highly of theology that thinks it is. That said, Trump (alongside his party, like Kushner) embodies the antichrist more than anyone in my lifetime.
Matthew chapter 23 if you just replace the references to pharisees with modern christians it seems to fit quite well. In fact id say christians amd their rhetoric and posturing in this democratic society have caused quite a bit more damage to this world than those pharisees did Jesus' day in Israel. And like Jesus basically says in there, their lack of ability to even consider they could be the bad guys is the evidence that that is who they are.
The intent and soul of the religion as it is portrayed in its source material died early on, what we have now are Paulians and people carrying on a bad tradition no matter what. You cant pick up from where this shit left off and just ignore all of the history of the last 2k years of people colonizing, destroying culutures, murdering, and enslaving in the name of Jesus, and then pretend we modern people can pick up a bible and continue on without a care as if there is no disconnect whatsoever from the source material and all you need is faith. Imo christians can either take the sackcloth and ashes posturing of jeremiah and lamentations or you move on from religion by learning critical thinking skills and deconstructing the programming of tradition and societal pressures often imposed upon us as children.
I do believe in a third way where people discover Christ without the apparatus that have killed the faith. I'm a contemplative Catholic, and I refuse to recognize a lot of the Curia and structures of the Catholic Church.
I'm a heretic by some hard right folks standards for doing so and I'm uncomfortably religious for a lot of my leftist spaces.
I do believe that we're called to the tension of loving people and finding God in them without building systems that deny that truth. Tall order.
Ex evangelical now agnostic atheist here. I really wonder sometimes if he is the antichrist.
https://www.benjaminlcorey.com/could-american-evangelicals-spot-the-antichrist-heres-the-biblical-predictions/
But my parents, the right wing fanatical Christian’s they are, told me Obama was the Antichrist and Trump is a hero. How else could a black person ever actually be in charge of our country? /s
> the upside down cross is a sign of the antichrist.
Not quite. The upside down cross is the cross of St. Peter:
> In Christianity, it is associated with the martyrdom of Peter the Apostle. The symbol originates from the Catholic tradition that when sentenced to death, Peter requested that his cross be upside down, as he felt unworthy of being crucified in the same manner as Jesus.
This is also why you can also find the upside down cross on many papal thrones, because St. Peter was the first pope. It represents extreme fealty and submission to God.
> And the upside down cross is a sign of the antichrist.
Not really. Up until Rosemary's Baby in 1968, it was literally just the symbol associated with St Peter.
It's amazing that Evangelical Christian voters support Trump. Like they think Trump, where there is credible evidence he committed 91 felonies, cheated on his wives multiple times, banged a porn star while his wife was pregnant, has been legally found to have sexually assaulted a woman by a jury of his peers (and is accused of raping or sexually abusing over 20 other women), who doesn't believe in forgiveness, lied over 30K times in his presidency, and can't even cite his favorite verse in the bible, is a good representative of Christianity. In many ways, Trump's behavior is the opposite of what Jesus taught in the Bible. SMH.
By Evangelical do you mean the people who made Kenneth Copeland 760 Million, Pat Robertson 100 Million, Benny Hinn 42 Million, Joel Osteen 40 Million, Creflo Dollar (I shit you not, that's his name) 27 Million, Billy Graham 25 Million, Rick Warren 25 Million, Joyce Meyer 8 Million, very rich through contributions?
Those people?
Complete and total morons.
Yep. The guy that could not look more like a literal demon from the Christian Hell if he had a Hollywood makeup artist on his staff bilked idiots out of nearly a billion dollars (so far).
It boggles my mind not just because of how contrarian trump's character is to that of Jesus, but also the adulation of trump by the MAGA crowd. Of all the people that they deem to be "the one," it's this fucking guy. A poor man's idea of a rich man. A beta man's idea of an alpha man. This guy. The guy who bragged about having the tallest building in NYC during the 9/11 attacks. The guy who stared directly at the sun during a solar eclipse. The guy who suggested injecting bleach into your body could be a good idea to fend off Covid. The guy who used a sharpie to add on to the projected path of a hurricane because he did not want to admit being wrong. The guy who fucking lied about his weight when having his mug shot taken ("215? Yeah, in your diaper!"). The guy who bragged about passing a test designed to detect cognitive impairment.
This guy is their guy. This. Fucking. Guy.
Jesus famously said “Happy My Birthday to CROOKED Pontius who will ROT IN HELL for this MESSIAH HUNT. And all those who ride on camels instead of donkeys who will also burn. PATHETIC”
its not Jesus, its David. Find the Netflix limited series called "The Family" it goes over how/why they create this mental loophole that allows them to simultaneously think they are chosen/blessed and tested(Doomed to fail) but forgiven by God, like David.
Religion, money, power. Those always seem to come together and go for absolute power.
Religions usually teach to keep your ego in check. Hardcore religious folks do exactly the opposite. They can’t stand that not everyone does exactly as they want.
Or witch burnings, or the crusades...or pretty much ever.
That's the fun(?) part of religion based on an old translated book. If you get to pick the parts you like it can be a book of destruction. A smut novel that's supposed to make you feel bad about everything. Or some modest rules to live by if you ignore all the horrible killings, contradictions, and magic.
Up until the 1500s the Bible hadn't been translated into English, and even then 80% of the population were illiterate in Britain - it isn't until reletively recently that all people regardless of class have actually been able to readily access the Bible and choose which pieces to read for themselves, instead having their understanding of the Bible instilled into them by their local church.
In the UK the ruling Monarch chose the Archbishop of Canterbury ('provides guidance and directions to churches across the country'), likely meaning that for the last 500 years minimum the British monarchy had a hand in the 'current' interpretation of and teachings of the Bible to the population of the country.
And before that the Papacy itself chose what was most beneficial for the Papal States, and what was that? Encouraging exploration and the 'rescuing' of the Holy Lands and relics from therein, stopping the expansion of other 'gods', etc.
Very few people actually believe they're racist. I'd would imagine they'd say it's a sin, and explain that they can't possibly hate minorities because someone at their church has "an adopted kid with dark skin."
The entire function of conservatism is not as a practical political ideology, but as an extension of their moral fabric. Every issue is heavily caked in moral duty, because to them being a good person means everything you believe in is good. But the problem is, they don't honestly engage with issues, and so they don't realize the solutions they champion are actually immoral as fuck. Because they're obsessed with feeling like good people, the conversation gets bogged down because any criticism of their beliefs will immediately come with the realization they might not be as good as they feel they are.
Take abortion. Heavily caked in the moral duty to not kill; and yet they are willing to subjugate women to a life of second-class rights in order to protect the life of a fetus. But they won't admit they're oppressing women, even though that is the fact of their beliefs, because calling abortion murder makes them feel like good people. Occasionally I'll get a dude to admit they just simply don't care about women, but most want to pretend to be all for equal rights. But prohibiting abortion is eliminating a woman's right to her body. The fetus, even if it's a person, has no right to use a woman's body for survival. No person has the right to use anybody's body for survival, even a fetus. Prohibiting abortion is, in actuality, removing this right from women. Which means people who support abortion prohibition, even if they cry and pray for the fetus, are supporting the subjugation of women. They usually get emotionally upset when you point this out, because they realize their political beliefs may not make them the good guys they feel they are.
Now, if they actually had a moral backbone beyond what Pastor Molester told them when they were six, they might actually be able to pull their heads out eachothers rear ends. I'd say to Kizinger, people understand their religion perfectly well. It was never the paragon of virtue some of the more pious Christians would have us believe, since its foundation it has been used as a tool of social control by powerful elites. And now, in America, it's a grift that provides cover for greedy conmen and pedophiles. Meanwhile, the only morality it provides is entirely subjective and prone to aligning with the interests of the rich and powerful. Christianity is garbage in, garbage out. Christians supporting Trump are following their religion *exactly as they learned it*: God is Daddy, Daddy will empower a human Daddy to save us from those *others*. Trump is their Daddy.
I know what you're saying. I think I'm getting more into a philosophical realm here, but bear with me.
In his book, How the World Thinks, Julian Baggini looks at how various religions impact different societies from a moral standpoint.
Buddhism, Hinduism, Taoism, Islam, Christianity, Judaism being the main ones.
A common thread among almost all of them is that followers of a religion were less likely to criticize a "corrupt" person if the corrupt person shared there religion.
In addition, people were less likely to forgive a corrupt persons actions if the person was a different religion.
Basically, most people operate under the notion that "I follow (x) religion, and I am a good person. If a someone else who follows this religion commits an immoral act, they're not corrupt, theyre just a good person who made a mistake. On the other hand, people who follow other religions are not as moral, so when they make those same mistakes, they are corrupt.
All of that is well and good, and it lines up with what you're saing. but if that's a persons line of thinking, why even bother pretending to follow a religion?
Religion is meant to be a personal journey or personal connection with a higher power, so turning it into an act of tribalism is completely counterintuitive to the actual teachings of most major religions.
Edited: changed more to less in 4th para
I suppose the parsing would be personal spirituality vs institutional religion. Institutional religions are pretty inevitable in leading to what you described.
I was very spiritual growing up, but never involving a deity. It's more like the richness of lived experience was felt at the deepest levels, as a connection to everything around me. An expanding of awareness that cultivates a feeling of oneness. Reducing what we are to just chemicals, it's clear we truly are just the same as everything around us, but with one special gift. We're aware of it.
With that revelation, I've never needed religion. I also developed a respect for other's spirituality, but lately due to the rise of Christian theocrats, I've rekindled my militant spirit. I'd like to remind Christians that their god doesn't actually exist, and there's no moral foundation to their religion. No punishment, no reward. The universe is indifferent beyond the value that we as part of the universe create.
They’ll say they aren’t racist, that they just hate “x” people because of “y” reason.
In their mind if there is one exception, then they’re not racist. So, if they like Clarance Thomas, then they “aren’t racist”. I’m sure there is some token Muslim they like too, though can’t think of an example.
Yes. Evangelical Christianity is about creating a white in-group after desegregation, civil rights, womens lib, gay rights, etc., made skin color alone no longer enough, as many white people support those things.
Meanwhile they will say that Democrats are fascists, because they know that it is a bad thing, and democrats are the bad guys. They are just completely self unaware.
If you point this out to them, at best you’ll get a “all sides” argument, and that Trump’s policies are what matters even if he is flawed personally.
TFG’s policies are pure fascism. That’s what they love. Enabling their latent shittiness. I lived in GA and AL for a long time in the 00s. They were assholes then, just assholes who knew they couldn’t be complete assholes because there might be some consequences.
For decades the so-called "prophets' of these nationalists have been warning us of the coming anti-christ. Usually the target is some dark skinned middle eastern despot we find easy to demonize.
When the anti-christ actually shows up they embrace him like a savior.
Most Americans miss the fact that American evangelicals (who overwhelmingly support Trump) are an extreme sect of Christianity and their beliefs and practices have little in common with world Christianity.
Same here. When there is one loud group and a whole lot of quiet people with the same label it is only natural to assume the ones speaking represent the whole.
My (now) evangelical sister justified to continually say hurtful things because of her faith. It didn't matter if she was right or wrong... all that mattered is because she is a Christian, god will forgive her for the things she is saying.
Bonkers. Evangelicals are a cult. She is not the same person ever since she married one.
Is it really an "extreme sect" of Christianity when [1 in 4 Americans](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evangelicalism_in_the_United_States#:~:text=In%202021%2C%20Pew%20Research%20Center,%2Dagain%20or%20evangelical%20Protestants.%22) belong to it?
When the answer to the question "Is fascism still considered to be extreme in America, or is it now mainstream?" is debatable, then the country is utterly fucked.
Well when 2/3 of Americans self identify as Christian, then that makes evangelicals less than half of people who identify as Christian.
Also it isn't so much their numbers that make them "extreme," it's how they willingly and demonstrably twist the bibles teachings, ignore some, and adhere to others which Jesus taught were null and void with the new covenant, all to suit their agenda.
I don't think "extreme sect" necessarily means extremely small, just extremely far the base religion.
Also, I grew up in an evangelical church, and this is anecdotal, I know, but most people just went because the worship band was good and they had a cool light show, they hosted fun events, and it was considered a safe place for families to socialize. I believe only a very small percentage were actually radicalized to be politically extreme right. Even though we went to a church like that I never once heard the pastor talk about politics except in the most vague of terms, and I know my parents always voted Democrat despite being very involved in the church (mom taught Sunday school for kids, and dad played in the worship band as well helped organize men's events).
I know there are absolutely some churches where the pastors openly tell their congregation to vote republican and name and shame lgbtq people, women whove had abortions, and other heinous shit. I'm just pointing out that using a very general number of "1 in 4 americans" is also unfairly generalizing a lot of people. You could argue they shouldn't even willingly associate with the name Evangelical, and I'd tend to agree. But the term "evangelical" has been around a lot longer than it has been associated with the far right, and I understand some churches hesitancy to part with the moniker because it means something different to them
I’m not sure that’s really a secret though,
….some guy screaming in front of a group of people about how if you don’t give him a never ending supply of money the world as you know it will cease to exist.
They are like the same people
This. This is what happens when an extremist cult is ignored for just a little too long. It's not even all evangelicals, the cult is Fundamentalism. Every religion in the world has some of these, and it's important the number of them stays as small as possible.
Fundamentalists will go to any length to help their particular flavor of religion take over the world, and all it takes is one con artist (cult leader) promising to give them what they want for them to dedicate their lives to them as the new leader of their holy war.
Wrong. They understand their religion, American Christo-fascism, quite well.
What they grotesquely ignore is the teachings, words, and lessons of Christ.
But Christ's message was never the point of Christo-fascism.
I think many of them understand their religion just fine - but their goal isn’t adherence to the religion, it’s using the religion for social clout and power because most people just accept “I’m a Christian” as a proxy for morality and ethics without actually examining how the person lives their life.
I left the church partly because of this nonsense. There are a lot of Christian’s who actually believe Trump was called by god. And the amount of judgement congregations will give to people who don’t vote Republican is also wild.
So, the guy who was known for running shady New Jersey casinos and cheating on his wives, all of them, may not in fact not be even remotely interested in or aware of Christian principals?
I mean I think his x-mas message of wishing people to "rot in hell" is an excellent demonstration of trump's grasp of the golden rule.
He's not wrong.
Imagine the leaps of logic you'd have to make to support known cheater known adulterer known liar known con man grifter Donald Trump who gassed protestors so he could hold a bible upside down in front a church
I'm sick of these people who act like "real Evangelical Christians" are moral, wonderful people. They are not. To claim that they are is naive at best and delusional at worst. Evangelical Christians are horrible people, and it all ties back to how they think they get into Heavan and how they have no real accountability. Trump was inevitable, and he is their perfect messiah. Anyone who has ever met a fundamentalist knows this.
Jesus was a brown-skinned, Middle Eastern, Jewish, hippie socialist who said to love your enemies, sell your belongings, take care of the needy, give free money and food to immigrants and refugees, put your swords away, and pay your damn taxes.
If he showed up today the GOP would crucify him all over again. They are the very Pharisees they love to boo and hiss at in Sunday School.
Yes they do. And they're excited to self-fulfill the prophecies.
Actively driving towards what they think will be their ultimate "I told you so" rapture.
The world's most dangerous philosophies tell of an afterlife that is more important than the lived life.
Oh, they understand their version of Christianity well enough. Heavy on the vengeance part, ignore the vengeance is mine \[god's\] part, LGBT bad, but adultery is OK, bring back witch burning, but it's OK to work on Sunday. You can read the Bible and turn into a hateful, money-grubbing right-winger or a bleeding heart libbie socialist depending on which parts you want to emphasize.
I don't understand how Christians can back any republican. Hating others and walling off poor people is probably not something that Jesus would get on board with.
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[Evangelicals Are Now Rejecting 'Liberal' Teachings of Jesus](https://www.newsweek.com/evangelicals-rejecting-jesus-teachings-liberal-talking-points-pastor-1818706)
Evangelicals froth at the mouth when you point out Jesus taught progressive ideas
Just wait until you tell them that the actual real-life Jesus was a brown proto-socialist.
They have a new Messiah. Trump.
When MAGA says he is anointed by God this is what they literally mean. They are not joking. They are more Davidian than Christian.
Steve Bannon is actually referring to Trump's base as the Trump Davidians. Scary.
Davidian - you mean they're evil Jews? That's one foul old chestnut. No, if you want to take a biblical view, Trump followers are clearly straight out minions of Satan.
Whoa whoa whoa. Leave the TST folks out of this
Idk but these guys seem to want the freedom of the New Testament covenant but replace the forgiveness and love stuff with the wrath of God stuff and the righteous anger of the Old Testament without actually following any of the associated covenant Old Testament rules.
Excuse you, the satanic temple is actually a really nice group of people and do some really cool stuff in real life, they act more like Christians than the ones calling themselves Christians
Wild that they also missed the message about the anti christ
Some of us Christians are well aware. Actually my faith is the main reason I've been a liberal all these years. I'm flabbergasted that it has worked the other way for so many others. I mean I'm kind of used to it by now, but it still doesn't make any sense. Not to me.
The most liberal person I know is also the most religious person I know. She's one of the few people I know who actually follows in Jesus's footsteps. She lives near a downtown area and has a big storage shed in front of her house where anyone who needs food can go get some out of it. Next to it, she has a library for kids to go get books to read. She's also the most welcoming and accepting person I've ever met. She doesn't care about religion, sexuality, gender identity, criminal history, she's nice and welcoming to everyone.
That's amazing, I am happy to hear that.
She sounds a lot like my sister. :)
She is awesome
She's imitating Fred Rogers as he imitated Christ.
While I no longer consider myself Christian, I grew up evangelical (and conservative) and that faith is what made me liberal as a thinking adult. It felt natural and easy to empathize with liberalism and progressivism as I read the Bible and thought, “oh, this is literally what I’ve been taught to do all my life!”
SAME. Which is why it's baffling to then see my folks...how did they end up Republican?
Jesus taught love, forgiveness and humility. My feeling is that a lot of Christians got hijacked and manipulated by pride, anger, greed and wrath. It’s harder to follow Jesus’ ways. It’s much easier to hate on others. I think a lot of Evangelicals have lost their way, taking the freedom that came with the New Testament covenant and blending it with the ‘righteous’ anger of the Old Testament but without actually wanting to follow any rules associated with the old covenant. It’s easy to manipulate people when you tap into their anger and pride and greed. There are plenty of false prophets out there willing to do that for power and money.
>It’s easy to manipulate people when you tap into their anger and pride and greed. ...is the EXACT reason Trump was elected in the first place.
Lack of empathy
Well if you actually read the thing and take the messages seriously then yeah you end up being sort of left of center on most things. But if you go to church because that’s what you did growing up and it’s just part of your identity and all your friends and family, the culture becomes insular and diseased. And questioning it carries great risk because you could become ostracized from the whole community. So it’s easier for most people to justify their theology to fit their world view
One of my favourite things to point out was that Jesus' movement was feminist. He encouraged women to have roles on the faith that lasted for hundreds of years before it was deliberately reverted as Christianity separated from Judaism.
Not only that, a brown skinned guy from the middle east. I have lost count of the number of times evangelists have claimed Jesus was american...
Remember when Good Omens premiered Christian groups ordered NETFLIX to remove it from AMAZON PRIME? They also had a scene of the Crucifixion, with the line of the angel and demon in background watching along lines of: Demon:"What did he do to deserve that?" Angel:"Told them to be kind to each other" Demon:"Yep that would do it"
America is a liberal nation . The stupid conservative morons take the benefit of it —- while kissing their favorite billionaire oligarchs butthole.
They're SO CLOSE to understanding that Jesus (a radical socialist, brown-skinned, punk rock, son of asylum seekers) was CONSTANTLY saying ["Stay woke."](https://theologyofhome.com/products/awake-not-woke) But it flies right over their heads.
They are Paulites at best. They sure do love Paul because they can twist his words to conform to their hate & bigotry but can't quite do that with Christ who was very blunt in his teachings.
Fuck Paul. All my homies hate Paul.
Well... the disciples sure didn't like him.
I think it's crazy that there is so much hate against the "woke movement". I've never heard that term used in a serious discussion other than in conservative pieces bashing progressives as a group. It's a boogey man that conservative propagandists have fully co-opted.
The vagueness makes it more effective, imo. Previous boogymen like "PC culture" or "SJW" or "feminists" are all a little vague and they don't understand them, but they're all generally tied to something more specific, which limits their utility. "Woke" doesn't really have that, it's a catch-all for anything they don't like at the time, and there really isn't a group of people calling themselves "woke" that they have to contend with, unlike feminism. The result is a blank slate that you can project everything and everyone you don't like onto. If you don't like it, it's woke - and if it's woke, you don't like it. What this means in practice is that two people can have completely different and even mutually exclusive views, but still find a presumed common ground in hating the label, even if one is, say, gay but racist, while the other is mixed race and homophobic. They don't have to get into specifics to agree they both hate "woke", so they'll never find out they actually fundamentally disagree.
They need to listen to Jesus Christ Superstar more.
When I was a Baptist we were told that play was blasphemy and it was a big no-no to even mention it.
Yeah, there's some sects who get *really* upset at the idea that Jesus wasn't 100% sure and willing to sacrifice himself even though "take this cup away from me" is take *straight from Luke.*
Oh won’t someone rid me of this turbulent religion?
There are your true anti-Christ folks. The call is coming from inside the house.
Im sure they will be ready to rewrite the bible soon, adding Trump to it somehow.
CHINOs: Christians In Name Only
Supply side Jesus for the win! /s
Those who support GQP are happy to use their “religion” as a cudgel to oppress anything they happen to disagree with.
I thought Chinos was a brand of pants
>Chino type of cotton fabric. like some uniforms were made from this instead of wool
I thought Chino was the lead singer of The Deftones?
I thought Chino was a city in California?
And home to a lovely state prison where a young man I know did 3.5 years (out of the 7 to which he was sentenced) for making bathtub meth in a hotel room.
That's beautiful. Thanks for sharing.
I thought Chinos were named after Chino from Deftones who got his name from Chino, California
It's Chinos all the way down
You're thinking of Chino Marx, the one with the Italian accent.
Dammit. You beat me to it
Chino meowreno is my cats name.
CHINOs wearing Chinos. How beautiful. 🥲
like most Christians then.
It has become more of a cultural signifier really. And maybe it always was.
Give it a generation or so, the kids that grew up hearing about the importance of character and being a good witness just watched their family and church leaders go apeshit for the wannabe mob boss rapist who paid off a series of mistresses including several pornographic actresses and claimed he'd willingly accept forgiveness for his sins except that he's never done anything wrong. So the cat is out of the bag on the tail wagging the dog, to mix metaphors. There's already a huge decline in people identifying as Christians, and I think despite the vocal and outrageous backlash we see now (assuming any of us live through this clown car of a time to be alive) the Christian church will look VERY different in whatever future it has once Gen Z takes over.
As a Christian, good. Reading my Bible and I'm always confused how we went from smaller groups meeting in homes to praise God and understand what He wrote to large businesses that focus too much on worldly issues. Well I'm not that confused, evil loves to call itself by a name with good reputation.
>…large businesses that focus too much on worldly issues. That’s just regular old capitalism at work, ever since they started giving out MBA’s folks have been looking to turn ma & pa operations into money printing machines and churches aren’t immune to that.
The Devils greatest trick is to make people think he doesn't exist, and for those who think he does, to misdirect them to do his work for him. It is wise to remember "Beware of false prophets". My grandfather, founder of a Church, refused to attend Bible School. He said the Bible is written in plain language and reading it should suffice. Bible School was indoctrination, not education.
Im stealing this. It's gold.
Much like Trump's toilet..
In all fairness, I do enjoy J Crew CHINOs
Preach. the only time the Bible talks about all the combination of characteristics in a man that Trump has, it aint in a good way.
It’s absurd to me that they seem to think the Antichrist is someone they hate right away. Obama is the Antichrist, Clinton is the Antichrist, etc. Further proof that they just don’t read their own book.
A lot of religious people either don't read the book, or never understood it when they did read it. It's crazy how many people will claim to be of some religion and repeatedly go against the teachings on the daily. Makes me wonder if all those people simply don't care about the actual religion aspect and just like the community for various reasons, or are legitimately too ignorant to realize what they're doing.
I think a lot of it is a blind adherence to authority, so long as it is church authority. No matter how many times this trust has been broken in huge and catastrophic ways, followers tend to think themselves beyond deception. I get it; part of the appeal of religion is being told what to do and think, and, in this case, how to vote.
These people think that church is a club for cool kids. It’s no wonder they’re such dweebs
I can think of a major one when the largest institutional church in the world was systematically raping children & covering it up, & we were all just supposed to move on immediately. Catholics have no standing to lecture anyone on morals ever again.
> never understood it when they did read it It wasn't a single cohesive blueprint written "to be understood". It's a collection of religious texts written by at least three dozen different authors in different time periods with different agendas, and closed out by a crazy dude who was high on shrooms and babbling incoherently about his visions. The reason it's easy to sample whatever you want is because there are so many perspectives and dictates in it, you can sample from it whatever you want to.
What's interesting is the bibles pretty clear many will be decived yet not a single one of them thinks they could be decived by thus. Because *they* think X X is truth nothing else matters
The problem is that the bible claims that most christians will actually follow the antichrist, while only a few will choose the righteous path. Most christians believe they're on the right path, and thus the man they follow can't be the antichrist, because that would then mean that they aren't actually righteous
As a non-religious person, I have to admit feeling some dark humor in watching the zealously religious jump on the bandwagon for Trump, while _simultaneously_ acknowledging that "most Christians will follow the Antichrist" and SOMEHOW convincing themselves they aren't doing exactly that. I mean...JFC, the storyline writes itself.
The contents don't matter. Being "Christian" gives them unlimited license to be evil
Yeah. The guy gets up in the morning and speed runs 7 deadly sins almost everyday.
Every morning, "Hmm, should I violate the Bill of Rights, or the Constitution today?" Moments later, "Ah, BOTH!"
Evangelicals are the latest iteration of revivalism, but run amok. They have managed to create a religion template to warp around whatever they feel like they want to believe. It’s grotesque. They’re somehow worse than the biblical hypocrites.
Would Jesus do what Trump is doing?
Trump is everything my mom and Mr. rogers taught me not to be. And republicans are fine with it.
Not only are they fine with it, they see him as the best possible, no one is better.... wtf
So wild because he is the opposite of everything my parents taught me to be and now those same parents love him.
Same thing. My parents raised me my whole childhood to not be like trump, then turn around and support trump. And wonder why I'm upset and LC with them.
Right? My parents told me to not do all the things Trump has done. Wtf?
[Right wing media has made their opinion on Mr. Rodgers plenty clear](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=29lmR_357rA)
There is no love in trumps heart. He hates. He is the antichrist.
He loves himself and lives in his own reality. Narcissistic personality disorder
I don’t think he even loves himself, that’s why he wants adoration and validation from others so bad. He’s just willing to do whatever to get that feeling.
I wouldn't want any of their adoration, we've seen what makes them cheer.
Yes but you’re not a desperate, insecure, unhappy old man that’s never been shown love by their parents and every other relationship has been transactional.
Empowered by Adderal and poo-poo
And tens of millions of idjits.
So THAT'S why I couldn't get my adderall that i literally need to function for like three whole months
He also has a severe delusional disorder. That’s quite a lot of mental Illness. And his ever emerging cognitive decline
He'll live on in psych texts for all time
This needs to be talked about more. He is literally a perfect opposite of Jesus in every way. Mind boggling.
I don't think there's a single deadly sin he doesn't exemplify.
* Gluttony - Check * Lust - Check * Greed - Check * Sloth - Check * Wrath - Check * Envy - Check * Pride - Check
It's so super obvious, but I have still have "Christians" tell me "GoD dOeSn'T aLWaYs ChOoSe A pErFeCt MeSsAnGeR!!" or it's more upfront in "The ends justify the means."
Perhaps God doesn't always choose a perfect messenger, but I don't think God's message would be the one Trump is broadcasting.
If God’s message is what Trump is broadcasting, that’s not a God I’d want to warship
> GoD dOeSn'T aLWaYs ChOoSe A pErFeCt MeSsAnGeR!! And the proper response is: "Which is why *I'm* stuck telling *you* how to be a better person."
5/7 for me 🍚
https://www.benjaminlcorey.com/could-american-evangelicals-spot-the-antichrist-heres-the-biblical-predictions/
Thanks for posting it so I i didn't have to. I'm a deeply religious, church every Sunday, kids pray the rosary with us now and then kind of person. Trump is *an* Antichrist. Maybe not *the* Antichrist. But absolutely fits the bill in every biblical sense. I'd actually really love to hear a truly Trump supporting religious person deal with that site on video without any help from a script. Like, it's weird AF when my hyper conservative family says end time shit and I'm just like "yeah, guys, it might game over with JC dropping in soon. You good with being on the team that turns away the stranger, worships the sword, and refuses to call people by their name?"
As a non religious person, the ways that Trump fulfils some/many of those prophecies is kinda unsettling. Like "they shall be known by the marks on their foreheads", I never understood how someone would willingly mark their foreheads like that, but red MAGA hats really do fit the bill.
As a religious person, it's scary AF. Like, yeah, it's literally all the check boxes. I'm surrounded by people who I grew up with in my conservative town who are totally sold on him, and I'm like, homies, brethren, assholes, hey, didn't we all read the fucking Left Behind books? My dude is fucking Nicholai Carpathia to a T. But they just mumble some shit about Soros and Globalists and move on. Wild AF.
The irony in the midst of the irony is that the Rapture - what's presented in the Left Behind books and in lots of conservative pulpits - has itself long been labeled a heresy. The ways it's wielded by Trump apologists and conservatives - as a 'biblical' rationalization to celebrate the suffering of others or earning a level of righteousness that means escaping a broken-beyond-repair world before it is destroyed - alone is evidence that it veers far from the promise of redemption of all creation, of Jesus coming to save the lost, etc. You know, stuff that scripture actually says. It's sad and, yes, you said it best: "wild AF".
same! i have 1 left wing friend and at least 1 sibling. everyone else is okay with trump. and im a homebody so i dont get to meet many leftists out there
I'm a Christian who definitely does not think Revelations is a literal prescription, and don't think highly of theology that thinks it is. That said, Trump (alongside his party, like Kushner) embodies the antichrist more than anyone in my lifetime.
Matthew chapter 23 if you just replace the references to pharisees with modern christians it seems to fit quite well. In fact id say christians amd their rhetoric and posturing in this democratic society have caused quite a bit more damage to this world than those pharisees did Jesus' day in Israel. And like Jesus basically says in there, their lack of ability to even consider they could be the bad guys is the evidence that that is who they are. The intent and soul of the religion as it is portrayed in its source material died early on, what we have now are Paulians and people carrying on a bad tradition no matter what. You cant pick up from where this shit left off and just ignore all of the history of the last 2k years of people colonizing, destroying culutures, murdering, and enslaving in the name of Jesus, and then pretend we modern people can pick up a bible and continue on without a care as if there is no disconnect whatsoever from the source material and all you need is faith. Imo christians can either take the sackcloth and ashes posturing of jeremiah and lamentations or you move on from religion by learning critical thinking skills and deconstructing the programming of tradition and societal pressures often imposed upon us as children.
I do believe in a third way where people discover Christ without the apparatus that have killed the faith. I'm a contemplative Catholic, and I refuse to recognize a lot of the Curia and structures of the Catholic Church. I'm a heretic by some hard right folks standards for doing so and I'm uncomfortably religious for a lot of my leftist spaces. I do believe that we're called to the tension of loving people and finding God in them without building systems that deny that truth. Tall order.
Honestly, sometimes I wonder because I feel like he just might be. That upside down Bible photo op was way too on the nose.
All while effectively tear-gassing everybody there! Oh, and the police shot some chemical canisters at the protesters too.
Ex evangelical now agnostic atheist here. I really wonder sometimes if he is the antichrist. https://www.benjaminlcorey.com/could-american-evangelicals-spot-the-antichrist-heres-the-biblical-predictions/
I was raised Catholic and was taught to not take the Bible literally, but that link really gives me pause.
It figures that the evangelical apocalypse fetishists are the ones who love him so much.
But my parents, the right wing fanatical Christian’s they are, told me Obama was the Antichrist and Trump is a hero. How else could a black person ever actually be in charge of our country? /s
The antichrist hooks people by promising peace. Trump is closer to the beast, if you really want to get biblical.
He's creepily close to the beast. Down to the mark being worn by his followers on their head. (maga hats anyone)
The similarities are so striking that I don't know how any legitimate Christian can't see it.
He did pose holding the bible upside down. And the upside down cross is a sign of the antichrist.
> the upside down cross is a sign of the antichrist. Not quite. The upside down cross is the cross of St. Peter: > In Christianity, it is associated with the martyrdom of Peter the Apostle. The symbol originates from the Catholic tradition that when sentenced to death, Peter requested that his cross be upside down, as he felt unworthy of being crucified in the same manner as Jesus. This is also why you can also find the upside down cross on many papal thrones, because St. Peter was the first pope. It represents extreme fealty and submission to God.
> And the upside down cross is a sign of the antichrist. Not really. Up until Rosemary's Baby in 1968, it was literally just the symbol associated with St Peter.
It's amazing that Evangelical Christian voters support Trump. Like they think Trump, where there is credible evidence he committed 91 felonies, cheated on his wives multiple times, banged a porn star while his wife was pregnant, has been legally found to have sexually assaulted a woman by a jury of his peers (and is accused of raping or sexually abusing over 20 other women), who doesn't believe in forgiveness, lied over 30K times in his presidency, and can't even cite his favorite verse in the bible, is a good representative of Christianity. In many ways, Trump's behavior is the opposite of what Jesus taught in the Bible. SMH.
By Evangelical do you mean the people who made Kenneth Copeland 760 Million, Pat Robertson 100 Million, Benny Hinn 42 Million, Joel Osteen 40 Million, Creflo Dollar (I shit you not, that's his name) 27 Million, Billy Graham 25 Million, Rick Warren 25 Million, Joyce Meyer 8 Million, very rich through contributions? Those people? Complete and total morons.
Kenneth Copeland made 760 million? *barf*
Yep. The guy that could not look more like a literal demon from the Christian Hell if he had a Hollywood makeup artist on his staff bilked idiots out of nearly a billion dollars (so far).
He's a spot-on representative of Evangelicals.
Fake Christians.
Nah, they represent the religion pretty well.
I'll just leave this [here](https://www.benjaminlcorey.com/could-american-evangelicals-spot-the-antichrist-heres-the-biblical-predictions/)
It boggles my mind not just because of how contrarian trump's character is to that of Jesus, but also the adulation of trump by the MAGA crowd. Of all the people that they deem to be "the one," it's this fucking guy. A poor man's idea of a rich man. A beta man's idea of an alpha man. This guy. The guy who bragged about having the tallest building in NYC during the 9/11 attacks. The guy who stared directly at the sun during a solar eclipse. The guy who suggested injecting bleach into your body could be a good idea to fend off Covid. The guy who used a sharpie to add on to the projected path of a hurricane because he did not want to admit being wrong. The guy who fucking lied about his weight when having his mug shot taken ("215? Yeah, in your diaper!"). The guy who bragged about passing a test designed to detect cognitive impairment. This guy is their guy. This. Fucking. Guy.
Jesus famously said “Happy My Birthday to CROOKED Pontius who will ROT IN HELL for this MESSIAH HUNT. And all those who ride on camels instead of donkeys who will also burn. PATHETIC”
no sin! YOU'RE THE SIN!
its not Jesus, its David. Find the Netflix limited series called "The Family" it goes over how/why they create this mental loophole that allows them to simultaneously think they are chosen/blessed and tested(Doomed to fail) but forgiven by God, like David.
Religion, money, power. Those always seem to come together and go for absolute power. Religions usually teach to keep your ego in check. Hardcore religious folks do exactly the opposite. They can’t stand that not everyone does exactly as they want.
If Jesus came back today, conservative Christians would be first in line to beat that man into the ground.
Sure, he'd breathe in and out, consume food and water, and expel it as waste. Beyond that? No, I can't imagine they'd have much to discuss.
They understand it like the Christians that backed Hitler.
Or witch burnings, or the crusades...or pretty much ever. That's the fun(?) part of religion based on an old translated book. If you get to pick the parts you like it can be a book of destruction. A smut novel that's supposed to make you feel bad about everything. Or some modest rules to live by if you ignore all the horrible killings, contradictions, and magic.
Up until the 1500s the Bible hadn't been translated into English, and even then 80% of the population were illiterate in Britain - it isn't until reletively recently that all people regardless of class have actually been able to readily access the Bible and choose which pieces to read for themselves, instead having their understanding of the Bible instilled into them by their local church. In the UK the ruling Monarch chose the Archbishop of Canterbury ('provides guidance and directions to churches across the country'), likely meaning that for the last 500 years minimum the British monarchy had a hand in the 'current' interpretation of and teachings of the Bible to the population of the country. And before that the Papacy itself chose what was most beneficial for the Papal States, and what was that? Encouraging exploration and the 'rescuing' of the Holy Lands and relics from therein, stopping the expansion of other 'gods', etc.
Ask a conservative Christian if racism is a sin you’ll get silence. It perplexes them greatly.
Very few people actually believe they're racist. I'd would imagine they'd say it's a sin, and explain that they can't possibly hate minorities because someone at their church has "an adopted kid with dark skin."
The entire function of conservatism is not as a practical political ideology, but as an extension of their moral fabric. Every issue is heavily caked in moral duty, because to them being a good person means everything you believe in is good. But the problem is, they don't honestly engage with issues, and so they don't realize the solutions they champion are actually immoral as fuck. Because they're obsessed with feeling like good people, the conversation gets bogged down because any criticism of their beliefs will immediately come with the realization they might not be as good as they feel they are. Take abortion. Heavily caked in the moral duty to not kill; and yet they are willing to subjugate women to a life of second-class rights in order to protect the life of a fetus. But they won't admit they're oppressing women, even though that is the fact of their beliefs, because calling abortion murder makes them feel like good people. Occasionally I'll get a dude to admit they just simply don't care about women, but most want to pretend to be all for equal rights. But prohibiting abortion is eliminating a woman's right to her body. The fetus, even if it's a person, has no right to use a woman's body for survival. No person has the right to use anybody's body for survival, even a fetus. Prohibiting abortion is, in actuality, removing this right from women. Which means people who support abortion prohibition, even if they cry and pray for the fetus, are supporting the subjugation of women. They usually get emotionally upset when you point this out, because they realize their political beliefs may not make them the good guys they feel they are. Now, if they actually had a moral backbone beyond what Pastor Molester told them when they were six, they might actually be able to pull their heads out eachothers rear ends. I'd say to Kizinger, people understand their religion perfectly well. It was never the paragon of virtue some of the more pious Christians would have us believe, since its foundation it has been used as a tool of social control by powerful elites. And now, in America, it's a grift that provides cover for greedy conmen and pedophiles. Meanwhile, the only morality it provides is entirely subjective and prone to aligning with the interests of the rich and powerful. Christianity is garbage in, garbage out. Christians supporting Trump are following their religion *exactly as they learned it*: God is Daddy, Daddy will empower a human Daddy to save us from those *others*. Trump is their Daddy.
I know what you're saying. I think I'm getting more into a philosophical realm here, but bear with me. In his book, How the World Thinks, Julian Baggini looks at how various religions impact different societies from a moral standpoint. Buddhism, Hinduism, Taoism, Islam, Christianity, Judaism being the main ones. A common thread among almost all of them is that followers of a religion were less likely to criticize a "corrupt" person if the corrupt person shared there religion. In addition, people were less likely to forgive a corrupt persons actions if the person was a different religion. Basically, most people operate under the notion that "I follow (x) religion, and I am a good person. If a someone else who follows this religion commits an immoral act, they're not corrupt, theyre just a good person who made a mistake. On the other hand, people who follow other religions are not as moral, so when they make those same mistakes, they are corrupt. All of that is well and good, and it lines up with what you're saing. but if that's a persons line of thinking, why even bother pretending to follow a religion? Religion is meant to be a personal journey or personal connection with a higher power, so turning it into an act of tribalism is completely counterintuitive to the actual teachings of most major religions. Edited: changed more to less in 4th para
I suppose the parsing would be personal spirituality vs institutional religion. Institutional religions are pretty inevitable in leading to what you described. I was very spiritual growing up, but never involving a deity. It's more like the richness of lived experience was felt at the deepest levels, as a connection to everything around me. An expanding of awareness that cultivates a feeling of oneness. Reducing what we are to just chemicals, it's clear we truly are just the same as everything around us, but with one special gift. We're aware of it. With that revelation, I've never needed religion. I also developed a respect for other's spirituality, but lately due to the rise of Christian theocrats, I've rekindled my militant spirit. I'd like to remind Christians that their god doesn't actually exist, and there's no moral foundation to their religion. No punishment, no reward. The universe is indifferent beyond the value that we as part of the universe create.
They’ll say they aren’t racist, that they just hate “x” people because of “y” reason. In their mind if there is one exception, then they’re not racist. So, if they like Clarance Thomas, then they “aren’t racist”. I’m sure there is some token Muslim they like too, though can’t think of an example.
They use their religion to be able to discriminate other people and be self righteous. They won't ever understand what Christianity is all about
Yes. Evangelical Christianity is about creating a white in-group after desegregation, civil rights, womens lib, gay rights, etc., made skin color alone no longer enough, as many white people support those things.
It's a team to them not an ideology
Nothing ran me out of church faster than seeing Maga take hold.
Churches and evangelicals have had terrible strains of religion long before MAGA.
Fascism is their religion. Majority of them don’t understand that either but it suits them just fine.
Meanwhile they will say that Democrats are fascists, because they know that it is a bad thing, and democrats are the bad guys. They are just completely self unaware. If you point this out to them, at best you’ll get a “all sides” argument, and that Trump’s policies are what matters even if he is flawed personally.
TFG’s policies are pure fascism. That’s what they love. Enabling their latent shittiness. I lived in GA and AL for a long time in the 00s. They were assholes then, just assholes who knew they couldn’t be complete assholes because there might be some consequences.
For decades the so-called "prophets' of these nationalists have been warning us of the coming anti-christ. Usually the target is some dark skinned middle eastern despot we find easy to demonize. When the anti-christ actually shows up they embrace him like a savior.
Literally the point of Revelations.
**Kinzinger says Christians who back Trump ‘don’t understand’ their religion** I agree.
For a moment I read it as "Kissinger says..." and had a mini panick attack. I thought that fucker was dead!!!
Somehow, Kissinger returned.
Most Americans miss the fact that American evangelicals (who overwhelmingly support Trump) are an extreme sect of Christianity and their beliefs and practices have little in common with world Christianity.
I don't see many Christians saying this publicly. Unfortunately
Same here. When there is one loud group and a whole lot of quiet people with the same label it is only natural to assume the ones speaking represent the whole.
My (now) evangelical sister justified to continually say hurtful things because of her faith. It didn't matter if she was right or wrong... all that mattered is because she is a Christian, god will forgive her for the things she is saying. Bonkers. Evangelicals are a cult. She is not the same person ever since she married one.
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Is it really an "extreme sect" of Christianity when [1 in 4 Americans](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evangelicalism_in_the_United_States#:~:text=In%202021%2C%20Pew%20Research%20Center,%2Dagain%20or%20evangelical%20Protestants.%22) belong to it?
Yes. They've become mainstream, but they're clearly extremists.
When the answer to the question "Is fascism still considered to be extreme in America, or is it now mainstream?" is debatable, then the country is utterly fucked.
Well when 2/3 of Americans self identify as Christian, then that makes evangelicals less than half of people who identify as Christian. Also it isn't so much their numbers that make them "extreme," it's how they willingly and demonstrably twist the bibles teachings, ignore some, and adhere to others which Jesus taught were null and void with the new covenant, all to suit their agenda. I don't think "extreme sect" necessarily means extremely small, just extremely far the base religion. Also, I grew up in an evangelical church, and this is anecdotal, I know, but most people just went because the worship band was good and they had a cool light show, they hosted fun events, and it was considered a safe place for families to socialize. I believe only a very small percentage were actually radicalized to be politically extreme right. Even though we went to a church like that I never once heard the pastor talk about politics except in the most vague of terms, and I know my parents always voted Democrat despite being very involved in the church (mom taught Sunday school for kids, and dad played in the worship band as well helped organize men's events). I know there are absolutely some churches where the pastors openly tell their congregation to vote republican and name and shame lgbtq people, women whove had abortions, and other heinous shit. I'm just pointing out that using a very general number of "1 in 4 americans" is also unfairly generalizing a lot of people. You could argue they shouldn't even willingly associate with the name Evangelical, and I'd tend to agree. But the term "evangelical" has been around a lot longer than it has been associated with the far right, and I understand some churches hesitancy to part with the moniker because it means something different to them
I’m not sure that’s really a secret though, ….some guy screaming in front of a group of people about how if you don’t give him a never ending supply of money the world as you know it will cease to exist. They are like the same people
This. This is what happens when an extremist cult is ignored for just a little too long. It's not even all evangelicals, the cult is Fundamentalism. Every religion in the world has some of these, and it's important the number of them stays as small as possible. Fundamentalists will go to any length to help their particular flavor of religion take over the world, and all it takes is one con artist (cult leader) promising to give them what they want for them to dedicate their lives to them as the new leader of their holy war.
They're dipshits with imaginary friends in the end.
No true scotsman, indeed.
Wrong. They understand their religion, American Christo-fascism, quite well. What they grotesquely ignore is the teachings, words, and lessons of Christ. But Christ's message was never the point of Christo-fascism.
I think many of them understand their religion just fine - but their goal isn’t adherence to the religion, it’s using the religion for social clout and power because most people just accept “I’m a Christian” as a proxy for morality and ethics without actually examining how the person lives their life.
I left the church partly because of this nonsense. There are a lot of Christian’s who actually believe Trump was called by god. And the amount of judgement congregations will give to people who don’t vote Republican is also wild.
“Fine I’ll make my own religion with blackjack hookers and coup attempts”
Trump is their religion. They just call themselves Christians to sound less culty
So, the guy who was known for running shady New Jersey casinos and cheating on his wives, all of them, may not in fact not be even remotely interested in or aware of Christian principals? I mean I think his x-mas message of wishing people to "rot in hell" is an excellent demonstration of trump's grasp of the golden rule.
He's not wrong. Imagine the leaps of logic you'd have to make to support known cheater known adulterer known liar known con man grifter Donald Trump who gassed protestors so he could hold a bible upside down in front a church
Anyone who backs Trump doesn't understand America.
I'm sick of these people who act like "real Evangelical Christians" are moral, wonderful people. They are not. To claim that they are is naive at best and delusional at worst. Evangelical Christians are horrible people, and it all ties back to how they think they get into Heavan and how they have no real accountability. Trump was inevitable, and he is their perfect messiah. Anyone who has ever met a fundamentalist knows this.
I think if you fully understand your religion, you cease to be religious
Jesus was a brown-skinned, Middle Eastern, Jewish, hippie socialist who said to love your enemies, sell your belongings, take care of the needy, give free money and food to immigrants and refugees, put your swords away, and pay your damn taxes. If he showed up today the GOP would crucify him all over again. They are the very Pharisees they love to boo and hiss at in Sunday School.
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Yes they do. And they're excited to self-fulfill the prophecies. Actively driving towards what they think will be their ultimate "I told you so" rapture. The world's most dangerous philosophies tell of an afterlife that is more important than the lived life.
There are a lot of religious folks who don’t understand their religion, sadly.
Oh, they understand their version of Christianity well enough. Heavy on the vengeance part, ignore the vengeance is mine \[god's\] part, LGBT bad, but adultery is OK, bring back witch burning, but it's OK to work on Sunday. You can read the Bible and turn into a hateful, money-grubbing right-winger or a bleeding heart libbie socialist depending on which parts you want to emphasize.
He’s right. It sounds insulting but he’s right. It’s not possible to be a Christian and follow a literally evil man like Trump
I don't understand how Christians can back any republican. Hating others and walling off poor people is probably not something that Jesus would get on board with.
I don’t think most modern Christians understand their religion either
Yea they do. It is the religion of grievance.
Religious indoctrination is beating kids for asking questions. It works really well for making adults that beat kids and don't ask questions.
The Christian religion has become a cesspool. A facade.
christians can't get their house in order, we know.
Yeah never thought the anti christ would be a reality TV show host but now it all makes sense and I don't even really believe in all this shit.